# Selecting A Hand Plane (*UPDATE * bought one...ok, now two)



## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

Hi Guys! 
I have been watching, with great interest for a while now, the group of guys that buy and refurbish hand planes.
My experience with hand planes is limited to the little Stanley Block Plane that I bought about 15 years ago for a specific project I was working on.

My question(s) for you fine people is this:

What type of plane do you recommend I look for? I have been looking at Stanley #5's on e-bay.

What price range if fair for the plane you recommend?

What venue should I be looking at to find one?

Thank you in advance for your input/advise.


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## diverlloyd (Apr 25, 2013)

Local auctions (auctionzip.com)is the best place to find them. Usually pick them up for a couple bucks. I like the bedrocks but the stanleys are good to as long as they are old. Im sure there will be the veritas and lee valley guys saying buy them and they are good planes but for the price of one you can invest in a couple stanleys and sharpening products. Then if you like them move on up to the more expensive ones but as long as they are sharp they all do the same job. 5's are good planes i also use 3's a lot i would think around $20 is a good starting price for any plane.


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## them700project (Aug 12, 2015)

From what i can tell the older ones are much better.(ww2 era). I watched something I think it was a jay bates comparison between a veritas , a bedrock, and a harbor freight. that compares outright cost amount of labor needed to repair and tune. The thought was that buying a veritas and putting 15 minutes into a blade sharpening is cheeper than buying a vintage stanley and putting 15 hours into restoration.


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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

It depends on whether refurbing planes is part of your hobby. If it is a business, time is money. I have really enjoyed cleaning up old planes.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> It depends on whether refurbing planes is part of your hobby. If it is a business, time is money. I have really enjoyed cleaning up old planes.
> 
> - Ocelot


I kind of like the idea of buying a used plane and cleaning it up so that I could use it myself. I thought it might be a good learning experience.
Not interested in buying and selling.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> From what i can tell the older ones are much better.(ww2 era). I watched something I think it was a jay bates comparison between a veritas , a bedrock, and a harbor freight. that compares outright cost amount of labor needed to repair and tune. The thought was that buying a veritas and putting 15 minutes into a blade sharpening is cheeper than buying a vintage stanley and putting 15 hours into restoration.
> 
> - them700project


I saw Jay's video (regular subscriber to his channel) but there are so many types and brands that it is a little overwhelming. What I really need is advice on what to keep my eye open for and what is a fair fair price range for a 'fir-r-upper'. 
Thank you for your response.


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## diverlloyd (Apr 25, 2013)

It shouldn't take longer then a hour to restore one. Unless its spent flattening the back of the blade.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> Local auctions (auctionzip.com)is the best place to find them. Usually pick them up for a couple bucks. I like the bedrocks but the stanleys are good to as long as they are old. Im sure there will be the veritas and lee valley guys saying buy them and they are good planes but for the price of one you can invest in a couple stanleys and sharpening products. Then if you like them move on up to the more expensive ones but as long as they are sharp they all do the same job. 5 s are good planes i also use 3 s a lot i would think around $20 is a good starting price for any plane.
> 
> - diverlloyd


Thank you Lloyd!


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Usually a Jack plane like a #5…...a Jointer like a #6, #7 or #8, and then a smooth plane….like a #3 or #4 size.

The Jointers will cost the most, due to their size. jacks are all over the place…maybe around..$20 for a GOOD jack plane. Smooth planes….seen some as low as $5, and some as high as $100….for used planes.

Jointers run about $100 and up.

Vintage plane makers include not only those Stanleys, but Millers Falls, Sargent , and Ohio Tool Co. for the good planes out there.

As long as you can actually lay your hands on one, and look it over…..you can soon find a good plane in the group.


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## diverlloyd (Apr 25, 2013)

No problem 99% of the time they go for $5 bucks here and the veritas and valleys go for around $50. Good luck and if you buy a rusty one evaporust works great as does brass brushes in a drill press and I start with 80grit sand paper then to 180.


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## EricTwice (Dec 9, 2016)

What would I recommend? #3, #4, #5, #7, a block plane, a rebate, and anything else you just happen across.

If I am looking at used planes, I generally figure the price by percentage. 
Like new, 65-75%
Used, good shape 50% of new 
requires work depends how much work is required. (usually 5$ or less)

No matter what the price (Unless it is already crazy) I try to talk them down. Remember the old proverb "Bad, Bad, says the buyer, then he goes away and brags."

I frequent yard sales and flea markets in season. I bought a Stanley #3 (1930s era corrugated sole) Lovely condition for 3$. (asking price, I even asked him if he was sure it was right)
I have bought from ebay. Be careful about condition. Look for the miss marked stuff. I bought a "Staley #4 for 5$ and then Had to have the bakley #3 to go with it. I believe I paid 6.50 for it.

I just got a birthday present from my sister. The hand dovetailed wooden box is marked $5.99. Inside is a Stanley England #71 (complete) that shows no sign of use. (She paid 5.99 for it) Look around, the deals are out there.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

Thanks for all the great comments and info fellas!
I've been a power tool guy since I started so branching off into hand tools can be a bit intimidating. 
You have given me a lot to think about and I will report back with what I find.
Have a great weekend!


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

I've usually had to pay around $25-30 on eBay for a plane I feel pretty good about bidding on. I don't worry about minor missing parts too much or broken totes. Those are problems easily remedied. Especially broken totes.

A fine wire wheel for a bench grinder and a 1" wire cup for a drill press will take care of most rust removal efforts.


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## HokieKen (Apr 14, 2015)

I'd recommend starting with a #4 or #5 both for ease of rehab and for being good all-around users. I'd watch eBay if you don't have local options (antique stores and auction houses are usually the cheapest buys). Don't be married to Stanley but don't buy no-names either. Stanley, Sargent, Ohio Tool, Millers Falls are all good choices. Just beware of their "value" lines like Stanley Handyman and Millers Falls V-line. Look for planes that are complete and that don't have any broken castings. You can repair or replace knobs and totes if you need to. Beware of missing screws. The threads used in older planes are no longer common threads so you can't just run to the hardware store and pick up replacements.

You should be able to pick up old 4 or 5s for $25-$50 shipped depending on condition. If you're patient, you can do better but that's a fair range IMO.


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## diverlloyd (Apr 25, 2013)

Uh the handy man series only thing I have succeeded with the one I have is turning my hand blue and constantly trying to keep it working while I'm working.


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

Ditto


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## wormil (Nov 19, 2011)

I wouldn't worry to much about price. You will own it for the rest of your life and in ten years you won't care if you paid $5 or $15 too much. If you plan on using it then don't buy the cheapest, buy one in great condition. And if you don't already have good sharpening equipment, invest well there too. A dull tool will never get used.


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## seadonkey (Jan 24, 2017)

check out mid west tool collectors. They have meet ups in a variety of areas where you can find great tools and knowledgeable people to discuss them with. I am just getting started and went to a meet up and walked out with a #3, #5, a Sargent somewhere between those two, and a block plane. I spent about $30, and got to talk to some really great guys. You do have to join, but it's well worth it


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

Thank you ALL very much for your comments.
You gave me a lot of really good information and advice and it is sincerely appreciated.


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

I'm late to the discussion.

Bench Planes:

Smoother #3-4 1/2 perhaps 5 1/2 Your choice based on how big your hands are and how heavy you like your planes.
Stock removal #4, #5, #27, #40 or #40 1/2. Scrub plane or course tuned bench planes.
Straitening #6, #7 or #8. 7 and 8 are true jointers, 6 is a fore plane but some people like them.

Good Low angle block plane 60 1/2 or 65

Joinery plane

Router plane #71
Shoulder Plane - lots of choices 
Rabbit plane - lots of choices

Grooving plane

Record 043/044, Stanley/Record 50

Combination planes ( Complex to use)

45 or 55

All sizes are Stanley unless noted otherwise.

What to buy advise on bench planes.

If you don't know how to recognize quality bench planes choose any Stanley with a 1910 patent date behind the frog. Either 1902 twice and 1910 or 1910 by itself. I'm targeting 1910 to 1940ish planes. This is an easy way to identify them. Once you have restored a quality plane or two, you will be able to pick them out. Other Good brands are Record, Ohio, Union, Sargent, and Millers Falls in the same age range. Earlier planes are good as well. They may have less features than the one from the age above but will be good quality. However, before you restore them do some research. You don't want to reduce the value of a collectable plane like a Type 1 or 2 Stanley.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

WARNING, WARNING..

Handplanes can be highly addictive…









not that I would know anything about that…


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

> WARNING, WARNING..
> 
> Handplanes can be highly addictive…
> 
> ...


I actually think you are understating your problem…. lol


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## corelz125 (Sep 23, 2015)

Bandit when are you gonna add a #8 to the collection?


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Had an 8 a long time ago…was just too big for what I do in the shop…









A No. 8c in fact.


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## GravelRoad (May 24, 2017)

#5 Jack plane is a good place to start. The prices can have a fairly broad range across brands and condition. Do you want a plane ready to use or are you willing to recondition?


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

You could always start a post asking if anyone has an extra. There are many on this site willing to part with an extra.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

if you're on facebook you can ask in the handplane group as well, Hand Plane Building, Restoring and Collecting

A good bunch of guys there as well always flipping planes.


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

The facebook page is very active.


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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

Don W usually has some for sale on his site, but was too polite to say so.

I'd like to thin my … er… collection (I hate to admit).

I've got a 5,6,7 of type 19, which are fine-working planes that I .. um.. might part with.

Also, I have 4 type 16 No 4's, so I'm thinking of letting go 1 smooth and 1 corrugated of those.

The corrugated is in the original box. There it is just as I received it - with a touch of rust. I have done nothing to it, since I've got several others already tuned up.










PM me if you are interested and i'll try to come up with prices. I'm not real hot on selling.


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## corelz125 (Sep 23, 2015)

bandit you were able to part with that beauty?


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Yep, sold it on that auction site a few years ago….


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> Don W usually has some for sale on his site, but was too polite to say so.
> 
> I d like to thin my … er… collection (I hate to admit).
> 
> ...


You have mail.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> #5 Jack plane is a good place to start. The prices can have a fairly broad range across brands and condition. Do you want a plane ready to use or are you willing to recondition?
> 
> - GravelRoad


I am interested in reconditioning.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> if you re on facebook you can ask in the handplane group as well, Hand Plane Building, Restoring and Collecting
> 
> A good bunch of guys there as well always flipping planes.
> 
> - Don W


Thanks Don. I just joined.


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

Here is what I basically started with. The two on the right I have had +50yr and they were passed down to me in the family. That said, IMO, you should start with the first 4 from L-to-R:


A #92 Shoulder plane
A low angle block plane
A #4 Smoother plane
A #6 Jointer

You could probably combine the last two and get a #5, if you absolutely had to. If you go that route, you will find that you will be using that low angle block plane much more frequently. Bottom line is that you really need to get the shoulder and block planes regardless. My 2-cents worth… ;-)


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## BurlyBob (Mar 13, 2012)

Bandit's very right about the addictiveness of hand planes. I was only going to buy one 3 years ago. I now have over 50. Be very careful and exercise great self control.


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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)




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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

This is probably the nicest looking No 5 I have, a type 19 (1949-1961), but it's one I might sell. front photo is above.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> Here is what I basically started with. The two on the right I have had +50yr and they were passed down to me in the family. That said, IMO, you should start with the first 4 from L-to-R:
> 
> 
> A #92 Shoulder plane
> ...


Thank you Mike.
That's good advice!


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> This is probably the nicest looking No 5 I have, a type 19 (1949-1961), but it s one I might sell. front photo is above.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

Ok Fellas;
I bought my first Stanley Bailey No.5 to restore. It was cheap.
A little disappointing in what came in the mail today. It is a Stanley Bailey with wood knob and tote. It is rusty. But, I'm wondering about it's vintage-ness. (if that's even a word)

The adjustment wheel is not brass. It's black plastic and broken to boot. The seller listed it as a Vintage Stanley Plane and that's it. That's all they knew. What do you guys think?
Here are some picture I just took.





































Did I make a mistake?

Chem


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## onoitsmatt (Mar 7, 2015)

Good choice. Those rubber/plastic knobs are from WWII era planes. Some say the castings are heavier on these planes too. It's a Type 17 I believe. Giveball the metal parts an evaporust bath and scrub with one of those green abbraisive pads. It should clean up fine and make a good user.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

And…iF you are concerned about the broken wheel….a Brass one fits just fine. They went with the hard rubber ones due to brass being needed for the War Effort, same with Nickle and Chrome plating.

A very fine plane.


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

You'd be surprised how well that will probably clean up.


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## bondogaposis (Dec 18, 2011)

I think you did fine. Clean her up and start looking for a replacement knob. Somebody must have one.


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## Tim457 (Jan 11, 2013)

I agree you did fine, that will clean up and make a nice user. Next thing to do is at least get the rust off the sole and learn to sharpen the blade. Poor sharpening will make you think hand planes suck. Clean up the whole thing if you want and unless it is way out of flat and causing problems, ignore the advice you'll see many places to spend hours flattening the sole.

Welcome to the slippery slope.

Here's some quick tips on tuning a hand plane:
https://timetestedtools.wordpress.com/2013/02/04/tuning-it-up-bench-plane-style/
Ask if you have any issues, the advice here will get you up to speed in no time.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

Thank you all for your comments.
I thought that maybe I had jumped too quickly before I knew what was what. 
I can probably repair the knob with a little epoxy while I look for a replacement.
My plan is the Evapor-Rust bath and the scotch-brite pads and maybe a brass brush.
I just noticed that there is a screw missing at the front of the tote. I think I remember reading that these are non-standard threads. Any suggestions where to look for a replacement?

I bought a WorkSharp 3000 a month or so ago and I have been working on my beater chisels and the iron in my block plane. It's done a nice job so far. They will all shave the hair off your arm. 
(My wife asked about the bald spots on my arm. Her response was " Really?" )

Thank you again for all your help.
I think I'm already hooked!

Chem


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## UpstateNYdude (Dec 20, 2012)

I can help you out with the parts if you want Chem, I have a bunch of them PM me and I'll hook you up.


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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

That'll be fine. You will also find that there are no brass nuts holding the wooden parts on, but just a steel bolt.

I have a No 7, type 17 (same era) and it's one of my faves. Yours, actually is better than most because you have the frog adjusting screw which was left off of most WWII Bailey planes.

Stanley stamped many, but not all, blades in that period with a date stamp. It's actual;ly on the front of the blade as I recall, but in the area that's usually covered by the chipbreaker.

A 3 digit code QYY, where Q is the quarter and YY is the year. So, 343, for example, would be 3rd quarter of 1943. I'm eager to see what you've got under the rust!

Your iron, by the way is almost full length. If it is the original iron, and has the date code, that's extra good in my book.

WWII planes also frequently didn't have rosewood but used something like American Beech. The fact that yours has the frog adjust screw makes me think it was from early in the war and perhaps they still had some rosewood. I can't tel from your photos because they put such a dark finish on the knob and tote that the species is often obscured. If you remove the knob and look at the bottom of it, it might not be stained. If it's dark colored inside, it's probably rosewood. During the war, there was plenty of rosewood, but transport was restricted. The nation couldn't waste transport capacity hauling tropical lumber. The immediate post-war planes definitely didn't have rosewood (47, 48, type 18).

-Paul


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## BurlyBob (Mar 13, 2012)

Chem, I've run into the same problem with missing screws. I know you'll find them on EBay. That nhplaneparts
has all sorts of parts for you. There's a few others as well. That screw is a 12-20 if I'm not mistaken and I might be about the 12, but the 20 is a definite.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> That s be fine. You will also find that there are no brass nuts holding the wooden parts on, but just a steel bolt.
> 
> I have a No 7, type 17 (same era) and it s one of my faves. Yours, actually is better than most because you have the frog adjusting screw which was left off of most WWII Bailey planes.
> 
> ...


Hi Paul,
The blade is stamped 143 I tried to take a picture of it but my cell phone camera wouldn't pick it up due to the rust.
The wood under the knob appears to be dark so maybe it's rosewood.
Whew! I guess I did ok.

Chem


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> I can help you out with the parts if you want Chem, I have a bunch of them PM me and I ll hook you up.
> 
> - UpstateNYdude


Thanks Nick. I give you a holler when I get it all apart and see whats what.


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## builtinbkyn (Oct 29, 2015)

Chem this is some of the dirtiest and most tiring work you'll do in your shop. Be prepared LOL Good luck and post the results.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> Chem this is some of the dirtiest and most tiring work you ll do in your shop. Be prepared LOL Good luck and post the results.
> 
> - builtinbkyn


You can count on it!


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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

I don't find it tiring at all!


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## JRsgarage (Jan 2, 2017)

that should end up as a great user as mentioned. my WWII plane was in pretty bad shape too but ended up a good worker. i took mine apart and left it sitting a tupper of vinagar for few hours and went at it with wired brush. congrats on your first plane


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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

> The blade is stamped 143 [...]
> The wood under the knob appears to be dark so maybe it s rosewood.
> Whew! I guess I did ok.
> 
> ...


Sound great!


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## diverlloyd (Apr 25, 2013)

Good buy. I passed one of these up when I first started because of the non brass adjuster knob. I researched it and it was gone by the next day. I'm glad you was able to find one and get it.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> Good buy. I passed one of these up when I first started because of the non brass adjuster knob. I researched it and it was gone by the next day. I m glad you was able to find one and get it.
> 
> - diverlloyd


I found it on etsy.com. What an odd place to fine a plane, huh? I was lucky.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

IF you find a stanley frog bolt, it can be used at the toe of the handle, until you get a correct one. 
Usually, they cost more for shipping than the bolt does.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

There are many who prefer the type 17 because of the heaver base. And you have one of the rarer ones with a frog adjustment screw.


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

I like meaty.


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## corelz125 (Sep 23, 2015)

Once you get it cleaned up and sharpened and start using it you will start looking for more one is never enough


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> Once you get it cleaned up and sharpened and start using it you will start looking for more one is never enough
> 
> - corelz125


Well…......er….....ah…......I already bought another one on Ebay yesterday. I think I caught the bug!


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

It's called the slippery slope for a reason.


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## waho6o9 (May 6, 2011)

> Once you get it cleaned up and sharpened and start using it you will start looking for more one is never enough
> 
> - corelz125
> 
> ...


That's the spirit, good job.


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## corelz125 (Sep 23, 2015)

welcome to the club. what did you get?


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> welcome to the club. what did you get?
> 
> - corelz125


It's hard to tell for sure. I figured for $9.00….....
The ad said "vintage" but what vintage I can't tell.
I see no markings.
Any ideas?

Here some pics:


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Type 20?

Or, Type 21? #558? Or #559.


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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

If it says "Made in USA", it's probably type 20, from the 1960's. At some point they stopped USA production and moved it to England only. Looks like wooden knobs on yours. Later they went to plastic. Most folks say the English, blue, plastic knob ones are no good, but I have one I've tuned up that planes nicely. No frog adjust screw though. It looks like yours has the frog adjust screw.

The blade's a little short. A full-length blade goes about to the top of the lateral adjuster.

It looks like it's blue under the dirt.

Here's the Bailey typing page I usually use.

http://tooltrip.com/tooltrip9/stanley/stan-bpl/bailey-types.htm

I have never bought one of the type that you have there.


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

The thing to do is clean it up, sharpen and tune it.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> I can help you out with the parts if you want Chem, I have a bunch of them PM me and I ll hook you up.
> 
> - UpstateNYdude


You have mail.


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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

Well… have you "after" photos yet?


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> Well… have you "after" photos yet?
> 
> - Ocelot


I wish.
We have been so busy. We had a funeral and then my youngest son's High School graduation (and every thing associated with that) this weekend. We also have our churches summer camp coming up and I am building (supposed to be anyway) a new set of cornhole boards for the kids to play with. Maybe this weekend I get her apart and dunked in some evapo-rust. I'm really chomping at the bit to see what it looks like with all the rust removed.

Chem


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

Hopefully things will work out.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

Hi guys,
Well the second plane I bought showed up here today.
It was just an e-bay deal I got caught up in. I paid $9 for it.
Here are a few pics.
It's blue alright. The frog is removable and there are a few numbers on the frog too. 031720 ?BH 4
I do not see "made in USA" anywhere on it. The plane iron has a "P" stamped into it but at this point I can't see any other markings. The tote & knob is a composite material.

How do I go about dating this plane?


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

I found a dating chart.
Looks like I bought a Type 20. (mid to late 60's) Not many nice said about this one. Oh well. I'll practice on it and learn what I can. Live and learn, right?


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

It's definitely a late model plane. Where is CA are you? I'm in Sacramento.


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## fivecodys (Dec 2, 2013)

> It s definitely a late model plane. Where is CA are you? I m in Sacramento.
> 
> - WayneC


Madera


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## WayneC (Mar 8, 2007)

It's been a long time since I have been down there.


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## HokieKen (Apr 14, 2015)

> I found a dating chart.
> Looks like I bought a Type 20. (mid to late 60 s) Not many nice said about this one. Oh well. I ll practice on it and learn what I can. Live and learn, right?
> 
> - fivecodys


Yeah, practice is good. Just don't let it discourage you if it ain't a user. Some planes just don't work. FWIW, looks like nice knob and tote. Just the screws, depth adjuster nut and wood pieces are worth what you paid.


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## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

I have a Stanley plane from the 80's that planes very nicely.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Type 20, made in England









Stanley #4c size









Works just fine….









Just takes a little elbow grease to tune up….


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