# Where'd you go?



## kolwdwrkr (Jul 27, 2008)

So I was searching around peoples profiles a little bit, mainly guys who have been here for a long time and are on the 1st and 2nd pages. Guys that have posted a lot of comments as well as projects. I've noticed that several of the people have gone. People like Rikkor, The Timber Kid, Thos. Angle, Mot, PanamaJack, Don, Bill, Paul D, Bob Babcock, jeanmarc, Frank, bigbuck, Greg Mitchell, and on and on.

I can understand some people may have had a busy month. But we are getting into numbers from 45 days to over 200 days. Curiosity has killed this cat. Where did everyone go? Where were the goodbyes? And more importantly what was the reason? I understand that a lot of people have had health problems and I'd hate to think that people left because of things happening on LJ's. Of course I have thought about calling it quits here on many occassions, and can name a few others who have as well. But the site is a joy to be on, even if there are a select few that cause problems with each other. Take Allison and I for example. I don't want to fight with Allison. She does an excellant job with the intarsia she does. Brings up some decent conversation that we tend to have our indifferances on but that's the way it works. Hopefully she can forgive me for all of my rants, as I forgive her for hers. We are all supposed to be friends here, and share our experiences. Even if we don't see eye to eye all the time. Allison and I do have dissagreements, but we are both Lumberjocks and in my opinion should be able to see past the small stuff and carry on as friends.

And that is what I hope some of the people who left can do if that was the problem. They have posted some great projects, and I know they can be of great value here on lumberjocks. I want to take this time to invite them all back. Give us a second chance to make things right and better. More enjoyable for you. If not, please write why you left. Maybe you are to sick to do woodworking and don't think you can contribute. Well that's not true. You still have the knowledge of the work, and at the least, can contribute to the coffee lounge.

A post was posted earlier about the coffee lounge. I think the coffee lounge is the reason why people want to leave. It can cause anger. But to have a community that is friendly you need to know more about the people involved. More on a personal scale. That is what makes us friends. I know you do beautiful work, but who are you? The coffee lounge helps us figure that out. It tells us when someone is feeling under the weather, as well as gives an opportunity to get things off of our chest that aren't related to woodworking. Take that away and people leave to find a venue to do so. We do woodworking in the garage, shop, etc. We don't woodwork on the computer. We help people, tell stories, search for information, joke, and take jabs. This site is the perfect place to do it all.

So come back soon. We all miss your projects and experiences that we can learn from.


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## PurpLev (May 30, 2008)

yeah, I noticed that as well, it seems like there are seasons where different LJs bloom… for some people LJ is the place to hang around when everything else is calmer and not as busy, but when business is picking up - LJ will have to go down the priority ladder.

time will tell. but like you, I hate to think that people 'left' because of things happening here on the site -I doubt thats the case though.


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## Chipncut (Aug 18, 2006)

*I PM'd a couple of guys yesterday, but no answers yet.*


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## CharlieM1958 (Nov 7, 2006)

Keith, I think you just have too much time on your hands to worry about all this stuff.  (kidding)

I suspect people stop coming around for a variety of reasons. For some, the novelty wears off and they get bored with it. Some probably find it so addictive that they realize it is taking away from their actual *shop* time. I know for a fact that Don, the great boxmaker, stopped hanging around because the site got too big and active for him to keep up with. I'm sure others have left for the same reason. And I imagine a few have left becuase they didn't feel comfortable with the bickering in the coffee lounge.

Things change… people change. Some adapt, others move on. That's pretty much how things are with every aspect of life. It's not just a Lumberjocks thing.


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## Moai (Feb 9, 2009)

me too. I was wondering about the very first member who responded my first comment here…Mot(Canadian)...where is him?

I remember Lumberjocks when I first came to the site -Nov-Dec. 2007- a very familar place,"an small town".........I think that was the reason many people was here.


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## boboswin (May 23, 2007)

It's the homeopathy effect.


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

Lumberjocks has changed a bit in the past couple years … gotten bigger and I say … even better … 10,000 members is allot , but give it ten years … with the exhibited fast growth …I predict there will be 10,000 members on the site everyday and a million lumberjocks strong !!! GO LUMBERJOCKS.

I think Charles hit the nail on the head as far as lumberjocks and why people come and go … kind of like the woodworking hobby itself. Some people jump in with both feet and a year later sell all their tools.

Good topic !


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## odie (Nov 20, 2007)

I have to agree with Charlie, you have way too much time on your hands.

Keith, Rants are fun to read most of the time. I usually don't pay too much attention. I know for me, It's reading the same questions asked over and over. For some reason not many are reading reviews when they have a glue question or the like. In stead they put a question out there. Also, that search box above isn't used as much as it could be.

Speak of Rants …. sorry but that is why I might disappear from time to time. My back is killing me today. This has given it a small rest. Now it's back to the shop …...


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## boboswin (May 23, 2007)

Keith let me give you a short list of some things that annoy me and see if there is a common thread:

1. New poster comes on only to get specific info for his needs and is never seen again.
old timers try to work magic from the poor description and lack of parameters and are usually told that it is not the answer being sought. He or she gets what they want and is never seen or heard from again.
(Time Better Spent in the Shop) =============== *TBSS*

2. Poster wants the best advice for buying a(XYZ) machine and in the same breath tells us he has only $$ or even better a fictitious budget! 
Where are we supposed to get that information? most of us have only owned a couple of upgrades for our shop. ===============*TBSS*

3. Constant inferences to personal philosophies either in the tag lines or in conversations here.
It never seems to occur that this might make some folks uncomfortable nor does it seem to matter. *TBSS*

4. You spend an hour or better recording the steps in your project and carefully blog the result for another hour with text to embellish the project and it is _swept off the 10,000 computer screens in a matter of seconds._ ==*TBSS*

5. An upset tool purchaser uses the forum to vent his spleen regarding a bad deal he dug himself into and in doing so hijacks the entire forum for days on end, insults those the disagree with him, while a half dozen people play Philadelphia lawyer for the amusement of the other 10,000. =============*TBSS*

I could go on but I am sure you get the idea.


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## kolwdwrkr (Jul 27, 2008)

Sorry Odie if this question or concern has been posted over and over. I don't pay attention I guess. I'm to self absorbed. I do have to much time on my hands, most of which I try to spend seeking employment, or trying to sell the work I've made. No luck either way. Ranting is a strong suit of mine, one of which I fully intend on toning down. In fact, don't expect me to comment here much anymore unless it is on a project or a topic I start. 
People don't look at reviews and such because maybe they don't want to waist so much time searching for the answer when they can just ask and have responses right away. Reading to me sucks, especially when I am coming in from the shop to ask a relevant question. I want the answer fast so I can get back out there. I truly don't care if somethings been asked or posted a thousand times. It wasn't me asking, and I'm not looking for it. I think a lot of people feel the same way, which is why they ask instead of look. 
This post in particular was my way of inviting people back, its not a way to get attention otherwise. I miss the ramblings of Frank as well as seeing new projects from people who have been here for so long. We aren't 10,000 strong unless people use the site. As of now we are less then 5000 strong in the sense that so many people have never posted here, and so many people are leaving. Lets forget the large number and look at the facts. It's still a small site, filled with a bunch of avatars. I for one would like to know those who inspire me here, and make it a community. But that's just me trying to be friendly.


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## CharlieM1958 (Nov 7, 2006)

Off the topic a bit, but in response to Bob's observations:

My favorite is when some newbie posts a question that could be answered with a 30-second Google search. And then a dozen of us regulars Google it up and spit out the answer like trained monkeys.


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## gotmarko (May 10, 2006)

I'm back on one of those first couple of pages, but I don't show much activity around here because I use a RSS Reader (currently Google Reader, previously Bloglines) to watch all the posting activity. So, while I see everything within a day or so of posting, I'm just not visiting the site directly.


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## Kindlingmaker (Sep 29, 2008)

CharlieM1958, perhaps if all the answers to all the same repeated questions were written down and posted then when the same question comes up the asker is to refered to "The List"... ie: where to buy wood on line? what is the best glue, what tools should I buy and where… That sort of thing. ...but then perhaps we would lose that personal touch of welcoming and the hope that the new person stays and becomes a lifelong LJ…


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

FAQ page is a another good idea


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

I tend to agree with Charles first statement , But I suppose there are people who are more curious about what has been in the past then myself.


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## ralmand (May 11, 2009)

I am new to the site, so I do not know what has happened in the past. But I can say that I LOVE it and the short time I have been a member, I have met some very nice people who enjoy the same hobby as me. I met a 'neighbor' on this site who went and visited with last week and bought a planer from him while I was there. This website is nothing short of GREATNESS! Thanks


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## odie (Nov 20, 2007)

*Oh bother*, way too much seriousness going on here. But I do enjoy your rants Keith .. honest.

Honestly, I can look up something a lot quicker than I can type a long detailed question … just me I guess. Now it's back to fun.


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## Grumpy (Nov 9, 2007)

Keith, just like any community of people, they come & go. I would not be worried. You are right on about the coffee lounge, it's a good release & a lot of the topics are related to the wood environment.


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## patron (Apr 2, 2009)

ive been a wood worker for 45 years , and this is the best ive felt in that time .
im with people that love the wood and the learning on their own .
have been on jobs where everyone is secretive , to keep their jobs ,
and are worried about sharing anything .
i struggled to learn this trade , and will do everything i can to help anyone learn easyer .
i don't own the knowledge or the skills , they should be free to anyone that can use them .
like fire , or wheels .
only then will we as a people move forward , only through sharing !
.
and when i come in all tired , i can chose to just look , or respond if i want .
some times i just need a laugh , so i appreciate all the joking and poking .
ive been up to my eyes in work most of my life , its nice to relax too !
so keep it up , we're all adults , we can decide for ourselves


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

right on !!!


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## Karson (May 9, 2006)

I just post to get my count up. 19996 and counting.

I'm sorry Keith I changed the purpose of your post.

In the past and probably in the future. I'll go to a site and post a question and 20 minutes later I'm somewhere else and have no idea how to get back to where i asked the question.

i believe that a lot of the jocks are of that type.


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

Never thought of it that way Karson … or you made me think of something else …. maybe from a little different point of view … <<<<<<< ! >>>>>>>>


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## Jojo (Jul 11, 2007)

*kolwdwrkr*, I could somehow qualify to fit in you description. Although I've never been one of the most active LJs, far from it because I only speak when I have something to say, I've been around here for a while and I see that my last blog entry is dated 185 days ago. I miss *Dusty*, *Don*, *Dorje*, *Frank*, *Mot* and so many others too.

In my case, there's not that much woodworking related happening in my life nowadays (apart from the huge nick I put on a chisel this morning, nice way to start a Saturday. A tip for you: chisel + hidden nails don't match that well after all.) Also, as I said recently, I tend to use the RSS feeds and filter the content so my usage of the site has evolved. It's the only way to cope with the flow of activity now.

Anyway, I don't think my case is the norm here.

After some 15 years frequenting online communities and mailing lists I have seen this phenomenon happen each and every time. It's the normal cycle of life in these places. I've seen it happen in English-speaking communities as well as French or Spanish ones, in woodworking-related fora as well as aviation, classic cars, or other subject-oriented ones.

Often people become more and more active, then peak and tend to calm down. Some pursue other interests simultaneously, some have kids and stop having spare time, some get overwhelmed by the sheer size of the site, some get tired and for them the novelty wears off, some become lurkers… In brief, as Lennon said, life is what happens while you are busy making plans. I don't think anybody (anybody smart at least) leaves because they dislike the Coffee Lounge tough.

The good thing is that while some go, some new come. Things change to stay the same. But bigger.

I wouldn't worry that much, you just have to learn to accept it and get used to how things evolve.


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## MyronW (Sep 25, 2007)

I was active on the site when I first started, but after I turned "pro" I got so busy trying to get off the ground that I pretty much stopped with LJ. After a while, my son pointed out that I had lost my hobby, and he was right! So now I stop by pretty much every day. I don't have my hobby back yet, but I feel better about my new career choice.


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## LeeJ (Jul 4, 2007)

Hi Keith;

This site does require a lot of time, just to keep from being forgotten. Or, at least somewhat out of touch.

And life does have a tendency to steal some of our leisure time.

Of course, I am speaking only for me.

Lee


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## mmh (Mar 17, 2008)

Okay, enough gabbing! Everyone back to the wood workshop!

I want to see a finished wood project by the end of the day!


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## Chipncut (Aug 18, 2006)

*Hi Lee,

I still can't figure out how you squeeze in any time here, with your businesses,

& other activities, you seEm to be keeping yourself awful busy.*


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## Radish (Apr 11, 2007)

I promise I'll spend some shop time today MMH (Millie, right?). Really!
But I thought I would throw a theoretical spin in the mix as well. My college major was in Environmental and Social Psychology at The University of Kansas (I make signs for a living - go figure). Two big dogs in that arena, Roger Barker and Paul Gump headquartered at KU and the gist of their focus was a small town called Oskaloosa, KS. Their theory, *Undermanning* postulated that in any small community there were a number of roles that need to be filled: The Organizer, The Town Cop, The Minister, The Educator, Class Clown, Gossip etc. When the population is small (like the early years of Lumberjocks) the call to responsibility/service to fill those roles is inversely proportionate to the population. The populace feels a greater degree of personal responsibility to step up and fill those roles within the community - *"Hey somebody needs to do this, and by golly I feel a personal call to do it because there are just so few of us here"* As an example: Thomas Angle was an administrator of emergency planning (hope I am getting the facts reasonably straight here, Tom) in Jordan Valley, OR - because he's a good egg, and because if there is going to be any Emergency Medical Response in this little town someone HAS to gutcheck and do it.

Conversely in a larger town the call to service is diluted. The folks don't feel the degree of personal immediacy to respond to the need to fill those roles, and subsequently a duty might fall through the cracks. Here that could be exemplified like this: Newbie has a finishing question or a wood expansion question or a set-up question. It goes unanswered because folks figure someone else is more qualified to answer, or they are too busy, or "That guy can look it up in the archives" or "Gee Pal - Read the manual" (RTFM or FRTFM to you guys that have been on the Internet boards for a while).

One more phenomena I have discovered here goes like this: Guy comes on board, catches fire and just gives it his all for a while. Projects, posting blogs and videos, dreaming up stuff to help focus the community. Finally he just burns out, or his wife starts to wonder when the hell he is going to come to bed, or he checks his ambition and figures he's becoming a Dillweed, or as Bob has pointed out, TBSS, "I not building as much as I'm typing - there is something cattywampus here." Or maybe you're spending a lot more time looking at the rear end of cows these days.

And finally if you were in on the "early years" and developed a connection with a group of guys who subsequently and quite naturally had any of the things in the paragraph above occur in their journey in Lumberjocks, you come on and don't see the old gang as much and it's just not quite the same (Dorje, Don, Mot, Frank - I miss you).
That is not to say that new allegiances or gangs of friends don't occur, but to harken back to the small town analogy-
Now instead of one bar, diner, soft-serve joint, roller rink, church etc. there are five or five thousand, and there's a new set of faces and one of the fellas hangs out at the other place…


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

you got it Douglas !


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## odie (Nov 20, 2007)

Douglas, you am a college grad-u-ate alright. *WOW, author, author !*


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## Chipncut (Aug 18, 2006)

I've never taken the time to really know what the advantages of RSS feeds are,

but if what I think it is, you can stealh your way around this site, as an invisible person.

Maybe that's why we don't see, or hear from them.

*Correct me if I'm wrong.*


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## boboswin (May 23, 2007)

So if I understand your hypothesis Doug we are no more or less than some repeatable socialization experiment and merely *type cast lab rats * with genetically selected, predictable behaviors?

Bob


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## Moai (Feb 9, 2009)

you got it Bob !


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

super-organisms in a electric lifeform


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## saddlesore (Oct 17, 2007)

Well I"m glad to know I'm not the only one on the treadmill, Bob!


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## miles125 (Jun 8, 2007)

I'm actually a simulated lumberjock. Just a brain in a jar like that steve martin movie


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

hand in a bucket of water


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## boboswin (May 23, 2007)

*Tick …...Toc, Tick …...Toc*

You who, anybody here?


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## odie (Nov 20, 2007)

Does anyone remember what started this thread?


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## boboswin (May 23, 2007)

*Redux.*


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## kolwdwrkr (Jul 27, 2008)

Did someone fart in here d~


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## mski (Jul 3, 2007)

Hey What happened to Niki the Jig god?
I guess we know who has no life!!


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## LocalMac (Jan 28, 2009)

Maybe some just get bored of it. I know sometimes I wait before I come back just so I can see more new stuff. The coffee lounge for example gets pretty boring sometimes. There is good posts here but I hate when I see the same forums over and over again. Lots of threads end up as fights, political garbage, or a never dying list of art work or pictures stolen from other sites without giving credit. I'd like to learn more about people's lives like the Extreme Birdhouse guy or when someone gets married and stuff like that.


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## Radish (Apr 11, 2007)

Hey Bob, there are always out-lying points of data on the infinite bell curve of experience. =^}
Two quotes come to mind:
The action is in the tails of the curve, &
Everyone is special and unique, just like everyone else.
Better?


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## boboswin (May 23, 2007)

Doug m'man facts don't have a good, better, best in them .
They're just facts.
The odd thing about getting long in the tooth is eventually realizing that :

A: There is a repeatable pattern.

B. It dosent matter very much on an indivdual bais.


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## wildfire (May 3, 2009)

I am new so don't know what the hell is going on!! Just love to see the work being done!


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## CharlieM1958 (Nov 7, 2006)

It's a good thing ********************************************* always keep their hip boots handy, 'cause it's gettin' deep in here!


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## grizzman (May 10, 2009)

well im still a new guy on the block..ive been wood working for a solid 15 years and have made alot of projects in that time and only recently found lumber jocks…i really like the site so far…love to see the projects that are done and read foks profiles, i just read karsons yesterday…a great guy with lots of experiance to draw on..that is what i like….i dont know if he liked being called an old fart…...but most of us are like that…heck that air can get might stale sometimes in the shop…ha…just keep makin the wood work…and i like seeing guys here just being friends…grizzman


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

no brain no pain


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## pitchnsplinters (Dec 26, 2008)

Who cares? Maybe these LJ's have the right idea? ... interesting thought, eh?


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

me thinks I might have figured where everone might have gone …
..
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There's a little boy in the center of the street jumping up and down on a manhole cover, and he's saying, 
Seventy eight,.... seventy eight! 
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A lumberjock walks up and asks, What are you doing? 
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The boy ignores him and keeps jumping up and down saying, Seventy eight… seventy eight! .
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Finally, the lumberjock asks the kid if he can have a look. 
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The boy lifts the manhole cover off and the lumberjock leans over to look in. 
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Suddenly, the boy pushes the lumberjock in, puts the lid back on, and starts yelling, .
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.Seventy nine, seventy nine! WOOOO!!


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## Michael121 (Jun 30, 2008)

CharlieM1958 I resent the "trained monkey" comment as I am untrained.

LOL

People get busy. I need to get my garage/shop soon cleaned up and put everything in its place.

Doing stuff with the house 3 dogs a 9 yr old work…all take a lot of my time.

Hopefully I get back to woodworking.


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

one thought is someone could start a little cut and paste campaign … sending messages via their profiles, inviting them back to lj's …maybe to post what they have been working on


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## woodworm (Jul 27, 2008)

Don't worry I'm still around…ha ha ha…
there are times when I just visit this site without logging in…


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