# Pratt and Lambert #38 replacement?



## RipFence (Jan 10, 2011)

EDIT: Can any of you comment on Old Masters Super Varnish? Claims to be a "High quality transparent alkyd varnish". 
Thanks,
Jim

Hello All:
I'm going to mix up some 1/3 1/3, 1/3 Sam Maloof/ Bob Flexner finish. In the past I have used Pratt and Lambert #38 but its no longer available. 
Could any of you tell me what is the closest available substitute? 
The project is a Stickley 336 but with inverse tapered legs like the 2340. The whole thing is done in maple and I really want to avoid amber shift over time. 
Thanks,
Jim


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## Kazooman (Jan 20, 2013)

I Googled Pratt and Lambert 38 to learn about it and found some evidence that it is available again. Have you looked recently or are you relying on remembering that it had gone off the market? If it has returned the current product might not be identical to the original stuff.

Well, That information was from a page on the P and L website from 2019, but I couldn't find a retailer with it in stock. The search did turn up a discussion about substitutes at the Sawmill Creek forum.


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## RipFence (Jan 10, 2011)

My information came direct from the local retailer an hour ago. He said they are touting a product called Fabulon as the closest replacement but I wanted to hear from Lumberjocks. 
My searches turned up all those hits as well. The Sawmill Creek thread only had Formby's Tung Oil Finish as a substitute and its shockingly expensive. 
Best wishes,
Jim


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

I think it was discontinued, and now it's been brought back. But it's still very hard to find. Here's an on-line source, and there are no doubt others if you search. the thing there isn't exactly a substitute for it. 38 is a soya oil/alkyd resin formula, and to my knowledge there are no others. There used to be several, now all discontinued. There is an alkyd resin varnish available, but it's made with linseed oil as the drying oil component. It's a veru good product, but quite a bit darker than 38. Anyway, it used to be SW Fast Dry Oil Varnish, and they have relabeled it as Minwax Fast Dry Oil Varnish…usually available only at SW paint stores.


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## Kazooman (Jan 20, 2013)

Hi Fred, your link to US Paint Supply was what had me thinking 38 was available again. Perhaps it is, but they list it as out of stock. I guess it would be worth a call to them to ask.


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## RipFence (Jan 10, 2011)

The retailer that I talked to said they had temporarily discontinued it some years ago and then brought it back. Now they have discontinued it again. Hence the confusion.


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

The P&L site shows it as being available (I guess), but the sites aren't often kept up to date. I think I'd call P&L and ask. If they still make it, they may be able to give you a source.


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## RipFence (Jan 10, 2011)

Hello All: I contacted Pratt and Lambert and got the following response. Looks like that ship has sailed. So back to my original question; what else would you use as a replacement?

***
Dear Jim:

Thank you for contacting the Pratt & Lambert website.

We have, unfortunately, discontinued the #38 Clear Varnish. We have no remaining stock of this product line in our warehouses, but you may occasionally find some in stock at retailers or online ordering services.

Our parent company owns Minwax - so you may want to check out their website to see what types of clear protective coats they currently have available. Here is a link to their site: https://www.minwax.com/wood-products/clear-protective-finishes/

Please let me know if you have any further questions or concerns.

Regards,


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

Sad news indeed, the magic (and low cost, I suspect) of "poly" has done it in.


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## RipFence (Jan 10, 2011)

Can any of you comment on Old Masters Super Varnish? Claims to be a "High quality transparent alkyd varnish". 
Thanks,
Jim


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

That's another one that I thought was discontinued. I just checked and could not find it on the Old Masters site. Maybe I need to add some to my stash. The one thing abpout it I could never figure out was whteher they used linseed oil versus soya oil (or something else) in the formula.


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## RipFence (Jan 10, 2011)

I just found this thread indicating that it is indeed soya. I've also contacted Old Masters and will post what they tell me.


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

I would be interested in what they say…notice I started that thread in 2011….so anything mentioned is quite old.


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## RipFence (Jan 10, 2011)

Ha, small world! Okay they got back to me. First response was that it was an Alkyd varnish. I replied with yes, but what oil is in it Then they sent me the MSDS and I've pasted the ingredients below. Must be almost all thinner/solvent. Sheesh.

Chemical Name CAS No. Weight-% Trade Secret
Solvent Naphtha, Medium Aliphatic 64742-88-7 30 - 60 *
Mineral Spirits (Rule 66) 64742-47-8 10 - 30 *
Xylene 1330-20-7 1 - 5 *
Stoddard Solvent 8052-41-3 0.1 - 1 *
Methyl Ethyl Ketoxime 96-29-7 0.1 - 1 *
Ethyl Benzene 100-41-4 0.1 - 1 *
_


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## wapakfred (Jul 29, 2011)

Well, if you refer back to my old post I mentioned the MSDS didn't offer any clues. Anway, should you opt to try some (and I might just to see for myself) the Paint Store lists it at about $17/qt.


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## RipFence (Jan 10, 2011)

The discussion with Old Masters continues. I got this email this morning. Still don't know what's in it but its NOT linseed oil.

I have asked our General Manager and our Product Manager and neither one of them know. It definitely is not Linseed oil - that would have to be listed on the SDS I sent you.

I have a request into our chemist to see if they can answer this for me. I will let you know what I find out.


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