# Planing Knots



## andy6601 (Aug 23, 2011)

I have been working with a lot of pine lately and I have been doing my best to attempt to select boards that have no knots or at the very least as few as posible. So when it comes to planing the boards down, when using a hand plane do you just plane over them, or around them? I have tried doing both, but I am not sure what is the best way to go about it? I get that having clear stock is the best, but now a days clear lumber of any species is not cheap and sometimes can't be found. So any advice on this would be great! I wish everyone a Merry Christmas and count their blessings in light of reccent events.


----------



## Handtooler (Jul 24, 2012)

I work mostly with Pecan because that's what I have from a downed tree in my yard 14 years ago. I try hand planning that which is EXTREMELY HARD and the knots really cauce chatter and gouges. So any technique that LJers provide will be appreciated also.


----------



## Cosmicsniper (Oct 2, 2009)

I don't use knotty pine for precisely that reason, but if I did I would run it through my thickness sander. If I didn't have that I would do it with a hand-held belt sander, at least to hit knots…I'd handplane the clear wood. But that's a good question and I'm curious how others would deal with it.

BTW, I've done the knots with handplanes in other species without too much issue, but they are so infrequent that I just suck it up and go with. It does dull the iron pretty quickly though.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

For me it depends on the knot. Some can be planed if the plane is good and sharp, but it dulls the plane pretty quickly. I typically us a scraper.


----------



## dhazelton (Feb 11, 2012)

Since you are hand planing you expect and enjoy irregularity and texture in a surface. I would just use a low angle block plane on the knot, and your number 4 or 5 jack plane on the rest.


----------



## djwong (Aug 2, 2009)

I often use a chisel to work knots before planing. You can also use mineral spirits or camilla oil, to soften the knot to make chiseling or planing easier. Using a chisel really saves me from dinging up my plane blades.


----------



## MonteCristo (May 29, 2012)

Tough call, as knots can be really hard and the wood around them can have challenging grain to plane. I would try to minimize the amount of planing to do, either by first resawing (if there's a lot to remove) or using a drum sander with a really coarse grit if there's less to remove but still too much for planing. After that, it's either risking tearout on a planer or using a high angle hand plane and scrapers. Sometimes boards with knots will plane remarkable well, using light cuts of course.


----------



## Richforever (Mar 19, 2008)

I recently found that sometimes a spokeshave can handle a knot that a hand plane won't.


----------



## bobasaurus (Sep 6, 2009)

An extremely sharp blade with a very narrow mouth should do it with fine passes… you could try a higher planing angle too (easy enough on BU planes, but on BD the only way is to relieve the edge opposite the bevel a hair).


----------



## bondogaposis (Dec 18, 2011)

I try to cut all of the knots out of pine boards. Even if I have to glue up boards from narrow strips. I like pine but not knotty pine. The problems you get into w/ the knot is is just not worth it to me.


----------



## Johnnn (Sep 21, 2012)

Just hit the occasional knot with your jack plane and see how it goes. Some knots are terrible and some are just a speed bump. You're planing end-grain, so what you really want is a sharp low-angle blade. I often plane around knots and hit them with a low-angle block plane separately if the jack is unhappy. Sometimes it really helps to wet it with BLO, mineral spirits, or alcohol. The real problem is when the grain around the knot is swirling and you get tearout, so you grab a high-angle smoother to deal with that, which is pretty wrong for the knot itself. Sometimes, a sanding block is the most effective plane…


----------



## andy6601 (Aug 23, 2011)

Thanks for all of the replies, I try to buy the clearest stock that I can but, even then you end up with knots, I will give all of these a try and it sounds like I may have to try different methods depending on what I see going on with each knot. So thanks everyone for the great advice!


----------



## JohnChung (Sep 20, 2012)

Knots can scratch a plane's sole fast. But what is a plane for?  For knots I use a 25 angle bevel blade. It will dull the blade faster. If it is still an issue with tearouts then change to a toothed blade. It will help with the knots. Once at the surface is pretty much there use back the normal blade to finish the surface.


----------



## TCCcabinetmaker (Dec 14, 2011)

super glue may keep the end grain from tearing out, but then it can also block stain to so


----------



## Purrmaster (Sep 1, 2012)

I feel your pain. Pine knots are impossible to avoid. A really good, sharp plane can get through them. my Veritas jack can. My Stanley Sweetheart block plane and my older Stanley jack can't. Knots often also cause tear out, which drive me nuts.

It might help slightly if you wax the sole of your plane.

You could try sanding the knots. But that's tedious due to their hardness.


----------



## runswithscissors (Nov 8, 2012)

Several possibilities: a rotary rasp chucked in your drill; an angle grinder disk with lapped paper layers (as the layers wear away, new grit appears); some other agressive cutters that can go in an angle grinder, such as carbide burrs.


----------



## jonoseph (Dec 13, 2015)

An old topic but I can give you some good tips as this week I have been hand planing the knotty floorboards from the upstairs passageway . Some boards are 20 feet long. The knots are in pairs going left and right with spacing about one foot apart lengthways . It`s a one hundred year old house and for some reason a lot of the floors were painted black. So if possible I have turned them over to use the back surface . I used a large sander on the ground floor rooms but with cupping in the surfaces I used it my way and sanded across the boards to avoid massive loss of wood. The sander could not work sideways in the upstairs passage. Half the boards were loose from the electrician.
Taking each board downstairs one at a time I used the staircase to support one end and a folding workbench at the other. The best planes for this were surprisingly 2 narrow RB10 planes .The blades are full width .One with a straight ,new blade with one corner peeping out .The other with a curved blade set centrally .That sharp straight edge cut into the knots in short 2 inch chuffing movements working across the board with----plane in line with the plank---. Just take 1/8 th inch width cuts working sideways till the knot comes down level . If the top surface was being planed the knots were proud of the surface to start with . The lower surfaces had a lot of splinterry rough stuff to clean up . Then the knots were still too high . So the longest plank had about 40 knots. Taking very short cuts on the knot left the other fine grained wood to be planed often in the reverse direction , to give a smooth finish .I had to switch direction several times in each plank . Each section between the knots had to be treated on it`s merits . Sometimes sliding the plane slowly with fingertip gentleness gave a clue to the direction needed . The result was worth the concentration .The cupping was left as it began . The corner edge of the straight blade worked down the slope into the concave boards. The other RB10 cleaned up the surface partly and then I used a foam backed sanding drum out in the shed . Not on all of them . Just the ones that splintered if you looked at them . Only shavings in the hallway and no dust . With floorboards beware nails ,large and small , tin tacks ,large and small and those damn staples .
The most difficult board--I ended up with the plane across the plank almost 90 degrees angle just using the tip end of the straight blade. That one needed nearly all drum sander and flapwheel to calm it down . I still needed Gorilla Glue to repair the electrician and plumber`s damage .


----------



## OSU55 (Dec 14, 2012)

Why I don't work with pine….............


----------



## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Main reason I don't…mind Pine. Handplane is held so it travels across the knot in a slicing motion. IF you try to take on a knot head-on, it won't work. You have to slice your way across them.









Pine and Oak tool tote. yes, there are a few knots in both woods. 









And the top for a Pine Shaker Table i built.

Just go at an angle to the grain, and use the plane to SLICE across the knot. IF the pine is solid and tight, should have no trouble with it.


----------



## rwe2156 (May 7, 2014)

1. Low angle plane with a skewing motion just described ^. Keep firm downward pressure.
SHARP blade + resharpened frequently depending on how hard the knots are.
I wouldn't go with a high angle plane but be aware the grain immediately around the knot can be a PITA.

2. Scraper

Problem with sanding is the soft wood sands away quicker than knot, leaving know elevated.

I wouldn't recommend hand power tools of any kind, especially a belt sander (aka project destroyer).


----------



## mamell (Dec 24, 2015)

I have a love/hate relationship with knots. They're often really beautiful, but as with my current project, a new bench top, 12 inches x 6 feet I have a few and trying to get these 2×4s leveled and the curves off the edges (I have 8 of them laminated) is to say the least a challenge.







(before sanding)

I used the random orbit sander and knocked it down, but still getting tearout around it so somewhere I'll just have to live with a small low spot in the bench top. I'm willing to live with a few knot so beautiful knots,but they are tough to work around at times.


----------



## BurlyBob (Mar 13, 2012)

I've got to agree with everyone about hating pine and those Dam knots. They sure give character to a piece but are a real pain to work around. I've dinged more than a couple of freshly sharpened plane irons on knots.


----------



## jonoseph (Dec 13, 2015)

Currently I am trying to level the wood blocks in the hallway .The blocks were laid in bitumen about 100 years ago . They were never levelled and you can see that in areas where nobody walks. The surface has been waxed over many years and is very hard to shift. I tried varnish remover and a scraper but the smell is enough to stop that .I tried planing the lips between uneven blocks but it`s a real slog. My wife does not like noisy machinery so I waited till she went to the shops for an hour . I have a supply of sanding machine belts . In one hour I managed to clog up 6 belts with the wax .I think knots would have been easier than this .I have tried 3 different planes and the narrow metal Stanley plane works best. Super sharp blades are best but the wax has absorbed years of fine sand from the nearby beach , so that makes a very abrasive surface to shift. The JCB belt sander is the only way to make any progress . 
But when I see the level blocks and the wood grain it`s all been worth it . The large sanding machine we hired to do the rooms would have been too much for the cramped hallway . Sanders can do a lot of damage before you realise .


----------

