# Best method for controlling wood boring insects



## 08k8 (Sep 18, 2017)

I've been reading up all of the great posts on this site about drying lumber and dealing with insect pests.

I've just had a ~80 year old red oak sawn to 4/4 and 9/4 material by a local sawyer. The tree blew down at my house and I perhaps delayed a bit too long before taking it in. Now, I'm noticing the classic tiny saw dust mounds on my nicely stacked and stickered wood….

I've read about Timbor and Solubor. I've also read others suggesting the 20 mule team borax will also work. I could buy this product and apply it tomorrow. I can also buy exactly the quantity that I need- as opposed to a large quantity of Timbor for my project.

I have a few questions about 20 mule team:
1). Is this option as good as Timbor / Solubor? Any draw backs?

2). What is the mix ratio for 20 mule

3). With these products, is there any health risk once I begin working the wood?


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## WDHLT15 (Aug 15, 2011)

What you are seeing is ambrosia beetle damage. They will leave as the wood begins to dry. They are not a problem other than the little holes that they leave. They can only survive in green wood. You are right to worry about other wood borers like powderpost beetles that will infest the dry wood. Spraying with borate will prevent them from infesting the wood.

Timbor and Solubor are 98% disodium octaborate tetrahydate (DOT). It is a boric salt. It is not the same as borax. Borax will probably work, but the DOT is formulated for making the boron more available for controlling the insects. I mix 6 pounds of DOT to 5 gallons of water and spray the boards on ALL sides until the wood is soaked. The wood has to be protected from the rain as DOT is water soluable and the water will wash out the borate.


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## 08k8 (Sep 18, 2017)

WDHLT15- thanks for your quick reply. SO, I did purchase some Timbor on Amazon…. and I plan to spray as you suggest. I spent ~$50 for 6# but- I figure that I cannot go wrong with this approach and it is what you recommend.. The wood is too valuable to me to take risk.

My frugal side is always intrigued though. I AM curious though if anyone has good luck with 20 Mule team. This is ~$7 for 4 pounds….. Others on this site have mentioned success using the product, and it is available at all of the big box stores.

I'm curious of successful mixing ratios etc.


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## Hockey (Apr 9, 2017)

Danny, where do the ambrosia beetles go after they leave? Do they go find growing trees to get some green wood?


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## WDHLT15 (Aug 15, 2011)

Yes, they find stressed or dying trees. They are opportunists.


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## Hockey (Apr 9, 2017)

Thanks, Danny.


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## 08k8 (Sep 18, 2017)

I used a moisture meter to measure the 4/4 stock and found that I was ~26%. This is 2 weeks after the tree was sawn. I'll spray the Timbor on and RE-STACK the entire pile with 3/4 stickers.

Is there anything else I should do?


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## 08k8 (Sep 18, 2017)

OK.. Thanks to Amazon, the Timbor showed up quickly.

Do you guys allow the boards to dry completely before stickering them? I'm worried about putting the stickers onto the wet wood and leaving lines.


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## WDHLT15 (Aug 15, 2011)

They should surface dry quickly, only an hour or two, then you can sticker them.


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## Fresch (Feb 21, 2013)

I mix 20 mule with sugar dry to kill ants around my camp, works good not sure about other pest types.
The ants take both sugar and mule back and feed the babies, the ones that get sugar give out nectar to the workers that's how they feed, the ones that eat mule die soon the ants die due to lack of food.


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## 08k8 (Sep 18, 2017)

Well, I've noticed over the past ~ 2 weeks that the boring insects have slowed BUT, they are not stopped. I used the Timbor as suggested (15% strength.)

Could I be battling something here that is NOT controlled by Timbor??


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## WDHLT15 (Aug 15, 2011)

Timbor will prevent reinfestation and will protect against powderpost beetles, which only infest the wood after it is dry.

Sounds like some ambrosia beetles are still leaving the wood. Timbor will not prevent any ambrosia beetle eggs or larvae that were in the wood, before spraying, from boring out to leave. It will likely kill them as the bore out to the treated surface of the wood. Do you see any little small dead black beetles on the wood?


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## 08k8 (Sep 18, 2017)

I do not see any black beetles. The only evidence is the small mound of sawdust on the board.

Just to be clear- this can NOT be termites, correct?

Is there any way to fully understand what I'm dealing with here?


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

I went through this several years ago. Gained some good information from fellow LJs…

http://lumberjocks.com/topics/60652


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## 08k8 (Sep 18, 2017)

Thanks HorizontalMike. I actually ready your story prior to posting this. As a result, I pulled the bark off of all live edges and got rid of all bugs that went along with them. A few days of sitting outside with a tarp on top and they were all gone.

I see NO insects on the wood. Just these tiny piles of sawdust roughly 1/4" diameter. I sure don't want to lose the lot of wood or infest my shop…....

I've been drying this with a fan & dehumidifier. The RH of the shop is going down and I get a constant drip from the humidifier hose. I do have a moisture meter and I've been probing a few of the 1" stock on the exposed edge. I'm really worried about the 9/4 stock because it is drying more slowly..


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## avsmusic1 (Jul 10, 2016)

I'm no expert so you'll want some more knowledgeable folks to chime in but I have two things to add

1. From the pics, it looks like the holes are in the lighter sapwood portions - this is softer wood and probably is further evidence that it's ambrosia beetles (they only seem to ever eat the sapwood on the stacks I've dried)

2. I'd be really careful about how quickly you dry and dry oak, especially the 9/4. You didn't mention how long ago you had the log sawn or when you started with the dehumidifier, but I've had terrible luck trying to dry oak with anything other than open air until it was basically at equilibrium


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## 08k8 (Sep 18, 2017)

The insect holes are not in the sap wood areas- the are deffinately in the heart wood of the tree. Surprisingly, I do not have a lot of activity by the live edges.

The wood was sawn 3 weeks ago and been inside w/ the dehumidifier for 2 weeks now. My shop is 900 sq ft and I brought about 500bf of 1" stock in & a whole lot of 9/4 (6) 20" slabs, and a bunch of assorted smaller salvaged pieces.

In my mind, since I'm storing the wood inside, I need to run the dehumidifier. It is a very slow process to extract the moisture- so I don't think I'll over dry the wood this way. I suppose that I could turn it down from "max" at some point and control the humidity in the room to the appropriate level.

Last year, we took a 30+" walnut tree in and milled slabs. Good luck so far drying the same way in my dad's shop.


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## avsmusic1 (Jul 10, 2016)

Gotcha - The colors must be coming up wonky on my screen so it seemed like sapwood

Respectfully, I would suggest you slow down the drying. The 4/4 may be fine but I have had a hell of a time trying to dry thicker oak with a dehumidifier. I'm no expert though so I'd also suggest asking around woodweb and forestryforum for drying suggestions/rates on the 9/4


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## 08k8 (Sep 18, 2017)

NO worries- I'm asking for your feedback 

What sort of problems did you have drying thick oak with the dehumidifier?

I took the time to cut up a couple of slabs that had various splits and cracks. In doing this, the salvage 9/4 material turned out to be ~ 8" wide or so- This is shown in the picture above. I was really surprised to see how wet the wood is in the center. All edge surfaces of course are dryer. I've read online that some say the water will never fully migrate out with the technique that I'm attempting.


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## WDHLT15 (Aug 15, 2011)

Sure does look like ambrosia beetles abandoning the ship. The wood is much too wet for powderpost beetles.


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