# Never again will I trust Grizzly for "Precision" equipment



## JoeinGa (Nov 26, 2012)

Good thing you had taken all those pictures. They would have just blamed you and basically done NOTHING


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

Hawkeye
That sounds like a bad experience alright,but keep in mind many folks have the same kinds of problems no matter who makes their equipment. It's bad enough that you received a jointer with a defect but the customer service should have made everything right for you once you reported your problem. It seems depending what area your in your experience you may get different treatment from Grizzly's CS .I've had nothing but top service from their Washington state CS. I think comparing them to HF is understandable given your experience, but 98% of their products are far superior to anything HF makes and many times on a par with equipment that cost 3 times as much.


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## Hawkeye1434 (Jun 8, 2014)

Fair enough Jim like I said I own a lot from them and I am very satisfied with what I have. I just said like HF you have to be very careful what you buy from them simple things no problem I have an amazing DC. I love my sander and my sharpener is half the price and I love it but after they told me that their engineers are good with the specs on the jointer I returned, then they have no business with me cause the specs are way off, precision is not their game, selling to the masses at a low cost is what they are after but with that said I will buy again on the right kind of items. Also no matter what jointer I look at half the reviews say grizzly and half say powermatic each has good and horrible reviews I don't know who to believe maybe I will try jet or something else in an 8 inch I really don't know what to do


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## ssnvet (Jan 10, 2012)

That's a major bummer.

Just out of curiosity, did you tighten up on the gib screws? (Not the lock screws, but the actual gib adjustment screws).

For those who might not be familiar, by virtue of the design, a dove tail jointer (by any manufacturer) will have the table will sag if the gibs are not clean and tight. And after shipping half way around the world, it's reasonable to be expected that the gib adjustment screws may be loose.










Once the outfeed table is set tangent to the tippy top of the cutter head, I tighten its gib screws very tight, since it will not be moved during normal operation. Then I tighten the infeed table gibs so that I can just move the infeed table with effort.

One of the reasons a Powermatic cost so much more is because it is very carefully set up by their techs in the USA. Discount manufacturers save you money by shipping to you directly from the warehouse, and I'm the kind of guy who is more than happy to invest some elbow grease to save that kind of doe. Fortunately Grizzly's does provide pretty good documentation.

I personally would hope to be able to get the tables to within 1/32" coplanar after some adjustment and would definitely be making calls if I couldn't.

Got to love digital cameras… you did well to photo document everything


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## WildmanJack (Jan 22, 2014)

One of my best friends sent a DeAngelico Tenor guitar via UPS. insure it for $17,000.00 as it was only one of 6 Tenor Guitars DeAngelico ever made. UPS packed it an made sure that they put a fork life right thru the guitar !!!! So much for sending really expensive stuff thru UPS !!!!!!


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## waho6o9 (May 6, 2011)

http://lumberjocks.com/reviews/3915

Bons review of the Oliver is worth your time. Bummer Grizzly

doesn't provide adequate customer service.


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## rustfever (May 3, 2009)

"The bitterness of poor quality remains long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten" - Benjamin Franklin


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## Manitario (Jul 4, 2010)

reviews like this keep me turned off from ever buying Grizzly; yes they have great customer service and yes other companies also have QC issues too, but I'd rather spend a few more $$ and have a better chance at receiving something that I don't have to send back.


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## pintodeluxe (Sep 12, 2010)

I find dovetail-way jointers difficult to adjust. Even once they are set perfectly, they sag over time. I have had much better luck with parallelogram jointers. They are easy to adjust, and once set they will not budge. I lifted my Delta DJ-20 with a forklift (with straps around the infeed / outfeed tables) and it was still coplanar within .002". That thing is bulletproof. The Grizzly 490 was modeled after the DJ-20, and ShopFox makes a clone too. 
Whatever brand you decide on, consider a parallelogram style jointer.


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## ssnvet (Jan 10, 2012)

Ditto what Willie said…. If I can ever afford to upgrade my jointer, it will be with a parallelogram model.


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## lumbermeister (Dec 24, 2012)

Pardon - But it is tough for me to understand the issues raised from the photographs attached. The first pic shows a combo square against the fence, with a gap that increases from bottom to top. Is it like that across the entire fence/table, or just the area that you photographed (if it is like that everywhere, a fence adjustment will solve the problem).

The next 2 pics show a scale held against the butt end and sidewall of a Veritas straightedge; I am not at all certain what info this is conveying. Appreciate, from anyone here, any elaboration of the meaning of these pics. Thanks.

*UPDATE*: Pardon - I see the gap you are conveying at bottom of straight edge. Good luck with your dealings on this.


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## Hawkeye1434 (Jun 8, 2014)

Well lumbermeister I think I was only aloud to post three pics but I have another pic of the opposite side of the fence with a gap going toward the bottom. The fence is warped and if I adjusted the fence like you were saying then the opposite bottom corner on the infeed table got severely out of wack. Grizzly agreed these were unacceptable tolerances I found and gave me a full refund. My only issue with them was they blamed me for the machine being severely damaged in shipping. They said I broke things and sent it back trashed. They never once asked or considered to be UPS fault. That really pissed me off. They said I would have to pay for the damages, a restocking fee and pay for the upgrade to the parallelogram model which was a whole $100.00 different at the time. After I showed them my pictures their whole tune changed and I got an email saying "after further review" we found out ups was to blame. Ok so now their backpedaling, they still wanted me to pay a restocking fee and upgrade. I said wow it sounds like I have been inconveniencing you this whole time. I reminded them I am the one who spent a ton of time and effort getting this beast in my barn (about 150 feet thru the snowy grass), 2 full days of cleaning and setup only to be disappointed, having to pack it up, the hassle of photos and emails and phone calls to grizzly, only to be called a liar after they got it back, and they say on top of that the machine is within specs well I'm letting the world know how crappy their specs are


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## Hawkeye1434 (Jun 8, 2014)

Finally they waived the restocking fee, but still wanted me to pay this $100.00 upgrade. I told them you pissed me off and wasted almost 5 weeks of my life dealing with this. (I know this is short timeframe compared to other stories but I had better things to do). And I had no jointer for my shop and they still had my money at that time. I said if you want me to give you more money to fix an issue your lack of specs or quality control caused your crazy. Just give me my money back and I will take my business elsewhere but guys I have no idea what to get but I'm leaning hard towards a powermatic 8 inch with helical head but every machine on here has good and horrible reviews so I don't know what to buy anymore.


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

I have a Powermatic, I am not sure that it is really better than anything else.
It is an older one and the casting in place sucks, and the welds on the base also suck.
I installed a Shelix head on it.


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## mprzybylski (Nov 21, 2011)

I have an 0604X (the 6" parallelogram model) and I have the same exact issue with my fence. No matter what I've tried to do I cannot for the life of me get the damn thing square. I can square the infeed side and the outfeed side is off or I can square the outfeed side and the infeed side is off. Unfortunately for me when I originally bought the jointer I had no idea what to look for and thought it "close enough". I'm now past 1 year of owning it so I think I'm basically SOL and have to plane the edges to get them square to the faces :/

I was able to finally get my tables coplanar after a few hours of fidgeting with them after I thought that may be affecting the fence squareness but alas that didn't help the fence issue. I'm not sure where to go from here but I'm considering an upgrade to a jet jointer/planer combo as I'm starting to run out of room in my shop anyway


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

Matt , take your fence to a machine shop to have it re-machined flat and true, no big deal.


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## Ken90712 (Sep 2, 2009)

I have the same jointer and had the same problem with the fence. The CS agent told me to lay it on the ground and jump on it so it will straighten out. I was in disbelief! They finally sent a new fence. When I was in Washington I went at looked at two of theyre table saws. 3 Hp and 5 Hp saws glad I did, going with different saw now. I have a few Grizzly machines but feel now the extra money is well spent on a better product.


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## Hawkeye1434 (Jun 8, 2014)

Yeah ken I agree with you , and Matt, B2rthc is right just take it to a machine shop and have it flattened then you will be in great shape. I am going with the powermatic because no matter where I look it's damned if I do and damned if I don't so I am getting the powermatic with the knowledge that if it's not perfect I will hook up with a machine shop and make it so on my own and parallelogram also now that I know better. Good luck everyone


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## woodmaker (Jan 12, 2011)

I had the same issue, but a quick email to Grizzly and they walked me through the process of getting the fence at a perfect 90.

Dear Michael,
Thank you for your email dated December 3, 2013.
We are sorry to hear that you are having problems with the fence on your Grizzly G0656X 8" Jointer with Spiral Cutterhead purchase. The fence can be adjusted to get it parallel to the table. The fence assembly will need to be removed to gain access to the rack for moving the fence in / out. 
Before working on your machine, please make sure the power source is disconnected.
Once the fence assembly is removed, loosen the screws ( ref #134 ) from the rack ( ref # 136) and remove.
Loosen the cap screws ( ref # 137) on the gib ( ref #138) 
Turn the eccentric stud ( ref #146) to adjust the fence. Just a small turn will swing the fence. This will be trial and err to get the fence parallel to tables.
If we may be of any further assistance, please do not hesitate to contact us. You are a valued customer, and we look forward to hearing from you soon.

Try this


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## smoker54 (Mar 24, 2014)

I understand your issue with "Grizzly". The thing is that I don't want to sound like I'm bad mouthing Grizzly as I do have one of there table saws and I love it. I did how ever buy a 6" Jointer from them and had to send it back due to a couple of issues with it. The in-feed table looked like water had been dripping on it and rusted, then it looked like someone tried to scrape or sand the rust off. Now there was a spot were the rust had made a raised spot on the in-feed table. It also had white paint and a dent on the motor fan housing like it had been dropped. So, I shipped it back to Grizzly via fright. I asked Grizzly and UPS if it was OK to send it back in a fully assembled condition and they both said yes. The UPS driver put it on a pallet and told me it would be "strapped" to it when it get to the terminal. The next thing I heard was a call from Grizzly telling me that the Jointer arrived at there location totally destroyed. So they refunded all my money (including original shipping costs) and told me that "upper management did not want to do business with me again". So, that's the long and short of it for me. Seem as though the issue should have been with UPS, not me. Oh well, what are ya gonna do!


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## MrRon (Jul 9, 2009)

I don't have anything against Grizzly. The biggest problem with Grizzly is their location. When you buy from them, you don't know what you are getting until it arrives at your door. You pay shipping and if dissatisfied with it, have to pay to return it. Their shipping is expensive, typically around $55. I prefer to buy locally if at all possible. That is why I advocate and recommend Jet tools. A short drive and I can examine it before buying. Unless you live within range of one of the Grizzly warehouses, that's a different story.


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## UpstateNYdude (Dec 20, 2012)

These posts feel more and more like the anti abortionists that line side of the road out in front of the Planned Parent Hood and proceed to berate and quote the bible to anyone that walks near the place…I wonder if there are picketers in front of Grizzly stores with Powermatic manuals waiting to spread the good word.


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## ssnvet (Jan 10, 2012)

Unless you go to a UPS retail store they don't "do" packaging.

The UPS driver should have refused to pick up the shipment of a jointer standing loose on a pallet. He may have thought he was helping out the customer, but trashing the machine didn't help anyone.


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## Surfside (Jun 13, 2012)

That's absurd. They shouldn't blamed you for it. UPS/Fedex always damage packages during transit. I hope everything will be sorted out


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## b2rtch (Jan 20, 2010)

"UPS/Fedex always damage packages during transit" 
Is this slight exaggeration or what.
I really had any damages and I received packaging several times a week


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## RandyinFlorida (Sep 27, 2012)

UPS Freight SUCKS! I know I'm speaking the obvious. I had my issues with the delivery of a band saw a couple months back.


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## bowedcurly (Aug 31, 2013)

UPS, Gizzly, all been good to me no issues whatsoever have 4 grizzly machines and they all work great, did buy a 98 Mercury Mountaineer and the front headlight fell out the 1st day I washed it. which was the second day I had it. so much for Ford. John Deere & Grizzly all great machines and both GREEN, and I will by another Ford if the price is right


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## Ken90712 (Sep 2, 2009)

Upstatenydude, really, that's the dumbest most rude thing you could say. Us woodworkers are just talking about past expirances with grizzly. When post a project or contribute to this great web site please keep that kind of subject off here. This is to good of group to have that here.


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## blockhead (May 5, 2009)

*+1, Ken*
As mentioned earlier, Oliver might be the way to go. I haven't had the pleasure of using one myself, but have heard lots of great things about their jointer. Best of luck with whatever you decide.


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## Dusty56 (Apr 20, 2008)

Have you tried Craigslist in your area, or do you have the need for everything to be new ?
I've had the best luck with "old iron" versus the new and improved crap on the market today.
Best wishes in your search for precision equipment at Grizzly prices : )


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## hunter71 (Sep 4, 2009)

I wonder how the old master craftsmen made such beautiful pieces.


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## NormG (Mar 5, 2010)

Maybe it will all vevel itself out


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## vicrider (Jun 19, 2010)

My very first joiner was a Craftsman 6". I knew nothing about gibs and ways. I struggled for a long time getting the infeed/outfeed tables true. And then could not get a square edge over a 2 foot piece of wood. I eventually discovered that the fence was not true.

Point is, I took it to a machinist (he did engine head grinding) and he trued it up for $50. Had that little machine for over 20 years and gave it to a young guy when I needed room for a larger one (a Grizzly 6" which I did have to fettle up, but it works great).

I have several Grizzly machines and realize they are not usually of a commercial quality, but they can be fettled up well enough for what I do. When I had a commercial cabinet shop, my tools were of a higher quality because they needed to last through lots of production with little down time. Truth to tell, the import machines didn't hold up as well, except for the VERY expensive German machines.

I'd also like to share that I purchased an imported 14" band saw from Harbor Freight waaay back when they were pretty much mail order. My wife decided to cut some fire wood on it, and broke the pot metal trunnions under the table. After having the saw for 30 years, I was able to go on their website, find the saw model, and order replacement parts for $3.50 each plus shipping.

Over the years, I have relied on Powermatic, General, the old model Delta Rockwell's, Milwaukee, Bosch and others but many current buyers seem to find that even these brands have issues. I sold and/or traded away most of those production machines as I got out of the business and into the hobby.

Conversely, I have never been a Black and Decker fan, but I have owned a little plastic B&D 1/4 horse router ($25 retail) for nearly 30 years. Still works, not broken….but I don't ask it to do what my 3 horse Milwaukee can do.

My belief is that we should only ask a tool to do what it was cost effectively designed to do.

Start any way you can, with whatever you can get, but do the best you can with whatever you have.

When you can afford it, upgrade.

vic


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## Hawkeye1434 (Jun 8, 2014)

Hi everyone so here is an update to this posting. UPDATE 12-1-2016, so over the summer i bought a new jet 8" jointer and it is amazing. The problem with the grizzley was the fence was actually warped and had to be reground by a machinist to flatten it out properly and grizzley sold it as a scratch and dent. Oh well I love my new jet and don't think I will be buying much from grizzley.com in the future


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