# Holtzapffel workbench project



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

*making a top will boards face up?*

Hi All

My initial idea was to build a standard 2- 1/2 inch thick laminated top from 8/4 maple lumber. But I am short of 8/4 lumber and want to keep waste and price under control. So I am thinking of making only the first 7 inch from the front edge up and doing the rest of the top with the boards face up, each board will be around 5 inch wide. My lumber is kiln dried and plainsawn. My main worry is stability

I would like to get some comments or suggestions on how I could go by with this approach and if it make any sense.

also I am thinking of mixing some oak in the lamination, any issue with that? kiln dried also

thanks


----------



## toddc (Mar 6, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *making a top will boards face up?*
> 
> Hi All
> 
> ...


If your boards lay side-by-side, as in a dining table top, you will experience more seasonal movement. You just have to accommodate it with your construction methods, but other than that I think you will be OK.

According to "Wood Identification and Use" by Terry Porter, red oak has a specific gravity of .77 and hard maple is rated at .72. In comparison, soft maple is rated at .55.

I imagine that your oak and hard maple would move similar. I mated ash and black walnut in a small project and they have the same difference in specific gravity and they move well together, but that is in a small project.


----------



## oscaro928 (Nov 1, 2012)

martin007 said:


> *making a top will boards face up?*
> 
> Hi All
> 
> ...


The bench came out really good. I may do one like it.

Oscar


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

*top and legs*

I finally decided to build the Holtzapffel workbench.

I have all legs and top parts milled, legs are glued, top pieces ready for glue up.










top is ash and red oak, 3 inch thick 24 inch wide and 72 inch long
legs are red oak.
vises jaws will be ash

I have not decided yet on the layout of the top pieces, I have 6 peices of oak and 8 of ash, So like in the picture (hard to see) it might choose to be (from the front) 2 oak, 4 ash, 2 oak 4 ash 2 oak

By the way this is my first ever project, and I hope to not do a major mistake because I am out of dried lumber

Here is the legs glued, When doing this, I have not paid attention to the grain ring orientation and I don't know if I should have. In the picture you can see that one leg was face glued with end grain ring opposed and on the other leg, the end grain were in the same orientation. I sure would like some feed back on this. on the bottom picture, some nasty cracks appeared after glue up and I wonder why. The boards were in humidity equilibrum with the shop and I sticked stack them a few days after rough cutting them. Again feedback much appreciated


----------



## damianpenney (Jun 22, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *top and legs*
> 
> I finally decided to build the Holtzapffel workbench.
> 
> ...


Good luck Martin


----------



## PurpLev (May 30, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *top and legs*
> 
> I finally decided to build the Holtzapffel workbench.
> 
> ...


Good way to start, and thats a nice thick top!

Don't worry about screwing up - we all do it, it's only a matter of how bad the screwup is, and how creative the recovery is. but if you want to avoid that- just take your time, mark all your pieces 1000 times over, and keep track of each piece, it's direction , it's orientation, and stick to your markings…

And welcome to LJ


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

*top assembled- now resuming work on the base*

Hi All, there is nothing like a rainy day to get things done in the shop )

Top is now ready for final flatenning and finishing. I got the two half pretty much aligned on final glue up so it shouldn't be too hard. Thanks to my planner and jointer. I sure love my DJ20 jointer

I would like to get some suggestion on finishing the top. I am thinking about a mix of linseed oil with beewax, or varnish. I hope that after the finish applied, there will be a greater contrast between the ash and oak. It is sure not like a walnut and maple contrast.

Next to do: the stretchers and the base joinery

Here is some shots, thanks for watching














































Should I leave the top there for an outfeed table to the bandsaw and do another one for the workbench !? )


----------



## damianpenney (Jun 22, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *top assembled- now resuming work on the base*
> 
> Hi All, there is nothing like a rainy day to get things done in the shop )
> 
> ...


God, what I wouldn't have given for a DJ20 on this project! Coming along very nicely Martin (and embarrassingly quickly I might add


----------



## PurpLev (May 30, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *top assembled- now resuming work on the base*
> 
> Hi All, there is nothing like a rainy day to get things done in the shop )
> 
> ...


yeah, that would make for a very sturdy outfeed table …. who needs a workbench anyways


----------



## croessler (Jun 22, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *top assembled- now resuming work on the base*
> 
> Hi All, there is nothing like a rainy day to get things done in the shop )
> 
> ...


Rub it in… You have a DJ20…. Is it one of the older ones or news x5 model?


----------



## teenagewoodworker (Jan 31, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *top assembled- now resuming work on the base*
> 
> Hi All, there is nothing like a rainy day to get things done in the shop )
> 
> ...


for the finish just go with something like a danish oil. you don't want wax or finish because things will be slipping and sliding everywhere. time will take care of the oak and the ash. its coming along really nice though.


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *top assembled- now resuming work on the base*
> 
> Hi All, there is nothing like a rainy day to get things done in the shop )
> 
> ...


Yes Chris, it is the X5 model

Danish oil is a made out of boiled linseed oil and varnish right. I have both in the shop, so I guess I could make a little recipe


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

*question about the mortise and tenon joinery*

Hi

I am getting ready to make the joinery for the legs and stretchers. I wonder if I should build the joint tight or leave some space for wood movement. The stretchers (tenon) are 5 inch in width by one inch tick. In the book, they call for a tight joint. I wonder what will happen when that 5 inch wide tenon expend in width.

the legs are pretty beefy 3 by 5 inch

thanks


----------



## MikeLingenfelter (Feb 19, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *question about the mortise and tenon joinery*
> 
> Hi
> 
> ...


I left mine a little loose in width. There will be a little bit movement but not a lot. I also drawbored my pins, to pull the joints nice and tight and to hold them in place.


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *question about the mortise and tenon joinery*
> 
> Hi
> 
> ...


thanks Mike, I wanted to two shoulder tenons, but since I will leave some room for wood movement, I wonder If I should use four shoulder tenon instead to prevent for seeing the gap in dry season.

Have you put any finish on your bench?

Your bench looks very nice, specially with the wooden screw. I still have not made any decision yet on the type of vise I will use. But the wooden screw are very tempting, my other options would be the veritas twin screw.


----------



## MikeLingenfelter (Feb 19, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *question about the mortise and tenon joinery*
> 
> Hi
> 
> ...


I didn't notice or understand you were only doing two shoulders. You don't need a very large shoulder to hide the gap, if you go that route. Also, 5" won't see a lot of movement. You will probably be fine if you decide to stay with the 2-shoulder tenon.

I used a simple Danish Oil finish on my bench. Also, Christopher Schwarz did a nice article in Woodworking Magazine, about workbench finishes if you have that magazine.


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

*base joinery*

Hi all

Before I made the base joinery, I planned the top and it's end grain

the circular saw on one side, the flush bit for the rest



























I got some hobby time lately and was able to make all mortises and tenons for the base.

I used the drill press for the mortises, it is not as clean as a routed mortise but it is quiet and I can do them while the kids are asleep, which is when I get most of my shop time. I used a chisel afterward to flatten the wavy wall.










The tenons where done using the table saw for the short shoulders and the bandsaw for the wide shoulders. The bandsaw has the advantage to leave a somewhat cleaner surface, plus it is hooked to my dust collector.



















I didn't square the mortises and I used my chisel to round the tenons

Then I dry assembled the bench and rout the chamfers










I just had to put the top on the base and show it off to my girlfriend










next things to do, drawbore the legs joint and mortise the top. I don't have any alignment pins so I am little nervous about that. I will wax the pegs and hope. If I understand correctly, if the joint are already a good fit and you drawbore it 3/32. Then this means that the peg takes all the stress and to find its way in, it will need to bend towards the shoulder then outwards without breaking. right??


----------



## GMman (Apr 11, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *base joinery*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Let us have a look at the girl friend too


----------



## Endgrain (Sep 23, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *base joinery*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Nice - I am building a workbench myself but using plywood and MDF - not too elaborate - Why the chamfers? Is it for looks or does it make dinging the edges less likely? I have seen this in several workbenches. Thanks.


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *base joinery*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Endgrain, I guess it does protect the bench's edges and also your work piece is you ever bang the bench with it. But I put them on mostly for the look.


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *base joinery*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Hey GMman, here she is )


----------



## Phishead (Jan 9, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *base joinery*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


lol. Your girlfriend's hot. I get most of my shop time in when the kids are asleep too. With my " quiet " tools. Unfortunatley, when they are ready for bed, so am I. Sometimes I have to force myself to go down there and have fun.


----------



## jcees (Dec 31, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *base joinery*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Gotta love those Hotzapffels! Nice workage. We'll be watching.

always,
J.C.


----------



## damianpenney (Jun 22, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *base joinery*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


You're making great progress on this Martin, I remain firmly in the slow lane


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *base joinery*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Damian, I just looked at your blog on your workbench and it looks real nice. Although I have 2 kids (5 year and 7 year), I am able to woodwork an average of one hour per week night and a few hours per weekend.


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

*bench completed*

Hi all

I have completed the bench, I still don't know if I will install the veritas twin screw vise or install a wood hook, making it a holtzapffel - roubo hybrid. So I will wait for now and start using the bench as is

the drawbore mortise went pretty well, No broken peg out of 12 joints (24 pegs!). I was glad to have this nice peg cutter powered by a drill and socket , it went pretty fast.










All ash pegs end were whittled, then lightly sanded and then waxed. I have also marked the peg with location when it is fully in. The pegs moisture were at 10%. I sure wished they had been dryer.










The joint were tighten by clamps prior to the insertion of the peg. I used glue for the base only. No Glue for the base / top joints.




























for the top mortises, I used the router with 1/2 spiral up bit , then chiseling the corners.



















Holes in the side of the top were done using a guiding jig










I then finisned the top with one coat of linseed oil and beewax mix. The outer and mid sections is oak, the two sandwich sections is ash










then on to the pine shelf










I wanted to add the wagon vise but then I looked at my small record vise on my utility bench and decided to use it instead. I mortised a slot underneet the bench, Using the top side as a cheek



















The top holes were done with drill and jig with 3 1/2 inch o.c. the vise chop is ash





































I am overall very satisfied, specially that this was my first furniture project. I would like to thank guys like Mike, Kem and Damian who have posted blogs on their own holtzapffel project which gave me some guidelines.

Now on to another project! 
Thanks for watching


----------



## Texasgaloot (Apr 8, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *bench completed*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Very well done!


----------



## pjaromin (Nov 28, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *bench completed*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Great series. Thanks and enjoy your new bench.


----------



## Woodwrecker (Aug 11, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *bench completed*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


That came out great. Good job.
Nicely done series as well.
Thanks.


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

*building the twin screw vise*

Hi all

Well, I couldn't afford the 350$ + for the wooden screws, and I didn't like the look of the black plate on the veritas twin screw vise. So I built my own using 2 tail vise screws (40$ each)

First I built the big wood pieces that will old the metal nuts. I didn't want to use through bolts and opted for a drawbore mortise and tenon attachment.



















I used the smallest bit that I could for the hole, The screw is 1 1/16 and I used a 1 1/8 bit. I found It helps to reduce sagging but it calls for precision. I waxed the holes because the screws do run tight. but pretty smooth nonetheless. Once the screw holes were drilled. I marked and drill the holes for the nut's screws. Note wich nut goes with wich hole, the nuts might not be exactly the same. At the end It will help making the screw run smoother. 


















I dry fit the blocks and hold them very tight with clamps, then I aligned the vise chop and clamp it also. I then used the drill bit I used for the hole to mark hole center on the chop.



















Now I can attach the nuts. While I tighten the screws, I monitor how easy the vise screw runs.










I decided to install the nuts in this manner instead of boring its way into the block. I think it might help to reduce sagging plus it is easier to install










I didn't picture the process of the attachment of the vise screw head to the chop, but it is the same as with the nuts. I then try the vise. Once satisfied I removed the chop and proceeded with the drawbore holes










Oh yeah, I also glued them. LoL they won't come off!










25 inch beetween screws, chop 4 inch tick 6 1/4 by 33 ash from 8/4 lumber


















little tapper permitted, I guess more if the holes in the chop were bigger, something to thing of, maybe a future modification









Almost no sagging, If you run the screws in synch (not tapered) the chop runs nice, when some taper, they put on more resistance. Overall very satisfied.




























Now it is COMPLETED

thanks


----------



## teenagewoodworker (Jan 31, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


AWESOME! i am looking into building my bench and i was thinking about doing this but i wasn't sure. its great to see that it works. have you tried doing some work in it yet? where did you get the screws?


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


screws are from lee valley store

I did some edge planing for testing sake. First I found that I was to far aside from the boards (4 inch top plus 4 inch for the screw head and handle). It felt pretty ackward. But then I think it is just a matter of adjusting how you work and made me pay attention to my planing motion. Except with very long boards, because the vise is so strong, I can use only 3/4 of it's length when I hold the board. At the end of the planing motion, I stretch my arm to reach the board's end so I don't have to stand beside the chop.


----------



## teenagewoodworker (Jan 31, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


sounds cool! i think i'm gonna try it. i have a lee valley giftcard anyway.


----------



## JohnGray (Oct 6, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Great job!!! Nice vise thanks for the post.


----------



## olddutchman (Aug 17, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Realy great Love the (play by play)


----------



## blackcherry (Dec 7, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Thanks for showing all of us your impressive new work station, the bench turn out GREAT…enjoy all your new future projects…Blkcherry


----------



## blackcherry (Dec 7, 2007)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Martin what was your total bd.ft used in this bench…thanks Blkcherry


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


BlackCherry, I never really counted the BF but here are the approx dimension. I will let you do the math

top 72×24 x 3 
legs 30×3.5×4.5
long stretchers 36×1.75×5
short stretchers 18×1.75×5
big vise block is about 30×3.5×6

and then the short vise block and the big vise receptive block

I can give you the real dimension later tonight if you want, but this will give you a good idea


----------



## Moai (Feb 9, 2009)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


This is an incredible bench! congrats!
What type of wood is that?


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Doubthead, base is red oak, top is red oak and ash, vise chops are ash


----------



## TheJoineryGallery (Sep 21, 2010)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


This might be a dumb question, but where did you find the vise screws? Ive been looking for some ideas on adding one of these to my own bench, so thanks for posting.


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


the screws are from LV


----------



## NickThiemer (Dec 26, 2014)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Hi Martin

How do you find working with the twin screws that are not connected by a chain drive? I have looked at the Lee Valley and Lie Nielsen vises but can't justify $200 just for the chain drive addition.

Is it easy to open and clamp pieces?

Thanks

Nick


----------



## martin007 (Jan 24, 2008)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


I have replaced the twin screw vice with leg vise and scissors from benchcrafted. I never really enjoyed the twins, but really like the benchcrafted. The twin vise was racking from top to bottom because of the location of the screws, so clamping wasn't always right. It is also slow and needs to be screwed really parrallel or some extra friction appears on the mecanisme. After working with the rwin screw vise for about 7-8 years, I had enough.


----------



## Jmacmadcap (Aug 31, 2015)

martin007 said:


> *building the twin screw vise*
> 
> Hi all
> 
> ...


Martin,

I have a couple of questions for you regarding this bench. I am in process of building the exact bench. I can not PM you yet as I do not yet have the requisite 5 posts here at Lumber jocks. I tend to be much more of a lurker than a poster after having running afoul of the morality police at another woodworking forum….lol…anyhow, If you would message me here maybe? I can then respond and send you my personal e-maii. Ill post it here. If this is a faux pas for this forum, I would appreciate it if the moderators would please delete the mail address, but not the whole post, as I really would like to contact Martin.

thanks all…

madcapwoodwright - at - gmail - dot - com


----------

