# Tablesaw comparison help



## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

First off, holy hell are these cabinet/contractor saws expensive. I still haven't replaced mine since the tornado took out my house last year. Got all the legal paperwork out of the way to start my business though and now I desperately need a good saw. I've looked through so many brands and need some help from others now. Is Sawstop worth the money? Should I just go with a Delta or Laguna and call it good? Or will a Ridgid do just as well as the rest of them for a 1/3 the cost? I'm also buying a new miter saw, but that seems to be down to the ridgid 12" or the dewalt.

1500-3000 for a sawstop. I know the safety factor is there, but what if it misfires? $150 down the drain easy. Has anyone seen this happen?

900-1400 for a good Laguna or Delta saw.

599 for the Orange Store special from Ridgid.


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## daddywoofdawg (Feb 1, 2014)

sawstop
laguna
delta
ridgid
would be my choices in order


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## Tedstor (Mar 12, 2011)

You're starting a woodworking business? 
That would immediately disqualify the Ridgid for me. Too many potential alignment and quality issues. If I were looking at big box specials, I'd be looking at the Delta from Lowes. 
But a cabinet saw would be my choice if I were making my living with it. Even if I bought used. 
I'd skip Laguna and look at Delta, Sawstop, or Powermatic. I'd look into JET as well, although in many cases JET doesn't offer a lot for the money (IMO). A good sale price might change that equation though.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

It's a hobby business. Wife told me I had to recoup the cost of tools. I'll definitely be able to do that. I work out of the garage so I need to be semi-mobile.


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## Joel_B (Aug 14, 2014)

Don't buy Delta unless it was made in USA.
(not a new one).
Even then if you need parts its going to be a problem.
I say this because I recently had a bad experience with a Delta product and their customer service.
That doesn't mean you will.
I'm sure a Delta saw can be made to work really well but if it was me I would look elsewhere.


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## jmartel (Jul 6, 2012)

If you're going to spend ~$1000, I'd buy a Grizzly cabinet saw.

http://www.grizzly.com/products/10-Hybrid-Table-Saw-with-Riving-Knife-Polar-Bear-Series/G0715P

if you don't have/want to put in 220V, or

http://www.grizzly.com/products/10-3-HP-240V-Cabinet-Left-Tilting-Table-Saw/G1023RL

If you have it or can put it in.


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## bonesbr549 (Jan 1, 2010)

Ok if this is your business then Sawstop! you mention a firing of cartridge costing 150. Big deal if it's saving your fingers / hand. The cost of an accident could reach 250k.

Quality wise top notch. Feel the pain once! Rigid should not be in the same conversation. I had a griz for 10 years and it served me well, but no comparrison to the SS.

Finally if you will be doing it as a business I would reccomend the ICS. Again, if you average the initial cost over the life of the saw, it's not that much.

That's my two cents worth, but then that and a buck fifty will get you a cup of coffee. Good luck!


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## rantingrich (Sep 19, 2014)

If I had the scratch I would definitely get the SAWSTOP. I have done a lot of reading and almost all the misfires are from small items of metal in the wood. Such as a staple usually in the end of a board. Most folks that have what they consider a misfire later sees a spot or even tiny bit of blood on their finger so they actually did touch the blade.

But yea a new BRAKE will cost you. Better you loose a little money than a hand or fingers. ALSO the blade will be cashed as well.

America, being what it is, I suspect every table saw manufacture will have to install a SAWSTOP devise or install another sort or devise after all this goes through the courts. Increasing a base model table saw as mush as double what they are now.

Also anyone with employees or students or any other person other than themselves using Their table saw would be a fool to not use a SAWSTOP.

Their Attorney would destroy you in court


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## RichardHillius (Oct 19, 2013)

The Sawstop is built as well as any other cabinet saw out there. Yea it's more money but there is quality there in addition to the safety features. It's a personal choice rather that quality and safety is worth the premium price or not. I think there is a general myth about the number of false triggers that happen on these things as well. My school has 4 of them used 7 days a week by students and there wasn't a single false trigger that I know of this semester. Yea it does happen but it's without question a result of someone doing something they shouldn't have been doing in the first place like cutting though a miter fence. And when they do go off for a good reason they are worth every little bit of extra money they cost. And it's not even a question of you pushing your fingers though the blade either, things like kickback loosing your footing or pieces shifting/breaking can cause your hands to move into places you never planned for them to go.

I won't say there are no other high quality cabinet saw brands on the market that are worth buying because there are and I don't like how the braking system is being litigated into our lives as I think it should be a personal decision not one made for us by attorney's but it is a great well built saw overall.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

I had almost an Identical comment to make as Richard except the school I teach out of has three saw stops and during the day they are in use by students from the Jr high and high school.If I remember right it 2years worth of use they have been triggered twice ,one for a students finger and once for one of my adult students using wet wood.
In my opinion you should not be worrying about $150 for a blade and cartage but instead about the $20,000 hand surgery and posable loss of a hand or fingers and months of therapy and lost of income.
If you want a saw that will last long term,don't play around with toy saws buy a SAWSTOP ICS and have a lifetime saw(barring tornadoes ),


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## intelligen (Dec 28, 2009)

If you're not buying a SawStop and have time to wait and watch Craigslist for deals, you can probably save yourself several hundred bucks on a cabinet saw. In the meantime you can try to get by with other tools. For example, it's easier to cut sheet goods with a circular saw or track saw anyway. Also some communities have wood shops that the public can use. Check for a local makerspace or college/university woodshop. Or if you haven't already, check with a local woodworking club to see if anyone knows of some resources you can use to get started.

The replacement SawStop brake is free if you send it in and they confirm that it fired due to flesh contact.

If you're concerned about misfires on a piece of green or wet wood, do a test cut in bypass mode with your hands far away from the blade. If the light flashes red during or immediately after the cut, then the brake would have fired if the saw wasn't in bypass mode. Other misfires can be caused by staples or nails, or unintentionally cutting into some thing metal that your hand is also touching (e.g., a miter gauge with a metal fence).

Also, a common misconception is that you have to remember to take the saw out of bypass mode. This is not true. As soon as the blade stops moving after a cut in bypass mode, the safety system will automatically go back to normal operation. If you want to make a second cut in bypass mode after the blade spins down, you have to go through the sequence to enable bypass mode again.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

Ok I am such a cheapskate when it comes to spending money, but I really think I'm leaning towards the Sawstop now. The warranty says it only covers 1 year though.


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## jmartel (Jul 6, 2012)

If you're getting a Sawstop, I'd buy the cabinet saw version. Either the 1.75hp one or the 3hp version.


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## DrDirt (Feb 26, 2008)

If you are doing this as a business - Sawstop is the ONLY rational way to go.

BTW - - with a home business - you will need Business insurance.

Your homeowners insurance will NOT cover tools or accidents on "site" because it is a business…even a hobby business, not "Personal Property"

If someone/anyone will EVER help you in your shop… a possible misfire or a 150 dollar pop is NOTHING compared to the costs and legal bills if someone gets hurt.

That part is just a sad fact of our society…. but State farm flat out tells us that if the tools in the shop are used for the business they nor the shop are covered.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

Yeah, I've already looked into the commercial insurance. Also have to file for my sales tax permit still. But I wanted to get this going in case I do end up having to take off work while I'm going to school. I could build enough to supplement my monthly income pretty easily. Just have to hope it sells quickly. I've been working with a few local interior designers and a couple store fronts to try and get stuff moving quickly once I get everything started up.


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## Tedstor (Mar 12, 2011)

Interesting. Two or thee years ago, I'd guess that half the LJ community poo-poo'd Sawstop. Admittedly, I was among them. But times seemed to have changed. Looks like the Sawstop haters are in the minority these days. My attitude has changed too. Price is the only thing keeping me from owning a Sawstop. But if I ever decide to upgrade to a high-end saw…...I think Sawstop will be the top of my list.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

I have the money, but I just absolutely hate spending money unless its on the wife. She's actually for the sawstop also because she'd rather me keep all my fingers. I'm just cheap. I know with the business I should get most of it back as a write off through the next few years.


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## RichardHillius (Oct 19, 2013)

> Interesting. Two or thee years ago, I d guess that half the LJ community poo-poo d Sawstop. Admittedly, I was among them. But times seemed to have changed. Looks like the Sawstop haters are in the minority these days. My attitude has changed too. Price is the only thing keeping me from owning a Sawstop. But if I ever decide to upgrade to a high-end saw…...I think Sawstop will be the top of my list.
> 
> - Tedstor


I think if the Sawstop had been a crappy table saw with the brake tacked on that would still be the case but SawStop is a top end saw with the added safety feature of the braking system. I would prefer if that safety system was a option rather than being forced on us which is where things seem to be headed and I do blame SawStop's inventors at least somewhat for fanning the fires of litigation around table saw accidents but that aside they have created an example of what a machine built for a lifetime of use should look like that I think a lot of other brands have cast aside over the years.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

I was just reading about all the litigation today on it. We live in a society where everyone wants a free dollar if they can. Hell even our cars have to be all computer assisted now because people can't handle sports cars. I believe the Viper had to convert to ABS and traction control in 2012 (somewhere around then). Now every joe who gets on Pinterest wants to use a saw they've never handled before and then wants to sue because they were too stupid to leave a guard over the blade.


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## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

> Interesting. Two or thee years ago, I d guess that half the LJ community poo-poo d Sawstop. Admittedly, I was among them. But times seemed to have changed. Looks like the Sawstop haters are in the minority these days. My attitude has changed too. Price is the only thing keeping me from owning a Sawstop. But if I ever decide to upgrade to a high-end saw…...I think Sawstop will be the top of my list.
> 
> - Tedstor


I do wonder how the tone has changed. I wonder if positive feedback about the (a) performance, (b) fit and finish, (c) instructions and support and (d) stories of accidents have changed the general consensus/tone. Out of the 5 cabinet saws I've used, 3 have been SawStops (a mix of PCS and ICS) and I can attest to great performance and fit and finish. Many a fellow local guild member have attested to the PCS being worthy of "last table saw" quality.

Whenever I finally get my own dedicated shop space, I am doing a bit of a dance between going for a more inexpensive saw (i.e. Grizzly) or to spend on the SawStop. I may have the risk tolerance to get a Grizzly and save some money, but with young ones who I plan to indoctrinate into woodworking, I'm inclined to spend more for their safety. Compounded over the lifetime of a hobby, the price tag will seem smaller. Or at least that's what I said when my wife asked to buy $3000 worth of sewing equipment.


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## alawoody (Aug 26, 2013)

I have had a Saw Stop for close to 4 years and it is without a doubt the best saw in the world. I had an occasion where the saw kicked off in less than a second! I did not touch the blade but was cutting a board I just glued together. The wet glue triggered the shut off. When I called the service department they were most helpful. They sent me a new blade gratis. I have the old brake hung up on my wall to remind me what can happen. The service department is extremely helpful and solving problems. They will walk you through any situation that comes up. This is the best saw ever made.Buy it!!


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

My wife does a bunch of crafts and my little ones like to be out there too. I'm looking at the options now.


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## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

> My wife does a bunch of crafts and my little ones like to be out there too. I m looking at the options now.
> 
> - PhillipRCW


My wife once said "back in shop class, I wasn't as afraid of the table saw as I was the bandsaw". I educated her on the dangers rather quickly.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

I'm not that sure that the there was anywhere close to 50% of the LJ membership were against Saw Stop's,There were a small number of members that had a problem with the inventor and were very prolific about comenting about how bad they thought the saw and it's inventor was along with other reasons they would never buy one. Becuase the commented so frequently when the subject came up it may have seemed like there was a big percentage of members that belonged to the I hate SS club.
I think I saw a comment about folks being too stupid to have there blade guard on? I don't think I've seen a blade gard on a saw for years in anyones shop (except a newbees shop) including pro woodworking shops,so I guess we are all too stupid to have our guard on ? guards are good but many experienced woodworkers don't want to take the time to take them off and put them on when they are doing an operation that the guards are in the way. The ironic things is that Sawstops has the easiest system for taking off and putting on guards I've ever seen.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

That's what I was referencing was new people to woodworking building projects and removing the safety devices and then suing because they hurt themselves. I have seen a ton of pinterest inspired pallet injuries as I call them. I've seen actual injuries here in town from people not knowing how to work a tool and then saying it's a crappy tool when it just wasn't handled properly. Love seeing people smash their fingers when not holding a drill tight enough. It's like torque is a new concept.


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## DrDirt (Feb 26, 2008)

> My wife does a bunch of crafts and my little ones like to be out there too. I m looking at the options now.
> 
> - PhillipRCW


WIth the kids out there, they will grow as well and want to do real projects soon- are you sure a hormonal teenager will always be careful?

In full disclosure, I have a Unisaw I bought new in 2003. There wasn't a sawstop out there.
But today a Unisaw and the Sawstop, and the PM2000 are all within 20 bucks of eachother….

I struggle with dumping a perfect working saw with 52 inch Besmeyer, and a routerlift in the wing.. to do the upgrade.

But head to head buying a new saw, I simply cannot IMAGINE for a second getting anything other than Sawstop.


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## Woodmaster1 (Apr 26, 2011)

I bought a 5hp unisaw three years ago and have been very happy. I went back and forth on the Unisaw and a sawstop but using a sawstop pcs at the school I teach at the unisaw for me is a better saw. I have not regretted my decision once. The unisaw has a bigger top and the side table is made a lot better than the sawstop. The safety issue does not concern me because I use the safety guards and a microjig. Granted if you worry about accidents the sawstop would be a good choice.


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## bigJohninvegas (May 25, 2014)

If you can afford it Saw stop is the only saw. I am a hobby wood worker, and am using a ridgid 4512 in my garage. How ever I have had access to a Delta, Jet, and currently saw stop. What a difference saw stop saws make. Good solid machine, and some day I will own one. I have taken classes at a local shop that has 3 saw stops. No comparison at all to my ridgid. I had might as well be using a skil saw at home. While working at the school, I have seen the saw stop brake fire twice now. What piece of mind, only a paper cut wound was inflicted. I have heard of the brake tripping by mistake, and Saw stop gave a free replacement. Also I here of great costumer service. Beware to read the owners book on the saw. Your body is an electrical conductor, and that is what the brake system uses to detect flesh. Cutting metal, and some plastic can and will trip the brake. However the system can be shut off to cut this sort of material. Taking the Ridgid at $600 out of the picture, you are instantly up at $1000 or more for a table saw. Being a pro, you are going to use that saw every day. I would spend the money.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

I have used both the ICS and PCS The ICS is a 5HP and the PCS is a 3HP. I've worked on a 5HP Powermatic 66 for 15 years plus. The ICS is a good match to my PM66 plus better finish and its famous safety mechanism. The PCS is a good saw but a little smaller and has less HP. There's about $900 difference so if that's an issue you might want to go with the PCS. I can't speak to the difference in a 5HP Unisaw but comparing it to a 3hp Saw Stop might be a more like comparing apples and oranges, as far as size and power. I would be very surprised if the Unisaw would top all the features of SS's ICS.


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## iminmyshop (Dec 9, 2012)

If this will be your business then you cannot afford to buy a saw that does not give you the accuracy you need.
If this is a business, the likelihood is that you may very well succeed enough to need help. The courts have already ruled that you have a responsibility to your employees if not to yourself to keep them safe if such a means is readily available. So the obligation will be a legal if not just a moral one. 
Sawstop is an excellent saw. I have one and don't regret spending the extra money. Yes, I did trigger the device and it ruined a blade plus required replacement of the cartridge. $160. It happened when a bit of metal came in contact with the blade (which may have ruined it anyway). I wish there were equivalent safety devices on all of my machinery.


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## knotscott (Feb 27, 2009)

If I were in your shoes, I'd go one of three directions depending on how much use the saw is going to get and your situation. *Table Saws*

The Delta 35-725 is a solid buy of a basic hybrid style contractor saw with a decent fence at ~ $550. Minimal investment that meets basic needs.

If you're going to be doing a fair amount of tough cutting, I'd make the jump to a 3hp cabinet saw….something like the Grizzly G1023RL or G0690 are among the best bangs for the buck on the market at < $1500 with solid cast wings and good fence. Requires 220v.

If you'll be doing a fair amount of cutting, and other people will be using the saw or your fingers are critical to you, I'd spring for the SS PCS 3hp < $3k nicely equipped. It's competively priced with other top shelf cabinet saws, whereas the SS contractor saw comes at a fairly steep premium. (~ $1700 with steel wings and lame fence)

Whichever route you go, take the time to get it setup well, buy the proper safety accessories, and keep a good quality, clean, sharp blade on it that's appropriate for the task on it. *Saws Blades*


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## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

As I understand it, the SawStop ICS is a better comparison to the Powermatic PM66/PM2000 and current Delta Unisaw. The PCS is slightly scaled down, but as far as I have been able to tell as a hobbyist, I can't tell the difference.

In terms if misfires, there is an open pay-per-use shop in my neck of the woods that has a SawStop ICS. The shop manager has told me before that in the 5 years of a usage by a range of inexperienced folks, the blade brake has fired 8 times, none of which has ever been a misfire from wet wood. That saw has a riving knife in it around the clock and not the guard.


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## unbob (Mar 10, 2013)

Sort of looking things over in my shop, there are 9 machines that will remove fingers quickly…...If the only machine I have is a table saw…..maybe the SS would make more sense to me?


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

I definitely think along those lines too. I want to be as safe as possible, but at a 2K price to begin with its just so hard to bite the bullet. For what I priced out, I could buy a laguna, a drill press, a band saw, some hand planers, a few clamps , and enough wood to build a norm Abrams inspired garage cabinetry set up. Plus have money left over for Christmas. I know the benefits, but I'm cheap.


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## Joel_B (Aug 14, 2014)

I have to wonder how effective the saw stop really is. In all the demonstrations a hot dog is used instead of an actual person's finger and is moved at very slow speed into the blade. In real life it is more likely that a finger would be quickly moved into the blade and they never show what happens in that case. I'm not doubting its good to have one or if it potentially could save loosing a finger but where is the proof? Anybody here had an incident where it made a difference?

Ok I found he does put his finger in the blade but very slowly and barely touches it.


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## Tedstor (Mar 12, 2011)

> I have to wonder how effective the saw stop really is. In all the demonstrations a hot dog is used instead of an actual person s finger and is moved at very slow speed into the blade. In real life it is more likely that a finger would be quickly moved into the blade and they never show what happens in that case. I m not doubting its good to have one or if it potentially could save loosing a finger but where is the proof? Anybody here had an incident where it made a difference?
> 
> - Joel_B


There are plenty of accounts of the brake firing in real-world scenarios. I'd be more curious to find out if anyone has ever managed to lose a finger on a sawstop. I'm sure the technology can't work EVERY time. That would be a tall order.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

I have seen several pictures of people who actually bled from the saw blade, but even then, a small cut vs what could happen worse than that. Obviously if I feel and my hand hit the blade it would be a lot worse, but still may not cut my entire hand in half.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

There are plenty of accounts of the brake firing in real-world scenarios. I d be more curious to find out if anyone has ever managed to lose a finger on a sawstop. I m sure the technology can t work EVERY time. That would be a tall order.

- Tedstor
[/QUOTE]

I would assume it's happened, but I can't find it. I'm sure if it did though somehow the company would find that the individual was in bypass made though.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Phillip can you buy a finger for less?

Joel 
I've seen a video of the inventor sticking his finger into a running saw blade of a Saw stop and have seen any number of reports here and elsewhere online showing small scratches on there fingers as the worse case injury they sustained.


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## jmartel (Jul 6, 2012)

> I have to wonder how effective the saw stop really is. In all the demonstrations a hot dog is used instead of an actual person s finger and is moved at very slow speed into the blade. In real life it is more likely that a finger would be quickly moved into the blade and they never show what happens in that case. I m not doubting its good to have one or if it potentially could save loosing a finger but where is the proof? Anybody here had an incident where it made a difference?
> 
> Ok I found he does put his finger in the blade but very slowly and barely touches it.
> 
> - Joel_B


Plenty of evidence from people who tripped the brake.

Additionally, there's tests on youtube that show a hotdog being thrown forcefully into the blade. Worst cut is about 1/8" Deep. Going to suck, but you won't lose a finger like you would without it.


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## knotscott (Feb 27, 2009)

> I definitely think along those lines too. I want to be as safe as possible, but at a 2K price to begin with its just so hard to bite the bullet. For what I priced out, I could buy a laguna, a drill press, a band saw, some hand planers, a few clamps , and enough wood to build a norm Abrams inspired garage cabinetry set up. Plus have money left over for Christmas. I know the benefits, but I m cheap.
> 
> - PhillipRCW


Do you have 220v available?


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

No, but I have an electrician friend. Still an extra $350 at least with the friend discount.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

So I stopped by and looked at the Sawstop cabinet saws. I couldn't do it though…. right now. I already have several orders placed for the business, but I wanted to make sure the amount of work I pull in just isn't friends getting excited for me and wanting me to build some small things for them. I went with a Delta from Lowes. Spend quite a bit less, but I will be purchasing the Sawstop once I can pay cash out of the business account. I took everyone's advice into consideration. If I'm going to spend that much though it's going to be decked out. I couldn't quite spend the $2800 right now since I still need some other tools too. I am building the shop now and will let you know how the Delta does through all this. Once I pull in enough money to get the Sawstop I guess dad will be getting a nice gift.


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## rg33 (Dec 1, 2012)

I never understood the hate for the Sawstop (full disclaimer I don't own one), it always seemed to me to be of a political nature for whatever reason, almost like that crowd had the mentality of: "Well if I want to cut off my digits as a red blooded American it is my right to do so…" but I put this analogy to a colleague in that field, what about all the other safety mechanisms we've benefited from, you dont have a problem with air bags on your car right, they are not limiting you to any rights or the third (ground prong) on most of your tools right…anyway sorry for starting to get on my soapbox and hijacking this post.

on a more serious note, for a business I would look at the grizzlies great bang for your buck, or sawstop if you can afford it. I own the orange special and have nothing but good stuff to say about it, but Im only a weekend warrior.


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## PhillipRCW (Dec 9, 2014)

I'm a mix of weekend warrior and professional lol. I started the business but it's not a deal breaker if I don't make money right now. I work a 9-5 during the week too and go to school. Wanted to follow a passion of woodworking and make a little cash while doing it. I think I have found a few places to funnel pieces through their store front for a small commission and if that keeps going well then I'll have the saw stop by summer. Just didn't want to invest that much into it yet. I used some savings to redo the garage and buy the other tools and didn't want to step halfway into the cabinet saw territory. May as well save up the rest and do it all at once. Plus, like I said, dad will get the Delta as a gift. He won't complain.

And as far as the Grizzly. I like everything about it except the fact that it's ugly as sin. There's few things I'd spend more on for looks, but good lord it's an ugly saw.


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## intelligen (Dec 28, 2009)

> I never understood the hate for the Sawstop (full disclaimer I don t own one), it always seemed to me to be of a political nature for whatever reason, almost like that crowd had the mentality of: "Well if I want to cut off my digits as a red blooded American it is my right to do so…"
> 
> - rg33


The hate stems from all the lobbying to force broader acceptance of SawStop or a similar competing active safety device and the numerous lawsuits against the table saw manufacturers who have not incorporated active safety technology into their saws (i.e., everyone besides SawStop). On principle, I put off buying a table saw for several years in hopes that a competing technology would come to market, but nothing ever did. On the bright side, at least riving knives and better guards are now common. I've never seen anyone complain about the law that required those improvements-it's almost like that legislation passed under the radar while people were kicking and screaming and yelling about SawStop taking away their civil liberties. I'd shudder to think that everyone just thought it made sense to require riving knives on new saws.

And Phillip, congrats on the new saw!


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## Woodbum (Jan 3, 2010)

From what I have heard on this site from people that have bought one, is that SawStop makes an excellent product and they are pleased with it. I am good with that. I would not categorize posters who are not convinced that the motives of the inventor are as pure as we would like to believe as haters per se. He found a niche in the market and addressed it with his product. Normal business practice here. I do not know this for a fact, but it seems that he might have a bit of a hardon for the big saw manufacturers that dismissed his idea when presented with it. Also very common in some business dealings. Thus the push to get his technology mandated on every new saw sold, which I do not agree with. I think that this technology is a wonderful choice for those who desire it, and are willing to pay a bit of an exorbitant price, I feel, for the peace of mind, albeit maybe false; that this product offers. BUT, I still feel that it is a personal choice to have this technology or to pass on it.

If I were starting out today, I would certainly consider this saw, unless I was in the same financial situation that I was when I stated 35+ years ago. Then it would be a very hard decision that would probably not go toward getting the sawstop for nearly $2k over the price of say a Grizzly 1023. What are my hands worth you ask? They are priceless; but I am willing to live my live with some expectation that money alone cannot protect me from all of the unpleasant things that MIGHT happen to me.

Not to forget what really started this controversy, was an untrained person using an ill equipped saw in a manner not consistent with standard safety practices. In other words using a portable job site saw on the floor with no fence or miter gauge to FREEHAND cut flooring is about as dumbass as you can get. Was he advised that this was a dumbass move? Probably, but it doesn't matter because the jury found in his favor and he got a whole wheelbarrow full of cash for being a dumbass. And we wonder why all the stupid safety warnings are plastered all over every power tool we buy.

Final answer: buy the SawStop if you want it, can afford it and need it. In your situation of having your wife and kids in the shop, positively get one. Then be certain to have training sessions about using it, because you CAN and WILL get injured, even by a SawStop. Good luck, work safely and have fun.


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## buildingmonkey (Mar 1, 2014)

Don't know how much experience with tablesaws you have, for me after 50 years of using tablesaws, I avoid putting my hands close to the blade. Use push sticks, and keep hands out of line with the blade. But if you do not automatically practice safety, would look at used sliding tablesaws. After buying a new Hammer slider, have been watching the used machine sites, find that occasionally you can find a used slider for a steal of a price. The old guy who purchased it dies, his widow doesn't know what to do with it, and you find it posted on woodweb, or IRSauctions.The Euros designed a much safer to use tablesaw, it is a slider.


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## jmartel (Jul 6, 2012)

> Don t know how much experience with tablesaws you have, for me after 50 years of using tablesaws, I avoid putting my hands close to the blade. Use push sticks, and keep hands out of line with the blade. But if you do not automatically practice safety, would look at used sliding tablesaws. After buying a new Hammer slider, have been watching the used machine sites, find that occasionally you can find a used slider for a steal of a price. The old guy who purchased it dies, his widow doesn t know what to do with it, and you find it posted on woodweb, or IRSauctions.The Euros designed a much safer to use tablesaw, it is a slider.
> 
> - buildingmonkey


For what it's worth, Shopnotes came out with a slider add on to existing table saws in a recent issue (#138). Sure, it's not the same thing, but it works nearly as well and helps keep your hands away from the blade. Of course, so does a crosscut sled.


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