# CV 1800 Bundle Review



## Redoak49 (Dec 15, 2012)

Very good review…thanks. it will help as I consider an upgrade to my dust collection.


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## Desert_Woodworker (Jan 28, 2015)

Good review, but I like and use Laguna and reccomend their product.


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## WoodNSawdust (Mar 7, 2015)

Thanks for the review. I am shopping for a DC upgrade. I just need a physically smaller unit to fit in the shop.


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## pintodeluxe (Sep 12, 2010)

Assembly sounds like a nightmare. And MDF components? Not so sure I like that idea, but hey if it works it works. 
Thanks for the detailed review.


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## JBrow (Nov 18, 2015)

Desert_Woodworker

Thank you for your kind words. Regarding your recommendation of Laguna products, I agree. Last year I purchased their 3 hp compact shaper, part of my major shop upgrade program. Although I have only made one project using the Laguna Shaper, I believe that it met all of my requirements and am impressed by its fit and finish, its features, and performance.

Before spending the kind of money we woodworkers spend, I suspect most of us identify our requirements and then look for tools that meet those requires and offer a good value. This is why I find these tool reviews and comments such as yours so helpful. In the end a tool that meets one woodworker's needs may not meet those of another and thus result in differing purchase decisions.

I have no doubt that Laguna produces quality well performing dust collectors. Some features of their dust collectors are: 1) they are compact in size, 2) offer dust collectors with plenty of power, 3) provide good fine dust filtration, 4) appear to be of heavy duty construction, 5) and are competitively priced, with special promotions from time to time.

One of the factors that played heavy in my CV 1800 decision was the extent to which each dust collector removed fine dust before entering the filter. Since I could not find definitive specifications from most manufactures showing the amount of dust that makes it into the filter, I concluded that longer cyclone funnels were better in preventing fine dust from enter the filters. However, these longer cyclone funnels increase static pressure within the unit and adversely impact performance. Therefore a longer funnel requires more power to compensate for the increase in static pressure; more horsepower and more money that can be spent elsewhere.

On the other hand, Laguna and many other manufacturers include either a manual or automatic filter cleaning mechanism. These mechanisms have the advantage of easy filter cleaning, though I am not sure how effective they are. Also, I would be concerned about premature damage to the filter. But then, in a hobby workshop, probably not enough damage to really matter. Man, I really do not like sorting through all the options manufacturers provide. I get a headache every time.

In summary, I respect your opinion concerning the Laguna dust collector, especially since it meets your dust collection requirements- evidently quite well; and based on my limited experience with Laguna.

Lastly, I ran across this YouTube video entitled "Laguna Tools 2 HP Mobile Cyclone Dust Collector Review - Part 3" by Marty Backe at "https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=a37WkDGa6qQ". It showcases one example of Laguna's superior customer service. Yes I know from what I have read, some may argue that Laguna has awful customer service or this example is not typical. Nonetheless and for whatever reason Laguna demonstrated impressive customer service in this example - and any new dust collector will likely require some sealing here and there.

pintodeluxe,

I might have thought that assembling the CV 1800, the way I did it anyway, was a nightmare at the time. It was a lot of work, no doubt. However the nightmare was installing the duct work. That was a real nightmare.

As far as MDF construction, I am not particularly concerned about it holding up. Apparently there was a time when the MDF components were not painted. In never ending humid environments like along the Gulf Coast, the naked MDF eventually began to deteriorate, as unprotected MDF can in constant moisture. The paint offers a level of protection that will probably last. Since I am in the mid-west where humidity comes and goes, I expect no problems with the MDF.

While the disadvantage of the CV 1800 is the extensive required assembly, it is relatively easy work. The components are light weight, especially when compared to the heavy steel models. I completed assembly with no help. For the price and performance, it is competitively priced, probably due in part to the materials from which it is constructed. How well will it last? From what I have determined, probably fairly well but only time will tell.


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## JBrow (Nov 18, 2015)

WoodNSawdust,

While doing a survey of dust collectors, I ran across Oneida's SMART Dust Collectors. They are a bit pricey, but are compact and offer some attractive features. I gave serious consideration to the 3 hp model. If you are interested they are in the "Premium Systems" category on Oneida's website. Here is the link to their 2hp and 3 hp models:

"http://www.oneida-air.com/inventory.asp?catid={D55CD13D-5CAA-4DD1-8646-157B8B3BDF44}"


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## RonGoldberg (Dec 11, 2011)

Outstanding review. I too, have recently added a cyclone and metal ducting system. Will write formal review soon. The difference is just as you stated - night vs day. What were we thinking all those years of not using proper dust collection? Personally, I believe, it is probably due to age and income - as we age, during our work years, we earn more money and can think about spending more money on our hobby. It would be interesting to see the average age of the woodworker that purchases a cyclone (I am willing to bet the average age is over 50). I am a bit disappointed that the woodworking magazine (all of them included) don't do a current review of cyclones. I bet it is because it would piss off some of the cyclone manufactures (as they are big advertising supporters). Would love to see a review of 2HP units and then another one for 3HP units. Well, one can only hope.

Can you please send more pictures of the ducting and the connection at the ports.

I too modified the ports on the jointer (from 4" to 6") and the table saw (from 4" to 5" and added an overhead Shark Guard with 4" port). Currently I am adding an additional port to the band saw. Already comes with a 4" port at the bottom wheel. I am trying to build and add a second port under the table.

Thanks again for the review and please send more pics.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

I have the same DC that I bought used, I installed it all by myself, this was a job.

http://lumberjocks.com/topics/46764


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## bkseitz (Oct 24, 2014)

Thanks for the detailed review. I've gone a cheaper route to start HF / SDD. I'll see in coming months' if the upgrade from Rigid 1hp dust distributor was worth it.


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## SplinteredDave (Oct 19, 2014)

Thanks for the review… I purchased the CV1800 but have yet to install it. Your review was very helpful. One detail I was curious about was your reference to the "pitot tube" you installed. Would you expand on that install and its benefits when you have a moment? Thanks


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## JBrow (Nov 18, 2015)

RonGoldberg,

Thanks. I used 6" SDR-35 Sewer and Drain Pipe to complete the CV 1800 installation. I would think that my approach for transitions and machine pickups would work with metal pipe.

I have 9 drops. Two go directly into the Dust Pickup for the machines with 6" Dust Collection Ports. The Radial Arm Saw Pickup that I constructed as best I could and the shop built Downdraft Sanding Table are straight 6" pickups. 6" smooth wall x .030 mil steel wire reinforced Polyurethane Flex Hose was used to make these connections. The Drum Sander received a 6" x 5" Reducer, and the 6" Flexible Hose made this connection the duct work. The remaining 6 drops were split into two 4" drops after the 6" blast gates.

This 6" to dual 4" transition was made using 6" X 4" Dust Collector Adapters (6" x 4" x 4" wye). These bring the two 4" ports directly into the 6" end of the adapter. I did not use a 6" x 4" reducer followed by a 4" x 4" x 4" wye because I wanted to maximize air flow at this junction. I figured a 60% reduction in air flow had I reduced the 6" duct work to 4". The 6" X 4" x 4" wye adapter (commonly used at a dust collector's inlet to equip a 6" dust collector inlet with two 4" drops) reduces air flow by 10%.

The 6" x 4" x 4" allowed me to connect two 4" flexible dust collection hoses to the duct work at one end, and to the dual 4" dust ports on the machine. As I may have mentioned in my review, I used a bimetal hole saw to drill a second 4" hole in machines that originally had only one 4" dust port. These machines were the Planer, Cabinet on the Table Saw, Shaper Cabinet. These were all metal. By the way, in doing this I ended up throwing the 4" hole saw and mandrel away. I could not release the mandrel from the hole saw. A bummer I know, but after just spending thousands of dollars on dust collection, what's another $30 to replace the hole saw. I also cut a 4" hole in the plywood cabinet that serves as my Router Table, giving me table top and lower dust collection ports.

I covered the freshly drilled 4" holes with 4" Angled Dust Ports. The 4" x 0.033" Flexible Hose I used is Clear Flex-Tube PU Polyurethane Smooth Walled Duct Hose. Both the 4" and 6" Flexible Hose can be bought on Amazon at a competitive (but high) price. The 6" x 4" x 4" wyes and the 4" Angle Dust Ports were made on ABS (I think) and from Grizzly. These fitting from Grizzly were inexpensive. I am sure that if you poke around on the internet you can find metal versions of these fittings. I used band clamps to secure flexible hose and applied silicone at the added dust ports.

Here are some pics. I am new to Lumberjocks and a have yet to figure out how to post pics. If these do not turn out just right, I look into some other way to post these.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Looks very good.
I made mine with AC duct


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## JBrow (Nov 18, 2015)

QitenAKADave,

The CV 1800 was outfitted with a Pitot tube so that the amount of air flowing out of the filter stack could be monitored and thus know when it is time to clean the filters. As the theory goes, when the filters are new and clean, air will be pumped by the dust collector out of the filters at the greatest possible rate. On the other hand, if the filters are completely plugged with dust and debris so that no air can pass though the filters, the air flow coming out of the cyclone is zero (in theory).

As the dust collector is used and more dust plugs the filter, the air flow coming from the dust collector outlet is reduced. By measuring the reduction in the air flow emerging from the dust collector outlet, one can know when it is time to clean the filters. The Pitot tube is a cheap and a cool way to monitor the air flow emerging from the dust collector outlet.

When a tube is placed in a fluid stream and perpendicular to the fluid stream, a vacuum is created in the tube. The fluid can be either a liquid or gas; in this case it is dirty air flowing out of the dust collector outlet. The faster the air moves across the end of the tube, the greater the vacuum.

By placing water in the tube, the vacuum will pull the water up the tube toward the end of the tube in the air stream.

The Pitot tube is a device that makes use of this principle of physics. It a U shaped tube containing water. One end of the tube is placed in the moving air stream. The other end of the U tube is open. When no air flows across air stream end of the tube, the water level in the U tube is the same height. As air flow across the end of the U tube increases, the water level rises in the leg of the U tube whose end is in the air stream. The water level in the other leg of the U tube drops.

Should you decide to make one for your dust collector, Stumpy recorded a video where he takes you through the construction of a Manometer (Pitot tube). It is found at
"



" and is entitled "SNW45- Woodworking dust collection upgrades- MAKE YOUR OWN MANOMETER filter monitor!".

The only deviation from Stumpy's design was ensuring that the Pitot tube extends at least 1" into the exhaust air stream. I mounted the vinyl tubing to plywood that is 5" wide and 20" long. I drew a measuring scale on the plywood. I also colored the water and then used a funnel to fill the vinyl tube. I only filled the U tubing to the point where the water level was about 1/3 high.

Ensure there are no kinks in the tubing. As time goes by, water will probably have to be added to the Pitot tube, but always fill to the same level more or less.

Additionally, I ensured that 24" or so vertical distance was maintained from the top of the water level in the U tube and where the tubing enters the cyclone. The last thing anyone would want to do was draw water into the filters. Lastly test the system when installed. Turn the dust collector on while watching the water level. If it appears that water will be drawn into the dust collector, shut off the machine and empty out some water and try again. If you maintained the vertical distance I suggest and only fill the U tube by no more than a 1/3 there should really be no problems. In my case, the dust collector only pulls the water level up toward the collector by about 2-1/2" to 3".

Make a note of the water level with the Dust Collector running when the Dust Collector filters are clean. When the water level fails to reach this benchmark, the filters are becoming dirty. Alternatively, when the water level in one leg of the Pitot tube approaches the water level in the other leg, the filters are clogging. I suspect this differential measurement is the best measurement to track.

I have not yet figured what the "time to clean" reading is. The measurement should be made with all but one blast gate closed. The open blast gate should always be the same blast gate when reading the Pitot tube. Air flow from different branches can and probably will give different readings due to static pressure inherent in each duct work branch.










In the photo, tubing on the right enters the cyclone air stream. Tubing on the left loops around and end exposed to free air.


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## JBrow (Nov 18, 2015)

b2rtch,

Thanks for your comments. I appreciate the link you posted as well. I know there are a lot questions concerning installing the CV 1800, demonstrated by the activity on Clearvue's forum. By providing the link, you have given those on this forum who are considering a dust collection upgrade an alternative perspective on the CV 1800. But on the other hand, your posts gave rise to a number of questions. I hope you have the patience to address at least some of the questions, the answers to which I may have missed. It is a very long thread

Herein above and in your post, you mentioned that you installed HVAC duct work. I considered that option but was concerned about whether it would hold up or collapse. Since you did not mention it, I assume it does not collapse. Did you use 6" 30 gauge HVAC pipe and fittings or did you go with heavier gauge duct work?

I looked at your install at the link you provided above. I envy you. I wish I had a place out of the workshop where I could have put the CV 1800. Placing the machine outside would have freed up floor space and made it much easier to mitigate the noise. But that poses some challenges.

First, the CV 1800 is pulling perhaps 800 cubic feet or more of air out of the workshop every minute the machine runs. That air must be replaced and you mentioned returning it somewhere near your wood burning stove, if I remember correctly. Did you pull in fresh air from outside or did you return air from the cyclone? How did you ultimately returned air to the shop?

Second, in the photos in your post, you installed the filters. One advantage of placing the dust collector outdoors is that you can avoid the expense of the filters as well as their maintenance. Of course if you returned air to the shop from the dust collector itself, you need the filters. Since air containing only fine dust is deposited outside the workshop, why did you install the filters?

Third, you mentioned in your post that you had a problem of sliding the dust collection drum under the cyclone funnel. I think you said the drum you had was too tall. For me, having maximum dust collection capacity was important. I do not like spending my woodworking time emptying the dust collection drum. How did you solve this problem?

Fourth, when you take heated and moist air outdoors and that air hits cold surfaces, condensation can occur. Moisture can deposit on the motor, the MDF components, and make dust stick to surfaces. I assume you insulated the outdoor enclosure to prevent this. Has condensation been a problem and if so, how did you overcome that problem?

Lastly and perhaps most importantly, your post was active until about September 2013. Have you had any problems with the CV 1800 since then?

Regarding the problem on which you seemed to have given up - that of knowing when it is time to empty the dust collection drum, I have a suggestion if you have not solved the problem. I suspect that it is a real pain to leave the warm workshop during a planing operation only to find you have capacity to run some more boards.

My suggestion is to construct a Dust Collection Chamber. This would be a sealed enclosure in which your Dust Collection Drum sets. The cyclone funnel penetrates the top of the chamber so that debris can be deposited in the Dust Collection Drum setting inside the Dust Collection Chamber. The Dust Collection Chamber would feature door to provide access to the Dust Collection Drum. The Dust Collection Chamber is sealed.

While a Dust Collection Chamber itself does not solve the problem of determining when it is time to empty the Dust Collection Drum, it does provide a stable platform on which you can mount some type of Bin Level Sensing mechanism. That can be an optical sensor, camera, weighing device, viewing port with direct access into the shop, or something else altogether. The Dust Collection Chamber allows you to mount the sensors so that they are stable and outside the dusty environment where the Dust Collection Drum sets. Emptying the Dust Collection Drum would not disturb the sensing system and is very easy.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

"Herein above and in your post, you mentioned that you installed HVAC duct work. I considered that option but was concerned about whether it would hold up or collapse. Since you did not mention it, I assume it does not collapse. Did you use 6" 30 gauge HVAC pipe and fittings or did you go with heavier gauge duct work?"

I used 6" 30 gauge HVAC.
To avoid the duct to collapse I invented and I made a vacuum safety valve

























I used a end cap, a DVD , a threaded rod and a spring.
When the vacuum is too great (all port closed) the valve open and it prevent the duct from collapsing.
It works great.

"First, the CV 1800 is pulling perhaps 800 cubic feet or more of air out of the workshop every minute the machine runs. That air must be replaced and you mentioned returning it somewhere near your wood burning stove, if I remember correctly. Did you pull in fresh air from outside or did you return air from the cyclone? How did you ultimately returned air to the shop?" 
I tried to install the filters outside and to make a return in the shop, but I rapidly realized that this was impossible. a quick calculation told ma that to have an area sufficient for the return air, I would have to remove the whole wall.
I moved the filters in the shop.This works well,the noise is very reasonable and I do not waste any heated or cooled air, in fact in the winter the air coming out of the filters is warm just due the compression of the air.










"Third, you mentioned in your post that you had a problem of sliding the dust collection drum under the cyclone funnel. I think you said the drum you had was too tall. For me, having maximum dust collection capacity was important. I do not like spending my woodworking time emptying the dust collection drum. How did you solve this problem?" 
I use a metallic trash can, it is tight but it fits

I live in Utah, no condensation here.
The DC outside is in an enclosed and sound insulated building to protect the neighbors from the noise.

To empty the trash can has not be a problem, I just go check before I start to work and if necessary I empty it. In the winter I burn everything in my stove.
I got it overfull a few times, then I just clean the filters.No big deal.

MY only problem is self inflicted: because of room restriction just at the inlet at the DC I have a sharp elbow, which cause turbulence and a restriction and the vacuum is not quite as good as it should be. 
If I could have a 6 feet long piece of straight duct this would greatly help.
If this was real issue for me I could fix the problem but this is not really a big issue as the suction as it is is enough for my needs.


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