# PM2000 vs New Unisaw



## gawthrrw (Sep 13, 2011)

Hey fellow Jocks, I know there have been numerous discussions about this but im having a heck of a time making a decision. I have finally got in a position to buy a new cabinet saw and thought the PM2000 was it. I especially liked the ONYX. I went to my local Woodcraft last week to put my hands on one and there beside it sat the new Unisaw. I was impressed with its quality. I have looked at about everything i can find on both of these saws and really like them both. At first i thought Delta might be more for the money but by the time i get casters to move it around and such i dont know. The Powermatic seems more solid but the Delta is made in the US and has a Baldor motor. I really like the front cranks on the Delta also and the one piece trunnion but the Powermatic is proven and the new Unisaw hasnt been out that long. I guess what i want to ask is do any of you have either of these saws and if so, how do you like it? Did you have the same issue with making a decision? What persuaded you either way? I want this to be the last saw i ever buy and dont want to have any regrets.

P.S. I know there will be someone to ask if i have looked at the SawStop….Yes, I have looked at it and originally I was looking at all three. I know its safer and all but i'm not interested in it. I have narrowed it down between the Powermatic and Unisaw. Thanks


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## PurpLev (May 30, 2008)

just - pick - one.

both are good saws and will serve you well for a long long time. there is no better or worse, they are just different colors (to simplify the equation).


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## Woodmaster1 (Apr 26, 2011)

Either saw will be a great addition to your shop. I had the same problem and went with the 5hp delta and love it. If I had got the powermatic I know I would be equally as happy. It boils down to which on e you like best.


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## knotscott (Feb 27, 2009)

Both are high quality saws. Go with the one made in the USA.


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## rustynails (Jun 23, 2011)

Gawthrrw, I just recently went thru the same decision and ended up purchasing the Delta. Here's why I purchased it and my reasoning. Since the Pm 2000 came out with the new design a few years back they have changed a few things on it since then. The fence was made by HTC now it's not. The motors on the saws are different than when they first came out. (Pm Rep told me due to problems) they are still foreign and the Delta does not have a Baldor motor but it is a Marathon but still built in the USA. The ONYX looks really cool but it's just paint and do you want to look good or work good. The casers on the Pm don't lift the extension table when moving so you still need to get a base or some kind of wheels to the one end, Also the wheels work with the same crank as the tilt and I am not sure if I liked that? Yes the Delta needs a mobile base and with that it would cost a little more but at this point between the two it's only a few dollars. (Remember extra wheels for the extension?)
With the Delta all the controls are up front and better gauges for accuracy. The riving knife has the adjustment and release up front as well and makes it a lot easier then the PM which you have to release from the inside. Also the Delta has grease fitting inside the saw to lube the guts of the saw. Dust collection is better I would say do to it sucks at the blade and within the cabinet but still leaves some. From most of my web site reviews from individuals I have read and talked with there were two kinds either ones that got a good Pm and liked it a lot or ones that had problems with fit and finish including the tops. (I did not read any that did not like their Delta but I am sure there are some) The Delta has a larger plate opening and the blade is back further and it has a larger cast iron top size. Plus the Delta if purchased by the end of the year has a $300.00 rebate. (I got mine from Tools Plus no tax and only $6.50 for shipping). The quality on my saw was great. The top was perfectly flat and the miter slot was right on to the blade. Negative things about the Delta are that the fence rail is aluminum instead of the traditional steel, which works good and will last but you cannot use magnets on it if you use jigs with the rail. They also changed the base from the one they show on all the sites so if you get there base you need to put leg levelers on it which cost about $20.00 but if you do that it works fine. If getting the Delta mobile base check into it and ask questions about it being different from that what is pictured. (Pm me if interested in the base and I can send you pictures of my base with the leg levelers I put oh it) Also the Delta went together really well and comes with DVD instructions to make it really easy to put together. 
Okay then that about covers my experience with my new saw. It does cut really nice and runs very smooth with no vibration and it passed the nickel test with flying colors. I have not run one of the new Pm's so I cannot comment on a comparison as far as that goes but I am glad I got my USA built Delta. But either way you will be glad you are upgrading to a cabinet saw. 
Good luck with your purchase as I know it can be a difficult decision.

Richard


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## danr (Sep 5, 2009)

I don't know anything about the PM saw. I have owned the "new" Unisaw for almost 2 years now and I am very happy with it. I also purchased the "Delta" mobile base. It has been excellent. I would not, I repeat, not purchase another mobile base other then the one from Delta.

As was mentioned in the earlier (very well written post) the Delta has the blade positioned farther forward (from the operator) than other saws. This takes a bit of getting used to expecially when doing lots of repetitive cuts with a cross cut sled (for example) but I like it. The riving knife/anti-kick-back paws, guard system is very very nice and user friendly. I, for the first time, actually use the saw with the guard in place most of the time.

Again, I can not compare the Delta to the PM but I can say that the Delta is a great saw. Also, like was stated earlier, I don't think you can go wrong either way.


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## alfa189 (Aug 30, 2011)

I'm glad you posted this as I am torturing myself with the same questions. Although, I must admit I am VERY tempted by the Grizzly G0690 (I have a small shop and cant fit an extension rail). I am going nuts trying to make a decision. I'm also a craigslist junky, scouring CL daily for new tablesaw listings. But I would hate to have cost be the only deciding factor and end up regretting it later. Good luck in your quest brother. I look forward to following this one.


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## rustynails (Jun 23, 2011)

dnar stated:
I also purchased the "Delta" mobile base. It has been excellent. I would not, I repeat, not purchase another mobile base other then the one from Delta.
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In checking out the saw and reviews about the base the old one as you mentioned are good but they have changed the new base design with no center support which is why I stated you need to put the leg levelers on it in the middle. They also moved the lifting wheel to the end and that is an improvement so you can lift it easier. 
I have been working with the Delta rep in regards to the new base and he stated that it was changed and Delta is looking at it to change it due to the problems as I stated with the new design.


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## gawthrrw (Sep 13, 2011)

Thanks rustynails. That was was a great review and exactly what i asked for. Like you I have not seen any bad reviews on the Delta which was not the case with the pm. I just wasnt sure if that was because it was a new saw or not, and maybe the reviews are scarce. The guy at woodcraft was trying to sell me the JET mobile base saying it was cheaper and just as good. danr stated that he would not purchase any other base than the delta. What makes that one better? Just curious. Thank you everyone for the info


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## gawthrrw (Sep 13, 2011)

Alpha wrote: I'm glad you posted this as I am torturing myself with the same questions. Although, I must admit I am VERY tempted by the Grizzly G0690 (I have a small shop and cant fit an extension rail). I am going nuts trying to make a decision.
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I know what you mean. I have been losing sleep over this. I know I should be exuberent about having the oppurtunity to even get a new saw, as i know any one would be better than the old craftsman contractor saw i have now. Just FYI I have a friend that has the grizzly G0690 and in my opinion it didnt compare to the PM or the Unisaw. Now i havn't cut anything with either of the later but the fit and finish on the two blew the griz away. Don't want to offend anyone who own's this saw because it is a good saw but I want the best quality i can get.


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## doyoulikegumwood (Jun 21, 2007)

well by just doing some price shopping on amazon I can get a 5hp uni saw for the price of the 3 hp powermatic. so lets see the all new and improved uni saw at 5hp or the old powermatic thats built like the old uni saw and only 3 hp. Now I know I will ruffle feathers but PM cabinet saws are just like everyone else's cabinet saw, trying to be a uni saw.


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## grumpy749 (Nov 22, 2011)

Gawthrrw Till me again the reason you discounted the Sawstop. The uni the pm and sawstop are all withen a few hundred dollars. All would make a great addition to any shop. Could it be because of the rumour that all saws bought after 2012 will have the blade brake technology available as an upgrade. Just a thought. I'm in in the same boat.


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## rustynails (Jun 23, 2011)

I bought mine from Tools Plus they have by far the best prices around that I could find and get good reviews. If you are thinking about a new Uni-Saw the $300.00 rebate is only till the end of the year / 24 days! I got a special on mine when they had the "Tool A-Rama" sale and got a great deal. But they still have the best prices that I have found on one. 
Also I left a message with the rep from Delta today and asked what was being done about the mobile base. He got back to me via e-mail and stated if anyone wanted to know about the base or more about the saw to contact him directly per his e-mail and he would answer any of your questions.

Delta Rep. >>>> Joe Brakhage <<<< [email protected]

Also my take on the Saw Stop is that it is a very good quality saw with lots of safety features and I would get one of those over the PM but me personally I did not like what I was reading about how people had to mess around with the electronics a lot to make the saw start and calibrating the electronics as well and you can't cut any wood with high moisture like treated lumber and things like that. But don't get me wrong like I said it's a nice saw and I don't want to get into a debate on that saw.


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## gawthrrw (Sep 13, 2011)

Thanks rustynail. I'm pretty sure i'm going to go with the Unisaw. I think its more bang for the buck and being made in the US will give me a little more pride in it lol. How was the shipping from Tools Plus? I'm planning on going back to woodcraft this weekend but if I can get it cheaper then heck yea? I think this thread will help a lot of people in the future and really appreciate everyone sharing their experiences.


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## gawthrrw (Sep 13, 2011)

oh, and grumpy. The biggest reason I stopped looking at the Sawstop was like rustynails said, a lot of reviews I read people were saying that the safety was engaging at odd times and they were always stressed out about having a spare on hand. All this makes me wonder about 4, 5 years down the road? I personally just didnt feel sold on it. I know you can run it in bypass mode but then what was the point of spending the extra money?


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## TLA (Jan 10, 2011)

Very good and timely thread. I'm finally able to get a new table saw as well and am looking at the PM 2000 and SawStop. Was leaning towards SawStop just for the safety feature since they were both the same price. Admittedly, I wasn't looking much at the Unisaw basically since it wasn't sold at my local woodworking store, but the comments here are making my decision harder…

I know what you mean about losing sleep about this decision. For one its a lot of money, but I also plan on keeping this new saw for a number of years and want to make the right choice.

Keep up the comments. Good stuff.


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## rustynails (Jun 23, 2011)

This shipping is $6.50 on any thing any time and you can hagle with them as well. I would talk with the rep as well as he answerd a lot of questions for me and is very helpfull.


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

I'd get the PM2000 but I personally don't like the black one. Perhaps you could get a better deal on a yellow one Others might disagree but I think it's fair to say that both have suffered from an overall decrease in general quality. If I can't find a used Martin or Oliver in the next couple of years, the PM or the Hammer will be on my list.

I would also agree with the above post: everyone is trying to be an OLD unisaw.


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## gawthrrw (Sep 13, 2011)

tyler wrote: "I wasn't looking much at the Unisaw basically since it wasn't sold at my local woodworking store, but the comments here are making my decision harder…"

I was in the exact same situation. I have always been a powermatic fan and have many friends and relatives who have old pm 66's. I always told myself that when I get the money i'm going to get a new PM! Well, that time came and because I always over analyze I started comparing specs on every saw out there. I had never even seen the new Unisaw before Reading about someone else owning one here. I'm now heavily leaning toward the Delta mostly because i think it has more to offer as far as ease of use and functionality. I guess i just really like the looks of the PM but i have to make myself look past that. 
I also was looking at the industrial sawstop. Most of the reviews on the professional version said that they liked the fit and finish on the Delta more, but the industrial version was the cats meow.. Now, I have never seen either the professional or the industrial Sawstop yet but i plan to this weekend. According to what i have researched online, the professional comes as a package, but you have to add the fence, cartridge, inserts, etc to the industrial version. I was nieve and thought the industrial version was in the 3.5k ballpark and wondered why anyone would buy the professional version when you get a bigger and better saw for a few hundred more. after reading that the going rate was $4800.00 for the industrial after getting everything you need to use it, the Sawstop came off my list. I love the safety aspect, but its not worth nearly 2k more to me. If i'm mistakin on that part please someone chime in.


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## doyoulikegumwood (Jun 21, 2007)

Just thought I would share this with you this product isn't avalible yet, but I like this idea allot more then saw stops method 



 something to keep in mind. I'm still thinking for the money delta is the way to go.


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## rustynails (Jun 23, 2011)

Actually the one place I looked at saws at stated that the delta rep (a different one than I have been working with ) said that delta is working a similar stop system as doyoulikegumwood posted about with a brake system like on a car and it doesn't ruin the blade like saw stop. But I am not sure when it is coming out or if I would want to be the first one getting one as new things always has bugs


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## mcase (Oct 31, 2009)

Get the Unisaw. Rusty Nails said it all. The UNI is American made - the PM 2000 is Chinese. Also , the old Powermatic is gone and so arguable is Delta, except perhaps their one last American Product. I had a later model pm 66 - a vastly overrated machine. Had a wavy table out over 1/32", had lots of runout., and had a poorly cast and badly misaligned tilt mechanism. I bought the Industrial SS almost five years ago now and it was a VAST improvement over the 66. The wavy tables are not confined to their saws you can find postings about similar issues with the PM jointers too. So, if I was to get a North-American style cabinet saw that was not an Industrial SS it would definitely be the UNI.


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## Woodmaster1 (Apr 26, 2011)

The school I teach at has a 45year old pm 66, jet and a sawstop pro with 36" fence. I bought a Unisaw for my home shop because it seemed the best of my choices. The sawstop is ok but I like the features of the Unisaw better. The jet I just do not like it, the dust collection is poor and it is under powered and kicks the breaker out. The new pm2000 may be a good saw but I am very happy to have the 5hp Unisaw with the delta mobile base.


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## roman (Sep 28, 2007)

neither

save yourself a fortune and buy "used"………ten cents on the dollar, better quality if you shop around, use the savings to buy materials through the same method you buy a used tool……….auctions.


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## rustynails (Jun 23, 2011)

Moron, you are correct you can save a lot buying used as I have had a few cabinet saws and they all worked very well including a Jet JTAS, a 1947 Uni-Saw, and an older PM 66 all of which cut wood fine and met all my needs. But if you go to a new saw of any make there is a big difference and it has a lot more bells and whistles that I defiantly appreciate. But at what price are you willing to spend? That is only something one can answer. I defiantly like my new saw but it also cost 3 times as much. But after 30 years of wood working I am happy I did it.


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## grumpy749 (Nov 22, 2011)

Hey doyoulikegumwood, thats exactly what I was referring to. Now wouldn,t that be the answer for large cabinet saws instead of small portables. And maby as an upgrade when we buy a new saw so as we can spend even more money ! '' gulp''


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## grumpy749 (Nov 22, 2011)

PS…uni is the way to go. I,m canadian but I,ll buy american first befor anything else. quality speaks.


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## gawthrrw (Sep 13, 2011)

I want to thank everyone here for the valuable info. I have nothing but admiration and respect for all of you. I've decided on the Unisaw. I think I already knew that but the info from the fine folks here put me over the line. I hope this thread will help others with these issues down the road, as I know that I have made a lot of decisions in the past by reading old threads on LJ's. Rustynails, once i figure out how to PM you on here I would love to get the info on that mobile base you have. Thanks again.


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## Alexdi (Oct 22, 2011)

I think you've chosen well. I was thoroughly impressed with the new Unisaw at a local Woodcraft. Everything about it was the best I've seen for this type of equipment, particular the convenience and smooth operation of the adjustment knobs. The fence was superb. Even the Sawstop cabinet saw next to it felt a noticeable step down. Except for the miter gauge. You could do better with a third party on that particular accessory. The Sawstop's is mediocre, the Unisaw just average.

You might take a peek at the classifieds before buying new, though. Startling deals occasionally appear on the used market. There's a guy near me selling a like-new Unisaw X5 with the extended fence, table, and all accessories and blades for $600.


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