# Annoyed with Leigh DR4 Pro Dovetail jig - RANT



## RocDoc (Jan 16, 2018)

I'm so sick of my expensive dovetail jig - not once has it made a drawer that was absolutely correct. I always have a 1/32 or more differential one of the sides, making the box/drawer not flat. I have tried offsetting, checked , rechecked , read, read and read the manual again and again. Apparently Leigh would blame on it a concentricity error…translation someone else's fault, eg) the maker of the router. The amount of time it has taken me to set this darn thing up , test , restest, test , retest is absurd. After 3 years of screwed up drawers and trying to fix them after the Leigh jig screw ups- I am now FINALLY going to learn to cut them by hand.

This means in a few months I can post again and complain how my joints aren't perfect…
Thanks for letting me vent.


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## Foghorn (Jan 30, 2020)

Sorry to hear that. If it helps, mine works great!


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

First, are you doing half-blind or through dovetails?

Like Darrel, mine works flawlessly. I doubt there is an issue with the jig, and whatever the problem is lies elsewhere.

I guess my second question is, why have you been screwing up drawers for three years? That seems counterproductive. The Leigh jig does require lots of practice to perfect, and you shouldn't be using your project pieces to do that practice. You should never cut your project pieces until you have a clean, perfect test joint.

Half-blind are easy to set up. I use a thickness board to set each of the bits to the correct depth. I have a separate one for each bit. Through dovetails require a bit more fiddling, but if you do it right, you can sneak up on a good fit without having to use multiple test boards.


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## socrbent (Mar 9, 2012)

Ditto Rich and Darrell. It helps if I use it more than once every 2 years  Your comments make me wonder if the fingers on your jig are perpendicular to the bar.


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## RocDoc (Jan 16, 2018)

yep to be fair - I don't use it much. Half blind and through.
Hopefully when I retire I'll have more time to figure it out.
When you need to crank out stuff for the house, you need to crank out stuff.

Glad to hear other people have success. 
I'm debating trying a different router as the results seem to be from concentricity, at least as the Leigh literature points out.


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## controlfreak (Jun 29, 2019)

I had my sights on getting one of these jigs and began reading reviews on Leigh & Porter Cable. A lot of reviews sounded like your difficulties. Since I am not doing any production work and some bad reviews I postponed getting one. I am still trying to improve on my hand cut dovetails and love the imperfect look of them. Anyway back to your jig. You may want to look at some of those reviews and other forum posts. I seem to recall seeing some ah ha moments where some users figured out what was causing them to be off. Sadly some also just gave up and retuned the jig. Hope you can get it dialed in.


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

No doubt about it, it is a very difficult jig to use, especially if you only use occasionally. I have to go back to the manual every time I pull it out. The concentric bit/bushing is a big problem for those using this jig….it must be perfectly centered. For some time I was using my PC 690 (older one) and couldn't center the bit in the bushing. Then I bought a router(s) that allowed some adjustment to center the bushing and the results were spot on.


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## Redoak49 (Dec 15, 2012)

Some people seem to never figure it out and get it right. I have had very little problems with mine. I have had it for 20 years and made many drawers. I have made through and blind dovetails along with finger joints.

I use a DW621 and a PC890. I carefully center the bushings in both of them.

Somethings that I do…

Make certain boards are exactly the same width and thickness.
I put sandpaper on clamp bars to make certain boards do not slip.
Double check boards are against stops and straight.
Make certain everything is tight.


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

Since absolute centering of the bit in the bushing is nearly impossible, probably the most important tip is to never rotate the router through the cut. I found it kind of natural to do that to ease through the cut, but if you think about it, any misalignment of the bit and bushing will become a factor in the cut. Keep the front of the router facing towards you at all times.

Really, perfect alignment of the two isn't as critical as one would think since the two work pieces align at the same edge relative to the final joint. If the bit is off to the right or left in the bushing as the router is oriented, the error will not cause the pieces to be off.

RocDoc, the best advice I can give is to make lots of practice joints. The Leigh jig is not a simple thing to learn. But if everything is set up correctly and you make the cuts properly, it can produce perfect joints.


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## Bonka (Apr 13, 2012)

I tried mine many, many times. I never did get acceptable joints. That was with the help of another WW who had the same model. He could not figure out what was wrong with mine. I am doing to sell the damn thing. 
I now use a Keller Jig.


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## GR8HUNTER (Jun 13, 2016)

I also had the porter cable 7116 omni was hard to set up i know have the Keller jig also :<)))


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## Lazyman (Aug 8, 2014)

I can't help you with the Leigh jig but if you want an inexpensive, simple and flawless dovetail jig, look at the Milescraft 1218 Dovetail Template Master. It is actually a jig to make dovetail jigs. It only cuts through dovetails so you have to attach a drawer front to achieve a blind dovetail affect and does not have the flexibility for variable spacing but that simplicity is what makes it so easy to use. You can make jigs for 2 spacing options. It probably takes about an hour to make the jig and then you dial it in once and all future uses just work. When I decide I want to make a drawer or box, it only takes about a minute to refresh my memory about the steps and less than 10 minutes later, I have the 4 sides cut with a flawless fit. Note that you can make jigs for literally any width that you want and you can make them for either a hand held router or for a router table similar to how the Leigh RTJ400 works. You can see the original video made by the inventor here.

You can see my results with the jig here.


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## xeddog (Mar 2, 2010)

My Leigh jig gave me nothing but grief for a while. It started life as a D3, but was upgraded to D4 specs. Like you, I went through the manual many times and finally gave up. Almost. I called Leigh support and they were VERY helpful and got me working with it. I suggest contacting them before giving up.

Wayne


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

"*Since absolute centering of the bit in the bushing is nearly impossible, probably the most important tip is to never rotate the router through the cut. I found it kind of natural to do that to ease through the cut, but if you think about it, any misalignment of the bit and bushing will become a factor in the cut. Keep the front of the router facing towards you at all times.*"

When I figured this out everything improve greatly.


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## Bonka (Apr 13, 2012)

I did all of the above with others watching. I m done with it.


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## Kirk650 (May 8, 2016)

I use the dovetail template on the Porter Cable as a Keller jig. PC has a supplemental section of the users manual to explain how to set it up do it. No longer limited to 12" of dovetails.


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## BurlyBob (Mar 13, 2012)

I agree that jig is not very user friendly. It took me a solid month of struggling to work that thing. One of these days I need to put it to use. I've found that I don't need it since I prefer metal drawer slides.


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## Woodmaster1 (Apr 26, 2011)

I ad problems with my super jig until I got rid of the bushing that came with and used a regular bushing. That ended my problems. Being impatient doesn't help much. I didn't need mine after my kitchen cabinet project so I sold it for 1/2 of what I paid. Wasn't a bad deal for me since I used it to make 20 drawers. My next adventure in dovetails I am going to try the Incra system because of the variety of joints you can do by just using different bits no templates to purchase. It comes tomorrow and once I get it installed and use it awhile I will review it.


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

*I've found that I don't need it since I prefer metal drawer slides.*

What does metal slides have to do with the drawer joints? I have use my Leigh for box joints, through dovetails and 1/2 blinds. All using metal slides.


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## pintodeluxe (Sep 12, 2010)

With all dovetail jigs, centering the baseplate of your router is critical. It's true of Leigh, Porter Cable, Akeda… All of them.

Since the Leigh uses an elliptical e-bush, it's advisable to center your baseplate with a centering cone and standard guide bushing. Tighten the baseplate screws, then switch back to the e-bush.

Leigh does sell a high end bushing kit that is quite slick, but all 3 of my Leigh jigs use the e-bush system which is slightly out of round (elliptical) by design. That's also the reason why you can't rotate your router as you work.

I'm assuming you're using two routers to cut through dovetails? Cutting through dovetails is a beautiful thing with two routers. One using a straight bit, and the other using a dovetail bit. Using one router was an exercise in frustration for me, but two works magic.

Centering cone with a standard guide. I'm telling you. You're only a 32nd off, you can't give up now.

Best of luck with a frustrating problem.


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

> Centering cone with a standard guide. I m telling you. You re only a 32nd off, you can t give up now.
> 
> - pintodeluxe


I haven't bothered with getting anal about centering, and my joints are perfect. I explained above why, so why would I give up? That's bad advice.

If you doubt it, look at the dovetails on this project, or this one. They were both made with a guide bushing simply screwed into the plate. No centering cone.

As long as you don't turn the router through the cut, exact centering does not matter.


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## pintodeluxe (Sep 12, 2010)

Rich,
I wasn't replying to you or anything you said. I was replying to the O.P.'s original problem and how to fix it.

If my tested solution is different than your tested solution, then mine is bad advise? Um okay.

You need to center the bit relative to the guide bushing. Even if you don't turn the router, you can get the sort of offset that the O.P. talked about. The pins and tails might fit just fine, but you can see a left-right offset of the two boards.
It sounds like you got lucky.
Centering the baseplate is standard procedure.


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

> It sounds like you got lucky.
> 
> - pintodeluxe


I can assure you that "luck" has nothing to do with it. Have I gotten "lucky" on every joint? If "luck" was involved, I wouldn't be batting 1000 for the past 20 or so years using that jig, yet I am.


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## RocDoc (Jan 16, 2018)

> My Leigh jig gave me nothing but grief for a while. It started life as a D3, but was upgraded to D4 specs. Like you, I went through the manual many times and finally gave up. Almost. I called Leigh support and they were VERY helpful and got me working with it. I suggest contacting them before giving up.
> 
> Wayne
> 
> - xeddog


Yep - I'm going back out and try again, but then I will definitely call Leigh support if it fails again. Thx


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## RocDoc (Jan 16, 2018)

> With all dovetail jigs, centering the baseplate of your router is critical. It s true of Leigh, Porter Cable, Akeda… All of them.
> 
> Since the Leigh uses an elliptical e-bush, it s advisable to center your baseplate with a centering cone and standard guide bushing. Tighten the baseplate screws, then switch back to the e-bush.
> 
> ...


Thank you - good advice. And I agree …I'm so close to it actually being perfect, hate to quit now.


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

I have to agree with Rich because that the way I've done it. I've never used a center cone. I just keep the router in the same orientation as I make my cuts.

I'm not saying this is the only way but it's a way that has worked for me.


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## Foghorn (Jan 30, 2020)

I use a centering cone but not sure if it helps as I've never done it any other way. I use it enough that I find it very easy to dial in using the tapered bushing.


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## nickbatz (Mar 7, 2018)

"probably the most important tip is to never rotate the router through the cut."

Could someone explain that to me, please?

(I have a new old stock Leigh dovetail jig that I'm about to use for the first time.)


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## Foghorn (Jan 30, 2020)

> "probably the most important tip is to never rotate the router through the cut."
> 
> Could someone explain that to me, please?
> 
> ...


Just that. Hold the handles and push straight forward and pull straight back without any turning of the router.


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## nickbatz (Mar 7, 2018)

Off the topic:



> I now use a Keller Jig.
> 
> - Gerald Thompson


Hey Jerry, are you from Henry Waxman's district (when he was in Congress)? He used to be my rep when I still lived in my parents' house!

(And no, that wasn't last week.  )

He wrote (or co-wrote) a really informative book called something close to How Congress Really Works.

But one digresses. Yes, Dovetails.

If I have trouble with my Leigh jig, I also have a General Dovetailer II that looks pretty foolproof, aside from coming with a total POS dovetail bit. Best of all, it only uses the dovetail bit for both sides of a half-blind dovetail.


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

> . Best of all, it only uses the dovetail bit for both sides of a half-blind dovetail.
> 
> - nickbatz


Don't they all work that way for half blind DTs?


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## nickbatz (Mar 7, 2018)

> Don t they all work that way for half blind DTs?
> 
> - Fred Hargis


I thought not, but I just looked it up damned if you're not right!

Why would anyone bother with through dovetails?!


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

> "probably the most important tip is to never rotate the router through the cut."
> 
> Could someone explain that to me, please?
> 
> ...


What Darrel said.


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## RocDoc (Jan 16, 2018)

So this begs the question: 
Why bother with the eccentric bushing if it is that sensitive to router position? If I remember correctly it is only needed for sliding dovetails and finger joints. Could be wrong on that.
Seems to me that the darn E bush is the problem.


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## hcbph_1 (Apr 11, 2020)

I've seen and in fact made a couple of centering pins before. I found some material that's exactly 1/2" diameter and turned the end of it to just slide into the inside of the collar which I use on a plunge router. I use that to insure the collar is exactly centered on the router, and it's worked for me.


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## Foghorn (Jan 30, 2020)

> So this begs the question:
> Why bother with the eccentric bushing if it is that sensitive to router position? If I remember correctly it is only needed for sliding dovetails and finger joints. Could be wrong on that.
> Seems to me that the darn E bush is the problem.
> 
> - RocDoc


You're correct. Thinking on it, I use the eccentric bushing for box joints and sliders.


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

> So this begs the question:
> Why bother with the eccentric bushing if it is that sensitive to router position? If I remember correctly it is only needed for sliding dovetails and finger joints. Could be wrong on that.
> 
> - RocDoc


I believe you're right on that. When I bought my D4 20 years ago or so, it wasn't available. I have one now, it probably was included with the D4 Pro upgrade kit I bought. At any rate, I've never used it.


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

> Why would anyone bother with through dovetails?!
> 
> 
> 
> - nickbatz


There's a long list of reasons to cut through DTs. They are not uncommon on case work for example. They are a little easier to cut if you do hand cutting, and I think it's easier on the Leigh jig as well. In fact, I think the only time I've used half blind DTs was on drawers, casework and boxes get through DTs. I dod remember an episode of Norm's where he cut half blind on casework, but that was because his PC jig only cut half blind (I guess).


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## MJCD (Nov 28, 2011)

I am returning mine… purchased as a personal Christmas present. The problem is not the jig… it is that I don't want to invest the frustration with learning it.

The user manual is clear in stating that some trial and error is involved, and from the many posts here and elsewhere many individuals successfully use the jig. 
The old saying about New York City… that it is a great place to visit, but not to live there… applies inversely to tools like the D4R… you have to live there, because visiting is frustrating.


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

This thread reminded me I haven't used mine in quite a while, so over the weekend I pulled it and refreshed myself on it's use.


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

Why would anyone bother with through dovetails?!

https://www.dcdrawers.com/blog/tag/different-types-of-dovetail-joints/#through

Like on this chest of drawers. The box/case uses through dovetails.








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