# Suggestions needed - how to construct this door



## M71 (Jan 26, 2015)

Hi all,

Could anyone suggest a method of construction for this solid wood door design - I need to make a dozen of them for interior use in genuine Mahogany. Each 'section' will be stained a different color.

They will be hinged in a wood frame - door size Height 7' x Width 2.5' x Thick 2.4"

Concern is cracking/splitting between rainy season and dry season.

Cheers








!


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## bondogaposis (Dec 18, 2011)

You need not worry about cracking or splitting as the pieces of wood are not confined and can expand or contract at will. The problem will be with the door frame as the door gets wider, probably in summer, it may not fit in the frame and close properly or be too loose in winter. You will have to allow for that. That is one reason why frame and panel doors are almost universal, they don't change in size w/ the seasons.


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## Ghidrah (Jan 20, 2015)

My concern would be weight, you're going to need to reinforce the frame to the R/O hinge side, use more heavier heavy duty hinges and longer hinge screws.


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## jerryminer (Jun 15, 2014)

+1 what Bondo and Ghidrah said.

The reason the frame-and-panel system was invented was because solid plank doors-like you're contemplating-don't work well: they change dimension with the seasons, and so don't fit well in their frames (at least part of the year) and are more prone to warping.

SOME solid-plank doors have been used successfully. But the greater the seasonal humidity changes in your environment, the greater the likelihood of problems.


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## RichardHillius (Oct 19, 2013)

How about a frame core with a thick applied face veneer? The only difficult part I see is allowing for movement of the veneer over the frame which might require something like applied moldings or half lap joints to hide movement. Or a very thin veneer applied to a plywood substrate? That would greatly lighten the pieces up as well and cut down on the cost by using secondary wood for the core.


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## Daruc (Apr 20, 2015)

> My concern would be weight, you re going to need to reinforce the frame to the R/O hinge side, use more heavier heavy duty hinges and longer hinge screws.
> 
> - Ghidrah


Brilliant, would have never thought of that.


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## ClintSearl (Dec 8, 2011)

That is coyote ugly! I wouldn't touch it with a ten foot Pole…or two five foot Swedes.


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

> That is coyote ugly! I wouldn t touch it with a ten foot Pole…or two five foot Swedes.
> 
> - Clint Searl


Some guys like fat girls, some like skinny. How would you build those doors Clint?


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

This is certainly out of my area of of knowledge. I suggest you do some research on "stave core'' door construction.


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## Ghidrah (Jan 20, 2015)

So that's what a stave core is, I have 2 in my basement shop leading to the bulkhead. I got them from one of the local intermediate schools back in the early 90s. Originally they were ext. doors, the bottoms were rotting, I contracted to install 2 new metal doors and kept the originals. Those babies weigh a ton, I doubled them up and had to shim and screw the crap out of the jambs to prevent sag.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

I agree with this type of door having a lot of weight to it and that some wood movement could be and issue. If you want this design a ply core and veneer might help with both issues,but you will need some solid wood stiles.


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## M71 (Jan 26, 2015)

Thanks everyone for your suggestions.

I can see we will need to reinforce the door frames and allow for door movement within the frames during the wet seasons.

After reading up on this over the last few days it appears there are 4 construction methods worth considering::

1. Ladder core with Mahogany veneer 'planks' glued to both faces.

2. Individual Stave core planks with T&G or spline joints.

3. One piece engineered wood slab core with veneer pieces glued onto both faces.

4. 3 ply laminated solid wood planks - glued together with T&G or spline joints.

Annual humidity range here is 67% to 81%

Mahogany lumber is at 12% MC

Given real Mahogany's reputation for stability and minimal movement would the # 4 option be viable or will it move over the years quite a bit like other woods?


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## jerryminer (Jun 15, 2014)

I just ran your numbers (67%-81% RH) through the Shrinkulator and learned that a 36" wide door built from solid genuine mahogany can be expected to expand/contract about 3/16" over the seasons. This is generally more than is desired in a door, but if it is tolerable for you, go for it.

You might consider a pair (or three) cleats to help hold the planks in plane. If you're building a 3-ply plank, you could put the cleats on the interior-out of sight-and allow a small joint line to show at each vertical joint, thus allowing each plank to expand and contract individually, without changing the overall dimensions of the door.


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## dhazelton (Feb 11, 2012)

Almost 2 and a half inches thick - WHY? What door is ever that thick, unless it's for a vault? It sounds like you need to hang a butcher block in a door frame. It might need a couple of steel threaded rods in it. Butcher blocks are usually supported by stringers and legs.


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## M71 (Jan 26, 2015)

Yep these will be some heavy solid doors at almost 2 1/2" thick - that's what the customer has specified and has decided upon. Cheers for the expansion/contraction figure jerryminer this is great info and helps us certainly.

I'm leaning towards the 3 ply laminated solid wood planks option but still concerned about warp and twist. The horizontal cleats built into the laminated planks out of sight must surely help - tight but floating rather than glued would be best I'd think or would you suggest gluing them in place?

Agree a small gap between vertical joint lines can only help overall movement though I doubt the clients will allow this, they prefer a solid sleek look.

It's my understanding 3 ply laminated planks will be more stable than solid wood planks and seems to be the general consensus though I've read some comments saying it makes no difference at all - what is your opinion?


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## jerryminer (Jun 15, 2014)

Sometimes it's our job, as professional woodworkers, to educate the client on the properties inherent in the material. I have steered several clients away from designs that look good on paper but are not likely to perform well in real life.

An engineered slab door with a veneer to suit the client's desired look would be the best performer here, IMHO. With a solid mahogany edge and a veneered face, the look will be identical, the problems fewer.


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## M71 (Jan 26, 2015)

Thanks jerryminer - agree it's our job to educate the client when the need arises - if a design won't work for whatever reason they simply need to be told.

Going to go with a stile and rail "ladder" frame for the core, 3/4" thick, and glue 3/4" thick planks on to each face of the core which we believe will give the door the stability needed.

This method will also reduce the expansion and contraction between the seasons which a completely solid door would have. 1mm gap between T&G planks glued on with a decent glue which stays elastic should do the trick.

Pin the planks in place and run the doors through the belt sander - the planks can later be removed for staining then glued in place.


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