# I really, really do not like sniping on Ebay!!!!! ARRRGH



## Padre (Nov 5, 2008)

I need to rant just a moment or two. I was bidding on some burl pieces on Ebay this weekend and I really thought I was going to get a good deal on them. Then, within the last 5 seconds of the auction someone swoops in and just barely outbids me. This has happened many times to me over the years and I have found it extremely frustrating.

I did some research and found out about "sniping." It seems you can purchase a program (many different kinds) or pay a commercial website to do this for you. You can see one such site here.
It will place your bid for you at the last possible second and hopefully you will win the auction this way.

I find this a little 'underhanded.' I thought it was supposed to be an 'auction!'

I know I'm being naive about the 'real world' and 'new technology' and the like, but I kind of liked the 'old days' when and auction was an auction and Ebay was a place of auctions not just a conglomeration of stores.

Nuff said. Thanks for listening.


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## DerekL (Aug 18, 2008)

You say you think it is supposed to be an auction, but how is it not an auction?


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## cathyb (Jul 8, 2009)

If you can win without overbidding, isn't that a little underhanded?


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## Padre (Nov 5, 2008)

An auction is where you can bid, re-bid and then decide to either keep going or not. Not making any bids and then at the last second trying to outbid another by a few cents without giving anyone else an opportunity is not an auction.


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## cathyb (Jul 8, 2009)

I meant can't win, but you get the point. That's not fair. There are enough LJ's out there. Why don't we have our own auction. I have wood that I could post and I'd love to work with some new species…....


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

It happens as Forest Gump would say.


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## Padre (Nov 5, 2008)

Whoa Cathy, a *MOST EXCELLENT* idea!!! I have wood too!


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## Padre (Nov 5, 2008)

Jim, lol, you make me smile! IMHO not giving anyone the opportunity to outbid you takes all the fun and auction right out of it.


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## jockmike2 (Oct 10, 2006)

It's happened to me too. I was bidding on some antique glass for my wife a few xmas's ago and I thought I had won until the very last second someone overbid me, it was very frustrating. I never had a chance to bid again. Arrrrrrgh is right.


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## cathyb (Jul 8, 2009)

I'm not much of an organizer, but honestly I think a wood exchange with lumberjocks "wood" be pretty cool!


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

Yup, just this morning I lost out on a mint Record #50 dado plane. Sheesh, I sat and watched as the bid suddenly changed 5 seconds before closure, just not enough time to get my fingers on the keyboard.

You gotta take it in stride, bid your best bid and be secure in the knowledge that you would not have paid what the winning bidder paid. Still, I know it hurts when I think I'm FINALLY gonna get a bargain…and poof!

Best thing? Bid the minimum bid, then re-bid to your maximum. Some people will go away when they know a bigger bid is out there somewhere…


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## CaseMan (Nov 4, 2009)

If you weren't willing to pay what the winning bidder paid, how is that underhanded?


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## YorkshireStewart (Sep 20, 2007)

Just bid to the absolute maximum you think the item's worth & turn your back on the auction until it's over. That's my way.

Having said that, my friend has written to ebay suggesting that they change their procedure such that; if there is a bid in the last ten seconds, they extend the auction by one minute, and continue to do this until there are no more bids. Simple eh?


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

Caseman…ask that question again, AFTER you've lost top-bidder status to a sniper.
Yorkshire…you're absolutely right. Bid your max, and the final price will be one increment above the underbidder if you win.


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## yarydoc (Oct 16, 2009)

Eaven with sniping you still have to put in the largest bid. If the auction closes when I am away from the computer I bid the most I am willing to pay and ebay will bid for me in increments up to that amount. If I am at the computer I use the auction clock and snipe.


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## mattg (May 6, 2008)

The guy who had the Mahogany I bought on ebay for my Highboy told me about those programs. After losing a few times to the same bidder, I started proxy bidding like $500.00!! When the end of the auction came, and that same bidder had won, again, he had a very expensive piece of Mahogany!! Ebay has blocked the bidder's identity now, so you don't really know who you are losing to until the feedback has been left for the transaction.


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## PineInTheAsh (Jun 14, 2009)

Padre, and others who bid on eBay:

When you get outbid it likely is NOT by just a little bit. When I really want something my bid is many multoples of the current high bid. One has to decide what really is important. Items with high bids of leass than $10. are often bid by snipers at $100. or more in the closing seconds. The final price eBay shows may make it appear the winner just snuck in by pennies, when in reality the sniper risked a very high bid.

Everbest,
Peter


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## Julian (Sep 30, 2008)

I rarely bid on an item I want until the last minute anyways. Why drive up the price with an early bid? If you aren't willing to play the game in the last few minutes of the bid, then just bid your highest amount and be done with it.


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## interpim (Dec 6, 2008)

You can use the proxy bidding system, and put in the most you are willing to pay for that item. If someone outbids you at the last minute, then they are paying more than you were willing to spend, and it is an actual auction at that point. I do like Yorkshire Stewart's suggestion though… it would put all those programs out of business, but in a technologically savvy world, people will find ways to manipulate the system.


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## WoodyWoodWrecker (Jul 1, 2009)

I always put in my highest bid that I'm willing to pay and I've lost many auctions. I don't like it but that's life. I have sniped at items with my highest maximum bid and still lost. It comes down to who ever has the highest maximum bid.


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## reggiek (Jun 12, 2009)

Everything is a different value to everyone…consider garage sales (one person's trash is another's treasure)....I too have gotten the snipe on bids….but that is ok…I just consider that's that way it goes…and try the next one…..You should always know that the most bidding goes on in the last moments of the auction….I will sometimes put a bid in at the last moment to see if I can snatch up a good deal…but mostly I bid based on how much I would be willing to spend on an item…(I look up wood items online to see what the going rate is first)....then based on that…I will only bid in the last hour of the auction…if you bid earlier…you will have someone always checking to see if they can get it for a bit more (you risk raising interest - as folks are always more interested in something that has a few bids on it - it's something to do with competition - just think of how drivers get on the roads - even nice folk will do stupid things to keep you from passing them)...Never get caught up in a bid frenzy….you will always get burned…end up with something you could have gotten online for half the price…I constantly see idiots bidding 3 to 4 dollars each for pen blanks above what you can buy them from Amazon Exotics or another good vendor….why?


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## Padre (Nov 5, 2008)

I guess, like I said at the beginning, I'm too naive. From now on I'm putting in my max bid, and then being done with it. If I'm outbid, too bad!


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## johnnymo (Aug 15, 2009)

that's happened to me before…
the best thing to do is stay online and watch the clock as it starts to wind down on the bidding time. I would keep refreshing the screen when you get down to the last minute and be ready to bid in the final seconds.


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

If you are setting there watching, put in the highest you are willing to spend in the last few seconds. If you aren't watching, put in the highest you are wiling to spend at your last opportunity, ebay's program will bid you up. If you put in a dirt cheap price and expect a super bargin, expect to get out bid. That is the way an auction works.


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## Karson (May 9, 2006)

I've won many auctions by bidding in the last few seconds. I don't use bidding software. I keep two windows open. One at the actual bin window where I've already entered my price, and one on the list so i can see what is happening. I've actually outbid someone who put in their first bid with about 5 seconds to go, They waited and didn't go high enough.

That's part of the fun of trying to win. If it's one of a kind for you then you need to be prepared to give it your best shot.

If you are just trying to get something at a bargain then you just try to get it for a great price.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

If you see an item that is currently, $50 for example, you may bid 75.00 for it. If the bidding increment (set by the seller) is $1, then the new current price becomes $51. When another person makes a bid, he may try to bid $52. However he will get a message, saying he has been outbid! When he goes back to the item to bid, the item was bumped by a dollar, because eBay tendered a bid for you by proxy. Now, you're the high bidder at $53. He can then try to outbid you again. This will continue to happen until the current bid is YOUR $75, unless somebody else submitted a higher proxy bid than yours, and they earn the high bidder status at $76. THEN, any bidder may submit his bid and earn top bidder status. Also, in a different scenario, if you see an item currently bid to $50 and you place a $100 bid on it, and nobody else ever bids on it, then you got it!! For $51 dollars. Just remember, other bidders can bump your proxy bid to the maximum, so if there's interest, be prepared to pay the full hit of your proxy bid… and STILL take a chance of losing it. This is why we all like to glue ourselves to our screen when something we like comes up. A revenge counter-bid sometimes is…irresistible!


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## sras (Oct 31, 2009)

Pasdre, You matched how I do it with your last comment. As others have pointed out, bid what you are willing to pay and see what happens. It can be fun to watch the bid run up and never reach your max. If you are outbid, that just means somebody wanted it more.


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## Brian024 (Feb 2, 2009)

This is why I don't buy anything off Ebay.


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## mvflaim (Dec 8, 2009)

don't hate the player.. hate the game.

Rule on Ebay is to bid the maximum you are willing to pay for the item regardless of it's current bid.


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## BronsonD (Jan 24, 2010)

"Then, within the last 5 seconds of the auction someone swoops in and just barely outbids me"

As mentioned above,they may have bid $50 more than you. EBay's proxy bidding system will only raise your bid until you are the high bidder, or your maximum has been exceeded.

"It seems you can purchase a program (many different kinds) or pay a commercial website to do this for you."

http://www.hidbid.com is a sniping service that gives you five free snipes per week.

There is both desktop software, and web-based sniping services that you can use, if you do not want to snipe manually.

I'd say there's more potential problems with desktop software - you could forget to leave your pc on, temp power outage could turn off your pc, ISP trouble, etc. could prevent your snipe(s) from executing.

With either, you have to submit your eBay login information. If you're not comfortable doing that you can either snipe manually or decide on your absolute maximum bid, and place it. As mentioned above, if you win, great. If you lose, as far as you're concerned the winner paid too much.

If you would still like to give desktop software a try, Jbidwatcher is free as well.

"I know I'm being naive about the 'real world' and 'new technology' and the like, but I kind of liked the 'old days' when and auction was an auction and Ebay was a place of auctions not just a conglomeration of stores."

I think eBay is on its way down.

"Best thing? Bid the minimum bid, then re-bid to your maximum. Some people will go away when they know a bigger bid is out there somewhere…"

I don't know if that is the best idea as early bid draw more attention to an item, usually leading to a higher ending price.

"Just bid to the absolute maximum you think the item's worth & turn your back on the auction until it's over. That's my way."

That's about the best advice to give. To add to it, scheduling a snipe may save you a little money overbidding early however.

"Eaven with sniping you still have to put in the largest bid."

Yep. EXCEPT, when 2 different bidders have the same bid amount, or there is not enough difference between the two bids to meet eBay's minimum bid increment. In this case, the first bid in wins.

So, if people were completely rational, the best strategy would to be to bid the second that an auction item is listed.

(Automated) sniping is more of a convenience for people who don't want the excitement that you can sometimes feel near the end of an auction, and want to hopefully save some money by avoiding early attention.

"If the bidding increment (set by the seller)"

The seller does not set the bidding increment. EBay has set bid increments, depending on the current price of an item.

You should understand ebay's proxy bidding system and know their minimum bid increments, when sniping or buying on ebay period.

Here are links to the minimum bid increments:

http://pages.ebay.com/help/buy/bid-increments.html

http://pages.ebay.co.uk/help/basics/e_item11.html

http://pages.ebay.de/help/buy/bid-increments.html

http://pages.ebay.com.au/help/buy/bid-increments.html

http://pages.ebay.ca/help/buy/bid-increments.html


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## sjfields (Jan 18, 2010)

I've picked up a few things over the last few years at ok prices and have seen lots of stuff at amazing prices… until I look at the cost of shipping. Often it doubles the cost. I've given up on ebay.


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

Shipping makes buying wood on ebay prohibitive in most cases.


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## RvK (Nov 22, 2009)

yea, they often jack up the shipping price either to catch people who dont pay attention and also so they dont have to pay as much in fees (the seller pays a % of the high bid in fees, but if it sells for $1 + $100 shipping, ithey only pay on the $1)

it is annoyin as hell tho. I always sort my lists by price + shipping lowest to highest so I'm always searching by total price, not by bid price alone to avoid that trap.

Then I say if its something you want, stick it on your watch list then a day before its due to end, bid what your willing to pay for it and let the chips fall where they may. Sniping only works when someone is willing pay more than you. If they're willing to pay more than I am, then whether its 5 seconds or 5 days before the auction ends seems pretty irrelevant to me (not that it isnt dissappointing of course)


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## araldite (Jan 29, 2009)

For any item on Ebay where there's active bidding, the winner is determined in the last 10 seconds. There's plenty of people, myself included, who place only one bid, that's my best bid as close to 1 second as possible. Except I don't use software, I do it manually. There's plenty of times multiple bids hit in the last few seconds and the highest bidder wins, as it should be. You can sit there all week with the highest bid and it means nothing.

As far as postage, I compare what I've been charged with what was actually paid and if it doesn't match up within a few cents, I message the seller to refund me or I'll trash them on the ratings. Most sellers back off because it's not worth it to get a bad rating.

Maybe I've been lucky, but I've had only one problem out of about 100 wins over the years, and Ebay got my money back.


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## 8iowa (Feb 7, 2008)

I used to bid often on eBay, but I seldom do today. I've found several times that the winning bid is sometimes more than a new item. Then there is the problem of many sellers overcharging for shipping and handling. Finally, eBay is very greedy. They practically force PayPal down everyone's throat.

Bottom line…..........who needs em!


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

Ebay and paypal are just like a lot of busineses after the dot.com bust; they try to generate a revenue stream without providing anything of value.


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

*Topamax*: Aww, c'mon….I've found lots of incredible things on eBay, some really terrific planes and parts, a copy of my high school yearbook (1971), lots of obscure collectibles, and the list goes on. I've also sold lots of things on eBay from way back in '98 onwards. I haven't sold in 6 years though, and stand corrected on the increment thing. Time was, you could select your own bid-increment when you put something up for auction. I recall there were complaints about some sellers abusing that privilege. Here in my desolate neck of the woods, there just isn't much to pick over in the real world. Ebay is my candy store. Paypal is good protection, too. *8Iowa*:I sometimes bid more than the typical US retail price, but you'd be amazed sometimes at what prices things go for in Canada…if you can even find them…


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## WoodyWoodWrecker (Jul 1, 2009)

My problem with ebay is that no matter the situation, ebay will side with the buyer. My friend sold a camera that would not power on. He stated clearly in several locations in the auction that it was defective. He figured someone could use it for parts or something. A guy bought it, received it, and promptly complained that it didn't work. Ebay automatically told my friend to send back the money and no appeal on his part worked.


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## pvwoodcrafts (Aug 31, 2007)

I like the LJ auction idea. I also think a lumber swap auction would be fun. I know I'm lumber rich and would be up for some swapping.


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## dusty2 (Jan 4, 2009)

I buy regularly on eBay and I snipe. When I set out to win an auction item I want two things. The item that I am bidding on and the thrill of winning. It is entertainment as well as a place to buy.

If there is something that I absolutely must have (there has been one time) I don't chance sniping. I bid an amount that no person in his right mind would match and then eBay does the sniping for me. No fun but I win and that is what it is all about - right.

Yes, there was a time when you could buy things on eBay for a very reasonable price and that time may now be gone. For that reason, maybe it is time to sell on eBay instead.

If this approach doesn't suit you, you have a couple options. You can always go without, or you can pay retail, or you can go find a garage sales.

In my neck of the woods there are garage sales galore. I have even found some places that are stocked with items bought by a guy who garage sales all week long and then runs his own garage sale on the weekends. I guess some might consider him an entrepreneur.


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## Porosky (Mar 10, 2009)

Let me preface this post with - I have not read all the posts - I sell most all my wood on a Buy it Now format, and use only a few auctions to help draw consumers to my ebay store, I also charge flat rate and combine shipping so you know exactly what you are paying.


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## sjfields (Jan 18, 2010)

poopiekat: as one who lives in Canada, I would be very interested to hear about the great deals you got from Canada vs the US. I find that in general the prices for things related to woodworking (tools and wood) are higher here than in the States - especially the tools. For example, I've been looking for a new table saw and was really interested in the Rigid 4511 at home depot. From the discussion I read in LJ that saw is on sale for $299 in the States (down from 499 and 599 earlier). Here its $799. I've talked to some of the store managers and they arent budging on the price. Now I'm thinking it may be worth while to drive down to States to one of the HD's that has it still and pay whatever duty I would have pay. It would still probable save me a bundle.


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

dusty2, I know people who I consider ebay or garage sale jippos. They buy and sell anything they think they can make a dollar on. Seems like a waste of time to me, too low a margin. Everyone to his own. My wife's uncle was independently wealthy and he still bought and sold "junk" for the thrill of skinning some one I guess )


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## pommy (Apr 17, 2008)

Padre i find i bib the same way as you what doesnt help is my internet speed so like you now i bib to what my highest is and if someone out bids me then it wasnt meant to be mine but i feel your diliema as it has happened to me so many times it hurts LOL…..

Andy


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

poroskywood, I just looked you up on ebay. Your shipping seems to be very reasonable. It might depend on the location, I have seem some that is very prohibitive; like doubles or tripples the bdft cost ;-((


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

sjfields,
I'm sorry if you got the impression that my good deals were found in Canada. The deals are in the US. It's even cheaper to ship something from the US to Canada than it is to ship from one point in Canada to another, because of CanadaPost's rates. That's why nobody comes TO Canada to shop! As for cross-border shopping, know the rules and regulations first, before finding things out the hard way!! Yes, you can judiciously save a lot, but know your obligations with regard to reporting. Have your receipts and a manifest of what's coming across with you too.


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## Karson (May 9, 2006)

Cal anyone tell me why a $25.00 gift card on ebay is getting bids to $28.00

I don't think I'd ever bid that much. Must be an auction mentality.


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

Must be for a collectible bankrupt store ;-))


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