# Tool Collectors Corner



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I've learned a lot from the folks here on LJs. I'm sure my tool collecting has been influenced more from LJs than any other single source. I love to discuss vintage tools, there restoration, their presentation, their history, their value right along with their use.

I'd Like to hear from others. What you like to collect. How and where you present them. You're thoughts on restoration, value and anything that has to do with collecting.

And most if all, questions regarding how and why related to collecting vintage hand tools.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Great thread idea Don. I'll say that as you know, as of late I'm into 4 1/2 sizes strictly. I can't exactly say why, but they're just so cool. I get the same feeling a person does with a #1 every time i find a new one. It's cool hunting around try to see how many i can find, which also opens up a lot of different manufacturers who made planes that i never knew about.

Once i can get some shop time I'm going to try and make a nice display case for them, while none of them are collectors pieces, or something a lot might consider worthy of such, how many people can say they have a collection of nothing but these sizes from every known manufacturer? I think the same would be cool for any size plane too though.

I've started to take a better stance on restorations. I don't like the labor involved in having to strip and repaint, so now i usually almost always leave the japanning alone depending how bad it is. I'll just file the frog and bed, sand the knob and tote, and wire brush all bare surfaces. A lot more rewarding and it's a lot faster too!


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## JustplaneJeff (Mar 10, 2013)

Being a general contractor for the last 25 years, and mostly doing millwork ,trim, and cabinets the last 15, I have developed a fondness for collecting old carpenters tools. Though I did not have a vast knowledge in this field, I have learned a lot from reading, hanging out at auctions and flea markets and following the forums of those in the know here on LJs. I do wonder, when I get a new[old] tool, who held it in their hands and on what jobs it worked on. The history of the piece intrigues me more than the value. And just for the record, none of the tools I have are above being pulled down off the shelf and used in the way they were intended[although I am very careful with some]. Lastly, I know if you have enough money, you can own anything you want instantly. For me its the thrill of the hunt. Finding the tools, along with the story of where they came from, and sometimes who owned them. Thanks Don for starting this thread, I'll be checking back often.


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## ksSlim (Jun 27, 2010)

Just a hint for those that can make it.
3 May 2014, Humbolt Iowa, MWTCA tool swap/sell.
10 May 2014, Sedgwick Ks (just North of Wichita), SWTCA tool swap/sell, 10AM-4PM.


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## superdav721 (Aug 16, 2010)

Do you wonder the history of the tool manufacturer?
Seeing a mans name stamped in the tool tells you he made a living from it. Who was he?
How was the tool taken care of? By what methods was it made?
Dont you think it wants to be put back in service?
I do.
These tools need to be saved and there usage recorded for future generations.
That is why I collect.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

I agree Dave. I've seen some planes, that were broken in half, to be fixed with steel plates bolted on both sides. Clearly shows ingenuity and a need to get the job done!


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## JustplaneJeff (Mar 10, 2013)

Yes I have the sickness!!!


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

Excellent topic of discussion, Don!

For me, I collect the vintage tools out of respect for their history and useful value. Our old home was built in the 1860's, right after the war. Every piece is hardwood…mostly walnut. Every piece of wood on the house was attached 100 years before electricity was available on this road! And the home is sturdy as a rock still.

Hand plane marks left everywhere, the doors, trim, 20" tall baseboards, transom windows over the doorways, little wooden decorative touches built on site by a craftsman with His own cared for hand tools. No air compressed driven nails, no ply, no drywall, no construction grade lumber. Just walnut, blood, sweat, and steel.

The more I examine this old house, the more respect I have for hand tools, and working wood with them! I love actually feeling the wood underneath the hand tool…can't do that with a router.

For me, it's the old Sargent planes…cannot pass one by for some reason. I only NEED one more Auto-Set to complete that family, and 3 more transitionals. No displays yet…all are in my bedroom…safe from humidity until restored and a till can be designed.  My LN's are my users, the Sargents will be sharpened and used on special projects.

Also, vintage saws seem to have this magical allure to me. Since I've learned that spring steel very sharp is a joy to use, my table saw is for flat storage. LOL. I pull out the Disston No.12 several times a week now…just love the feel of the tool cutting wood. And brass backers from the 1800's are beginning to grow in numbers in my shop. Have to save them from restaurant walls!

Just color me Sargent…I'm always on the hunt for a screwdriver, dividers, gauges, etc. How could you not love this lil gem?


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Man, Auto-set 707? Is it corrugated? Awesome!

Speaking of old houses. My inlaws have a GORGEOUS house built in the mid 1800s. Every piece of wood is quartersawn oak. The stairways are all raised panels, with gorgeous hand rails, moldings. The two dens have gorgeous dens, mantles, carved ribbons, fluted columns, the cieling in one has an amazing molding motif on it out of cherry, as is the rest of the woodwork in that room. Im working on restoring a 20 foot radiator bench out of cherry for them with raised panel sides. The house is just a work of art. They said it used to be someones mansion.

I am planning on doing a blog about it when i get a chance. The best part is my father in law is a woodwork nut, he has a bunch of cool pieces. He flys for fedex, and usually picks up some cool stuff in other countries.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I'm a big Sargent fan as well. I'm always looking for more Sargent information. I love to add top my Sargent type blog.

I also agree with Dave. I will search for the names stamped on the vintage plane in hopes of finding another story worthy of another post.

Jeff, you certainly know how to find 'em.


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## TechTeacher04 (Mar 17, 2014)

I have been building my full set of Stanley Sweetheart Baileys. I currently lack the 1 and 2. I display them above my bench where I can enjoy them. I will use them on occasion just for fun. I have the users right next to them so i can compare when I get nostalgic.


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## JoeinGa (Nov 26, 2012)

Some of you guys aren't "collectors"... but more like HOARDERS!

(Not that that's a BAD thing


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

I'm not a hoarder, i just sold a bunch of mine off, probably 10 or so planes. Which is a lot considering i only had about 30 or so. It's tough to want to sell any!

Techteacher- Good luck on the #1/#2 search. Deals ARE possibly, just have to be diligent, i just score a #1 on ebay. Neat little plane.


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## DonBroussard (Mar 27, 2012)

Another interesting thread to follow, and it's off to a great start.

I'll add more later.


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

Lat, no to the corrugations on the 707, but I've got 'em on the 718 and 722! Waiting to hoard the whole family before restoration. 

Jeff, thanks for sharing that photo of 150 planes (no, I didn't count), maybe my wife will see how small MY collection really is! LOL


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Terry- They just don't understand, they need to realize, we need a lot of planes like they need a lot of makeup. lol.


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

^or pairs of shoes! OMG!


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## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

I like my Type 11 Stanley's, preferably corrugated. I've got a full line minus a #4 1/2 C (it's a type 10, non-corrugated).

Lately I've also been starting in on Keen Kutter KK series planes as well. I've got a #4-1/2c, #5-1/2c, and #4c. It's taking a LOT of self control not to bid on a #64 though… and by not bid on, I mean not bid *again* on…


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

Nice thread Don, and a good start.

While I've always had a fondness and appreciation for old tools, I never thought of myself as a collector until I joined LJ. Just seeing the tools and reading the discussions here has brought out the latent collector in me, with a bent towards old saws. I didn't really choose saws, they chose me. I'll acquire other old tools as I can, of course.

I enjoyed reading about old tools and old houses above. Though I never saw it, my great grandfather (son of the man in my avatar) built a large two story farm house in West Virginia. His son (my grandfather) was required as a teenager to hand plane all the chestnut siding for the house, turning who knows how many thousands of board feet of chestnut lumber into beveled siding by hand. It's a wonder he ever wanted to pick up a tool again, but he became a carpenter for the rest of his life. I have a number of his hand tools.

One thing I think would be worthy of discussion in this thread is this: When should a restoration be attempted, and when should an old tool just be left alone as is. I have a couple of old saws that I'm torn whether to restore or not. They are early 1800's, not in the best of shape, and even if I restored them, they probably wouldn't be daily users. In truth, they may be better suited for a museum. I'm not sure restoring them is the right thing to do, but I'm interested in others' thoughts on this. Secondly, when you do restore a tool, how far should you take it? There seems to be two schools of thought. I've seen some old tools that were made to look like new again, and they look great. Other people prefer to do only the minimum to make the tools useable. I'm not sure there is a right or wrong answer. It's probably a matter of personal preference. What do y'all think?


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## woodchuckerNJ (Dec 4, 2013)

I personally like to use tools, not collect them.
I find it irritating to find a perfectly good tool sitting there not used, or on a wall in a restaurant.

That being said, I realize that some tools are so rare, that they need to be saved for future generations to see. So I don't have the absolute answer to how to balance that.

To the Hoarders, you guys suck. You need to make some of your stuff available to people that need them. After 3 or 4 of the same item, you are twisted. Is it that you want to make sure you have it and someone else doesn't? Do you want to take it to the grave? Funny thing is, most of it will be sold by your family at a yard sale or estate sale.. so you can't take it with you.

Lately I have seen some junk equipment going for lots of $$.. not worth it. Hopefully I'll find the few pieces I need at a garage sale ….

You collectors have driven the price up of ********************.. people feel that you collector's piece is so valuable so my rusted piece of junk is of equal value….

Now I have expressed my view, but it's not all that cut and dry, collecting is not a bad thing.. but you have an effect on the rest of the hardware out there. It becomes more money for no reason at all.


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## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

for me personally, I just like to restore to usable. I just want to stop the rust from eating away at it. I don't typically polish everything up like crazy, just enough to clean it off. At least for now lol


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## ShaneA (Apr 15, 2011)

I appreciate both types of the rehab. I like them looking shiny and new a tad bit more, but I also see the beauty and reasoning with just cleaning, up and putting back into service.

The hard part for me in balancing the sickness of collecting vs hoarding is the urge to have all the sizes, even though most of them are not used with great frequency. I think I want them, just because. Anyone have a 2" 750 stanley they are looking to part with…cheap? : )


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I actually wrote a blog about the"when to restore" topic. I never posted it because it had a preachy sound, so I need to revisit it. I believe it has to do with the condition in relation to its age. After all, even museums perform restorations. I to have become more reserved in restorations, but some of the stuff I pulled up looks like they were found by digging threw an outside dump. They just deserved to be restored.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

I just like the old planes. and I've rescued some that were sure to end up in a landfill or scrapyard. I'm currently on the prowl for my favorites, the transitionals regardless of manufacturer, and number 4's with weird trademark names on the lever caps. I can't help it! I don't pass up any plane for sale if not priced outrageously.

In my neck of the woods, there are no other collectors that I know of, so it is the like-minded gents here in Lumberjocks who sustain my interest in the vintage planes. Along with the fellowship, I've come to identify planes which have mismatched parts or otherwise modified from what they should be. I've learned a lot here. I find joy in restoring the poorly-kept planes, removing rust and sharpening them and take them on test rides afterward!

Indeed there is a sense of stewardship when you own more planes than you can shake a stick at! For those who blame us for hoarding, and driving up prices, I'd bet if you met any one of us in person, we'd gladly give you a plane or two to get your collection started. Nothing would be expected of you in return, of course.


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

Jeff - I respect your opinion, but I disagree. If someone thinks tools should only be used and not collected (or hoarded), then that person should be looking for user quality tools and not rare tools. User tools can still be picked up pretty cheaply - $25 for a plane, $10 for a saw, etc. If paying $25 for a tool rather than stealing it for $2 makes someone upset, then it's hard to have a lot of sympathy. The price of everything has gone up, not just tools. It's the world we live in.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I get the idea that collecting can drive up prices, but so can recruiting more woodworker to use hand tools. I used to teach technology and some engineers would preach to me how I was teaching my own competition. I agree, but that just drives us to be better.

Collecting tools may drive up the price, which means it drives up the value. My plane collection is worth more than I paid and that's the point.

One the flip side of that however, driving up the price, creates a need, so more are saved, dug and sold, and dug out of the old barns and cellars, the more that are saved, the easier they are to find, which drives down the price. I agree its not even, and prices will rise, but I'm ok with that.

As far as my family selling them at estate sales. My wife and kids know better than that. There are auction houses that specialize in vintage tools, and I've made sure my family knows that.

I don't want my vintage plane to depreciate any more then I'd want the stocks in my 401K to depreciate. Its all relative.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

That's not even an accurate statement. There are countless amounts of cheap good tools available. Gotta know what to look for.


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

I haven't tried to calculate it, but I'd bet, in real dollar terms, most vintage tools are cheaper today than when they were new. And they are certainly cheaper than equivalent quality new tools, if you can even find them.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

Agree with lateralus819. There will ALWAYS be tool bargains, and there will ALWAYS be people asking a king's ransom for their stuff. With participation in Lumberjocks, you will begin to know a nicely-priced gem from an unrestorable piece of crap.

Of course you can always snap a few pics and post a question here about whether something is a good buy or not! There's plenty of room for more collectors and restorers. Just build up a foundation of knowledge before diving in headfirst.


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## Tim457 (Jan 11, 2013)

I agree with Don - "One the flip side of that however, driving up the price, creates a need, so more are saved, dug and sold, and dug out of the old barns and cellars, the more that are saved, the easier they are to find, which drives down the price. I agree its not even, and prices will rise, but I'm ok with that."

There are so many old high quality tools rusting and going neglected right now it's a crying shame. The more the value goes up and the more of them that are saved by collectors or for users the better. Once it gets to the point that there are very few coming out of old barns and basements it may be a different story, but I think it's important to save as many of them as we can.

And Bob, I haven't seen exact numbers, but I've heard a new Stanley in their heyday would cost an average worker a weeks salary. That's way more than a premium Lie Nielsen costs today, not to mention the availability of cheap vintage options.

So I'm not really a collector myself, but I can partly sympathize with the collector bug and desire to save the old tools and find good deals and as an investment. Personally though, I just want good quality user tools and have fun digging up the old stuff and restoring them. Even though I'm not searching for a matched set of any kind, I guess you could still call what I do collecting.


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## DocBailey (Dec 9, 2011)

Tim
RE: your assessment of wages vs. cost of tools.
Sorry, but I don't think that's even close.

I have a brand new in the box no 5 Stanley/Bailey jack. The 1951 receipt from a hardware store in Nebraska is for 6.45 after tax.
I also have a '64 Craftsman catalog. Their top-of-the line No. 4 plane is $8.29. An average weeks' wage in 1964 America had to be over $100.00.

Conversely, the average cost of a LN bench plane would probably require half of the current median wage to purchase.


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

According to this site, today's value of the 1951 $6.45 plane would be between $46.80 and $312.00 depending on which metrics you use to calculate it. The value of the 1964 $8.29 plane would be $48.00 to $203.00. Pretty interesting. I didn't know there were so many ways of calculating worth.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Depending on your wage, it could be a weeks pay. Even still. Think about, what is $500, over 30 or 40 years that you'll have the tool? Not to mention you can always get almost full retail if you don't like it.


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## BJODay (Jan 29, 2013)

I like Stanley planes. I don't want to collect. I want a set I can use. So why do I have 2 #3's, 3 #4's, 2 #5's and a second #2 being shipped this week?

My Dad had a corrugated #4 that he used for planing doors. I remember him letting me plane a door edge. He also had a rabbet plane that he was thrilled to own but I never understood why. He loved having a tool that was 20 years old but still as versatile as the day it was made. I am currently on the prowl for a #78.

BJ


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## Tim457 (Jan 11, 2013)

Doc, I guess I should have specified. When I said heyday I was referring to well before that. More like 1920s or before I think what I read was referring to. And the current median US household income is around $50k so yeah a quarter to half of a weeks wage at that level would get you a Lie Nielsen depending on model.

I think the cost for a Stanley 4 or 5 was in the $5-6 range well before the 50's too.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

In 1910 a Sargent #408 was $3.00.


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## mikeevens45 (Jan 31, 2014)

I just finished redoing a miller falls 422… love it..everything was rusted solid so had to make it new…shaves sooooooo nice…really like other planes besides my stanleys I have a set of type 17 s..3-7 with the plastic knob…why plastic?...not really sure….I been picking up old planes like dunlap, Shelton , mf, Stanley, fulton and refurbing them for users…all have lost 90% of the finish so returning them to useful tools is my goal. sold a lot to local woodworkers…the old planes work great and don't cost a lot like a lie-neilsen…for us amateurs or beginners they are awesome…as I get better …a 4 1/5 LN is my first one…lateralus…the 5 1/2 is cool also…but I like "fat boy" (my 4 1/2).. plane on my friends

mike


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Damn collecting sucks. Just bought a #2, But it'll go nice with my #1. My wife was actually happy cause i have a full set, not all the same type though. Still cool though!


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## Slyy (Nov 13, 2013)

Holy gee-golly Yoda, what a great topic and thread! Favorited and watching!

My opinion on reasons for collecting seem to follow the common thread of most of those here in the thread.
One of the most fascinating aspects of these tools is wondering what the story is behind this well crafted piece of equipment I can hold in my hands. The history, or potential there of, allows this visceral connection I can feel from myself to the craftsman/artisan who previously held the tool.
Most of what I have collected so far have been mostly horrible rust buckets so I've done more restoration rather than refurbish if that make sense. But I do feel that if rust is easy to control or an item has a great patina, then I will strive to keep it as original as possible.

The whole "feeling a connection" stuff is kinda nerdy but I think I'm in like company.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Sly, "rust buckets" are great. They're pieces a lot of people pass up, and to be honest, before i started restoring them myself i used to pass by them. Now i know what lies beneath.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

I clicked on the thread,
And set it to "Watch",
But not because I'm a collector.

I have a few planes,
With many the same,
But not because I'm a collector.

Rulers and saws, toolboxes and cauls,
Have all found their way to my shop.
Chisels and files, with brace bits in piles
Have filled my tool tills to the top.

I will not chime in, 'cause my logic is thin
On my insistence I'm not a collector
I just it in the back, not speak as a hack,

Aw heck, you know what I'm going to say…


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## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

...... He's not a collector. Yea, neither am I. Starting another tray for the excess drills in my chest, but I'm not a collector!

Great ditty Smitty, pity I can't rhyme.


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## Slyy (Nov 13, 2013)

Smitty, your waxing philosophic with magniloquent exposition has me feeling quite discomposed!


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## DocBailey (Dec 9, 2011)

Average weekly wage in 1910 = $14.40

A plane such as the Sargent mentioned by Don W would represent less than a quarter of a weeks' wages.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

I suppose I could dig out the BoswickBraun Catalog #43. It had several pages of just Stanley planes, with the wholesale prices to each item. Including every cutter know for the 45 and that other combo plane…

Same catalog had everything from Axes to swingsets. Even listed a sparkplug for a clothes dryer. Even had a bunch of pages to shop in for guns, and ammos. Don't even ask about all the fishing supplies they carried.

Place was located in Toledo, Ohio. Inside the front page was a blurb about the UPS rates for '44. As in 1944.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

It's close with LN/Veritas planes. While if Docs info is close, it is higher today, the product is much better as well.


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## superdav721 (Aug 16, 2010)

Now the sad part is when I go to an antique shop and 90% of what I pick up I already have.
I am on the look out for the hard to find things. My favorite is to find something that I have no idea what its purpose was.
Those are the fun ones.


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## Vincent (Mar 10, 2009)

I collect transitional planes. I have some Liberty Bells, Sargents, Union, Keen Kutter and Pine Knot in the collection. Some are used on a regular basis, some are destined to live in a display cabinet (like a pre-lateral Stanley 24 with the Eagle logo) and some are there as spare parts. I find them in antique stores, thrift shops, flea markets and sometimes on Ebay. I am currently looking for a Stanley 21 and 23. I know they are out there waiting to be found.




























!https://storage.googleapis.com/aws-s3-lumberjocks-com/n3awi4s.jpg

!


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## JayT (May 6, 2012)

Finally getting time to contribute.

I'm not a collector, I just have a lot of antique tools that happen to be redundant ;-)

Like many others, my interest starts with bringing old tools back from the grave, or the barn, as the case may be. I understand where Jeff is coming from, felt very much the same not that long ago and still have some of those feelings. On the other hand, I also fully agree with Don's point that the only way to save some of these tools is for them to have a value more than just scrap metal.

Like many of you, I restore/refurbish old tools and then many of them get passed on or sold. There is a reason I sell those tools here on LJ instead of ebay-I want them to go to someone that will appreciate and use them, not just sit on a shelf. Vincent, I'll see your #24 and raise you 10-the only real shelf-sitting display piece I have is a pre-lateral #34










All the rest get used to a greater or lesser extent.

I'm not sure whether to thank you for the thread or not, Don. A great topic and place for discussion, but also one more good thread to try and follow.


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## BJODay (Jan 29, 2013)

Smitty is a poet, .. and doesn't even know it.


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

^Love the trannies!

As far as collectors raising the value of vintage tools goes…

Ummm…wake up! Supply and demand rules our economy. Ten people in line at the drive through at Hardees raises their prices. 1,000 online orders for the same pair of Nikes raises their prices. All the Moms in their full-size sport ute has raised those prices. 10 hungry families sitting in que at Red Lobster raises their prices. AND, any time diesel fuel costs more, everything costs more.

BTW, hoarding and collecting nice stuff is one of the few perks that come with old age! As a nurse, I wiped poop off enough sick people, made enough life or death decisions at 2AM, and showed up to work on time for 25 years…now I deserve the LN planes and a full set of Sargents if that's what I WANT. Hell, I could replace my 9-year old diesel truck, but it runs like a bull, so I'd rather collect tools that will outlive me.

Anyone who cannot respect that point of view must be 21 or so…just sayin'


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## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

^ hear, hear!


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## ShaneA (Apr 15, 2011)

Terry went manifesto…nice.


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

I never thought I would hear a Lumberjock say they love Trannies. 

I'm not a collector
I'm not a collector
I'm not a collector

Just have to keep reminding myself.


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## jamesicus (Jan 11, 2011)

I have a passion for North Bros. "YANKEE" Radio Tools & Tool Sets (actually "YANKEE" tools in general).
Please visit my web page at http://jp29.org/wwyankeeradio.htm.

Please also visit my Vintage Woodworking Toolbox page at http://jp29.org/wwtoolbox.htm

James


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

Terry - I like your style.


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

I'm a Yankee guy as well James. I just got one of their catalog reprints and have a variety of their tools.


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## Vincent (Mar 10, 2009)

How about a Liberty Bell 135 with the eagle logo?


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## Vincent (Mar 10, 2009)

Or perhaps a Sargent 178 Rabbet Plane.


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## Slyy (Nov 13, 2013)

Atta boy Terry! I've worked hard enough, I've worked long enough, and gosh darnit! I deserve it if I want it!!


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## john2005 (Jun 8, 2012)

I think Terry pretty much hit it home for a lot of us. I probably still have some time to put in though…


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I with you Terry. I started working when I was about 12. Cut firewood and sold it all through high school. Did college while working full time and raising 3 kids. Until I started traveling I always worked 2 jobs. If I want to display a hand plane in a cabinet in my office, where I'm STILL working, try and stop me!! My gun cabinet is not far away!


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## superdav721 (Aug 16, 2010)

I allow myself a certain amount for tool purchases each month.
The wife lets me get away with it and I do admit I have a good woman.
As long as my chores are done she rarely says anything to me when I grab shop time.
I call it my mad money.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Lol Don. How do you get ANY work done with those beauty's in front of you? Do you ever catch yourself just staring at them?


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

My gun cabinet is not far away!

That's funny Don. Isn't it Amendment 2a that gives us the right to keep and bear hand tools? It goes along with Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Rustiness.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

My wife is cool about my tool buying habits too. She know's i like them and i use them. A lot of time she encourages me. I told her i was going to sell some tools to pay for a few i bought, and she said not to sell anything that is useful. She's a very talented painted so she herself is very much into art.


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## BigRedKnothead (Dec 21, 2012)

My friends here on LJs have watched me dabble in tool collecting. I'm certainly drawn to woodworking tools old and new. The thing that holds me back is that I don't really enjoy rust hunting. I'd rather be in my shop.

Here's my bailey type 13's:









-
Sometimes I get frustrated with the rising prices on vintage. But now we have great options for new tools too. So wuddyagonnadooo?

I've always wandered about the cost of the old planes compared to the wage back in the SW era. Even if a plane was about 1/4 of a weeks wages back in the day, it's not too far off what Veritas and LN planes cost today. By those numbers a $40 vintage no 5 is a steal!


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## superdav721 (Aug 16, 2010)

lateralus819 That is wonderful.
Mine gets the fruits of my tools labors, so it works in her advantage.
Plus we antique shop together.
Sounds like we got us some good women.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Jeeze, Red that collection looks damn fine! I wish i had a set of the same type, but alas i don't. I've got a #7 and #4 1/2 that feel phenominal to use. My favorite planes to use. The #4 1/2 is a type 15, not sure on my #7. I also have a type #6 #8 which is awesome. One thing i don't like about the earlier types is the small adjustment knob.

A man who doesn't like rust hunting? *Gasp*


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## Vincent (Mar 10, 2009)

Summerfi: I am with you. I know that my pre-lat 24 and my 135 will be kept pretty much as found. I will clean off some of the rust and sharpen, but the finish and the checks are part of it history.

Terry and Don: I hear you. In my working life, I have logged over 2 million flight miles and have spent years outside the country working on projects. So, what's and extra Sargent 3408 or 3411? I see myself as a preservationist of sorts. I will keep them safe so that the next generation can have and use them also.


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## lunn (Jan 30, 2012)

I'm not a collector but i do have about a dozen or so. I guess i'm just lucky to stumble on the #64 and the 10 1/4 The flea mkt. i go to, alot of people clean out their barns etc. to make a quick buck. Besides me i've never seen anyone else look at them. Darn can't wait to go back next weekend! Oh my what am i turning into?


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## lysdexic (Mar 21, 2011)

I try to collect friends on the Internet, but its difficult


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## superdav721 (Aug 16, 2010)

you have more friends than you know


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## DonBroussard (Mar 27, 2012)

I'm not a collector either. I'm the curator of a very private museum. I love to share the stories of the hunt and acquisition for them, and of the stories they tell. Of course, I also enjoy showing how they work too.


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## woodchuckerNJ (Dec 4, 2013)

Ok, after seeing Vincent Nocito Sargent 178, I am curious what my Sargent Rabbet plane is. I am missing pieces of it.
I have used it without those pieces, but would love to find them. One has to be the fence that sets how wide the rabbet is. The other must be the depth.

So what # is it, where can I find Sargent info.

















Thanks folks.


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## superdav721 (Aug 16, 2010)




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## BigRedKnothead (Dec 21, 2012)

A man who doesn't like rust hunting? Gasp
I know, I know. If I hit a couple places and strike out…I'm already done. Guess I don't have the patience.

lunn- What'd you end up doing with that no 64?


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

I'm kinda the same way, i get discouraged. The only time i find anything good locally, it's at the big flea market. It's in may and i can't flipping wait! I told my wife I'm bringing a bag of cash 8)


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## ShaneA (Apr 15, 2011)

Red I think the local spots you look in must be like mine. Off name brands, in tough shape for Bedrock money. I have yet to see any plane in the wild, save one estate sale of a hoarder, I would even considered buying. After so much nothingness, my hope and enthusiasm gave way.


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## Vincent (Mar 10, 2009)

WoodchuckerNJ: What you have there is a Sargent 79 Fillester Rabbet Plane. It is similar to a Stanley 78. You are missing the fence and rod on the inboard side and the depth stop and screw on the side with the nickers. You can find the depth stop and screw on Ebay sometimes. Search under Sargent Planes. You could also check 
http://www.antique-used-tools.com/parts.htm to see if you can locate the missing fence and rod. A good source for info in Sargent planes is http://www.sargent-planes.com/


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

*woodchuckerNJ* Vincent hit it with a Sargent 79. I'll just add yours was made between 1918 and 1948. Before 1918 they didn't have the horn (knob) on the front. After 1948 they went to a dimple pattern.

I keep a running list of parts dealers here, I just send out emails until I find what I'm looking for. Ebay is typically the best bet. I've bought from NH Plane Parts the most.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

NHplaneparts is great, fast shipping too.


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## superdav721 (Aug 16, 2010)

Ok guys I am in need of an two inch toothing iron for a coffin body.


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## Slyy (Nov 13, 2013)

For you Scotty, meant to post it a day ago but call and sleep got in the way!









What's the consensus on restaurant wall/ceiling hanging tools? Just tried out a new BBQ joint with the wife the other day. Place had several eggbeater drills, sweep braces and large handsaws (read one and two man xcuts) around. Braces looked mostly like later stanley and millers falls made mowhawk shelburne examples but a few hand drills were older vintage from cursory examination. I'm certainly appreciative that they are not in a land fill somewhere but in the same vein, I hate to see them not out and creating in an artisan's hands.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

While it's nice to see vintage tools being used, i think it's good to at least see them not rotting away.


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

Seeing them on a restaurant wall may at least make more people aware of them and perhaps develop a bit of appreciation in some. While they're hanging there, at least they're not rusting away somewhere.


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## Slyy (Nov 13, 2013)

Yeah, I'd certainly prefer to know they are being used (they are tools after all) but I do like knowing they still live.


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## MarkE (Feb 26, 2008)

I never really thought of myself as a collector, but I guess I do have a fair collection of Stanley bench planes. My Stanley planes are all users and range from type 6 through type 20, and from No.2 through No.8, including the 4-1/2, 5-1/4 & 5-1/2. I also have a No.1, but it is a Lie-Nielsen given to me by my Wife.

I get my satisfaction from bringing new life to old planes. I buy them, restore them, and sell them. I really enjoy taking a rusty old piece of junk destined for the landfill and turning it back into a useful tool. I especially enjoy getting the tool into the hands of someone just starting down the hand tool path.

But, I also understand the desire to build a collection, any collection really. It usually starts off pretty easy, I mean, anyone can find a Stanley Bailey No.4 type 11, there are probably 100 of them listed on eBay on any given day. But the satisfaction comes from finding those one or two final pieces that finish off the quest. Followed quickly, of course, by the start of the next quest.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Good summary at the end there Mark. I'm nearing my collection of 4 1/2, i think i have roughly 10 more to go, i have 6 different brands right now. It's funny trying to track them down.


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## redryder (Nov 28, 2009)

It would appear that some of you are just "plane" crazy.

While I do like old tool collecting and really admire posts of old tool refurbs, I don't have the extra space in my shop to let these relics of the past take up valuable floor or wall space.

I do have a few "dinosaurs" on the wall outside my shop. Wall hangers if you will…...............


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Most of the rooms in my house have a few planes strategically placed as part of the decor. Most being restored woodies.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

I bet in the next 10 years Don will have a house shaped like a plane. lol


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

There was an old man who lived in a plane.
He had so many hand tools, they drove him insane.
He cleaned them and waxed them and set them in cases.
There were so many, he had no more places.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Old?


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

LOL Don, who said I was talking about you?


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## Slyy (Nov 13, 2013)

Bob is going for self reflection here!


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## JustplaneJeff (Mar 10, 2013)

Some new display cabinets with s









some more of my collection. Further proof of my illness. I need Obama care!!!!!


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## DonBroussard (Mar 27, 2012)

@JustplaneJeff-No, if you like your planes, you can keep your planes, period.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Whats up with that white #66? That is awesome lmao. I wish i could do that. I don't have enough of a collection anymore and dont think i will. To that extent anyways.


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## TedW (May 6, 2012)

Excellent topic Don. I wish I could afford to collect, but watching what you and the others have hoarded is the next best thing.


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## TedW (May 6, 2012)

I have two block planes… one sharp and one sorta sharp. I like a little variety in my collection.


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## nztoolie (Aug 1, 2013)

You just gotta love the vintage stuff. Cant wait until i make another visit to the US of A & chase some vintage tools. "Too much is not enough"


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Tool hunting is a rush. I walked into a antique store today and saw piles of tools. I didn't know my eye's could get that big lol.


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## JustplaneJeff (Mar 10, 2013)

Lateralus: The #66 is actually a real pale green, it was that way when I bought it at an Amish farm auction several years ago. Don't know why it showed up white in the image


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

*Jeff*, those displays are fantastic!!


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

http://***.com/topics/29-tool-collecting


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)




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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I've got a question for those who wander around the flea markets and antique places looking for the rare and unique. I tend to pick up anything I haven't seen before if its reasonably priced, but I'll also pay a little more if I know its something I need for a current collection project.

For instance I'm looking for an early type 424, so I'd pay more for one then a #422, which I already have. The question is, how do you keep track and how do you remember what it is you "need"?

I keep list in my phone, even with some descriptions. For example I would like to have a complete set of Stanley #4s type 1 through 20, so I have a list of the types I don't have, and a short description so I can quickly determine the type.


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

Unfortunately, I don't get to walk around and pick up vintage, but while shopping on fleaBay, I use an app on my iPad called List Master, to keep up with haves and don't haves. Lets me create multiple lists, and add brief description and even a photo of each item on the list.

I find it difficult to just remember which 34xx I still need! LOL.


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## jamesicus (Jan 11, 2011)

I grew up with hand tools in the 1930s and 1940s - I used them to help my father in his work projects - I used them in the woodworking trade after WWII - I still use them as a hobbyist - I like the look and feel of them - I love them!


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## upchuck (Nov 3, 2013)

Don-
My favorite flea market here in old tool hell is the Glendale Park and Swap. I try to show up there between 7:00
and 8:00AM on Sundays when I have a few extra bucks in my pocket and a few hours to kill. My arrival hours are aimed at late enough to allow the vendors a chance to set up their wares but early enough to avoid the hoards and avoid the Arizona heat. I adjust the start time seasonally.

At that time I usually have a 5 minute wait to pay the $1.25 ($0.75 on Saturday) parking/entrance fee at the booth. While in line I read a half a dozen 4 X 6 index cards I tuck into a reprint of a falling apart 1916 edition of Stanley Tools Catalogue No 34. The index cards are labeled: Tools (1 & 2), Planes, Plane Parts, Bits and Pieces, and BOLO. With the line of cars moving at 2-4 mph I don't think it is a safety hazard to hold the cards on the steering wheel and glance at them again. I'm mostly familiar with the stuff on the cards but it helps to reread them again just before I start out on the hunt. The index cards get items added and subtracted until they are difficult to read then they get rewritten.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

I wish I was more OCD when I started collecting planes.
Now I have a hospital, and soon a junkyard, once all the patients have been released.










I'm starting to segregate the legitimate, numbers matching planes from ones that I've acquired with broken parts, missing pieces, and mismatched or mongrelized parts. There's about 45 in all, ones I have that need some form of attention or other. Like.. who has the lower half of a Record #5 two-piece chipbreaker? I'm breaking up perfectly good, intact planes because of parts that do not legitimately belong together. Let God sort 'em out later, wink, wink.

I have Ohio planes with SW cutters, Record planes with Handyman cutters, lots of planes that need welding, drilling or tapping, hang holes, ones missing correct screws or lever caps, and many more with broken totes. It's starting to drive me crazy, I can hear it in my head already when the day comes that I offer up some stuff in yard sales or antique shows, customers squawking over a repaired tote or chipped lever cap.

I've got projects that keep getting pushed to the back burner so that I can concentrate on improving the handplane gene pool. How silly is that? Lately, I've been paying 'NHPlaneParts' home mortgage as well. Yet, I still can't resist the local antique shows and junque shops for an elusive Stanley #25 or any other tool priced right….


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Poopie, do you buy them when they're included in a lot, or just intend on fixing them?

I used to ignore planes that needed a few parts here and there, now i know better.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

How closely I scrutinize a potential purchase depends on the tag price. I've bought $2 planes simply because the screws were worth that to me. And, a $2 plane can always be resold for $5, usually, on a table. Yes, I've snagged planes by the boxful, a few good users come out and get rehabbed quickly, the orphan planes from the box tend to accumulate on a lower shelf, til I get to them. Yes, I occaisionally get hosed on a plane that isn't as good as it looks. Other planes have come to my core collection in excess of a hundred bucks!
Truth is,* lateralus*, you should never walk away from a plane marked at $5 or less, if it has any merit at all. A restoreable cutter is worth that at least! All of us, each, someday, will put a boxful of plane parts in somebody else's hands, after all.


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

PK, I have to applaud you for trying to improve the handplane gene pool! A very honorable task. Those Stanley lever caps on a few of my Sargent trannies drive me nuts! Glad to know I'm NOT alone…

What we need an open discussion about is an organized way to store 20+ tupperware containers with restoration projects in progress…planes, braces, level parts, saw totes and parts, hey, that's where those extra irons were hiding!

LOL.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

You know you have too many when you can't remember where an iron went for a particular plane.

I grabbed a t-10 #4 1/2, and began sharpening. Noticed it had a SW cutter when i KNOW it came with a t-10 iron lol. oops.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

*lateralus*: Time was, I used to think it was a great idea to keep a few extra cutters on hand, ready to drop in my #4 at the slightest sign of dullness. Now I know better these days, to keep the planes original, and have a few (dozen) alternate
planes ready to go with their own sharp, original blades and simply switch off to a fresh plane when the going gets rough. Because accurate identification often depends on the markings of a single component, I want to be sure that my Stanley planes consist of period-correct parts. Hey, I just discovered that one of my generic #78s is an Edge-Rite, a fact that would be unknown to me if somebody, somewhere, switched out the cutter. It's our duty to posterity, making our planes right again.

*Terry:* Yes, I also keep my under-construction planes in separate Tupperware shoe-box containers. You gotta resist the temptation to snarf a screw or barrel nut from one plane when working on another! These details documented in various journals about when and why a pair of frog screws went from cheese-head to chamferhead to round head, yikes…if there ever was a Pebble Beach Concours in the plane world, we'd probably all lose 99 points for illegitimate swap-outs. Hopefully, that day will never come, LOL! My Excel spreadsheet helps me keep track of what's going on, what's missing, what needs to be machined, etc, but it is tedious work keeping it up to date. * {Edit} * I once bought a Union #7 *because* it had a Stanley lever cap and SW cutter!!


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

When i restore a lot at a time, i use those re-sealable small lunch tupperwares, and label the top with the plane and type.


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## jamesicus (Jan 11, 2011)

*Don W. wrote:*

"I've learned a lot from the folks here on LJs. I'm sure my tool collecting has been influenced more from LJs than any other single source. I love to discuss vintage tools, there restoration, their presentation, their history, their value right along with their use.

I'd Like to hear from others. What you like to collect. How and where you present them. You're thoughts on restoration, value and anything that has to do with collecting."

*Don, I have just updated and re-written the pages of my web site - I hope you can find some useful new information there.*


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

A complete type 1 Sargent #414, including the original type 1 cutter. Its got a fresh coat of dupli drying and parts soaking in citric.

Who really thinks this shouldn't have been restored?










Watch for a blog when completed.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

Why would anyone NOT think that plane shouldn't be restored? I know the Sargent 414 was a plane on your wish list, Don. Now, bring it back alive, can't wait for the blog!


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Congrats, Don!

Let's see. You posted that 55 minutes ago, so I'm thinking Yoda has the refurb done about now. Where's the before and after pic?


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

+1 to the Congrats, Don. A complete Type 1…looks like it found the right home already!


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Nice score Don, can't wait to see that sargent you just got!

Don and i just hit up the local flea market, both scored some stuff.

Wife picked up a bunch of (old crappy) Saws. Don and I talked to her about it LOL.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

A Birdsill Holly plane I picked up over the weekend. According to Roger Smith its the first successfully manufactured metallic plane.

So a question for the collector types. The guy I bought this from was a collector who's selling out. He told me when I bought it it originally had a closed tote. My research shows he knew what he was talking about.

So the question. If it was yours, would you make a new one to match the original?


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## upchuck (Nov 3, 2013)

Don W-
Neat plane! That looks like a plane pared down to the basic essentials. That is one big ol' hunking knob on the front. What is your goal for that plane? Are you ever going to use it or just for display? I like the long horn on what you have. But if you can find a chunk of appropriate wood (age, species, color, growth ring orientation, etc.) sure why not try to match the original. I'm looking forward to seeing this plane after the elves get to work on it.
chuck


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## DocBailey (Dec 9, 2011)

My vote: fashion a replacement handle

I would absolutely want to display it as it once appeared-especially given its historic status.


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## JayT (May 6, 2012)

Agree with Doc. I'd fashion a tote as near to original as possible-same wood species and design.


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## john2005 (Jun 8, 2012)

Agree with above stated, although I would normally ask DonW about these things….


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

thanks guys. I was looking for some reassurance. I hear the old "you should never restore old things" so much I started to second guess myself.


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## DocBailey (Dec 9, 2011)

Don

I fully subscribe to that maxim, whenever practicable, but it is perhaps better observed in practice as:
"Don't do anything that can't easily be reversed."

In that case, you could easily bolt your original (non-original) handle back into place, no?


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

> Don
> 
> I fully subscribe to that maxim, whenever practicable, but it is perhaps better observed in practice as:
> "Don t do anything that can t easily be reversed."
> ...


I doubt I can get it off in one piece since its cobbled together anyhow. It slides into a dovetail and I'm not sure what (if anything but friction) holds it in. I did try to tap it out with a dowel and it didn't budge. I think i'll make a new one and once its made, it'll come out one way or another.


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## upchuck (Nov 3, 2013)

Don W-
You are the most experienced person I know of when it comes to plane restoration. Your contributions to this forum with your own projects and advise to us others is extensive; even exhaustive.
I also think that it speaks well of your ethics and ethos that you would second guess yourself. It's sensible, too.
I mean if you start to get in over your head who are you gonna call. It's always problematic when the rescuers need to be rescued half way through a rescue.
Practical considerations: Are you *sure *that the tote is not factory? Early versions of products often are searching for the bestest, easiest, or some other way of doing something.
Is the dovetail tapered? I'd make sure that the tapping (followed by banging, to be followed by full scale slamming) was in the right direction. Maybe you could ease the exit with a saw kerf at the wood/metal joint.
Does the attachment of the knob give you any clue as to how the tote may be attached?
Good luck. Let us know.
chuck


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

Planes are like lost puppies.

They all need to be rescued.

And talked to in a baby voice.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Thanks Chuck. Its probably going to be awhile before I start it. I want to do more research. I know the current tote is a replacement. Its nailed together.

I did check for a taper. I think it's pinned somehow.

I'll keep you posted.


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

> thanks guys. I was looking for some reassurance. I hear the old "you should never restore old things" so much I started to second guess myself.
> - Don W


To me, when thinking about this just remember that when/if you pass this or any other plane along, that the new owner can and WILL say to the World… "This plane is AS-FOUND." And you, the previous owner, will just be part of the history of that plane in some obscure way… *;-(*


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## Wally331 (Nov 8, 2012)

Is there a screw through the bottom that's hidden by grime maybe?


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Anybody have a guess as to the kind of wood. My son says walnut. I said Mahogany. "American Wood and Metal Planes" by Andew D'Elia suggest Holly used maple. Roger Smith suggest Beech.

The cloth looks to be denim, so i'll assume its not original.

PTMPIA V-2 has the closest thing to this version


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

The knob sure looks like mahogany to me. To put it another way, a mahogany tote would match the look of that knob, I think. Don't know if it'd actually be the same wood though.


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## racerglen (Oct 15, 2010)

Shesh Don, I thought it was fiberglas not denim !
That is some find ! Can I vote for the closed tote please ?


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

Now wouldn't denim actually BE 19th century vs modern crap?


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I started roughing out a piece from Smitty's mahogany. I think its gonna work.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)




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## JayT (May 6, 2012)

Dang, Don, that looks great!


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## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

looks too good, gotta rough it up a bit lol


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## ToddJB (Jul 26, 2012)

> looks too good, gotta rough it up a bit lol
> 
> - Mosquito


+1


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## SCOTSMAN (Aug 1, 2008)

You've got it seriously bad brother! I thought I was bad when buying tools but your something else. LOL seriously when your short of a buck or two you can always cash them in what does the missus say regarding all those cabinets ?it looks like a shop or museum LOL well done and have fun Alistair


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## SCOTSMAN (Aug 1, 2008)

Oh and that's not denim but hessian like an old wick type cloth. Alistair


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## racerglen (Oct 15, 2010)

Damn but that looks GOOD, nice work in what, 20 minutes Don ?
Seriously, very sweet !


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## DocBailey (Dec 9, 2011)

Nice work Don, but I too must add that I think it needs some aging.

I would suggest a few dents, finish dulling using worn-out sandpaper or steel wool, and finally some black wax/polish to fill the new dents.


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## john2005 (Jun 8, 2012)

and some multi-colored paint speckles.

Looks awesome!


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

i'll come back to the tote, started on the cap. I thought I'd make a new "old" one, then try to fix the original back to original/










It in the fire pit getting some "patina" 
I originally made the pieces and was going to farm out the welding, but I got impatient.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Some pictures of the Holly if interested, http://www.timetestedtools.com/birdsillholly.html


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

Awesome work, Don!

Wow, the casting on that plane looks like a tank!

The whole tool just reeks of heft…looks like it would be a formidable jack…


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I've got a sort of replica in my head. Need to pick up some steel.


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## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

Well I did it, I actually bought two planes as a collectors item. A set a match planes by David Bensen of Albany. They are huge by T&G standards, they work on 1 3/8" stock!



























I got the tongue plane to work









The groove plane has been a bit troublesome. I can't seem to get the wedge tight enough. Any ideas?


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

try roughing the contact areas with some course sandpaper.


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## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

Thanks Don.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

Wow, those planes were born in *Don'*s neck of the woods?


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## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

Yup


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

While not collector items by any stretch









This 13" long jack plane needed a bit of clean up









That "frog" does NOT come out. Tote needed to be replaced, too









So, a walnut one was cobbled up to fit. Iron needed to be ground back a bit, but still has a bit of life left in it









Just a simple Jack plane, not meant to be a smoother with micron thin shavings. About $5 for the plane









ParPlus #5


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

So this is how this tool collecting thing sneaks up on you. I just bought what I'm pretty sure is a type 4 #3. As I was making sure I didn't already have a pre-lat #3, I realized I only need a #7 to have a #3 to #8 set. Whoot Whoot!

In addition, looking at my #1, it seems to have the qualities of a type 2, which means if I can find a pre-lat #2, and a #7, I have a complete set of pre-lateral Stanleys.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Sweet stuff Don!

I want a pre-lat someday lol.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Don, you are not a well man. Enjoy! ;-)


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

What do you do when you find a Super fine Sargent #407 for $46? You buy it of course!


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## Slyy (Nov 13, 2013)

What else is there to do?

Picked up some saws and a plane yesterday myself. Hard to pass up ANY decent old saw for $5, same goes for any plane. $5? Yes please, I'll take it home!


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## ksSlim (Jun 27, 2010)

There's no antidote, relax just go with it!

Sometimes, North of ya we have special pickins.


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

Nice score, Don! All your time searching certainly pays off!
A Type 4? (guessing)


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## racerglen (Oct 15, 2010)

local collectors show yest n' today, saw these two guys last year at a table, price reduced this yr, oh, what the heck.








European type block ? down to 10 from 20, candle wax all over it, the other, not quite sure, no chuck as such, just a thumbscrew into a quarter inch hole.










and..








No blade, metal skate with surface rust otherwise just dirty.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I'm guessing a type 4 as well Terry. We'll see when it gets here.

Nice pickins Glen.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

Nice grabs, *Glen*! I'm developing quite a taste for those horned Euro-planes. I have two like yours, somebody modified them into scrubs, and I don't lust for a #40 anymore. Is yours a Nooitgegat? (spelling) ?
As a kid, I recall merchants on Main Street raising or lowering their storefront awnings with that type of crank tool, but it might indeed be a bit brace after all.

*Don: * Niiiice #407!!


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## racerglen (Oct 15, 2010)

P.K. there's no mark at all on the little guy, just a hair over 5" long, the crank tool is 9 and a half long no mark, the plough plane also has no markings other than "no. 50" stamped on the heel, the skate's in the Evaporust as we speak, but a scrub and a scrape showed no markings there either.


----------



## bobro (Oct 24, 2014)

Although I've never really liked the look of the traditional horned planes, the design is very practical and I find that due to the horn you can approach the thing from the side and sort of combine pulling with pushing to get a very fast and well controlled stroke.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

so the super fine #407 showed up. Its a very nice #408. talk about a bad ending to a bad week. We're back to "if it seems to good to be true…........"


----------



## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

Ouch, *Don,* that hurts…
I've got a 605 1/2 C coming, and I'm having nightmares about it. It's the collateral damage that every collector has to absorb, unfortunately.


----------



## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Send it back Don. Was it labeled as a #407?


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

It was labeled as as "SUPER FINE#407" in caps 

The seller has already offer a discount. I'm waiting to hear how much. It is in super nice shape.


----------



## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

If you file a claim through eBay, you've definitely got a good case, because this situation fits perfectly in one of the categories: "*item significantly not as described*". You'd undoubtedly be able to get a refund for the total amount.
The eBay forums have plenty of examples like yours, with responses giving generally pretty good advice.
->eBay-->Community-->Discussion Boards-->Topics


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I'm not to concerned. They seem willing to work with me on it and if I tune it up it will make somebody a nice user.

At the same time a received a nice prelateral type 4 #3 which was half the typical ebay price. It came from a fairly well known tool dealer, so I was worried it wasn't really a Stanley because they didn't list it as such. Buts its a nice "vintage correct" on all parts, type 4, #3.

So you win some, you lose some.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Dual post from the and plane thread, but definitely a collector piece:

No new planes for me, but I've got an old one coming. I'm not sure why I'm drawn to the needy. A CHAPLIN'S IMPROVED needing some love.


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Congrats, Don. Looking forward to new pics and an exploration of the plane.


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Good to see you bought that Don. I was eyeing it as i like the looks of those, but i figured id better not!

Cant wait to see it!


----------



## JayT (May 6, 2012)

Don, has the sickness got so bad you now must bathe with a plane handy? 

Can't wait to see the Chaplin all fixed up.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Is bathing with a plane part of the sickness? I assumed everyone did that. My wife said it was weird, but I figured "what does she know"!


----------



## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

LOL Don, that is funny.

They just don't understand. But hell, if it is a purse or shoes they go bonkers!


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

This is what will hopefully be a full set of Bailey types. I need a type 1,2,3,12,14 and now a cordovan. I suppose a Handyman as well.










And a complete set of pre 1910 Sargent 400 series bench planes.


----------



## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

Jeez, Don, with all your talk of Sargent #400 series, I might catch the bug too. Though I am intrigued by the auto-sets…now that would be a cool series to show off!!


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I've got most of the 700 series. I need the 707. I foolishly passed on one a while ago. Luckily Terry snagged it.


----------



## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

I'm seeing a bunch of Chaplins and Tower-Lyons planes on eBay lately. I try not to look, but….


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

> This is what will hopefully be a full set of Bailey types. I need a type 1,2,3,12,14 and now a cordovan.
> 
> - Don W


Ah, Type 21! lawl. Like you needed an enabler…


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

> This is what will hopefully be a full set of Bailey types. I need a type 1,2,3,12,14 and now a cordovan.
> 
> - Don W
> 
> ...


ha, that made me chuckle Smitty.

I think I just bought a Union X series collection. And I said I was avoiding Unions!!


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

You're now buying entire collections at a time? Man, you got it good!


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Union X' are things of beauty IMO. I had a #4 i bought to check it out. Sold it and luckily got just over what i paid. Really cool pieces.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Should be headed my way soon.


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## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

Don, sell off one of the kids?


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## JayT (May 6, 2012)

Dang, Don. Now you've gone to buying collections, not piecing them together.


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## summerfi (Oct 12, 2013)

Don now owns 0.0002% of all the planes in the world. LOL


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

Don is the %1 of planes LOL. Sweet collection Don. Can i come drool at them?

Are you going to leave them as is or restore them?


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I don't think they need restoring. Well see when they are in my hands.


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## Slyy (Nov 13, 2013)

> Don is the %1 of planes LOL. Sweet collection Don. Can i come drool at them?
> 
> Are you going to leave them as is or restore them?
> 
> - lateralus819


Lawl Lat!! Don's a 1%! Personally I like the looks of that tool collecting lifestyle! Haha!


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## lateralus819 (Mar 24, 2013)

I've seen a lot of his collection in person. It is pretty impressive!

He was kind enough to take me inside. Definitely jealous!


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## Slyy (Nov 13, 2013)

Oh I have NO doubt, I'm sure most of us could spend some time looking through Don's Collection. Jealous included for free.


> He was kind enough to take me inside.
> 
> - lateralus819


Found it difficult not to point out how statements like the one above get you in trouble over at the SOTS thread. 
Made me lawl!


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## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

Awesome collectors lately, Don! Those Unions look quite heavy and sexy.

hey, speaking of Sargent 707's…

Have you ever seen a photo of one without the red stain on the wood? Why just the 707, and not the others? Or did the other Auto-Sets just see more use? Want to start restoring mine…planning on new knobs/totes for the family, since mine are in poor shape or shop made, and want them to match. (But, I'm NOT doing much to the lil 707 except light cleaning.)


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

That #707 looks like an awful lot of work. You probably ought to just send that north.


----------



## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

^LOL!

Nah, the 722C looks like a lot of work!

Maybe I should start looking for SETS of collectors already restored? Seems to be the new trend?


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## handsawgeek (Jul 31, 2014)

I don't consider myself a tool collector - most of the vintage tools I buy are intended as users. I only have one tool that I have kept aside and put in a display cabinet. It is one of two Stanley try squares I picked up at a yard sale for a buck and a half each. I didn't notice until I got them home that the smaller of the two still had an intact, 100% complete sticker on the wood handle. A little internet search on vintage tool sites revealed that such try squares with a complete sticker are very uncommon. Most of them get quickly worn off during use. Even one with a partially intact sticker commands a bit of value premium. So, I figured I could spare this one from use and preserve its 'sticker price'.


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## Waterlog (Feb 9, 2013)

Is anyone from LJ going to Donnelly's Tool Auction in Avoca, NY next week 7/23, 24, 25? The tool flea starts Wednesday 7/22. I plane on having a table at the flea (my first time selling at a show). I have saws, vises, and planes mostly few other things. Wood be nice to meet some LJers. Lester


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I really wanted to, but I'm not going to make it again!


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Here is the whole story, but

Is this plane really that rare or is this some marketing hype that somebody fell for?

In keeping with my rule of never getting rid of something until I know what it is, I've had one kicking around for a while. I just never figured it had any value.

Here is my 1213 1/2


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## upchuck (Nov 3, 2013)

Don W-
I read "the whole story" and looked at the photos and I have a few questions.
Without a chip breaker how does the depth of cut adjust?
What does the "frog" look like?
What are the basic dimensions of that plane? Length? Blade width?
Do you want two of them? (Depending on the answers to my other questions?)
chuck
P.S. I'd been thinking about painting mine pink.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Prety cool, Don!


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Before you paint it pink, send it my way. I'll take the $250.

Thanks Smitty.


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## Tim457 (Jan 11, 2013)

> Is this plane really that rare or is this some marketing hype that somebody fell for?
> - Don W


I have no ability to confirm, but my gut says it was mostly marketing hype. With a typical rare plane someone would just state it's rarity, but that listing goes on and on about how rare it is and how it will fill that hole in the collector's till.



> Without a chip breaker how does the depth of cut adjust?
> - upchuck


I can't remember exactly how the Gage mechanism works but I think the hole to engage the adjuster was in the iron. I assume that's how this is too.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

The 2-13 1/2 is not in Sellers book, but is in Walters. And I couldn't find nothing else on the internet, so the mystery goes on. It just strikes me as odd its not in Sellers book.


----------



## mudflap4869 (May 28, 2014)

Well I lost out again! Tool collectors corner? Just more hand planes in a world full of hand plane collectors. Can anyone please tell me where the real hand tool, broadaxe, froe and adz fans can be found.


----------



## upchuck (Nov 3, 2013)

Don-
After your post about the Stanley Defiance I went and dug my suspect plane out from the paint pile. And I reread your post about it again. Maybe you can look at the photos and tell me if what I have is similar to what you have.
First photo is of the whole thing. Maybe you can see the $5 price marked on the side. The flash mostly washed out the number. It looks about 9-1/2" long. 









This second photo shows the parts and pieces laid out. Mine too is marked "Made in U.S.A." the period following the "A" is off set 1/8" or so below the letters. It also has the number 526 cast under the tote. The heel of the tote has a chip/chunk missing and the wood was finished with an ugly red/pink coating that was so thick that I wasn't sure it was wood under it until I began to remove the finish.
The lever cap has the notches on both sides of the front to fit the cross pin. It is painted a shade of baby blue that I associate with the cheapest poorest quality child's tools that I see in the wild. The "L" bracket has a hole in one arm to screw into the blade and the notched "U" on the other arm of the "L" is to engage the depth adjusting screw.








In the third photo I've flipped the lever cap and the iron over. The lever cap does not have a spring under the lever. The 1-3/4" wide blade has two threaded holes to allow adjustment after many many sharpenings. Even the heads on the knob and tote screws are a bit different. 








I got this plane at St. James Bay Tool Co. in Mesa, AZ. I had been in that shop the day before and I went through a half of a dozen boxes filled with rusty parts and looked at the many planes he had. I don't recall exactly what I bought that day but I'm sure it wasn't much of anything. I had picked up this plane twice or thrice and pulled the lever cap and blade off and marveled at the frog and the simplicity of the design. But each time I put it back on the shelf. This plane haunted my thoughts that night and I kept thinking about it.
The next day I drove 15 miles out of my way and went back and bought it. I like it. But it seems sort of absurd to me at the same time. I've always thought of it as a "tuition" plane. I paid five bucks to learn something. The thought that anybody would think it was worth $250 is absurd and comical to me.
Is mine like yours?
chuck


----------



## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Two out of five saws are now cleaned up









Disston No. 7s, from around 1896-1917, both still have their nibs. The other three will take a bit longer than an afternoon to clean up…









Not too sure about that short one….it has a nib, and a No.7 handle…....but the handle doesn't fit quite right…

Will see what it is, after a good cleaning…has rip style teeth too. 6ppi???

The one with the "gray" handle is a non-nibbed No.7, the other is a D-8.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Upchuck, I'd say that's a 1213 1/2.

http://m.ebay.com/itm/Stanley-No-1213-1-2-Smooth-Plane-Gage-Adjustment-Screw-Exceedingly-Rare-Model-/291437673797?nav=SEARCH


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## upchuck (Nov 3, 2013)

Thanks Don W-
I'm glad I didn't paint it. But for me it is hard to this plane seriously. Want to trade something for it?
chuck


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## Tim457 (Jan 11, 2013)

> Well I lost out again! Tool collectors corner? Just more hand planes in a world full of hand plane collectors. Can anyone please tell me where the real hand tool, broadaxe, froe and adz fans can be found.
> 
> - mudflap4869


There's a lot of threads in the Hand Tools forum, and some that are older so they're in some other forum, that hand tool fans hang out in. But you'd have to search if there is one for axes and such. Or you could start a new one. Glad to see you're doing alright.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

On those three saw I have to clean up…

panel saw with a four hole ( No.7 style) handle and 7ppi?

Full length saw, with a three hole handle and 8ppi?

The smaller medallion has a "SHEFFIELD" Patented ove a shield with the letter "A" on it, below which is "WARRANTED" Diameter is about 13/16". The heads on the rest of that saw's bolts are smaller than the Disston ones.

Transplants? 









The D8 on the right has now been cleaned up..8ppi









About the same age as the two No.7 s I ahve already done. Now, about them handles..









The one on the right is from a "BirthdaySaw" I am also trying to clean up. Note the other two? Now, if I lay the panel saw's plate there..









Three of those four holes will line up with the three holes in the left handle. It would leave one hole covered up. Might work?

Trying to decide how to continue this project….


----------



## DLK (Nov 26, 2014)

I found this mortise marking gauge in one of the old tool boxes I acquired this summer.
Says "Poire" and "Patent pending Oct 22 1872". (Poire is of course french for pear.) Needs a little more cleaning. Originally the wood was quite dirty/greasy and the brass was very green. I was not sure it could be saved. But now I think it can be made a user.











Does anyone know anything about it? Manufacture/history etc.
Does anyone have ideas on how to lengthen/replace the marking pins. The inner one seems to me to be warn down to much. Has someone here for example made such tools (of brass)?

I think I just found it on Esty. Looks like I have the "fence" rotated 90 degrees. and I am missing a brass plate that goes under the lock down thumb screw. Does someone have pictures of what that plate should look like.


----------



## Johnny7 (Jun 1, 2015)

> Well I lost out again! Tool collectors corner? Just more hand planes in a world full of hand plane collectors. Can anyone please tell me where the real hand tool, broadaxe, froe and adz fans can be found.
> 
> - mudflap4869


I believe you need to investigate timberframing or agricultural forums.
Here are a couple of possibilities: antiquetractorsforum(dot com) and forestryforum(dot com)


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

> Well I lost out again! Tool collectors corner? Just more hand planes in a world full of hand plane collectors. Can anyone please tell me where the real hand tool, broadaxe, froe and adz fans can be found.
> 
> - mudflap4869


Perhaps you can create the threads for Axe, Froe and Adz…


----------



## DLK (Nov 26, 2014)

Good idea. I'm getting a froe delivered next week. So I for one would like such a forum.


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

I've added a Froe thread….

http://lumberjocks.com/topics/109090


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## Tim457 (Jan 11, 2013)

> 2. Does anyone have ideas on how to lengthen/replace the marking pins. The inner one seems to me to be warn down to much. Has someone here for example made such tools (of brass)?
> - Combo Prof


I don't have any answers, but I've been thinking about that too. The pins on these are steel, not brass right? Then if they were driven though the brass once, it should be repairable in theory. I've passed up nice rosewood marking gauges because the pins were worn down, but it the repair is feasible I won't again.

P.S. that is a nice gauge.


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

Adze page

http://lumberjocks.com/topics/109114#reply-1735898


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

Axe and Hatchet Page

http://lumberjocks.com/topics/109098

Anyone know if we have a drawknife page?


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## Tim457 (Jan 11, 2013)

> Anyone know if we have a drawknife page?
> 
> - WayneC


I don't think so. A google search for drawknife site:lumberjocks.com came up with a lot of results but not a discussion thread I could see.


----------



## wormil (Nov 19, 2011)

Picked up this Lufkin radius gage set and the case is in bad shape but usable. Not sure what this material is but it's a little oily and very gritty, I'd like to clean it without destroying it. My wife says soap and water. What do you guys think?

Top with flash, bottom is what it really looks like.


----------



## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Maybe Murphy's Oil Soap?


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

> Maybe Murphy s Oil Soap?
> 
> - bandit571


+1


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## wormil (Nov 19, 2011)

Murphy's it is, thanks guys.


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## CFrye (May 13, 2013)

> I found this mortise marking gauge in one of the old tool boxes I acquired this summer.
> Says "Poire" and "Patent pending Oct 22 1872". (Poire is of course french for pear.) Needs a little more cleaning. Originally the wood was quite dirty/greasy and the brass was very green. I was not sure it could be saved. But now I think it can be made a user.
> 
> 
> ...


A little late here, Don. I just saw this video on a gage similar to yours.


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## DLK (Nov 26, 2014)

Thanks for the video Candy, but it is a very different gauge. I did get the missing piece for it. I'd like to give it new points. I understand one can use old phonograph needles. But have not got a round to it. I have like 5 gauges now and use only two. Two I think are like the ones in the video.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Anyone here seen a type study specifically addressing the H&R bases made for the Stanley #45?


----------



## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

^ I think the slippery slope has gone vertical!

I've not seen anything like that. What about Heckles guide?


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## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

Shoot, I was going to check on that…


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

There are obviously changes over time with them. Japanned, B and at least one post-B type. Maybe only tied to the plane types? I don't know.


----------



## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

So the answer is yes. Shows 3 types. Abbreviated version:
Type 1 (1886-1889): Japanned
Type 2 (1890-1896): Nickel plated with round brass knurled thumb screws. Curved knurling is earlier, straight knurling is later
Type 3 (1897-1941): Nickel plated with flat thumb screws. S casting earliest, B casting second, and no letter is 3 newest

I you want more specifics PM me


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Sounds like five vs. three. So theis Heckles guide… Is new to me. A Stanley book for collectors, I guess. No wonder I don't have one. ;-)


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## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

Specific to the #45 http://www.amazon.com/Stanley-Forty-Five-Combination-Plane-Identification/dp/B002OFI3OO


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Holy Ish! $125 for a used paperback? The book itself is a collectible!


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

> Holy Ish! $125 for a used paperback? The book itself is a collectible!
> 
> - Smitty_Cabinetshop


They come up up on ebay for about $40 from time to time.


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

"Sometimes it's not what you own, but who you know that owns."


----------



## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

yeah, eBay prices are better for the book, I just found it on Amazon first when I searched for it


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Anyone here collecting Rockford planes and needing a R5?


----------



## DLK (Nov 26, 2014)

I got one of those. In much better shape. Mine looks and feels like a beast. Its next I think in the restore queue.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Didn't JayT have Rockford's?


----------



## JayT (May 6, 2012)

> Didn t JayT have Rockford s?
> 
> - Don W


I just have one, an R5-1/2, it's a very good quality plane. Not sure I need another at the present time, though, unless Smitty just feels like giving it away.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I think I've upped my collector status

http://www.timetestedtools.net/2016/02/13/the-elusive-6408-sargent/



















The person I bought it from paid $5 for it at a tag sale. He was nice enough to include the tag with the plane. He got some nicely tuned users, and depreciated my paypal account a bit, but I think we're both happy.


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Congrats, Don! No money shot??


----------



## terryR (Jan 30, 2012)

Awesome, Don!
Just amazing how there are no markings on the smoother. Easy to miss what's behind the frog, and mistake this guy for a $5 plane!


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Sorry Smitty. This is one that won't even get sharpened.


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Wow, really? Not even sharpened? Is the 6408 in the value range of the #1? Higher?


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I would value it extremely higher than a #1. I can find images of 2 6408 on Google. One is now mine, and one is on my Sargent post with all of the pictures. Those were pictures sent to me from another collector. Other than those two, I have never seen another. Other than the one I have, I've never seen one for sale, or one that sold.

A Stanley #1 could be bought in no time if you had the money to spend.


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Holy cow, *now* I learned something! Thanks Don, I had no idea! That is so cool, Congrats!


----------



## kmurrell (Feb 15, 2016)

Hi, I just joined this site. I like what I see here and think I will be a frequent visitor. I am searching for help with some old Hargrave screw clamps. I can find little information on them but date them to between 1925-1939. Is there anyone here or elsewhere or a different forum









you might suggest to help me learn about these clamps? I recently came across them in the belongings of family and intend to use them in my shop, but because they look unique I decided to do some research. They are very heavy and possibly were quickly replaced by wooden screw clamps, but that still doesn't explain why I can't find much info on them. Any advice or suggestions? Thanks.


----------



## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

I have an old Hargrave bar clamp but nothing like you have there.They are quite something and look quite heavy duty. Having them from family is all the better.


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Not a Hargrave expert by any stretch, but they seemed to be a tool maker that cast all kinds of things in the day. Like Kevin, I've got a clamp or two of theirs; they're typically 'overbuilt' items. What I mean is, I don't recall seeing any decorative elements to their castings - very utilitarian and strong.

Those clamps look great, definitely great users!


----------



## kmurrell (Feb 15, 2016)

I found them in the Hargrave catalog that is circa 1939,but that is the only reference. They say PATT.APP.FOR which I assume means Patent Applied For. I think it is unusual not to find any photos of others on the internet though, and they don't appear in a later catalog. Wondering why this is? Were they too heavy and from then on only made from wood? The catalog, photo attached, shows metal and wood. I am unable to find them in the patent database. A bit of a mystery, so I am looking for someone who is very familiar with Hargrave/Cincinati tools or someone who knows clamps.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

for the stanley collectors interested in history.

Let me know if I left anything out.

http://www.timetestedtools.net/2016/02/24/stanley-time-line/


----------



## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

Don, just scanned the time line. Nice work. Now a couple of questions

The first is where is any mention of Russell Jennings? Did I just miss it?

The second is on mitre boxes. Justus Traut's boxes were in production by the 1880's and he worked for Stanley as far as I know.

Thanks for putting this up, I'll be referring to it often.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

> Don, just scanned the time line. Nice work. Now a couple of questions
> 
> The first is where is any mention of Russell Jennings? Did I just miss it?
> 
> ...


1944 Stanley purchases the Russell Jennings Manufacturing Co, of Chester CT.
1906 Miter Boxes added to the Stanley line.

what else you got?


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Very nice, Don! And I particularly love the notation of the Cordovan line.  Didn't realize it was only three years or so!


----------



## DLK (Nov 26, 2014)

1897 The #55 universal combination combination plane is introduced.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

> Very nice, Don! And I particularly love the notation of the Cordovan line.  Didn t realize it was only three years or so!
> 
> - Smitty_Cabinetshop


It came from your blog, so I assumed it was right.


----------



## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

Don, what I should have said is I think the mitre box date should be twenty years earlier.


----------



## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

Wow, now I need to check that out. Don't remember where I saw it, there's so little on that type.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

> Don, what I should have said is I think the mitre box date should be twenty years earlier.
> 
> - theoldfart


Belive it or not, there is some conflicting information. You are correct and its been fixed. I went by Walters book this time.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

i went back to see where that came from. It actually came out of Patented Transitional and Metallic Planes in America: Vol. 2


----------



## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

Don, let me dig out an article that I have on the Traut mitre box. If I can find it I'll send you a copy.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

^thanks!


----------



## theoldfart (Sep 9, 2011)

Don a quote from Doc Bailey post:
I'm trying to find/beg/borrow a copy of the Chronicle of the Early American Industries Association from March of 2007 (Vol. 60, No. 1) which supposedly has an article on this box. Here's a teaser outtake I found online:
"On June 8, 1875, Justus Traut filed a patent tor an improved miter box, which would launch the Stanley Rule & Level Co. into the miter box manufacturing business for the next one hundred-plus years. Justus Traut was one of Stanley's inventors and contractors. His patent was granted on June 19, 1877 (Figure l). This miter box was designed to be an improvement to miter boxes that were available at the time by other manufacturers. Traut's miter box featured a cast-iron frame and facing board of one-piece construction (Figure L2). This guaranteed that the frame and the facing board would remain perpendicular and square to one another at all times. Most miter boxes of the era …

I have the article on a dvd.

A second quote from the actual article
When the miter boxes were rst introduced on October 1, 1875, Stanley did not have a designated number for them. They were offered without a saw or with a 20-inch Disston back saw at an additional $3.00 (the miter box cost $7.00; the additional cost of the back saw would bring the total to $10.00).


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

thanks Kevin


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I'm starting to gather a fair amount of vintage levels. I'm trying to come up with a way to display them, probably hanging them on the wall in some part of the house. I'm looking for some idea's


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

I have a few too many, and you're right: hard display items.


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