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## PurpLev (May 30, 2008)

surprising, thats the first story I heard of such faulty customer service from Grizzly. I was never a fan of their product but they seem to be affordable, and from people's stories they seem to be of decent quality with good customer service….

sorry you had to go through that horrific drama - only makes you appreciate more the joy of the PM doesn't it?

customer service/satisfaction is a great deal, and esp. with American companies I'm surprised sometimes that it is not put up high on the list.


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## sbryan55 (Dec 8, 2007)

I have to agree with PrupLev's comment. There was a silver lining to this after all when you swapped the saw out for the Powermatic. I have been looking at Grizzley's equipment since I really want to upgrade my saw this year. But the PM2000 is at the top of my list (actually it is #2 behind a Sawstop but I am not sure if the cost differential is worth it).

Thanks for the review.


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## Woodchuck1957 (Feb 4, 2008)

I've allways been more proud to own Delta equipment, especially the older American made stuff, rather than Grizzly or Shop Fox. I did buy a used Grizzly edge sander and a DC and they seem to work ok, but I wouldn't have bought them new, the shipping cost and the shipping hassle as the original poster pointed out pretty much kills the deal for me. If I buy a piece of equipment locally and there are problems, I can usually get it resolved the same day or the next.


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## SCOTSMAN (Aug 1, 2008)

yes but is delta still in operation certainly as I said there seems to be no such company any more in the uk.The moral of this story is to juist keep things in writing with all of these things then and only then do you have comeback sorry about your sad story but you'll be more wary next time Kindest Regards Alistair


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## DaveHerron (Jan 21, 2008)

Sorry to hear about your trouble. I've only had good experiences with Grizzly. I own the 1023SLX, 8" long bed jointer, 2hp dust collector, and a 14" band saw. I have no complaints, especially when I consider the savings over Powermatic, Delta, Saw Stop, etc. By the way, the new Grizzly saws come standard with riving knives and they are working on a retro fit for the existing cabinet saws.


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## motthunter (Dec 31, 2007)

I also have a grizz left tilt saw, a 2HP cyclone dust collector and an 8" jointer and they are workhorses.

I agree that they should have been better at helping you. My experience with them has been the opposite though. I had a real hard time setting up the dust collector, and they helped me every step of the way. The only thing they didn't do was take a plane to my town to hold my hand.

I also had a defective part and a missing part that they sent me UPS at their cost without a hesitation.

The problem with a warranty issue is that you really do need to get it resolved ASAP. If it were my saw, I never would have let up until it was right in the first place. We all can learn a lesson to be more diligent and push for service when we need it instead of putting it off until it is too late.


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## SST (Nov 30, 2006)

The sales department sells the first product, and the service department sells all subsequent products. Sorry to hear of your ordeal.
As to the sawstop…pricey, but how do you put a price on a finger that's still on your hand vs one on the shop floor??? -SST


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## juniorjock (Feb 3, 2008)

(Edit) Why did you not get the problem resolved before the warranty was out ?
-JJ


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## blackcherry (Dec 7, 2007)

Thanks for sharing your customer relationship story with Grizzley, this review will weight in heavy if a upgrade in TS is in the future. I do hope your new saw delivers plenty of projects and no regrets. Thanks again for sharing Blkcherry


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## ___ (Jan 2, 2008)

This is for Juniorjock - if you read my post, you'll see that I called Grizzly several times before the warranty was out. As I stated, they didn't see it as a hardware problem on their part. Rather, they saw it as a problem with the belt tension, or the blade (wobble, as I recall), or possibly something else.

Thanks to everyone for your responses. I don't believe that Grizzly is a lousy company. The support reps were very nice. The saw had its strengths. The main drawback is a one-year warranty, and that the customer service guys didn't just send me a replacement arbor assembly in the first place. They were with me that there was a problem - that eventually led to a major failure - they just didn't see it as their responsibility to rectify.

I learned a long time ago of a study conducted by IBM that resulted in the finding that customers are more likely to be repeat customers if they have problems that are responded to favorably. Even more than customers that have no problems! Seems counterintuitive, but it makes sense when you consider that a relationship is formed, and conclusions are reached when you ask for help.

I asked for help - repeatedly. I was told that it wasn't a hardware issue on Grizzly's part. I gave up. I asked again after it was out of warranty only to be told the same thing, and that they'd be happy to listen/advise only. It was about 23 months in that the saw completely failed. Lesson learned.


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## juniorjock (Feb 3, 2008)

I understand what you're saying. Sorry you had such a bad experience, but everyone knows that could happen any time we order something from a company. I'm sure there's not a supplier out there that has a spotless record. I'm sure you did everything you could. Did you consider just sending it back to Grizzly?


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## USCJeff (Apr 6, 2007)

Hadn't had a problem with this saw. Been using it on weekends for a couple years. Gets the job done in my shop.


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## trifern (Feb 1, 2008)

Thanks for the review. I have a Grizzly lathe that is constantly down and in need of new belts and parts. My warranty runs out in March. I have begun saving my money for a different lathe. Their customer service is always nice, but that does not improve my inferior tool.


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## DannyBoy (Oct 26, 2007)

Bad to hear a bad situation with a customer service. One has to wonder if they realize that one bad review can change the spending habits of a lot of "Lumberjocks".

It does show a lesson to us all that warranties are not infinite and to get satisfaction from the machine we need to make sure we do everything we can to get it right in the allotted time. Still, I would hope a defective part replacement would be honored by the company. Had the bearing broken on day 366 and the blade come loose and injured you, they would have still been liable for damages…

~DB


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## wiswood2 (Apr 12, 2008)

I OWN 12 GRIZZLTY MAJOR TOOLS ,SOME ARE 12 YEARS OLD THE ONLY ONE i HAD TROBLE WITH WAS ONE OF THE 2 DRILL PRESSES . i WAS BAD FROM THE START. i CALLED THEM THEY SENT ME A NEW PART AND SAID THROW AWAY THE BROKEN ONE.I HAVE A DELTA JOINTER THAT HAS BEEN IN THE REPAIR SHOP 6 TIMES IN THE FIRST YEAR i HAD IT.BUT THEY FIXED IT AT NO COST BUT THE SHIPPING . BUT THAT ADDED UP TO THE COST OF A NEW ONE. AND THEY WOULD NEVER TELL ME WHAT WAS WRONG WITH IT.i GET VERY GOOD SERVICE WHEN ORDERING MAINTANCE PARTS LIKE PLANER BLADESAND SANDING DISKS. i AM VER HAPPY WITH MY GRIZZLY TOOLS gOOD LUCK


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## Woodchuck1957 (Feb 4, 2008)

Holy cats. You don't need to YELL ! lol


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## ___ (Jan 2, 2008)

Wow, that's some response there 'wiswood2.' It's nice to see that other's experience with Grizzly was positive, and that we do identify with our tools and feel strongly about their value in our use.

My post/review was in no way meant to sully the reputation of Grizzly tools, or more importantly, its support staff. However, if the lack of support or the failure to accept culpability on their part was my experience, I think it fair to let others know about that.

There are no perfect tools. I am aware of this. That's why we have warranties. In this case, the warranty was useless. I was sold a defective tool that I was later forced to fix at my cost. That's all. If that information is helpful in allowing others to make a decision about a tool purchase, I've succeeded in sharing my "Grizzly 1023slw failure story."


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## ericandcandi (Oct 7, 2008)

So are you saying by buying a PM2000 that this kind of problem will never happen? or Are you just that frustrated and would spend any amount of money?


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## roundabout22 (Mar 19, 2007)

While I personally haven't had many problems with grizzly products, I understand your frustration. I have a bosch router kit that I got based on reviews. While I can still use it It's a pain in the behind to switch between bases. Since I was past warrenty I was out of luck. So now I'm very hesitant to buy anything that bosch makes. I hope the PM2000 works out for you.


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## mattg (May 6, 2008)

Wow, I think you must've gotten one made on Friday. I own a Grizzly G0586 8" jointer, and a 14'' bandsaw. Both are workhorses. I did have a problem with my jointer initially. It seems whoever installed the belt pulley, didn't tighten the set screw on the pulley. I barely heard a "clang" with my ear protection on when I was using it, then it stopped jointing. Well I pulled the belt guard off to look at the set screw, and the woodruff key. Sure enough, the key was the "clang" hitting the cabinet(it was on the floor), and the pulley key way wasn't aligned with the arbor key way. I aligned it, applied some thread locker, tightened the screw, and voila, fixed!! I also remember the blade guard being loose on the shaft, and scraping the bed. One call, and I had a new one under warranty. All in all, it is still a great machine! My main bandsaw is my 14" Grizzly. I don't believe I would order another Grizzly machine however, due to their exorbinant shipping costs. I've been purchasing Jet machines lately. I get free shipping to our store, and an employee discount. I believe Jet's imported machines are better quality than Grizzly. Especially my new drill press.


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## SeniorChief (Mar 13, 2008)

Wow, what a bad deal. Sorry to hear about the situation. I have been saving money for some time now since all of my tools are yard sale tools and the table saw is a contractor saw with a horrible fence. The grizzly catalog has been in my shop for some time now and I look at it every day saying to myself just a couple more months and I will have the money I need.

Do not get me wrong I have purchased two tools based on reviews and have had great results from them, "The Dewalt planer and Bosch Multi-router".

So the question is: Do I scratch the whole Grizzly savings, and instead of a couple of months being ready to make a big purchase. Or, do I go another year to save enough money to purchase something like the PM, Jet, SawStop, etc. Or, do I go with Grizzly and make it a point to inspect everything twice. Big decision…...

My best bet is to just drive up to Houston and talk to Matt Garcia and look at the tools they have on their floor. I need a hook up Matt…..LOL….

Question for you Tablesawed: Did you ever determine the exact cause of failure of the Arbor Bearings? Was it manufacture installation defects? Mis-aligned trunions to motor assembly? To much tension on the belt assembly? Was the arbor tight before assembly? Being a ship Inspector as soon as you described the whirling sound and screeching as the motor wound down I knew the exact problem as I have seen it several times before on much larger applications such as a diesel to generator mis-alignment. Using a micrometer to determine runout and adjusting with shims is not feasible on a tablesaw, did you have a good straight edge to determine pulley to pulley alignment during assembly? (Don't take that question wrong, just gathering information for things to look for in the future on equipment I buy)

There is a fellow around the corner in Port Aranaas Texas that has a Delta UniSaw (Norms edition) with a 50" rails and a biesmeyer fence for sale that he does not want any more for 1200$. What do the LJ's on here know about those saws?


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## Woodchuck1957 (Feb 4, 2008)

Norm's Edition Unisaw ? Never heard of such a model.


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## JJTC (Jan 15, 2009)

I just joined so I could toss a comment in here too. Long time lurker but new to membership deal
I've got 3 Grizz tools and my shop is assorted colors from gold to grey with a orange and white mixed in too.
I've at one time or another had some issue with just about every tool I own. All have been minor except for a motor failure on Jet (jointer) and Delta (DC). 
The 2 companies that really stand out in my mind are PM and Grizz. They both bent over backwards to resolve things, and I mean bent over 180 since both were long down on warranty claims.

If this saw had problems from the beginning which it sure sounds like from the post I'm perplexed why it was not addressed at that time. I mean addressed in a manner such as this _ I have tried the recommended fixes, they don't work, I want to exchange the thing. If the request went no where I would talk to their manager.
I mean the MANAGER.
Grizz has done this for many people (replacement) over the years I have read various forums. I know PM has too. MM, Steel City, Shop Fox and ….even Harbor Freight(no snickers plz lol). Seriously - these companies all have a reputation of bending upside down to do right. Their very existence requires it in the age of this forum stuff.
I don't expect the finishes to be as perfect on my Grizz things as my PM or General tools. Nor should I for 40% of the cost. But I do expect - demand is better word - that they function exactly as I would expect them that tool should. If not I expect a remedy. 
Like I have said - PM and Grizz have stood out by the preverbial country mile. I will buy them and General products in a heartbeat any time I need a tool and they fit the bill. Not a seconds hesitation on my part either.

Now as to that Grizz lathe talked about above ….. I avoided it due to reading and hearing reports that it was not what I wanted (issues). Also avoided Delta and some others. Due diligence on all purchases is my motto. Then they dang well better work as others have said theirs do or else. lol

You now have a wonderful saw - it's IMO in a different class. So was the price. I guess it somewhat boils down to what we expect and also what we willing to pay for. I don't expect all the bells and whistles on something that's way less in cost. I do wonder how, in the same circumstances and with the same outcome based result, what your impressions of the PM would be? Things sadly can happen to anything. I love the security blanket feeling of a 5 yr warranty vs a 1 or a 2 but in almost every case if somethings going to fail it does soon after purchase or we know that an issue exists. You evidently did. It's just a bad deal all around. For you obviously and also for them - this type of thread, whether warranted or not, is never good for a company.
Enjoy the new toy - she is a honey of a saw


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## jake (Apr 5, 2008)

I had some trouble with Grizzley not sending me a dust collector bag that was not as pictured and it was a different size. I was upgrading to a 2 micron bag from the original 30. After much frustration with customer service trying to get what I ordered, I asked for the president of Grizzley to call me. He sent me a new bag, and to keep the original one they mailed. I had my spouse sew the bottom to the correct size and now have a second to use. While the initial calls were frustrating, they do stand behind the purchase if you go up the ladder. Sorry you had such a negative experience, and I too said it never should have taken so long to resolve and made me wonder if I would buy other Grizzley products. I bought a Steel City table saw about a year ago and have had great experience with the saw and customer service. They are pretty moderately priced and I believe I will purchase other major tools from them in the future. I have Delta tools as well and have had good overall experience. Like many people I am not able to purchase many of the higher end tools like Powermatic, just not able to afford them, so companies like Grizzley, Steel City and Delta certainly need to work on keeping a good portion of thier client base happy if they want any brand loyalty. I am sure Grizzley would have preferred me buying any saw from them. That small frustrating experience cost them a much larger sale. Wtih so many of the tools coming out of the same factories with minor differences, customer service and sales tactics will become more important than ever.


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## SeniorChief (Mar 13, 2008)

Woodchuck, sorry I call it Norm's edition because it is the same exact saw he has on his floor in the TV series. To be honest with everyone, Grizzly products still sound (based on the comments here) a viable option for a good source of tools and support. But Jet is the most likely the next purchase.


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## jackd942 (Dec 19, 2007)

That really sucks that you had that experience with them…I actually have that same saw still in the box that I purchased a month ago. I have not finished the remodel on my shop to install it yet. I also purchased a big 17" Bandsaw, 15" planer on enclosed base, 2hp dust collector and a spindle sander. They did leave out one piece to the dust collector that I noticed when I got home and after calling them, I received the part within a few days. Just hope I don't run into the problems you have.


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## ChicoWoodnut (Dec 15, 2007)

Jack,

Set them up quick and make sure they all run before the warranty expires.


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## jackd942 (Dec 19, 2007)

Chico,

I'll definitely have it all set up very soon so I can put everything through the paces…I've purchased a lot of stuff from Grizzly in the past and have always loved their service…I was very surprised to read this review.


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## JJTC (Jan 15, 2009)

That thing called setting up and using eems to be so routine and part of the process but …. it isn't always either.
Bought a wet grinder from WC and a couple of ceiling tension pull air hoses from Northern. I was doing a lot of things - all items along with some other things too got put in storage spots and tucked behind things as happens. Took me better than 2 years to remember they even were here. The stupid grinder had a shot moter from the start. Both the hoses worked fine for a short time, then went south on me too. All out of warranty needless to say. Shame on me no doubt. Now I test things and try to buy at the time of need - but still a fool for a sale so Lord knows what I still have hiding. I best check this weekend since it's been to cold to do anything else.


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## RBWoodworker (Mar 22, 2009)

I want to let anyone who is experiencing problems with their saws, especially when they are making unusual sounds to do everything they can to pinpoint the problem, and to not just ignore them.. unusual sounds are being caused by something either faulty or out of alignment..I had the problem with my saw sounding too loud and did not sound like it did when i first purchased it..I found that the pulley was working itself loose..pulleys commonly have only 1 set screw to secure them to the motorshaft along with the pin..when your dealing with high torque motors that, when first starting up,, they reach their top speed of usually 3470 rpm immediately.. that's a lot of stress on that set screw. I removed my pulley and installed what is called a "Taper-Lock" pulley.. what that is is a 2 piece pulley.. the first piece is tapered and hugs almost the entire length of the motorshaft and the second piece which has the grooves for the belts is opposite tapered.. when they come together and the 2 set screws are tightened (they tighten into each other..not the motorshaft).. the first pullet get's "Squeezed" tighter and tighter onto the shaft of the motor..so rather than just the set screw of a normal pulley holding the pulley onto the motorshaft.. you have the entire sleeve of the pulley squeezing the shaft..it worked wonders for me.. however.. for my powermatic 66 saw..those pulleys were 75 bucks each..I bought 1 for the motor..and 1 for the arbor of the saw..perfect alignment is critical also..they must be in alignment with each other perfectly.. my saw purrs like a kitten now..


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## RandyMarine (Mar 5, 2009)

Man, I am sorry you had a bad experience with Grizzley. I just bought a grizzley jointer and setup and tuning was cake. The one thing I have a problem with in your review is you kept using the saw with the defect. I know we want to get things done, but I would have never used the tool if it wasn't right….I like my fingers and head for that matter. I had a similiar issue with Ryobi, I immeiatey boxed up the little band saw and sent it back. After a few weeks of them not being able to find the issue , I requested and got a full refund and bought my jointer instead.


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