# Yet another steel wool and vinegar question



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

Hi. My second project is kind of based on my first, which looks like this:








You guys here on LumberJocks gave me some great advise on finishing the first one, so I'm hoping you can help me with this one,
I'm thinking of giving it an aged look using steel wool and vinegar. Do you guys think that would be an appropriate finish, or should I stick with something like the first one? If I do use steel wool and vinegar, do you use any finish over that, like shellac, poly, etc?
Thanks in advance for any help you can give me.


----------



## jumbojack (Mar 20, 2011)

pine does not do well with the steel wool vinegar treatment.


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

Bummer, jumbojack. I was hoping. I just want it to look aged, not ebonized. Will it do that?
Thanks.


----------



## j1212t (Dec 7, 2013)

My problem with pine and spruce is that you never really know, for example in our case with European bought I think it was pine, maybe spruce… vinegar and steel we got a green result… (the green accent pieces you can see in this pic)









Depending on the 'coctail' we got a light green or a dark green. it still looked nice in context of our house with other colours but something in these woods just makes the vinegar and wool work a lot differently. I read about it, but I can't quote what it exactly was.

So if you wnat to know for sure I would test it on a scrap, but probably a stain would be a better option.


----------



## Deycart (Mar 21, 2012)

I'm not sure what you are looking for in a finish, but you could try India ink as a base coat apply as much as you want dark. BTW the first coat is very dark. And then what ever you want over as the ink it got was water based. Its a very dark finish but leaves the grain almost visible.


----------



## wtnhighlander (Dec 12, 2013)

I have used vinegar / steel wool mixtures on pine, and got varying results that seemed to depend on how long I left the steel in the vinegar. On one piece, I applied a solution of 1 ball of 0000 steel wool completly disolved in about 1 pint of vinegar. That piece turned a nice chestnut brown after about 3 days. I top coated with shellac, which seems to slow the coloring process quite a bit. However, that piece has become noticably darker after a year or so.


----------



## jayden (Nov 30, 2013)

Great job done by you especially on the designing part on the top but I hope more finish on that and I suggest you to use steel wood and vinegar for more finishing. They are really effective.


----------



## jayden (Nov 30, 2013)

Great job done by you especially on the designing part on the top but I hope more finish on that and I suggest you to use steel wood and vinegar for more finishing. They are really effective.


----------



## Mahdeew (Jul 24, 2013)

Try steel wool and shellac. Rob it in very thin, leave in sun for a few days until you get the desired color then finish.


----------



## RussellAP (Feb 21, 2012)

You could leave it outside in the weather for a couple months. That should do the trick.


----------



## GaryW (Aug 28, 2011)

I have let my vinegar & steel wool sit for several months. I added cedar (red) hart chips to get a red tint. Well the tint don't work. But I have a great black stain. One coat is transparent but the grain guickly disappears with more coats added. One coat, sanded after on oak is killer, te stain on oak goes deep. 
My stain on pine will dirty (blacken) the surface.


----------



## jumbojack (Mar 20, 2011)

I am currently working on a bed frame. The lady wanted the distressed 'old' chunky look. We priced barn wood and found it to be, for them, cost prohibitive. I used a variety of sanding implements to distress the wood. Wire wheel to take some of the soft grain out leaving ridges of late growth. I used a belt sander tilted on edge to do more of the same. A propane torch in the soft growth to further 'distress'. I stained with minwax golden oak. I left some stain in various places on the frame.









This is a detail shot sent to the customer of the cap on the footboard.
By the way she is so far thrilled with the look. We used standard building dimensional lumber from HD.


----------



## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

I used to use pure amonia on oak, I do not know what it would do on pine


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

Thanks for all the responses. I'm really, really new at all this, so your input is highly valued.
I put in a tremendous amount of work on the first one distressing it and making it look old. Unfortunately the finish I used didn't help in making it look old. Don't get me wrong; I loved how the finish turned out - it just didn't have the "ancient" effect I was looking for. Maybe a combination of the steel wool & vinegar treatment, followed by a stain would do the trick: what do you think?
If I do use the steel wool & vinegar treatment, will that affect gluing in any way, or should it be fine?
Thanks,
Bobby


----------



## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

Before you dismiss the vinegar and steel wood. here is a suggestion

Pine has very little "tannin" in it , so it doesn't react real well with the vinegar and steel wool solution, which is a reaction with the wood more so than an actual colorant.

make you some green tea, use the grounds or bags , make it strong, as in 4 bags to a cup , really strong. Apply that to the pine , and let it dry. The green tea has a lot of tannin in it , so now you have just added some tannin, and the vinegar and steel wood has some thing to react with it . Different "pines" , react differently so be sure to do a test sample . Also you will find the reaction is better id its not sanded too fine, 180 is about as far as you want to go, also try a sample sanded with 120. You have to have the wood "open" so the tea and vinegar can get in .


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

Now that, Mister Neil, is exactly the kind of advise I was looking for. I can certainly go out and get some green tea, but I wonder if regular black tea would contain the same tannins? I have lots of that. I always brew my tea super strong. I learned to drink it that way from Sergeant Major Mac Donald, who used it as part of his campaign to terrorize we second lieutenants I've been drinking it that way for many years.


----------



## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

Actually Black tea will work,,, but make it strong enough to walk.


----------



## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

What about coffee? Is it any good?


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

That's the only way to brew it. Thank you, sir, I'll brew up a big batch tomorrow morning. This should be fun!


----------



## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

na coffee doesn't do it very well, not sure why ..The green tea is the best. but black works. The issue is how much resin is in the pine and how well it can be absorbed,, Box store stuff usually can be a little more resinous . Hemlock , which is the knotty "white wood" they have , has less resin..

You have to experiment with it , if it doesn't work well or doesn't give you the look you want, a wipe down with deck brightner ( oxcylic acid) .. will kill it in seconds. Also be aware you will get a little grain raising. just let it dry and give it a quick scuff with some 320 or so .. It's fun to experiment with .


----------



## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

Ok , no plug intended I assure you , but Stumpy did a video review of my book, at about 1:31 he is flipping the pages, on the bottom right , you will see some yellow pine I did with the Green tea and vinegar and steel wool , it will give you an idea of what to expect . http://www.stumpynubs.com/favorite-things.html The bluish look is not he vinegar mix, just the grey and brown

PS, Thanks a ton Stumpy ..


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

Plug all you want. When you write a great book like that, you should let people know. I plan on buying it when I get the money. I looked at 1:34 and it looks a lot like the effect I'm hoping to achieve. I'll run some tests tomorrow. What I'll be using it on is poor "white pine, #2 or better" from the HD here in San Diego. We'll see how it goes.


----------



## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

yep I just looked, at 1:34 bottom of the Rt page .. hope it helps.,.. Duck Dynasty was a bit boring tonight , so I played on the puter .

Also remember , the more iron /steel and the longer the mix sits, the better, some good old rusty bolts/nails works even better .. nothing galvanized ..

If you don't get what you want Pm me , As Mr T said in one of the Rocky movies, " I Got allota mo"


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

I've had some steel wool soaking in a quart of vinegar since yesterday. Should be ready for testing in another day or two. Another quick question, if I may: can I treat the wood, let it dry, and then glue? This solution won't affect gluing, will it?


----------



## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

It shouldn't, but I have not tried it .. do a test, I would at least , give the contact points a little scuff sand with some 320 or so , to be sure the glue can get a bite. There is no finish or sealant involved, but the scuff for me just spells "make sure"


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

That's what I'll do, then. I can't see any reason that it wouldn't work, since there are no oils or waxes involved.
I'll run tests, of course.


----------



## wseand (Jan 27, 2010)

Come on Charles, I could see a Neil Cam in your future. "Life of Neil"


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

Will the entire boxed set be available for $19.95, plus shipping and handling? I'd buy it just to watch him perform his magic.


----------



## wseand (Jan 27, 2010)

It comes with a free set of Ginsu Steak Knives, and a bag of #0000 steel wool.


----------



## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

Neil cam , Da*n it's almost that way now, I have an on line Woodworking show ,an on line finishing class. I feel like I spend my life in front of a camera . Who would have thunk ? . I dislike cameras , and they dislike me, but I tolerate. I am a woodworker and finisher, just like you , just maybe a little more experienced .

Definition of experience : mistake + mistake + mistake + mistake !


----------



## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

dawson .. sent you a Pm


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

Okay, you had me with the Ginsu Steak Knives, but I was hoping for two bags of #0000 steel wool. I have a feeling that I'll be going through a fair amount of that stuff.


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

Charles. I sent you a PM. EM to come.


----------



## wseand (Jan 27, 2010)

You can get a second bag free as long as you pay for S&H which is $19.95.

Charles, 
Your problem is you have to love the camera and it will love you back, its a give a take relationship.


----------



## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

ok , time to say good night , but I will leave you with this :

2 of the most "interesting " emails I have gotten recently , and I get a few emails , ( average about 150-200 a day)

one guy ask me to " define wipe "

the second is what made me think of this , It was about the steel wool and vinegar stuff, guy wanted to know if he could use " synthetic " steel wool, Aka " scotch bright"

nite all .


----------



## wseand (Jan 27, 2010)

nite charles


----------



## dawsonbob (Aug 5, 2013)

wseand. You mean they won't throw in a second bag for free with the original order? I thought there was always a thing where they say "But wait! Order now, and we'll double your order." What kind of deal is that, or have I been watching the wrong channel?


----------



## wseand (Jan 27, 2010)

Nothing is free Dawson, Ship and Handling is probably as much as the original price. One of these days I should order something and find out just how much that is.


----------



## DonyaRurles (Jan 22, 2014)

Hair extensions and hairpieces really can help to improve the looking of people and help to change them a lot hair extensions and hairpieces if choosing the right type and right style of hair wigs for you, of course that you will look and become more and more attractive and also buy cheap hair wigs now is easy as you can just get the ideal style that you want online at online shops now. I have just buy me a bob wigs and it is perfect.


----------



## Blondewood (Mar 30, 2009)

I used the tea after letting the vinegar/sw dry and got a nice gray to light brown color. I rubbed with steel wool afterwards in areas to further variegate the colors. I rubbed the pine with a steel brush first to help it absorb the liquids.


----------



## Manitario (Jul 4, 2010)

This has been a very informative topic; I've had a jar of vinegar and steel wool soaking for about 2 years…waiting for the right project. Very helpful advice Mr. Neil! 
My favourite part though is from DonyaRurles about hairpieces….what a great discussion this has been, advice on finishing and on hairpieces…


----------



## Blessedwalnut (Sep 12, 2015)

Hi, I know this has been a while since anyone posted here, but did anyone use a knotting solution on the pine before applying the vinegar solution?
Also, any recommendations for weatherproofing after without loosing the colour?


----------

