# TV cabinet in Sketchup



## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

I'm new here, but I thought I'd share a project I created this week using Sketchup. We have a 65" Mitsubishi rear projection TV in a nice oak tower setup to hold the AV components and such. We've been looking at getting a newer set, and saw a nice Mitsu 65" DLP we debated getting after Thanksgiving. We didn't get it at the time, but I decided to make some plans to create a matching cabinet to put the TV on that would also include several drawers for DVD storage:










I designed it around a 2×4 substructure (cut and jointed to 1 1/2" x 3") with oak ply for the top and sides, 3/4" oak for the face frame and drawer false fronts, 1/4" oak for the false front panels and back, and 1/2" MDF for the drawers. They're not in the drawing but the drawers will ride on 1/2" full extension side-mounted slides. The design is a match for the existing entertainment system. I plan to go ahead and actually build it before we get a newer TV.

I haven't figured-out a good way to create the rail and stile lock joints for the false fronts yet using Sketchup, so the tops and bottoms of the rails currently look like they extend over the stiles. I also will be using wood drawer pulls, but it wouldn't let me apply the texture to them so I need to mess around with that some more. If anyone wants to build a similar setup I can provide you with the SKP file plus a couple others where I exploded the model and applied the dimensions needed to build it. I also created cutting diagrams for the wood and sheet goods using Sketchup.

On another forum I was pointed to a very nice rendering plugin for Sketchup called Podium. You can download it free, but the output in the free version is limited to 500×500:










I highly recommend Sketchup for detailed design work. Once you watch a few tutorials it becomes very easy to use for even a novice like myself.


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## oscorner (Aug 7, 2006)

It looks very nice. Thanks for sharing. I look forward to seeing it after you have built it.


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## rikkor (Oct 17, 2007)

I am still having a hard time with SU. I can make the components, but I haven't figured how to place them. Nice looking rendering.


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

As far as placing components, what I've done is make sure I've grouped the part, select the group, select the move tools and choose a part of the component I want to connect to another object, then move it into place. Holding down the shift key will keep it moving along an axis. It took awhile to get the hang of it, but I can move objects around pretty-well now. I'm by no means an expert, but I can at least do what I need to in the program.


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## rikkor (Oct 17, 2007)

That could be an insight. I'll have to play with the concept.


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

Well I deeply admire your Sketchup skills. Currently I sub out my Sketchup drawings.

I think that your design is nice. I am concerned about the comment that it is designed around a 2×4 substructure. This is not necessary at all. The unit should not have 2×4 material anywhere in it.

Your false drawer fronts could be Kreg jigged, dowelled, face frame biscuited, or run a dado that will accommodate the inside panel and a tenon from the rail. (If I am understanding your question correctly.)

The large entertainment center I built does not have any framing material in it and it houses a very large television.
http://lumberjocks.com/projects/737

You can build the unit out of plywood and biscuit or Kreg jig almost all of it. It will be stronger than you think.


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

I was just reading your plans again and I have to add that you should try a plywood like baltic birch for the drawers. The MDF would not really be reliable as a drawer box. I think this would be a decision that you would regret. It could be another plywood even off the shelf from the box stores but not MDF.

Your faceframe could be Kreg jigged too, this works great, and Kreg jig the faceframe to the plywood sides. You may be amazed to know that this whole project can be Kreg jigged.


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

The face frame will be put together with pocket screws. The false fronts on the drawers will be constructed using rail and stile router bits, but I haven't figured-out how to make the complex profile work in Sketchup so it isn't drawn correctly.

The 2×4's are really just a cheap shortcut for mounting the drawer slides and providing a center support. Like you said other than a possible center support the structure itself is strong enough on it's own to hold the weight of the TV. The sides of the 2×4's will be flush to the face frame, allowing me to mount the slides directly to them. I wouldn't call this fine furniture, but from the outside it will match my existing entertainment center. Here's a blow-up of what the substructure looks like:










As for the MDF drawers, the primary concern there was a simple material that I wouldn't need to finish. Plywood would need to be edged to look decent. I could go with the cheap cabinet route of laminated particle board, but I don't know if that would be any better than MDF. Other than MDF not holding screws all that well, what reason would you not recommend using it here?


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

Todd, that is spectacular work on that entertainment center you built. If you were to compare your work to mine it would be obvious that you are a professional carpenter and I'm just a amateur DIY guy. 

I love to build things and have built many projects around the house. I've built sheds, decks, finished the basement, built DVD cabinets, and other projects. However, I'm more of a rough framing kind of guy than a finish work expert. I like it when I can cover my poor skills with trim.


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

It's time to ratchtet your work level up a notch. You just joined LJ and there is more knowledge available to you from this single source than you can shake a stick at.

We'll guide you.

One of the things is that you are spending money on materials that you do not need and creating extra labor in the framing.

By the way, that entertainment center is the first project I ever did like that. I didn't think that was too bad for my first "tv stand".


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

You certainly could use a center support. I would just use a plywood panel.


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

2×4's are cheap, but it is a lot of joinery. I suppose I could go with just the plywood and reinforcing corner blocks. I'd have to add a few spacer blocks to mount the rails to, but that's not that big of a deal. I've never tried using pocket screws to connect plywood to plywood. Is it workable or just stick with the corner blocks or biscuits? I'll redo the structure and post the alternative version here shortly.


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

The corner blocks are a good idea.

The modern furniture that I made is all biscuited together. I am currently working for those same clients right now.

The spacer blocks are a normal item. I usually just run a stick in the back from bottom to the top, high enough to catch the top runner.

I will check to see if I have some construction photos of the modern furniture showing joinery.

Gotta get back to work!


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## SPalm (Oct 9, 2007)

Gwurst, If you can design like that in SU, you can kick it up a notch in the shop. Listen to Todd, he is a class act. Nix the 2×4s for sure.

Nix the MDF also, go with ply (the better the grade the better the result). Edge banding can be real easy, and a nice technique to have in your pocket. You can buy a roll of iron on oak (or maple/birch) for cheap at the big box stores. Just iron it on and trim the edges with a router, plane, or knife. Solid wood edge banding is also pretty easy if you have a router and a flush trim bit.

Steve


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

Ok, here's the revision using corner blocks and 3/4" ply for a center brace. I added the strips in the rear to catch the ends of the drawer slides. Would you just glue and screw the panels with the corner blocks, or biscuit them as well?


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

Steve- thanks for seconding the motion on those items.

Gwurst would not need to edge band anything in this project if he is using a solid wood faceframe on the front. The sides cover the back panel edges, it is not that way in the drawing but I know that you know better.

The drawing says that you are right on target.

The corner blocks are right, the strips for your drawer hardware is right and you are using a center panel for the support. Perfect.

My corner blocks are usually glued, predrilled and screwed to pull it together. I typically use hot glue for speed but Titebond works too. If you make the corner blocks big enough you can attach the top by screwing through them from below to create a hidden fastening system. This works well for a plywood top but take wood movement into consideration if it is solid lumber.

Putting a box like this together is a bit of a chess game because you have to think a few moves ahead.

It is easiest to install the glides without the top on but they may keep you from attaching the top using the corner block if it is too tight in the cabinet box.

You may have to install the glide hardware then remove enough pieces to get your drill gun in there. After you attach the top it is easy to reinstall the glides because you already have the screw hole. The screws are short and you can hand drive them pretty easily.

If you think there is a magic trick to it, well - there it is.


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## SPalm (Oct 9, 2007)

The only reference to edge banding I intended was for the drawer interiors (to get rid of the MDF).

If you get the DLP (go for it), it will be not be a heavy TV, so don't worry about super bracing, but it seems like it needs a dust shelf between the drawers or a bottom or something for a little more strength against racking when it is moved. (?)

But what about the cable box and DVD player etc?


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

Without the 2×4 support system racking is a concern, even with the corner braces. With the top and back attached I don't think it will be too big of a problem, but if I run into problems I'll add a bottom of some sort.

As for the equipment, that currently sits in the entertainment system surround:


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## Brad_Nailor (Jul 26, 2007)

Welcome to Lumberjocks! Nice Sketchup work! I see you have discovered podium. Great rendering plug in isn't it? I have been using Podium since it's first beta version, and I love it. It greatly improves the SU output. I have the full version and I love to render stuff in the larger sizes…really makes the details pop. I love your exploded view as well. Did you use the SU sun to do the render or did you place omnis or LEMS? I dont know if you are aware of the Podium user forum. It's alot like this site, a great bunch of people that are helpfull and it's full of tutorials and tips http://www.websitetoolbox.com/tool/mb/supodiumforum
As far as drawing complex door/drawfront profiles you might want to try this technique I blogged about http://lumberjocks.com/jocks/Brad_Nailor/blog/2413 It might work for you.


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

I used the SU sun and shadows for the render, but I've played-around with omnis. I've perused quite a bit of the Podium forums and sample renders. I actually discovered Podium via your Empire State dining table blog. My needs are basic, but it can do much more than I'll ever use it for. I'll probably get the full version eventually just so I can get a larger screen size. Apparently the demo used to do 640×480 but now it's down to 500×500.

I've looked at your panel tutorial, and that is probably the way I'll have to do the lock router bit profiles. I'll probably play with that this evening when I get off work. Extruding the profile is probably the only way to create a complex profile.


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

So now as I understand it the new unit will become part of the original entertainment center to hold the new TV? I just realized that, but it does not really make any difference in the construction.

Racking will not be an issue because that typically happens when you move a piece of furniture with a lot of weight on it. Plywood case pieces do not suffer the movement issues either that can cause racking. I guarantee that with the design you have it could be biscuited or pocket screwed and it will be fine.

The biscuits take a while for glue to set, so you can also do a combo by using biscuits but adding a few pocket screws to hold until the biscuits are set. That helps if you do not have enough clamps, long enough clamps, or not enough time to let it all set.


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

Yes, it will be more-or-less a permanent piece of the entertainment system between the two towers. Like you said I don't think racking will be an issue in this situation, since if I do need to move it I'll remove the TV and drawers.

I'll probably use biscuits to join the carcass, and the corner braces should hold it while the glue dries. A couple pocket holes might be added if needed.

Hopefully, I can get the stain to match well enough that it looks like a matching piece to the rest of the center.


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## Brad_Nailor (Jul 26, 2007)

I agree with Todd, you are right on target with the plywood panels rather than the 2×4 skeleton. Since none of your sides will be exposed I would go with pocket screws to assemble the whole thing (again like Todd suggested). And seeing as how the drawers will hide the interior I would pocket screw the face frame on as well. You could use biscuits to assemble the carcass, but you need to clamp them while the glue dries. Thats the beauty of the pocket screws. I use clamps to get everything square and in position then drive the screws and your done..no clamping needed! Make sure to post the draw fronts after you re draw them i would like to check them out!


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

Ok, here's the 50 cent version of making a complex lock bit drawer front I used:

Step one was to create the stile, since it only has a single shaped profile. I created a 2D side profile and extruded it out to the needed length. Then I grouped it, moved and copied it, and rotated the new piece into position:










Next, I moved the two pieces together so the profile overlapped:










Select the profiled piece. From the Edit menu select Intersect, Intersect with model and move the pieces away:










Once you delete the unneeded lines you are left with a piece in need of repair:


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

Once you repair the broken surfaces you have the piece you need:










Proceed to copy and flip the stile and intersect the model on the other side of the rail. Once that is repaired and ready, copy and flip the rail:










Here it is with the pieces put together:










Create the interior panel:










Exploded complete panel:


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

Here's where I ran into trouble. I wanted to create the roundover on the outside edge of the panel. I went to one corner and drew an arc to represent the roundover. Exploding all the groups allows you to use the select tools to select all the top edges for the Follow Me tool to follow. After selecting all the edges, select the Follow Me tool, hold down the ALT key and click in the middle of that arc and drag the mouse to the top of the drawer face. You may have to move the mouse around for it to select just the outside edges. When you are finished you get this:










You can select the Extending faces:










Go back to the Edit menu, select 13 Faces (# may vary) and intersect the model again:










Delete the extra lines and try to repair the broken lines:










The problem is it is almost impossible to get the rails and stiles to separate at this point. You're pretty-much stuck with it as a solid piece that looks like the piece you need. It "can" be done but figure a good 30 minutes to an hour to clean it up. A royal PITA.


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

I will have to come back to look at your last post again, I have plans tonight. I also will get some joinery photos on the modern furniture. That set is all biscuits and pocket screws.


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## Brad_Nailor (Jul 26, 2007)

I like the way you did the draw fronts ….looks awesome..such great detail. Just for the hell of it I tried doing one with the follow me method..here is what I came up with..I just tried to eyeball your profiles and dimensions..







Yours have the great rail and style detail on the sides. And if you can figure out how to separate them they would make a great exploded detail drawing. The ones I did don't have that detail, but would look fine on a finished piece, and I was able to draw that in allot fewer steps. Thats whats great about programs like AutoCAD and Sketchup there are so many different ways to do the same thing! As far as the round over maybe if you ran the profile on each piece separateley using component edit, without exploding them and then put it back together then you could still pull it apart.


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## North40 (Oct 17, 2007)

What if you put the roundover on each rail/stile individually, rather than using "follow me" from part to part to part?


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## Brad_Nailor (Jul 26, 2007)

Is there an echo in here? lol


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

The joints prevent the follow me tool from completing the roundover on the individual pieces. I might try extending the top line and see if that completes the profile for me. I'll play around with it and see if I can get it to work. If you don't need an exploded view it's a heck of a lot quicker to use David's follow-me profile way to build a cabinet door.


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## North40 (Oct 17, 2007)

Brad - what did you say? I didn't catch that as I was too busy re-typing the last thing you said. And I don't know if you noticed, but there may be an echo in here.


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

Gwurst - I had too much to share here so I did a blog http://lumberjocks.com/jocks/toddc/blog/2656

You are definitely on the right track now.


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

Excellent blog, Todd. I was going to reply here but I decided to share my thoughts on your blog entry instead. Your work inspires me to try more ambitious projects.


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## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

Gwurst - really glad to see your understanding of case construction coming around. That's the joy of LJ.


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

I'm just about ready to actually build the cabinet now. I've gotten the rail and stile joint to match the ones on the main entertainment center, and I've redesigned the carcass. I just wasn't comfortable with the open bottom and the support provided by a 1/4" piece of plywood on the back, so I added a couple braces to the back, added floor boards to the bottom, and went with regular rectangular reinforcement braces everywhere but for the top where I will use the triangle braces to help secure the top. The floor boards will add some much needed structural stability during construction and when moving the piece. Plus, with the full extension drawers you'd see the carpet when the bottom drawers were open and I thought that would be tacky.


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## gwurst (Nov 28, 2007)

Well, we went ahead and bought the new TV and I have the wood, so I'm going to start building the cabinet in the next day or two. One of the few things I'm still debating is where to mount the full extension drawer slides. My intention was to mount them in the middle of the sides, but most of the projects I see have them mounted near the bottom of the drawer. Is there any benefit in one or the other, or is it just personal preference?


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