# Older Hegner Multimax - upgrade?



## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

I'm curious to hear from anyone who does fretwork on an older Hegner that doesn't have the quick tension release or quick-clamp. I recently picked up a 1991 Multimax 18 thinking it would be an upgrade to my Delta (40-601), but now I question that logic. Do you get used to the longish blade installation sequence and fiddly clamp arrangement? Is it almost required to get at least the quick-clamp they have if you want to do lots of fretwork? What you Hegner owners/users think.

Cheers,
Brad


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## PaulDoug (Sep 26, 2013)

I have a Hegner but it has the both the upper arm quick tension release and I have a quick clamp installed on it. But my answer would be no I would not get use to not having these. You might check with Advanced Machinery (https://www.advmachinery.com/), they have an updated upper arm for some of the older models of Hegners that has the quick tension release on it. I think it is around a $200 upgrade, so depending on what you paid for your saw, and what condition it is in, would have a bearing on whether it would be worth getting the upgrade.

It would be worth calling and asking, they are great people to deal with.

The "Quick Clamp" is definitely worth having.


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## kelvancra (May 4, 2010)

I had an older Hegner (single speed) and swapped the blade locking bolt for a knurled knob, akin to what the later Hegners run. It worked great for speeding up upper blade mounts and dismounts.

As long as the hex screw on the opposite side is set right, the knob, coming in from the other side, locks the blades at center.

I sold the older Hegner and ended up with a newer, variable speed unit with the front tension release. In the course of looking up info on the newer one, I learned about the flip system for the back tensioner PaulDoug mentions. It beats having to adjust the knob every time you want to release tension.

I believe you can swap the arm too, so you'd get the front release.

Remember, you're playing with a saw which, new, is over a grand, vs the Delta. As such, a quick release on top and a better tensioner may be well worth the money. In the end, put it up on the market for five hundred and see how quickly people jump to get it.






In between the older and new Hegner, I picked up an RBI for a couple hundred. Sold it to my friend and used the money toward the other Hegner, when it became available. Add to this fray, I had a Delta I gave away. When it's all said and done, the Hegner is, by far, my favorite. It runs smoother, and getting to the lower blade lock was much easier.


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

Thanks for the input! I did send AMI an email, but have not yet received a reply from them. Based on everything I've read and heard, it looks like the rear tension rod upgrade, along with a quick clamp is what is needed to make doing fretwork easier.



> Remember, you're playing with a saw which, new, is over a grand, vs the Delta.


Yeah, that is what kind of surprised me. I've read hundreds of reviews and 'which saw' threads over the years, and it's almost universally accepted that the Hegner, Hawk and Excalibur are the top tier machines - with the Hegner being the most expensive by far. That is why I jumped on this one when it made itself available, and why I was quite taken back when features that I have been used to having on my lowly Delta were non-existent on the Hegner.

But my Delta isn't one of those cheap Asian built things either… it was the last model Delta made in the US and has features that even the present day Hegners don't - such as a tilting *and* rotating table and a PMDC motor that has a 40 to 2000 SPM range along with a LED digital speed readout. It's also all cast iron and weighs at least twice what the Hegner does, even though both have the same 18" capacity. It is a C-arm machine though, which has a very different cutting action than the parallel arm arrangement of the Hegner.



> ... depending on what you paid for your saw, and what condition it is in, would have a bearing on whether it would be worth getting the upgrade.


Well, I didn't pay much for the Delta when I first got it ($35 used), and I paid even less for the Hegner, so I suppose throwing ~$100 at it for the upgrades is a worthy action. The Hegner is in like new condition and came with all the original stuff it shipped with, as well as a few books, a bunch of extra blades (in addition to the ones shipped with the saw) and the optional star handle for the upper blade clamp. It also had the welded stand, foot pedal and magnifying light. I am pretty confident that if I don't like the machine I can re-sell it for way more than I have into it, but I am really hoping that it can become my go-to saw in the future.

Cheers,
Brad


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## ibewjon (Oct 2, 2010)

What a great find. I got two 14" Hefner saws for $90 each. I didn't need two, but figured it was cheaper than any major replacement parts I may need. Still looking for a steal, I mean deal like you got on a larger model. Enjoy.


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

> Still looking for a steal, I mean deal like you got on a larger model.


Don't get the wrong idea, it wasn't exactly a steal - I got it as an even trade for another machine (lunchbox planer) I had… and had to drive 2 hours one way to make the swap. I admit that I probably got the better end of the deal, but both of us were more than happy with the arrangement after all was said and done.

Getting back to the 'upgrade' queston… I did hear back from AMI. Actually, I believe it was the President of the company who wrote me back. He said that back in the day, before they had the tension release or quick clamp, he used to demonstrate the Hegner saws at trade shows a lot. Claims he could do the blade swaps for internal cuts in about 10 seconds! He basically implied that once you develop that rhythm for the blade change, it becomes second nature. I guess I can see how that may be possible after lots and lots of practice. I also realize that they came up with the tension release and quick clamp for a reason! Regardless, they are going to get back to me on the availability of an upgrade to the tension system (new upper arm or rear 'cam' tension rod) and quick clamp. I really love how smooth and quiet it is, so I'm determined to make this my primary machine.

Cheers,
Brad


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## kelvancra (May 4, 2010)

My buddy loves the RBI I traded my old, single speed Hegner for, but remarks on how smooth the Hegner is in comparison.

While I loved the variable speed of the RBI, I hated that the angle set for the table was in front of the blade holder.

I like the simplicity of the Hegner holders, compared to the RBI, even though the Hegner version is overpriced, again, compared to the RBI. After the Hegner without one, I did love the tension release on the RBI.

In the end, I'm glad I made the jump, and so is my buddy. From it all, I'd say the tension release is a bigger improvement than the quick clamp, which is attached to the side of my saw via a neodymium magnet, so takes less than a second to grab.


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## Finn (May 26, 2010)

I have two single speed Hegners that I like, but I do not do any fretwork. I have the quick clamp on them and it works well. Without that, I would not recommend a Hegner for fretwork.


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

Just heard back from customer support and thought I'd pass their message on to anyone else considering an upgrade to an older machine. There were two front table supports used over the years. Apparently, the early models had a support that protruded out at a 45 degree angle, and later ones were straight up. If the machine has an angled support, then the arm replacement is NOT recommended. They say it was not designed to handle the extra weight and "the front tension lever causes an imbalance and would create an excessive vibration and rattling resulting in undo wear in the machine."

Mine does indeed have the angled bracket (see picture below), so they recommend using the upgraded rear tension rod with the cam lever on top instead.










Cheers,
Brad


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

Thought I would update this to give a bit more info that may be useful to others. I went ahead and ordered the quick clamp and quick tension release upgrades - total was a tad over $100, and after using it a bit, feel it was well worth it. The tension release, being in the rear, is perhaps not as convenient as the newer front release, but it's still a world of difference from not having one at all!










Then a few days ago, a 1992 Hegner M18-VS popped up on CL about an hour from me. It was in a little rougher shape than my 1991 model, but I noticed it had the upper arm with the tension release up front, even though it had the same angled table support as mine - which went against what AMI had recommended. Wanting to verify what AMI had said, I went back and looked at the pictures they sent me to determine which table support I had - and the one that showed the angled support also had the front mounted tension release arm! Go figure.

So I went ahead and snagged the '92 Hegner just because of that upper arm:










I look at it as getting the upper arm for over $100 less than buying it from AMI, and got the rest of the machine thrown in for good measure. It also came with a bunch of extras, like the dust collection tubing/fittings, a bunch of extra blade clamps, original manual and some other goodies. Only thing wrong with it, besides the cosmetics, is the bellows had dry-rotted and needs to be replaced.

Speaking of the bellows - they want ~$50 + shipping for an OEM part. I have read that many people were able to use CV Joint boots instead for significantly less money (~$10 at local auto parts store). Yet, nobody seems to be able to point to a specific part #. Closest I have seen is that the ones for a Mini Cooper work, but there appear to be several different boots that were used on those cars depending on stuff like model year and left or right side of vehicle. I also see some on e-bay, but those are not much cheaper than the OEM ones. Has anyone gone this (CV boot) route? It would be great if we could come up with a specific part number that works. I'm not a big fan of trial and error if I can avoid it 

Cheers,
Brad


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## ibewjon (Oct 2, 2010)

Or skip the bellows and hook the dust blower to the air compressor with a regulator to adjust the air pressure low enough.


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## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

I'm still rocking the Delta 40-601 and I haven't had the opportunity to use a nicer machine but occasionally I look despite having negative room for any additional machines. Is the Hegner that much better? I've found no short comings yet with the Delta and mine was in excellent, rarely used condition when I picked it up. Heck, I was only kind of interested as my son was showing scroll proficency with a skinny blade on the 14" bandsaw but I felt a scroll saw would be a little safer.


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

> I'm still rocking the Delta 40-601 and I haven't had the opportunity to use a nicer machine but occasionally I look despite having negative room for any additional machines. *Is the Hegner that much better*?


Honestly, you aren't missing much… IMO, that Delta has better blade clamps (and no need for different sizes), ability to tilt AND rotate the table, and a wider speed range along with that cool digital speed display. The Hegner does run smoother, is much simpler in design, and parts are still available - although they are on the expensive side. The only reason I now have the two Hegners (and a like new Delta Q-3 as seen in picture above) is pure luck. Always remember, the best deals come along when you aren't looking for them and least expect them! I have long since run out of space, so of the four saws, I'm still trying to figure out which ones I want to keep, and which ones will go. That Delta Q-3 is also a sweet machine and the tool-less blade changes are a joy to use. Time will tell.

As for the bellows… hooking it up to a compressor isn't really an option, and I really don't want to go the aquarium air pump route either… just another thing to mess with. I took the measurements needed, and think I found a CV boot that will work. Got it off Amazon for $15 and should have it by Monday to test.

Cheers,
Brad


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

Update; Got the CV boot today (a day early), and it's a *100% success*! Total cost was $14.12 ($13.20 + tax) with free shipping from Amazon:









It's from All Balls Racing and is their part #19-5024. The top and bottom diameters are slightly smaller (~5mm) than needed, so it stretches and makes a good tight fit. And the length is a bit longer than needed, but that isn't really a problem as it scrunches down easily.

It was designed for some pretty tough service as a CV boot, therefore it should last a really long time in this application. And they claim the boot fits a bunch of different vehicles, so I doubt the supply will run out any time soon. Air flow seems identical to my other saw with the OEM bellows installed. Looks and works great, should last longer and is cheaper than OEM. Couldn't ask for anything more other than maybe choice of color 

Cheers,
Brad


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## ibewjon (Oct 2, 2010)

Thanks Brad…just ordered one for the 18" saw I recently picked up. I was going to go the air compressor route, but this is easier at that price. Great idea.


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## ibewjon (Oct 2, 2010)

Arrived today. VERY tight fit, won't need any clamps to hold it. Thanks


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

Duplicate post deleted
(Darn mouse messing up!)


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

> Arrived today. VERY tight fit, won t need any clamps to hold it. Thanks
> - ibewjon


Strange, I didn't find it all that tight - but definitely good and snug. Almost the same as with the OEM bellows, which don't use clamps either. I found it quite easy to scrunch the boot up and install it on the arm first, then stretch the bottom around the base.

I'm also curious if it will work as well on the other machines (other than the Multimax 18). The replacement bellows sold on e-bay says it will work for all Multimax and Polymax machines, so I'm guessing they all have roughly the same dimensions.

BTW: I did find a bellows that had basically the exact measurements for the top and bottom mount, but figured it would be loose and require clamps. If anyone wants to give it a try, it's a universal boot FB3001 and costs about $22 on Amazon. I measured 28mm for the upper connection and 84.4 for the base, which match almost identically - but the length only needs to be ~80mm and that universal boot is listed as being 148mm, or almost twice as long as needed.

Cheers,
Brad


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

Just another FYI regarding replacement parts - this time, the blower hose. The M18 I bought with the missing bellows also had the wrong blower hose installed. It was actually using the hose for the dust collection system, which is larger and didn't fit quite right, resulting in some air loss and other irregularities - so I wanted to replace it as well.

Fortunately, you can still get a replacement hose from Advanced Machinery for just under $20 ($9.95 + another $9.95 shipping). But the specs show it as a pretty common 8mm O.D. hose with a 6mm I.D. and approx. 34 inches long. A quick search turned up plenty of sources, but about the best deal I could find was a 10 meter (32.8 feet) roll for $12.99 on Amazon.










The description says it is 'clear', but it's really a translucent whitish, just like the original tubing. I really don't like shorting Advanced Machinery on a sale, but I just couldn't see paying over $6 a foot (including shipping) for something as simple as tubing that could be found much cheaper elsewhere.

Note: You really need to get the metric sized tubing. I originally tried to use some 1/4-inch I.D. tubing from my local BORG, hoping that the ~0.01" difference (6mm = 0.236") wouldn't matter much. Didn't work… it was too loose on the upper connection and didn't fit right into the bellows base. Lesson learned 

Cheers,
Brad


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## ibewjon (Oct 2, 2010)

And that's the problem. I don't like paying high prices to dealers, but if they don't sell enough parts, they may discontinue them like other sellers have. Just a thought…


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## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

Parts, actual proprietary parts I get but if a company needs over a 1500% markup on readily available materials, it's too late, they're already doomed.


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## ibewjon (Oct 2, 2010)

But that air line has a bevel cut on one end! Can't get it that way at a big box or hardware store. I do agree some parts from all suppliers are way overpriced. But I think of the new delta stopping parts for older machines. Others have done the same. And Advanced recently sold me a used arm for my 18", instead of selling me a brand new one for double the money.


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

> But that air line has a bevel cut on one end! Can't get it that way at a big box or hardware store. I do agree some parts from all suppliers are way overpriced.


I know it was tongue in cheek, but the air line doesn't have a bevel cut on the end - at least the stock one I have doesn't (but the dust collection system one does  Even if you ignore shipping, it is just some pretty standard tubing that they are charging roughly $3.50 a foot for; which is $3.10 more a foot than what I found at Amazon. However, one of the key features of owning a Hegner is parts availability, even on older machines. That has been a cornerstone of their success, and perhaps the only reason why they can get away with, in most cases, way higher prices than anyone else could. I doubt they want to risk that.



> But I think of the new delta stopping parts for older machines.


The new Delta didn't stop supplying parts for older machines because people were buying them at the local hardware store instead… they don't supply those parts because they can't, even if they wanted to. It started back when Pentair owned them, and then Black and Decker killed what was left, so the current owner of Delta never had a chance. You may want to read this thread over at OWWM where a Delta sales rep lays it out in pretty good detail:

Delta Parts Availabilty?

Cheers,
Brad


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## ibewjon (Oct 2, 2010)

I will look into that thread. But the piece of tubing I recently got from them did come with a beveled end to match the tube to the arm angle







Well, almost match the arm angle. I purchased $480 of various parts for two saws, and paid $24 shipping. I guess it pays to buy in bulk. I was rebuilding a saw with a broken arm and some parts missing or broken. Nice to have parts available.


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## prazbotta (May 20, 2020)

I picked up a Hegner 16 for $300 and got the rear tension quick release and a bellows for it from Advanced Machinery. I don't mind paying a good price for a good product, but I also agree the tubing is WAY overpriced for what it is. When (not if) my bellows drys out and cracks, I will go with the CV boot as well. Thanks for the detail!

I also agree the quick release tension upgrade was well worth the money. I don't do fretwork often, but I do enjoy scrolling. My Hegner did not replace, but supplements my Walker Turner Driver Line saw. Talk about a process to swap a blade. But I got used to it, and since it is all up front, it's not too bad. Now I use the Walker Turner for simple cuts, and the Hegner for fretwork.


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