# How do you sharpen your plane irons and chisels



## cajunpen (Apr 9, 2007)

I have the WorkSharp and when I bought it I thought that it would take care of my sharpening needs for my plane irons and chisels. It does a pretty good job and I thought that my tools were sharp. I recently bought the BUS Smoother and it was sharp out of the box. I also ordered, with the BUS, a set of 1000 & 4000 Japanese Water Stones and the Veritas angle guide. I used it on my plane irons and WOW what a difference it made - they are now razor sharp. I did find that it took about 45 minutes of steady work to establish the bevel and hone it (on each iron). I noticed that when I sharpened my chisels on the WorkSharp I set the bevel on the machine at 30 deg. and sharpened to what I thought as a good edge. Once I got the Veritas guide and the water stones I decided to re-sharpen the irons and chisels. I found that when I set the Veritas guide at the 30 deg. setting for the chisels that it set a completely new bevel. Am I doing this right, do you think that I wasted my money on the WorkSharp? How do you guys that have the WorkSharp sharpen your tools - do you just use the WS or do you also use the stones? Any input will be appreciated. I do know that my planes and chisels have never been so sharp, since I honed them on the water stones - so I guess that's the way to go.


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## rikkor (Oct 17, 2007)

From "You Know You're A Lumberjock:"

371. You buy a double wheel grinder to sharpen. Then you buy a slow speed grinder to sharpen. Then you buy glass plates and sticky sandpaper to sharpen. Then you buy Norton waterstones and Veritas jigs to sharpen. Then you buy a WorkSharp 3000 to sharpen. And you don't feel bad about any of it. (P.S. You still have the whole kaboodle)


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## MsDebbieP (Jan 4, 2007)

I haven't done any sharpening .. but I always remember Dick's comment about thinking that his tools were sharp until he bought a quality chisel that came sharp-really sharp. Sounds like you have seen a difference between what you thought was good enough and what is "really sharp". Nothing less will do from now on so whatever you need to do to get that sharpness then that's the way to go.


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## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

I am not good at sharpening, but envy those who can get that razor-sharp edge that makes cutting tools so much more precise.

I go with Ms Debbie's advice.

Dalec


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## schwingding (Dec 5, 2007)

Your stones will produce a better surface than the Worksharp, as you have noticed. Typically the initial bevel is achieved with a grinder and then honed on the stones, saving some of the 45 minutes you required.

The issue you're going to have with the waterstones is that you will need to keep them flat, as they will wear with each use. You can buy a diamond coated stone for this task.

I have a Tormek, and while it makes things fantastically sharp, a good stone will still do better. Why? Because the leather honing wheel on the Tormek deflects as the iron is put to it, which simply is not as accurate as an unmovable stone. I grind on the tormek, then hone on stones. A combo not to be beat!

Angle jigs are not all created equal. Find one and stick with it.


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## mot (May 8, 2007)

Hey Cajun,

The Veritas guide sets a primary and secondary bevel. If you are at 30 degrees but have the roller set to the secondary bevel, then you'll be doing a secondary bevel that is 1-2 degrees more. Check the instruction sheet for what you have to look for on the roller.

I use the Veritas Mk.II sharpener on all my planes and chisels, then run them across a 4000 and 8000 waterstone. If you're enjoying the 4000 stone, grab yourself an 8000 stone for final sharpening. Then you'll be styling!

Cheers!


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## alindobra (Oct 3, 2007)

I use the Veritak Mk.II like tom. I make the primary bevel using coarse sandpaper (start at 100). The secondary bevel is established with 220 and then 600 and moving to the micro-abrasives (Lee-valley sells them here: http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=33004&cat=1,43072). The sandpaper is glued on glass (super flat). If I just have to touch a chisel up it takes less than a minute. I also use leather a strop while I work (just get the edge razor sharp again).

Also, what needs to be kept in mind is that "crazily sharp" is hot helping necessarily a lot unless you cut very soft materials (like cheese). The first time you hit the chisel while cutting cherry, the super sharp just got not so sharp (or microscopically broke). On other hand, sharp makes work much better. You should be able to remove small amounts of wood by paring (pushing the chisel by hand).

I virtually never use a grinder on a chisel (but I never use a stone on a bowl gouge either). I do not see much advantage in using water cooled grinder for chisels (way too slow). These systems cost too much anyway.

Since I am proficient now with the Mk. II jig, I am not considering buying a WorkSharp system. If I would I would buy extra plates and the finest sandpaper they have.

Alin


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## Daren (Sep 16, 2007)

Freehand on wet and oil stones http://lumberjocks.com/projects/3873. I do not let mine get so dull that it takes even 10 minutes to hone them to a razor. I sharpen others that they have goofed all up that can take longer, I have to use several stones (grits). Some of the sharpening systems do speed up the process I guess. But really for me honing an iron/chisel is part of the woodworking experience. I can use the time sharpening to reflect on my next step on a project or whatever, quiet time in the shop.

I know many(most I think) woodworkers who would not even touch a hand plane. They threw them out and only use power planers and jointers. So if you are one of the kinda guys who likes to use a hand plane, I think hand sharpening should be part ones skill set. Just my opinion, because I personally enjoy it.


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## sbryan55 (Dec 8, 2007)

I have used both stones and adhesive sandpaper on glass with a honing guide to try to sharpen my irons and chisels but could never get a satisfactory edge on any of them. They would cut but I could never get a razor sharp edge. (I resisted the Tormak grinder because I tend to be cheap!!!!!). Finally out of frustration with using relatively dull tools I bought a WS3000. Out of the box I produced a mirror edge on my chisels and irons with which I could shave the hair off my arms. It took me several hours to sharpen all my irons and chisels initially because of the poor job I had previously done but now I can renew the edge in just a few minutes if the tool looses any of its edge.


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## Karson (May 9, 2006)

See all of the different ways to sharpen and so many people happy and so many people unhappy.

What a guy to do?


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## cajunpen (Apr 9, 2007)

That is so true Karson - Like Grandpa used to say "Suit yourself and let the rest be pleased". I do appreciate all of the input, I have kept playing with the Veritas Mark II honing guide and water stones and find that I am getting a very sharp edge on my tools. I think I will use the WorkSharp 3000 when I come across a really bad edge on a tool and use the stones and guides for keeping my edges sharp. I have learned that there is nothing like working with a sharp tool - what a different experience ).


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## rpmurphy509 (Nov 6, 2007)

We have a Tormek at work I use once in a great while to reset the hollow grind on older chisels and irons.
For all other sharpening needs I was using oil stones, and just switched to some Japanese water stones.
I don't use a guide, just do it by hand. After a while of doing it by hand the guides just seem to get in my
way and mess me up.

I also have two sets of chisels, one for fine work and paring by hand. The other gets the hammer and mallet
treatment for gross work and mortising.

Stick with a system you're comfortable with, and before long you'll find that even with budget tools and
sharpening, your blades will show your prowess in the cuts they make.


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## Wooder (Dec 9, 2006)

1/4 float glass 12×18 with up to 2000 grit paper. Vertias holder. Waterstones and Arkie stones in drawer now..


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## Harold (Nov 13, 2007)

I use a simple kell guide for the plane blades if I let them go to long. For the chisels I have a 3×10 DMT 600 on one side and 1200 on the other, as Darren metioned above I will touch them more than needed, a couple minutes each day. As I work I have 6×1 hard felt wheel mounted to an old 1/2" drill charged with Dico E5. I keep them polished for a couple reasons, the edge is always very sharp and a smooth finish helps with the salt air. I polish my plane blades and chip breakers for the same reason, once alittle surface rust gets a foothold it is a real hassle to correct.


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## Karson (May 9, 2006)

Frank Klausz uses a regular sharpening grinder with pink or white stones. It cuts a hollow grind and then hones the tip and the shoulder. After wearing it down to where the hone line is getting too big He'll regrind a little and the start the honing all over again.

He took 3-5 minutes at the most to sharpen a chisel.


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## mjsworkshop (Dec 16, 2007)

I've thought a lot about sharpening as I own a small sharpening business as well as do woodworking. For me the important distinctions are these:

1) For most hand tools, flatten and polish the back of the blade. The cutting surface is only as good as its coarsest surface it's a waste of time to polish the face edge of a tool if the back looks like it was sanded with 80 grit. Those scratches in the back of the blade will be present where the back meets the front (your cutting edge) and will weaken it. You'll spend more time sharpening andy our end result will always be substandard. Flattening and polishing the back need only be done once.

2) Shaping/grinding: This is the rough work that is done on either powered grinders of some kind or very coarse stones or sand paper. This is where you create a hollow-grind (if you want one), and set the angle of the tool.

3) Sharpening: This is the process you will use most often. Using either fine stones (or your choice of system: sandpapers, diamond paste, etc). Use what you are most comfortable with. Use jigs if you like them and they help you achieve a better edge.

Optional) Stropping. If you want to strop the edge of the tool, you will create a slightly convex edge. (for chisels and plane irons-Never strop the back of the tool… you've spent a lot of time making the back flat, you don't want a convex edge on the back of the blade) Many folks will tell you not to strop chisels and such because of this convex edge. To me it makes the edge sharper and I've detected no disadvantage in doing it-so I do.

I've used many different systems and here is what I'm currently using:
Grinding: Tormek and/or Baldor grinder
Stones: Shapton ceramic stones

-mj
www.mjsworkshop.org


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

Most guys have a fit over this method, and I really don't recommend it for anything nice. I use a belt sander with a worn out 100 grit belt. I flatten the back, and I get the bevel. It may be 30, 27, 28, or 25 degrees - whatever. I finish it up on a leather strop board from WoodCraft with some polishing compound. The hair will fly off of my arm. This makes my chisels wicked sharp, it works in the field and works fast. I use this method on my chisels but keep in mind they are Buck and Stanley chisels. I would not do this with anything nice like expensive Japanese chisels. But the proof is in the pudding if you have seen my work.

The bottom line is this, it is really about practice.


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## mjsworkshop (Dec 16, 2007)

Oh and I've used the WorkSharp and have just 1 issue with it: If you've polished your tool backs, the tool rest will really scratch them up. Especially if you put the PSA 400 grit little bit of sandpaper they have included on it.

BTW… the company that makes them is just a few blocks from my house in Ashland, OR. They are a great company and asked our local woodworking guild for feedback while they were developing the tool. Where the WS3000 really shines ;-) is in sharpening gouges with the slotted wheels.

-mj


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## derekcohen (Jul 15, 2007)

I recently bought the BUS Smoother and it was sharp out of the box. I also ordered, with the BUS, a set of 1000 & 4000 Japanese Water Stones and the Veritas angle guide. ..... I found that when I set the Veritas guide at the 30 deg. setting for the chisels that it set a completely new bevel. Am I doing this right, do you think that I wasted my money on the WorkSharp?

Cajun, ask a 100 woodworkers how they sharpen their tools - and you will get 100 answers!

A couple of immediate responses …. if you think that a 4000 waterstone gives you "sharp", then wait till you try an 8000. OK, there is a cheaper way … just scribble a little Veritas green rouge (looks like a wax crayon) on a piece of MDF and hone the blade on that after the 4000. THEN you will know Sharp!

Another immediate thought is that you clearly do not know why the BUS is such a super smoother (no offence meant, but when you state that you honed the bevel at 30 degrees because that is what you had on your chisels, well …).

The advantage of the BU (bevel up) planes is that they can alter their characteristics easily with a change of bevel angle. The higher the bevel angle, the better they plane interlinked grain. I tend to use a 50 degree bevel on my BUS (with the 12 degree bed this gives a cutting angle of 62 degrees). A 30 degree bevel (=42 degree cutting angle) would only be suitable for very straight grained face grain on softwood or most end grain. On interlinked grain it is pretty much guaranteed to create tear out!

For a detailed discussion of the BUS, go to my review.

For reference, I grind all BD (bevel down) and non-laminated blades with a hollow, then freehand a microbevel on waterstones. However for BU and laminated blades I grind the primary bevel flat (at 25 degrees) using a belt sander. Then I use the Veritas Honing Guide Mk II to add the chosen microbevel.

Note that a microbevel may only be about .25mm wide. This means that you can complete your honing in a very short time since so little steel is removed.

My tip for the BUS and all BU planes to be used with a camber … only get the blades with a 25 degree bevel. Try and camber a 50 degree primary bevel and you will quickly see that the amount of work to be done is daunting. AND BU blades require a greater amount of camber than a BD blade (its all in the geometry).

Anyway, the BUS is one of the great smoothers - an absolute bargain when you comapre it against some of the great and expensive smoothers around. Enjoy.

Regards from Perth

Derek


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## JJackson (Mar 23, 2007)

Bill,

I will give you my opinion on sharpening from a guy who is cheap, doesn't like to sharpen tools all day, and wants it done now!
My process is very fast and I believe it will make your tools just as sharp as anyone elses.

1. Take plane blade or chisel to grinder. (slow speed grinder with just any medium grit wheel, just don't overheat the steel)

2. Hollow grind the blade or chisel to your desire.
3. Take blade or chisel to table saw/jointer and flatten the back to a polish. (to do this, go to Walmart and buy automobile sandpaper in grits to 3000.
4. Put plane blade or chisel in a Veritas jig and hone away on auto paper you bought from Walmart that is now on a piece of glass. (you could also us table saw or jointer top)
5. After honing, take blade or chisel to grinder that has a cloth wheel on it. Apply diamond paste to wheel, and buff the hollow ground edge, not the back at all.

6. Take blade or chisel and shave hair off a body part of your choice to see how sharp this process makes it.

I don't think this is anything that hasn't been talked about before. I think its a modified scary sharp method.
I started sharpening this way because I got tired of flattening my waterstones (which are expensive) all the time. Also the mess I didn't care for. In my personal opinion, spending a ton of money on sharpening equipment is a waste.

Hope this helps. Remember, I am not a professional, just an average cheap woodworker! : )


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## iSawitfirst (Dec 18, 2007)

Wow!

^^ That sounds really down to earth, easy and cheap. I'm gonna give it a try.


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## Blake (Oct 17, 2007)

I also use the automotive sandpaper. It is simple and cheap. I just wet it and it sticks to a granite slab of piece of glass. The key is to always use new paper and change it often. I use a full sheet which gives me more surface area so it doesn't wear out so quickly.


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## mski (Jul 3, 2007)

One Way AND CHEAP!!!!!!!!!!!!! Save your $$$$$$$$$$$$
Scary Sharp
http://www.shavings.net/SCARY.HTM#original

I can split a hair with this system!!!!!!!!


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## Daren (Sep 16, 2007)

Sorry, self deleted, long winded post. I am not/should not participate in sharpening discussions here.


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## woodnut99 (Dec 17, 2007)

Ask the Japanese! .... Wow some Great tips here… Keep it simple. and try to spend as much time working the as preping the tools. I sometimes get lost in tool prep. And realize it was fine when I started for the job I was doing.. My simple advice, which is what your probably up to take a day every few months to re-work all chisels and plane blades… then only fine tune between jobs.. If you restoring a frame for the metropolitan museum yes use a leather strop after each chisel strike.. I'm try to equal my tools for my specific jobs… Not get too picky, which I've noticed myself doing lately with all this great advice! Some time over sharpening, creating too thin of a bevel and chipping my metal, cause I began to favor one chisel over others.. ... Good luck there's nothing like a really sharp chisels.. I'm for sure gonna save this page and return to it, thanks.. Patrick p.s. The right chisel for the right job Is most important I'm finding.. Thanks alan dobra , todd, and karson Together they form a GOOD FORMULA…


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## derekcohen (Jul 15, 2007)

Hey guys, Cajun is asking about sharpening the blade for his BUS, a BU bladed plane. The rules are slightly different for these planes compared to planes of the bevek down (BD) variety.

With a BD plane, the angle of the bevel makes no difference. The cutting angle is obtained from the angle of the frog (in, for example, a Stanley plane this would be 45 degrees). With a BU plane, the cutting angle is obtained from the bed angle (12 degrees) plus the bevel angle (so, to cut at 45 degrees, the bevel angle would need to be 33 degrees). A degree here-of-there is not important, but where as a 30 degree bevel on a BD plane would still enable you to plane face grain, the same bevel on a BU plane would lead to tear out.

Bottom line - you cannot just go and hollow grind a BU plane blade at any angle and do a quick honing of the resultant microbevel. It will work poorly! BU planes are very flexible in that they can plane at many angles, but these need to be set using a honing guide. I recommend at +/- 37 degree primary bevel with a couple more degrees for the micro secondary bevel. This is very easy to set up on the Veritas Mk II.

All the above advice (from forum members) on preparing blades is fine for chisels and whatever - there are a million ways to do this, and I could name/describe most - but they are inappropriate for Cajun's BUS.

For a simple method for chisels or BD blades, try this out …

http://www.wkfinetools.com/contrib/dCohen/z_art/sharpSys/sharpSys1.asp

Regards from Perth

Derek


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## MikeLingenfelter (Feb 19, 2007)

Has anyone really done the math on the cost of sandpaper for sharpening? I'm not saying sandpaper doesn't give you a sharp edge, but the "cheap" part I think is misleading. You can get a nice set of King combo waterstones for maybe $60 and if you go with Norton you can get a set for maybe $100. I think you would go through $60-$100 worth of sandpaper long before these stones would ever wear out.

In the short term, sandpaper can be cheaper but in the long run I think it's more expensive.


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

I really like the Scary Sharp system… simple… VERY GOOD… and economical.

http://www.woodworkstuff.net/scary.html


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## YooperCasey (Nov 27, 2007)

While I haven't used the WS system myself I do have the Veritas Mk2 in my shop and thoroughly love the edge I get on the japanese waterstones that came with the system. As far as you noticing a new bevel being created…

I think you are getting to a point in sharpening where you are seeing a tolerance mismatch. Both pieces of equipment are going to have a setpoint, plus or minus a certain tolerance. When you unclamp your plane blade or chisel and place it into the other piece of equipment you are effectively resetting that tolerance to what the other machine has. So the WS may have an angle of 30 degrees +/- 5', and the Veritas may have one that is 30 Degrees +/- 5'. In reality the worksharp could be 29 Degrees and 55 minutes, while the Veritas is 30 degrees and 5 minutes. That is 10 minutes difference, or .16 degrees.

As an aside, at lunch today I'll grab one of my chisels that I just sharpened on my Veritas Mk2, and put it into our optical comparator and see how it performs.

In an ideal world the clamping and workholding would be utterly rigid and perfect. Though, as someone who works in a production grinding shop, it is rarely so. Any time you remove a part from a fixture and place it in another one, even if it differs ever so slightly it will require an initial cleanup before you have to remove fresh material. Even the finest Studer or Junkers grinders have this, even if it is a fraction of anything we are dealing with.

As to the economics of the scary sharp system… I've been in a time study and econometrics kinda mood at work so maybe I'll run it through and see what happens…


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## Dorje (Jun 17, 2007)

"As to the economics of the scary sharp system… I've been in a time study and econometrics kinda mood at work so maybe I'll run it through and see what happens…"

That could be interesting…


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## MikeLingenfelter (Feb 19, 2007)

That would be interesting, I was just going with my gut and quick calculation of what I pay for sandpaper. I hadn't gotten scientific with it yet .


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