# holdfast



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

Hi, i built a small work bench with a 3' thick top of laminated 2×4s. i drilled a 3/4" hole for a hoildfast. In the listing it was stated that the holdfast was made for a 3/4: hole. The tool is made from unplated 5/8th" round rod . It wont hold. I textured the shaft and it still wont hold, any suggestions. Hers a picture of the bench thanks Mike


----------



## SMP (Aug 29, 2018)

I don't see a picture of the holdfast in question? Best value is probably Gramercy brand. Have to whack them in on top of the loop with a hammer or mallet a couple times. Do you have a link to the one you bought?


----------



## shampeon (Jun 3, 2012)

You might need to counterbore the underside to reduce the thickness a bit. Since holdfasts work through wedging, the angle you get from thicker bench tops reduces the wedge action. Boring out the bottom with e.g. a 1" bit will allow for more bite.


----------



## rad457 (Jun 15, 2013)

Memory serves me correct, Kiefer's solution for over sized holes was to install copper tubing inserts? Re-drill holes to 3/4" copper tubing then epoxy them in, use some 80 grit sandpaper on your hold-fast to improve the grip?
+ 1 for the Gramercy hold fasts!


----------



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

I looked at the Gramercy but they were out of stock here is a link to the listing
https://www.ebay.com/itm/Woodworking-Holdfast-Holddown-for-3-4-hole-Sold-Individually/324088515113?ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT&_trksid=p2060353.m2749.l2649

I plugged the holes in my bench because they were out of square, I mean way out. I drilled a 3/4" hole in the side of a 2×4 with the drill press so the hole is square, still won't hold, could the pine top be the problem. What about a smaller hole. I have to buy a bit anyway, my cheap forstner bits are to short. This holdfast is recommended for tops atleas 3" thick Thanks mike


----------



## tvrgeek (Nov 19, 2013)

Are you hitting it hard enough? 
It could be deforming the pine and not holding.


----------



## bondogaposis (Dec 18, 2011)

Sandpaper it at right angles to the length, makes a big difference.


----------



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

I jhave textured the shaft with sandpaper and with a center punch. with the punch it does hold a little better but not as it should. Why is it that the people on utube can get them to work but I can't, most have hard wood benches but a few are soft


----------



## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

Given that the second to last picture in the eBay listing says if your bench is too thick, try counter boring (same suggestion as Ian), I'd try that…

After I roughed up the shafts on my gramercy holdfasts mine work fine in a 2.75" thick top. Don't forget to wipe it down with some mineral spirits or denatured alcohol to clean off any oil that might be on them


----------



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

thanks I never thought of oil, ill try the counter bore but according to my research 3" i s the minimum size for holdfasts. Would a smaller hole be ok I can get an 11/16ths bit, and that would allow some compression in the soft wool thanks Mike


----------



## HokieKen (Apr 14, 2015)

I doubt a smaller hole will help. It will probably "guide" the shaft too straight and not allow it to wedge as designed. I really think you probably just need to keep on going with sandpaper. I have had gramercy holdfasts for 2+ years that have worked awesome. Last week, I oiled my benchtop and the next day went to set a holdfast and neither one would set to save my life! A few minutes with some 36 grit sandpaper had them back to work though.

The coarser the paper, the better. Make sure you're going around the shaft and not along it with the paper too. If you go along the shaft, you won't see any improvement. And make sure you sand all the way up into the curve.

Good luck man!


----------



## shampeon (Jun 3, 2012)

This is from the Gramercy site:









Imagine a workbench top thicker than your holdfast is tall, like 10" thick. The holdfast would just sit in the hole and not wedge.

Now imagine a workbench top that is only 1/2" thick. There's not enough wood in the top to effectively create the wedge.

You want enough thickness to have wood for the holdfast to wedge against, but not so much that the wedge angle is too low.

The minimum thickness of the top for holdfasts is NOT 3". That might be more the maximum for 3/4" dog holes, and you're clearly having issues with your holdfasts wedging in. You can counterbore with whatever method you want (large auger bit, plunge router, chisel, etc.), but it has to be enough to allow the holdfast to create an effective wedge angle.


----------



## HokieKen (Apr 14, 2015)

The Ebay listing specifically says "for 1-1/2" or thicker benchtops" so like Ian said, you don't need 3". I don't believe 3" is too much either though but I've been wrong before. I know my bench is about 3-1/2" and the Gramercys work fine at that thickness with 3/4" holes.

BTW, those look like really nice holdfasts for the price based on the Ebay listing. Good choice


----------



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

thanks for the help I'll counter bore


----------



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

I made a test piece, it worked ok. what do you think about an 11/16 hole


----------



## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

I say if it gets you up and running go for it.

I went with 3/4" round dogs so I could use my holdfast in any of the dog holes if I wanted, but truth be told I've never done that yet, in 7 years of having them…


----------



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

]ok


----------



## SMP (Aug 29, 2018)

Try this. Here is a pic of my gramercy ones. Tried to take a pic of the "divot" at the bend. Its just below the bench line, so going to be within the first inch or so of the hole. Maybe you could take a cold chisel/mason chisel and smack the back with a sledge hammer just below that bench line. This divot has kind of a "crater" that grips opposite of where the leverage presses. Hope that makes sense?


----------



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

ok what does that mean


----------



## Sylvain (Jul 23, 2011)

some experimentation:
https://www.lumberjocks.com/topics/303267
unfortunately I didn't get much feedback


----------



## WoodenDreams (Aug 23, 2018)

The type of clamps I use sometimes have a ribbed shaft









Irwin has adapters to use the Quick Grip clamps in 3/4" dog holes.


----------



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

ok I made a hole in the side of a 2×4 this time I left room to clamp to, it didn't work in my vise. I think my vise has some movement in it, it is a lite vise. So i put it over the edge of my new bench and it works fine. Thanks mike


----------



## HokieKen (Apr 14, 2015)

> I say if it gets you up and running go for it.
> 
> I went with 3/4" round dogs so I could use my holdfast in any of the dog holes if I wanted, but truth be told I ve never done that yet, in 7 years of having them…
> 
> - Mosquito


That's surprising Mos. I did the same for my bench but I use my holdfasts in the dog holes constantly. In fact there are no "holdfast holes" just the ones I drilled for dogs. I figured I would add holdfast holes as needed but so far, hasn't been needed.


----------



## Karda (Nov 19, 2016)

I got my drill bit and did the dog holes. I also found my mistake, when I was rapping in the hold fast i hit the top of the curve and the didn't hold then I missed and hit the front of the curve, IT HELD. That was my problem I was hitting it in the wrong place


----------

