# Cutting Rail Road Ties???



## newwoodbutcher (Aug 6, 2010)

I'm planning to build a 120 ft three tie high retaining wall as well as a few road curbs flower beds and steps with RR Ties. What 's the best tool for cutting the ties? I'm thinking that using a chainsaw will ruin the chain at some considerable cost. I cut one with a sawzall but it wasn't easy or very accurate. I'm thinking a 12" circular saw or a portable band saw from Craig's List might be my best choice. I'm thinking the pitch and sand in the ties will dull any blade pretty quickly. Is it worth it to buy cheap carbide blades and just plan on wasting them? Or steel blades? What are you folks experience? Any advice would be appreciated


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## Dal300 (Aug 4, 2011)

A 20" chain for a chain saw is about $14. Can you buy any other blade any cheaper and sharpen it repeatedly?

There's no easy way to cut coated ties.

One thing I should mention, check with the local authorities.

When I lived on US2 in Montana and used old ties for a retaining wall on the front yars, the state made me get rid of it because of the chemicals in the wood.


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## newwoodbutcher (Aug 6, 2010)

So you would use a chain saw? How long will it cut before it needs to be sharpened/replaced?


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

Most guys who do a lot of this use a 16" Japanese 
beam saw. You can do it with a chain saw too.
Be prepared to sharpen your blade and be aware 
you might distort the edge channels on the bar.


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## Lifesaver2000 (Nov 17, 2009)

Over the years I have installed hundreds of old railroad ties in building parking lots and campsite areas, and we always used a chain saw to cut them. If you are using used ties, it pays to look each one over in the area you plan to cut to remove small rocks, and also look for the occasional piece of iron. As I recall, we could go a day on one sharpening if we didn't hit any major rocks or anything.


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

You can keep a chain pretty sharp touching it up with a file. If you are careful and keep it consistent, it will start cutting a curve. Use a guide if necessary or you haven't done much filing.


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## lunn (Jan 30, 2012)

The chemicals in the wood burns your skin !!! iI built a wall outta them on a hot day wearing shorts using a chainsaw. Sure glad the lake was near by. Lesson learned the hard way.


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## newwoodbutcher (Aug 6, 2010)

Thak you all. I wouldn't have thought the chainsaw was the best choice all on my own.


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## Grandpa (Jan 28, 2011)

Wear a helmet with a face shield when doing this. ties get gravel pressed into them since they lay on a gravel bed when in use to hold rails. You will encounter an ocassional gravel and it can be thrown by the chain. I agree that the chain saw is the best tool.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Ken
As a contractor who has replaced a good number of retaining walls made out of rail road ties I would advise against using them at all. The retaining walls I've replaced were full of carpenter ants. I would suggest using ground contact pressure treated 2×12's or what ever size works for your project or use the concrete retaining wall blocks.


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## gfadvm (Jan 13, 2011)

Guys that install tie walls use a chainsaw motor with a special 'tie cutter' circular blade. I have rented these and they work really well. Call around your local tool rental places. You will dull/ruin a chain in minutes cutting railroad ties.


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## FatherHooligan (Mar 27, 2008)

Used to heat my home with ties (long time ago in very rural area…the deer never seemed to mind), and used a 24" saw blade mounted on a steel frame and driven from the tractors power take off. You can cut a mess of ties and once you've cut a truckload of ties you need a break so you touch up the blade. It worked great, when I moved I gave the saw to a buddy. As far as I know he's still using it.


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## FloridaCracker (Mar 28, 2017)

I just about fishned a small retaing wall for visible end i used a skill saw cut all the way around then finished with a reciprocating saw. Then I cleaned off the saw marks only the vertical post left to install


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## AMZ (Jan 27, 2020)

Chai saw! Easy to touch up the chain, as long as you don't run into the metal inserted into each end or into dirt.


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## therealSteveN (Oct 29, 2016)

> Ken
> As a contractor who has replaced a good number of retaining walls made out of rail road ties I would advise against using them at all. The retaining walls I ve replaced were full of carpenter ants. I would suggest using ground contact pressure treated 2×12 s or what ever size works for your project or use the concrete retaining wall blocks.
> 
> - a1Jim


I agree 100% with this. Railroad ties, at least the ones that become available for sale, are the cast offs after the rail line they are on decides they are no longer serviceable. I have a Nephew who collects them for a company. He's said he wouldn't think of putting one of those bug infested timbers anywhere near a place he called home. Your treated wood products, and the concrete blocks you will be the first owner.

If you decide to stay with the ties, I haven't seen this use of a chainsaw to cut them, that others seem to have. Timber framers, are either using a 2 man push pull saw, or one of these.

There is the Skill Sawsquatch, shown, and Makita has one called the Bigfoot, both are 16" + or -. A straight true line can be made. I cannot imagine the mess a chainsaw could make.

https://www.amazon.com/SKILSAW-SPT70V-11-SUPER-SAWSQUATCH-Circular/dp/B077SJGDWS


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## ibewjon (Oct 2, 2010)

Add possible fire ants and termites. The ties come from all over the country. Tried ties years ago, never again. Their life is about over when replaced, so I would add a little money and go new timbers, or concrete. Railroad ties are used on a bed of stone that drains. Buried in soil, they rot in a few years.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

And….they used Creosote to treat them…..think HOT tar, pressure infused into the wood. There are 4 such relics sitting along a former alleyway between my backyard, and the neighbor's yard…..they are warping and splitting, and anything but straight. 
YMMV…but…



























Not that old…holes for the spikes were pre-drilled…


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## FloridaCracker (Mar 28, 2017)

The new treated lumber wont last nearly as long been there tried that. If you buy the really old rail road timbers there no good. Make sure you get the solid timbers 8 foot they should be in the range of 300 lbs a piece. If not there old you can see in my picture, solid wood I cut most of the ends. 10 footers don't stay under the track as long and they are heaver cant say I see any bug infestation but I only buy the good one not the crap at the feed store. The new pressure treated wood its rotten in 5 years. if in contact with the ground in Florida. On the farm I grew up on we had these at the gates and corners to all the pastures.


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## FloridaCracker (Mar 28, 2017)

If it a permanent wall I say concrete. Remember if using wood you need to use a ground barrier and rock behind for drainage. Now the old arsenic pressure treated wood lasted this new stuff does not.


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## FloridaCracker (Mar 28, 2017)

> The chemicals in the wood burns your skin !!! iI built a wall outta them on a hot day wearing shorts using a chainsaw. Sure glad the lake was near by. Lesson learned the hard way.
> 
> - lunn


Never had that reaction before. I have had similar reaction when cutting a Chinese tallow tree its an allergic reaction.


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## CaptainKlutz (Apr 23, 2014)

+1 Chainsaw for cutting.

+1 Don't use old ties. 
Only buy/use fresh unused ties for any project you want to last more than 5 years.

+1 Used ties have gravel embedded. It hurts like hell when stones are ripped out by chainsaw and then embed in your legs.

+1 The tar/oil preservation chemicals are dangerous. 
Keep skin covered, and wear dust and face protection when cutting. 
Furthermore: Your clothes will need to burned when job is done, as the stuff doesn't wash out - unless you soak/scrub them in kerosene for 24 hours first.

Only 3 tiers high? Hmm,
FWIW: Vertical walls (wood/concrete doesn't matter) holding back soil need to be stoutly anchored into position. 
- The first 1-3 layers need to have rebar stakes driven 12" below frost line to prevent movement.
- Must have dead-man supports embedded behind wall into soil to overcome water pressure from wet ground. 








Picture borrowed from: https://www.thisoldhouse.com/yards/21015197/engineering-a-retaining-wall

General rule of thumb I was taught for timber wall was 2 feet deep support behind wall for every foot of wall height. Need dead-man every 4 feet along wall, starting on 3rd tier high.

The longevity of wall be increased if you lay it on gravel foundation, and include drainage behind wall to reduce hydraulic pressure. This greatly increases the length of time before termites/ants find your yummy wall.

Can buy commercial wire and steel rod anchors to use a dead-man, which reduces the amount of digging behind wall.

One last tip: 
Timber stair steps are BAD idea as they don't last very long. 
In wet/snow conditions they are like walking on greased concrete. Is total PIA to shovel snow off of timber steps. The don't tolerate rock salt or ice melting compounds, and degrade after one season of de-icing. The constant action of sand/gravel/dirt being ground into surface as people use them, makes for quick degradation. They also have to be stoutly anchor into ground (like a wall) and attached to each other, or they move. Need to pay careful attention to water drainage around stair steps, and embed drain pipe next to stairs to prevent entire stair case from lifting or sliding down hill. 
Every set of timber stairs I have installed was replaced within 5 years with either poured concrete (when behind a timber wall), or replaced with conventional pressure treat stair riser and pressure treated steps that lifted wood off the ground.

#IAMAKLUTZ, not an expert: but have installed dozen timber retaining walls for myself/friends/family in my lifetime. They look cool when built properly, but will never be installed in a home I intend to live more than a few years.

As always, YMMV

Thanks for reading and Best Luck.


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## FloridaCracker (Mar 28, 2017)

Wow i thought we had temite problems. For us they last termits dont like them here better eating everywhere. I have small retaing wall in fl There is definitely a big difference with the new pressure treated. Old ties are crap The ties I buy look like solid oak could slice them up into boards. I have cut some in half long ways.


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## therealSteveN (Oct 29, 2016)

This is what I got when I googled, Used railroad ties, where to buy.

Keep in mind my Nephew is employed by the National Salvage & Service Corporation. The new ones, are the most recent ones he's drug in. Bandit showed a picture of what a "new" railroad tie looks like.


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## farmfromkansas (Jun 16, 2019)

I went to a class on installing the concrete retaining walls. You dig a ditch, and put gravel in it, then lay the concrete blocks on that, and you also backfill the wall with a few inches of gravel. The purpose of the gravel is to allow water to flow through the wall without tipping the retaining wall over. This system will last a life time. Worn out railroad ties have a life of maybe a few years. Using gravel under and between dirt and ties would add to their life, but they are basically used up when the railroad is done with them.


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