# Which Smooth Plane to buy?



## 12strings

I need advice on purchasing a smoothing plane.

I don't want to spend more than $200, so lie neilson is out. Currently in consideration:

-Veritas #4 1/2
-Veritas small BU Smoother
-Wood River #4
-Look for an old Stanley #4

I have zero experience with Bevel-up planes, other than block planes. I have an old Stanley #5 that I have tune up and use for both general use and smoothing, and really like it. Given that, should I not consider the BU smoother at all…will it be too different from a standard bench plane? Does anyone have experience with more than one of these to rate one over the other?

I really only want to have one smoother (I'm a simple man).


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## nwbusa

Here's my two cents (or $200)... I've got an old Record #4 (basically the same as a Stanley) and a Veritas BU smoother. I paid $20 for the Record and $219 for the Veritas.

They both do a great job of smoothing.

The Veritas is "nicer" both in looks/feel (personal preference) and features (set screws to prevent lateral blade movement, for example). Is it $200 nicer? For me, it was. But that's mostly because I like to buy shiny new tools. The reality is that the $20 Record plane does everything I would need a smoothing plane to do.

I like the Veritas bevel up planes for a couple of reasons. 1) No frog adjustments = simpler set-up (I know, it's not that difficult to fettle a standard bench plane, but still…) and 2) I also own the Veritas LA jack and jointer planes, which use the same blades as the BU smoother. That means I only needed to buy one high angle (50 deg) blade and one toothed blade, and those blades fit all three planes.

Not sure if any of that helps you at all, but good luck with your decision!


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## knotscott

I'd take a good older American made plane over a new Asian import any day, but I'm sure just about any of them can be made to work. LN, Veritas, Clifton, etc., are top shelf, with a price tag to match….if budget allows, you're all but guaranteed a fine plane right out of the box. If you can't justify the price difference, and good used older plane is my choice. Good Quality Hand Planes On a Budget


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## BigYin

Pre war stanley 4 1/2 is the best choice for a smoother. same length as a No.4 but wider.

http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan1.htm#num1

the above site will advise on what you need to look for.

Ebay today has a 4c in US price still low.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/STANLEY-BAILEY-No-4C-SMOOTH-PLANE-/190736992839?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2c68cf8a47


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## donwilwol

I've got LN, veritas and vintage. LN, veritas seem to work right out of the box with just a little fussing. Vintage takes a little fussing unless you get it pre-tuned from several LJ's who do it. Side by side a well tuned vintage works the same and cost a lot less.

I've got a LN #62. Its a great plane, I just wish I'd got the #164. If I didn't have a good #4 or #604, that would be first. My recommendation is a good vintage #4.


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## lj61673

You can cross the Veritas #4-1/2 off your list for $200 or less.

The Veritas small BU smoother is a great piece, super flat blade right out of the box. Just a quick honing with your favorite sharpening method and you're ready to roll


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## 12strings

Good point on the price of the 4.5. Maybe I was thinking of the #4 price.


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## BTimmons

*Don W* is too modest not to plug his own site. ^^^ His collection of planes that he restores and sells are quite nice, and reasonably priced. I bought an old #4 from him that I'm quite happy with.


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## NiteWalker

Veritas bevel up smoother.
I'm in love with the veritas bevel up planes.


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## HorizontalMike

An old/older #4 smoother with a NEW quality blade, like a Hock, would keep you under a hundred and put you into a higher quality tool. I did this with one of my old Sargent #418s and it kicks butt now. Not going to argue which blade is best because there are several after-market blades that make these old planes hum…


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## ITnerd

+1 to Brian; Don W's stuff is the way to go unless the 200 is burning a hole in your pocket. he has a fully refurbished Stanley Defiance +4 for 32 bucks! You could pick up a ready-to-go 3 and 4 and still take the wifey out for a steak dinner.


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## BTimmons

Exactly my thinking. I could recommend that everyone get a Lie Nielsen smoother, but I'm poor! So I give the kind of advice I feel economically qualified to give.


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## Woodendeavor

I was not a hand plane user until recently. Went to a local woodworking show where Lee Valley was demonstrating the Veritas family of planes. My first and only plane so far is a Veritas low angle smoothing plane. I purchased this plane for the flat sides for use with a shooting board. I now own 5 blades for this plane that make it so versatile. I have 2 25 degree blades, one straight and one cambered; one 38 degree blade, straight; and 2 50 degree blades, one straight and one cambered. I bought the additional blades over time but with an investment of $320 I have 5 planes to use


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## donwilwol

I've written this statement about 100 times here on LJ's, so I'll write it again. We all work a little different. I tend to be a bit impatient. I have a LN #62, so I know how easy it is to change the blade, but it's nothing like reaching over and grabbing another plane, already set foir the task. And we're talking a price difference that's pretty insignificant.

The other part of that is a plane sized to make a good jack, makes a fair smoother and so forth.

I'll be honest, if I win the lotto, I'll have a whole set of LN planes, but then, there's no way I'd sell my whole set of vintage either.

It may sound like a really tough decision, but its really not, whether you buy vintage, LN or veritas, if you pay a reasonable price, your not going to lose to much on the resell side, should it come to that.

The most important aspect of hand planing is have fun!!


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## 12strings

Thanks for all the advice… I think, after looking at Don W's tools, I think I'm sold on getting a vintage smoother. 
It will compliment my trusty #5 nicely…after that, all I need is a shoulder plane, and my plane collection might just be complete. 

I hope to go to the WWI marketplace in a few weeks to hold some #3's and #4's to find out which feels better in my hand…I'm thinking the 3 might be too small…and I have no idea how anybody uses a #2 or a #1.


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## donwilwol

I don't use the #1 very often, but when I do, I hold it like a block plane and it works very well and is actually a lot more comfortable than it looks. Look in the comment section http://lumberjocks.com/topics/42268

I like the number to for some small task. I wouldn't start smoothing a table top with it, but hey, its just cool.

Everyone should have a #4 in my opinion (#4 size, doesn't need to be a Stanley). A #3 is also nice, but the #4 should come first, unless you are very young, or very small built. Which I am neither.


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## PPK

I'm new to (posting) on Lumber Jocks, although I've read lots of the threads for good info. Should this be a new thread?

I'm strongly considering buying a Veritas bevel up smoothing plane, but I've read that a lot of people don't like the handles (not swept forward enough) and also that the norris style adjuster is really close you your hand when gripping the tote. has anyone found this to be true? Can one get other handles for these planes. I don't like that on the Lie-Nielsons there's no side-to side adjustment. I'm kind of new to the realm of planes, btw.

THanks,
Pete


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## chiseler

I have 1 LN plane and about a Doz. old stanleys, and I always reach for my stanleys first. You can't go wrong with a refurbed Stanley/Bailey plane for a fraction of that price. Tried and true for me for almost 40 yrs.


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## OSU55

Depends on what wood you are smoothing. As long as you stick to fairly straight grained wood, any Stanley Bailey 4 or 4-1/2 properly tuned will do just fine. I have 2 of each that perform very well, but they have limits, just as any of the standard 45° bevel down planes do, including LN and Veritas. A properly dressed chip breaker helps (described here) but has its limits also.

If you like more wooly, twisted, reversing grain stuff, these will create tear out. The simplest solution for this is a #80 cabinet scraper. A Veritas scraper plane is a much more expensive solution (review here). Another solution is a Mujingfang 63° wooden smoother, $75 from Woodcraft. Requires some tuning and can be a pita to get adjusted just right, but does a super job. The high angle makes it hard to push, which is a pita when using on straight grain.

The Veritas small and full size BU smoothers can handle any situation with the right bevel on the blade. I have the full size, with blades beveled at 38°(50° cut) and 50° (62° cut). The freshly sharpened 50° bevel handles just about anything. I haven't tried a toothed blade, which is another possibility.

Several options to address smoothing needs. If you only want 1 tool though, one of the Veritas BU smoothers with multiple blades is the only solution. For those who don't like Veritas totes, here is a redesign to make your own.

For the very best solution, a Veritas custom plane, 4 or 4-1/2, with one or 2 extra frogs at different angles, would be that cat's a**. Starting to get over $400 for one plane though…............

The cheapest is a #4 or 4-1/2, and a #80, that you refurb yourself. No need for thick aftermarket blades or chipbreakers - properly sharpened and tuned the OEM stuff works just fine.


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## PPK

Wow! Thanks OSU55. I wonder why I never thought of joining before. information tailored to the question is way better than hunting around for an answer. Currently I own a Millers Falls #22 jointer and the infamous Harbor Freight "bench plane" #33 or something like that, and a Stanley block plane. They all make shavings. more or less. I've been bidding on some Stanleys on Ebay, but just can't seem to bring myself over $30 for a rusty looking old timer. I'll keep looking.

I have mainly worked with Hickory (not a good thing to learn hand planing on, I know) since that's what I find beautiful. Currently working on a set of Hickory bar stool height chairs with walnut accents, and want to plane off the milling marks left from my router/flush trim bit after template routing.


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