# How safe is a radial arm saw and is it a good addition to the shop?



## Alan72 (Oct 31, 2012)

I'am going to look a used Delta shop master Radial arm saw in the morning. I ask my brother if he wanted to go for a ride and take a look at it. He told me that I don't need one and that they are dangerous! I never used one, and I would only use it for cross cutting and dados. I'm hoping if someone could tell me who uses them if it's worth getting. I know every tool in the shop is dangerous but is the radial arm saw more of a risk, Thanks. Alan


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

If you use them safely they are not especially dangerous. 
Ripping is awkward and most users use another means 
these days.


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## mudflap4869 (May 28, 2014)

I picked up a used RAS about a year ago. I wish I had bought a sliding miter saw instead. It just takes up valuable space and is rarely used. I can do a better job with the other tools in the shop. I learned the hard way.


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## freddy1962 (Feb 27, 2014)

They are great for crosscutting and dados. Stay focused and don't get in a hurry and you'll be fine using one. I use mine for crosscutting wide, rough lumber usually. My miter saw is limited to the width it'll cut.


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## patron (Apr 2, 2009)

most of the 'dangerous' stories come from years ago
when contractors took them to job sites
just siting on uneven ground with the short tables that came with them
and 3 or 4 guys cutting different boards
and turning the arm or beveling with them
chewing up the back stop and table
with some care radial arm saws are excellent tools
for what they were made to do

in a shop setting with a longer table (to support the work)
and not changing the carriage back and forth for all cuts
they work just fine

strong arm the tool when you cut
in the event the blade does grab
and wants to jump out across the board
it pushes you back with it

here is how i set mine up
and some jigs made for it

http://lumberjocks.com/projects/21465

for dados

http://lumberjocks.com/patron/blog/11083

use it safely
like any other tool


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## johnstoneb (Jun 14, 2012)

An RAS is only as dangerous as the person using it. I had one for quite awhile. Got rid of it. I only used it for crosscuts, it took up a lot of room, was a junk collector, when I did want to use it It was easier to use the table saw because I didn't have to find a place for all the stuff piled on the RAS table.


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

My shop will never be without one again. It's only as dangerous as the user…and does a ton of stuff really well, I did kick out the miter saw.A lot of discouraging input on the RAS from those who had the misfortune to buy a Craftsman saw…..if you have a good one (older Dewalt, Delta Turret arm, etc.) they really earn their keep..


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## bondogaposis (Dec 18, 2011)

Be sure to get a blade specifically made for RAS or they have a tendency to over run the cut, which can be dangerous.


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## Alan72 (Oct 31, 2012)

Thank you all for all the info. I'm not sure after all if I have the space in the shop for RAS. I'm still on the fence, but it's seem to be a really good deal but the space is a big issue.


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## timbertailor (Jul 2, 2014)

A RAS is a very versatile solution and do a whole lot more than just cross cuts. And they are so inexpensive, they make a great addition to the shop. I hear a lot of complaints about how much space they take up. Most swing out of the way, like mine, and provide an additional work surface when not in use.

They sure do come in handy when working on long pieces of stock like baseboards, quarter round, and mouldings. They also are great for making quick, clean cuts when you do not want to fire up the table saw. And you would have to buy a pretty expensive Miter Saw to match the cross cut capabilities of the average RAS.

I would look for an older model. Mine has been running for 45 years and earns its keep.


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## Rick Dennington (Aug 27, 2009)

I like my RAS…..Wouldn't be without it, unless it dies of old age…..I bought it new in 1985, along with my table saw and chop saw…..All are Crapsmans, and are still going strong….That was when they built good Craftsman tools. Several years ago I built a chop saw and RAS station, did away with the old splayed legs, and added about 16-18 ft. of cutting length…..One of the best moves I ever made in the shop….You can view it in my workshop pictures, or on my Blog under Shop pictures #2…...If you want to…....


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

It's like any tool those who have had a RAS for years have gotten use to using them,but like others have said they take up a lot of room,that's why I got rid of mine. If you don't have a big budget Then you might get one because they take so much room there's a lot of them on the market so even top notch brands sell for $50-$100 in my area.
I discourage my students from using them to rip with. If you don't take the proper steps with a RAS you have a strong possibility of kick back.


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## Nubsnstubs (Aug 30, 2013)

In the very early 70's I worked for a custom shutter shop. They had about 4 RAS's for cutting miters on the shutter frames, and next to that another 4 for regular straight cuts. Each saw had a lead weight of about 10 lbs attached to a string or rope and pulley that made the cutting operation extremely smooth without over running the cut. Also, it kept the saw back against the stop instead of creeping forward like most that don't have anything to keep the blade behind the fence when not being used. I know, it should be level, but it always seems to go out. And, NO, I don't own one and haven't for the 35 years I had my business. Slideboards and miter saws were used instead. ...... Jerry (in Tucson)


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## sawdust703 (Jul 6, 2014)

I have had mine for over 10 yrs, bought it used from a contractor that THOROUGHLY ABUSED the ol' gal!! My shop couldn't operate w/o it!! I had to do A LOT of work to it when I bought it, but I have it built into a bench made just for it. It is an older Craftsman, & works well!! Yep, like any other machine, they require occasional squaring, cleaning, lube in the bearings, motor blown out, etc. But if treated with respect, they will do anything ya ask of it!! I may ruffle some feathers here, but, I have a tendency to disagree w/the space issue as well. I had my shop in our basement for many years, in a 8' x 12' room. The saw swung out of the way to allow me to use my bench for other uses w/o bothering the saw. If I had it to do over again, the RAS would be the first saw I would purchase for a small shop. Simply because of affordability, and its adaptable to most ANY purpose. Yes, it goes w/o saying there are teeth in one end, so ya have to learn to use it! And as far as buying blades just for the RAS, I disagree with that too. But, everyone has their own opinions. I live in a small community, & have limited access to saw blades. I use mine for dadoes, cross cutting, miters, etc. I also own a table saw, miter saw, & many other saws. The miter saw collects dust!!! But the RAS is the most used saw in my shop. Just my two cents.


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## GT350 (Dec 22, 2012)

I have used radial arms saws back in the '70s but I don't have one now. I find them less safe than a miter and table saw and I have never found a project where I thought I could do this job better, faster or more accurately with a Radial Arm Saw so I have no desire to get one.
Mike


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## derosa (Aug 21, 2010)

Love mine for the reason others have mentioned, had to crosscut a wide, long heavy board, not safe for the table saw and impossible for the miter saw, easy on the radial. Also really convenient for having to cut a lot of the same dados. Wouldn't get rid of mine.


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## exelectrician (Oct 3, 2011)

No, No, No, don't buy a RAS.!!!

Why // I will let you figure that out all by yourself!


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

I used a RAS (12' Delta) in shop classes I took a few years ago … never felt comfortable (or safe) with it, but as others have said it was useful for breaking down long stock.

I have a 12' SCMS in my shop now along with a 10" cabinet saw. Between those two I haven't found anything I couldn't do that I might have been able to do on a RAS.

There is a reason there are so many of them so cheap on CraigsList all over the country.


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## Woodmaster1 (Apr 26, 2011)

I have a dewalt 3hp 10" for 30 yrs. and use it all the time. I like it much better than the miter saw. It does not seem to take up that much space. I have placed between the garage doors where it fits perfectly.


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## TheWoodenOyster (Feb 6, 2013)

I don't really get the business about them being dangerous, though I have never used on extensively. It seems like any other tools as far as the danger factor. If you use it incorrectly, it can hurt you. Otherwise, I don't see why it gets such a bad reputation. I'd sure as heck rather spend a day with an RAS than a day with a jointer.

I think they can be useful, but aren't by any means necessary. I think I would probably only use one to rough cut long boards to preliminary lengths. I'll say this - I would need some serious expendable income and shop space before I bought one.


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## Grandpa (Jan 28, 2011)

The saw's motor can be turned 90 degrees to the right or left so someone ripping on the RAS should pay attention and not turn it the wrong direction. If you turn the motor the wrong direction it will take the board away from you and shoot it through whatever is sitting out there. You also have to put your fingers close to the blade and it is difficult to keep you eyes on everything. If the wrong blade is used it will tend to over run the cut or walk up onto your wood and came at you scaring the beejeebies out of you. If you use the correct blade this is virtually eliminated. They can be sweet when adjusted and used properly. I have an expensive compound miter saw and they don't replace a well mannered radial arm saw. So many things you can't do on the miter saw that you can do on the RAS. If all you want to do is crosscut a few boards then get a miter saw. As far as can you tune them and build things, well I had a friend that build a larger mantle clock with a RAS.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

The RAS 'takes up space' when extension surfaces are added left and right of the table.

A table saw takes up space when an outfeed table and wings are added.

And a SCMS takes up space when you want to cut stuff longer than 3' and build a mitre station for it.

It is as unsafe as you let it be, without question. Same for a table saw, or hand plane or chisel.


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

I'll note that radial arm saws cut dados of consistent
depth more easily.

The relationship of the carriage moving above the work 
allows consistent depth cuts that can be difficult
with a table saw.

In removing material selectively, to relive the back of
a moulding for example, one can run a dado blade
or moulding cutter and see what one is doing.

Tenon cheeks may be cut by tilting the saw carriage
sideways. Angled tenon cheeks are easy as well.
Curved chair backs may be tenoned with less
fixturing fussiness than the table saw or other 
method might require.

Some radial arm saws have a thing to attach a router
collet or flexible shaft tool to on the back of the 
carriage. This can be used for overhead routing
excavations where again you can see what you 
are doing. Technical miter fold boxes can be
made as well since minor variatons in material
thickness do not matter to the radial arm saw.
To do these, you use a moulding head and tune
the saw carefully to excavate a v-shaped groove
leaving a tiny thickness of material left. Then 
when the cuts are made the piece can be folded
up into a box with a visible joint at only 1 corner.

Radial arm saws can be fitted with a relatively
inexpensive chain mortising attachment for making
deep through mortises in timber frame components
and craftsman style furniture.

Aside from that they can work pretty well in place
of a miter saw. With either miter saw or radial
arm saw the tool's utility in crosscutting longer
boards is greatly increased with a carefully
made table and fence system.

If I had room for both I would have both, set
up with large tables. As it is I use neither
currently, but I started woodworking on my
dad's radial arm saw and got to know it adequately.


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## Nubsnstubs (Aug 30, 2013)

> You also have to put your fingers close to the blade and it is difficult to keep you eyes on everything. If the wrong blade is used it will tend to over run the cut or walk up onto your wood and came at you scaring the beejeebies out of you. If you use the correct blade this is virtually eliminated. They can be sweet when adjusted and used properly.
> 
> - Grandpa


I've seen this "wrong blade" thing about 3 times in this thread. Would someone please enlighten me on what is the proper blade for a RAS?.

Hey Gramps, whenever anyone is working with any woodcutting equipment, fingers always get too close. Some inadvertently, and other times on purpose. I always get within 2" of a cutting instrument, and have never been cut. It's been when my fingers were more than 6" is when I got cut. I was cutting 1/4" moulding once and just got stupid as I was looking at the end of my pushstick, and my finger was 3/4" forward of it keeping the wood against the fence. Ouch! One bandaid later, I was back to cutting 1/4" trim…. .............. Jerry (in Tucson)


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

You want a blade with a negative rake angle. It inhibits
a crosscut blade from self-feeding into the work when
the carriage is pulled outwards.

The safest procedure is to pull the carriage out all the
way, position the work, turn on the saw and push
into the cut. This is awkward of course and
with care the saw can be used safely with a pull 
cut.


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## NoThanks (Mar 19, 2014)

Your always going to hear about how dangerous they are by someone. 
I think they are as safe as any tool if you learn how to use it properly.

In certain cases it may take more due diligence to make sure your operating it correctly than perhaps another tool, 
but still can be done safely as long as you know what your doing.

I've always had one in my shop. My latest RAS is set up for crosscutting, but I'm able to use it for other operations if necessary. I'm running a Delta 16" (3ph) 
Never once have I had a problem with the saw wanting to lurch forward at me.
I can crosscut 26" with no problem and I haven't had to re-adjust the saw for squareness since I set it up last.

I'm not disagreeing with Loren, but I always just pull through the material on the way out. 
Just the way I'm comfortable doing it.

(now if I could just figure out what a spring loaded punch is)


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## REO (Sep 20, 2012)

I woud advise against the pull out the saw-position work and push in to work practice. it is very easy to pinch the blade at the end of the cut ending with a stuck saw or a loud bang as the board pulls instead of cutting. negative rake blades are typical used for soft metals or cutting plastic and have only recently been introduced as "safety blades" for RAS's. they do reduce the possibility of self feeding but using the saw properly is your best protection. line of fire? RAS's are indispensable for long repetitive angled cuts on long pieces like framing for a roof. A CMS doesn't have the travel. As one mentioned they have a good use in breaking down long stock into short useable pieces. as far as uniform dado's the table saw is a better bet as the gaging is done by the depth of the saw and error is on the side of cutting to shallow not too deep you have a second shot at doing it correctly. it is nice to be able to see the cut on the long side once in a while. it is also a good tool for trim manufacture it can cut coves, dental molding components and as loren mentioned it can be used in joinery for cutting tenons. all can be done on the TS as well but you may develop your own preference for one or the other.


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## Alan72 (Oct 31, 2012)

Well I went and looked at the RAS today, it was in pretty good condition, and the motor sounded good. I paid $125.00, I think the guy who sold it thought I was going to low ball him but gave asking price. I only need to replace the table top. I look forward setting it up in the shop. Thanks to everyone who responded to this topic, tonight I'll read and watch safety videos on the RAS. I also have to find a manual for this but hope not to have any issues finding it on line. Thanks again.









p


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## NoThanks (Mar 19, 2014)

That looks like a nice saw Alan.
When you set up your table be sure to put the fence far enough forward that you won't accidentally bump your hand into it. 
I like to have mine set so that I can cut a 2" thick board without the teeth hitting the wood. You may want to move your fence a little closer to the front just for more safety.
Just my Opinion, others may differ.


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## johnhutchinson (Dec 9, 2013)

> A lot of discouraging input on the RAS from those who had the misfortune to buy a Craftsman saw…..if you have a good one (older Dewalt, Delta Turret arm, etc.) they really earn their keep..
> 
> - Fred Hargis


I have to politely disagree with Fred on his Craftsman comment. I have a Craftsman RAS with a motor-driven, variable-speed, cable-release system that makes it very safe.

This is one tool where Craftsman shines, and it's probably because of numerous lawsuits regarding the dangers of their older saws that they've addressed with their newer RAS.

One of the biggest mistakes RAS users make is assuming they can use their table saw blades in their RAS.

*YOU - CAN - NOT*

You must use a negative-hook blade.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Good luck with your new saw Alan,it looks like a good one,I'm sure it was alot more than $125 new.


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## JBuckley (Aug 24, 2014)

It looks to be in good shape. I think it is helpful to have another option set up as a dado or a crosscut to relieve having to make blade changes on the table saw.


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

> I have to politely disagree with Fred on his Craftsman comment. I have a Craftsman RAS with a motor-driven, variable-speed, cable-release system that makes it very safe.
> 
> This is one tool where Craftsman shines, and it s probably because of numerous lawsuits regarding the dangers of their older saws that they ve addressed with their newer RAS.
> 
> - johnhutchinson


John, I have to admit (I've had 3 C'Man saws) I've never seen one with a cable release system; I'm guessing that refers to carriage movement? Regardless, my comment isn't directed at that aspect of RAS useage, it's more about the Craftsman saws not holding a setting or returning to zero after you swing the arm. Through the Sears marketing effort to make the RAS "the only tool you need in a shop" with all the mostly mal-funstioning attachments and you get a lot of folks calling the RAS a piece of crap. That said, I do realize a lot of folks with the older models (say, pre mid-70's) have one that serves them well, but even then you will often see comments like "I leave it at 90º". So, in case I didn't mention it earleier, it's only my opinion….and while there are some good Craftsman saws out there, there has been thousands of bad ones, leading to the RAS reputation generally espoused nowadays.


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## freddy1962 (Feb 27, 2014)

Nice looking saw Alan. iwud4u, here's a center punch (spring loaded) Pop it where you want to drill. Drill bit will follow the divet and not dance around. I used them for years installing commercial door hardware, closures, panic bars. They are excellent for popping a divet to center screws for hinges and other hardware, ect.


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## MrRon (Jul 9, 2009)

A RAS is no more dangerous than any other machine in a shop. Saws come in various types and each excels in one particular way. Table saws excel in rip cuts. A RAS excels in crosscuts. The RAS was the saw used by on-site building contractors until miters saws came into being. Contractors now have two saws on their job sites; a miter saw and a table saw. The RAS was my first saw because of it's versatility. I now have a RAS, miter saw, cabinet saw and bandsaw in my shop.


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## NoThanks (Mar 19, 2014)

> Nice looking saw Alan. iwud4u, here s a center punch (spring loaded) Pop it where you want to drill. Drill bit will follow the divet and not dance around. I used them for years installing commercial door hardware, closures, panic bars. They are excellent for popping a divet to center screws for hinges and other hardware, ect.
> 
> - freddy1962


Thanks freddy!


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## unbob (Mar 10, 2013)

I was instructed to use the left hand To pull the saw head, with the right hand holding the work on the motors right side.
This makes sense to me as, using the right hand to pull the motor head, leaves the left hand on the blade side.
If one is going to saw off a hand, it will be the left one.


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## johnhutchinson (Dec 9, 2013)

*unbob:* What the ???

I'm just taking a break from using my RAS, and I couldn't help but notice your technique.
Unless you have an EXTREMELY long neck, I don't see how this is a safe way to use the saw. I do it occasionally, but only when all else fails.

Perhaps someone is pulling someone's leg … or hand, in this case.


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## NoThanks (Mar 19, 2014)

unbob, is your stop on the left of the saw or to the right. 
If it's on the left then you need to hold your material tight, with your left hand, and pull with your right.

When I trim the leading edge I hold the material with my right and pull with my left, but I'm on the other side of the saw when I do this.


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## Grandpa (Jan 28, 2011)

hold the stock with the left hand on the left side of the blade and let the right hand pull the saw motor across the stock. My arm won't fit under a saw motor. Another thing is to always put your thumb next to your forefinger on top of the stock when holding the stock with either hand. This way the thumb doesn't get extended into the travel of the blade. It would not be nice to leave the thumb laying on the table. 
BTW, very nice looking saw and worth the money I am sure.


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## johnhutchinson (Dec 9, 2013)

*Grandpa:* Good advice !!!

I've even considered the possibility of hold-down clamps mounted on top of, or behind, my fence. But clamps only on the "held" side.

I put a laser on my RAS, and now I have the option of:
Leaving the line
Splitting the line
Making the line disappear

Makes me happy. 

A laser really does improve the usefulness of a RAS because you really don't need to extend a perpendicular pencil line across the board. If you have a measurement mark anywhere on the board, you can split it with a laser.

I know that a lot of folks want to cut dados with a RAS, but it's not for the faint of heart. A dado stack wants to grab and come at ya. When I've cut dados, I've nibbled them with successive passes. I've seen Norm cut dados on the New Yankee Workshop, with a dado stack on a RAS, and he can just barely control the stampeding chippers.


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## unbob (Mar 10, 2013)

I use a stop when needed to the right. Often mostly cutting to a mark, aligning to the right side of the clean cut fence slot.
Just the way I was shown to do it long time ago…..to avoid any chance of sawing my left hand.


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## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

As many have mentioned, only as dangerous as the user. Having the saw try to self feed itself can be unnerving to the uninitiated. Negative hook blades help make this much safer, having used both positive and negative hook blades on different RAS, positive hook blades are certainly not something you'd want to start with. The big advantage over a SCMS is the ability to cut dados and a motor with much more torque.


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## Grandpa (Jan 28, 2011)

And…..most RAS will cut across a 16 inch board.


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

With a RAS as well one can cut a variety of end
scarf joints in long boards. It's quite an interesting
tool when you get to thinking about long timber
joinery with it, especially with the router attachment.

Curtis Epelding wrote an interesting article many
years ago on doing chair joinery with a radial
arm saw. As I recall he had some interesting
fixtures.

A conga drum maker I grilled many years ago on
his construction methods cut the bevels one
steam bent staves using a 14" RAS set up for
ripping with a sliding carriage on linear bearings
to carry the stave. At the time I was in awe, 
but now it seems rather obvious. He did brag
about how much it cost him to build the rig…
I dunno if he was telling the truth or just 
trying to put me off, a scrappy would-be 
competitor.


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