# Using Birch Ply for a bookcase face frame?



## Roux (Aug 14, 2014)

I'm designing a bookcase, based loosely off of Norm Abrams's classic New Yankee episode 108.

I'm using Baltic Birch Plywood, and have purchased two sheets, even though the project could squeak by with one.

In the New Yankee episode, Norm uses pine for his face frame and nosing. I have learned that using a hard wood for nosing would better support the shelves, and further reduce the possibility of sagging under heavy load. Additionally, the pine at my local home store is pretty ugly stuff, and would take a lot of love to look decent.

I am intending to paint this project, not stain.

Is there a good reason for me to not use the trim from my second sheet of Birch Ply to make the face frame and nosing? I have never worked with the stuff before, but the mighty internet tells me that even its edges can be sanded fairly smooth. If I could get it smooth, and paint it, I could avoid buying 8 board feet of hardwood.

I don't want to cheap out and regret it, but if I'm painting this thing anyway, what harm is there?


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## InstantSiv (Jan 12, 2014)

You will see the layers if you paint.

I haven't tried this but a friend told me that he puts glue on the edges and sands after it dries to get a smooth look.

Might be something to try.

Also if you're going to pocket hole the face frame the screws can sometimes separate the layers so predrill so that doesn't happen.


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## Roux (Aug 14, 2014)

Just wanted to say thank you, that was great advice. I've been experimenting with the glue edge technique before getting into the meat of this project… It's about "80% perfect" for me so far, which is much better than the "30% decent" look I got off of just painting the edge.


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## firefighterontheside (Apr 26, 2013)

You can mix the glue with water, say 50% and then paint it on the edges. This works for MDF as well.


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## MrRon (Jul 9, 2009)

I would get some Poplar for the face frame and nosing from the big box store. It is pretty inexpensive and takes paint well. Save the other sheet of BB for another project.


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## BinghamtonEd (Nov 30, 2011)

I agree with Mr Ron, save the ply. You're not saving anything in the long run, as on a future project you'll be looking for ply and not have it, and buy more.

If you do use the ply, the iron-on edge banding is easy to apply and takes paint well, and is sold at the big box stores. I find it's easiest to cut the parts to size, then apply the banding on show surfaces, and then cut any joinery, like rabbets or dados, then assemble. Trying to apply it afterwards is just more work and often not as nice-looking. No special tools needed except an iron, also a block plane makes trimming to size a breeze.


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## ChefHDAN (Aug 7, 2010)

+1 for Ed & Ron
I've done several projects with ply and often find myself realizing that the work to cover the edges takes more time and work than just using solids, where it's usually only endgrain cover that has to be planned out


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## Waldo88 (Nov 7, 2014)

Why paint the BB ply? The even ply pattern looks good and works for a lot of applications without hiding it. A lot of modern furniture makes use of this fact.

If you are going to paint it and hide it, why spend the money on BB ply, just get some run of the mill cabinet grade stuff instead.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

I agree with those who say just use Pine ,birch or Poplar for the face frame,instead of plywood.


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

You could edge band it. I've done it. Also used glue and fine sawdust sanded after dry.

I'm prob wouldn't cut into a fresh sheet, but Id use scraps all day.


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## ADHDan (Aug 17, 2012)

I think it just comes down to whether you have more time or money (or hardwood scrap). I think it all the prep work required to use ply for a face frame would be too much of a headache compared to using a cheap hardwood. I'd also be concerned about plywood splitting or shifting more during a pocket screw assembly due to the ply layers, and if the cabinet is likely to take a little abuse I believe ply (as well as poplar and pine) will dent more easily than something like oak or birch.

There's a lumberyard in my area (Twin Cities) that sometimes puts out big bundles of 1×2 offcut hardwood strips for $10 specifically for face framing. It might be worth checking around for something similar in your neck of the woods.


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## MT_Stringer (Jul 21, 2009)

> I would get some Poplar for the face frame and nosing from the big box store. It is pretty inexpensive and takes paint well. Save the other sheet of BB for another project.
> 
> - MrRon


+1 What Ron said.

The end result would look something like this.









Or this.


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## Waldo88 (Nov 7, 2014)

> I think it just comes down to whether you have more time or money (or hardwood scrap). I think it all the prep work required to use ply for a face frame would be too much of a headache compared to using a cheap hardwood. I d also be concerned about plywood splitting or shifting more during a pocket screw assembly due to the ply layers, and if the cabinet is likely to take a little abuse I believe ply (as well as poplar and pine) will dent more easily than something like oak or birch.
> 
> There s a lumberyard in my area (Twin Cities) that sometimes puts out big bundles of 1×2 offcut hardwood strips for $10 specifically for face framing. It might be worth checking around for something similar in your neck of the woods.
> 
> - ADHDan


Baltic birch plywood and plywood in general are very different things….

Glued up baltic birch strips makes a fine cutting board (BB ply glue is waterproof). Birch is every bit as hard as oak and ash, and harder than walnut, cherry, and soft maple.


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## Rayne (Mar 9, 2014)

+1 to TheFridge. I made a media cabinet and entertainment center out of plywood and just used edge-banding. The stuff is awesome as long as you make sure you get the correct species. Both of my projects are stained with poly coat on top. Photo shows before the glass going in.


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## ADHDan (Aug 17, 2012)

> Baltic birch plywood and plywood in general are very different things….
> 
> Glued up baltic birch strips makes a fine cutting board (BB ply glue is waterproof). Birch is every bit as hard as oak and ash, and harder than walnut, cherry, and soft maple.
> 
> - Waldo88


Yes, yes it is. That's why I suggested he use birch or oak for a face frame if it's going to take abuse.

Or were you saying that BB plywood would not dent as easily and thus would be fine for a face frame? That may well be; I don't know.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Excuse the difference of opinion, but oak is not really a good choice if your going to paint the face frame ,most shops including mine use Poplar for paint grade jobs,it's inexpensive,durable and takes paint very well.


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## ADHDan (Aug 17, 2012)

> Excuse the difference of opinion, but oak is not really a good choice if your going to paint the face frame ,most shops including mine use Poplar for paint grade jobs,it s inexpensive,durable and takes paint very well.
> 
> - a1Jim


Noted. I know poplar is often the go-to for face framing, and you're a lot more experienced than I am. If there's any doubt I'd certainly give deference to your opinion.

I guess I just have a lot of cheap red oak, and since I don't really like its grain and color generally I use it for anything that's going to get beaten up by kids.


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