# Political/controversial topics



## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

I cannot tell anyone else what to do and I would not attempt to try.

However, let me advise my fellow LJ friends that I make it a point to never read or comment on any non-shop talk topic that appears to be political or controversial. I, effectively, boycott them.

I encourage others to consider adopting the same policy.


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

Rich- I like you. I agree with you. But COME ON! Why do we have to go through this cycle every week or so? Someone posts a political thread. Someone doesn't like those threads so he posts one saying he doesn't. Arguments erupt…

If you don't like the threads, and you don't waste your time reading them, why waste your time starting new threads to comment on them?

Don't get me wrong, I'm not against you or your opinion. It's that just every time one of these "I don't like something" threads pop up, some controversy starts and another old LJ leaved the site…


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

I am 100% with you Rich.
There are more than enough forums for political ranting.


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## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

landog - - I'll have to make another tractor video. Maybe the next one will be a little more refined. OTOH - It's crudeness may be part of its appeal. However, there will be no red tractor videos coming from me. The closest I could get is my Toro zero turn ratio (ZTR) lawn mower that that would not be very interesting.

Stumpy - - We obviously disagree. I respect you and your opinions but on this issue I guess we have to agree to disagree. For the record, I am not suggesting a ban on these controversial topics. I'm only saying that I elect not to read or comment on them.


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## dbhost (Jul 20, 2009)

I won't interfere with anyone else' right to discuss anything, and in particular Religion or Politics. However, I come to the woodworking forums for woodworking and related topics… And unless I can be convinced that the political or religious topics are directly related to woodworking, I avoid them like the plague… They simply sow discord into an otherwise harmonious community.

I am not offended by them, just saddened that there are folks that feel so strongly about these threads, and can't seem to steer away from them that they end up leaving LJs… FWIW, this is the only woodworking forum I am on that tolerates those discussions period… As a moderator on another site, I hate killing political type threads, but I have to do it… I wish Martin would implement some stronger rules and moderation here…


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

Rich- Fair enough. Hopefully this thread will just be a nice discussion. But if it turns bad, be prepared for my well prepared and thoroughly sarcastic "I told you so"... 

By the way, another professional woodworker left the site yesterday. I won't mention his name, but it appears he was so fed up with the content on this site that he asked for every trace of him, even his projects, comments in old forums and PM's in people's in-boxes to be removed. I noticed when I went to send him a PM and he was gone without a trace…


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## Paul2274 (Nov 17, 2009)

Here, here !!

Unless we form the Wood Party !

Rich for President !!

Paul


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

Rich-I think that's the way it should be. I come to LJ's to get away from such stuff … if I want to pick a fight or get into a pi$$ing match, all I have to do is walk into the office next to mine (both at work and at home)!

-Gerry


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

Gerry- You pi$$ in the office next to yours?


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## BigTiny (Jun 29, 2010)

Hi Rich.

I'm all for political posts here. Carved busts or marquetry images of Lincoln, Washington, Jefferson et all would be fine with me, as would the same treatments of elephants and donkeys or even marquetry copies of FDR or JFK campaign buttons, enlarged for ease of construction of course. 

Paul


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

Stumpy-Only if I can't make it down the hall fast enough … when you get to be my age, you'll understand!

-Gerry


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## live4ever (Feb 27, 2010)

Completely with you Rich. Like many others I come here for woodworking knowledge and discussion. It's nice to be a part of a harmonious community with little or no division. Politics are the antithesis of that.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Oh not this one AGAIN.
Folks, Look at, Read, respond, don't respond to anything that takes your fancy on the LJ site. It is YOUR choice, so there is no need to keep "looking over the fence" to see what others with a completely different line of thought or subject are discussing if it does not interest you.
I am not all that keen on political/religion posts etc., every one to their own choices.


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## patcollins (Jul 22, 2010)

The problem with poilitical conversations on here is people take things way to personally. "Oh they dont agree with me, they must be evil" People treat their politicians too much like their favorite football team, YaY US BOO Them.

Generally political message boards are fully of tne wingbats of all types and talking to them really has no point to it. Talking about this sort of thing at LJ is almost like talking to your friends because I bet most people here are fairly similar and would probably get along just fine face to face. I dont know about you all but I have friends that I couldnt be more different from in my beliefs but we are still friends and we talk about this sort of thing, even bust on each other about it from time to time.

If someone is the type of person that gets all butthurt when someone else doesnt agree with them they need to stay off the internet in general and go live in a cave. Its very easy to not click on something.

And lastly the Dallas Cowboys suck!


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

I think there are two things that should never be spoken of in polite company. Politics, and bowel movements. Why? Because they both inevitably produce the same result.

Let's face it, if you like Republicans you will always support them as the only hope for the nation. If you like Democrats, there way will always be the best. But in the end, does anything ever really change except the D or the R?

I have a better idea… instead of arguing about which political party is best (since history has shown that neither can solve the problems we face), let's talk about which RELIGION is best (since clearly only God can fix this mess). I'll bet we'll have no arguments at all over religion!...


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## wiswood2 (Apr 12, 2008)

We see enough political lies on TV.
Lets stay in the shop.
Chuck


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## dakremer (Dec 8, 2009)

i usually dont participate in the political forums either, because they dont interest me what so ever. However - i am not bothered by them IN THE LEAST. The fact that there are threads like this one (which cause more drama than the political threads themselves) makes no sense to me. You obviously felt compelled to start this forum topic because political threads really really bother you and you want a following of boycots. However if you aren't going into the the threads and reading them and getting caught up in them….how are they bothering you?


> ? I dont read those threads…and they dont affect me at all, and dont affect my LJ experience at all. I just dont get how they are affecting you guys in such a horribly negative way


??

All of the "complainers" like to say that political threads just dont belong on woodworking forums. Well….. starting threads about not wanting political threads on woodworking forums is the EXACT same thing. Its completely absurd. In fact you can almost call THIS a political thread because now we are talking about the "politics" of Lumberjocks, and what should and should not be allowed, etc ,etc.

Usually its the complainers that cause more problems and issues than the people talking in the political threads. The people participating in those threads obviously know that the topic could get heated, etc. They CHOOSE to participate….just as you CAN CHOOSE to NOT participate.

If the complainers stopped complaining about the political threads (and stopped participating in them), and the people who enjoy political threads kept participating in them…...the world would be a much happier place

PS - I'm sure politics is talked about in MANY woodworking shops. And seeing how this site is like a big woodworking shop, the NON-SHOP TALK (i.e. non-woodworking talk) forum seems like a completely appropriate place

good grief….....lets all get over it


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## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

On this site we have the option of seeing all the forum categories or we can select one category we want to review.

I would really like the option to see every category except X. Better yet, the option to pick which of the multiple categories I want to see. I would select everything except non-shop talk.

Administrators - Give us this option and the world will be better.


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

I made an almost exact likeness of a president 
but it was not made of wood 
it would not balance 
it was only one letter away from being scrap 
so I flushed it.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Nah David, fess up. You had the runs and thought you were melting.


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## longgone (May 5, 2009)

Lumberjocks just needs to become a catch-all site about every category imaginable….and then we all can pick and choose what we want to read and participate in. Woodworking, politicks, religion, prostitution, dugs, the daily news etc. 
*Who needs just a woodworking-only website? If someone creates a good woodworking-only website I will be on it like white-on-rice…but it doesn't yet exist so I choose to put up with this one for now*


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## dakremer (Dec 8, 2009)

haha David - that was funny!

Rich - I actually really like that idea. For the people that cannot BARE to see a title of a political thread, this would be perfect. It would eliminate all the complaining, and would eliminate having to see those threads if you didnt want to. Good thing for the admins to consider!


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

lol @ Rex (mr.beenthereandonethat) ;=)


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Don't get so frantic Greg, They have asked the administrators to pamper everyone individually, especially those who can't decipher a category. They are going to offer personally preferred screen layouts, glowing buttons with your choice of color and sound effect, and screen in your favorite color. Additionally a "Read to Me" option will be available for those who need it.


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

lol @ Rex (mr.neverbeentherebutknowswherehe'sgoing) ;=)


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## pierce85 (May 21, 2011)

"All of the "complainers" like to say that political threads just dont belong on woodworking forums. *Well….. starting threads about not wanting political threads on woodworking forums is the EXACT same thing. Its completely absurd.* In fact you can almost call THIS a political thread because now we are talking about the "politics" of Lumberjocks, and what should and should not be allowed, etc ,etc."

Nope. If there were no political threads, there'd be no reasonable need for threads of the type that Rich started. There is no equivalence here.

I can make statements against discussions that promote pollution without being in the same league as those who promote pollution. What's absurd it equating the two…


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## dakremer (Dec 8, 2009)

You're completely missing the point, Pierce. Political threads arent against any rules here. So they are COMPLETELY appropriate. People are complaining about them because they think they are inappropriate for the site, and apparently they bother them tremendously. Posting a thread about not commenting on political threads is just as "inappropriate" as the political threads themselves - how does this thread "belong" in a woodworking forum?? (according to the "complainer's" theory) Its completely hypocritical. Basically Rich wishes he could hide his own forum topic from himself so he didnt have to see it…..

"Nope. If there were no political threads, there'd be no reasonable need for threads of the type that Rich started. There is no equivalence here."

- there ARE political threads on LJs…..and theres still no reasonable need for this thread.


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## pierce85 (May 21, 2011)

dakremer…

Sorry, but I didn't miss your point at all. It reads as it reads. It's simply not logically correct. Again, I can be against the presence of something and voice my opposition without being the same as that to which I'm expressing opposition.

E.g., I oppose Republicans are think they're idiots. That statement makes me neither a republican nor an idiot - and most certainly not the latter. ;-)


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## dakremer (Dec 8, 2009)

*1)* some people's opinions - political threads are inappropriate for woodworking forums - because not woodworking related, because they cause drama and heated comments, and differing opinions. Lets boycott and complain about these threads. Would like to block these kinds of threads so I dont have to see them

*2)* I am one of those people who dont like political threads because of reasons stated above. So I am going to start a thread about NOT commenting on political threads. This thread will not be woodworking related, it will probably cause drama and heated comments AND differing opinions. I want to boycott and complain about my own thread and also please block me from my own thread so I do not have to see it.

I can't get any clearer than that. You are completely missing the point. MY POINT is that this thread is completely hypocritical and no different than the political threads themselves according to why political threads "should not" be allowed…


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## ShaneA (Apr 15, 2011)

Rich, I support your boycott and anyone else who you can get to join you. Not looking is a great solution. If I am not mistaken it should be easy to skip over topics that dont interest you. I know that I dont read every forum, blog, or project description. Its always a matter of what interests us. I dont have a scroll saw, so I really dont identify with those topics. If a woodworker no longer wants to be a part of this site because he/she cant look past limited political content, I suggest that they have bigger problems to worry about, than what woodworking site they call home, and I wish them luck.


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

If the "I don't waste my time reading the political threads" crowd wants to boycott the political threads- how will they do it? By all agreeing to not read the political threads?

How will that work since you're already not reading them?


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## ShaneA (Apr 15, 2011)

Stumpy, I think that is how they could do it. And if it is successful, and i hope that it is, no one would have to leave the site because of too much political talk.


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## pierce85 (May 21, 2011)

No dakreimer,

What you've done is simply redefine the conditions under which statements against political discussion on LJ are impossible because you've defined such opposition as political. Why are they political? Because they're non-woodworking related just as political discussions are non-woodworking related. Therefore, any statement against political discussions is itself political because it's non-woodworking related.

Gee wiz, how could you argue against something that you're engaged in yourself? That's a real stumper.

In other words, you've set it up so that any expressed opposition to political discussions on LJ is self-defeating because they're non-woodworking related, and because political discussions are also non-woodworking related, any opposition to political discussions on LJ is itself considered political discussion.

It's a neat trick but a very old one, sometimes referred to as a correlative-based fallacy.


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## HawkDriver (Mar 11, 2011)

I could care less about the existence of the non-shop talk area. However, one thing to take note of, is that a thread is started almost weekly as someone stated earlier against it. You don't see these "anti" threads starting about other topics or forums, so maybe it's an issue that needs attention.


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## 747DRVR (Mar 18, 2009)

I agree with you 100% Rich


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

A short while ago *Martin* took the trouble to produce some stats of the percentage of "Non-Shop" postings there were against those in all the other categories. The results said it:
I recall *95%* was was woodworking posts and *5%* was Non-Shop items which *"included" * political threads, - *but only a small fraction of that *5%* was political*.
It is quite clear to those who understand statistics that any political posts are less than 5%, maybe 2%, so are we incapable of avoiding 2% of what we don't like, or do we object that 2% of the membership likes it?
IS it pure greed to want ALL the cake, can't you share?, can't you just ignore something you don't want to take part in?, is anyone forcing you?
The whole thing is childish and stupid and stinks of domination …....seig heil


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## NormG (Mar 5, 2010)

This is just like my first woodworking project a 51 years ago. And that is all I ma going to say


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## bigkev (Mar 16, 2011)

This is getting silly.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

*................. and they all lived happily ever after. Say goodnight Gracie.*


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## dakremer (Dec 8, 2009)

"You can feel the political tension and it arises on many other threads" - Outside of Nonshop talk forum, I've never (personally) read political stuff. If you only want woodworking, then stay out of Nonshop talk, and you wont get any politics…...

also on a side note…this site is like "Martin's woodshop" and he lets everyone come in and be a part of it. He obviously allows political threads because he has created a place for it (nonshop talk forum), and hasnt removed any of it…..If you were to come into my woodshop and dictate what me and my friends were allowed to talk about, you'd get the boot. Get past it, get over it, shape up, or ship out


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## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

>"FWIW, this is the only woodworking forum I am on that tolerates those discussions period… "

Well said dbHost and ShipWright. As a moderator elsewhere, I don't understand why Martin/Escelate embraces it either. Nowhere but LJ. It can be filtered on the pulse page, but nowhere else. Well, they almost fixed it.

Edit: That was funny David G.


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

Maybe Martin is amused as well. ;=)

It's all harmless as long as at the end of the day you have respect for others' thought, beliefs, and perceptions. Especially for the idiots that … just kidding ;=)

It takes a village, you know ? Even if some of the houses have padded walls.


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## dakremer (Dec 8, 2009)

"laced with fowl language"-give me a break. Quit trying to slander me, and make me look bad. Calling you a moron (which I did) I dont think qualifies. Pretty pathetic move for someone who "doesnt play 10 year old games" (like you said)

once the lies and exaggerations start flying around is when I leave…..seeya

Rich - nothing i said was meant to be directed right at you. I have nothing personally against you, and sorry for "taking over" your thread.


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## doordude (Mar 26, 2010)

I think Rich, is just baiting everyone. he really loves politicle discourse, and reads this stuff in the dimly lite corner of his house. Oh wait; i do that too… see Rich now you've suckered me into reading this stuff. but i like it. alright, there i admitted it . Ok i'm a sawdust eating conservative repuub-ic. there i'm out ; somewhere, now and where that is i don't know. i guess i'll have to read a non shop topic to find out.
I LOVE YOU GUYS !


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## pierce85 (May 21, 2011)

You're a class act, dakremer…


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## dakremer (Dec 8, 2009)

thanks for the compliment. You didnt have to


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## pierce85 (May 21, 2011)

My own personal policy with regard to private messages on any forum, whether here at Lumberjocks or the many other forums of which I've been a member, is that when I receive a private message from another member that is abusive in any way, I make that message public - almost always.

The reason for this is simple. Private messages should not be an avenue for members to hide behind when expressing their anger and abuse toward another member. It's not simply an abuse of the private messaging system but an abuse of the forum itself. It's a form of cyber bullying and the fact that it's being done through private messaging makes it even more egregious.

I've received a private message from Dakremer that clearly violates Lumberjocks terms of service. I'm not making this message public, but I am requesting that Martin take some sort of action.

It's up to two messages now. Darkremer, I'm asking you to stop private messaging me. Chill out, dude.


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## dakremer (Dec 8, 2009)

hahahahaha - you guys are awesome. Did you secretly PM each other and come up with a plan to slander my name?? I wouldnt put it past you. This is getting ridiculous. I'm out of here (again)

trust me. I'm "chill"


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

*Rich*- I think I'd better start warming up for my "I was right song"...


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## Gene01 (Jan 5, 2009)

I read the political threads. They validate my opinion that most woodworkers are fairly intelligent and have far ranging interests. Besides, I like to argue with NBEENER. 
There are other types of threads that are pure woodworking that I don't read simply because the subjects don't pique my interest. 
So Rich, I'm with you. If a thread isn't your cup of tea, don't bother with it. There's quite enough great stuff on this site to keep one glued to the computer for hours without having to venture out of one's zone of comfort.


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

I like to argue with me, too, *Gene* ;-)


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Neil, 
You *are* just one big walking and talking argument. lol


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## Sawkerf (Dec 31, 2009)

Personally, I quit arguing with myself when I realized that I was losing most of them.


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

I can't believe how much we talk about not talking about this.


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

Landog,
I learned along time ago to ONLY respond to dekremer "ON-Thread" and *never* offline. And Pierce has it right that dakremer "...is a class act". I NOTICED Pierce's sarcasm though it appears dakremer missed it. *;-)*

I truly support what Rich is saying and hope that folks WILL boycott political posts. Since all, or nearly all, of these posts come from the far-right, I will fill in for the Left. I look forward to the day I will no longer need to do that, but until then…


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Yes Al, it is amazing how many argumentative people respond and engage in a basically argumentative post. Can't argue with that can you?
I'm still waiting for a post on Love - some want it, some don't get it, making it, losing it etc., etc. The mind boggles as to what a post's threads would contain. lol


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

Love is like … oxygen:
You get too much, you get too high.
Not enough and you're gonna' die.

-Sweet (1978)


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

I've been through diamonds
I've been through minks
I've been through it all 
Love stinks

LOVE STINKS
J. Geils Band - 1980


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

You love to hate me
But you won't kill me
Suicidal surge
Desensitize the world

Diabolus in Musica
-Slayer (1998)

What? It says "love" in it?


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Good morning Mike, how do you like this weather?

Does advocating boycotting mean that a person will endeavor to refrain from using a product, service or whatever as a sign of their disapproval and to exert pressure for changes that they want to be made?
If so, they have every opportunity to boycott just by "not going there", which apparently they seem unable to do.
Boycott is a term used mostly attached to *political issues*, exactly what the complaint is about. 
Why not boycott all Chinese tools, that would do us all more good.

A boycott is an act of voluntarily abstaining from using, buying, or dealing with a person, organization, or country as an expression of protest, usually for political reasons. It can be a form of consumer activism.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Al, what more can I say------I Love It.


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## Gene01 (Jan 5, 2009)

Rex,
I tried to boycott Chinese tools. Can't afford to, anymore. Sigh.


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

This might be the simplest boycott in the history of boycotting. 
I respect Mike because he's educated on the issues, has strong feelings on them, and feels compelled to correct broadcasted claims that he believes to be patently false and maybe even grounded in provable mistruths. Mike and I are on opposite sides of the fence most times but he makes me question my position through well articulated and well considered arguments. I can totally understand why he feels compelled to comment. I've got zero beef with any of that. If I did, I wouldn't push my left mouse key.

Edited for bad grammar.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Al, Mike is an OK guy, he's a Texan for heavens sake !!!!
I know he says what he thinks, not just on the spur of the moment.

This post subject is really just a folly that opens up old arguments again. I believe the administrators of this site have enough to do keeping it up and running, so asking for personal additional features to be made shows a lack of respect, especially when the solution is already in place. If people are too lazy to use the available tools, then I feel they have no right to expect changes to their own liking----after all, this is a FREE site, NO fees.


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

OK Al,
I don't want you wearing out that left index finger, so be careful and only use your block planes with your *right*(NOT political right) hand. OOPS, I guess that would be wearing out your RIGHT index finger on the mouse. Carry on and use it at will…

*;-)*


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

^LOL!


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

I think there's not enough threads on here that are written by lovers of the 1950's craftsman 24" scroll saw. So I say we ban all scroll saw threads (they're all dominated by the bench top scroll saw lovers. It's not fair…)

Sorry Mike, couldn't help myself…


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

*You know it's just the RIGHT* (hand) *that keeps pushing the LEFT* (mouse button) *to do things.*

*;-)*


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Yes Jeff, and it is a bright new day to enjoy


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

Nope, Landog. That doesn't count. The only guy on LJ's besides me who I've seen using the Craftsman one is Mr. Mere Mortals. I need to ask him about his because I can't get my blade tensioned. My understanding is that there is no thesioning mechanism, that it tightens itself through the pull stroke. But in practice it is floppy as heck and won't cut properly. I've been trying to figure that one out for a couple years, so the saw mostly takes up a lot of room in the shop.

This is an example of one of these saw I found on google images.


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

Landdog- That is actually not my saw. Mine is the same model, and mine is in a lot better condition. That is just a photo I took off the internet rather than go out and photograph my saw. These things are SUPER heavy duty, just one big hunk of cast iron. There's a built in light (uncommon back then) and the table has a tilting mechanism of even better quality that most band saws!

It's movement mechanism is the same shape as the body- one big "C" inside all that cast iron. So the blade is not pulled up with each stroke and tensioned by pulling against the bottom arm like most saws- BOTH the top arm and the bottom arm move up and down on their own. So I fail to see how the blade can be tensioned during the stroke. Yet there's no tensioning mechanism that I can find to manually tighten it!


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Stumps & landog: Some decorum please. What gives you the right to hijack this thread about political content by infusing woodworking tool conversations here.
We don't want to start a trend where you can also get WW info on a Non-Shop post do we?
Consider yourselves chastised ….... no supper for you.


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## SCOTSMAN (Aug 1, 2008)

Let's just all agee to be friends.Pal,s buddies and jocks.Or is that politically unacceptable LOL


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

I'll drink to that Alistair


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

Don't mess with me, Roger- or I'll start a new thread announcing I'm leaving the site over all the non-wood related threads!

AND I'LL NAME NAMES!!!!!!!!!!


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

WOO - HOO Stumps, you are *BAD*

I still think we should have a Roast Category?


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## ShaneA (Apr 15, 2011)

A roast forum would turn uglier than the political forums! No doubt that there would be some hurt feelings there. But I am sure it would be amusing, to me, at least.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

landog, as a penance, you are required to make 300 tons of sawdust before you go to bed.

Shane: We would have to carefully pick our victims, only LJs with a sense of humor. No Politics, Religion allowed, but woodworking skills etc., etc. may be included so that the roast can truly have WW content to pass the litmus test.
I will be tough finding a target, almost as tough as looking for a virgin at the Chicken Ranch, but we can try.
Any suggestions folks?


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## 280305 (Sep 28, 2008)

Stumpy,

So sorry to hear that your blade remains floppy even during the stroke.


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

Zing! ChuckV for the win!


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## Gene01 (Jan 5, 2009)

Need a blue pill for stumpy's limp and floppy blade.


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## greasemonkeyredneck (Aug 14, 2010)

Don't ask me why (I have no idea), but I decided to weigh in on the political discussions abound.
I am a VERY politically vocal person, under the right conditions.
I NEVER discuss politics or religion on the internet. I feel it is just a waste of my time.
I do appreciate the Non-Shop Talk forum allowing the political threads though. I do enjoy reading other people's thoughts on political topics.
I read some of the political threads on here and completely agree with certain people. I keep my thoughts to myself, but enjoy reading them.
I read some of the political threads on here and completely DIS-agree with certain people. I keep my thoughts to myself, but enjoy reading them.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

It was William (no) Tell


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