# So the wife ..... Plumbing question



## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

Dropped the guard to my beard trimmer into the toilet and it appears to have mad eit past the bend in the trap. I bent up a clothes hanger and fished around for a bit to no avail. My next move is to unbolt the toilet and go reverse fishing. Im gonna need a new wax right correct? Anyone else got any slick ideas out there?

That'll teach me to leave my man grooming accessories laying around.


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## superstretch (Jan 10, 2011)

*chuckle


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

Hmmm, was this a devious way to teach you a lesson for leaving the lid up?


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## ScottC (Apr 6, 2010)

You can try a shop vac but it could be tough. If you remove the toilet and reinstall, you should replace the ring.


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## RTim (Jan 11, 2011)

Do you have a basement or is your house on a slab? If it's a basement you may be able to save pulling the toilet. Typically the toilet is seated over an elbow with a short run to the stack. Before pulling the toilet I would try opening the cleanout at the bottom of the vertical stack and see if it landed there. Unless there's a fairly long horizontal run from the toilet to the stack, the clipper head will probably wash right through.

Good luck!


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

Tim, the toilet is on the second floor and the clean out is in the basement 2 floors down. The toilet is flushing but not very well at this point. I should have been a bit more descript but my thought is that its stuck at the bottom end of the trap for the toilet.

Also im not real interested in pressing that guard back against my face. It had a great 10 year run but i just hate to see the old fella go out like this.


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

CR1 Ill have to borrow the snake from work tomorrow ill give it a shot … i was planning in trimming the ole flavor saver up but its gonna have to wait until i buy another one.


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## RTim (Jan 11, 2011)

The toilet is the trap. There is no second trap in a toilet. I found this diagram on the web at http://www.toilet-repairs.com that shows how it all connects together. If the toilet isn't flushing well it could be jammed in the top bend in the toilet. Try shutting off the water supply and flushing the toilet to drain it and use a mirror to look up inside and see if it's jammed in hte bend.


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## wildbill001 (Mar 2, 2011)

Lordy I hate plumbing. Yes, if you pull the toilet, you should replace the wax ring. DON'T try to snake through the toilet or you'll more than likely need to end up buying a new toilet and a new beard trimmer guard.

My beard trimmer guard is really small, maybe 3/4" across and could not imagine it causing a slow-down in water flow. Sounds like it may have gotten hung up on something that was already in the pipe. Most toilets are connected to a 4" pipe. That may or may not reduce down, guess, it depends on local codes.

You might want to try some liquid drain cleaner to see if it dissolves/dislodges whatever the guard might be caught on. Yea, I know, most drain cleaners say not to put in toilet. And that is correct, you shouldn't. But after I pull the toilet and before I start snaking, I dump some cleaner down, wait the appropriate amount of time, then follow that with a couple of buckets of water. Usually, it does the job and I don't have to mess with the snake.

Of course, YMMV.

Bill W


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## CharlieM1958 (Nov 7, 2006)

I would try going at it with a closet auger. You might either get it out, force it all the way through, or break it up into smaller pieces.


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

Tim thanks for the diagram … i did mean that top bend, i got a coat hanger pretty deep but not around the bend. . Id venture to guess that its about 1 1/2" around. Thanks for all the help everyone.. except stretch .. he keeps laughing 

Looks like im yankin that puppy out tomorrow night.


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## Sawkerf (Dec 31, 2009)

Pulling a toilet is pretty easy (I've done dozens), but I suspect that your trimmer guard won't be in there. That drawing (above) is correct and it's almost certain that the guard is somewhere in the sewer line. Depending on how many turns yours makes, and how often you've flushed that toilet, it might be in the street sewer line (or septic tank) by now.


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

I wish that was the case sawkerf but ive got reservations .. the toilet isnt flowing very well, kinda gurgling and generally not working well. Its a kohler toilet and has a pretty steep bend, it takes 2 turns. So ive imagining it either jammed up in the toilet or in the waste line. The waste line being 4" would have swallowed it and sent it septic diving if it got there is my guess.

Ive done a couple of toilets so im not terrified of it but obviously i dont wanna do any more work than i really need to. Im gonne give a snake a shot tomorrow night after work and if that doesnt work im gonna dethrone the throne.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

chrisstef,
Well if all the above methods fail, you can guarantee your beard trimmer guard will end up in the septic tank. It would be fairly easy to retrieve it from the septic tank but personally I'd just replace the guard.


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

Thanks Rex .. no way im goin swimmin with the lumpfish. I think its time for a replacement.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Smart idea chriss, your guard may not be a floater.


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## Uncle_Salty (Dec 26, 2009)

Chriss: pull the dang toilet! Two nuts on the toilet bolts, a supply line… some towels to soak up the mess, and you got the toilet off!

I, too, have done several toilets. A plumber by accident! Anyway, lift straight up on the toilet and lay on its back in the bath tub (if you have one). If not, set it in the shower and tip it back so the tank is leaning against the wall. There will probably be some pretty nasty stuff there, but you might find some other things which also may be causing some problems: q-tips, disposable shaver caps, tampon insertion tubes… you name it! I have three daughters and this is my life! Trash cans? Heck! I wish they used them all the time!

Anyway… after you clean it out, clean off the old wax ring off of both the toilet and the toilet flange on the floor. Reinstall a new, room temperature, 3/4" no seep ring. The manuals always say to install the ring on the toilet and then install the toilet. But I have always had better luck placing the ring on the toliet flange on the floor and then installing the toilet on the ring.

I usually don't mess around with the old toilet bolts unless they have been changed in the last year or two, so while you are buying the new wax ring, buy some new bolts. I'd also pitch the old toilet supply line and go for a new steel braided line. It is a little more forgiving in case the new toilet ring sits at a different height, and is also easier if you ever need to replace the old toilet valve. I'd ditch the old ball cock valve if you have one and get a newer all plasitic valve.

I generally turn the water on and flush the toilet several times to check for leaks at both ends of the supply line, the valve, the tank to seat, and the seat to the floor. Then a bead of caulk (silicone or tub caulk, but make sure it is mildew resistant!) between the stool base and the floor, and you go it licked!

The crapper is a great invention that is suprising maintenance free! But when it gives us trouble, it is really the @#$%S!


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## doyoulikegumwood (Jun 21, 2007)

i noticed that you went at it with a coat hanger just thought i would throw this out their. to fix the scratches in the porcelain you can dran the toilet and use soft scrub to get rid of the scratches. just in case that the next post lol


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

Not much to add, but I hate plumbing too!! The only thing worse is when someone calls me a plumber ;-)) The electrician/plumber thing seems to go along with the Bob/Bill thing!!


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## CharlieM1958 (Nov 7, 2006)

Whatever happened to our resident plumber, Mary Anne?


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## gfadvm (Jan 13, 2011)

I'm not sure what pulling the toilet will accomplish. You still won't have access to the inside of the toilet and I can't imagine that the trimmer caused a clogging below the toilet. I assume you have tried plunging the crap out of it? I'm just trying to save you the hassle of pulling the crapper and having to redo the wax ring, clean up the mess. I just replaced 3 toilets at my house and my daughters house and I hate plumbing! Good luck and sounds like a new beard trimmer is in your future.


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## Sodabowski (Aug 23, 2010)

*Dude*, why don't you just go ahead and build a new guard out of, say, Lignum Vitae? That would greatly challenge your carving skills!

Seriously, sorry about that, I know it's a PITA to shave or trim one's beard without a guard (I bought a new trimmer a few months ago because my old one was becoming really painful to use)


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

Since you may not be a regular puller of toilets, here are a few tips for the beginner.

1. Shut off the supply valve and hold the flush lever down until all of the water that can leaves the tank.

2. Plunge the remaining water in the bowl to get as much out of the bowl/trap as you can.

3. Remove the caps over the two (2) johnny bolts, then remove the nuts from the johnny bolts,

4. If your toilet has been caulked along the base, cut that with a razor knife.

5. Carefully remove the toilet by lifting upward. You do NOT want to damage the flange with any sideways lifting or twisting.

6. Aside the toilet onto a piece of cardboard or throwaway towel. Part of the wax ring is on the bottom and it is not fun to play with.

7. Take a baggy or bread bag, etc. and put your hand into it like a glove. Use your covered hand to get as much of the wax ring off the flange seat (and the bottom of the toilet) as you can. When done with this chore, just pull the bottom of the plastic bag out as you remove your hand and you will in effect be holding a bag of the wax ring in your still clean hands.

8. Do whatever you are going to do to the toilet…

9. When you replace the toilet, get a jumbo wax ring with the insert (instead of the thin wax-only wax rings.

10. Get new johnny bolts unless yours are in good shape.

11.After installation, caulk the base all the way around EXCEPT the very back where you can't see it. If you ever have a leak from the ring or flange you will know it sooner rather than later if you leave this "hidden" weep hole.

12. If you have a compression supply line, throw it away and get a threaded reinforced (stainless braided or the ones reinforced like water hose) supply line. Homeowners (ie non-plumbers) re-installing compression type fittings on toilets and refrigerators are where many leaking damages occur. If not seated and tightened correctly, they can blow off under pressure and especially if you have a water hammer event.


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

13. Real plumbers use that bread sack with the used toilet ring to wax their moustache. Homeowners usually throw them away unless they know a real plumber that hasn't changed a toilet for a while.


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

LMAO @ Topa.


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## Uncle_Salty (Dec 26, 2009)

Jenks:

Pulling the toilet will allow you access to items that are "floating" in the trap. Plastic floats. Plastic with low mass will not be sucked into the torrent when flushed, but will hinder other solid items from flushing correctly!

When you pull the toilet and tip it on its back, all of the "stuff" in the trap falls to the back of the trap and the water will weep out. Then when you tip it back to its correct position, all of the stuff in the back of the trap can fall to the flange hole of the toilet, where it then can be removed.

One time, at a business I was working at, I found a an empty plastic skoal can in the trap of the toilet. That little bugger caused a lot of damage to the flooring, and it wouldn't plunge or snake. Perfect example of what I am talking about, but taken to the extreme.

Pull the toilet.


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

You guys are a trip! There also seems to be one common theme around here .. everyone hates plumbing, including me! Ive been forced to learn plumbing little by little since buying the house 3 years ago. The water is super hard with minerals and there have been obvious problems indicated from all the copper to plastic to copper splices throughout the basement. Plumbing in my house requires a total shut off since all the old valves dont hold so ill take the suggestions to remove and reinstall the ball valves and supply lines.

I dont think i scratched up the throne much with the coat hanger, i was pretty gentle with it and didnt go nuts trying to dig it out, i figured if i didnt hook onto it the first time i cant reach it, so I put aside the brute force and ignorance on this one, which is typically my go to.

Topa, do you want me to save you some wax for the beard and the chops?

Salty, you're dead on with this one. That guard has plenty of openings in it, not a solid piece, so im sure that there is some TP all jammied up in it which is causing the clog but doesnt have enough mass to catch the bawoooshh.


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## 489tad (Feb 26, 2010)

Grow it out, move to Texas, start a three piece rock and roll boogie woogie band!


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

An old plumber told me that years ago ;-)) Mine is not a handle bar, so I don't wax it. Besides, I'm an elelctrician.


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## gfadvm (Jan 13, 2011)

Salty - I retract my comment. Thanks, I learned something today. That's why I spend so much time here! David - Wow. You are the "toilet man"! That's a lot of good info I wish I'd had before I changed out those 3 crappers. Man, not sure that came out right. No offense, David.


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

@gfadvm, None taken. "Toilet man" one day, cabinet man the next, etc. It's a matter of survival, I suppose but we do it all. I bet we change out as many toilets in a month as some full time plumbers do (and sinks and valves, appliances, etc.).


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## Knothead62 (Apr 17, 2010)

Drain the tank first! Flush and then use a towel or sponge to get the water out. Didn't see that mentioned or did I miss something. Personally, I would run the snake through it and forget about the guide.


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

Well an update on chasin turds … i went out and purchased all the supplies, came home … and shes flushin like a champ again! I wadded up a nice chunk of TP and chucked it down … no problems, no blowbacks, no floaties. Plumbing appears to be possibly, maybe, averted (i hate jinxing myself).

"i got 99 problems but my throne aint one"


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

I saved David's instructions as a Microsoft Word file. That's how much I liked them.

David_turd.doc

Sharing is caring


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

Oh they were spot on i must say .. lol @ sharing is caring.

Now on to hacking up a Lombardi Trophy …


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## superstretch (Jan 10, 2011)

Since I ran across this again, You should flood your basement with the toitey water.. Never know what you'll find


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

Well, since All is using that as a reference ;=)

The three things that we find over and over from homeowners or bad plumbers are the following:

On a new toilet, make certain that the tank to base is tightened evenly so that the tank is level. The unknowing tend to tighten one side, then the second, then back to the first and stop regardless of level.

New toilet again.. set the float / fill mechanism so that the water is at the waterline. Too many or left at the factory setting and either fall short of fill or fill to the top of the tube spill and in no time you have a fill-cycling water-wasting noise-making problem.

The johnny bolts are often left too long to allow the cap to snap down tightly. get the break-off type johnny bolts or use a hack saw to do it right.

Ok, primer complete. :=)


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## Rambo (May 18, 2009)

Turn the water off at the stop and wet vac it out.


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