# Homeless



## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

How much longer can we continue to feed, clothe and find shelter for those that choose not to participate as responsible citizens? I know they all have a sob story to tell and someone other than themselves to blame for their sorry place in life. How tired I get of seeing panhandlers and beggars on sidewalks and at street intersections. Where is their self respect? Where is their inner drive to support themselves and become responsible for their own actions or lack of? Am I alone in my thinking?


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)

You are not alone.


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)




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## altendky (May 7, 2012)

There are the bad and there are the good that deserve help… the difficulty is in differentiating en masse. If we each took the responsibility to get to know more people that aren't as well off as we are and to help them out directly we could take control of that. Until then, we will continue to throw money around impersonally.

Simply put, doing things better often takes more effort and we choose not to exert that effort as individuals.


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## Goatlocker (Dec 31, 2012)

How about we go back to the CCC (Civilian Conservation Corps) concept? My grandfather was in the CCC back in the depression. This was a form of welfare where able adults went to a camp and were given food and shelter in return for work. They built roads, bridges and all things related. They were given a small stipend that went directly to their families so that they could live.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

"Where is their self respect? Where is their inner drive to support themselves and become responsible for their own actions or lack of? Am I alone in my thinking?" 
They are smarter than you and I.
A few weeks ago a news group followed one of them here in SLC. 
He made over $ 800.00 in the day! and that is tax free.
Not that I would want to do it.


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## distrbd (Sep 14, 2011)

If they are mentally ill, they need help , period.

But, if they are physically and mentally fit and still choose to stand at a corner of an intersection holding a sign and begging for money, then the obvious reason to me is, panhandling/begging must pay very well,I have heard a conservative estimate of $10 to $20 per hour! and all they have to do is to swallow their pride and forget about human dignity just for a couple of hours a day.

My only hope for them is to regain their self respect and work hard for their money, it is as simple as that.


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## Ghidrah (Jan 20, 2015)

As opposed to the millionaires eventually caught in welfare fraud or tax evasion, it's ok though there're far fewer of them taking advantage of the system than there are of the truly poor


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Ken As I wrote above this guy that the TV crew followed made over $800 in the day. 
That's quite bit more than $20.00/hour, more like $80.00/hour

What is also well known at least here in SLC, is that , just like prostitutes, most them a pimped and they "work" for drugs.
You should not give them money ( I do when I am impressed to do it by God) but you should support your local rescue mission which is better equipped to help them.


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## GregD (Oct 24, 2009)

Personally, I am skeptical that all of the individuals panhandling at intersections in my area are as destitute as they claim to be. Homelessness is a real problem, and although there is some overlap panhandling seems to be a different problem.

Utah seems to be getting better-than-average results with their strategy for dealing with homelessness:
http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-utah-housing-first-20150524-story.html

There is, and probably always will be a portion of society that is not sufficiently functional to care for themselves. And there is, and probably always will be, a portion of society that could take care of themselves but won't. Then there are those that temporarily fall on hard times. I think the best strategy is to accept the reality and try to deal with it in practical ways.


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## Daruc (Apr 20, 2015)

I look at the panhandlers and decide for myself if I think they are capable of getting a job or not. 
I doubt that any of the ones I see are pimps, lol Anyway, a lot of them have disabilities that are evident and, even though they may be drinkers or whatever, I sometimes give them a few bucks because I know even if they were looking for a job, no one would hire them.

What bothers me is this. 
I was getting gas the other day and this big, healthy, well dressed guy comes up to me. 
His wife was driving the SUV already in line for gas, a couple of kids were in the back seat. 
He shows me his Vet card and proceeds to tell me "his sob story" why he needs some gas. Here is the thing! 
This was the second time he asked me in a couple of months. Apparently he does it all the time.


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## lew (Feb 13, 2008)

********************, a whole family of them live next door…


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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)




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## DanYo (Jun 30, 2007)




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## Pono (Mar 10, 2012)

yes dkv you are here in Hawaii it is bad. Majority are not mentally stable add drugs alcohol etc and its a wild party… Just yesterday we were going to my sons soccer practice. In the parking lot there was a meth head standing in the middle of the road on a speed bump looking at the sky. Worst economy and pay in nation here for the middle and lower class I have seen people snap mentally in there 30s and end up on the street. Then theres the lazy ones im not sure about those? I think put them in a secluded area and let them go wild?

I was at subway once and bought this guy outside a sandwich skinny real skinny.I gave it to him and he flipped out and threw the sandwich said he is allergic to onions haaaaa


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## SirIrb (Jan 12, 2015)

Hummm. 
If you want a TV you buy it. If you want a new saw you buy it. If you want food you by-God best have a way to buy it. It is not anyone's responsibility to do so for you. Comments about the CCC or some such other gvt program is hogwash to say the least. If it is the gvts responsibility then the means to do so is passed to me via theft-some call that taxes. It is no right. Rights which exist transcend time and space. That which a caveman had is the same we have-negative rights: not to be assulted, killed, stolen from or defrauded.
I take care of me; you take care of you.
Someone in the peanut gallery shouts "but it's for the children…."


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## BurlyBob (Mar 13, 2012)

How is it fairness to take from those who have worked hard to earn what they have and give it to those who won't.

Ya, got to love them liberal socialist democrats!


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## altendky (May 7, 2012)

> Hummm.
> If you want a TV you buy it. If you want a new saw you buy it. If you want food you by-God best have a way to buy it. It is not anyone s responsibility to do so for you. Comments about the CCC or some such other gvt program is hogwash to say the least. If it is the gvts responsibility then the means to do so is passed to me via theft-some call that taxes. It is no right. Rights which exist transcend time and space. That which a caveman had is the same we have-negative rights: not to be assulted, killed, stolen from or defrauded.
> I take care of me; you take care of you.
> Someone in the peanut gallery shouts "but it s for the children…."
> ...


While I share your thoughts on thef… err, taxes… and what a right really is (I say it can't be a right if you can't have it as the only person left on earth), I do still believe that it is a good thing to help others. Nobody has a right to force me to help others but I'll admit that I'm a bit ashamed right now because at this point I'm not doing much of it. Hopefully I'll get my butt back in gear and change that.


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## altendky (May 7, 2012)

Without even getting around to worrying about fairness or right and wrong, I'm not sure how the future is going to work out. More and more work is being automated and so the jobs are very rapidly going to become all highly skilled. Rich people will hire a few highly skilled people and by equipment for them to setup at which point the rich will become richer. Don't get me wrong, that doesn't make them evil… but, practically speaking it sure seems like while this will make things cheaper and more plentiful it will also make it very difficult for even more people to find work. Any thoughts on how to deal with this without forced redistribution of wealth? Believe me, I'm not arguing for that, I'm just concerned that we won't figure out how to deal with it well..


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## Dark_Lightning (Nov 20, 2009)

You can thank Ronald Reagan for defunding the infrastructure that supported all the mentally challenged. I like what he did with a lot of things during his administration, but this is one of them I don't. 30 years hence, there is still no resolution. Where I live, the neighboring communities (Thousand Oaks, I'm looking at you, you heartless bastards!) bus the homeless to our community for their care.

By the same token, if you are observant, you will see an equivalent or better (to my) 24 speed bike chained to the fence at the freeway off ramp, most places I go. People wearing hangdog expressions abound, but it is my considered opinion that they are just moochers.

I've a pet Maltese dog that has a better life than I do, has never been struck in anger (or at all, for that matter), but cringes when someone goes to pet her. I'm thinking of renting her out to the ASPCA for her room and board, because I can tell you, she makes the most pitiful face, compared to the commercials!


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## SirIrb (Jan 12, 2015)

I fully agree. I am not discussing the freedom to gift something to someone. That is between you and your family.
As long as the gift was gotten legitimately there is no issue.
I am talking about forced benevolence. Which is no benevolence.


> Hummm.
> If you want a TV you buy it. If you want a new saw you buy it. If you want food you by-God best have a way to buy it. It is not anyone s responsibility to do so for you. Comments about the CCC or some such other gvt program is hogwash to say the least. If it is the gvts responsibility then the means to do so is passed to me via theft-some call that taxes. It is no right. Rights which exist transcend time and space. That which a caveman had is the same we have-negative rights: not to be assulted, killed, stolen from or defrauded.
> I take care of me; you take care of you.
> Someone in the peanut gallery shouts "but it s for the children…."
> ...


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## SirIrb (Jan 12, 2015)

Who makes the robots that do the automation? Write the programs? Automation is good for one who has gumption. See the worm and take it i.e. get schooled in a way that is market demanding and make more than you would if you were the guy who did the robots job.

It isn't yours to worry about how others will deal with this situation. Worry about how you can capitalize on it.

There were people who bemoaned the cotton gin because it took jobs away from hard working people. How far does one wish to travel down this rabbit hole. Thank God for the cotton gin, industrial revolution and the computer era. I don't have to break my back all day.

Thanks DKV, you just wanted to get people wound up. Should have started a SS sucks or I hate Rigid thread. Those are fun.


> Without even getting around to worrying about fairness or right and wrong, I m not sure how the future is going to work out. More and more work is being automated and so the jobs are very rapidly going to become all highly skilled. Rich people will hire a few highly skilled people and by equipment for them to setup at which point the rich will become richer. Don t get me wrong, that doesn t make them evil… but, practically speaking it sure seems like while this will make things cheaper and more plentiful it will also make it very difficult for even more people to find work. Any thoughts on how to deal with this without forced redistribution of wealth? Believe me, I m not arguing for that, I m just concerned that we won t figure out how to deal with it well..
> 
> - altendky


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

Had no intention of getting people hyped out. Only stating the facts. Here's another fact…this is a conservative site which typically relates to a more religious site than not. Religion in the states means Christian. What happened to the Christian generosity towards those that don't have? Aren't the haves supposed to take care of the have nots?


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## SirIrb (Jan 12, 2015)

I'm not disagreeing with helping people who can not help themselves. I despise forced benevolence, as I stated above.



> Had no intention of getting people hyped out. Only stating the facts. Here s another fact…this is a conservative site which typically relates to a more religious site than not. Religion in the states means Christian. What happened to the Christian generosity towards those that don t have? Aren t the haves supposed to take care of the have nots?
> 
> - DKV


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## ElChe (Sep 28, 2014)

Posts like this on woodworking website irk me. There. Consider me irked.


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## altendky (May 7, 2012)

> Who makes the robots that do the automation? Write the programs? Automation is good for one who has gumption. See the worm and take it i.e. get schooled in a way that is market demanding and make more than you would if you were the guy who did the robots job.
> 
> It isn t yours to worry about how others will deal with this situation. Worry about how you can capitalize on it.
> 
> ...


I hardly suggested that technological developments were bad. Who will write the programs? Me, I'm a well educated programmer who aims to eliminate his own job by improving the level of automation and efficiency of the development process (I figure if I can do that I'll be given other tasks and get paid more). But, I don't like the idea of massive divides between the haves and the have nots with little practical opportunity to cross that boundary. Dealing with that without forcing wealth redistribution or otherwise impinging upon our freedoms seems like a much more interesting topic than 'how long until the leachers suck us dry'.


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

> Posts like this on woodworking website irk me. There. Consider me irked.
> 
> - ElChe


What irks me is people who complain about being irked when I know they don't have to read or participate any particular thread/post if they don't want to. You are not forced to read anything here. After all this was posted in the off topic forum not the woodworking forum. Doesn't it make sense not to partake in what you don't like?


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## Redoak49 (Dec 15, 2012)

Joke of the day….......
"Had no intention of getting people hyped out."...


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## SirIrb (Jan 12, 2015)

I'll be the community cynic: make the most of yourself, technology and automation and milk it, the poor and lazy (those who are not you) will always be there. Make a difference by what you do. Teach your trade to one who wants to but can not see a way out of their poverty. I refuse to try to force my help on one who doesn't want it. Especially if all the want is my cash. Technology and poverty are like a freight train: you won't stop it so capitalize on one and choose to make a difference in the other, but don't tie yourself to the tracks.


> Who makes the robots that do the automation? Write the programs? Automation is good for one who has gumption. See the worm and take it i.e. get schooled in a way that is market demanding and make more than you would if you were the guy who did the robots job.
> 
> It isn t yours to worry about how others will deal with this situation. Worry about how you can capitalize on it.
> 
> ...


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## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

Christian giving to those who don't have isn't always about money. Give a man a fish, feed him for a day, teach a man to fish, feed him for life.


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## ElChe (Sep 28, 2014)

AlaskaGuy, I click on the off topic post and this comes up. So instead of getting some insight into the lives of fellow woodworkers or a joke or something, I get a homelessness discussion. I get it. I hate people gaming the system. Rich beggars. Drug addicts using welfare to get drugs. Whatever it may be. The fact remains that the vast majority of people who are homeless aren't eating filet mignon and many lack the skills to rejoin society in a productive society whether due to mental illness or abject poverty or lack of a meaningful education. They give up on themselves and society gives up on them. Anecdotal stories about rich beggars are an awful way to examine the problem of homelessness. There. I'm less irked.


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## LumberJax (Aug 19, 2015)

Some people have a hard time getting a job in the job market these days.


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## SirIrb (Jan 12, 2015)

For the record, that is not a biblical quote, though it is one I fully agree with.


> Christian giving to those who don t have isn t always about money. Give a man a fish, feed him for a day, teach a man to fish, feed him for life.
> 
> - bigblockyeti


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## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

I know, if it was, I would have identified it as such.


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

How many of you Christian woodworkers invite a bum home to teach him woodworking?


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## RobS888 (May 7, 2013)

I thought we were going to have a Christian quote-off for a minute there.


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## SirIrb (Jan 12, 2015)

Funny thing about agnostics/ atheists, they are usually quite angry that there are people who would see things different from them. Like they harbor a grudge…against a Deity for some unknown slight. Not all, but most I have met.

I would teach anyone anything as long as I didnt feel they were a threat to my family. Wise as serpents, innocent as lambs. Lets just say that I am being wise by my decision to be careful about who I invite home. My priority as a husband and father is to protect my family.


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## Ghidrah (Jan 20, 2015)

How many here has donated time and labor to Habitat for Humanity? Built handicap ramps for free? 30 + yrs ago I road with a loose group of bikers that created a benefit for a homeless shelter that ran for a couple maybe 5 yrs. Get arrested and have as many as possible to bail you out.

There're are many who can and are willing to work but can't get a job, how many here have been homeless? Tried to get employment without a residence, living out of your car (if you're lucky enough to have one) or Salvation army or shelter for battered women as your local? I bet the answer verges on -0-, there's a huge stigma associated with "Homeless" as stupid, crazy, untrustworthy, lazy and unclean.

The same thing has been happening to the older white collar work force too, being downsized, retired or fired, (to avoid severance or pension clauses). For a few I knew, they complained and wailed like they had limbs severed but were able to sell off the or one of their vacation homes, eliminate a Vaca or 2 and go 4 to 6 yrs instead of 2 between new car purchases.

It appears to be inherent behavior for the haves and entitled to be oblivious or near sighted


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## Grumpymike (Jan 23, 2012)

Ghidrah, you struck a nerve there I have donated many hours of time to habitat over the years and encouraged employees of our firm to do the same … I installed a program that if an employee donated a work day to habitat they got paid for it.
Habitat as you all know is for people less fortunate that need a hand up and they work for it and earn it.
I support Habitat as you do.

I have seen people that take your money and buy drugs, then tell their kids that cereal is all that there is for dinner.

Someone here asked if you have ever taken a bum into the shop to teach them woodworking? Well, I haven't because I would have no tools left after the theft.

The last year that I was in the corporate world, I had two openings for entry level workers. I was flooded with applicants and selected the best 12 candidates according to information in their applications and resumes.
4 failed the drug screening before the first interview.
One fellow had no solid home, lived here and there with relatives and only had a message phone.
One girl lived with her mom and had no job history, because she had just graduated from High school.
Those were the final choices because they wanted to work, and to learn. Others were eliminated for various reasons like asking the wage scale and benefits in the first 5 minutes, Garish piercings and unkempt attire.

A huge majority of the truly homeless people are mentally challenged and could not work at a normal job … These folks need help that is sparse to say the best. As for the rest … Well here we get into the drug and alcohol culture, and the just plain lazy. The druggies won't work because it interferes with their party life, and the Alcoholics are addicted to a different drug.

There are organizations that assist these folks, and have had some success with recovery; I donate to them as part of my personal community service. The one I donate the largest sum to is the Salvation Army as I have had experience with them clear back to 1968.

If a beggar or homeless person asks me for money, I just tell them that I donate to a shelter or mission and they should contact them.

Well off the soap box and back into the shadows …


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

> Funny thing about agnostics/ atheists, they are usually quite angry that there are people who would see things different from them. Like they harbor a grudge…against a Deity for some unknown slight. Not all, but most I have met.
> 
> I would teach anyone anything as long as I didnt feel they were a threat to my family. Wise as serpents, innocent as lambs. Lets just say that I am being wise by my decision to be careful about who I invite home. My priority as a husband and father is to protect my family.
> 
> - SirIrb


How do you determine a threat? Is this just an easy way out?


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## Cricket (Jan 15, 2014)

Even though I received a large number of reports about this thread, it has taken me a bit to respond because I was afraid that I might respond with anger instead of understanding that we all look at things from different view points. We all see the world a bit differently.

I wanted to find ways to express that unless we ourselves have been in their shoes, we can't possibly understand or judge. Unfortunately, I could not find the right words so instead I am going to share something I wrote on my personal blog a little over a year ago….










*Your Face Haunted Me*

I went back to look for you today.

Your face haunted me for weeks. I had no choice. I had to go back and find you.

I thought maybe you could use a friend, someone just to talk to.

For three hours I walked the streets. I was so sure you had to be there somewhere.

It wasn't cold this time. It was actually a bit too warm to be comfortable in my sweatpants and a t-shirt so I stopped to buy water.

I wondered if the temperature was ever just right for those with no home to go to.

I wondered if you had cold water to drink so I bought a few extras to bring to you.

As the sweat began to trickle down my back, I finally gave up.

I headed back to my truck.

I stopped dead in my tracks when I saw you sitting there, right where I had left you before. Where had you been?

I stood there for the longest time trying to find the courage to talk to you. I blurted out something about it being a gorgeous day and you just looked at me like I was a total idiot but I had looked for you too long to back down now so I just stood there, looking past you towards the water.

I asked you if you would mind if I sat down for a bit and you gave me that look again.

I sat down anyway.

You pretty much ignored me as you wrote something down on your tiny slips of paper, but every now and then I saw you peek up at me.

I figured this was okay too, just sitting there with you, enjoying the cool breeze coming across the water.

When you spoke, your voice was so quiet I barely heard you, but I smiled and nodded my head. Mostly I just listened because when I did respond you told me that you weren't initiating a discussion with me. That made me smile again. I saw that little smirk you gave me and I was content to just sit there with you.

Then my phone rang and our worlds collided.

I knew you didn't like it and I tried to silence it quickly.

It was too late. You began slowly putting your stuff away as you prepared to leave.

I tried to give you a few bucks. You told me you didn't want my money.

I knew it was too late. I had broken the moment. I had intruded on your solitude.

I'm sorry.

I won't give up though. I will be back because now that little smirk is gonna haunt me.

You may not need me, but I think I need you.

Next time I'll make sure my phone is shut off.

Maybe I'll bring lunch to share…


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## diverlloyd (Apr 25, 2013)

I give food to the less fortunate and money to pan handlers. I don't care if I give 3 or 4 thousand a year to less fortunate(using the word "bums" is a a-hole way to say it). If even $20 of that goes to help someone in need then it was worth the money. I donate my time,money and effort to help others,if one of the less fortunate said could you teach me how to weld, do woodworking,mechanic work, hvac or any other thing that I am knowledgable about yes I have a extra room for them and the time for them. Like me for instance I quit my job to take care of my grandmother and I could have been homeless if things went wrong but I was lucky and everything went well because I'm a skilled individual. I can get a job in many different fields and I learn fast. But to be so selfish not to help out someone in need is straight crap. So what if you have to give to cons to get to the actual ones in need. Is it not worth it to help one in need. if you go buy at goodwill do you feel you are helping out the challenged. If so consider the goodwill ceo makes a million plus a year and they pay the challenged less then minimum wage(thanks to a loophole from the early 1900s) by less I mean some make less then a dollar a hour. This is like when my wife and I go to the bookstore I will buy a magazine then spend around a extra $100 on buying books to donate at our local children's hospital. Mind you that money is very tight at our house and we really can't afford it but I will spend it anyways. Then there is always a person in front of use wearing 40 grand in clothes and jewlery and driving a $100000 car who say oh no I can't spend the extra dollar on that. Reading most of the posts here all I can think of are those people. I have been fortunate in my life so far the least I could do I help another person out even if it means I have to help out the ones who are taking advantage of the situation but it's not in vain if I help out just that one that really needs the help. Anyways that's my opinion and that's it.


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## Cricket (Jan 15, 2014)

"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a battle you know nothing about."


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## oldnovice (Mar 7, 2009)

This aggregate consists of homeless, pan handlers, those that want to be homeless, bums, and the mentally challenged. In my opinion it is disparaging to lump them all together as a burden on society!

Each of these groups must be treated appropriately which is the crux of the problem as a solution for the aggregate is probably inappropriate.

That is just my opinion!


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## BurlyBob (Mar 13, 2012)

Many would be wise to consider….There but for the grace of God, go I.


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

No matter how you word it or how soft your heart it all comes back to who foots the bill for this burden of society. This has been going on since the invention of the sidewalk and intersection.


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## RobS888 (May 7, 2013)

> Funny thing about agnostics/ atheists, they are usually quite angry that there are people who would see things different from them. Like they harbor a grudge…against a Deity for some unknown slight. Not all, but most I have met.
> 
> - SirIrb


Was that directed at me?

Sounds like that stupid "God is dead" movie, where he was mad at God for some pain he had. We aren't mad at a God, just can't understand the need/devotion to one. If we are mad at anyone it is the people that use faith for their own benefit. My feelings are whatever gets you through the day, just don't try to control me/anyone/young women with it, or your interpretation of it.

Were you proselytizing when they got angry?


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## RobS888 (May 7, 2013)

> Many would be wise to consider….There but for the grace of God, go I.
> 
> - BurlyBob


Well said!


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

> Without even getting around to worrying about fairness or right and wrong, I m not sure how the future is going to Any thoughts on how to deal with this without forced redistribution of wealth? Believe me, I m not arguing for that, I m just concerned that we won t figure out how to deal with it well..
> 
> - altendky





> No matter how you word it or how soft your heart it all comes back to who foots the bill for this burden of society. This has been going on since the invention of the sidewalk and intersection.
> 
> - DKV


When in doubt just do what Jefferson would do


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## SirIrb (Jan 12, 2015)

Not at you, DKV.
I was just stating my thoughts on the matter. I dont see as many Christians mad at an Atheists need for no devotion as I do Atheists mad at Christians for having it.

I havent seen the movie, is it good?



> Funny thing about agnostics/ atheists, they are usually quite angry that there are people who would see things different from them. Like they harbor a grudge…against a Deity for some unknown slight. Not all, but most I have met.
> 
> - SirIrb
> 
> ...


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## altendky (May 7, 2012)

> No matter how you word it or how soft your heart it all comes back to who foots the bill for this burden of society. This has been going on since the invention of the sidewalk and intersection.
> 
> - DKV


Yes, and taxes are stealing, I agree… but we must not use that fact/opinion to justify 'them'ing the less fortunate. It enhances the divide rather than closing it. The two issues are intimately intertwined but they are not one in the same.


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## Tennessee (Jul 8, 2011)

I personally have no problem helping the down-trodden, the homeless, the less fortunate.

BUT - I give my money to proven charities who are well schooled at which direction to really aim that money. 
I AM NOT smart enough to tell the difference most of the time.

Examples:
My wife works for a charity called Family Promise. They find couples, usually with children who are homeless, and put them through a rather rigorous testing process that lasts many weeks. In that time, the family is provided with shelter and food.
They must: Find jobs. Show that they are talented enough to take care of their children. No drugs, no alcohol. Demonstrate that they know how to properly do a family budget. (No holding money back for that great tattoo that they want) 
Religion of some sort is encouraged, but not mandated. 
If after about four months, they show they can do all of this, and keep the job, they are helped in finding housing and complete the program. Amazingly, over half wash out since they really didn't want to do the straight and narrow, they wanted a free ride for a while.

One day, my wife was waiting at a red light with a panhandler at the corner. She observed him look at his watch, decide his shift was over, and walk over to his rather new minivan, get in and drive away. WTF??

that's why MY money goes to proven charities who know the difference - I usually don't

Give a man a fish, feed him for a day…teach him how to fish, feed him for life.


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## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

I don't have the answer.

I have seen the same homeless people on the same street corner with the same cardboard signs year after year. I see people give them money day after day. Nothing changes. Often times I see them raising a brown paper bag to there lips. Year after year. Many choose that life style and don't want to change.


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

> I don t have the answer.
> 
> I have seen the same homeless people on the same street corner with the same cardboard signs year after year. I see people give them money day after day. Nothing changes. Often times I see them raising a brown paper bag to there lips. Year after year. Many choose that life style and don t want to change.
> 
> - AlaskaGuy


My understanding is those signs are passed on from father to son…


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## ssnvet (Jan 10, 2012)

So DKV posits a hot button question and then tells everyone what his definition of a Christian is supposed to do about it….

but he never really mans up and offers a solution, now does he?

O.K. thou great ranter and rager…. what should we all do about the homeless?

Come thou oh fount of wisdom…. enlighten us for a change, instead of playing the stir-it-up gadfly…

Or are you trying to get on the ticket with Dpnald Trump as "apprentice" mud-slinger and chief? :^p


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

My solution is you man up, pull up your big boy pants and become responsible for yourself. You don't get up each morning thinking the responsible majority owe you something. Most of the homeless are past help, they became of the irresponsible mentality back in their formative adult years. Restrict them to outlier areas and get them away from responsible citizens. I volunteer to judge.



> So DKV posits a hot button question and then tells everyone what his definition of a Christian is supposed to do about it….
> 
> but he never really mans up and offers a solution, now does he?
> 
> ...


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## Ghidrah (Jan 20, 2015)

Grumpymike,

I commend you and your company's effort to help, in that light, I'm ashamed to admit I haven't participated in well over 5 yrs, there're more centers in our area than 10 yrs ago.


> I have seen people that take your money and buy drugs, then tell their kids that cereal is all that there is for dinner.
> - Grumpymike


I know that music too GM, my wife works with a woman, whose son and girlfriend, (who met in rehab) have been in and out of detox and rehab too many times to count, almost 30, they live in the parents basement and now the 2 have a baby. Because of what the parents have gone through over the yrs they are experts in the culture the woman knows most of the addicts in town because she's been to all the you name it meetings.

Being my age, growing up when I did and traveling to different places, I've witnessed much more than the average person and I don't miss it. There're are many forms of addiction, however chemical dependency addicts look and act different than general homeless, even the mentally unstable. When you know the enemy it's so much easier to spot, even it's well dressed and spoken.


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## exelectrician (Oct 3, 2011)

We are all one flood, one earthquake, one car crash,,, fill in your blank here, away from being homeless.

When you are down,, it is very hard to pull your self back up,
'cause high and mighty people love to kick those who are down.


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## ssnvet (Jan 10, 2012)

yawn


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## oldnovice (Mar 7, 2009)

*exelectrician*, you forgot wild fires like those in California, or anywhere else for that matter!


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

> We are all one flood, one earthquake, one car crash,,, fill in your blank here, away from being homeless.
> 
> When you are down,, it is very hard to pull your self back up,
> cause high and mighty people love to kick those who are down.
> ...





> *exelectrician*, you forgot wild fires like those in California, or anywhere else for that matter!
> 
> - oldnovice


Please be serious. The homeless I speak of are the beggars and bums of our society. Anyone left homeless because of the above will use their insurance to rebuild and continue on with their employed, productive lives.


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## madts (Dec 30, 2011)

Many of the beggars and bums you speak of DVK, could very easily have been wiped out by a natural catastrophe. Getting their life together on a new farm and whamo. A flood and no insurance. Just think of the whirl pool of bad stuff that happens after that.

Anyway 2% of the population is unemployable for that ever reason and society can or cannot do anything as it wishes.
I prefer to show some compassion, and vote and give, for good things happen for the needy.

Madts.


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

> Many of the beggars and bums you speak of DVK, could very easily have been wiped out by a natural catastrophe. Getting their life together on a new farm and whamo. A flood and no insurance. Just think of the whirl pool of bad stuff that happens after that.
> 
> Anyway 2% of the population is unemployable for that ever reason and society can or cannot do anything as it wishes.
> I prefer to show some compassion, and vote and give, for good things happen for the needy.
> ...


No insurance? That's not being responsible. Lenders and lien holders require insurance.


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## RobS888 (May 7, 2013)

> Not at you, DKV.
> I was just stating my thoughts on the matter. I dont see as many Christians mad at an Atheists need for no devotion as I do Atheists mad at Christians for having it.
> 
> I havent seen the movie, is it good?
> ...


I would say it was bad, because it blamed his anger on a tragedy, not on say a reasoned position


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