# DAMAGE - Will shellac UNDER poly get cloudy if a hot mug is rested on it?



## gargey (Apr 11, 2016)

Hi Guys,

I know a downside of shellac is that water or heat can damage it. On the plus side it can be repaired. But if you put a water-based poly on top of it to protect it, it cannot be (easily) repaired.

Here's the question:

*If you put (in my case water-based) poly on top of shellac, you will protect it from moisture, but what about heat?*

Basically, I'm considering finishing a cherry side-table with a few coats of shellac and then water-based poly on top, but don't want to risk "sealing in" damaged shellac if someone puts a hot cup of coffee on top of it.

Anyone have experience with this?

I know I could skip the shellac, but water-based doesn't have that much life (popping grain) on its own. I plan to avoid oil-based because in this case I want to avoid the darkening/yellowing effect.

Thanks


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## gargey (Apr 11, 2016)

Anyone?


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

Are you honestly wondering why no one is responding to your post? If so, please reread your most recent comment on wahoos latest post.

http://lumberjocks.com/projects/87421

Do you even google bro?


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

I hate trolls


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## gargey (Apr 11, 2016)

chrisstef - just trying to keep the whole world from going insane. seems like some guys could post a picture of a turd and get 50 "wow great job!"

TheFridge - The word "troll" does not mean what you think it means.


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

So you're saying you're the judge and the jury. Got it. Let me know where I can send you part of my salary. I certainly must owe you some tax money for your wonderful service to mankind.


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## gargey (Apr 11, 2016)

I'm not bull********************ting anyone. I'm truthful and direct. I don't feel the need to post bull******************** like this:



> So you re saying you re the judge and the jury. Got it. Let me know where I can send you part of my salary. I certainly must owe you some tax money for your wonderful service to mankind.
> - chrisstef


Sorry if you can't handle a little bit of reality. Later.


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

Have you ever heard of coasters, trivets and hot pads????


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

We can all determine our own reality, I do not need yours to validate mine. I'm very capable of thinking all on my own.

Your truthful and direct comes off a pompous and arrogant and its got no place amongst many of the fine individuals around here from whom ive seen many wonderful acts of kindness. You should try doing something nice for someone besides yourself once in a while. It might loosen up those underpants a little. I think theyre squeezing a bit too tight.


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## bobasaurus (Sep 6, 2009)

You could give it a try on some scrap and see what happens. I would probably not do the shellac and stick to just poly or some other heat-resistant varnish.


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

Didn't know trolls had feelings.


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## gargey (Apr 11, 2016)

> You could give it a try on some scrap and see what happens. I would probably not do the shellac and stick to just poly or some other heat-resistant varnish.
> 
> - bobasaurus


Thanks, good suggestion, don't know why I haven't done that already.


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## gargey (Apr 11, 2016)

> We can all determine our own reality, I do not need yours to validate mine. ... You should try doing something nice for someone besides yourself once in a while. It might loosen up those underpants a little. I think theyre squeezing a bit too tight.
> 
> - chrisstef


OK confucious. You're the one who has a problem with me, is putting words in my mouth (judge & jury), and is trying to tell me how I should be. Not the other way around. So "I do not need yours to validate mine" is a little misguided.

Also, no one is forcing you to participate in thread. You chose to mess it up.

...

Oh and by the way, here's another piece of bull********************:



> You should try doing something nice for someone besides yourself once in a while.
> - chrisstef


I'm not pretending to know anything about you, why are you pretending to know anything about me? Do you have a basis for making that statement? I prefer to argue on merits.


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## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

to address the question, your correct the poly will handle the water, heat is a different animal, and nothing tolerates that really well, oil's do best. To Get the warming effect of a solvent or oil, I personally would do a coat o or 2 of Arm R Seal, its a urethane and does super well, I would use gloss, just to avoid any streaking from a satin or Semi gloss.

Let is dry at least 36 hours, more if you can, it dries well and hard, then do a light scuff sand ( more of a wipe) with some 600, as long as it powders its dry , the do your WB poly and you should do fine. It in MHO would be better than shellac.

Now this will throw you a curve ball, but it works well, if your wood is blotch prone, then do a wipe with some water, just to dampen, then do the Arm R Seal over it,immediately , the water will prevent the oil from being readily absorbed, and help prevent blotching, I know it sounds like it shouldnt work but it , does, .. try it, you will see, I learned this quite by mistake. Good luck


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## gargey (Apr 11, 2016)

Charles-

Interesting. Water+oil sounds scary, but I'm not afraid to test it out and see how it goes. Cherry can be blotchy…

I like shellac thus far, but maybe I should listen to the chorus and only use it in low-abuse situations.

Thanks


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## gargey (Apr 11, 2016)

> Have you ever heard of coasters, trivets and hot pads????
> 
> - AlaskaGuy


Do you expect family and friends to *unfailingly* use them? Would you risk hours of handwork knowing that ONE instance of failure could ruin the finish? Do you now understand why I am asking the (OP) question?


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## chrisstef (Mar 3, 2010)

Sucks when someone garbles up your thread with negativity don't it? Even more of a shame that your post was so inflammatory on Wahoo's thread that it's recently deleted by admin. All I'm sayin, brotherman, is that you get what ya give. Give negativity and ya get negativity.

FWIW I think the poly will shield the shellac from white ringing on ya. If ya need more protection from shellac go with button or seed lac if that's your final finish.


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## CharlesNeil (Oct 21, 2007)

Gargey,

I was writing my finishing book, and I had a little guy helping me, we had a bunch of cherry boards out and doing all sorts of different things, in any event he wiped a board kinda wet, then put a coat of Arm R Seal over it, he had gotten confused, I was squealing "NO NO NO", but it was done. We let it dry and amazingly, the blotching was dramatically reduced, SO we tried it again and again , same result, tested adhesion , no issue.

This is where we found that its not the color the solvent or oil product imparts, its the reaction the tannins in the wood have to the solvent, if you have a blotch prone wood, the faster the oil or solvent dries, the less blotching . Stuff like BLO , pure tung or others oils , that dry slow and can migrate to the softer grains and for lack of a better word , puddle , and just sit there the worse the blotching is.


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## gargey (Apr 11, 2016)

Interesting. Thx


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## dalepage (Feb 6, 2016)

I'm fairly certain that I've never seen so much worthless psychobabble in one post.


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

Ha! Long story short

Gargey is a partial troll. I don't think many people like him and apparently it's fine with him because he keeps opening his mouth in other threads.


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## Mahdeew (Jul 24, 2013)

I like your idea and will try it on some mahogany.


> to address the question, your correct the poly will handle the water, heat is a different animal, and nothing tolerates that really well, oil s do best. To Get the warming effect of a solvent or oil, I personally would do a coat o or 2 of Arm R Seal, its a urethane and does super well, I would use gloss, just to avoid any streaking from a satin or Semi gloss.
> 
> Let is dry at least 36 hours, more if you can, it dries well and hard, then do a light scuff sand ( more of a wipe) with some 600, as long as it powders its dry , the do your WB poly and you should do fine. It in MHO would be better than shellac.
> 
> ...


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