# Edited: Sturdy construction, odd warning



## AaronK (Nov 30, 2008)

it's probably something that can leech out of steel - I dont think *i'd* worry about it, since you wont be immersing them in your water supply. that said, wood fasteners are nicer


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## JJohnston (May 22, 2009)

I'm surprised you haven't noticed that "Prop 65" warning before. It's on everything. I wouldn't worry about it. It's probably the zinc from the galvanizing or something. Pump enough of anything into a laboratory mouse and it's bound to cause a problem.


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## Eric_S (Aug 26, 2009)

I've never seen that warning on any type of metal bracket before, I'd rather not use something like that if I have a choice, which I do.


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## CharlieM1958 (Nov 7, 2006)

They are only dangerous in California. You're fine.


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## racerglen (Oct 15, 2010)

Could even be the bag that's deemed a hazzard ?

;-)


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## Szczuldo (Oct 21, 2010)

if i choose not to purchase or use everything that had the prop 65 warning label on it, i would not have a router, a table saw, blades, bits, and everything else i have recently bought for my up and coming shop.

I wouldn't worry about it if I was you.


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## Wolffarmer (Jul 14, 2009)

I have seen the Prop 65 warnings with files you down load. Sheeesh. Makes the whole thing meaningless.

Randy


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## Eric_S (Aug 26, 2009)

Randy lol. If I saw it on eveyrthing I dont think it would be as big an issue for me. I have never seen this before though on a metal bracket.

Alexei, I must be blind. I haven't seen these at all on tools. I guess I'll be more observant next time.

I'm not worried, I just would rather not use it since I have the choice.


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## KnotWright (Nov 6, 2008)

Yes its true, EVERYTHING in California causes cancer thanks to PROP 65.

Eric if you're making furniture that you want to become an heirloom, why not just make the table top hold downs like our buddy Norm (New Yankee Workshop) does, run a dado down a section of wood and then use your drill press to punch in some holes, and finally head over to your chop saw and trim the clips to width.


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## Eric_S (Aug 26, 2009)

James, yeah thats what I said I would be doing in the review. I purchased these because I just wanted the stands done, but even while purchasing them I figured I probably wouldn't use them on this project and would instead use them on a future one. I'm sure they are probably safe since I wont be licking them or eating them or drinking water with them in the glass, but still its just something I have never seen on a metal bracket.

I found this on Rocklers website so maybe it doesn't mean anything for this particular product:
"Rockler Woodworking and Hardware has chosen to provide a warning based on its knowledge about the presence of one or more listed chemicals without attempting to evaluate the level of exposure. With products on Rockler's website, the exposure may be *below the Proposition 65 level of concern, or could even be zero.* However, out of an abundance of caution, Rockler has elected to place the Proposition 65 warning notification on *all* its products."

IGNORE THIS REVIEW. Its worthless now lol.


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## ellen35 (Jan 1, 2009)

I think if you eat the clips, you can get cancer… or worse!


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## mmh (Mar 17, 2008)

Well, moot or not, thanks for the warning!

It's sad how a company has to CTA (Cover Their Assets) to sell anything. I will have to put a lable on my canes that they could cause a falling syndrome if used improperly and if one sucks on the handle too long, may cause tooth decay or cancer.


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## Eric_S (Aug 26, 2009)

Lol mmh!


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## dbhost (Jul 20, 2009)

For what it's worth, EVERYTHING causes cancer, but only in the State of California… It's fine everywhere else…

Seriously though, I have used LOTS of those clips, and I believe they are electro plate galvanized if they are the ones I am thinking about. YES if you grind the plating or otherwise make the plating or other metal products to make the fine dust airborne, then YES you can increase your cancer risks.

These cancer warnings on just about every product known to man just reinforce how silly California can be…


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## Eric_S (Aug 26, 2009)

Brian thanks for that info.


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## Eric_S (Aug 26, 2009)

Thanks for the tip but I dont have a biscuit jointer yet. I was planning on using a slot routing bit.


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## dbhost (Jul 20, 2009)

The biscuit joiner tip should come in handy. I am about to build the base for a potting bench for LOML, and I do NOT want to go through the whole setup for the kerfs on the table saw… This should make my life a LOT easier…


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## dbhost (Jul 20, 2009)

Eric,

Be careful. I heard biscuit joiners cause cancer in California too!


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

How funny !!!

*Eric* don't worry: us blind guys DO stick together !

And … if you *cannot* laugh in the face of danger, then … well … your hand planes have GOT to go ;-)


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## Eric_S (Aug 26, 2009)

Lol I really must be blind. I've purchased many Rockler products and have never noticed this label before.


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## AaronK (Nov 30, 2008)

in that case, it wouldnt be as elegant, but you could always use dowels (without glue of course!)


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

As one who lived half my life there, and knows/knew about Prop 65 ….

http://oehha.ca.gov/prop65/background/p65plain.html

I'm pretty okay with it.

In fact, I'm okay with many things that seek to level the playing field on black-box issues like this. In the Information Age, we should have ready access to this sort of information. It doesn't rob us of our ability to make decisions about what we, as consumers, will or will not use.

It's just information.

In fact, Rockler's approach is rather lazy and reduces the potential benefits that Prop 65 could offer to Californians (or others).

Instead of asking its suppliers to verify whether known carcinogens ARE used in their products, they slap a label on everything ?

I worked supply chain in an industry that had tight connections to Department of Ag regulations. We took the time to work with our suppliers to either get required info, reduce use of chemicals considered dangerous, or both.

It WAS harder than ignoring it all, but it was also the right thing to do.


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## JJohnston (May 22, 2009)

If you follow that link, you can see the list of some 800 Prop. 65 chemicals. Interestingly, both testosterone and wood dust are on the list.


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## AaronK (Nov 30, 2008)

testosterone and wood dust SHOULD be on that list. those are some pretty hazardous materials!

neil - you make a really good point about rockler. by putting it on everything they are diluting its effect even more so.


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## Eric_S (Aug 26, 2009)

Neil I totally agree. It is a completely worthless warning when its on everything and doesn't do any good other than saying we are lazy and don't want to deal with suppliers so we'll just cover our asses. I didn't know it was on everything which is why it concerned me. Now that I found out its on everything I'll probably completely disregard that label when I should in fact still be reading it on certain products.


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

Exactly *Eric*. And (n=1) there's anecdotal evidence that their practice is eliminating any possible benefits that the Proposition may have had.


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## reggiek (Jun 12, 2009)

The trouble with that stupid warning is that it makes people complacent….with everything having warnings on them….how can you tell the stuff that is really dangerous?

Sometimes these tort attorneys really cause alot of stupidity… like warnings about not putting live animals in microwaves….etc etc…. Trouble is, folks quit reading the warnings if they are on everything. I guess it all is part of the "it's someone else's fault" that permeates law offices for ambulance chasers these days.


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## rbterhune (Jul 31, 2009)

Unless you're going to lick/eat them or wear them as a charm bracelet I don't think you have a problem? Who's even going to be able to get to them after the drawer is installed?...no one.


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## crank49 (Apr 7, 2010)

It's such a shame too. California used to be a wonderful place to do business. I have known many manufacturers over the years that said,"You can introduce and sell a product in California to prove its value as a product. If it works there, then you can move on to the rest of the country." I don't hear this anymore. Now it's more like "Try to sell it anywhere else first. If you have no other options, then try California as a last resort, but be preparred to jump through hoops, and don't even think about trying to manufacture out there."


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## HokieMojo (Mar 11, 2008)

An older one that I found interesting is on the Lie Nielsen webpage. Apparently you are supposed to wash your hands after using a handplane.

http://www.lie-nielsen.com/catalog.php?grp=1269
warning is at the bottom


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## Manitario (Jul 4, 2010)

just try not to eat one, and you should be ok.


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## longgone (May 5, 2009)

I was planning a trip to California in the spring but if everyone there will be dead from cancer I might as well save my plane ticket money.


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## Sawkerf (Dec 31, 2009)

Everything in, on, over or under CA has that warning. If we had baby harp seals, they would need the warning, too.


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## Eric_S (Aug 26, 2009)

Greg, you should go but make sure you have a t-shirt that says "Warning: I cause cancer" lol


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## FirehouseWoodworking (Jun 9, 2009)

Deleted.


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## DrAllred (Sep 2, 2010)

If the courts in California had their way, every thing would be labeled with Prop 65, that includes the air, sand, dirt, water and of course people….

Really sad what a small group of people can get a law passed as this Prop 65.


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## Jimi_C (Jul 17, 2009)

I use the figure 8 connectors, no groove required. I just made a simple jig out of a piece of 8/4 - ran a rabbet so it became a clamping block, and used my drill press to drill a 3/4" hole exactly where I wanted the fastener on the rail. Then I could just clamp the block where I wanted it, and used a forstner bit with some tape to mark the depth with a hand drill. I can fine tune it to the point where the fastener is perfectly level with the surface of the rail, and the forstner bit makes a nice starting hole for the pilot bit.


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## SouthpawCA (Jul 19, 2009)

I live in California. The warning is EVERYWHERE. So much so that nobody even cares about it. It's for the lawyers and as far as I'm concerned means nothing. We vote on everything here and that's what happens when you have voters who aren't educated on a particular subject voting on it. It sounded good at the time.


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