# The sanding vortex...



## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

Oh, man, I started looking at powered sanding options-angle drill-type arrangement with the small pads, probably 2" to start with. Holy Smokes! way too much to choose from, and not cheap. So, I need your thoughts on what to consider for finishing relatively small bowls (up to 10"D) that won't break the bank, stuff you've used successfully. As far as the drill goes, I see that there are 90-degree attachments out there, to put on your own drill, and angled drills that aren't super expensive. Then the vast array of disc brands. I use Abranet on flat stock, the higher cost pays off with much higher durability, but not sure where to go with these small discs on a drill. Your thoughts?


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## waho6o9 (May 6, 2011)

There was a You Tube video where the guy used Harbor freight 1/4" shank quick connect

bits for drills and made up an assortment of different grits for your application.

Ha ha I found it:





HTH


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## Jim Jakosh (Nov 24, 2009)

I bought the Harbor Freight 90 degree drill and I use it all the time for sanding pieces on the lathe and then leveling the bottom after I turn off the tenon and leave just a nub on the bottom. I have a 2" sanding pad with 1/4" shaft and use the serrated discs from klingspor.

At tone time Harbor Freight quit selling those drills but I did see them back a few months ago. I think they list at $30…....... well worth it …........better than holding a drill and a right angle attachment.

cheers, Jim


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## ArlinEastman (May 22, 2011)

Jamie

Here is where I bought mine

http://www.woodworkingshop.com/product/tz20000/#.VfOJXcuFPUA

and the sandpaper

https://www.woodworkingshop.com/search.aspx?q=H%26L+Grit+Scalloped+Disc+

For small turnings you would want a 1.5" and 2" pads. When you get to turning bigger things you will need the 3" stuff.


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## dyfhid (Jun 4, 2015)

For Abranet discs, not too bad money-wise, https://thesandingglove.com/Mirka-Abranet-Sanding-Discs.asp.

For a decent angle drill, again not too rich, well, I was going to link you to CPO Milwaukee reconditioned for a Milwaukee 0380-1, but I don't see them there anymore or anywhere available for that matter. It's too bad, with a 55 degree angled chuck it's nice for sanding on a lathe. Maybe there's something similar out there.

Now that I look a bit more, it's not a Milwaukee, but … http://thesandingglove.com/Angle-Head-Drills.asp


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> For Abranet discs, not too bad money-wise, https://thesandingglove.com/Mirka-Abranet-Sanding-Discs.asp.
> [Snip]
> Now that I look a bit more, it s not a Milwaukee, but … http://thesandingglove.com/Angle-Head-Drills.asp
> 
> - dyfhid


Have you used Abranet discs for sanding bowls? I don't want to assume that just because it works great on flat-stock, it's also perfect for turning. Thanks for the link on the angle-head drills! I see they have soft, medium and firm disc holders. What might be the best choice for my 6"-10" bowls, mostly maple, alder or cherry? Different for a hard wood such as Madrone?

Sandingglove looks like a good resource. Another one I like is 2Sand.com They have good prices on Abranet, and you can get it in small quantities. Some grits, I can use a 100-pack, but for others I really don't need more than 10 in a few years.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> Jamie
> Here is where I bought mine
> http://www.woodworkingshop.com/product/tz20000/#.VfOJXcuFPUA
> and the sandpaper
> ...


Ahhh, I'd forgotten about the Klingspor/Woodworking Shop site. Before discovering Abranet, Klingspor was always my go-to sandpaper, and I like the company. I was planning on 2" pads, hope they won't be too big. I have 3 very small bowls to do next week, was just going to hand-hold the paper for those. ;-) Thanks, Arlin!


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> There was a You Tube video where the guy used Harbor freight 1/4" shank quick connect
> bits for drills and made up an assortment of different grits for your application.
> 
> Ha ha I found it:
> ...


Thanks, I'll check it out.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> I bought the Harbor Freight 90 degree drill and I use it all the time for sanding pieces on the lathe and then leveling the bottom after I turn off the tenon and leave just a nub on the bottom. I have a 2" sanding pad with 1/4" shaft and use the serrated discs from klingspor.
> 
> At tone time Harbor Freight quit selling those drills but I did see them back a few months ago. I think they list at $30…....... well worth it …........better than holding a drill and a right angle attachment.
> 
> ...


What's the deal with the serrated discs? They must have an advantage, yes? Also, what would you recommend for the disc holder: soft? medium? hard? depends on the wood? Thanks!


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

Well, one thing for sure: I won't be buying the current Milwaukee model. Look at these negative reviews" (30% of the total). Sounds like the earlier model was much better.


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## LeeMills (Nov 2, 2014)

For 2" disc I use Vinces blue flex with radius interface pads.
http://vinceswoodnwonders.com/blue-flex-discs/
I tried the scalloped kind from other suppliers and the edges left more scratches than it removed (not Klingspores)
The blue flex is 25 for $4.75 which is a good price IMHO.
If you call him I'm sure he still offers a "starter kit" which has the main back and three interface for different grits and an assortment of grits. Pads in the blue flex are 2-3/8 so they wrap over the edge.

Vince has some short videos to explain the how/why of interface pads, different types disc offered. Using the interface pads do make a lot of difference.

Oh, I have a right angle drill attachment which I used to start with. Outside or large items it is not bad; for interior it is difficult to maneuver if you can even get it inside for items much less than 6 or 7 inches. By the time you add the angle, the chuck, the sanding head, and the interface pads it may be 3-4" length.
I do have a Milwaukee but mine is older and the switch is not a problem but it is Very Heavy and I usually use the tool rest for support.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> For 2" disc I use Vinces blue flex with radius interface pads.
> http://vinceswoodnwonders.com/blue-flex-discs/
> I tried the scalloped kind from other suppliers and the edges left more scratches than it removed (not Klingspores)
> The blue flex is 25 for $4.75 which is a good price IMHO.
> ...


Thanks, Lee, looks like a company I might want to buy from! I'm not seeing blue flex in 2-3/8", only the green. Web site might not be complete though. I'll call and ask about a starter kit, good idea!


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## LeeMills (Nov 2, 2014)

> Thanks, Lee, looks like a company I might want to buy from! I m not seeing blue flex in 2-3/8", only the green. Web site might not be complete though. I ll call and ask about a starter kit, good idea!
> - ForestGrl


I didn't see them either but the hardware should be the same, just a different paper (mylar).


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## Wildwood (Jul 22, 2012)

If scroll down the page will find 2 3/8" disc.
http://vinceswoodnwonders.com/blue-flex-discs/

Can also see & get more info going to home page.
http://vinceswoodnwonders.com/store/


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

> Have you used Abranet discs for sanding bowls?


Yes … I use them in conjunction with velcro discs and backers from Vince Welsh http://vinceswoodnwonders.com/store/


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## Nubsnstubs (Aug 30, 2013)

FG, I've been using a pneumatic right angle drill for the last 4 years. My air compressor just about keeps up with it. The arbors I have are for twist lock discs. They come in 1" to 3" od in grits from 36 - 240 for wood. I haven't found any finer grits, as I get them from 3M. 
The beauty of pneumatics is they don't get hot with extended use. If you have an air compressor that produces over 6 cfm free air, the tool is perfect for the job. There also is no possibility of being accidentally elctrocuted by using pneumatic tools. I don't have any info on it right now, but will post it after I get back from my woodturning meeting today if your interested…........ Jerry (in Tucson)


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

Just an after-thought … another way to go is with an angle grinder and ROS attachment from Arbortech ( http://www.arbortechusa.com/view/woodworking/contour-random-sander/query/product/san-fg-200 ).

It is a little pricey, but yields excellent results. It is designed to use with PSA pads, but some guys in my club have purchased an extra disc and glued the hook side of Velcor to it so they can use with Abranet or flex discs.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> FG, I ve been using a pneumatic right angle drill for the last 4 years. My air compressor just about keeps up with it. The arbors I have are for twist lock discs. They come in 1" to 3" od in grits from 36 - 240 for wood. I haven t found any finer grits, as I get them from 3M.
> The beauty of pneumatics is they don t get hot with extended use. If you have an air compressor that produces over 6 cfm free air, the tool is perfect for the job. There also is no possibility of being accidentally elctrocuted by using pneumatic tools. I don t have any info on it right now, but will post it after I get back from my woodturning meeting today if your interested…........ Jerry (in Tucson)
> 
> Nope, my little PC compressor is quite small, so will have to go with electric.
> ...


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> Have you used Abranet discs for sanding bowls?
> 
> Yes … I use them in conjunction with velcro discs and backers from Vince Welsh http://vinceswoodnwonders.com/store/
> - TheDane


Vince has been recommended to me by several turners now, so I'd say that's probably where I'll head. Thanks!


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## bwstout (Jun 25, 2015)

I use the Milwaukee right angle drill and buy all of my sanding disk and back up pads from I also have a HF right angle drill. The Milwaukee is more comfortable to use over the HF. If you get the HF I would buy the extra warranty the drill will worn out in a year or less if you use it everyday but they will give you a new one. Mine lasted a year, but the Milwaukee is still is outstanding shape after a year. I use them almost everday. I turn 95% bowls from 5" to 16". To sum it up my choice is the Milwaukee drill and supplies from Vince.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

bw, Do you have the new model of the Milwaukee, or the older model? I know people really like the previous model, but the current one seems to have design problems. I've already ordered the Neiko from Amazon, so we'll see how that goes. Have you actually had good luck with HF replacing a drill under extended warranty? If the Neiko goes belly-up too soon, I might try the HF. Thanks! Going to call Vince and see if he has a "starter kit."


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## bwstout (Jun 25, 2015)

Yes I have the new model Milwaukee # 0370-20 pick it up from Home Depot, I like it over the HF and it looks a lot like the Neiko drill. I was going to buy a Neiko my daughter bought the Milwaukee for a Christmas gift for me.
As for as issue with the replacing of the drill at HF I have not had any issues just paid $7.00 for the extended warranty on the replacement drill and if it wears out in before a year is up then I get another one. It becomes a $7.00 cost each year. The drill head bearings wear quickly on the HF drill.


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## soob (Feb 3, 2015)

Here's what I did:

An angled drill.

A $2 ebay 2" Velcro-faced pad made for a random orbital sander (available for $5 from harbor freight, give or take).

Interface pads made from a piece of 1/2" foam (available anywhere) and some 2" wide "industrial" Velcro. You just stick the Velcro to both sides then cut out the discs on the bandsaw.

Use scissors to cut-up a bunch of Klingspor 5", no-hole ROS hook-and-loop discs. (you get four 2" pieces per).

The tricks to power sanding are: 1) push lightly and with a consistent pressure at all times; 2) lathe very slow, drill pretty slow; and 3) always use a fresh sandpaper disc. They're cheap; throw them away after you use them.


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

Another way to make your own sanding discs …


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## SirIrb (Jan 12, 2015)

Buy a card scraper, or better, make your own from an old saw blade (hand saw) and you will NEVER sand again. YouTube Card Scraper and watch the magic.


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## soob (Feb 3, 2015)

Yeah, but make sure you hold it at an angle so it cuts rather than scrapes. (Please don't try using a card scraper on the lathe!).


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

> Buy a card scraper, or better, make your own from an old saw blade (hand saw) and you will NEVER sand again. YouTube Card Scraper and watch the magic.
> 
> - SirIrb


Card scrapers and woodturnings mix like oil and water.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> Buy a card scraper, or better, make your own from an old saw blade (hand saw) and you will NEVER sand again. YouTube Card Scraper and watch the magic.
> 
> - SirIrb
> 
> ...


Thanks for setting him straight, TD. I was sans internet when that post was made, spending time with siblings in SoCal. Card scraper and a candlestick or bowl. Methinks not! :-0


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

REPORT! Am back from the desert, made my decision on sanding. The cheapo angle sander arrived before I left for the trip. Sat down today and decided to order blue starter kits (2-3/8" and 3-3/8") from Vince at Vince's WoodNWonders. Just a thought on TheDane's post for making my own discs. If I were hand sanding, I'd take advantage of that. But with power sanding, I suspect the laser-cut discs will last longer by not separating as readily. I've seen a lot of laser-cut material, and there's a big advantage there!


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

> Just a thought on TheDane s post for making my own discs. If I were hand sanding, I'd take advantage of that. But with power sanding, I suspect the laser-cut discs will last longer by not separating as readily.


Hmmm … I power sand (with an Arbortech ROS attachment on an angle grinder) using the home-made discs all the time. Never had any problem with the PSA discs separating. They do wear out like any other sanding media, but are no worse than the laser cut blue discs from Vince.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> Just a thought on TheDane s post for making my own discs. If I were hand sanding, I d take advantage of that. But with power sanding, I suspect the laser-cut discs will last longer by not separating as readily.
> 
> Hmmm … I power sand (with an Arbortech ROS attachment on an angle grinder) using the home-made discs all the time. Never had any problem with the PSA discs separating. They do wear out like any other sanding media, but are no worse than the laser cut blue discs from Vince.
> 
> - TheDane


I may very well try it down the line. Found a box of sanding discs I must have picked up at an auction, high quality gold stuff, so really have nothing to lose! I saw the Arbortech attachment yesterday online. Looks like a pretty cool invention. Sad to say, our angle grinder is too bulky and aggressive for me to handle for something like sanding.


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## NJJoe (Apr 14, 2015)

I've been using this Neiko from Amazon.

http://www.amazon.com/Neiko-10529A-8-Inch-55-Degree-Quarter/dp/B000XUHA8C/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1443563611&sr=8-2&keywords=angled+drill

The first one seized after three days but the company immediately replaced it and this one has been going strong for two years+. I just occasionally blow out the insides through the vents. Variable speed, cheap and reliable.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> I ve been using this Neiko from Amazon.
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/Neiko-10529A-8-Inch-55-Degree-Quarter/dp/B000XUHA8C/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1443563611&sr=8-2&keywords=angled+drill
> 
> ...


Yep, that's the one I got too. Will have to use it soon to make sure it isn't a lemon. Good to hear that they were responsive with your first one. I'll hope it's like the second one you got-two years is great!

PS: How noisy is yours?


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

> Sad to say, our angle grinder is too bulky and aggressive for me to handle for something like sanding.


I bought a small Hitachi grinder (G12SS - 4 1/2"), which is about the same size as my cheap HF angle drill. The only problem is the Arbortech ROS is 3 1/2" long, which means you can't use it inside smaller bowls.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

All my Vince stuff arrived today, and I have set aside tomorrow for **woodworking**!! Have yet to get back in the shop after returning from my little trip to USA's heat sink. So looking forward to it, will report tomorrow night. ;-)


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## toddbeaulieu (Mar 5, 2010)

I had that Milwaukee on my Amazon wishlist when I came across your thread. One of the reviews mentioned the older version of the drill as being excellent (his died), so I ended up buying one last night on ebay for $76. Now I have to research the discs/attachment.

BTW, I have what I consider to be an amazing scraper. It's not a card scraper, it's much more substantial. I even bought one for my buddy because I knew he'd love it, but would be too cheap to buy it himself. They sell three styles. There's no need for a burr with this style.

http://www.stewmac.com/Luthier_Tools/Types_of_Tools/Scrapers/StewMac_Ultimate_Scraper.html


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## CharlieM1958 (Nov 7, 2006)

I guess I'm missing something. Why would anyone want to use a disc sander inside of a stationary bowl rather than sanding while it still on the lathe? I use various grits of Abranet wrapped around flexible sanding sponges. Makes quick work of things.


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## toddbeaulieu (Mar 5, 2010)

So, I'm as new as they come to turning but from the MANY videos I've sat through so far, lots of people seem to like a spanning sander. Also, it seems that the pattern is to start with a power sander and then switch to a passive sander. If you think about it, a spinning sander is sanding in all directions, rather than the one, which should work much, much faster.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> I guess I m missing something. Why would anyone want to use a disc sander inside of a stationary bowl rather than sanding while it still on the lathe? I use various grits of Abranet wrapped around flexible sanding sponges. Makes quick work of things.
> 
> - CharlieM1958


The disc sander is used while the bowl is spinning on the lathe (best of both worlds). This requires a balance of proper speed of lathe (slow), proper speed of sander (about half-speed from what I read so far), and not too much pressure. Evidently, it's much faster than hand-sanding, less tiring on the human. Advice from AAW members mostly has been to power-sand to 180 or, 220, and then hand sand (on the lathe) for the finer grits. Firmness of backer pads varies according to class of grits-harder pads for lower grits, softer pads for higher grits. See my next post for a video link to Vince's system has been, by far, the most recommended set of discs/backers).

PS: I love Abranet, and that's one of the disc options that Vince offers. But I'm starting with the blue discs, then will branch out according to need. Abranet is supposed to be especially useful on green wood.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> I had that Milwaukee on my Amazon wishlist when I came across your thread. One of the reviews mentioned the older version of the drill as being excellent (his died), so I ended up buying one last night on ebay for $76. Now I have to research the discs/attachment.
> [Snip]
> - toddbeaulieu


I'll have to check out those scrapers, they look cool and if they're popular with luthiers, they're probably quite good. As I've mentioned before, the majority of suggestions I've gotten about discs and pads have been for Vince at Vince's WoodNWonders . His stacking system of pads and interface pads helps reduce fatigue of the Velcro. Here is a short video:





and the back-up pads (haven't watched this one yet): 




He has starter kits (LMK if you can't find them). I got the 2-3/8 and 3-3/8" blue starter kits.

Gotta go, running late!


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## toddbeaulieu (Mar 5, 2010)

I received the Milwaukee angle drill (used) and I can immediately see that the trigger is a different design that the current offering. I can also see why people don't like the new design. With the old, you can grip under the trigger while working with the chuck.

I also bought a 2" starter kit from Vince and his Sanding Wonder. It's expensive, but really well made. I haven't tried it yet, but hopefully will today.

This thread was very helpful. Thanks.

PS: Vince was very pleasant, accommodating and helpful in getting me started. I'm definitely going to buy from him again.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> I received the Milwaukee angle drill (used) and I can immediately see that the trigger is a different design that the current offering. I can also see why people don t like the new design. With the old, you can grip under the trigger while working with the chuck.
> 
> I also bought a 2" starter kit from Vince and his Sanding Wonder. It s expensive, but really well made. I haven t tried it yet, but hopefully will today.
> 
> ...


Yep, your observations on the Milwaukee (new vs. old) are spot-on. Vince has a great reputation, and it seems his sanding supplies are top-notch. I've watched his videos and done a little sanding, can see technique is something that has to be developed. I also ordered one of the big storage cases, and got an extra 2" backer that I'm going to turn into a Chucker-pad (hopefully). He wants a picture if it works.


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## toddbeaulieu (Mar 5, 2010)

Well I tried the Wonder today. You're right, it will take some getting used to. I got it going a few times but used the drill mostly on a bowl because I've got enough to learn as it is.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

Oh, the Sanding Wonder-sorry, I missed that part. I'm just learning to use an angle sander, LOL.


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## groyuti (Oct 12, 2015)

[No message]


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## Bill7255 (Feb 23, 2012)

I just recently started turning again. I had bought disc from 2sand. I had this http://www.homedepot.com/p/Milescraft-Drill-90-Right-Angle-Drill-Attachment-1390/100507163 attachment I bought years ago and never used. It actually works fairly well. A little getting use to, but the handle is nice and the attachment swivels.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

Yep, I looked at those attachments, didn't feel coordinated enough, LOL. I buy my Abaranet from 2sand.com, really like their fast service and the fact that I can get small quantities of grits I don't use that often. Welcome back to the Dark Side!


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## TheWeiss (Jan 7, 2015)

I can add that I bought one of the sanding disc kits from PSI (via Amazon) and I was very disappointed. They all fell apart really quickly. The foam pads that the Velcro sits on was junk and came about in the midst of my second use.


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## Bill7255 (Feb 23, 2012)

The ones that 2sand has seem to hold up well. Note they are not for high speed. I like their white rhino disc as the last a long time.


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## ForestGrl (Jun 5, 2015)

> I can add that I bought one of the sanding disc kits from PSI (via Amazon) and I was very disappointed. They all fell apart really quickly. The foam pads that the Velcro sits on was junk and came about in the midst of my second use.
> 
> - TheWeiss


Oh, dear, don't get me started on Penn State. I have bought a couple things that were good values, especially the overhead blade guard, but I bought their 3-step buffing system and it was horrible, sent it back and ordered a Beall. I'll put a review on LJ about the PSI piece of junk.


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