# Bait and switch sales tactics?



## scamp238

Sounds like business as usual. Anything to get your dollars from your wallet to theirs. I try not to fall for that stuff, but I am human. I guess you can chalk this up to a lesson learned.


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## TheOldTimer

I think magazine subscriptions are in the toilet so they are trying to make money wherever they can.


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## americanwoodworker

Ever look at the old woodworking magazines. I mean like 20+ years old. They have alot of content in them. Lots of projects, jigs, stories, interviews etc.. Now look at todays and all you see is ads, Ads, ADS! You pay $5.00 an issue to see about two or three projects, a couple of tips and tricks and thats it.

Issues like what you describe is why I don't participate with these companies. To much about getting our money and not enough in giving good high quality content.


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## TropicalWW

I'm in the same boat as you, and I have to say, I'm glad to see that I'm not the only one that felt the same way you do.

I've been in touch with the powers that be at PWW regarding both the Roy issue and the content issue. They have been very receptive to feedback, and extended offers to try to level things out a bit. Unfortunately, the offers that we're extended to me are still out of my price range given the fact that I'm heading out for a major cross country move tomorrow. Maybe for someone else, the offer would work, but for me, right now, I have no choice but to stay with what I've got, or cancel the service all together.

I truly believe the guys and gals at PWW are stand up people. They want to put out a good product, and they want to produce content that people want. My only real issue with the recent exchanges that i've had with PWW were more on the content side than pricing.

Anyone that is currently signed up for ShopClass on Demand will know that in recent weeks, there have been video clips released on various turning topics with Steve Shanesy. My issue with these clips was two fold. First, the most recent clips is nothing more than a 7 min. infomercial for the Wolverine Jig, and second, the clips that are being released as "new" content are the first three chapters from a full DVD that was already availible on the site for download. It's as if they thought they could re-release the same content and no one would notice! The OP's comment about the new releases not being up to par with what was originally on the site when we signed up were right on the money.

Anyway, I don't think PWW did a bait and switch. I think they got caught off guard with the whole Roy thing. Everyone got so excited about being able to bring the Roy content to the masses, that no one thought about the people that were under the impression that they were making a long term commitment just a few months earlier.

This whole experience hasn't soured me on PWW, but maybe Shop Class isn't for me. There are just too many good bloggers out there doing free stuff or good subscription stuff to waste money on waiting every two weeks just to get content that was already availible.


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## syeret

I found myself in the same situation, fully agree with you.


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## TheOldTimer

I have canceled all but two of my woodworking magazines for the reasons that americanwoodworker above described. Most of the magazines are concentrated on advertising and tool revues. The content of most of them are repeated year after year. The same old content, the same old stories on why and how to do this and that task. SawStop articles are beaten to death in all of them. The two magazines that I elected to keep contain no advertising. It just does not make sense to me to pay $35.00 dollars per year for a magazine that is plump full of advertising.


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## BenI

My sister bought me a years subscription to PWW for Christmas and I like it so far. They have some good projects but I definitely understand where you're coming from, they have a fair amount of ads.

*OldTimer*, if you don't mind sharing, which magazines are you subscribed to that have no ads? Curious and looking at maybe asking for more subscriptions for birthday, etc.


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## thedude50

this is why i have my dvr set to record all the shows and then i rip them to dvd it is just me doing the right thing


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## TheOldTimer

BenI:

Woodsmith & Shop Smith. They are geared more for the beginner but they have some good Ideas.


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## REK

Well I know for a fact that it is a communist plot to get your money. 60 bucks to watch videos that have already been paid for by pbs underwriters…It takes one computer tech to keep up the servers and maybe a staff of 1 or 2 to program the content and keep the web site alive, for 50 buck a year someone is rolling in the dough…Almost sounds like a government program. Save your money and watch Stumpy Nubbs!!!


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## lumberjoe

Bob, not even close. Do you have any idea what high availability infrastructure hosting costs? In order to let multiple people view content at the same time with the same performance, you need some beefy gear in a data center with some pretty beefy gear (redundant electricity from separate grids, back-up generators that can run for days, fully redundant access and core layer networks if you are doing it right). That does not count bandwidth. A FULL DS3 costs about 10k per month from a tier I or tier II provider.. A website or web service with a lot of streaming traffic may require multiple.
Also I fail to see how this is bait and switch. When you signed up, the content your are now excited about was not even on the site. If you chose not to subscribe to the additional content, you still get the same thing you signed up for at the same price (unless i am missing something). This would be the same thing as claiming you cable company is ripping you off because you are paying for basic cable and don't get HBO


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## TroutStalker

Joe,

I guess I should have been more explicit. When I signed up I was promised that the price would never change and all future content would be included. That was true until recently; they usually add a couple of videos each week. With the wodright's shop they created a new 'special' channel and asked for $60 more for a six month subscription. Hence, I consider it bait (the promise that any new content would be included) and switch (putting new content in a new special channel).

Also, I agree with you that there is considerable expense involved in setting up the infrastructure for delivering video content. However, they had already setup the infrastucture for the previous videos. Hence, other than possibly needing more bandwith, they had no additional infrastrucure expenses to add the woodright's shop.


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## lumberjoe

If you were promised all future content included in that price, I agree with you. I'm sure they found a way around it by claiming it's some sort of premium service and non-premium members will still get additional content, however that is sticking way to close to the letter of the law and shying away from the spirit of it. I choose not to continue or even begin to to business with such companies.


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## rpaul1

I am also disappointed with the quality of content and pricing of PWW both magazine and website offerings. I subscribe to fine woodworking, wood, woodcraft, American woodworker, woodworkers journal and Canadian woodworker. The popular woodworking prices and recycled content are by far the worst combination of highest price and least value. Unlike some of you, I can,t even get a reply from customer service on how to download an ebook that I purchased, but will not download on any computer or device I've tried. I have to say I won't be sending them any more of my money.


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