# Florida has a sheriff like Arizona has



## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

*
Florida has a sheriff like Arizona has
*


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## Cozmo35 (Feb 1, 2010)

"When you are shot 68 times you are naturally gonna die." - BEAUTIFUL! LOL!!!!


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## ClayandNancy (Feb 22, 2010)

We need more police officers like that!


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## JollyGreen67 (Nov 1, 2010)

He just UAD (up and died). Should be more of them!


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## DaveHuber (Nov 12, 2009)

Golly, this is refreshing!!

Gee this is FUN!!

Well, somebody has to say it, so here goes:

What, exactly does this have to do with anything?

Why, precisely, does anyone find any of this amusing?

What, exactly, does anyone gain from posting tho childish, inane drivel?

Not just this post, but the vast preponderance of posts from you are nasty.. You are obviously not a happy person. Look for an outlet for whatever ails your soul elsewhere. You don't bring out the best in others and don't contribute anything positive, on balance.

Be kind, be positive, be constructive, or be quiet.

Grow up. At least try to camouflage your insecure, casual hatred and racism, jingoism and base meanness.

Maybe you could fake being kind, positive, constructive and decent until it becomes habit rather than trolling the Internet for the nastiest stuff you can find, then spreading it around like something you stepped in while walking down the alley.

Try it, you might like it.

Oh, and thanks for fouling the pool by continually posting this crap. It makes this a place fewer and fewer people want to visit. Why would you do that?

I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt by assuming you are ignorant of the fact that your constant stream of paranoia, hate, ignorance and bile is repugnant to the decent folk who want to exchange views on WOODWORKING.

Now you know.

I'm guessing you spew this bile in person and people are repulsed, and avoid you. So, you are lonely and take it to the Internet, where you think it passes for intelligent discourse. It does not. It is pathetic. Undoubtedly, you were raised better than this.

Go down to the park and yell at the pigeons if you want to be a mean, old pathetic cank. Leave the decent folks alone.

If you have something positive and constructive to add, please do so. Otherwise, quit crapping in the punch bowl!

"Have Fun!"

Indeed.


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## davidmicraig (Nov 21, 2009)

Joe, my response will not be aggressive as the former. I don't believe you are a bitter, angry man. But there is another side to law enforcement that is willing to use excessive force in a situation. What follows is not something I read in the paper or online, but what happened to me personally -

About 20 years ago, I was pulled over in Okemos. A rather wealth community in Michigan, not far from the state capital. I had a broken headlight and figured I would get pulled over eventually, so I sat in the car waiting for my fixit ticket. I was a little confused when another police car pulled in alongside the first one and even more so when one officer was drawing his gun.

The two men approached and ordered me to get out of my car. Not knowing what was going on, or why these guys were so uptight, I slowly put both hands outside the car window so they could see I was unarmed and told them that I would not exit the vehicle until one of them informed me of what I did wrong. That option was not given to me, however, as one of them jerked the car door open, pulled me out by my shirt, threw me against the front of my car and began cuffing me. My Miranda rights were read but I still had no idea on why I was being arrested. I turned my head to inquire about the charges, one officer put his gun against my head and told me to turn back around or I would be dead. I was never more terrified before or since.

I turned around and was cuffed and I told the officer that I was not aware that a broken headlight was this big a deal. I was then informed that I committed two felonies in the Detroit area. Having not been there since I was 8, I couldn't recollect committing such a crime. It was at this point, they decided to run my social security number and drivers license through the system. They discovered that they had the wrong David Craig. I was uncuffed without apology and was informed that they wouldn't' give me a ticket this time, but to get my headlight fixed. Nice of them to not ticket me after threatening my life. I had no priors, no tickets, no bad record of any kind. These men were prepared to do whatever was necessary to apprehend this other David Craig, including shooting an unarmed, innocent citizen.

We do not need more sheriffs that can kill a man and make flippant jokes to the media. What we need are more men of honor who are willing to use the gun in self defense but who understand that taking a life is a very serious thing. I want a Sheriff who would respond to such an event by saying "It is unfortunate that this man used force which required us to use force in defense. I wish it were otherwise." Not as funny or popular but definitely more worthy of respect in my book.

David


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## Woodbum (Jan 3, 2010)

Give it a rest-take it somewhere else. Go to a site that wants political and social issue discourse. Maybe some here want that but I don't. I come here to read and talk woodworking. If I want that other silly s**t, I 'll go where i expect it to be.Just my opinion, and I could be wrong


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

*DaveHuber:*

First of all, *the criminal fired the first shot…* That is ALL that is needed for further action to be taken.

And… if he had been taken alive, etc. the Liberal Wackos would have turned it upside down, the guy might get OFF completely OR he would be tried, found guilty, placed on death row, and kept there for 30-40 years while he went through the APPEAL process costing the taxpayers close to 1 million dollars.

When, in reality, it was very obvious… he fired first, pretty much admitting guilt, and happened to die while the police were "protecting themselves"... True Justice without 30-40 years of BS!

*David Craig:*
They obviously broke the law, did not follow proper procedure, and the City should have been sued for a few million $$$... It's a shame you didn't take some kind of legal action… They obviously deserved it!
I'm sorry that horrifying experience happened to you…

I am not a violent man… probably the opposite… BUT, when I see a Black Dog who was seen doing horrible illegal things, is guilty as Hell, and people are trying to call it a nice White Dog because of his bad childhood, blah, blah, blah, it does something to me… Our System is SO SICK in places…
... and it's like a breath of Fresh Air when things are handled properly… For a Change!


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## oldnovice (Mar 7, 2009)

To be less wordy than both of the Daves, this is very *CRASS!*


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## GregD (Oct 24, 2009)

The policy expressed by Sheriff Judd is morally reprehensible.
It is also blatantly illegal.

It is always a tragedy when someone dies a violent death.
At least if you are a true Christian.
And even for many of us that aren't.

There should be no hesitation to use lethal force when necessary.
And no regret either.
But blood-lust celebration is shameful.

Naturally, the liberal media went nuts and asked why they had to shoot the poor, 
undocumented immigrant 68 times.
Since when is asking a question "going nuts"? This statement clearly reflects the prejudices of its author, and is not likely a reasonable characterization of the actual events.

And then more blood-lust celebration from the Sheriff and even the coroner.

Two men and a dog died violent deaths.
It is a relief that a killer was stopped.
And honor is deserved to those that did what needed to be done.
But it is a sad thing.
At least for true Christians.
And even for many of us that aren't.


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## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

I agree pretty much with *most* of what GregD said.

For whatever it is worth this apparently is what actually happened:

http://www.snopes.com/crime/cops/judd.asp

Obviously, the man was guilty if this is true and the sherriff's deputies had to shoot in self defense. It's doubtful that 110 shots had to be fired with 68 shots hitting the outlaw. I will not judge them for that.

However, Joe, I must say that the tone of your post did not sit well with me either.


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

*
The murderer was found hiding in a wooded area. As soon as he took a shot at the
SWAT team, officers opened fire on him.

*

Now, let me understand this completely…

*The police were fired upon! Shot AT! With a GUN!*

*What are the police supposed to do?*

Give up and let him go FREE?!

I see "True Christians" are now entering the picture…

The Father of Christ laid down the Law on how true Murderers and Rapists should be punished.
He (God) said that they should be Publicly put to death.
Jesus said he didn't come to change the law one iota, but to fulfill it.

Don't ask me for the Chapter / Verse… I don't remember… BUT, I know it to be true.

*Also, this thread is NOT going into a Religious Debate and does NOT WANT to do so.

I am hereby requesting that the Religious debate STOPS right NOW with this post.

Please… abide by my request…

Thank you very much.
*


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## craftsman on the lake (Dec 27, 2008)

Joe and I had some private correspondence a few days ago. I think we pretty much agreed he's nuts. I think he's a good guy. Just nuts. Heck, could be worse.


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## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

Human beings are such complicated creatures. We all come from different backgrounds and there are an infinite number of variables that occur in each of our lives that contribute to our make up and how we look at the world that we live in and interact with it and each other, not including the makeup of our own souls and minds, even our DNA if we want to get into scientific terms.

We have thousands and thousands of years of human suffering behind us.

Perhaps the greatest tragedy of all is that in spite of all that we have been thru as a species together we have never learned how to live together in a peaceful way. I suspect that we never will.

I have never seen our country so divided as it is today.

I have never met a dog that I did not like except for Hank. He was the dog from hell. In defense of Hank his back leg was shot off by a man with a shotgun. If I put myself in Hank's place I probably would have taken an exception to that myself.

I had the priviledge of working on a horse farm. Horses are such noble creatures. If you will look into the eyes of a dog or a horse you will see that they want to please you. You can usually negotiate with a horse or a dog.

I have owned a number of cats. I have come to understand, however, that you don't own a cat. It's probably more like they own you. I believe that cats are great students of human nature and study us in order to see how to manipulate us. We might could learn something from cats if we could talk to them. I do love them them so, however.

Porpoises are wonderful creatures, too. I've never had the pleasure to swim with them but my children have.

I don't know the why of it all or why the world is the way it is. But it does all seem very profound to me.

I'm not sure at all that it will end well. I suspect that it will not.

helluvawreck aka Charles
http://woodworkingexpo.wordpress.com


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## davidmicraig (Nov 21, 2009)

Very thoughtful post Charles. Up to about 8 months ago, I worked from home. For almost five years my social interactions were with my cats or watching the birds outside and the visits I would have with jockmike2. I was a little sheltered and didn't really mind that a bit. It has been a bit of a trying process to be out there more and come face to face with so much blind hatred and anger. When you get to the root of most difficulties, they are self inflicted. Life presents its own trials, we don't have to add to it.

David


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

*Katdaddy:
*
Sorry you are so far behind the Times…

Only the facts are reported… just the facts…

... did NOT warrant your attack…


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

Some people just like controversy, arguing, debating and baiting. That's Joe Jyddon. And you guys fall for it every time. You're doing just what he wants. Indore him and maybe he'll go away.

He use to do this on WoodNet until they ran him off.


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## craftsman on the lake (Dec 27, 2008)

In a previous post above I said:
"Joe and I had some private correspondence a few days ago. I think we pretty much agreed he's nuts. I think he's a good guy. Just nuts. Heck, could be worse."

Joe just contacted me privately saying that he didn't agree he might be nuts. He's right, but I didn't really say that. It was my wife and I who were the ones who agreed he might be nuts. That's why I said 'we'. He said in his email: *"I think you should do a retraction of your statement…Otherwise, I will consider an attack & report it as such."*

So, here it is. I'm sorry if you thought I had included you in that statement. I did not mean that. You did not agree that you were nuts.

On another note:
Joe, I don't mind if you report it but please don't consider an attack, or even do it. I think that would be a little much. Threatening someone with being attacked is a bad thing. I'm glad you don't know where I live.

And I don't dislike you. but, a bit of advice. Don't put stuff like this in writing. These days with terrorists and all the weird shootings, patriot act, etc….. Threatening to attack someone in writing could be considered something the powers watching could act on. With your appearing to be gleeful that some guy got riddled with bullets wouldn't help your case. I'm sure it's just something you said without thought first. No big deal on my part, I'm okay, really, but please be careful in the future. 
And don't worry, I'm a little nuts too. It can be a good thing. Keeps things interesting. Have a great day Joe. I'm looking forward to seeing some more of your wood projects in the future.


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

"J*oe and I* had some private correspondence a few days ago. I think *we* pretty much agreed he's nuts. I think he's a good guy. Just nuts. Heck, could be worse."

No mention of Wife!

Just Joe & I…


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## DaveHuber (Nov 12, 2009)

I'll say it.

I think Joe is nuts.

And mean.

And racist.

And paranoid.

An non-constructive.

And not a positive force in the world, judging by his posts.

Maybe he's a super guy, but he's hiding it. He successfully hides his god qualities behind the constant stream of mean, racist, childish, nasty posts.

The thin skinned howling from Joe when people point out his BS is clearly evidence that he is not duly developed emotionally.

If Joe diddnt want everyone to think he was a jerk, kegs wouldn't constantly go out of his way to prove the point. I assume it's deliberate.

Unless it is involuntary, which means Joe needs supervision.

Given his appetite for armchair violence, perhaps supervision would be a good idea.

I, for one am tired of Joe's crap.

I wish he'd go foul some other pond, and let the rest of us have fun

If more folks stand up and say "enough of this" please stop pr leave, perhaps he'll do one or the other.

Likely, he'll just keep on going. Seems like he's been at it a while.

Oh, and yes, I'll acknowledge my post could be considered intemperate. I think subtle and courteous has been tried, and ignored. Joe can't take a hint, so I'll be explicit.

You are obnoxious and tiresome. Stop, shut it or go away

"Have Fun!"

Oy! The irony!!

Dave


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

*Well DaveHuber, I'd say you pretty well aggressively attacked me… Yes, I flagged your post.*

I post Facts… just the Facts… Whether you like the Facts or not, they are The Facts!

I feel it's important that more people, that are not informed, be informed… to be woken up…

That's all… very simple…

If you don't want to read it, just don't Click on it… LOL
... there are some people that appreciate it…


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## davidmicraig (Nov 21, 2009)

Here's the thing. I have no problem with attacking a person's ideas. Joe posts his thoughts and beliefs, I don't agree with them, I respond by relaying my thoughts and beliefs and why I disagree. This is communication, two way street. Someone can post something that offends me, I can post my response and say that I find it offensive. I do this, not because I think I am going to change the original poster's mind, but because I don't like to sit by idly and let a comment I find offensive go uncontested. That is freedom of speech and the reader is allowed to form thier own viewpoint based on the information provided.

I don't, however, personally attack the person. I attack the ideas. I think that I could sit down with almost anyone on this site and find a common ground in which I would come away enjoying the experience. I could sit down with Joe and talk about box making, or his shop, his influences, whatever, and I think we would get along just fine. If Joe wanted to talk politics, I would either excuse myself, or make it plain that we can share thoughts, but only if he can handle opposing opinions. If it starts to get ugly, time to go back to woodworking or excuse myself.

Insulting the person is, in my opinion, stepping over that line. Now there are those that will disagree with that viewpoint. That is fine, I am used to opposing opinions. However, if I post anything that someone does not agree with, I would hope they would attack the thought or the idea but not me personally.

Just my two cents,

David


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

David Craig,

*Joe posts his thoughts and beliefs*

NO… just the Facts… Just the Facts…


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## JollyGreen67 (Nov 1, 2010)

Hey Joe, don't worry 'bout it, don't let it get you down. As I see it, there are a bunch of 'em don't now how to have any fun. For me, you got my vote.

David: So you let those idiot cops just walk off and didn't do anything? I would have been down to the local law enforcement office with a LOUD complaint immediately, because, what they did to you was also not justified.


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

*Thank you, Jim….*

I knew there was someone out there that appreciates what I'm trying to do…

At this time in our History, there is an abundance of very scary factual things happening, which I feel should be known to those that are not aware of it.

I didn't classify this thread as Political… I didn't think it was…
... just an efficient Police Action… LOL


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## patron (Apr 2, 2009)

hi joe

been a while since we talked

i have had the pleasure of meeting and staying in joes home
for 3 or 4 days 
and don't remember having one political or religious conversation

we just (as dave points out) talked shop and woodworking
and got to know and appreciate our lives and time together
laughing and even working together

many have lived and died for all our rights to be free to do this

everyone has different paths and experiences 
which takes us all to new and unknown places

how we conduct ourselves in public
has always been respectful and responsible in the past

somehow the world and this new fast access to communication
and ideas has made it possible to be 'experts' at just about everything around us now

that we have somehow lost our moral compass
is very real these days from many parts of life

bashing and abusing each other doesn't solve to much
just makes t harder to find any common ground

have a good mothers day all


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

*Hi Patron,*

Yes, we had a very nice visit…

I don't think we talked much about politics because things were NOT quite as HOT as they are now…
*
'everyone has different paths and experiences 
which takes us all to new and unknown places'
*

It's the *New & Unknown*, at this time that scares me… *we are NOT headed toward good things *(IMHO).
So many things are happening all at the same time… We are in trouble & nobody seems to care… That's the MOST troubling thing that's happening! LOL

Every Political thread I start, I tag it with "Political" to give everyone with full warning in case they choose to ignore it.

Y'all have a good Mother's Day too…

BTW, I, for the most part, will not talk about religion… unless the subject comes up…

Thank you.


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## GregD (Oct 24, 2009)

Based on the account given on the snopes.com link, I find no fault in the deputies' actions or in Sheriff Judd's comments. "We weren't taking any chances" seems quite appropriate given the circumstances described. Very different characterization than the description in the original post, IMHO.


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## vipond33 (Jul 25, 2011)

This incident happened in 2006! Why would you dredge it up now? There are almost an infinite number of unfortunate events in the past such as this. Will you be reporting on them all? With glee?


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

vipond33:

This just came to my attention…

NO…

NO…


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## derosa (Aug 21, 2010)

I find the verbal response to be a little outrageous and perhaps warranting of a psyche eval, it sounds like there is a little too much glee in the killing of the perpetrator and cops should never be about revenge regardless of who was killed. If the account is accurate that he was dug in and armed then he had already shown himself willing to kill to avoid arrest and the cops were justified in filling the area full of lead to avoid putting themselves into any serious harm. 
That said I find it reprehensible that in a modern nation such as ours people like the Arizona sheriff are permitted to continue to operate with impunity or that people should be thinking that it's a wonderful thing. Lets try to move ourselves into the 21st century and leave the barbarity of the past in the past. We should be growing as a society and not taking glee in the suffering of others even if it is viewed as just punishment.


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

*derosa:*

Well, after seeing how one of their beloved buddies was horribly executed, and based on what immediately followed, I do think the Police were somewhat angry and if needed to take the Murderer OUT, they would not hesitate to do it… with vigor!

They did not break any laws… They are human… They have feelings… They had just lost a buddy in a very INHUMANE manor… I'm with them! They did their jobs… * Beautifully!*

It's easy for you feel bad for the Heinous Murderer… in real time, it was easy for the police to do their job.


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