# Big upgrade and decision sawstop vs 2 grizzly machines



## WoodworkingBarber (Apr 29, 2017)

Ok so I need some advice. I'm between two choices I've got some money put back for a new table saw. It will be a huge leap for me (kobalt contractors saw right now). I'm looking at the sawstop contractors saw with t glide fence, cast iron wings, dust port, and mobile base. (All of my budget). Or I can get a grizzly g0715p and also get a 8inch jointer g0656w or the g0490 for the same price. I don't have a jointer right now and I know that would greatly improve my shop, but the sawstop is my dream saw. I'm a barber, guitar player, painter and woodworker, so my hands are everything to me.

In addition I know that safety is key so getting a sawstop is not so I can half-hazardly forget to be safe. It's just for the quality of saw plus the safety feature that I never plan to trigger. Not all accidents are due to negligence


----------



## CharlesA (Jun 24, 2013)

I think you answer you own question. It's all about the digits. $ digits vs. finger digits.


----------



## mrg (Mar 10, 2010)

Save the digits. You can also have a mishap with a jointer. Go with your Dream saw.


----------



## MadMark (Jun 3, 2014)

Griz g0715p and Incra is a stellar combo.

M


----------



## Carloz (Oct 12, 2016)

You have to chose between quality and quantity even putting the safety feature aside.
Besides a jointer is not strictly a must have tool. You can substitute it with other tools in most cases.


----------



## joandust (Apr 29, 2017)

Hey wwbarber! The sawstop is in my honest opinion your best choice, I own one and it was one of the best buys for my shop ever. You can't put a price on safety, always go with more protection even if it costs a bit more. Have fun!


----------



## Hdoilcan (Apr 22, 2017)

A couple months back I was trying to decide between a Sawstop and Grizzly and was thinking the same thing…... I could buy other tools with the money I would save by purchasing the Grizzly. I search some table saw accidents on google and youtube.

I'm now the owner of a brand new Sawstop PCS.

The other tools can wait until I can afford them. Can't replace fingers.


----------



## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

IMO, don't bottom feed. What I meant by that is, don't buy the bottom "price-point" product from either/any manufacturer. Jump up one or two models, and you will find a better success rate in getting quality equipment.

That said, now price check the better models from each manufacturer and use THAT to guide your purchase. I think you will be surprised when/if you try the above methodology. While I do not own either of the two TS models you mention, I DO own one of the better models from one of these manufacturers. And I could not be happier…


----------



## Markmh1 (Mar 9, 2017)

I didn't look very hard at the safety features when I bought my PCS, just at the saw.

FWIW, I'm getting jointer quality edges with my PCS and the 40 tooth blade the saw came with. When I buy a better blade, I'm thinking even that already good finish will improve.

Mark


----------



## Desert_Woodworker (Jan 28, 2015)

> Griz g0715p and Incra is a stellar combo.
> 
> M
> 
> - Madmark2


I like what I see- Much more saw and a 8"jointer vs a contractor saw. With power tools safety must always be of concern- please post your decision.


----------



## JBrow (Nov 18, 2015)

WoodworkingBarber,

I learned a long time ago that buyer's regret is a bitter pill. Since you say the Sawstop is your "dream saw" you may regret a decision that does not include the purchase of your "dream saw". Additionally I have come to believe that quality tools come at a higher price but tend to be a pleasure to use over a long time. I do not own a Sawstop, but from the many posts I have read, Sawstop seems to offer quality (high value) tools.

I believe you are correct; adding a jointer to the shop will improve the ease and quality of your woodworking. If you go with the Sawstop option, you could also buy a used Craftsman or other brand jointer probably for around $100 maybe $200, until your budget allows for a jointer upgrade. The benefit of buying an inexpensive used jointer is that for a little money you can gain some experience with the jointer. This experience could be invaluable when the time comes to upgrade. Once upgraded, you could conceivably sell the used jointer for nearly the same money it cost to buy.


----------



## waho6o9 (May 6, 2011)

Enjoy your new Sawstop


----------



## ArtMann (Mar 1, 2016)

I think you should buy the saw of your dreams but I own the saw that HorizontalMike says is a "bottom feeder". It is a very fine tool for what I do. I try not to pass out advice on something I have never owned and don't have any experience with. This is coming from a person who has been woodworking for 40 years and has owned several table saws. I also am lucky enough to be able to buy whatever brand and model I want. I got that way in part by being frugal and buying what I need rather than what someone else thinks is worthy.


----------



## ArtMann (Mar 1, 2016)

Here is my comment on JBrow's thoughts. When I started woodworking, I built and sold internal bee hive parts. I bought a used 4 inch "AMT" brand jointer powered by a 3/4 hp washing machine motor. A few of the old timers may still remember the brand. I doubt if I paid $50 for it. I eventually gave it away but not before I made several thousand dollars using it. It worked great for those small parts. Today I own a 12 inch jointer because that is what I need for what I am doing. Good used 6 inch jointers are abundant and inexpensive, at least where I live.


----------



## Desert_Woodworker (Jan 28, 2015)

> I think you should buy the saw of your dreams but I own the saw that HorizontalMike says is a "bottom feeder". It is a very fine tool for what I do. I try not to pass out advice on something I have never owned and don t have any experience with. This is coming from a person who has been woodworking for 40 years and has owned several table saws. I also am lucky enough to be able to buy whatever brand and model I want. I got that way in part by being frugal and buying what I need rather than what someone else thinks is worthy.
> 
> - ArtMann


Nicely put. I expected a pro Saw Stop response from this site and yes it is a fantastic saw. That being said, think of the "logic" behind the pro Saw Stop ( SS) reasons for it. Yes it is designed for safety; but other than a workshop with more than a table saw- how many more machines are there in the shop that can disable you? Therefore, if the concern for your hand safety is your priority then SS otherwise buy what YOU want or think that you want.
Ps consider a Laguna entry level cabinet saw


----------



## Desert_Woodworker (Jan 28, 2015)

> Here is my comment on JBrow s thoughts. When I started woodworking, I built and sold internal bee hive parts. I bought a used 4 inch "AMT" brand jointer powered by a 3/4 hp washing machine motor. A few of the old timers may still remember the brand. I doubt if I paid $50 for it. I eventually gave it away but not before I made several thousand dollars using it. It worked great for those small parts. Today I own a 12 inch jointer because that is what I need for what I am doing. Good used 6 inch jointers are abundant and inexpensive, at least where I live.
> 
> - ArtMann


I follow you so far but -Do these used 6" jointers have the "helical head" and the trend is helical head 8 -12" wide- but no Saw Stop safety mechanism. Go with Grizzly or Laguna new. Just my opinion.


----------



## knotscott (Feb 27, 2009)

It all boils down to what value you put on your safety vs having a more fully equipped shop. It's really a personal choice that only you can make.


----------



## johnstoneb (Jun 14, 2012)

Sawstop with the T glide is the way to go. I have the sawstop contractor. The quality can't be beat and you get the safety hopefully never to be used.


----------



## Babieca (Apr 13, 2014)

If it were me, I would get for the Sawstop.

I got my 6 inch jointer for $100 on craigslist (and spent another $50 for a new switch, cord and knives), but I could manage very easily without it. A sled for the planer takes care of flattening anything over six inches right now anyway and for edge jointing a hand plane may take a minute longer, but that's about all.


----------



## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

Get the Grizzly saw and the G0490, less to go wrong and the stopsaw has nothing to protect you from kickbacks the Grizzly doesn't have already.


----------



## rwe2156 (May 7, 2014)

If you don't use the machine much, or have a fear of cutting off a body part, get the SS.

OTOH, if you (like me) know there is more than one way to cut off a finger, well…...

Actually, I wish someone would invent a CutStop chisel. LOL


----------



## pintodeluxe (Sep 12, 2010)

Sawstop now. 490 jointer soon. Both are great tools.


----------



## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

> I think you should buy the saw of your dreams but I own the saw that HorizontalMike says is a "bottom feeder". It is a very fine tool for what I do. I try not to pass out advice on something I have never owned and don t have any experience with. This is coming from a person who has been woodworking for 40 years and has owned several table saws. I also am lucky enough to be able to buy whatever brand and model I want. I got that way in part by being frugal and buying what I need rather than what someone else thinks is worthy.
> - ArtMann


Sorry Art. I didn't know that you had missed the following:
"...Jump up one or two models, *and you will find a better success rate* in getting quality equipment…"

I am glad you had success with the one you purchased. BTW, I never said that the entry level saws were ALL bad, only that the chances of having issues with them were greater. And yes I understand that even a Porsche can have an issue.


----------



## ArtMann (Mar 1, 2016)

I wonder how HorizontalMike is measuring "success rate". I think it is more than just functionality and eye appeal regardless of cost. I think things like value are a part of the equation too.


----------



## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

> I think you should buy the saw of your dreams but I own the saw that HorizontalMike says is a "bottom feeder"….
> 
> AND
> I wonder how HorizontalMike is measuring "success rate". I think it is more than just functionality and eye appeal regardless of cost. I think things like value are a part of the equation too.
> - ArtMann


Give it a break Art, honestly. You misquote me and go off on some tirade, generated from that(your) very same misquote… Geez…

Oops, you almost got me going Art.

That is until I noticed that you have *all zeros* posted in ANY of your profile, including no workshop, and you have been on LJs well over a year. How about contributing to LJs in some constructive manner by posting some projects, reviews, blogs, etc.? Just sayin'...


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

If you believe in insurance for your most important hands go with the Sawstop,a good number of people that post table saw accidents start by saying "I was one of those guys that said I've been working all these years without an injury why do I need a Sawstop" then they go on to describe their hand injury and it's pain and large hospital bill.
You saved up for this purchase you can save up for your Grizzly Jointer and get it later.


----------



## bonesbr549 (Jan 1, 2010)

I feel ya pain. I started with a crappy lowes brand table top when I was young (long long ago), and now have the SS ICS. Get that saw you want! The jointer, I'd start saving back and find an old one on the cl later.

I "saved" some money and bought a 6" delta POS with aluminum fence and it was horrible. Gave the thing away.

For a long time, I used a #7 hand plane and roughing plane to flatten my stock. Was elbow grease (using rob cosmons rough to ready method) and worked just fine.

I now have the 12" griz jointer and its great to work with.

BTW had the griz 1023 before the SS so I do like my griz, but get the SS! buy once cry once. Worth it!


----------



## knotscott (Feb 27, 2009)

Is the OP still with us?


----------



## WoodworkingBarber (Apr 29, 2017)

Hey guys thanks for all the input, I just ordered my Sawstop pcs 36" today. It will be worth the plunge. I thought about it and two to three more commissions and I'll get the 8" jointer I want.

All you wisdom is fantastic and helpful.

Thanks again!


----------



## bonesbr549 (Jan 1, 2010)

Congrats and post a review when u get it


----------



## Let_that_saw_eat (Jul 30, 2016)

Newbie here to tables saws, just from what I've seen I agree you can't put a price on your fingers, but until they create a saw that 100% prevents kickback, all those hot dogs in the commercial don't mean much to me.
I plan on buying a Grizzly, just too much of a price difference for my wallet. Clear head, focus and respect all power tools, this is a hobby, not a sweat shop.


----------



## PJKS (Dec 21, 2016)

Buy the Sawstop …. You wont regret it !!
Best purchase I ever made !!


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Let-that
waiting for a saw that prevents kickback 100%(in the home shop budget) is like waiting for a car that could never get in an accident it all has to do with the Nut behind the wheel, if you use command sense,the riving knife,blade guards, feather boards, hold downs and stand clear of the path of kickbacks then kickbacks are far less lightly ,but if you break the safety rules your more inclined to have an accident just like driving.


----------



## ThistleDown (Jun 8, 2016)

I worry more about kickback than cutting off digits, I make a habit of not putting fingers near spin-ey sharp things. I got a Griz 1023RL and an Incra. Got some Micro Jigs to keep spin-ey sharp things from my hands.


----------



## johnstoneb (Jun 14, 2012)

The saw stop is better quality than the grizzly and you hav e the safety. Good choice.


----------



## HTown (Feb 25, 2015)

Good choice. I've owned a Unisaw for 18 years and can't imagine a different saw, unless the little one wants to take up the Hobby, then it will be an easy decision to make the change. 20 fingers being better than anything less.


----------



## ThistleDown (Jun 8, 2016)

> The saw stop is better quality than the grizzly and you hav e the safety. Good choice.
> 
> - johnstoneb


I am not trying to start a war but that is a totally subjective statement. When I went looking, and I looked very hard at everything, SS, Griz, Uni, Jet and PM, I did a cost for quality analysis. The Griz won. Here is what I need a TS to do: cut true, spit out the dust, have enough power and be dead flat on the table. When compared to the SS the Griz had the same power, was dead flat, had a true fence and has better dust collection, (look at the 1023RL) and a waaaay better cost. Not taking into account the break away blade the Griz was hands down a better deal. The SS is not better quality, I know, I drove to all over VA to test them both, it just does not have the break away blade. Like I have stated, I keep my fingers away from the blade at all times, using tools made for just that purpose. SO I got a saw that does the job and is comparable to the SS in every way except the, I think, invented danger, of the break away blade. I say invented danger because if you are stupid, lazy or just distracted from what you are doing, you will get hurt on ANY tool. For instance, I have been driving for 47 years and never had an accident, not one. Was I lucky? No, attentive; and I lived and worked in the DC area for all that time, which has the worst traffic on the east coast.

OK, this danger thing has been beat to death, but Grizzly has comparable quality at a good price and can be put up against any other brand. I know, I looked at them all and can buy whatever I want, so cost was not the driver in choosing a TS. Value was.

Sorry John, it just got my craw, stepping down off the box.


----------



## jonah (May 15, 2009)

You're saying the tens of thousands of blade contact injuries every year are *all* caused by inattentive people.

Bull********************. You don't have to be stupid, lazy, or distracted for your fingers to come into contact with a table saw blade. Being smart, proactive, and attentive certainly reduces your risk of injury, but cannot eliminate it. Your anecdotes about safety behind the wheel are not data.

I've been in three accidents over ~20 years of driving, none of which were remotely my fault. Does that make you a better driver than me? The only rational answer to that question is "no."

Should I then buy a car without airbags and seat belts because I happen to be a very good driver with excellent reflexes?


----------



## edapp (Jun 27, 2014)

Thistledown, 
As the recent buyer of a sawstop PCS the quality has been unlike anything i have ever purchased. The packaging, hardware, instructions (gloss, color, spiral bound book!) and assembly were a joy. These are things that give the impression of quality and value (to me). The tables are flat, the miter slot was square to the blade (as best as i could measure) from the factory. The fence was square to the miter slot/blade upon assembly.

Yes a grizzly will cut straight and true, and so will many jobsite saws. If you want to go down that road you could say that the grizzly is way more than anyone needs and they should buy a rigid, or bosch, or ryobi because they all cut wood. The perception of quality is subjective, but to me the Sawstop was worth the price difference, and it would have been without the safety feature. Now there is certainly a place for Grizzly in my shop as well, and I have a Jointer on backorder.


----------



## Jeremymcon (Jul 16, 2016)

I don't own a jointer or table saw yet (bandsaw, planer, hand planes), but if I were in your situation, I'd be leaning toward the sawstop. Safety factor is a big one for me, and do you really need an 8" jointer? Just get a jack plane for those twisted boards, roughly flatten one face, then run it through your planer. Most of the kiln dried lumber I buy is nearly dead-flat anyway. Edge joint by some other method, unless you're doing a lot of it. Hand planes, table saw sled, router and straight edge, whatever.


----------



## Let_that_saw_eat (Jul 30, 2016)

@ a1Jim,

I wasn't saying that I'm waiting for a saw that is 100% kickback proof, I'm saying I'm more afraid of kickback and use all the safety items you listed. All I meant was i think a safety feature like the SS is great but it can make you lax. 
I don't sell any work and I'm in no hurry to finish a project that I need rush thru and rely on a safety feature that solves ONE potential threat, always focus and trust your gut.


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

The table saw debate I think will always continue with those who say you need a SawStop to be safe and those who say how could you be so stupid to injure yourself on a rotating saw blade. 
I'm not sure what SawStop you've looked ThistleDown but the ones I've used have been top quality , I can't speak for the other levels of SawStops but the ICS Sawstop is very high quality enough for me to buy one and give up my beloved Powermatic 66 a flagship of great quality saws for years, but I fond my ICS SawStop to the bigger and better and safer with outstanding dust collection and great features . I know there expense but as I said earlier so is reconstructive surgery.
I do know that some people feel that the possibility of injury on table saws is way overblown and they don't need A SS for their safety, that's fine and perhaps they are right but as I'm getting older I find sometimes my focus is not what it use to be so the SawStop is just some insurance that I feel is worth the investment for me, I don't try and shove buying a Sawstop down anyone thought. I sincerely hope those who feel they don't need the safety factor SS offers never have any serious problems on their saws.
Just for the record, all the Grizzly tools I own have been a great value and well-made tools, so good luck with your new saw Enjoy!


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Hi 
Let that saw eat
I think what your saying is possible about people becoming too lax in using their SS saws, I guess it has to do with the individual using the saw but in a number of years as a woodworking teacher I find my adult student give the table saw a great deal of respect even though they are using SawStops, plus I always teach how to use table saws as if they don't have safety technology. Yes, it's true many wood shop accidents happen by people being in a hurry, but not all shop accidents happen by people being in a rush.


----------



## Let_that_saw_eat (Jul 30, 2016)

@a1Jim

I can certainly see your points and respect everyone elses too. Much like any piece of equipment its all in the volume and task you perform. I've seen many incidents at my old job and have been involved in a few that shook me, so i tend to always respect any wood processing. Below is the link to the sawmill i worked in for over a decade.






I've seen bandsaws blow up due to feed rate, watched a 20"x16"X14ft long Soft Maple cant hit the dual headsaw after the carriage safety release failed and fly thru the wall of the sawmill and stuck into the exterior wall of the next building. I was tailsawing standing an armslength away from the 5ft lower saw which exploded sending metal flying everywhere. Without a doubt though, worst sound i ever heard in my life, even thru the ear plugs. Its engrained into me to always proceed cautiously with any milling process.


----------



## JackDuren (Oct 10, 2015)

Best way not to start a war is to not say anything.


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Pretty interesting mill.


----------



## ThistleDown (Jun 8, 2016)

Sigh, I am saying it is not better quailty just because of a safty feature. If you take that out of the equation they both do the job of cutting straight true wood, and that is what a TS should do. It is not better QUALITY just because of the feature. A bit safer, sure, not better quality.

And I know I am a better driver, I just know it. LOL


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Take away the safety factor and my SS outshines any table saw I've used before. It has the best dust collection, easiest blade insert removal. the easiest access to the inside of the saw, Most powerful 5hp, This saw is beyond a monster, my Powermatic 66 weighed 600lbs my ICS weighs 900 lbs makes for a good stable saw the doesn't move around.


----------



## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

> [...] my ICS weighs 900 lbs [...]
> - a1Jim


Why does yours weigh several hundred pounds more than a normal ICS?

Cheers,
Brad


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Well Brad it wouldn't fit on my bathroom scale ) I 'm going by the shipping label but the manual says 685 LBs (saw only) no fence, side feed rails. etc. I'm sure mine weighs the same as all the other 5hp units, according to the manual the weight varies according to what motor you have.


----------



## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

> I'm going by the shipping label but the manual says 685 LBs (saw only) no fence, side feed rails. etc.
> - aiJim


Strange.. the SS site lists that 685lbs as the complete saw with a 52" fence… and the saw only (no extensions or fence) weighs 530 lbs. For comparison, the PM2000 lists at 675 lbs and the Unisaw at 661 lbs.

Cheers,
Brad


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Brad
No sense beating this to death i"m going by what my manual and shipping label said if what you found online say 685 lb that's fine with me ,PM2000 isn't a PM66, so who cares, one why or the other.
Have a good night.


----------



## JackDuren (Oct 10, 2015)

The Unisaw,Powermatic 66 and Grizzly comparable have all been good saws. I wouldn't walk from any on a budget. The SawStop offers something extra. If that extra isn't of value then I'd be happy with either of them with the correct fence.


----------



## Redoak49 (Dec 15, 2012)

The Sawstop is a great saw not even considering the safety. It is well made, great finish and customer service. In my opinion, the fit and finish is much better than the Grizzly and a price to match.

If you want a Grizzly , great and you should buy one. It has a great price point.

If you want a Sawstop and the safety it adds, you should buy one.

If you want something else, you should buy it.

The insane arguments about these saws is beyond belief.

HOWEVER…....
I will never buy a Grizzly tool after reading the issues that an LJ member reported on with the arbor on his saw.


----------



## JackDuren (Oct 10, 2015)

I used a grizzly saw for years without a problem.


----------



## bret0826 (Jul 16, 2017)

it all comes to down to safety and what you willing to pay for it.the ss is not better then the grizzly except for the blade stop.i will disagree with Jonah because yes it is user error that causes injuries on the tablesaw.unless the blade shoots out of the machine and hits you,which I have never heard of how else does your fingers touch the blade.My advice is to buy what you feel most comfortable with but don't buy the ss because its a way better saw because its not


----------



## dbray45 (Oct 19, 2010)

I have a question about the Sawstop.

Will the blade stop cutting the hot dog if you are not making contact with the saw body or frame when the blade comes in contact to the hot dog? In the demonstrations that I have seen, the person has their hand on the table and holding the hot dog - creating the electrical contact required.

The reason is - if you do slip and lets say that you are wearing the right clothing, shop apron, etc…, you are not making contact that the electronics can detect. If this is true, you can get cut fairly significantly before the technology knows you are there.

If this is the case, it is a substantial false security. Also, say you were cutting damp wood and you turn off the safety, at that point you are no better. And we all know that wet or damp wood can bind up faster than properly dried wood. If you forget to turn it back on, well, you have a standard table saw.

In my way of thinking, this is more dangerous because without the safety features - you know the risks all of the time, not sometimes and maybe this time, but possibly not next time.

I am not trying to start any kind of conflict or debate. This hobby, trade, industry, IS frickin dangerous. I have carving chisels that if they fall off the work bench, will make a pretty good slice in my leg or foot. Hell, I reached for something and caught one of the blades - barely touched it and it cut me. Makes you think every time your hand gets anywhere close to the chisels. You need to be that way EVERY time you enter your shop or you WILL get injured at some point. There are three things for certain - you were born, you will pay taxes someplace, and you will die. Everything else is an option.

I am not in favor of either one, just trying to keep the focus on safety here.


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

I guess we can come up with lots of scenarios, what if your seat belt pops open on impact in a car accident kind of issue. Here's info about how SS works.

http://www.sawstop.com/why-sawstop/the-technology


----------



## Gene01 (Jan 5, 2009)

The OP has made his choice. Only he can tell us if it was the right one for him.
Last week, I put a healthy gash in a finger with a PULL SAW! Stupidity abounds.


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

BTW
I have a SS and treat it just like it doesn't have the safety mechanism and where I teach Woodworking there are saw stops and I teach my students how to use table saws as if they don't have a safety device. 
I hear this thought all the time online that SSs makes you lackadaisical about safety, to me, this is pretty absurd. let's think about this for a minute I buy a SS so I can forget about safety??? I say the reverse is true people who buy SSs make a big investment in a SawStop for safety, why after buying one would you say oh I'm safe now I'm not going to watch how close my fingers are to the blade and trip this device so I can spend $100+ on a new blade and cartridge and see how this thing works? There's something about a spinning saw blades that people with IQs over 12 says don't touch me.
Before I bought a SS I always thought about Saftey before I stood in front of a table saw and that hasn't changed since I bought one. I bought a SS because I'm concerned about that one time I slip or make a mistake. Most of the hand injury post I see on LJs start with something like "after 20-30years of using a table saw I did….., something stupid "and fill in the blank on how bad the injury was. 
I don't fault people who don't want a SS we all have to do our own risk analysis.


----------



## dbray45 (Oct 19, 2010)

And what if your seat belt gets stuck and won't release as a train runs into your car - I wear a seat belt but there was an instance when for some reason I didn't one day and a car hit me head on. There was a 10 lbs wrench that went flying on impact and hit me in the back of the head. If I had been wearing my seat belt, it would have taken my head off. There are always the what ifs and they can change your life as well.

Have to disagree on that Jim. It is not the level of actual safety that I am speaking about. It is the perceived level of comfort in your head of which I speak.

Thinking that you are safe, knowing that you are safe, and being safe are all very different things. Just like you teach your students, there are rules to be learned - you can learn them now, or find them out later - but you will at some point. Just a matter of the cost that you pay.

Just because you have a SawStop product, does not guaranty that you are safe from injury. It means that you have taken XXX precautions for this event - under these exact conditions.

For many, that is great and are good with it. All I saying is that you can never let your guard down - and that goes with driving an automobile as well.


----------



## dbray45 (Oct 19, 2010)

I didn't see your second post before mine went in.

You are right - you have to treat it as though it is not there - always. But most people don't - or else they would not have all of the "saved" finger or hand stories. People are getting careless.


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

My point exactly David "that you can never let your guard down " SawStop or not. SS is insurance of only one way you can get hurt on a table saw.


----------



## Bluenote38 (May 3, 2017)

For what it's worth my next big ticket item is a SawStop cabinet saw. I VERY conscience of safety but it only takes once to earn the title "stumpy"


----------

