# My frustration with power tools mainly Ryobi



## Blackie_ (Jul 10, 2011)

We all know the saying you get what you pay for at least most of us do.  
There are a lot of manufactures out there, the hand power tools I am mainly focusing on here and also what I have in my inventory are Harborfreight product, Home Depot's - Ryobi, out of these two Ryobi has been my worse frustration and failure rate compared to HF go figure, *shrugs* I've had better luck with any and all of my HF tools over Ryobi. I am going to limit myself from now on what I buy from HF and will never purchase another Ryobi again more so at the price HD is asking for their line of c**p, as a matter of fact I think I've learned my lesson and will focus on buying name brand product which leads me to Skil hand power tools, I'd like to have others opinions on this product Skil as I've been finding great deals (low pricing) at Lowes on Skil hand power tools and have purchased a few items already.

Thanks
Randy


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## greasemonkeyredneck (Aug 14, 2010)

I also have developed a hatred for anything with the Ryobi logo on it. Everything I've ever bought with Ryobi stamped on the side died and untimely death at the worst possible time. 
I now have several Ridgid tools. So far I have not been disappointed by any of them.


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## affyx (Jan 1, 2008)

i am so happy to say i sold the last of my ryobi small power tools (which never worked accurately) at my yard sale last weekend! The only Ryobi I have left is a BT3100 table saw which is excellent for my needs.

to me Skil is in the same caste tier as Ryobi; I've had good luck with porter cable, but I think their quality has dropped in recent years - Ridgid and Dewalt seem to be the mid-tier leaders now, although Bosch, Milwaukee and Makita seem nice too. Skil, Ryobi and Craftsman are all bottom shelf IMHO, the top shelf is Festool, with the aforementioned inbetween

my opinions, YMMV


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## Charlie5791 (Feb 21, 2012)

I have a Makita cordless drill that I've had forever and it just won't quit. I won't buy Skil, Ryobi or Craftsman (although I do have a C-Man miter saw. It's older and I wouldn't buy another one).


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## Blackie_ (Jul 10, 2011)

JC makes since thus the reason Skil is priced so low at Lowes.


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## ssnvet (Jan 10, 2012)

Ryobi is about the only "normal" tool brand out there (not counting uber high end German stuff) that I have never purchased….

I've considered them several times and they always struck me as absolute rock bottom… light and skimpy.

I've used a couple Harbor Freight tools and they were actually pretty decent. I think most of their stuff (at least what I've seen) is a clone of somebody elses successful design.


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## MedicKen (Dec 2, 2008)

Buy Bosch and dont look back


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

^That's what I did with my insurance money after a theft, MedicKen. I saw two broken Ryobis on the "try out" shelf at the big box a few years back. Made an impression on me and I never bought one. I've had a couple of Skils out of desperation and they all died pretty quickly. I like Bosch, Makita, and DeWalt in that order. I like Milwaukee too but I only own the super sawzall; hardly enough for me to comment on the brand. I own a Hilti drill (a gift), which is obviously awesome but a great bit of overkill for me. I use harbor freight for pneumatic tools. If I get a year or two out of a $20 pneumatic tool, I figure I'm ahead of the game.


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## waho6o9 (May 6, 2011)

I did the same thing Blackie. Looking at 10 messed up Ryobi batteries I started to add up the costs, and came to the conclusion not to purchase junk.
Hello Festool. It's actually less expensive to purchase quality than it is to throw good money after bad.


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## BillWhite (Jul 23, 2007)

Now you can add the new "improved" Porter Cable, Skil, Black and Decker, & Rockwell to the list of brands that have gone the way of least cost production. Once fine brands (Craftsman included) have taken to living on the name rather than the integrity of the product.
That said, I have an old Ryobi 3' X 21" belt sander that won't quit, and a Ryobi miter saw stand that is heavy as he!! but solid as the proverbial rock.
Today I sticking with Makita and DeWalt. Maybe they'll keep the quality.
The black and green stuff is WAY out of my league.
Bill


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## Blackie_ (Jul 10, 2011)

The only two Ryobi tools that I have left and they both seem to be doing just OK are the biscuit cutter and the 1300 or 1301 (can't remember) planer. I'll refrain from buying anymore Skil. What about *Hitachi*, where are they on the margin line?


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## knothead (Aug 4, 2007)

Same experience here - My first router was a SKIL with so much run out on the motor shaft it would snap bits off in use, thought it was me at first but a little investigation revealed the POOR quality of the tool.

Bought a Ryobi cordless drill, drill motor was kinda ok but the batteries were and are junk, bought new batteries, same junk. Both have been exiled to the trash bin of "lessons learned" (Costs more to buy cheap and then replace it with quality than to buy quality in the first place).

I also have a Crapsman 10" miter saw that collects dust - No matter how much I fiddle with it I can't get a consistent square cut from it and miters are an absolute nightmare. I use it in the early milling process for cutting to "rough length" when square doesn't matter and otherwise it just collects dust.

I know we all look for bargains, and occasionally you find one, but in tooling, quality trumps cheap at every turn. Not to mention the frustration inaccurate tools cause. I'm no tool snob - there are no Festools in my shop, but Bosch, PC, Rigid, and DeWalt (Not necessarily in that order) all have secure homes here. Just 2 cents worth…......

Chris


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## BobM001 (Jan 8, 2012)

OK, here's the "deal". Techtronics owns several US brands. Yes even Milwaukee. They also build the Rigid power tools. Robert Bosch bought Skil which was on the skids at the time. Bosch tools are good stuff. I own two Ryobi tools that are about 20+ yrs old. A 2 1/2hp, 1/2" plunge router that serves me well on my router table/home built mortising jig and a 3×21 VS belt sander. BOTH are excellent. But, these may be of an era when their stuff was still made with some degree of quality. I know several people that "fell" for the "lifetime guarantee" with Rigid tools at Home "Despot". Much to their chagrin when the tool farted its eye out they got the "Oh, the guarantee isn't through us, you have to send it back to the factory." So that "great deal" isn't so "great" after all n'est pas? Got an issue? Go STRAIGHT TO THE TOP! E-mail the customer service dept of the manufacturer. Raise some hell (politely) with them. They want happy consumers. If the tool is still under warranty there should be no issue. The "bots" in these DIY/tool stores generally are clueless. I bought a pipe threading set from HF. 1/2"-1" for 40 bucks. Lifetime guarantee. If a die breaks they replace it I assume. This is the set that when I get the "Hey! Can I borrow you pipe dies" goes out the door. They're not getting my Rigid dies. BTW, Rigid should stick to their forte, piping tools. I'm a fan of Metabo power tools. Good stuff built in Germany.


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## Tennessee (Jul 8, 2011)

The only Ryobi I have ever owned is the BT3100 table saw I bought back in 2000. Still accurate and doing it's thing. I've been thinking of a new saw lately, but I just cannot justify it since this thing just keeps on cutting like the day I bought it, save it looks like it has been through a war. (Moved four times now.)

As time goes on, (and I own WAY too many cordless drills), I find that I keep getting more and more Rigid tools. I still buy HF for low usage items, but my main four cordless drills are three of those Rigid compact 18V Li-Ion with 3/8" chucks, and one 18V Li-Ion Milwaukee with the 1/2" chuck. I have lots of others, and corded drills, but I don't use them unless I have to drill through a bunch of bricks, then the Milwaukee plug-in Holeshooter comes out.

My routers are Bosch, save for one Porter Cable and a HF that I just could not pass up. (1/2" router for $49? I bought it…) Then I bought a Rigid router that came with a plunge mount no extra charge and I like it a lot save for where the off-on switch is.

All my vacuums are Rigid. Two of them are 12 years old and still running fine, as I use multiple vacuums as a dust collection system so they get some real hours on them. Recently they had a special, a 12 gallon with not too many attachments, but it came with a detachable motor for use as a blower. $49. I got the last one in my store, and it is a great vacuum. Where you going to get a 2HP 12 gallon with detachable blower for $49, guaranteed for life?

I used to buy DeWalt, not anymore. Now it's Rigid, Milwaukee, Bosch, or for low usage, I look over to see what HF has. Like their Chicago random orbit sander for $22.99. You can't beat that.
I've never considered Festool, and I only bought two Rockwell units, the multi-tool sander/cutter/Festool knockoff which is great, and that dumb small plunge 3 1/4" circular saw w/laser light which I hate. Can't cut a straight line with it, even with a fence!


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## knotscott (Feb 27, 2009)

I've been as unimpressed with Skil as most Ryobi….both are aimed mainly at the same homeowner market as B&D, Tradesman, some Craftsman, HF, and others. If you want better quality than Ryobi, you need to aim at more of the pro/serious hobbyist market. I'd look to Bosch, Milwaukee, Makita, Metabo, Hitachi, DW, some Ridgid, some PC. I'd found some great deals on Hitachi in the past few years and have been very satisfied overall.


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## Tennessee (Jul 8, 2011)

By the way, a little rant about Craftsman. My very first experience was back in 1971 when I bought one of their "reconditioned" routers from a bin in Norfolk, VA. It ran for a couple years and finally just basically fell apart. OK, but $35 was a lot of money in 1971. A few years after that, I had a Craftsman tractor, top of the line, B&S industrial engine, the decal said. One year, 13 warranty service calls, and when the renewal letter came it said one more year warranty for $375. This was 1980! I said the heck with that, I could replace the engine for that! Which, dead in the middle of the very next Pocono winter, is exactly what happened when I was plowing my drive, the engine seized. Found out that Briggs and Stratton, whose decal was plainly on top of the engine, would not support that engine. Could not even get parts through B&S. A new replacement engine was half the price of the tractor from Sears. Sold it off instead after I took the engine apart to find plain bearings, a splash oiler and only one piston ring per. What a POS that was.
Few years later, I bought a variable speed Craftsman drill, and after the third one, I finally got one that worked for more then a month. Same with the second router. Had to turn in two before I got one that worked. Still own the "third" router, but never turn it on, it is a memorial these days for me to never buy another Craftsman tool - ever. Threw the variable speed drill away, too sick to even sell it at a garage sale. Sears chain saw? I'll bite, heck of a lot of saw for the money. Wrong… Found out they decided that aluminum was good enough to hold the bolts where the chain bar mounted on. It's not. Bolts slowly over time pulled out of the casing. Kept cutting in a circle. Some guy gave me $25 for the engine. 
Back in 1996 I needed a larger belt sander but did not have the money, found the 3X24 Craftsman, and while sanding with it first time, the front wheel fell off because the hot melt glue holding the front wheel on melted. It didn't even have a key! When I took it back, the guy reached down to a large stack of return forms, maybe three inches high. I asked him why so many return forms? "Well, we use a lot of them."

That was it, put a fork in me, I was done with Sears…that was 1996. Oh, and if I remember right, the famous Craftsman warranty does not cover a "sharpened edge". You would be surprised how many Craftsman tools have a "sharpened edge".
Nowadays, I won't even walk into a Sears. Sorry, Craftsman lovers…


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

^Blackie, I'm not sure about Hitachi. I seem to recall a few people liking their monster chop saw. They look like something out of a spaceship to me.


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## Kentuk55 (Sep 21, 2010)

Sorry to hear that Randy. I think every brand has its goods & bads of their products. Sounds like you just got a case o bad luck with them. I've had my share of the same but with a few other brands. I think it all depends on who/where/when some o these tools go together. Keep it on the up-side. Good luck with your next purchases of whatever model/s you wind up with.


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## cjwillie (Sep 6, 2011)

The only Ryobi tool I have ever owned is an early AP-10 planer that was given to me. While it doesn't compare to the heavy commercial planers, I have found it to be a big surprize. It has handled all that I have put it through. I use it almost daily without issues. It is accurate and I have had no problems with snipe and blade changes are easy. I wasn't expecting much when I got it but I have no complaints other than I wish it was a little bigger. From what I have seen of other Ryobi tools I am not impressed but this one serves me well. When the oppurtunity to upgrade comes along, I will definitely go to a bigger and better quality planer but I can't find anything negative to say about this one!


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## PutnamEco (May 27, 2009)

I'm curious, exactly what Ryobi tools are failing? I've only tried their cordless drill and their circular saw. and both seem to be worth what you pay for them. I see a suprising amount of Ryobi on job sites, second only to Dewalt, and always wonder why. Could it be that they are one job wonders, and contractors are treating them as disposables, and writing them off?

I have very little experience with any of today's Skil tools, Their wormdrive saw (SHD77) seems not to have suffered much loss of quality from the move to Chinese production. I have developed a real distaste for low quaility tools. I have found that in the long run they are not saving me any money. I have however made my living with tools and can justify paying more for a more durable tool.

When I'm trying to economize, I'm usually buying high quality used tools rather than cheap new tools, as I find this is what works best for me.

Hitachi make some nice nailers, Their NR 83 A2 framing nailer is an industry standard. I think their circular saw is a little funky, but that is just MY opinion. Their little impact driver (WH10DLP4) seems pretty nice and it is comfortable to work with. I can't speak for its longevity though.
I haven't worked with their other tools enough to comment.


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## crank49 (Apr 7, 2010)

I have an old, like 1976, Skil circular saw. Built like a tank, made in the USA, and a great tool. Bought a Skil jigsaw in the 1990s and it broke the second time I used it. Piece of crap. Bought a Milwaukee Sawzall a few years ago and it's a great tool, was also made in the USA. Needed a random orbit sander and could not find anything made in the USA, so I got Ridgid because I liked the dust collection hook-up. It's been great also. I can't, from my experience say all USA tools are great, nor can I say all Chinese tools are junk.

What I try to do is stick to what a brand is known for. For example, Bosch is known for jigsaws, Porter Cable is known for routers, Milwaukee is known for recriprical saws; and these tools by these companies are top notch, usually. It's hard to beat a Hole Shooter from Milwaukee, or a cordless drill from Dewalt. Simply because of the way the market works, these tools are not going to be the least expensive in each class, but they should be good values.

You do have to be careful due to so many of these companies being sold out to foreign companies. There was a time when there was not a better circular saw on the market than a Skil. That's why circular saws are often call "Skil Saws" even from other brands. Today Skill is owned by Bosch and they use the brand as a low end mass market commodity product to sell at places like Walmart. They might be a fairly decent tool now, but certainly not the industry leader they once were.

I can't understand the logic of folks who say "good product, low pricing" inthe same sentence. If I'm selling a tool recognized as the best quality, I'd be a fool to sell it cheaper than anyone else.


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## dpop24 (May 14, 2011)

Ryobi, SKIL, and Black & Decker are the brands I won't buy anymore. I consider all of these brands just a hair over HF in quality, but the price doesn't justify a premium over HF tools. Most consider Craftsman in the same category but I've had lots of great luck with the brand in the past 10 years.

I finally learned my lesson after many years of buying the lowest priced tool and being disappointed when I was replacing it. Now I try to buy the best quality took I can afford, especially for the larger, more expensive tools. I do most of my shopping for big tools on Craigslist and have been happy with the Ridgid and Jet finds I have brought home. For cheapie tools, I'll still buy HF but expect them to fail and consider them disposable. If they last any time at all, I consider it a bonus.


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## lumberjoe (Mar 30, 2012)

I have a somewhat differing opinion. Bargain tools in general is a hit-and-miss market. While my wife and I do very well, I am cheap by choice. Tools are toys for me. I don't make my living with them. I cannot see investing many many thousands of dollars in toys when my kids need to go to college someday. Yes, Ryobi, Skil, B&D, and the harbor Freight line up are all in the bottom of the barrel group. However, that does not mean they are all crap. I've had some great successes with Ryobi tools, as well as the HF stuff. I have never had any luck with anything Skil has made in the past 10 years or so. I've also had some duds.

My point is, don't count a brand out completely. Not everything every brand makes is good, and not everything a brand makes is bad. For another example, look at the worthless pile of crap 6" bench top jointer delta is pushing now. I'd be embarrassed to put my name anywhere near that, even if my name was Ryobi.

Do your homework. There is TONS of info on the internet. Read all the reviews and learn how to decipher the "Oh my god, I LOVE my new tool!!!" from the factual ones. Also learn to spot the "I don't know what I am doing and didn't read the manual, this tool sucks!" reviews.


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

The Ryobi cordless stuff is alright for the price, in my experience. If
the stuff gets ripped off on the jobsite it's not heartbreaker.

Ryobi used to be a professional brand, comparable to Makita and
Hitachi. They made some heavier duty tools for professional
Japanese carpenters.


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## timbit2006 (Jan 6, 2012)

I find myself trusting in Bosch very much. I've used a lot of their hand tools and they were very nice. Personally, I only have a Bosch 10" Miter saw but I have plans to buy a cordless drill kit this weekend(I love sales.). I also have plans to buy their fixed/plunge base router combo after I buy my motorbike.

I have two Ryobi tools. A 9" Bandsaw which I bought in my, "I have no idea what I'm doing" days. The bandsaw actually works very well despite the 3" cutting capacity. I wish I had known about used tools back then, for the 200 I payed for it(Tax sucks).
I also have a 30 dollar 5" ROS from them. It sands… And that's where it stops. I find it orbits a bit too slow. It's a decent sander though.

I've never used Ridgid before, but I'm thinking about some of their stuff.


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## ShipWreck (Feb 16, 2008)

Ryobi "in my opinion" makes some pretty clever tools, but they are not made for heavy use by construction workers, or the hard core hobbiest. They are for the home owner who might use them occasionally. I like alot of the ideas that they put into thier tools, but I dont buy any of them.


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## joebloe (Feb 13, 2012)

I like Bosch, Dewalt and Makita ,as they say you get what you pay for.I had a Ryobi 14.4 v cordless drill and flashlight combo lasted about 2 yrs.I have a Dewalt cordless drill and a impact driver 18 v no problems so far I've had them a little over 2 yrs . I've got a Bosch router and love it,has a fixed base and a plunge base.Where I used to work they where buying Porter Cable cordless tool sets, and are getting good results from them.Got a Makita circular saw,have had it over 10 years can't beat it.My personal advice stay away from Craftsman,they are in the same area as Ryobi.


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## MrRon (Jul 9, 2009)

Ryobi, when they first came on the scene made some excellent tools. Their portable planer and resaw bandsaw were excellent.


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## dbhost (Jul 20, 2009)

Blackie, I am curious what Ryobi tools you have had that were such duds. There are some Ryobi tools you couldn't give me, but others that I have that have served their purpose in life quite well…

Ryobi BT3100 table saw. Put in through heck and back and it's still spot on accurate. Not a SawStop or anything, but beats the tar out of anything else in my price range… 
Ryobi quarter sheet sander. Beats the Makita it replaced. Not saying much there. The Ryobi is just okay. The Makita was terrible…
Biscuit joiner. Will probably outlive me because I barely use it.
6" random orbit buffer. Use it a lot. Works great.
Detail sander. Less than impressed. Not a bad sander, it's just as good or bad as the others.
Corded keyless chuuck drill. Not as powerful as my Craftsman, but a good tool for not a lot of money…
AP1301 13" jointer. Same one you have. I broke the knob on it by dropping something heavy on it like an idiot. Ryobi sent a replacement under warranty even though it wasn't their fault…

There are some tools I have seen from Ryobi that just creep me out with their fit and finish making me think they are probably duds… Those are.
#1. The miter saw and miter saw stand. Both the 10" and the 12" miter saws seem very poorly made. While my HF is passable, the Ryobi honestly scares me… My neighbor has a Ryobi 10" and it is LOUD and inaccurate. He borrows my old B&D from time to time… 
#2. Belt sander. Seen them in store, they seem to be easy to break.
#3. Certain models of the routers. Some are good, some are scary… The R161K I used to have was nice. Not sure what model the plunger my neighbor has is, but it is downright scary!

My old late 1980s made in USA Skil circular saw is a workhorse that I won't part with. Everything Skil I have bought since 2000, except the router bits has been disappointing…


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## Knothead62 (Apr 17, 2010)

My Ryobi tools are still going but as I mentioned on another thread, three batteries won't hold a charge. I stay away from Craftsman- they contract with someone and make a few changes where factory original parts won't interchange. You have to buy Sears/Craftsman parts as long as they are available.


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## Blackie_ (Jul 10, 2011)

DB both were sanders that failed, one was a random mouse type and the other was the small palm finish sander.


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## rockindavan (Mar 8, 2011)

My first drill was a corded ryobi for $10. Still works but I don't expect much from Ryobi. At a job this summer a guy who has no appreciation for quality tools had a bunch of ryobi cordless tools. He had a charger with 8 battery plug-ins. Most of the time it was nearly full with batteries. Goes to show the quality of their batteries. I'll stick with Makita for all my cordless needs.


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## mark4345 (Oct 7, 2011)

I too avoid ryobi at all costs. I owned 1 router it fell apart on the 3rd use. I work as a carpenter, so i know a fair bit about that the best power hand tools are. Skil really depends on what you are buying… most of the stuff is cheap however the worm drive skilsaw is probably the best circular saw on the market. It is overkill for a lot of people and on the heavy side but well worth it. I have owned a mag77 for 10 years and have not had a single problem with it, these are also the saws we use on the job provided by the company. They all perform very well even with the beating they generally take on jobsites.

As far as sidewinder circular saws Makita makes a really nice one which also can take a beating and keep going, I used these almost exclusively in residential construction. I have seen one take a tumble off a roof and it came out ok.

Milwaukee makes a great sawzall, Both bosch and porter cable routers are great both on job use as well as my shop, I tend to favor bosch jigsaws.

As far as cordless drills and impact drivers…. I have used Dewalt, Bosch, Makita, Hilti, Milwaukee. While they all work very well, i tend to favor dewalt and makita the best. I use the makita currently daily at work the 18 volt drill and impact driver i like this best because it is light weight, clips to my belt, has plenty of power for most operations and batteries last a long time. When i have heavier drilling/driving to do i get the dewalt 20 volt….much more power, but also a lot heavier. Both have led lights to light up your bits, which is nice on jobsites that arent always lit the best.


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## renners (Apr 9, 2010)

Buying Ryobi is like chucking your money down the toilet. When you need spares you won't be able to get them.
You'll end up wishing you'd bought a Makita/Dewalt/Bosch/Festool instead.


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

In my early days as a remodeling contractor I had purchased a few Ryobi, Craftsman, and Ridgid tools because of the price. Most of those did not make the cut and in general I will never buy those brands again.

I will say that I have a couple of Ridgid palm routers that have done well for me for many years now but I would not replace them with another Ridgid based on my experience with the brand overall.

OK one other thing, I do get high mileage out of my Ridgid shop vacs and really like them.

My best tools have been (in no particular order) DeWalt, Hitachi, PorterCable, Makita, Bosch, & Festool. In fact, of these listed brands, I have most of what I originally bought back when I got my start or when I replaced the short-lived tools of the other brands. The cost per year certainly has paid off since I have been using many of the major names for 10 - 14 years. The cheap brands did not last 2 years on average.

I won't even consider Harbor Freight tools But since I make my living with my tools, I make my decision on a different set of standards than many hobby woodworkers.


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## cjwillie (Sep 6, 2011)

I see a lot of good opinions on Bosch tools. I have had mixed results with Bosch. I have a Bosch router that has served me well for over 20 years. My only complaint is the wear on the flat spot on the shaft for the wrench has rounded and makes changing bits "fun". My Bosch jigsaw I wouldn't trade for any other saw. I've had it for about 25 years and it works as goood as the day I bought it. However, I have a Bosch chorded drill that is only good as a boat anchor. About a week after purchase it quit working. I had it fixed, it was a bad PC board in the drill. It worked for about a week, then quit again. I have had it fixed three times and it quit every time. It has sat in a drawer, unuseable, for years. I paid $160.00 for this drill back in the 1980's and it's a big piece of junk. Not sure why I still keep it, maybe to remind me not to buy any more Bosch drills.


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## TCCcabinetmaker (Dec 14, 2011)

believe it or not, every tool company is capable of puting out a defective tool….
I have a ryobi random orbit that out performs my dewalt random orbit, but to be honest, dewalt being owned by black and decker, I'm not surprised.

See the thing is most of these companies no longer manufacture their own tools but out source that to some overseas firm, so potentially any tool could be coming from different factories, one where they hire only people who should not assemble a pallet and one where they hire only the best workers, it's kinda luck of the draw now days I guess…


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## dhazelton (Feb 11, 2012)

I bought a Sears 14.4 volt cordless drill in 2000 that was a Ryobi in black plastic. I drove thousands of screws with it on a corrugated sheet metal-covered pole barn. Drove a ton of drywall screws with it, too. The original batteries gave out about two years ago and I still plan on replacing them because the power was fine and it was a very well balanced drill.

I have a Ryobi random orbit sander that I've used to sand all the siding on my house for repainting. It works great.

I had a 1985ish Skilsaw that I loved, but the motor bearings failed much sooner than I thought they should have, considering the low hours on it. I replaced it with the ultra cheap Ryobi circular saw and with a good Freud blade and frequent checks of alignment it has done a lot of work for me.

I've purchased two Harbor Freight tools with a motor - the first was DOA and returned, the second was the close quarters stubby drill and I have such an infrequent need for it that I can't comment on it's reliability. My feeling is that if you make your living with a tool, don't buy it at Harbor Freight. That said, when looking at a Festool pad sander, the salesman told me that another customer had his sander die and for 'only' $150 the factory in Germany rebuilt it - I could buy two Makitas pad sanders for that repair money.


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## lumberjoe (Mar 30, 2012)

Well said TCCCabinetmaker. Everyone has their own opinion on tools, and everyone uses them differently. Find the tool that works best for the way you use it. As with anything, look for reliable reviews/opinions from people with similar usage conditions as you would perform. Not everyone that needs a truck needs to get a Ford F350 dually with a long bed for example. On the same token, a contractor towing a massive trailer would rip apart a Toyota Tacoma in a review. 
Something geared toward a weekend warrior may let a professional contractor down, but that doesn't mean it is a bad tool. Yes Ryobi makes some crap, so does dewalt, Delta, and Porter Cable (who are ALL owned by Black and Decker).


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## PutnamEco (May 27, 2009)

Re:
Black & Decker

Black & Decker merged with Stanley it is now Stanley Black & Decker


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## Dwain (Nov 1, 2007)

I have three of the basic Ryobi drills. I am a hobbiest and find they do what I need them to do. I have been able to upgrade to the lithium batteries, so I have what I believe is acceptable battery life. These are the only ryobi tools I use. I would prefer a Makita drill set, but that's a pretty big spend. I have a Bosch router and love it. I have had it for 8 years and it is still my go to router. I also have a hitachi 3hp router. Works very well also. If I had it to do over, I would probably have invested in makita drills, kept my bosch router and jigsaw (Man, I love that saw!). I too have a skil 77 worm drive saw. I trust it completely, but know I am in for a long day if I have to use it too much. That sucker is heavy!


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## doughan (Apr 22, 2011)

The cheapest tool i have is a belt sander I bought for 200 dollars back in 1984…....it was more then half a weeks pay but ultimately has cost less then 10$ a year and I still can't kill it.

It's a porter cable when they were still some of the best around.

It seems all these home improvement shows have led the tool manufacturers to try to hit a price point that will include the casual homeowner user that picks the tool up once every few months…..with the result that if you intend to use it everyday it will break down in short order….yes you get what you pay for but sometimes tools just have better engineering.it would be interesting to see what ryobi pays their engineers(overpaid at anyprice if you ask me)


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## AKSteve (Feb 4, 2012)

I have two Ryobi Drills, one a Drill Press that I got at a garage sale for 50 bucks and a Hammer Drill I got at a pawn shop and both have performed without problems. as a matter of Fact I got a Delta Mortiser jig for my Drill press and it works great! My Vacuum is a Rigid and it is pretty awesome! no problems with that, My Planer is a Rigid too and works like a dream, never any problems with that, it slices through hardwood like butter! and all of my other power tools are craftsman, I love the Bench top sander and the Plunge router just keeps on trucking. I am not however happy with the Band Saw, I did not realize at the time it would be so wimpy! and you can only get the blades at Sears, and my Table Saw is junk too. It keeps going out of Alignment, I have to constantly adjust the blade to a good 45 degree angle and the Cover for the blade is inset and it not flush with the table, it constantly cuts smaller pieces at an angle, and I definitely don't like the Miter slot, it's grooved so it won't pop out, that I don't get. but the Craftsman cordless tools are pretty awesome, I have a 19.2 volt Drill and 5 and 1/2 circular saw(for cutting plywood) and no problems there. I wish I could afford Festool and the other high end tools that would be nice, maybe one day


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## jonchilds (May 16, 2011)

I have a couple of their 18v+One tools and have pretty good luck. The drill has lasted a few years and the impact driver about a year so with no problems. I got one of their wet tile saws on sale cheap (way cheaper than renting for the 4 days that I would need it) and it served its purpose. I got the 12" drill press for $69 when they were clearing that out. For a guy who just does regular homeowner stuff around the house they do seem to serve their purpose. Home Depot always seems to be clearing one tool or another out at a price that I can't pass up. For the amount I use stuff it is usually get Ryobi/HF level stuff or do without it.


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## JAAune (Jan 22, 2012)

The old Ryobi tools were practically indestructible in my experience. I've worked with one of the AP-10 planers for the past five years in a professional shop. It's handled thousands of lineal feet of hardwood by now and shows no sign of wear. The only other person I know who owned one had pretty much the same experience. He only got a new planer because he wanted one with a height lock.

I was given a newer Ryobi rotary tool and that one I've had a less positive experience with. It wouldn't start up one day (even though it was pretty new still). Some time later it started working again but the negative impression still remains.


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## Blackie_ (Jul 10, 2011)

Lots of great stories and info.


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## Martyroc (Feb 1, 2012)

Its all the new tools, almost all manufacturing has been moved overseas. I have a Craftsman TS 23 years old made in USA still the focus of my shop. Took 14 hours to set it up, (Yea, you don't forget that amount of set up time no matter how old you get, just wish I could recall my anniversary that quickly). I own Dewalt which I have been very pleased with, Milwaukee, all old when it was still made here, and about a handful of other brands. My go to Brand is Bosch, My Jigsaw, Hammerdrill and a few others I have are Bosch, and I have never been let down. I have a Ryobi handheld Power Planer I got last year for my Birthday, Ive used it twice for about 5 minutes both times, I guess with that kind of usage it might last. I don't by HF power tools, but I do by the air tools from them. I bought a pneumatic flooring nailer from them to do the floors in my house, it worked good and was 150 cheaper than anything else, and it it sits collecting dust for the last 3 years, it was still cheaper than the rental.

Also I am a tool guy, I keep 2 or 3 of every tool in case one goes down in the middle of a project, has not happened yet, but just in case. Its handy when a woodworking buddy need to borrow something my projects never go on hold since I lend them the spare.


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## knotscott (Feb 27, 2009)

Along the lines of TCCcabinetmaker's comment that all manufacturers can make a defective tool, just because a tool fails or is defective, doesn't mean they all will. Most of us are dealing with a sample size of one tool, which is fairly meaningless statistically….the owner of the defective tool may feel differently, but it's possible that he's the owner of one of 3 defective tools out of a run of 10,000. 9, 997 owners will likely have a different opinion of the same tool than the 3 bad eggs.

It's also important to note that many tools within a brand don't have much correlation from one model to the next….different tools are often designed and specked out by different teams at different time intervals, and made in different factories. With the rate that the business associations change, it's very possible that a particular tool was originated with different management in charge, which can effect a lot factors about quality, market niche, parts support, profit margins, numbers made, etc…. one reason I try not to base my tool purchase decision on brand name alone. A poorly made sander doesn't necessarily mean a poorly made TS from the same brand…..and even a cheaply made TS doesn't mean all TS models from the same brand are similar quality…. think of a $159 Craftsman saw made by Ryobi vs a $1000 Craftsman saw made by Steel City. Conversely, a well made PC router that's been unchanged in many years doesn't necessarily equate to a well made PC cordless drill that's a new design….they share very little in common with each other. As another example, Grizzly has had several recent reports of problematic G0715P hybrid saws, which don't correlate to their other Grizzly saws or tools….the customer service response is the only common thread aside from the nameplate.


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## PutnamEco (May 27, 2009)

Re;* knotscott*
It's also important to note that many tools within a brand don't have much correlation from one model to the next

That is why this website and others like it are so valuable, for help in separating the wheat from the chaff.It is always nice to get a consensus before laying out some cold hard cash

Re:
a well made PC router that's been unchanged in many years

While the design may be the same, I believe a lot of tools have gone down in quality when they have moved to Asian production. I also find that a lot of the "New and Improved" tools that have come out, have merely been redesigned to be produced in a less costly manner. When there is a tool that I consider, I try and get a first generation.


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## NathanAllen (Oct 16, 2009)

While I disdain Ryobi as well, I still love and use my AP1300 planer.

Also, out of respect for those who still have them; their BT3000/BT3100 were well made entry level table saws.


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## Dal300 (Aug 4, 2011)

Geez, give it a break ladies and gentlemen.

Manufacturers are not in the business to make a product to last 50 years now days, they are in the business to sell products.

I've dealt with engineers that would be excited to design and engineer a tool that would last forever, however, the reality of life is that if the company allows them to do that, the company doesn't sell as much so the stock holders don't get the dividends they want and therefore they don't invest in the company.

It doesn't matter if it's Asian based, US based, Canadian based, Mexican based or European based. The quality isn't there because *you* the consumer, won't pay for it.

How many threads have we seen here and elsewhere about how good a particular item has been? Or on the other hand, how bad it's been? Because it was made in the US? nope, Because it was made in Asia? nope. It was made cheaply so it would fail.

Yes, there are exceptions to this rule, but not many, and you will notice that you pay a premium price for those items.

A Historic example: In 1975 when I mustered out of the Army, The Ford engine plant in Cleveland paid $4.35/hr for a guy to sweep the floor. In 1992 at the same plant where I was picking up engines for OMC, the same guy was still sweeping the same floor, but was making $32.00/hr. Was this because of his skills? Maybe his educational background with a broom? Maybe it had to do with his ability to enhance the manufacturing process? Nope, it had to do with his longevity with the Union. You think the American/Canadian workers aren't spoiled? they have priced themselves out of the market.

BTW, 3 out of 10 of those engines wouldn't pass muster at the OMC plant and I got to haul them back to Cleveland.

Yeah, it would be nice to have a $200,000 home and shop and 'open floor plan', hardwood floors and an "ensuite double bath" for the master bedroom.

The reality is that all of us have caused this problem by wanting more and more but have been willing to pay less and less.

I buy Asian, Japanese, European and anything else I have to to get the job done. Having hauled parts and equipment for most of my life as a truck driver, I know where a lot of this stuff comes from and how it is made.

Even if your machine plainly states, "Made In USA" it probably isn't. Here on US 79 we re right next to the railroad tracks and within 30 miles there are 4 switch yards. It's amazing the number of automobiles, auto parts, machine parts, furniture, tools, cooking devices, etc that are made there. 
It's also interesting that minor or interior parts don't have to be stamped with "Hecho en Mexico" as long as they are assembled in the US.

Look at your computer, take the side off and really look at it. HP, Dell, Gateways, Compaq, etc… the parts are made everywhere except in the US. 
Look at your table saw you are so proud of as being "MADE IN THE USA"! Even 30 years ago, the bearings came from SE Asia, or India or Argentina or elsewhere.

Maybe it's time to get off your high horses and learn that we don't live in a tight little nest anymore. The market is global and we don't have a choice in this as long as the American worker thinks his/her work is worth more than anyone else's in the world.


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## pintodeluxe (Sep 12, 2010)

I bought a Ryobi cordless combo kit years ago. That silly drill didn't even have variable speed! It was either on or off, nothing in between. 
I had that 10 minutes before exchanging it for a Dewalt.
Dewalt, Bosch, Jet, Freud, Porter Cable, Bostich. These are the tools I have had great luck with.


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## Blackie_ (Jul 10, 2011)

There are a lot of points that have been made here reading through all the comments and it is possible I just got a hold of a bad batch of tools from Ryobi but my main issue is Ryobi have gotten too proud of their tools by way of cost, why pay more for a cheaper tool when I can pay almost the same or a bit more for a better known brand of tool, I'm not saying it may be better but I would have a better piece of mind thinking I was getting more, I think of it as like buying a tank of gas for my truck even though most fuel comes from the same manufacturer, I feel better paying the same price at a well know station knowing what I am getting rather then the same price at a station I don't like or an unknown station.


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## PutnamEco (May 27, 2009)

Sorry to take this off topic but…

Re: *Dallas*

Nope, it had to do with his longevity with the Union. You think the American/Canadian workers aren't spoiled? they have priced themselves out of the market.

North American workers are NOT the highest paid workers, Nor do we have the highest standard of living. When using the Inequality-adjusted Human Development Index the United States ranks 23, while Canada does slightly better at number 12.

North American workers live in a area with a high cost of living, we can't afford to work for pennies. A person in the United States could not survive on a Chinese workers wages at the same standard of living a person living in China can. Their housing, food, and clothing cost a fraction of what it does in the U.S., not to mention things like health care, and most things are not regulated to as high a standard as we maintain here in the U.S., I won't even go into the toll they take on their environment, just know they have serious problems with pollution, that would have people rioting in the streets if it were to occur in the U.S. 
If it were not for organized labor we would not have things like the 40 hour work week, eight hour workdays, minimum wage, overtime pay, paid vacations, child labor laws, maternity leave, safe workplaces and many other rights that our workers tend to take for granted.
if your concerned about the real problem, figure out why we produce enough food to feed the world, yet many people cant' find profitable enough work to be able to afford it.

Re:
Maybe it's time to get off your high horses and learn that we don't live in a tight little nest anymore. The market is global and we don't have a choice in this as long as the American worker thinks his/her work is worth more than anyone else's in the world.

So, what are you suggesting? That we lower our standards to that of China, so we can compete with them? I'm sure the people that pay you would love to pay you what your equivalent employer in China pays, while allowing you the same rights the Chinese worker has.

Re:
The reality is that all of us have caused this problem by wanting more and more but have been willing to pay less and less.

I'll agree with you on this. It is our shortsightedness as consumers that has been one of the main causes of our race to the bottom. I would also add, it is my belief that our stagnating wages are one of the other contributing factors. If we had enough excess cash to spend on things, we would be buying higher quality products.


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## Sawkerf (Dec 31, 2009)

Well said, Dallas!

IMHO, the real problem is our desire for Festool quality at Harbor Freight prices. All manufacturers know that there's a price point for their stuff and that they have to design and build to not exceed that point. If they go over, they're faced with the choice of reducing manufacturing costs - or marketing a different (usually smaller) consumer demographic.

I often tell my customers that there are three elements to a good job - Price, Speed, and Quality. They get to pick any two, but I'm in complete control of the third. - lol

I gotta wonder how many of the brand snobs take a tour of Wal Mart or Costco every couple of weeks. - lol


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## PutnamEco (May 27, 2009)

Re:
I gotta wonder how many of the brand snobs take a tour of Wal Mart or Costco every couple of weeks. - lol

I have to wonder what percentage of Walmart employees can actually afford to be homeowners,no less afford a hobby like woodworking. With 
12,300 WAL-MART Workers and their Dependents on Medicaid in my home state of Florida.


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## woodshaver (Mar 21, 2009)

Ha-ha! I was just doing a search to see if anyone out there was unhappy with RYOBI tools. And my search took me back to home page Lumberjocks! 
I bought a Ryobi string trimmer or weed whacker. I got two seasons of doing lawn. Then while using it the motor just went to a low RPM and wouldn't rev up. Because of how it was acting I suspected it might be a worn cam shaft. I took the valve cover off sure enough the cam had melted because it was Plastic. Yup Plastic! Oh and get this you can't buy a new cam to replace it. I was on hold for over an hour to find that our! But you can by a new entire motor short block with a new metal cam installed in it for $130 bucks! Are you kidding me! I only paid $96 bucks for the trimmer! Ryobi is nothing but Crap! I'm out the money but they can add me to the long list of unsatisfied people that will help spread the word about how this company will take your money and trun it into a loss.


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## Gshepherd (May 16, 2012)

12 years ago I bought Ryobi cause it was all could afford at the time. Then as I got more into woodworking I moved up to Bosch,Makita, a few Porter Cable and Dewalt. air Nailers I like the Grex and Nikle and a few Bostich. All Manufactures have their strengths and weakness just do the research and ask for feedback on what your looking at. The only reason why some of the tools have gotten cheaper is beacuse they were forced to make them cheaper for the masses. To a certain extent we are to blame for poor quality. If I had to go by a bunch of tools today I would be using Ryobi and the such but thank god I bought the good stuff when I could afford it and they will outlast me…..


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## Howie (May 25, 2010)

@Woodshaver…... I found the best trimmer on the market to be….....Roundup. After going thru 3 trimmers
I figured it out it was cheaper to by a liquid trimmer.


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## woodshaver (Mar 21, 2009)

Howie, 
Oh Yah! That stuff works great! I wish that's all I needed! LOL!!

I went out and bought a Craftsman 4 Cycle. They got a promotional going on right now. You get the $179.99 one for $149 and you also get a free electric starting motor with it. A Great deal! I always had good luck with Craftsman tools. This thing starts on the first pull. 
I'm happy! No more Ryobi for me.


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## lumberjoe (Mar 30, 2012)

Craftsman doesn't actually manufacture tools. In all likelihood, you just bought another Ryobi trimmer, just red instead of grey.


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## woodshaver (Mar 21, 2009)

Joe, 
It's made by MTD … As long as i'm not dealing with Ryobi I'm happy!


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## Blackie_ (Jul 10, 2011)

I can almost understand why large appliances companies manuficturing so as not to last as long as they did 20 years ago as there's not that big of a demand and makers were focused on needing funds to stay in business, though they are still made to last up to 15 years and sometimes longer but small hand power tools fall into a whole different category as theres a huge demand for them so I see no reason why makers produce cheap tools made to fail.


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## woodshaver (Mar 21, 2009)

You are so right Blackie!

I just fixed another tool! 




I'm alway fighting to keep my tools running. I just fixed my Ryobi weed whacker. I repaired the plastic Cam Shaft inside the motor using some Nylon stock and my woodworking tools.


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## bunkie (Oct 13, 2009)

I can't say that I've had bad luck with Ryobi. I own several of their tools and they have worked well for me. None of them are "primary" tools that see a lot of use. For those, I tend to run toward Bosch, PC, DeWalt and Milwaukee.

I have the following Ryobi tools:

1/2 Hammer drill
3/8" 18-volt drill/driver circular saw kit
3" belt sander 
hand-held power planer

None has ever disappointed me.


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## jerryo (Apr 15, 2010)

Just wondering Blackie, what Ryobi power tools do you have? I have a 2 hp router, biscut jointer, 2 13 inch planers, and the cordless set containing the 18v drill. reciprocating saw, circularsaw and the cordless trim router. All have performed well for me. I do not use them everyday however. As for the Hitachi, I have the jig saw, 2 1/4 router and a 3/8 drill. For the price range I think these tools offer the best value and performance. The router is super smooth and quite and has enough power. Performs great mounted in the table and handheld. The jig saw is lightweight and nimble and I cut through 2inch thick maple with no problem. Jerry


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