# HF dust collector total make over



## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

I wanted to do this for a long time and finally this morning I did it.
In about 6 hours I totally modified my HF dust collector: I build the cart of scrap, I repositioned the motor/impeller and I installed a wok modification.
Of course I cannot tell you how much better it works but for sure it has more suction than before and I sucked in a 5 gallon bucket of dust without having a grain in the bag.
You cannot see it but I also have a Thien separator in the trash can.
Thank you to all who did this kind of things before me and who gave me the ideas.


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## doyoulikegumwood (Jun 21, 2007)

very nice bert i have the same collector and am thing of doing the same thing


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## Toolz (Feb 26, 2008)

Looking great Bert.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Toolz, I used a 16" wok, that I paid $20.00.
The great mystery is "where should the wok seat"?
Does it make a difference if it seats high or low.
Mine seats pretty high. 
If you have very good eyes, on the picture through the plastic bag, you can see the bottom edge of the wok
I know and I understand many think about aerodynamic and fluidic but I do not understand the principle behind the cone or the wok.
Do they prevent the fine dust to be sucked up back in the filter?


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## fito (Jan 13, 2009)

hi, iam planning in doing the same but with phil thien baffle hat, i all ready do the baffle hat for my shop vac and it work, greattt. nice work, it sholud work alot better!!


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Fito, I use both. I have the Thien separator in the trash can and the wok in the dust collector.
My main goal is to prevent so much dust from entering the cartridge filter.
I tell you in about a year if it worked or not. ( it was about a year since I installed my cartridge filter. I found over a gallon of dust in it the day before yesterday)


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

Bert-Nice! How did you suspend the wok … steel strapping?

-Gerry


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Wow Bert you really did a number on the HF changing it from a chevy to a Ferrari.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Thank you Jim.
Gerry , no I used a piece of plywood that I cut the match the inside angle of the dust collector then I screwed it up with two screws and then I drilled two holes in the bottom of the wok to screw it to this piece of plywood.
If you look at the picture I also use two bungee cords the hold the filter down instead of the turn buckles, much easier to remove the cartridge to inspect and to clean it.


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## ChunkyC (Jun 28, 2009)

Nice work. I've been wanting to do the exact same thing to mine. Maybe with your inspiration, I find the perspiration to do mine.

I like the bungies on the outside of the Wynn. I bought eye hooks at the hardware store a week or so ago to do the exact same to mine.

Maybe some day I'll find the motivation..

Nice work.


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## ChunkyC (Jun 28, 2009)

I've never heard of anyone putting a Wok in their DC before. Where did you get the idea from?


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Chunck, 
I found the idea here:
http://lumberjocks.com/Toolz/blog/24815
and here:
http://www.popularwoodworking.com/tools/shop-made-vortex-dust-collector-woks-on

Also I have been reading about dust collection and the HF dust collector for year.


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## ChunkyC (Jun 28, 2009)

Thanks for the links. This is completely new to me.

This is just my opinion but I think the Wok with the Thein baffle on an pre-separator is a tad overkill. However, I would love to hear back after you've run yours for a while and let us know. I had a Thein baffle in my HF DC before I got my barrel pre-separator and ran both for a while. I can't tell any difference from when I was running both verses just the pre-separator that I have now. Now that I've converted mine into a two stage DC, I never get any chips in the bag, except for when the barrel is full. When I get chips, I know it's time to go and dump the barrel.

Well done and thanks for the links.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

I am trying to get no dust (or very little) in the filter, this is why I added the wok.
Time will tell if that works


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Chunck, I went to visit your workshop page, I like your fixture to flatten the board and I wish I had all the boards you have.
It makes me sick in my guts every time I think about the sawmill I had in France a long time ago and all the wood I cut and that was left outside to rot. Today in our country that would thousands of dollars but in fact this is not even for the money but for the waste of very nice wood.


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

Bert-I hear you on the waste.

There's a sawmill a few miles north of where I live, and the operator has been using big hardwood burls for firewood!

When somebody from my turning club was up there to buy some rough lumber, he noticed a 53-foot trailer that was about 2/3 full of beautiful burls. He asked how much and the mill operator told him to take what he wanted … otherwise they would just go into the wood-burning furnace.

Bowl-turners would give upward of $75 apiece for these!

-Gerry


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## Toolz (Feb 26, 2008)

Bert, I'm with you on the height of the wok. I used spacers first but after I removed them I got less dust in the filter. Maybe because I used a 14" wok rather than a 16" one. I think experementation is the key.


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

One day … SOMEBODY should get one of those "manometer" thing-a-ma-jigs, and start documenting the actual performance increase/decrease of all of these individual modifications, allowing others to decide which things they might do, next, to their DC, and the bang-for-the-buck OF such modifications.

But it isn't going to be me LOL !

Nice job ! I DO love a nicely hot-rodded HF 2HP DC. The fact that you got Chinese cooking involved, somehow, is just extra points !


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## MrRon (Jul 9, 2009)

If you can find an Oriental food market nearby, that would be the best place to find an inexpensive wok.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Mr Ron, this is where I bought mine, in fact a Vietnamese store.
Neil really the best way to do that would be to have time and money and to just cut, sand or plane tons of wood with different configurations and then to weight how much saw dust we get in the filter and in bag for each configuration.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

This morning I made one last modification: I cut a window in the side of the trashcan/separator ( I used a 2 liters clear plastic bottle for "glass") to see when it is getting full before I get the saw dust in the plastic bag on the dust collector so that I do not have to mess with bag and also I prevent getting dust in the filter.

To answer Neil, I know that I "pull" more air now than before as the circuit breaker which was not tripping at start up before the modification now trips, indicating that I now use more amps.


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## Brickman (Nov 28, 2011)

One possible source for a suitable "wok" could be either a Brinkman or Weber Smokey Mountain smoker water pan. They are about 15 inches in diameter and are porcelain coated to prevent rust. The Brinkman has two sizes available (13 inch and 15 inch) that have a lip on the top of the bowl where the Weber does not have a lip. If you order the Weber make sure to get the one for the 18" model. They can be found on the net for as little as $7.00 from some of the big name sporting goods places. Below is a picture of what they look like. The Weber is on the left.

http://www.virtualweberbullet.com/waterpan_photos/pan_comparison.jpg


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

" *Brinkman* or Weber Smokey Mountain" do you own the company?


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## dbhost (Jul 20, 2009)

Bert,

I keep putting this mod off. You pulled it off nicely. I am probably going to pick the ring on mine up too so it will clear my 55 gallon separator…


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Thank you dbhost.
The window I made in the trashcan this morning works perfect and I see all the stuff spinning in there.
This morning I used the table saw, the planner and the sliding miter saw, the suction is much better.
All together I am very happy with the modifications.

This morning while using the sliding miter saw, the blade protector shattered on me , without any apparent reason.
I found a piece clear across my shop, thank God I was not injured.


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## WhoMe (Jul 9, 2009)

Really nice mods to that system. Looks like it will work great. I am actually interested in your canister filter. Curious as to where you got that since it looks like a really good fit. 
Gonna bookmark this thread for future reference.


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## Brickman (Nov 28, 2011)

"Do you own the company" I wish! They are a huge company. My handle is Brickman as I work for a brick manufacturer. Just happen to know about the water pans because I am a competitive BBQ cook.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

WhoMe

http://www.wynnenv.com/35A_series_cartridge_kit.htm


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

WhoMe, let me know if you have question


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## vernonator (Feb 21, 2011)

That is one of the projects I have on my list for christmas vacation - off from the 23rd thru the 2nd…11 days and no where to go but the shop….wheeeeee

Thanks for the inspiration and followup…

Mark


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Mark, you are welcome


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

By the way, the connectors on the trash can lid are 4.00" and the connector on the dust collector itself is 6.00" (or 5.00"?). 
I found a "no-hub" plug, fitting perfectly in the 6.00" ( or 5.00" ) hose from the dust collector and the 4.00" fitting on the can lid. 
No-hub is connector for cast iron piping that you can find at your local big box store.
I hope this help.


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## Racer2007 (Jan 13, 2011)

Bert, that thing Sucks. But then thats the whole idea right. Some day I will have a shop that I can set one of those up in , but for now it's just a broom and shopvac for DC duty.


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## thedude50 (Aug 13, 2011)

do you have photos or a blog on this dust seporator


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

thedude50,
No, I do not.
Why do you need them?
I thought that you were not interested in this kind of cheap Chinese junk.
But if you wanted to build one I would be glad to give all the information I have.


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## thedude50 (Aug 13, 2011)

i am intrested in making the second stage my current jet is also made in china. i think or Taiwan most thing we buy are made there some is better than some others but i dont want to fight with you i am curious about how you made a cyclone. i have thought about buying one i have the .5 micron bags but i think a cyclone will protect the impellars for taking a beating I had seen a vortex type cyclone was thinking i could use a 55 gallon drum or maybe a 35 gallon drum

I know you as a guy who gets the most he can out of a tool and respect that I dont think i am a brand snob but i do like specs and I think that there are better vortex machines than my jet which is asingle stage machine if i make it a 2 stage machine it will likely last longer

I would also like to know if your filter is made for the jet


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

*thedude50*:

It sure looks like the Wynn 35 filter IS made for the Jet.

I think it's a good product, with good customer service/fast delivery, and at a fair price.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

thedude50
I did not made a cyclone and I do not look for a fight with any one and I would be glad to help.
In the trash can I have a Thien separator which works fantastic:
http://www.cgallery.com/jpthien/cy.htm
I also cut a window in the side of the trash can to see when it gets full *BEFORE *getting debris in the plastic bag and filter.
On the bottom of the dust collector I installed an upside down wok , to try to mimic the effect of the cone in the newer Jet DC.
I am trying to get less dust tin the filter.
Look here
http://lumberjocks.com/Toolz/blog/24815
and here:
http://www.popularwoodworking.com/tools/shop-made-vortex-dust-collector-woks-on
I do not yet know if that really work or not but the adaption is inexpensive , $20.00.

What I can tell you is that the suction is greatly increased compared to before. As I wrote above , my dust collector now trips the breaker thing that it never did before


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

Bert,
Do you know of anyone who has run this WOK mod for an extended time? I am already running a Thien lid separator into a 30gal can and it works great. When the plastic bag starts to get chips, it is time to empty the can, not a big thing for me.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

HorizontalMike, no I don't , this is a new thing.
Why don't cut a window in you trash can as I did? 
I works perfect.


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

Bert,
I tend to empty the "fine dust" when I empty the chip can, that is unless I am doing a heck of a lot of jointing or planing that day. Then I'll empty the fine dust every second or third chip can load. My biggest DC day was 8 loads of chips. My arms were a bit tired THAT day *;-)* ... but much fun to "get'r dun…"


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

I used my DC all day today with my table saw, miter saw, planer and sander and tonight I have no dust at all in the plastic bag. The trashcan is almost full.


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## bigike (May 25, 2009)

nice


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## foneman (Mar 11, 2007)

B2rcht,
I really like your setup and your reports of no dust in the bag. Do you have pictures of how you installed the wok below the Thein baffle? I am assuming it is installed below it and if so could you provide some details on the size of wok and anything else pertinent to copying your setup?
thank you,
john


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

The best part about it is that if it ever dies, it'll be quick to replace. I never would have thought to move the blower up top like that. Fantastic work.


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## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

"Wok on" you guys. Or is it "Wok and Roll"?


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

foneman, the woke is 16" (bought it in a Vietnamese store for $19.00).
I cut he handle off, I drilled two holes in the bottom and I installed it upside down just under the filter. Some people have sued a piece of metallic strap to install it. I used a piece of 3/4 plywood that I cut to fit the profile under the filter and then I screwed the woke in it. After doing that it is difficult to use the turn buckles for the filter, this is why I use the external bungee cords. To remove the filter is now a piece of cake.
If you closely look at the picture you can see the edge of the woke thought the plastic bag.

I very strongly recommend to cut a window in the trash can as to see when it gets full *BEFORE* you get anything in the plastic bag and filter.

The Thien baffle is, where it should be, in the trash can before the impeller on the DC,


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

"These boots were made for Wok'n,
and that's just what they'll do …."


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Neil you are badddddddddddd!


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## TheDane (May 15, 2008)

Neil-You've gotta quit taking everything so seriously … try to lighten up.

-Gerry


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## WhoMe (Jul 9, 2009)

just don't let those boots Wok all over you…..


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## kdc68 (Mar 2, 2012)

b2rtch….that's really impressive Bert. Thanks for sharing a great idea and all the provided information
To use it, do you wheel it from tool to tool or do you have ducting from all your tools running to it?


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

kdc68. I move it around.
My next step is to buy a cyclone to replace this dust collector


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## kdc68 (Mar 2, 2012)

*b2rtch* - thanks for the reply


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## empty5853 (Oct 6, 2009)

Great Picture Bert. Looks like just what I'm after.

1 Question.
I've read so much about the Thein Seperator that I want to build one. Any pictures, drawinmgs, specs. on it?

Thanks for all the great replies.

Mark T.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

In fact what I use a a Thien baffle, inside the trash can.
http://www.jpthien.com/


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

http://www.harborfreight.com/extra-savings.html


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## BTimmons (Aug 6, 2011)

By the way, the latest issue of FWW (#232) had a pretty in-depth article on various dust collectors, separators, and filters. I recommend it.


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## brtech (May 26, 2010)

In the current issue of FWW, they test a super dust deputy against a Thein baffle, and the baffle comes out very well against the SDD. It has higher flow, and around the same chip separation. It seems to let more fines through to the filter, which clogs the filter faster. The advantages and disadvantages are small, but of course the baffle costs a whole lot less than the SDD.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

One or the other,
could you send the article to me?
Thanks.


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## History (Dec 22, 2012)

I've seen what Bert and others have done with the HF 2 HP DC and I have allways wondered if operating a motor vertically that was meant to operate horizontally was ok to do. So far from what I've been able to find on the internet for information suggests that it's not ok because a horizontal motor does not have thrust bearings that a vertical motor does. Do not expect the motor to have a full life.


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## scotterman (Apr 1, 2013)

This looks like a great project. I am also interested in your suggestion of a window in the trash can. What did you use to cut the can and how did you fasten the window to the can? Was the window installed just below the baffle?

-scotterman


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## Tenfingers58 (Jan 25, 2011)

The easiest way I've found to cut a garbage can is to drill a 3/8 hole in the corners and cut it with a sabre saw/hand held jig saw. Leaving the lid on the can helps to dampen the noise (some).

Smooth the edges with a file or sandpaper, you don't want sharp edges to cut your dust bag. I use clear bags in the can to make emptying a lot cleaner.

To attach the window I use pl-400 construction adhesive.


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## ssnvet (Jan 10, 2012)

I put a Thein plate in my single stage DC and just emptied the bag and cleaned the filter for the first time last week.

There was almost no large debris in the filter pleats, which is a big imporvement, so the plate is doing what it is supposed to do (which is pretty much the same concept as the wok, or the modified wok/Thein plate hybrid.

There was still quite a bit of fine dust in the pletes, so I'm sure there would be a great deal of benefit from adding a second stage (either a trash can with a Top Hat or Thein seperator, or a cyclone) would be a big benefit.

I'm very space limited, however, and my current set up is one that I can live with.


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## ADHDan (Aug 17, 2012)

This is almost exactly the type of setup I want to make for my DC, eventually. I have the same model. Quick question - how is the motor/impeller suspended? That thing is heavy, and I can't really tell from your picture how you've got it fixed in place.

Great design!


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Dan, if you look to the left you can see that I have two 2×4 and a piece a plywood across on which the blower is bolted down.. I works very well.


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