# Had a TS accident today



## Joel_B (Aug 14, 2014)

I was using my Craftsman TS today that I Have had for decades.
I was cutting a shim from a 2×4 for installing some kitchen cabinet slides.
I had carefully positioned the fence for the right width, made a test cut then tweaked the fence a little so it was right on.
The shim needed to be 2 inches tall so I then realized the 2×4 was taller than I needed. But since I had already set the fence to the proper width, I decided to cut the 2×4 vertically with the blade set to 2 inches height which is only partially through the 2×4. I thought I was being safe using a featherboard and push stick.
As I got to the very end of the cut and was about to turn off the motor the blade grabbed and thew the 2×4 at me hitting me just above my right wrist, then it ricocheted off something and hit an LED light fixture hanging from the rafters and damaged it. It all happened so fast I didn't realize what happened until it was over.
My arm had a minor cut but swelled up bad and hurt like hell. Decided to have my wife take to me urgent care to make sure I didn't have a broken bone. After waiting there 1-1/2 hours and getting an Xray turned out it was ok so I feel really lucky, it could have been much worse. 
If my saw had a riving knife or splitter maybe this wouldn't have happened, but I think it was totally avoidable.
If I wasn't inpatient, I would have moved the fence, cut the 4" side of the 2×4 down to 2" and then moved the fence back to cut the width of the shim. By cutting only partly through the 2×4 I risked having the kerf close down on the blade. When I looked at the 2×4 after the cut it indeed had had sprung the kerf closed. 
Just a reminder to always think about safety before making a cut.


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## sansoo22 (May 7, 2019)

Glad you're all right. And also glad you went to urgent care to have it checked instead of "toughing" it out. Sucks to have the insurance bill when nothing was actually wrong but better safe than sorry.

I just about made a dumb cut on the TS today myself. Had one of those "wait that's pretty stupid" moments and rethought my process.

Thanks for sharing what happened. It's always good to have a reminder that we need to think first and be patient.


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## SMP (Aug 29, 2018)

Lucky! The good thing is for most people, the first scare makes them be safe from then on. I had a kickback graze my hip once. From then on I have stood out of the line of fire each time. Kind of like shooting a bow, it takes one time for the string to hit your forearm and you learn to turn out your elbow every time from then on. I also ALWAYS wear safety goggle when using a grinder.


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## MrRon (Jul 9, 2009)

I have a large shop and there are many ways one can get injured. Saws are usually the most prone to inflict an injury, due to the speed in which an injury can occur. I would rate the tools most prone to injure as follows: On the top of the list would be the table saw, followed by radial arm saws, jointers, table routers, lathes, band saws, belt sanders, grinders, drill presses, scroll saws and pneumatic tools. Injuries can range from dismemberment, cuts, scratches, fractures, blinding, hearing loss to death. The workshop is a very dangerous place and most have sustained an injury in their lifetime. Danger lurks behind every corner and is ready to strike when we lose our awareness. I've been at it for over 70 years and got my share of cuts, bruises and scratches. Thank GOD nothing too serious has befallen me. At 85, I must be so much more vigilant around tools. When the time comes when I don't feel safe; that will be the time I hand over all my tools to my son. He too works around dangerous tools and so far hasn't made any serious mistakes. He is in the air force, so he is aware of safety on the job and at home. It is true that minor injuries happen and do serve the purpose of warning you to stay vigilant.

I see people wire up light fixtures without turning off the power first. They get away with it, but that one time they get electrocuted may be their last time. Danger is all around us; in our homes, in our jobs and even while doing recreational activities. One needs to be aware of one's surroundings.


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## Dark_Lightning (Nov 20, 2009)

Lucky that the damage wasn't worse! I had a kickback on my table saw from a rifle stock blank that laid my arm open and bruised the snot out of it. Went to the urgent care and they pulled the skin back over the bare spot and put a bandage on it. I can't even see the scar!

I've noticed that for myself, if I start getting tired or in a hurry, that I get injured (not every time, obviously, but when I think back on what happened). This is true for both woodworking and when I worked as a mechanic.


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## BurlyBob (Mar 13, 2012)

Like all everyone here, I'm glad your okay. I too have several kick backs. They happen and it seems that they happen no matter how hard we try to avoid them. My best to you.


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## Andybb (Sep 30, 2016)

OK. Gotta ask. .
1. Why don't you have a splitter or knife on your saw?
2. Why are you making that vertical cut?
3. Why would you be thinking about reaching for the switch with the stock still between the running saw and the fence held with one hand?

Don't get me wrong. I've had kickbacks and every one was my fault as I had removed the knife for something like a dado cut and forgot to put it back on.. I now assume the saw will try and kill me every time I turn it on and try to anticipate that and never operate the saw without a knife or splitter. No kickbacks since that catharsis.

Glad you're ok and I bet that's the last time you'll do that.


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## Fresch (Feb 21, 2013)

I still remember the day my wife asked me how I got a square bruise on my chest! 
Funny she didn't mention the small cut on my face, but I was pulling my shirt over my head at the time.


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## LittleBlackDuck (Feb 26, 2016)

As others, congratulations on your survival…


> ..... If my saw had a riving knife or splitter maybe this wouldn t have happened….
> - Joel_B


I make jokes on just about everything, other than my weight, looks and TS safety. I believe there is no excuse for not having at least a splitter.
First thing on the ajenda is to pay the medical bills and second, if nothing more, look into the MJ-Splitter (or such).

I used to have a built-in "riving knife/splitter" on my contractors TS but continually kept taking it off for various reasons and was too lazy to put it back. One day I got shafted in the belly by a flying plank… I was lucky it was the bulk and not the spearhead offcut that would have punctured instead of the plank's very painful bruise.

I am not spruiking any brands, however, the MJ is relatively cheap, easy to install and repeatable/transferable between multi ZCIs… do suggest one for thin and normal kerf (according to your saws)... I have gone the steel version though the cheaper plastic is better than none.

Since I started using them I have not had any kickback issues (I do take other precautions like feather-boards and such) and just realised that I have gradually become complacent over time.
I will use this post as a reminder to stop being so complacent.


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## Andybb (Sep 30, 2016)

> If my saw had a riving knife or splitter *maybe *this wouldn t have happened, but I think it was totally avoidable.
> 
> - JoelB


Take out the word *maybe* and insert *probably_*.

Again, glad you're ok.


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## Manitario (Jul 4, 2010)

I'm glad you're ok. I'm an ER doctor and have seen my share of people who have not been so lucky.

These posts are always somewhat of a mystery to me; in my 10y of woodworking I've never had anything kick back. It seems to be something I see and hear about all the time and the only real reason is that there are still enough woodworkers that don't have splitters or riving knives on their TS. I guess I was lucky enough to get into this late enough that all the TS on the market these days have that vital safety piece.


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## sansoo22 (May 7, 2019)

> I m glad you re ok. I m an ER doctor and have seen my share of people who have not been so lucky.
> 
> These posts are always somewhat of a mystery to me; in my 10y of woodworking I ve never had anything kick back. It seems to be something I see and hear about all the time and the only real reason is that there are still enough woodworkers that don t have splitters or riving knives on their TS. I guess I was lucky enough to get into this late enough that all the TS on the market these days have that vital safety piece.
> 
> - Manitario


I've never had kick back that i wasn't expecting. Which I know sounds kind of stupid and is. Sometimes cutting small shims or spacers i get lazy and dont get out the GRR Ripper. I push stock thru from the left side of the blade making sure to stand out of the way and let the thin little pieces bounce off the garage door. This is a good reminder to stop doing that.


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## Murray54 (Sep 28, 2012)

Glad your ok. I had a kick back one time late in the day took riving knife off for some reason forgot to put back on worst beating I ever took board hit me in the chest left hell of a bruise. Wife saw battle scars later threatened to sell my tablesaw. The reason it kicked back on me is because I got lazy with the cut and stopped pushing before clearing the blade.


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## controlfreak (Jun 29, 2019)

I see a pattern here on these TS accidents or close calls. "It all happened so fast I didn't realize what happened until it was over." With the speed of incident it is impossible to correct on the fly. Glad you are okay and thanks for sharing so we can all stay on our toes.


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## JackDuren (Oct 10, 2015)

Better small than big. Mine was I 1983 using dados. My hand flew as fast as the wood. Can you imagine…


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## Joel_B (Aug 14, 2014)

Wow, didn't expect so many responses.
Glad I was able to increase safety awareness.
Also now feeling even luckier it wasn't worse.
I was all set to order the MJ splitter today, but I have been seriously thinking of getting a new TS before this happened with safety as one motivator. I think this incident has pushed me into ordering the Grizzly hybrid saw I was considering as I read riving knives are more effective than splitters at preventing kickback.
Didn't want to spend the money when my Craftsman is otherwise an ok saw but don't want chance serious injury.


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## JackDuren (Oct 10, 2015)

A splitter makes a world of difference. Even I after all the years and have been retired am thinking more safety on my Unisaw. I'venever had the guard on it since new. Not sure of the options forr this saw either. But open to suggestions…

Anybody running a factory guards on there unisaw?


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## kelvancra (May 4, 2010)

One of the problems is, most of us don't really know how much we need a spliter until after we install and use one.

I use push sticks that pale what most use. That is, they rise well above the blade and hold the wood down at least ten inches beyond the push portion. I used them before most even heard of other than the pathetic push sticks people have used for years.

My push shoes or whatever you'd call them are always beat up because I have zero qualms about running them through the blade. They are disposable for good reason.

In spite of their value for GREATLY reducing kickbacks, there were still those times a piece of wood wanted to close back in on itself and the push shoe barely got me through. Still, most of us know where pinched back edges of blades leads. For that reason, I gritted my teeth and went for a Merlin Splitter.

The Merlin Spliter turned out to be as good an investment as the push shoes I started using decades ago.

They were gone for a few years, but I just found them at Woodworkers Supply. That's good news.

https://woodworker.com/excalibur-merlin-spltr-delta-10--unisaw-rt-mssu-118-952.asp


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## CaptainKlutz (Apr 23, 2014)

Sorry OP. 
Kick back is dangerous. Not using a splitter or riving knife is asking for trouble, and requires special attention to body position and push block selection to avoid.



> Anybody running a factory guards on there unisaw?
> - JackDuren


Not unless I am forced to use one? 
The factory guard doesn't provide any dust collection, and as they age the plastic is no longer clear; and makes the cut hard to see.

My preference on old Unisaw is the disappearing splitter (PN 34-868) that was sold as part of the commercial Unifence package using the overhead guard. Can still buy the disappearing splitters today. 
https://deltamachinery.com/accessories/table-saws/34-868/









Unlike the MJ version splitter in the ZCI, the Delta splitter will tilt with blade. 
There are two drawbacks on this version .vs. a real riving knife. They have kick back pawls on side that limit the minimum cut width to ~3/4" , and the pawls limit the max cut depth slightly less than full height of the blade. The splitter easily lifts up/down, and hides under the insert when using a cross cut sled.

Like others have said, safety first! 
Having a splitter or riving knife is mandatory, even on a perfectly adjusted machine. When I restore a ignored/abused Unisaw, I always install new disappearing splitter before I sell it, if it didn't come with one.
YMMV


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## LittleBlackDuck (Feb 26, 2016)

Personally, a riving knife is the way to go… if it is synchronised with the blade. Otherwise, non-through cuts will force you to remove the knife and we are all too lazy to immediately put it back on until the next scare.

On the topic of fitted riving knife… ensure the setup allows for varied kerfs if you play with saw blade widths… Friend of mine made this mistake of having a fitted (non-removable) "thicker" riving knife on his brand new TS when he used to use thin kerfs 95% (in the past).


> .... Kick back is dangerous….
> - CaptainKlutz


Not when you're spruiking a product… Hey Mr. MJ… a few shekels on your *fantastic product*, my way please!


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## sansoo22 (May 7, 2019)

While we are discussing TS safety I have a pondering of sorts. When many new or new-ish folks come here looking for table saw advice…what to buy, what's it worth, hybrid vs contractor vs cabinet, etc…we often as a group tell them to go buy something used. Which is fine advice but I feel we forget to mention the safety upgrades they will need when buying older used machines. The suggests are usually Unisaw, PM66, or any old cast iron cabinet will do you wonders. Well many of those older saws lack the safety features that brand new jobsite saws come with.

Currently im still using a jobsite saw and the greatest feature of that little bugger is the tool free riving knife and guard changes. I've never made a cut without at least the riving knife being in because its as simple as pull handle, insert knife, ensure its seated proper, and done.

Captain - I'm glad to hear you outfit the Uni's with a splitter before it leaves your shop.


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## kelvancra (May 4, 2010)

Sadly, these are ONLY for right tilt Unisaws. They do not make a left tilt version.



> Sorry OP.
> Kick back is dangerous. Not using a splitter or riving knife is asking for trouble, and requires special attention to body position and push block selection to avoid.
> 
> Anybody running a factory guards on there unisaw?
> ...


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

> While we are discussing TS safety I have a pondering of sorts. When many new or new-ish folks come here looking for table saw advice…what to buy, what's it worth, hybrid vs contractor vs cabinet, etc…we often as a group tell them to go buy something used. Which is fine advice but I feel we forget to mention the safety upgrades they will need when buying older used machines. The suggests are usually Unisaw, PM66, or any old cast iron cabinet will do you wonders. Well many of those older saws lack the safety features that brand new jobsite saws come with.
> - sansoo22


And yet, there are many, many people (myself included) who started on, and have been using table saws since well before 2009, when riving knives became mandatory on saws sold in the US! And usually, the first thing to go missing on those were the splitter/guard assembly. For those of us who did, suggesting that one only start on a newer machine with all the current safety features is sort of like 'do as I say, not as I do' situation. While safety features are nice to have, knowledge of the dangers involved, along with proper tecnique and procedures for minimizing those dangers, is far more important IMO than any safety feature.

Cheers,
Brad


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## JackDuren (Oct 10, 2015)

I get a chance I'llUT the factory duard,etc on the saw. Have the manual but looked up utube one day to see it put on but didn't see and forgot about it. Guess I'll have to READ….


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## WoodenDreams (Aug 23, 2018)

Glad your alright. And glad you took the time to remind us all about safety. I have the Grizzly G0771Z Hydred, I like the table saw and it has a nice guard and riving knife. But safety can still be a issue. half the time the blade gaurd is off because of sled use. Too easy to not put the guard back on when I go back and forth from the sled. Same with the riving knife, sometimes I take it off when using a zero clearance blade throat. and don't take time to put the riving knife back on. You may have safety features on the table saw, but If you decide not to use them because of trying to save time, what good are they. We all like to do short cuts. Safety is about taking the time for safe usage, without short cuts. I'm not harping, we all can learn from others. This could have happen even with a Sawstop or any other table saw.


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## Joel_B (Aug 14, 2014)

> Glad your alright. And glad you took the time to remind us all about safety. I have the Grizzly G0771Z Hydred, I like the table saw and it has a nice guard and riving knife. But safety can still be a issue. half the time the blade gaurd is off because of sled use. Too easy to not put the guard back on when I go back and forth from the sled. Same with the riving knife, sometimes I take it off when using a zero clearance blade throat. and don t take time to put the riving knife back on. You may have safety features on the table saw, but If you decide not to use them because of trying to save time, what good are they. We all like to do short cuts. Safety is about taking the time for safe usage, without short cuts. I m not harping, we all can learn from others. This could have happen even with a Sawstop or any other table saw.
> 
> - WoodenDreams


 The G0771Z is what I probably will be getting.
Are you saying you can't use a ZCI with the riving knife?


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## kelvancra (May 4, 2010)

Like Brad says, many of us got our saws before riving knives were a thing.

Replacing them is not an option, when you consider the cost of that $1,700.00 saw is, now, around $3,000.00 to $4,000.00. As such, the best we can do is add decent splitters, like the ones mentioned here, and things like over-arm guards with dust collection (I went with the Excalibur about ten back).


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## LittleBlackDuck (Feb 26, 2016)

> ..... but If you decide not to use them because of trying to save time, what good are they….
> - WoodenDreams


That's why I swear by my *MJ splitter* and not the splitter/dust-hood that was supplied with my TS.
Takes 2 seconds to take off and 2 seconds to put back on… ok, maybe another 10 seconds looking for the slippery sucker.
Only time it's not on (splitter) is for non-through cuts where uncontrollable kickback is not an issue and bevel cuts for which I use a sled.

As a backup, feather boards/plastic are a handy asset combined with a customised push stick,









no such thing as a *one fits all pushstick*.


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## kelvancra (May 4, 2010)

Yep (one size does not fit all).


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## Andybb (Sep 30, 2016)

Might be overkill but this and a few different push sticks work well for me. Still can't bring myself to use the blade guard though.


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## LittleBlackDuck (Feb 26, 2016)

> Might be overkill …
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Never… But those JessEm rock!


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## Andybb (Sep 30, 2016)

> Might be overkill …
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I bought them the morning after taking the 2nd kickback to the belly in a month a few years ago. Granted I didn't have the knife in the second time but it scared me.


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## sansoo22 (May 7, 2019)

> Like Brad says, many of us got our saws before riving knives were a thing.
> 
> Replacing them is not an option, when you consider the cost of that $1,700.00 saw is, now, around $3,000.00 to $4,000.00. As such, the best we can do is add decent splitters, like the ones mentioned here, and things like over-arm guards with dust collection (I went with the Excalibur about ten back).
> 
> - Kelly


That's really the point i was trying to make. I don't think anyone with an old machine needs to upgrade nor do i think new wood workers should only buy machines built after 2009. When i was new, and i still consider myself new, I didn't know why new saws are left tilt or why they all had riving knives. I took it upon myself to research why but if im suggesting to someone else to go buy an older saw i feel i should also make them aware of some safety upgrades that should be done. I agree 100% with Brad that proper technique is the most important but i feel like the safety features exist for those times when proper technique isnt known or in the case of this post just not used.

And lets not forget that for many new folks YouTube and the vast see of bad videos is going to be where they get most of their knowledge on technique.


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## Andybb (Sep 30, 2016)

> I didn t know why new saws are left tilt or why they all had riving knives.
> 
> - sansoo22


My guess is that most people work with the fence on the right side of the blade and tilting to the right makes that dicey and they realized the additional safety (and because of litigation) of having a knife, but that's just a guess.

I have never run my saw with the fence to the left of the blade. (and I'm left handed)


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## kelvancra (May 4, 2010)

My first Unisaw was a right tilt. The second is a left. Loved the right, but forty-fives against the fence needed room for the push shoe. Aside from that, I had no complaints against the saw.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

I have been surprised more than once by the tension a board can release when cut. I have even had them bind up while cross-cutting with my table-saw sled.

My last kickback really got my attention and I have now installed a Shark Guard. The stock guard that came with my saw was terrible. I went almost 20 years without a splitter (no riving knife for this saw) before I got popped.
Always thought I was being careful enough. WRONG!

I now have found myself much more comfortable ripping boards on the band saw, letting them rest for a while, and then cleaning them up at the table-saw.


















I am glad you weren't seriously hurt. It's time for a splitter.


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## CyberDyneSystems (May 29, 2012)

Lots of talk about a splitter, did I misunderstand the OP where he was not through cutting? (ie a splitter would not have worked in this application)

Riving knife (or those little micro splitters maybe)


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