# The Infamous Stanley "Handyman" Line of Planes & Tools



## 33706

We're all aware of the decline of quality in Stanley tools over the last few decades. In type studies of Stanley planes, they all come to a screeching halt after type 20's, approximately 1967 or so.

They Handyman line of planes rarely, if ever gets mentioned. I know, they're generally not held in high regard, *Don W* hates them, but I've seen the occaisional positive comment about them.

So, where to start? should we try to categorize them, identify better ones from real clunkers, assign a "type" to the various permutations, or what?



















As you can see, there are several differences among my various Handymans. Some have a bright plated lever cap, others with hammertone finish or solid gray paint over a crudely cast cap. Lots of other subtle manufacturing differences too, from one to another. I suspect that these planes, based on the ones I own or have seen offered for sale, they were originally purchased in department stores for Father's Day gifts by well-meaning family…and put away and forgotten.

Maybe we could generate a list of other non-plane Handyman products, too? Any pics or info? What say you? Thx!


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## donwilwol

ok, I'll watch. but just for fun and even though they may not easily make silky smooth shavings, they are part of the tool history. Do we even know the years they were made?


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## bandit571

The Handyman line was the budget line. It took the place of the Defiance line of tools. That's right, tools. Each line up had a full range of tools. I even havd a trisquare with that red handle, with "Handyman" cast into it. Used to have a line up of three bench planes and a block plane. I am starting to change over to Millers Falls tools, so my Handyman tools (except for that square) are now sold off.









A #3, A #4, and a #5 size. Look at the totes as well. Some have almost no "foot" others have a normal foot.

Some had a chip breaker painted red, too.

Some are quite good, some…......


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## bandit571

Years made? I think they started back in the 1950s?


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## 33706

Hmmm… I do think we could put together a list of individual planes, with their distinct differences. Then, we could maybe figure out the genesis for the line, what they looked like and how they changed from year to year. Then we can work toward an answer to Don's question… when WERE they made??? Someday… *a Handyman Blood and Gore..*. with apologies to Patrick Leach.


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## 33706

Yeah, Bandit!! I wonder when hammertone finishes became the rage, it was undoubtedly the 1950's. Note also the kidney shaped holes in the lever caps, another giveaway. I'll have to dig up my Popular Mechanics magazines and see if there are ads for Handyman stuff.


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## donwilwol

should be a *handyman snot and tears*.......


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## DocBailey

I say let them rest in peace (or rust in pieces?).


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## distrbd

My very first hand plane was a Handyman,bought it from ebay but while I was waiting for it to to be shipped I did a google search on it and boy ,everyone gave it a thumbs down,it felt like I couldn't have bought a worse plane so when I received it I just put it away ,later on I bought a couple of decent Canadian /US made planes and compared them to the old HANDYMAN,then I realised why it was inferior ,it weighed less ,looked rough and crude .
I use it just as often as my better planes which is not often LOL.;


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## bandit571

Also in the tool box with the Handyman Square









A small, fancy screwdriver.


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## JustJoe

Don't go hating on Stanley now just because they learned how to market to a broader audience in the 50's. Yes, a lot of the line was cheaper, but some pieces were just rebranded from their regular line. 
In addition to all the planes:
The handyman line included a set of chisels in a pouch - plastic handles that were squarish (flat front/back with rounded sides). I I've had/sold two sets that were a clear/gray color and I think there was another one with clear/red color handles. 
t also had a few Yankee screwdrivers - at least the 233H, 133H and 433H if not more. 
There were a few braces - the H1250/1253.
There was a small set of regular auger bits that is hard to find now.
They made individual socket chisels with cheap wooden handles, don't know the number but I don't see them that much so they either melt in direct sunlight or are getting rare. 
Block planes that were copies of the #110 but with decals on the red lever cap.
I had (might still be buried somewhere) a small bench vise that bolts onto the bench but only if your bench was about 1" thick or less. It has 1.5-2" jaws on it. 
An eggbeater drill.
There was at least one style square. 
They also sold tool sets in wooden or cardboard boxes. Those included a short saw (very hard to find) and the brace also came with up to six screwdriver bits - 3 regular and 3 phillips.


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## quartrsawn

... and I'll bet they are better made than the Chinese junk sold in Big Blue and Big Orange today !


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## Deycart

I have a few handyman bar 6" bar clamps. They don't have very much clamping power, but at 4 for 50 cents it was hard to pass up.


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## Deycart

This is my Dunlap push drill that I restored. I striped the old black paint off and the red stuff and made it purdy.


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## 33706

Oh, well…you guys are probably right. All the good research projects have already been taken, and done well. Perhaps I'll just break up my Handymans and create a spare parts depot on eBay….the frog screws have got to have some value, at least…or are they inferior too? Or, I'll donate them locally. Postal charges alone (Canada) preclude any incentive to sell them on eBay. Heck, I know I've got less than $100 tied up in those in the pic above.

Still, it's fun to talk about Stanley's dark days of plane making!


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## bandit571

The Handyman line took over from the Defiance line.

Strange thing is, I once had a Handyman #1204, and a Companion #4 sized plane. Other than what was cast into the lever caps, and stamped on the irons, they were the same exact plane









except the Sears Companion could take thinner shavings. Don't know why…


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## 33706

Interesting comparison, Bandit! Somewhere, somebody has to have the authoritative last word on this this plane geneology of the last gasp of USA-produced planes in the latter half of the 20th century. Why this body of information has never been dug up and made public, I'll never know. I find the North American hand plane Swan Song to be as fascinating as the early days of plane production. (Glad we still have an upscale plane manufacturing base in North America!)


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## BillWhite

PK, we just wanna know how many planes do you REALLY have? 
Bill


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## 33706

Aw, crap, Bill do I hafta count them again? BRB

[Edit:] Not many, really. Not counting spoke shaves or scraper planes, approx. 229. My Stanley 45s are counted as one apiece, even though they're 7 planes in one. Almost half are my weird collection of off-brand #3s and #4s, (A pictorial blog is coming about those.. soon), about 1/4 are my transitionals, and most of the rest are my core users, and boxed fresh NOS planes. Well, ok, also the additional 27 spoke shaves. I'll toss in one more stat: 18 sharpening stones, 12 grinding wheels, and 4 felt buffers, and some days I do actually get some work done. That's more than John Travolta; he only has two planes… he keeps his at his own house, too.


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## bandit571

A Handyman Tri-square









VS a Defiance square









Been around awhile…


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## 33706

Thanks, Bandit! I swore I'd never bring home another vintage square, but I like the look of that 'Defiance'! I'd like to find an example of those that had the little scribe secretly threaded into the base, by the level. The old Starrets had that feature, maybe a few Stanleys too. So I should buy one more, right?


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## bandit571

Model Number on the Defiance Square is #1221. One of the scales is in 32nds.

The other side of that Handyman Square actuallu shows a Handyman at work!









Not too bad a little square, though…


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## racerglen

PK, I have a wide range of combo squares including a Defiance that was Grampa's , all have the scribe, not threaded in, fitted into a kind of friction fit roll pin in the base, and that includes some new ones.
It's pretty much useless other than , yes, it is complete. Things are so small they make a better cork board 
pin than a scribe.


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## donwilwol

I almost bought a handyman combo square this weekend just to show I'm not completely prejudiced, but the price was to high for a low quality tool. And it was thin and light.


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## theoldfart

Just got done TRYING to tune up a BLUE nightmare of a smoothing plane, is there anything they didn't paint? A lever arm made from silly putty, warped frog etc. etc. etc. My friend is convinced its worth the effort. Think I'll hit the flea market Sunday and get him a proper 4.


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## bandit571

Oh, the handyman #4 can be made to plane nicely









Just a bit fussy, is all. Not made for a Pro Cabinet maker, but for the average Homeowner, needing to fix things around the house.


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## crank49

PK, I just now finally figured out who's picture you have in your avatar. That's F.L.Wright.


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## theoldfart

*Bandit*, how much time did you spend frettling that damn plane? Sole took a long time just to get near flat around the mouth. No fun removing the paint job on frog and mating points on the base. Should rename it the Masochist handyman.


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## bandit571

Beltsander took maybe 15 minutes to clean things up. 100 grit belt.

Same belt was used on the frog's bottom.

From start to getting good to decent shavings…..one afternoon.

The #1205 jack took a little longer, mainly due to the iron needing more work.

The #1203 was maybe two hours of cleaning and sharpening. No too bad a little plane. Might have been an older version??









Even this #1249 block plane wasn't too bad…


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## theoldfart

probably should have used the belt, used files instead!


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## palaswood

So I just got this Handyman in a package deal with a T13 No 4C on ebay (both for $40 incl shipping).



















Pretty gnarly condition, but as Don W suggests, it would make a good scrub plane for removing paint and thicknessing reclaimed boards (which I come across often these days).

Anyone have more info for me on this plane? What year etc.. Just curious.


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## JustJoe

They started in the mid 1960s. I don't know when they stopped.

Edit: I may be wrong. It's been about 2 hours since my last mistake so I am due.
My big Stanley book (John Walter, great book, go buy it.) does talk about them, he just doesn't like them enough to show a pic of more than one of the planes. He said Stanley got the name when they bought out North Brothers (yankee screwdrivers and drills) in the mid forties, and introduced the Handyman line in 1954 and produced them for 20 years. He describes the quality as "lessened somewhat from the Four Square and Defiance in order to compete with the home owner workshop and repair products flooding the market."


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## 33706

That's the first time I've ever seen DonW say something nice about Handymans. If you group them together, motley examples, they went through several changes, like the finish of the lever cap, color of the sole, finish of the tote and knob, etc. I cannot ever seem to find any literature about these, even when they went from the "Stanley Handyman" to just plane (heh) "Handyman" or vice versa. I should pay more attention to advertising literature, like in Pop Mechanics or perhaps wood magazines for type/dating info. Indeed *JustJoe *is right, many tool makers cashed in on the Do-It-Yourself craze after WWII. If you got one, tune it, use it, like it, and you win! After all it would be a shame to butcher up a collectible plane just to have a scrub. I think perhaps the Handyman line is not that bad, just that there are so many better ones out there to choose from. I have trouble setting them back down on the table at yard sales…if less than $15 or so. You did well, Joseph!


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## donwilwol

I said it would work as a jack, the only thing good a Handyman would make is a paper weight.  (I have a reputation to uphold here)

JustJoe, I've been looking for that book. Man they don't go cheap. John Walter's web site says a new one will be released in 2013. But it also says to stop back in a few week and he'd have more information and that was in January.

EDIT>>>See what I mean about the reputation!!!


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## 33706

What's the name of that John Walter Book, guys?


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## donwilwol

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Stanley-Tools-Guide-to-Identity-Value-John-Walter-1996-2nd-Edition-SUPER-RARE-/251323726417?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a840fba51


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## JustJoe

Ouch. That's the book, but the price sticker on the back of mine says $40. It's worth $40 easily, but you'd have to be a serious Stanley collector - and not just planes - to go $250.

Edit: And you'd have to be completely nuts to think about buying it for $500.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/Antique-Collectable-STANLEY-TOOLS-Guide-to-Identity-Value-John-Walter-/251183762508


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## donwilwol

He has a smaller one that's pretty good to. But harder to find.


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## Rios

I know I'm jumping in kind of late but I think its great to have examples of the homeowner planes, once you have a great collection of the premium planes you naturaly turn to the secondary ones. I have 2 H1205s one H1204 one H1203 and a block, then theres the VICTOR line and Defiance , Eclipes, Four Square. And then the ones Stanley made for others like Lakeside ,Trustworthy, Wards , Bluegras, Firestone.
It's all good.


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## 33706

Thanks, Rios!
It's hard to 'settle'....these consumer oriented planes probably do as well as any for the casual homeowner, but let's face it, when you need a plane for intensive work and intricate joinery, these planes will probably not cut the mustard. I guess as long as you put these to work for the types of jobs they were intended for, they'll do just fine.
I'm a real sucker for the off-brands like the ones you mentioned above, and I've got plenty of 'em! Sometimes I feel like just putting them all away somewhere, out of sight, out of mind. And keep only my favorites at arm's reach, the Records, Rapiers, and Bedrocks and a few other personal faves. I just can't seem to separate my collection from my working shop tools, they all want to hang out together.


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## Rios

Yes, I wish I had more room in my shop. I have three or so that I keep sharp and use but the rest are organized in a set of shelves, total geek world.


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## bandit571

Wards Master #3 at work on end grain?









Have an older Defiance #4 in the stable as well as a few other #4s


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## Rios

Beauty eh! probably has a brass nut.


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## bandit571

That one is a WWII era one, with the hard rubber wheel for depth adjust. Tuned up real nicely..


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## 33706

A Wards Master is high on my wish list, I'd like a #3 though. Better than Monkey-Wards other line, the Riverside? planes…


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## Rios

I love it. the Defiance I have has a "Hammer tone finish"50s I know. but some of my best planes are the war era.
History is awesome in all its iterations.


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## Tugboater78

I have a ward's #3 in my restore q the blade has some major issues but itsseems it won't be a bad one
Have a #6 and a #4 in this blog: http://lumberjocks.com/Tugboater78/blog/series/6654

No shaving pics in blog but 6 does good as a foreplane, the 4 has yet to be tested

Anyone know how to date them btw? I am going by memory atm but the. 3 different blades have different stamps #6blade says Ward's Master (also has a blue frog and lever cap), #4 has Wards Mast'r stamped on blade, black frog no paint on lever cap, #3 has 2 line stamp: Wards Master/ quality ,black frog no paint on cap. I have seen, but don't own some that have red frogs/ napping too..


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## donwilwol

I've always dated the Wards just like the maker. Stanley made most of the earlier ones, so date those as if it was a real Stanley. It really is, the only difference is the name stamp. Every Wards I've ever seen with a red frog was a Millers Falls, and again, its identical except the name on it.

You can't compare a Wards Master to a handyman unless you make the same comparison to a Handyman and Stanley-Bailey. Two complete different quality sets.


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## bandit571

A Defiance #4









There is no actual frog to this one. Also has a short pebble finished lever cap. No lateral lever, just tap the side of the iron. Steel adjuster wheel swings with the iron, as there is plenty of room on the rod the yoke is hanging from. Underneath a thick reddish finish were those red handles. A Stanley made one, or one of L. Bailey's?









This is what it looked like when it came in the door. Cleaned up nicely??


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## bandit571

Wards Master Quality is stamped on the iron of this plane









but seems to be a WWII Stanley #3 with the hard rubber wheel.


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## Tugboater78

Aye, thanks Don, I can't remember which one. the #4 maybe has a frog adjust screw but the 6 does not, the casting of the 6 is comparable to ww2 era an after., thick sides on the sole. Reckon I will just get home and do some better research and restoration. Counting down, t minus 13 hrs left of this long hot boat trip.


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## 33706

*Bandit: * That looks like a Siegley cap iron to me.


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## 33706

*Tug:* Okay, now I understand the "Anywhere I Roam" remark. Hurry home!


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## bandit571

Defiance had a funny looking lever cap to it









didn't even have any paint on it.


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## bandit571

The one to the left is a Mohawk-Shelburne #900. Both a re #4 in size. Stumpy nubs now has the MS plane. It was made right when Millers Falls was dropping the Mohawk lineup for the "V" line.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop

Inspired to post here because of the addition of the steel block plane, "NOS" in the pic. Gift from my Dad!


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## 33706

One less Handyman eyesore littering the landscape…. or soon to be…


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop

:-(

Save the Handyman!!!


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## 33706

*Smitty*,
With all the rarities in your collection, I'm surprised at how sentimental you are over the Handyman line of planes.

My life revolves around woodworking AND antiques. Collecting planes is a natural thing for me, but my tendency to stockpile antiques in general, and resolutely refusing to sell anything 'til I retire, does create problems. I believe that the Handyman series is probably going to be an easier sell than the blackened old Ohio and Union planes that I'm bringing back to user condition. Robbing good Handymans to rebuild dilapidated old orphans is probably not such a good idea! But since the soles and lever caps aren't going anywhere, I can bring them back to life someday too, like when the price of scrap iron gets ridiculously high….right?

Anyhow, I have a dozen or more broken planes of greater significance in polyethylene shoeboxes, waiting for parts or brazing, or totes/knobs. They need to be brought back first, before I can even consider what to do with my Handymans. I'm making totes, Jeez what a time-consuming task!! Santa, aka my awesome wife, got me a gas brazing kit, so I'll be grinding out some cracked Bedrock cheeks soon.

I've been passing on most Handymans that I see on flea market tables; Don W. kinda shamed me out of getting any more.

thanks, Smitty, for giving the Handies their due respect.


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## 33706

After doing a filtered search for Handyman planes on eBay, I was amazed at the prices some of these were set as a starting bid. However I'd have to put a 'watch' on some of them to see if they actually sell. Either there is a high degree of optimism on the part of the sellers, or a belief that these planes are gold, or perhaps they actually *do* sell in the $35-$95 range.

If the latter is the case, I'm gonna shine mine up and get them out there!!


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## bandit571

Might be surprized…

Companion brand planes at Sears were Handyman planes…..

Many of the hardware brands were just Handyman planes with a different logo on it, like Eclipse









or this rusty $8 Handyman 1104









Or the look-a-like Victor planes…


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## unbob

I think this FourSquare was the early version of the Handyman. These get a bad rap, but this 5 1/4 size works good.
http://i170.photobucket.com/albums/u265/donsmonarch10ee/DSC01247_zpse6b19db1.jpg[/IMG][/URL[/URL]]


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## 33706

Thanks, *unbob!!*
Yup, I just came into possession of a Four-Square, after months of sniper bidding outdid me.
I'm really pleased with this #4-sized one, but I wish I had the decals on the cheeks like the one you posted!!
It went right into my glass display case. Sorry, no money shots!

*Bandit*: you're right, Stanley offered a plane for every budget. The market is flooded with planes that are not top-of-the-line, but after the apocalypse there may be precious few to work with… and then we'll hear stories of people fettling Handymans and their equivalents into world-class users… maybe?


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## bandit571

IF one looks closely enough into this till, one can just make out a Four Square 5-1/4.









It had no decals, but it did have a special lever cap.

Otherwise, it is just another Stanley #5-1/4.


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## 33706

It was Charlie1958 who lit the fuse for me to find a "Four Square" plane. it was probably 20,000 posts ago in the HOYD thread.


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## Tim457

> Santa, aka my awesome wife, got me a gas brazing kit, so I ll be grinding out some cracked Bedrock cheeks soon.- poopiekat


Nice Santa. What kind of setup do you use for that? If shipping to Canadia and back weren't so high I'd try to have you work on on for me too.


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## bandit571

you'll need a #1 tip and some Silver Brazing rods…..


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## 33706

Thanks for the (heh) tip, *Bandit*! I've only got bronze and brass, and some alloy for gas brazing with flux coated. I'd like to consider silver, if the color matches cast iron enough.

*tim*: Shipping is always the deal-breaker here. you could buy a nice Bedrock ready to go with what it would cost to get it here and back.

I want to be brazing and welding OUTSIDE, my theory is to warm up the plane sole in the gas grille, and back in for a bit after the braze, to hopefully reduce stress on the hot cast iron.

Maybe a short blog or pictorial on my crack repair…my last how-to went so FREAKIN' well….:-^


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## donwilwol

http://www.ebay.com/itm/VTG-Stanley-Handyman-Wood-Plane-H1203-3-Size-in-Original-S-H-Green-Stamp-Box-/201271193465?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2edcb2af79


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## 33706

WOW!!! Thanks, *DonW*!!
This confirms what has been said earlier. I'd had foggy memories of getting dragged into an S&H Redemption Center, my mother armed with shopping bags full of filled-in booklets. I'm firmly convinced that those Handyman planes were an option that people went for, not because they had any earthly use for a plane, but that they had enough leftover S&H booklets that had to be traded off for merchandise, or lost. This would also explain why these planes usually looked unused… they spent their life in grampa's sock drawer, as unappreciated Christmas presents…

I'm trying to find S&H wish list catalogs…I wonder what other cheezy tools were available in the '50s and '60s. Though I'd be unwilling to part with the $50 that these typically go for on eBay.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1969-S-H-Green-Stamp-1973-Blue-Chip-Stamp-Catalogs-loose-stamps-/251805394577?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3aa0c56691


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## racerglen

"Does not ship to Canada "


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## MrRon

Back in the 50's, tool makers realized there was a market for less expensive tools. Not everyone wanted or needed a professional tool, so they made a new line of tools aimed at the non-professional tool user.Handyman was one of them. Basically, they came off the same assembly line as their higher grade tools. The lesser grade tools skipped a step or two and went to shipping. The better quality tools went through all the finishing steps before going to shipping. Later on, separate assembly lines were dedicated to the "cheaper" tools. Quality started out good, but fluctuated over the years in response to the market. One can find good serviceable Handyman tools that work as well as their more expensive brothers, or can be made to do so with a little effort, (filing, sanding, polishing, etc). I have some of those bargain tools and there serve me well for the level and type of work I do. I could never justify a $200 plane when a $15 one works for me. It's the old Cadillac vs Chevrolet issue. They both get you to where you want to go; plain and simple.
It appears the "handyman" tool line is still being made in the UK.


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## 33706

Bingo, *Glen*, I miss out on SO MANY good grabs, because I've filtered out all of the "Does Not Ship to Canada" listings. Problem is, when I receive notification of an item I've lost by being outbid, eBay shows me "Other items that might be of interest"... and invariably, they are listings that fell thru the cracks as NOT shipping to Canada.

There are S&H catalogs available to Canadian addresses, I'd like to find a 1958-1962-ish edition for $10-$15 bucks. As a kid, our home was literally furnished by S&H, Gold Bond and other redemption houses.

In the 80's many yard sales were dominated by S&H tchotchke. Memory lane, urrrrgh.


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## donwilwol

ok, you handyman guys can't pass on this, http://www.ebay.com/itm/TWO-Handyman-CoA-Tool-Hall-of-Fame-Bronze-Medals-STANLEY-BAILEY-PLANE-SKILSAW-/161607722274?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item25a0922522


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop

just watch me. ;-)


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## 33706

Heh, thanks, *DonW*!!

In this case, the "Handyman" is the name of the club, not a reference to the Handyman line of Stanley planes.
This "Handyman Club of America" made people members automatically, gleaned from mail order addresses that they bought from other woodworking sources. Then they slammed you with a bill for membership dues, and prob a DVD that you never ordered.

The token things are of passing interest to me, however, as a coin collector. Wonder who minted them?


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## rareair

I found 3 planes at restore a habitat for humanity shop, 1 Stanley handyman jack plane, one stanley #3 handyman, and a 9 1/2 block plane same era. $11each. I will remove rust chemically and then oil and reassemble. They will make decent working planes.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop




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## bandit571

Have only these two in the shop…









A 1247, and a 1248…...plane wise. I do have a push driver , Yankee 133H somewhere in the shop..and a push drill… they seem to be better than the block planes….


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## JackSmash19

I had to chuckle at this thread - I realize it's pretty old. I recently purchased several vintage planes from a seller on Ebay. In total, it was an assortment of 3's, 4's, and one Bailey No. 27 wood bottom.

Within the group was a Stanley Handyman 1203 in pretty decent condition and a Stanley Defiance (also looks like a No 3 or 4 model) in decent condition.

So, I've been messing with the Handyman all day cleaning it up, putting a new coat of enamel on the inside of the sole, polishing up the cap iron, etc. I also have the blade sharpened up to 1,000 grit right now. I have a 3000/6000 whetstone I was planning on pushing it through just to take it as far as it will go for an edge.

I was thinking about re-selling it on Ebay. I've seen guys selling some crappy planes from the Handyman line for 40-50. So, I figured one that has been restored might bring around the same.

That said, there is a lot of good info in this thread about the Handyman line. I appreciated reading it.


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## OleGrump

Back in the early 1960s, I remember my Grandfather, who had his own cabinet shop used to say "Buy Stanley hand tools, Black and Decker power tools. Period". (Notwithstanding the fact that he had a Delta lathe and drill press and Craftsman table and band saws…..) Because the old guy was SO adamant about telling us boys this, the post noting 1967 caught my attention, it was a LONG time before I had anything other than Stanley woodworking hand tools….. I got over it with time.


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## usagrown

So I stumbled across this thread because I am trying to purchase my first plane. Have been learning from a guy named Paul sellers who shares his knowledge of woodworking on YouTube.

I saw a picture bandit posted of some shavings from a no. 4 and noticed the handyman also has the kidney shaped screw slot on the lever cap (depending on year)......I don't have nor am I in a position right now to spend alot of money on a no. 4 Smoothing plane. It seems to be easy enough to find an inexpensive, even pre-used or unused but old handyman somewhere. My gut tells me it is just fine for woodworking so long as it is tuned properly. I'm assuming the steel is American pre 1970 so it should tune well and last.

Just trying to make a good decision before pulling the trigger and buying one…..thoughts?

Thnx


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## usagrown

https://www.plane-dealer.com/single-post/2016/11/15/Stanleys-Junk

Also found this
https://www.plane-dealer.com/single-post/2016/11/15/Stanleys-Junk

Interesting take


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## donwilwol

> So I stumbled across this thread because I am trying to purchase my first plane. Have been learning from a guy named Paul sellers who shares his knowledge of woodworking on YouTube.
> 
> I saw a picture bandit posted of some shavings from a no. 4 and noticed the handyman also has the kidney shaped screw slot on the lever cap (depending on year)......I don t have nor am I in a position right now to spend alot of money on a no. 4 Smoothing plane. It seems to be easy enough to find an inexpensive, even pre-used or unused but old handyman somewhere. My gut tells me it is just fine for woodworking so long as it is tuned properly. I m assuming the steel is American pre 1970 so it should tune well and last.
> 
> Just trying to make a good decision before pulling the trigger and buying one…..thoughts?
> 
> Thnx
> 
> - usagrown


According you your profile you live in Mass. You can find Stanley-Baileys, Sargents, Millers Falls, Unions and a plethora of other really good vintage planes for $15 or less. Why you'd want to aggravate yourself with a Handyman if you want a real user plane would be a mystery to me. Some of us tune them up for the challenge, and some collect such creatures, but there is no way i'd intentionally pick a Handyman if I wanted to do woodworking.


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## 33706

True enough, *Don!*
Cripes, the whole point of this thread was to sort out the various versions of Stanley's crappiest plane line, and I think it has been emphasized here and your other sources as well. 
This whole topic was created because at the time we were looking at case studies of the progression of Stanley planes in the 'HOYD' thread. Though I got a bunch of Handymans, I'd never recommend them to any serious users.
A decade ago I had aspirations to conduct amateur woodworking classes and I wanted a cheep supply of sacrificial planes for students to destroy, and these were easy to come by.
*Don* is right, get off your butt and find a serious type 11 to 14 Stanley plane and put it to work.


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## corelz125

You can find a sargent for even less than a bailey.


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## bandit571

Yep, I can indeed make a Handyman tune up and do some woodworking….but…they rarely hold their settings. About the same league as Great Neck planes….Even ones by Anant (India) are better than the Handyman planes. However…

There were TWO versions of the Handyman planes….the early version was about the same as a Stanley Type 20, other than the frog adjust, and the logo on the lever cap. They even used real wood for the handles! The later versions, with that funny looking rear handle ( no toe?) had the worse frog seat..EVER. Could not keep the frog still…settings never stayed put….lucky IF the sole was close to flat. Stanley also sold these dumb things to Sears…painted red lever caps printed on logos….run away from these.

The early version…you could add the Stanley regular iron, and a blank lever cao, and it will act and look just like a type 20 plane.


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## skylerlt

Old thread, but ove recently acquired a handyman no. 4 that was my grandfather's. I was wondering if anyone has gotten any new info on this line of planes. The odd part about the one I've got is the keyhole shaped hole in the lever cap. Wondering if that can be used to date it.


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## 33706

> You can find a sargent for even less than a bailey.
> 
> - corelz125


That statement simply doesn't make any sense.

*Skyler*: sounds like a plane comprised of mixed parts. No pics, no feedback.


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## TheFridge

Maybe he's referring to ebay? I've heard similar things about sargents from a handful of people.


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## 33706

Maybe so, *Fridge!*

There are planes that I actively collect, and those that I'll buy simply because they're priced right.

I have over 300 Stanley planes, and…4 Sargents. Everyone is free to make their own comments on availability.


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## TheFridge

I hear you. if I had room and if I could find them for more than 30$ a piece I'd be swimming in them  and other goodies

From what I'm told, the sargents are gems in the rough. Cheaper usually and had tighter tolerances than Stanley's.


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## Spokeshave1

Hi folks

Despite the age of the original post, these posts seem to live forever so here is a new addition.

Check this 4 page flyer for Handyman tools. https://archive.org/download/StanleyHandymanToolsNo101C/Stanley%20Handyman%20Tools%20No%20101C.pdf
Though it is printed in the USA, it advertises 34 Canadian (made?) Stanley Handyman tools. If these were Canadian-made, Stanley production from its Roxton Pond, Quebec, location ceased in circa 1984, ( http://thevalleywoodworker.blogspot.com/search/label/HIstory ) so these tools pre-date 1984. I have a number 4 unused (actual ID is H1204) Handyman with a crushed box…..neither of which I wanted but this was part of a package deal to acquire a drawknife from a friend of my friend. The frog of this plane is not adjustable and this leaves the mouth wide open. This plane was apparently designed for wood butchers because fine shavings are not possible. Not surprising, the Handyman line of planes have a poor reputation among woodworkers because there are many much better made pre WWII Stanley planes available on the "used" market.

On pages 150-153 in Stanley's 1926 catalogue, there is a listing of 32 early budget "Stanley Four-Square Household Tools". 
https://archive.org/download/StanleyCatalogue341926/Stanley%20Catalogue%2034%201926.pdf

As Patrick Leach states on his "Blood and Gore" website at http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan0a.html

"The booklet also ignores the cheaper brands of Stanley planes. Remember, this originally was a guide for those guys who intended to use what they purchased. I can't, in good conscience, recommend that someone use a Four Square or Handyman plane over a Bailey or a Bed Rock. In my disturbed mind, Stanley's lesser planes were the first trickle of oil to grease the slippery slope of the decline of handtool quality, which now leaves us with the junk manufactured today."

'nuff said!

Cheers


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## 33706

What I took away from this is that my all-wooden molding planes stamped "Roxton Pond" were somehow affiliated with Stanley Canada tool makers. Did not know this!


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## jp29

I cannot be much help on this, except for the following excerpt from one of my web pages where I discuss the Stanley 7xx series of socket chisels. I cannot remember where or why I came by that Defiance chisel - it is the only one I ever owned.

"……………The No. 1251 "Defiance" chisel was essentially the No.750 with a different company stamping on the steel socket and a naturally finished wood handle. The "Defiance" line of Stanley tools was described by the Company as being of somewhat lower grade, although the quality and finish of the steel that was used in the No. 750 and No. 1251 chisels appears to be about the same ………"



















Actually, I think the above makes more sense if you visit the web page at http://jp29.org/wwstanchisels.htm - there are more pics there also.


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## Spokeshave1

Hi Poopiekat

If my mention of Roxton Pond is of interest, you may also want to read about the early plane makers who were there before Stanley decided to open their factory there. See this first part of that story.
https://thevalleywoodworker.blogspot.com/2018/04/the-plane-makers-of-roxton-pond-quebec.html

From your earlier posts, it appears that you are Canadian…as am I. I have a number of planes and spokeshaves branded "made in Canada" and I was curious where and how Stanley came to be manufacturing here.


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## Spokeshave1

Hi jp29

I recognize the name "Defiance" as originating with Leonard Bailey after he sold his original patents to Stanley and started working for them, and then later left Stanley to strike back out on his own. Stanley later bought out the Defiance line from Bailey.

This website may be of interest to you for more history on "Defiance". 
https://www.farmcollector.com/tools/stanley-tool-co-defiance-zm0z12augzbea
"Birth of the Defiance tool line
In 1929, Stanley introduced the Defiance tool line. Marked by less expensive, quality tools, the line included all the customary tools, braces, drills, hammers, levels, screwdrivers, squares and planes. By 1939, the line expanded to include awls, bevels, wood and metal chisels, a crowbar, drill bits and bit extensions, files, a hatchet, an ice pick, nail sets, pliers, punches, saw sets, tape measures, tin snips, vises, wrenches, zigzag folding rules and, by 1952, even a wedge vise. With the onset of the Great Depression, company officials sensed a large market of farmers and homeowners who wanted to do their own work with a cheaper, quality set of tools.

The Defiance name was acquired in the 1880 purchase of Bailey Wringer Machine Co. That company made planes with the Defiance name and a battle-axe trademark. Stanley Rule & Level Co. first used the Defiance name on a cheaper screwdriver line in 1904. In March 1923, Stanley included the Defiance name in the patent office's book of product names for future use on a general line of tools."


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## Spokeshave1

Here is an addendum to my earlier post on Handyman tools.

Here is another Handyman Tools catalogue from 1959. As indicated on the internet archive, "These pages are from the Shapleigh Hardware Co. catalog for 1957, updated to 1959."

https://archive.org/download/StanleyHandymanTools195759/Stanley%20Handyman%20Tools%201957-59.pdf


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## hairy

I don't do a lot of hand planing. My little block plane takes care of my needs. I do have a few because woodworkers are supposed to. I'm sure something I say will peg somebody's sphygmomanometer. It's only a hand plane.

I have a Handyman H1204. Yard sale, $5. I remember using it once, but not what for. It did what I wanted it to do. If I am correct,it's a fore plane, before using a finishing plane. It's not supposed to be sexy, just get you started. Right?


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## Spokeshave1

Hi Hairy

If you scroll up 6 or 7 posts you will see more info about this plane. The H1204 is a Stanley Handyman finishing plane like a number 4 Bailey, but of poorer quality. The larger plane, a number 6 Bailey, is usually referred to as a "foreplane". I have sometimes seen a number 5 Bailey Jackplane also referred to as a foreplane. The reason for this name is that it is applied to the first plane usually used to do rough work such as scrubbing. For instance, if you are working with sawmill cut lumber, you will need to remove a lot of wood (scrub) by planing down to the thickness you desire. You can scrub quickly with a plane that has a comparitively open mouth and which has a heavily cambered cutter. http://www.timberframe-tools.com/tools/scrub-plane-iron-cambering/
Examples are a Stanley number 40 Scrub plane, and if you strongly camber the cutter - a number 6 foreplane - or a number 5 jackplane.
http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan5.htm#num40

Very generally, larger planes (eg # 8, 7, 6) are used for flattening or jointing and the smaller planes like the number 4 or 3 are used for finishing. The longer planes will reference their flat bottoms and will remove peaks that shorter planes would just ride up. For example, see:
https://www.popularwoodworking.com/article/bench-planes-the-system-of-three/

If you want to learn more about Stanley iron handplanes, I highly recommend you start with the "Blood and Gore" website.
http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan0a.html

There are also many excellant books available on the topic of handplanes and their correct use and maintenance.

Cheers


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