# Scosch or tad



## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

FYI - This is not intended to be a serious topic, but we may get some interesting responses.

I've had an assistant helping me on a project at the church. He's very helpful (and he likes to do the clean up).

When we are checking measurements and he finds that we are off by a very little bit he will say that we are off by "a scosch". I would describe how much we are off in a similar situation as "a tad".

In my mind, a tad is less than 1/32nd of an inch and more than a hair. I'm not sure what my assistant's definition of a scosch is other than "a little bit".

As an FYI - I am also prone to talk about how far off I am by reference to the with of the saw blade (on a table saw or miter saw). I will say 1/2 or 1/4 of a saw blade.

How do you talk about being off by a little bit? What terms do you use and what do they mean. Of course, some of you are never off so you probably don't have a term to use.

Related - Sometimes, when trying to get the fit right we will "inch up" on the final size. I find that to be an odd phrase since when I am "inching up" I am usually taking cuts that remove something that is a LOT less than an inch. Do people who use the metric system "millimeter up"?


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## GaryW (Aug 28, 2011)

Whoa, 
your both just " a hair off ",
this can be seen when you fit together two pieces,
if you can see into the joint then it a "hair line" off,
so you sand the end of the tennon, just a ' hair '
to fix it so its tight, 
GaryW
( I just don't understand. 
I cut it off twice and its still too short )


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## docholladay (Jan 9, 2010)

Well, people have told me that I was about "half a bubble" off from time to time. Also, there was that time that I cut that board 3 times and it was still too short. 

In answer to your question, I have been known to use the word "fudge" for being just a little off. And when trying to fit pieces in an existing structure that isn't exactly square or level, I have been known to use what we call "fudge factor number 9" to refer to that little bit of adjustment used in making something fit. On occasion, that means applying the technology of "if it doesn't fit, get a bigger hammer" - or whatever weapon of persuasion seems appropriate at the time.

Doc


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## Howie (May 25, 2010)

scosh,tad,inch(sneak)up,half a bubble,fudge…I've heard all the descriptions and I think it depends on what part of the country you are in. The thought intended is carried over. I tend to have to "tweak" a little.
Good post Rich


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## saddletramp (Mar 6, 2011)

My answer to this question is not family friendly so I will cease and desist. ;^)))


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## Gene01 (Jan 5, 2009)

Same here, Bob.


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## CharlieM1958 (Nov 7, 2006)

Gene and Saddletramp: You guys must have been thinking of the famed RCH.

It ain't offensive if you don't know what it means.


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## RockyTopScott (Nov 16, 2008)

Saddle is that CH?


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## jbertelson (Sep 26, 2009)

"Micro-milli-tad" anyone?.......picked that up from a friend a long time ago…....

In my mind, I "sneak up" on things, I don't inch up on them…..........(-:

..........does that make me "sneaky"?

I also use "tad" and "scosch" and "a wee bit"..........

.......so I ask my wife what she and her quilting friends say, when they are off a bit…expecting something typically feminine and cute…......

She answers "Oh S…"

Yup.


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## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

While I am quite familiar with the off-color phrase "CH", it never seems appropriate when working at the church.


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## pierce85 (May 21, 2011)

Doc - "I have been known to use the word "fudge" for being just a little off"

I've also been known to use a term similar to 'fudge' for being more than just a little off… ;-)


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## ChefHDAN (Aug 7, 2010)

Smidge


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## WrathOfSocrus (Sep 8, 2011)

While I haven't done much in the way of fine woodworking with other people, I have done a lot of rough framing and several wood floors and a tiny bit of trim work. Most of the time people use the 'blade' increments to describe small amounts. A 'fat blade' is usually about 1 1/2 blade widths and a 'skinny blade' being about half a blade. In rough framing I would say a 'fat eighth' would be the most common phrase I hear being told to cut. I have heard a lot of the things above including cutting the same board 3 times and it still being too short. Or cutting a 5 common 3 times and it still ending up a 5 hip.

The same could be said about angles when trying to match new work up to existing walls, roofs, and ceilings. Whether it is rafters or molding, sometimes the angles don't add up to a perfect 90 degrees. For instance if you have a miter that has a gap at the 'point' someone might say to take a blade off the 'heel'. Or they might put a mark on the board and hand it to you saying to cut it 'from here to nothing' which means cutting off at the mark and ending the cut at the existing angle across the board. This can also apply to bevels.

I think the important part is understanding each other no matter what you call your measurements. As long as you can convey angles, bevels, and lengths to each other to get the cut right then that's a good system for you. I have ended up working along side different crews and they all tend to have different ways of saying things. If you don't understand someone's system you may have to pose the question a few different ways before you get an answer you understand. Being a cutman for a framing crew I find it absolutely critical to look at what someone is trying to do before cutting. Many times I can get pieces lined up on the workbench or sift through cut offs to make the most of our materials. Another trick I use is to cut a bunch of shims out of a scrap block and keep them in my tool pouch. If someone is working out of view of the work bench I will give them the shims to write on and make lists of block sizes or draw plywood cuts they need.

If all else fails you can make it fit by beating it into submission!


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## higtron (Jan 26, 2011)

When I use to hang dry wall you you refered to measureing things in terms of 1/8, so if you said 17&6 you where talking about cutting a piece 17 3/4". If you wanted a piece 17 13/16", you would say 17&6 heavy. If you wanted a piece 17 11/16" you would say 17&6 light. CH's weren't addressed until after work.


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## cloakie1 (May 29, 2011)

my term is usually a 'nat's knacker', which can be either to long or to short…..when fitting a piece i 'niggle it in',one of the guys i work with says 'a fleas foreskin' or 'within a fleas' if we are using the bubble stick for checking our levels. have also been known to ask for a measurement and then term it full..eg 367mm full which means ever so slighty oversize so you have something to 'niggle' with. these terms are kiwi orgin but it interesting to hear what you guys up top say when things aren't quite going as they should…great post rich


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## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

Thanks to all for your participation in this discussion. I was hoping from some input from foreign shores and cloakie1 came through. I must admit that "a fleas foreskin" is an expression I had not heard before and it is one I will not forget.


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## Cosmicsniper (Oct 2, 2009)

I typically say, "L'il bit". Smidge or smidgen often suffices as well.


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## Roger Clark aka Rex (Dec 30, 2008)

Surely you can't use a "hair's width" because a lot of LJ's are follicularly challenged.


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## eccentrictinkerer (Feb 9, 2010)

An old friend from North Carolina used an expression, "Finer n' frog hair", which I took to mean something really thin.

I'm sure we Scandihoovians up here in Minnesota have some expressions like that, but I can't think of a darned one.

Heard most often around my shop - "Uff da!".


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## nailbanger2 (Oct 17, 2009)

*higtron*, I was working with my helper and someone he used to work with in drywall a while back. The new guy started talking in eights, which took it's toll in cuts until I found out what was going on. I explained that from now on, we would say the enire fraction to make it clear to all, i.e. 7/8, 1/2, or 1/16. He replied that he didn't cut *anything *to the sixteenth. I wished him well in his journey through the world of drywall, haven't seen him since.

"Newbie, shorten this board by the skin on your teeth!"


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## Manitario (Jul 4, 2010)

most of my joints are off by a skinch, which I think lies somewhere between a tad and a hair.


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## higtron (Jan 26, 2011)

Nail Banger in dry wall venacular we deal in 1/8"s, but we do cut to the 1/16" of an inch when you say 27&5 heavy, that means 27 11/16" it's just a way of comunicateing to most dry wall workers. I am a carpenter by trade, I talk in feet, inches, and fractions just like you if I had worked for you I would have used your venacular and you were justified in fireing the new hand he should have been more flexable. But I just wanted to point out that dry wallers also cut to the 1/16" when we say heavy, or light after we throw out how many 1/8"s there are now I'm not even sure how this form of comunication started, but I believe it's a kind of short hand so when your barking out measurements over all the backround noise of most job sights it's less confuseing. also most dry wallers are partnered up with someone that they work with day in and day out and you start to talk,move,lift like a team, and two guys that work together in unison can bang out a house, or whatever unbelievablly fast because you get paid by the square foot not by the hour.


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## cloakie1 (May 29, 2011)

we also have a few other terms down under….a hairs breath which has been similiarly refered to above….but there is also a flysh!t….which is a bigger term than a hairs….but there is also the other extreme with i haven't seen mentioned yet..eg… not a dogs show,,out by a country mile,not even close,close…but no cigar, not a sh!t show in hell, these can be either to short or to long….then you have other things like a gap showing somewhere, in which case you would say…. you could drive a bus through that!!!!
something that has a pretty good fit and is good enough for intended purpose, my favourite saying is… a blind man on a galloping horse would be pleased to see it!!!


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## ellen35 (Jan 1, 2009)

It's a "whisker" to me… in honor of my 2 cats!


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## Tootles (Jul 21, 2011)

Ellen, you beat me to it.

Now a whisker is a touch larger than a hair. And, where I come from, they are generally mens' hairs.

Made you flinch, didn't I?


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## saddletramp (Mar 6, 2011)

cloakie1 wrote: "something that has a pretty good fit and is good enough for intended purpose, my favourite saying is… a blind man on a galloping horse would be pleased to see it!!!"

Where I come from, we would say: It's good enough for who it's for.


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## Pdub (Sep 10, 2009)

*cloakie1 wrote*: "something that has a pretty good fit and is good enough for intended purpose, my favourite saying is… a blind man on a galloping horse would be pleased to see it!!!"

*saddletramp wrote*: Where I come from, we would say: It's good enough for who it's for.

After 22 years in the AF and still working on an AF base we say: Its good enough for Government work.


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

i got with schoch … but whenever it doesnt work i fall back to the saying "nothing a little brute force and ignorance cant cure"


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

In my shop, a scosh is a little more than a hair, and a little less than a smidgen or a tad. All of them are less than 1/32", and all are used intermittently with expletives when I am trying to 'sneak up' on a cut.

-Gerry


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## Jim Jakosh (Nov 24, 2009)

When I was in the tool room, we used to say it was off a hair so we got out the micrometers and began measuring hairs. The only thing I remember is that a blonde hair was the thinnest. I don't remember how many thousandths that was any more. Then we used to say it was only a blonde hair off!


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## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

I wonder if my gray hairs are thinner than my remaining brown hairs.


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## Jim Jakosh (Nov 24, 2009)

Rich, get out the micrometer and find out!! I think gray hairs are thinner.


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## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

I know that as my hair turns grayer, the overall feel of my hair is much thinner than it used to be.


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## saddletramp (Mar 6, 2011)

Hey Rich, You might have noticed that mines a little thinner too now that it's gray. ;^)))


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## Deglazed (Jan 12, 2011)

In Minnesota, we always used the word scosch. Perhaps it's a Scandinavian thing. I guess I am a little surprised an Iowegian hasn't heard of it. How about schmutz? Any "substance" of unknown origin.


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## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

For the record, it is my assistant that uses the word "scosch". He is a lifelong Iowan of Norwegian descent. I live in Iowa, but I am a Michigan native or Irish/German descent. I've only lived in Iowa 14 years.


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## Dark_Lightning (Nov 20, 2009)

Nobody's measuring in gnat's eyebrows? Hmmph. "Scosh" is well-known to me, though, but then I came from Minnesota, lots of Norskies up there. RCH is also something we use in optical alignments, like surveying. Don't know why, we can measure down to .001" with the optical mike and 1 second of arc with the degree wheel.


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## cloakie1 (May 29, 2011)

i haven't noticed anyone who measures with an eyecrometer either…a very handy tool…altho depending on the user it is not always accurate!!!


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## DMIHOMECENTER (Mar 5, 2011)

CH is for beginners. We have further refined that to red, brown and blonde (from thicker to thinner), then there is the "fuzz off" (even finer yet).

I don't make this up, but it works somehow between the cut man and the installer.

Also "blade off", "half blade off" and "fuzz" for some guys.

Perfection is of course "dead nuts". And for some reason, a completed perfect assembly is the "cat's a$$".

Gnat's a$$ is another.

The thinnest thing in the world is a gnat's a$$ stretched over a 55 gallon drum, I hear.


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## cloakie1 (May 29, 2011)

or the bee's knees…


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