# No... I don't WANT to be a woodworker... I AM a woodworker....



## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

While I am frustrated at the comment that was made to me and I realize that connotation is lost in writing sometime… Know that I take it all in stride and laugh.

So… I had a comment made to me. I guess it was more of a question. "So… you think you want to be a woodworker?". At first I hesitated because I felt like it was not really a real question and more just someone taunting me. Yes. this person is a man. But I don't feel like most men are like him. My response… "No". He looked at me a bit puzzled and as he started to make his next comment I replied… "I DID want to be a woodworker… but now…I AM a woodworker." I went on to tell him that I always dreamed of doing this and that over the last year I actually made it happen. The response I got was a roll of the eyes. LOL

So the conversation did continue and I realized that the reason I was asked the question in that way was because this person wanted me to make them something. LOL! Not the best approach.  I guess he thought that if he made me feel like I was not a "real" woodworker that I'd feel challenged and then feel a need to prove myself and commit to something before I thought about it. This person wants me to make them a guitar. I laughed! Just because I am a woodworker… doesn't mean I can make ANYTHING that is made out of wood. And it doesn't mean I think I'm as talented as any other guy out there. I know my limitations. There are certain things I can't do… YET! And there are things that I don't even want to do.

For example… I have no desire to do any kind of wood carving. Or intarsia. Not interested. I think they are totally cool and love to look at others work. But it's not something I'm interested in making myself. And there are other things that I just can't do yet. As I do more and more projects my skills will build and I will venture out to more and more things. A guitar??? I think that takes some skills that I do not yet have. And… I don't know if I want to make a guitar. I'm not doing this to make a living at it. So it is something that I enjoy and I get to choose what I make.

I just think it is funny that this guy thought he could question me that way in order to get me to do what he wanted. But it takes more than that to offend me. And my answer to him was very nice. This guy is an excellent musician. Best voice I ever heard and he is great on the guitar as well. So I told him that the kind of guitar that he'd like and want was something out of my reach at this time. He suggested a class. I told him that if he was willing to pay for the class, the materials and my time… I would certainly think about it. He still sounded interested in me making one for him. Of course… I think that it would be a wiser investment to just spend that money on a nice one. But he still insisted he wanted me to make one. We'll see if he still feels that when he finds out how much it would cost.

So… I definitely know that my work is not that of a find craftsman who has been doing it for years. But I do have a passion for woodworking. This is not a temporary ride to see if I like it. This is something that I plan on always doing. It's not something I see as a career. Yeah, I'd like to make some things and sell them. But that's mostly so that I can buy more tools and more wood. And so that I can get to make more and more things. Eventually… I'll run out of places for the things I make. LOL.

So… NO… I don't want to be a woodworker… *I AM a woodworker!*
And I love it!!!!


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## GaryC (Dec 31, 2008)

You should tell him your initials are LJ and, there are sever thousand of us that will vouch for you.


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## mojapitt (Dec 31, 2011)

And tell them that you have about a hundred big brothers that will make his life miserable if he's mean to you.

And yes, you are a woodworker.


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## 489tad (Feb 26, 2010)

You make things out of wood and you like doing it, I'd say your a woodworker. If you do want to make him something, make him a guitar stand or even a cigar box guitar.


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## kdc68 (Mar 2, 2012)

So… NO… I don't want to be a woodworker… I AM a woodworker!
And I love it!!!!
v
v
And a damn good one at that.
v
One could question him as to why he wants a guitar….does he want to be a musician?


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## woodshaver (Mar 21, 2009)

I think you got this guys number! Every woodworker has a skill level that experience dictates. Some are masters and some are not. some make birdhouses and some make fine furniture. And it's up to the woodworkers to chose what their expertise is. I'm sure if you asked him to make you a record album singing songs that sound just like Bruce Springsteen Elvis or Madonna he would come up with an excuse and maybe see your point. 
You ARE a woodworker and one with insight!


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## fredj (Jun 4, 2013)

Way to go standing up for yourself, and all woodworkers !

I once worked for a man who was highly skilled woodworker. He did make a guitar, and often played it out in front of the shop. I guy walks up and asks to play it, he did and played it well. Afterwards he asked my boss where he got it and who made it all that. After learning he was talked to the maker he asked how much would it cost to have one made. $10,000 was the answer. He replied that it was less than he expected. Don't know if he ever came back and ordered one or not. 
Some rock and some blues guitarists have made their own guitars, Junior Brown (Rockabilly) comes to mind. I guess that makes them woodworkers too.


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## JoeinGa (Nov 26, 2012)

Maybe he thought that if YOU made him a guitar, it would cost LESS than if a MAN made it for him! (You know, all that "political correctness" about women making less then men for the same jobs and all that BS)

And I agree with Monte.. tell him you got about a hundred "Big Brothers" that'll pound him if he gives you any crap


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

LOL! Exactly! I will tell him that.

And yes… I've actually asked him to sing certain songs that the reply was… "that's not in my range". Which was because he has a deep voice and can't do the higher pitches. So yeah… I guess maybe I should ask him if he wants to be a musician… or a singer…. LOL!


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## BillWhite (Jul 23, 2007)

Makes ya wonder if some folks don't understand that words MEAN something.
Might have been said in jest, but the connotation is demeaning at best and stupid at the worst.
You go girl/lady/woman/WOODWORKER.
Bill


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

Oh… and I didn't know the Marc Adams School of Woodworking was so close to me. It's every bit of two hours… but that's not bad.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Angie ,there's always going to be ya hoo's like that around I'm 110% confident that you'll know how to handle them when that kind of dribble comes out of their mouths.


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## Earlextech (Jan 13, 2011)

Angie, Some men are just jerks. This was his way of flirting (by putting you down). I wouldn't give him the time of day after the way he talked to you. As the father of two young women I think you let him off easy. My wife and for sure, my youngest (21) would have put him in his place instantly. You are a woodworker and I am glad to see your posts every time! Keep up the good work.


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## Sanding2day (May 6, 2013)

Nice way to deal with him woodworker Angie… Agree fully with your statements with the possible exception of your "thinking about attending" a class if he paid for it, the materials, and your time… Would personally not need to think very long on that, happily take minimum wage to learn some new techniques  Thanks for sharing the experience… All the best…


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## lumberdog (Jun 15, 2009)

You are a woodworker and a fine one at that.


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## degoose (Mar 20, 2009)

When Sam Maloof was asked what he did… he replied he was a woodworker…


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## huff (May 28, 2009)

Angie;
Loved your response! Keep up your great woodworking!


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## Grumpymike (Jan 23, 2012)

Hey Angie,
A person that makes musical instruments is a *LUTHIER*. 
My son wanted me to make him a guitar a few years ago … a solid body, I told him that I am not a luthier, but I would give it a try as soon as he put up a $3,000 deposit for the materials.
He informed me that he could buy that guitar for $1500 at the music store … So, I remain a woodworker and not a luthier.
You can have some fun with this because Luthier will not show up in a lot of dictionaries, but look up violin makers on line.


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## Momcanfixit (Sep 19, 2012)

Angie - Extech took the words out of my mouth. Sounds like the guy was pulling your pigtails.
If the boys can't take him, let me know 

After I ran my first marathon, a big jock type at work asked me what my time was. I told him, and then he asked 'did you actually train for it?'. I guess you can't fix stupid.


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## GaryC (Dec 31, 2008)

ahhh, Sandra…. you can fix stupid, it's just not legal


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

Since I wasn't there, I guess you know better than anybody how the conversation went, but to be honest, I think there s another possibility, based on what I read, maybe not what you heard. So lets look at another possibility.

Building a guitar takes a lot of skill and craftsmanship. Any musician is going to know that. A musician offering to pay you to make one just doesn't seem like a putdown to me. Even if it wasn't intended, it seems like a huge compliment.

The second is a perception of a woodworker. I've been working with wood since before I can remember. I still don't consider myself a woodworker. But I do honestly believe I can make anything if its made out of wood. To me a woodworker is someone who makes a living dong woodworking. He's the guy who builds the guitar, even though he has no desire to build a guitar. It has nothing to do with the quality of the craftsmanship. He could be a good woodworker or a bad woodworker, quality or craftsmanship has nothing to do with it.

So if I asked if you wanted to be a real woodworker, and could I commission you to build me a guitar, it certainly would be meant as a compliment.

lets face it, you wrote a great write up, well thought out, good grammar, god spelling, etc, but that doesn't make you a writer, right?

Don't get me wrong, the guy could still be a jerk. But you'll need to write more onto it to convince me.

Thats just my consorted way of thinking.


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## SQLandWoo (Jan 19, 2010)

I hear you! The nerve of some people. I would have told him if he wanted a guitar so much, get off his rear end and go do the classes himself.


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## JollyGreen67 (Nov 1, 2010)

Angie: Tell him we have his number.


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## Momcanfixit (Sep 19, 2012)

Jimbo - hysterical signature. I love it.


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## fge (Sep 8, 2008)

Angie, his insistence on you building him a guitar may be him trying to establish some ongoing interaction with you. Only so much can be gathered from your words, but since you know him, and you experienced the conversation, is it possible he has a crush on you. When I was younger I would tease with girls I liked. Many times likely saying somethingor doing something iI would later regret and wonder "now why did I say that, I must have sounded goofy". Of course I have no idea this guys intentions and you would know best. I just thought it as a possibilty.


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## mtenterprises (Jan 10, 2011)

Ah you can never tell where these things may lead. He just may bite and you will learn a new skill.
A story.
Years ago a friend brought me a violin to repair, she had great confidence in me. I really wasn't interested in doing it and didn't think I had the skills to do it so I just put it away in the shop. Every time we met she asked about her violin and all I would say was I was thinking about it. Well after about a year she showed up at my shop with a library book on building violins and said learn how to fix it. So I read the book and with great trepidation I started the repairs and actually finished the repair and was quite proud of myself when she strung it up and played it and she said that I did a great job. This coming from a musician selected to play in our local philharmonic orchestra. After that I repaired a couple more violins and a couple bows also.
So you just never know. Keep an open mind.
MIKE


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## NormG (Mar 5, 2010)

Sounds like you handled it very diplomatically, wonderful job and hand him a baggie of saw dust


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

Here's the deal…. The guy is a jerk. And yes he has a crush on me. After knowing him and being a part of the conversation… He was taunting me. Not as much of an insult as a manipulation. It would be very expensive for him to pay me to build this thing. And he does not part with his money easily. And… He likes things a certain way… So if he was willing to pay me… It means he thinks I'd do a good job. A very good job.

This guy is irritated by the fact that I'm a woman. I'm a single mom of four. I do not have a college degree…. Yet I own my own home, I'm not on welfare and I've managed to make a long time dream of mine come true…. Without the help of a man. He obviously sees some talent or he wouldn't be willing to spend the money. He just thought that by questioning me the way he did… That I'd be all to eager to prove that I was a woodworker and get me to do it for way less. Test me… He's a jerk…. Regardless of his motives. Lol.

Oh… And when I say I made my long time dream come true without the help of a man… That's not totally true. I had the help of many men right here on LJ's. many of them guys that have commented on this very post. I've received tips, inspiration, knowledge, suggestions, opinions, encouragement…. And even some wood and coupons. This place has been an important part of my journey and a big part of why I can call myself a woodworker.

As far as making a living at it… Who knows… Maybe someday ill have my own little boutique store in Downton Madison. If you don't know much about Madison…. It's a historic town and we get lots of tourists. Lots of visitors from Cincy, Louisville and Indy. They like to come here and spend big bucks. So who knows… But for now… Lol. I gotta get my bench done and go from there. Lol


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

Lol! I'd like to give him a Baggie of sawdust. That would actually be pretty funny 

Like I said originally…. It frustrated me… But I didn't let it get to me. It just made me think. And when people ask me what I do for a living… My reply actually is that I'm an office manager AND that I've recently taken up woodworking. It's just part of who I am now. And I love it!!!


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## jumbojack (Mar 20, 2011)

From what Ive seen you are a woodworker and you CAN make a guitar. They are not much more than a box attached to a stick. Sure it is a special box and kind of a special stick, but a box and a stick none the less. Now I am not saying you should build a guitar, what I am saying is you COULD build a guitar.


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

I'm thinking…. If he wants to pay me to do it… I can't lose. It would be cool to take any woodworking class. And one on guitars would surely be full of things that I'd use for other projects.

I am going to do this though…. I'm going to make him a pick holder. I seen Steve on WWMM make one and I've wanted to make one every since. This would be a good opportunity.

And know this…. When I say this guy is a jerk… Lol… I say it laughing. We get along just fine but he knows that I think he is arrogant and a manipulator. But I've known him for a while and I can handle him and his personality just fine. Lol. It deeply annoys this man that he can't get under my skin.


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## RonInOhio (Jul 23, 2010)

Those guitar builds are very time consuming from what I have seen. And you usually
need some specialty tools and jigs.

I would love to build one for myself, but would probably do a kit first, before attempting to do one
from scratch.


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

I'm thinking he must have done some research on it because he mentioned the specialty tools. And apparently there is a class in Louisville that he knows about.


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## RonInOhio (Jul 23, 2010)

It would definitely be something intriguing. If you got the training , luthiers demand quite a bit 
for handmade guitars.


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## woodcox (Nov 21, 2012)

cbg 








high road is more satisfying.
Good luck with the pick holder.


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## bowedstraight (Jul 18, 2013)

he needs is twig sawed off


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## Blackie_ (Jul 10, 2011)

Ah so the story unfolds and the blot thickens, Angie you do wonderful woodwork, and after reading your comment about him being a jerk and what he is to you I agree with Sam, I wouldn't give him the time or day, if he offers to pay for your schooling that'd be a kind and generous offer but then you have to think about his intentions and motives what does he want and expect in return? More then just a guitar? Would you have a since of obligation too him?


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

If he paid for the lessons and the materials and my time making it… I'd feel obligated to make him the best guitar I could.


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## jeffswildwood (Dec 26, 2012)

Angie you do fit the my definition of a wood worker. If you "work" in wood, you are a wood worker. By work, how can that be the right word when it's so much fun! From my most simple to my complicated projects I love every minuet of it and I see you do too. I love the look on peoples faces when I present my work and I bet you do too. I put my heart into every project and strive to improve and do it better and I can tell you do also. So ignore the snide comments and just keep doing what you love, making saw dust! Keep up the good work, woodworker!


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

Angie,
I know you said this guy is a jerk, half smiling. I think the guy truly has a crush, an attraction, a__, whatever you want to call it. IMO (my polarized opinion) is that this guy is totally frustrated that he cannot figure out what really makes you tick. I do not think he is picking on you for the sake of picking, he just CANNOT for the likes of himself figure out how to communicate with you in a mutually meaningful way.

Geez! I would ask every man here on LJs to wave their hand if this EVER happened to them in their younger lives, but I do NOT want to set off ANOTHER Hurricane "Sandy", or "Irene", etc. from the winds created by all of those men fessing up… *;-)*

That said, IMO, it would probably be better to avoid further in-depth conversations with him, contractually or otherwise, in order to not play on his 'misdirected' feelings. In the long run you both would probably appreciate that line drawn in the sand. Just sayin'...


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

Jeffswildwood…. I agree with what you said… I love every minute of what I do when I'm woodworking. It doesn't matter if its the bench I'm building, the mini picnic table…. Or repairing my kitchen chair. I love it. It's amazing to finish a project and look back on it and know…. I did that 

Mike…. You are probably right


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## JoeinGa (Nov 26, 2012)

Hey, maybe one day out in your shop you might just decided to MAKE a guitar! Might take 6 days, 6 months, or 6 years. Dont tell anybody… just make it and take it to him and say "Is this what you had in mind?"

I'd bet his jaw would hit the ground.


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## Momcanfixit (Sep 19, 2012)

I have to say that I completely agree with Mike's take on it after reading the rest of the story. Sounds like his offer may have strings attached, pardon the pun.

Many women (myself included) get into the habit of trying to prove themselves. We feel the need to show that we are capable enough, strong enough etc. The urge to do that can even override our good sense and gut instinct.
If your gut is telling you that he's a jerk, don't let your pride convince you otherwise…..

Go sistah!!


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

Joe… LOVE that idea. Lol.

Sandra… I think the whole way he approached me was because he thought I'd want to prove it to him at all costs. He probably thought I'd just jump in and agree to it and not think twice about the cost or anything… Just that I'd want to prove it so is do anything. However… That's not happening. If I was to make a guitar for him… It would cost him dearly and it would be well worth my time. So if he was willing to agree to my terms… Of course I'd do it.

Of course… Lol… I still like joein10asee's idea best. Lol


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## JoeinGa (Nov 26, 2012)

YEAAAAAAAH! Score "1" for me!


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## bondogaposis (Dec 18, 2011)

This whole thread reminds of an old saying, 
"Why does the Frenchman kiss the lady's hand? Because he has to start somewhere."


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

LOL!


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## kdc68 (Mar 2, 2012)

I like HMike's comment as well.

I think the guy truly has a crush, an attraction, a, whatever you want to call it. IMO (my polarized opinion) is that this guy is totally frustrated that he cannot figure out what really makes you tick. I do not think he is picking on you for the sake of picking, he just CANNOT for the likes of himself figure out how to communicate with you in a mutually meaningful way.

But to some extent, it can work both ways….probably not in this case…but then again…hmmm


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## fge (Sep 8, 2008)

I like the old saying Bondo quoted. It might have good merit.


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## mojapitt (Dec 31, 2011)

Don't do it for someone else's benefit, do it for yours. That being said, I really could use a trip to do a whooping. Sure I could enlist some help. Disrespecting ladies and LJs won't be tolerated.


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

Oh… I wouldn't do it unless it was for my benefit. Not for this kinda guy anyways. Lol. 
If it was for someone else… I'd be more than willing. I have a dear friend that has made several comments about what I've been doing and she is very supportive. I have made her a project and would refuse to let her give me a dime. I can't wait to finish that project.


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

Lol! Just picturing having all my LJ buddies over in my backyard and this guy coming over and walking back there… ROFL! How fun would that be? I bet he'd high-tail it out of there pretty quick.  (you should see the devilish grin on my face right now


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## TimRoman (Jul 4, 2013)

Angie,

You mentioned the Marc Adams school being near you. I highly recommend it. It's a wonderful facility and they have classes of all types and at all skill levels. They even usually have a guitar-making class there at least one a year. Maybe you should tell your friend he should go and build one himself. 

I took a week-long cabinet-making class there in 2010 and I'm headed back in just over a week for another class, this time to build an arts-and-crafts style entry table. I wish I lived as close as you do. I have to drive there from Maryland.

I've had a few people try to get me to build things for them but I've made it clear that I have a HUGE project list for my own home and for my immediate family members. If they continue to push, I quote them a price that is SO high that they just shut up about it. Maybe someday one of them will agree to pay the outrageous price and I'll switch from being an amateur to a professional.


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

I would love to take some classes there. I want to take some online classes too. I've heard a lot of great things about the Charles Neil classes. I can't remember who mentioned taking his classes on finishing.


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## TimRoman (Jul 4, 2013)

I don't know anything about Charles Neil. I took a one day seminar at Marc Adams' school with Mitch Kohanek on finishing. I learned more about finishing in that one day class than I had in all the years before. It was the first time anybody ever clearly explained what the instructions on those cans REALLY mean and which ones I could ignore. I still don't really enjoy finishing but it no longer scares me like it use to do.

Either way, check out Marc's website and I'm sure you'll find a class worth taking. You are close enough to take a weekend or one-day class to start.


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## 69BBNova (May 1, 2012)

I've been thinking about this thread since you posted…

I've only read the first few posts, but people like him have bothered me my whole life…

So I think you should get the plans and keep them with you at all times in case you come across this POS and offer him to build it under your watchful eye using your equipment and ask him if a few of your Lumberjock buddys can hang out to watch him until its up to snuff…

And as for myself I consider myself a newbe concerning woodworking


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## DonBroussard (Mar 27, 2012)

@Angie-Can you please make me a guitar? I like your style, and I think your answer was just great. I enjoy your thoughtful posts. You're kind of like the Erma Bombeck of Woodworking!


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## AngieO (Jul 9, 2012)

I definitely will end up taking a class at Marc Adams. I was looking at the schedule for Sept and Oct. It's a lot of money for a single mom to come up with. I know it will be worth it though. And yes… I did see that they have a guitar class once a year. They've already had the first session for this years.

In the meantime… I'm going to be doing some of Charles Neil's classes.

69BBNova… that is an excellent idea as well. LOL

Don… Thanks! And I would love to. LOL I think the classes at Marc Adams are probably around $750. LOL


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## TimRoman (Jul 4, 2013)

I happened to start a class at Marc Adams' on the same day they were finishing up a guitar-making class back in 2010. As you would expect, most of those who were making guitars also play guitars. I was impressed with the quality of the work from those in the class, including a few who claimed it was their first woodworking project EVER. During a break in our class, we were treated to a group of them jamming on their new (but unfinished) guitars, which all sounded very good.


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## reedwood (Jan 27, 2011)

AngieO, AngieO….I love you so. The Cars.

ah….love is in the air. smells like woodchips.


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## fge (Sep 8, 2008)

I wonder what kind of market there is for selling custom made guitars. My wife would love that class if I could send her to it.


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