# Dust



## teejk (Jan 19, 2011)

I'll start by saying sorry about a new post on an old topic but I've been through so many posts (many quite dated).

So let's refresh the topic with updates to all the reviews that were posted when the machines were new and the user experiences were still evolving.

My single user shop is 30×40 with 10 foot ceilings (all metal clad). Contractor TS, DP and my sanding table are the only tools I would consider fixed, the other stuff (BS, planer, jointer etc.) are mobile.

For the most part, my work is contained to about half of of the space (i.e. 20×30). I have 240v on a separate 20a breaker ready to terminate with the outlet at/near where the DC will be parked in the working space.

I like the idea of a mobile DC. Don't scream at me if I say I don't want anything to do with HF (too many Craftsman tools in the garbage to count so my shop is entirely Delta/PC/Dewalt). The Delta 50-763 sounds great but a BIG $$$$ gulp. Their single stack machines seem to be widely used also but there I don't see much difference between Jet/Penn/ etc.

So I hope to get some input from others about what they would do with my floor plan. Based on what I have read, the "separator" is a no brainer so no need to suggest that.


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## gfadvm (Jan 13, 2011)

I really like my Grizz with the cannister filter but I don't move it around. It lives in the garage next to my shop so I don't hear it. I felt like it was easier to move hose than machine. My separator is the simplest one I've seen and works great. You can see both on my shop tour and the separator on my project page. Hope this is the input you were looking for.


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## kizerpea (Dec 2, 2011)

I took my jet to the extreme. it was a rolling unit until i had a brain fart an built a cyclone hard piped it in an built a mega filter..in my projects….


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## BillWhite (Jul 23, 2007)

Of all the HF stuff available, the DC gets very good reviews. Mine has worked flawlessly since I got good felted bags. I didn't go high tech with separators or pleated.
Bill


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## ducky911 (Oct 6, 2010)

Noise to me is a big problem…i get one powerful enough that it could be moble but a bit away.

Also 1 micron of better…..some of these machines are like just running a fan to blow the bad stuff around but clean the shop from large dust particals. It is my understanding that the stuff that hurts you is so small you can not see it.

I solved both my concerns buy buying a grizzley 1 micon than piped it outside the shop after the noise got to me.


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## thebigvise (Jun 17, 2010)

The cheapest way to get a great system is the Oasis 5 HP double bag unit (check Amazon). I would park it near my 220 outlet and install 4" PVC (thin walled) available at most big box stores. I could give you the details if requested, but I have been thrilled since my shop became as dust-free as a surgical suite, and I spent less than $1,000. This is much less than what most folks spend on comparable capacity.


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## teejk (Jan 19, 2011)

some good ideas but a few questions/comments…I have brain over-load after reading everything I could find.

Noise does seem to be a common complaint (I usually have to ask people to repeat that comment…i.e. the hearing damage is done but I'll note it for the next life). In addition to the noise factor, it seems to also make sense when it comes to emptying the collector…will be on the cold-side away from the area I'm trying to keep clean.

I partitioned my 30' wide x 56' long shop into 16' "cold", 40' "finished" (with radiant in-floor heat in that part…it gets cold here). To avoid a 40'+ duct run to where I am currently set-up, probably best to re-orient the tools closer to the partition wall…I already ran 2 separate dedicated 20a tool circuits around the shop in a "horse-shoe" so should be easy enough to do other than my 240v circuit runs to the other wall where I am currently set-up. A few sticks of conduit should be easy enough, I have plenty of room in my panel to do it and I'll save the existing 240v circuit for "future 240v use".

Now to the machine itself…the Oasis doesn't seem to be available anywhere. "Single-stackers" don't appear to differ regardless of brand (Delta/Grizzly/Jet/etc.) and like so much of our stuff I suspect they all come from the same factory. Any comments on that assessment? "Double stack" units seem to be rare and expensive.

So now to 4" piping…"Bill" (the major cause of my brain over-load) wants minimum 6" main-trunk with "size-downs" to machines. And to finish up for now, PVC and "grounding" comments?

final final note…bigvise…I appreciate "surgical" clean but after spending the better part of a week cleaning dust from a 30×40 workshop (including 3/4" conduit and boxes/multiple shelfs/etc.), I'll settle for 95%. Dust seems to be like black bears…keep moving until you find a spot that has no dust (bears).


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## Grandpa (Jan 28, 2011)

http://home.comcast.net/~rodec/woodworking/articles/DC_myths.html

I think this guy has the PVC grounding thing all figured out. I bought a Clear Vue. there are other good units out there but I looked into the "better units" and found that after you buy one that is large enough to do what you want and make the upgrades to make it do those things you spend a lot of money. Then I asked myself what my health was worth and what bout the grandchildren that I hope to work with in my shop. I have a 30' x 61' steel building with a concrete floor. I has a 30×40 and added a 21 ft room to the end. I placed my collector int he smaller room on the "other side of the wall" from my work area. I am in the process of connecting my 6" metal collector pipe and making the trunk line runs now. I plan to reduce to 5" on some of my drops and 4" on the others. I watched my mother (and other family members) struggle in later life with emphysema and cancer. They were smokers and I have never smoked (except second hand) so I felt that I had a slight advantage. That is not a place I want to go. I do want to work with my grandchildren in the coming years so I am trying to make it the safest I can. I am using spiral wrap steel pipe. the fittings are the expensive part. I have been able to buy some of those at the local heat and air supply place and actually I have gotten some good fittings at ACE hardware but they don't have wyes. I am using wyes instead of tees. I think anything you read from Bill Pendtz is worthwhile. Like I said other have good machines also but the cost comes down to the same so I got the 5hp Clear Vue. I was in the Grizzly place in Springfield MO. looking at 2 hp and 3 hp collectors. Another customer walked by me and said get the big unit. I had to come back and get it later. It was just a couple of hundred $$ less than the 5 hp I ended up buying. That is where I am at the moment.


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## stevepeterson (Dec 17, 2009)

teejk,

I wouldn't spend upwards of $1000 for the Delta with cloth bags without considering some of the Grizzly cyclones in the same price range. Or for a little bit more you could get a ClearVue or an Oneida.


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## brtech (May 26, 2010)

Another satisfied HF fan boy with the Wynn Canister filter here. You can spend more, but I think you don't get the value when you do unless you go up to 4-5HP with a properly designed cyclone and a high quality canister filter.

All of the 2HP and under DCs can't generate enough CFM for a 6" main. Some of the ones that really are 2HP (and the HF is not) could probably deal with a 5" main, but that's expensive. So, if you go to a 5HP (which is what Bill P recommends), then go with 6" mains, and 40' of main is probably okay if there aren't very many corners. If you can't, then you are accepting some fines risk, you are stuck with 4" all the way, and 40' of main line won't work.

The filter MATTERS. .5 micron and lots of nines.

On the smaller units, lots of folks use a Thein separator. On the larger units, Cyclones rule.

Piping matters, but grounding doesn't (it can be annoying, but it's not a safety issue). No 90s, no Ts. Just wide sweep elbows or two 45s and a short straight section, and wyes. Keep flex hose to a minimum. 10' if that's the entire path. Better to hard pipe with S&D PVC all the way.


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## teejk (Jan 19, 2011)

to steve and brtech

You are adding to my "over-load"!

I know all about the "Delta Premium"...usually the same machines as everybody else but that color commands a premium (but I've had 2 full-size pick-ups and opt for the GMC over Chevy). Can only guess the marketing guys got into my head.

So I'll add Grizz to the list (their "industrial" line I guess). And will revisit HF…for the price, I guess I can always pipe it correctly to accept a different unit if I don't like it, plus we have a store in Eau Claire.


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## teejk (Jan 19, 2011)

as an update, almost done "flipping" the shop from the east side to the west side (when I set it up, I had a choice…as usual I picked heads and the coin came up tails). I'm waiting for a call from my local Shopfox dealer about pricing on their 3hp cyclone units. unit draws 22A on 240v so my 12 ga wire on the east side would have been risky at best (certainly 22A is only on start but I respect electrical codes therefore I don't want to install a 30A breaker on 12 ga wire).

The units do have an 8" intake so the final decision will be made after I consult my HVAC guy. Still thinking about placing the unit in the "cold-room " to baffle some noise (although the dealer did offer that it won't be any louder that many of the machines that will be running at the same time).


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