# Working out of a tool chest?



## Smile_n_Nod (Jan 20, 2011)

Has anyone here built (or bought) a large toolchest for hand tools (the kind that sits on the floor, and which has been popularized recently by Chris Schwarz)? Do you have experience working out of it? If so, what do you think of it?


----------



## sikrap (Mar 15, 2009)

I have a large tool chest that sits on the floor. I bought it because its solid white oak and I thought it was gorgeous (still do). The problems I have found are: (a) its REALLY heavy and is a royal PITA to move, and (b) bending down to get tools is not good for my back. That said, I'm 60 so these issues may not be a problem for the younger folks.


----------



## Tim457 (Jan 11, 2013)

I bought one complete with many of the tools that I was looking for, but I don't have any experience working out of it since I'm still cleaning the tools and getting a bench made. I haven't even gotten to doing much for the chest yet. I'm not sure if I'll work out of it or not once I get everything set up. Even if it's compartments were set up the way I'd like them to be, I'm not sure if I would work out of it, but I'm going to try it. If you watch Chris's videos, it appears that what Chris means by working out of his chest is taking out the tools he plans on using for the day or the project he's working on and laying them out on the bench, not literally getting each tool out of the chest and putting it back after each use.

Dave, would a pedestal work to bring it to the right height for you? And nice tag line Brett.


----------



## JGM0658 (Aug 16, 2011)

I don't have a wood tool chest, for on site work I use Pelican cases with partitions made out of plywood. The only thing I dislike about them is the constant bending to get and put away tools. A1Jim posted a thread on the best tool box, in it there one with legs, which is the one I will be making soon.


----------



## VillaggioWoodworks (Feb 25, 2013)

I built an Anarchist Tool Chest out of plywood, hardboard, pine, oak and poplar from Home Depot last summer. It took me a weekend, and it's the best thing I ever built! All of my important tools fit in the chest, and it's easy to move everything from one place to another. (My car is a Honda Element, so once I get the chest off the ground, it just rolls right in.)

My main reason for building the chest was because we were moving across the country. I wanted a way to make sure my tools were protected for the move as well as having a way to work as soon as I got a bench set up in our new house. What I didn't want to do was unpack tools in their new shop and have them laying out everywhere or waste time building shelves and racks for storage. This forced me to learn to work out of the chest.

Well, it turns out, you need at least one rack and a shelf to work out of the chest efficiently. I built one of these…also in a weekend:

http://www.popularwoodworking.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/ToolRack1.pdf

I could have gotten by with just the rack part, but my current bench doesn't have a shelf so this combo is really a great all in one solution.

The tricks to working out of a chest are:

- Unload what you think you need for the day from the most bottom part of the chest first. This should be the bench planes and panel/hand saws you use the most. You won't want to have to go back to get these over and over anyway, so just take them out at the start of the day and leave them out. When you're done, wipe them down and put them away. This system makes it automatic to regularly wipe your tools down.

- The chest needs to be on wheels. Those extra few inches getting the chest off the floor will make all the difference in the world when you need to get to something at the very bottom.

- The height of the chest needs to be at a point where you can use one hand to support you while you are reaching to the bottom of the chest. Just bending over to get to the bottom of the chest is murder on the back, but using one hand to support yourself makes this something you could do all day without any discomfort…not that you'd have to, because you got all the stuff out of the bottom of the chest first thing!!

- Where things are located in the tills needs to be flexible. There are some items that have to go in specific places. (My egg beater drill won't fit any place but my bottom till, however just about everything else can move around depending on what I'm doing at the time.) If I don't plan to dovetail anytime soon, there is no reason for my dovetail markers to be in the top till.

- Learn to work with the till's fanned out the way Schwarz shows in his video this way you can dump things back where they belong when you are done with them. (I've tried to do this, but I made my till's 9" wide. They are supposed to be 8", but there is a misprint in the book, so I have to slide things back and forth a little more than I'd like. My next chest will have this fixed!

- Get over the fact that tools will rub against each other. For marking gauges, marking knives, dividers, scrapers, etc, it just won't matter. There won't be any damage to the cutting edges from just sitting in the chest. (Chisels, rasps, etc are a different story…those should be in tool rolls!)

- The biggest tip I can give is NOT to build Chris' chest. His is set up for how he works and the tools he owns. Build a chest for what you have and what you want to build. The best example of this I have is how the ATC deals with back saws. Chris just slips his dovetail and carcass saw between other saws. I made sleeves for mine so they hug the front wall of my chest. For me, this is perfect because I seem to put the saw back as soon as I'm done with them rather than have to wait until the panel saws are put back. For me, this works. Christ might hate it.

I hope this helps! I love my tool chest. Someday I'll build a nice dovetailed chest so I can paint over the dovetails and never see them, but I'll know they are there and that's what's really most important!


----------



## canadianchips (Mar 12, 2010)

Hi Brett. I use 2 storage cabinets. The lower portion is built similar to a mechanics tool chest. I have made "pigeon hole " cubicles for my tools. I suggest layout the tools you want to be in this storage. Allow a little more space for each one, when you change the tool this space is still usable. My bottom portion is on 3" heavy duty castors. 2 doors in front, screw driver and drill bit compartments on inside of each door. The top of cabinet is another box, 3 drawers from front and 1 lid on top. (similar to an "Gerstner tool chest" the craftsman made years ago.) I am still using the top portion I made 35 years ago.


----------



## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

I've worked out of this tool chest in my shop for a good long while and it works for me. However, it's heavy with all of the tools in it. If you built a smaller version of it with less tools you might be able to use this type of chest.

helluvawreck aka Charles
http://woodworkingexpo.wordpress.com


----------



## wormil (Nov 19, 2011)

Well, it turns out, you need at least one rack and a shelf to work out of the chest efficiently.

Do you put the shelf rack on the wall behind or next to your bench? It would be nice to have those built into your bench.


----------



## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

Rick, I also have about 46 drawers full of hand tools as well on two roll around carts and two roll around work benches. My portable power tools are stored on wall shelves or in roll around carts with shelves.

helluvawreck aka Charles
http://woodworkingexpo.wordpress.com


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

I have one. I don't care for it for tools I use all the time. When the top is shut, I wind up using it as a shelf, then I need something in it. I put wheels on it so I could roll it around, but if you work in a shop, on a bench, doing woodworking, why do you need to roll stuff around. I now use it for tools I only use occasionally.

If you move from place to place then a tool box or small chest makes sense. If you work from a single location, I don't think it does.


----------



## VillaggioWoodworks (Feb 25, 2013)

Rick,

In a perfect world, I would have that rack at the tail vice end of my bench right above my tool chest, but that's isn't an option. Right now, it's behind me on the wall. That works ok, but it's not as convenient as it would be if it were on the same wall as my bench.

Really, a perfect world would be not having that shelf/rack at all. A shelf at the bottom of my bench and a rack above the bench would be all I'd really need. However, my last bench had a shelf and I seemed to pile crap on it rather than keep a spot clear for my bench planes so I have a feeling I'll always need some kind of shelf near by.

I also agree with Don, if you have a climate controlled shop and you never leave it, racks and shelves are probably worth a look. My last shop was an un-climate controlled garage in south Florida…3 miles from the beach…yes, it was a tough life! That shop was a rust magnet. Our HOA said our truck had to be parked in the garage at night. Many times that meant the truck had to come into the garage soaking wet. For me, a chest was the only option to prevent rust.


----------



## VillaggioWoodworks (Feb 25, 2013)

Oh…and one more thing…I never shut the lid when I'm working….if I did, I'd stack crap on top of the chest left and right!!!


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

and if you don't close it, it fills up with all kind of sawdust and crap. Pull a box next to your bench when your working and see how much crap goes in it. I am amazed there is anything on the floor. But do that with a garbage can, and its empty at the end of the day!!


----------



## wormil (Nov 19, 2011)

I also have about 46 drawers full of hand tools

I would stop woodworking before dealing with that. I have 3 drawers in my shop and that's 2 too many. One is a junk drawer for pens, pencils, notepads, manuals, small things I don't want to lose and stuff I rarely use. The other 2 drawers hold tools but I don't like them for that and will eventually rearrange. Sometimes drawers make sense but rarely in woodworking.

If you move from place to place then a tool box or small chest makes sense. If you work from a single location, I don't think it does.

I plan on building one and trying it out. I've come to realize that I spend too much time walking back and forth between wall racks and a rolling cart, it doesn't seem like much but really it adds up.


----------



## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

everybody works different. I wasn't insinuating its wrong, just wrong for me.


----------



## VillaggioWoodworks (Feb 25, 2013)

You ain't kiddin', Don! I have a garbage can at the face vice end of my bench and I've had to train myself to brush the bench top off in THAT direction rather than over the sides or worse yet, right into my chest! After I filled the chest full of shavings a few times, I learned to pay a little more attention to what I'm doing!

For me, leaving the lid open all the time works fine. I don't use any power tools except a lunchbox planner and every now and then a Festtool tracksaw. I also don't have a tail vice so all my planing is done against stops at the face vice end of my bench. If I had a tail vice or I sawed against a flip up stop at the tail of the bench, I would be much more concerned about crap falling in the chest.

No matter what, there is always something that gets into the box, but it's minor and I just vac the box out every now and then.


----------



## kokomoron (Feb 25, 2013)

I really understand Christopher Schwarz 's view that all of the tools that you need to make gorgeous furniture can fit in that. chest. Also understand that he travels all over the world and takes most of his hand tools with him. Chest is mandatory. My tools very rarely leave my shop. I have been spoiled by working from shelves that make thevtools visible and accessible. I am to old to change.


----------



## walden (Nov 11, 2012)

I have been working out of one from the 1850's. (The one in my profile picture.) Works great and keeps the tools clean and rust free. I have found a chest to be easy to work out of once you get the tools arranged to match your working habits.

The only problem is trying to move it. With that in mind, I'm getting ready to move across country and will need to pack my tools in something else for the move.

I'm going to sell the chest if any one is interested and could pick it up in Nashville. Measures 36" x 24"x 24".


----------



## davegutz (Oct 16, 2012)

This is a very interesting forum because I'm in the process of making the Anarchist toolbox and wish I weren't. I didn't realize how much bending over this is going to require and I didn't realize how much precious floor space it's going to take. Instead I now want to build one of those wall hanging boxes with lots of nesting, overlapping doors that I can walk over to and grab a tool. I may toss the floor box in the attic and store some blankets in it.

I too don't expect to take my show on the road and I like to wander in an out of the shop every few hours and just leave stuff half done for weeks at a time. Putting stuff away every few hours doesn't make sense for me.

I'll keep watching and listening.


----------



## walden (Nov 11, 2012)

Hi Dave G:

If you build the chest approximately 24 inches high, you can place your hand on one side and reach in with the other to keep the stooping to a minimum. Also keep in mind that there is a lot of stooping in hand tool work anyways. Just some thoughts.

I usually pull the bench planes out when I start for the day and place them under the bench. I then have most of the other tools I use regularly in the top tills so I don't even have to slide the tills around much. Very efficient in the end.


----------



## gawthrrw (Sep 13, 2011)

I just built the Anarchist tool chest and have only used it for a few weeks now but love it. I move every few years for my job so am really happy to have something mobile that I can keep all my hand tools in. I was worried at first that the chest would be a pain being only 24 inches tall( Im 6' 3") but after putting the caster wheels on and getting it all together its actually convenient for me. I dont see myself taking this massive thing to job sites or anything but its nice to be able to roll it around the shop to my projects and being able to keep it all together when I move. I will be putting pictures on here of it soon. Still working on the paint job.


----------



## TCCcabinetmaker (Dec 14, 2011)

I used to use an old army foot locker for a tool chest, kept it in the back of my explorer, was good for keeping tools together, not so for finding them when I needed them.


----------



## VillaggioWoodworks (Feb 25, 2013)

The picture of Ron's shop makes me remember one of the reasons I love my ATC that I didn't mention before.

The box limits the amount of tools I can have. If it doesn't fit in the box, I don't need it. Everything I need, except consumables, fits in my chest and there is still plenty of room to grow. That being said, I wish I could have as many beautiful planes as Ron, and there is a time saving advantage to doing so as well. Having a dedicated molder or a smoother set with a higher angle can make things go much faster. If I hit something with more difficult grain, my only option is to stop, sharpen, and hope for the best. Ron's set up would have more options, and again, when I was in Florida, I could have gone with that set up but I would have to spend all my shop time fighting rust!

Dave, if the chest is the right height, on wheels, and you learn to use it the way it was intended, there is very little stooping and bending. As for how much floor space it takes up, that one you are right on the money with. For me, I was getting in trouble with our HOA because of the noise of the power tools. I was going to have to work by hand or not at all. For me having all my tools in one place and being able to protect them was the most important thing. The square footage of floor space lost by the chest was easily gained by selling the table saw. However I can easily see that for others that floor space is a deal killer.

A tool chest isn't for everyone. If your shop time is only in small bursts, a chest might drive you nuts. If you like to leave things out or you like to "collect" tools, the chest may just take up space and not really get used. I had different needs and the ATC met those and then some.

If you're at all on the fence, get a sheet of plywood, screw a chest together, screw some tills together and work out of it for a bit. If you hate it, you might be out $100. If you love it, you're screwed! Until you have a Barrett bridle plow, you'll never be happy!


----------



## woodbutcherbynight (Oct 21, 2011)

If I just did woodworking maybe a small chest would be what I could work with. Problem is I am a mechanic by trade and have a second toolbox at home (yes sawdust is a unwanted tenant) so I have much more than just woodworking tools. Add to that mess of tools the plumbing stuff, and tooling, the electrical stuff, and tooling, the painting supplies, and tooling. Man I should own stock in one of those box stores. 46 drawers is a starting point. (Laughing) I agree with most that posted though, to each his own and everyone does not do only woodworking or turning etc etc. My toolbox for work is laid out in the exact same manner the man that I was an appretince to 25 years ago did. It works for me and I know where everything is, and remember to put it away when I am done. Now that pesky sawdust you can keep that stuff. (Laughing)


----------



## wormil (Nov 19, 2011)

There is a misconception that C.Schwarz built his tool chests for travelling, I once thought that but he's been working out of tool chests for decades and uses them in his shop. Another misconception is that he invented these chests but the designs are based on years of studying European joiner's tool chests, primarily English and Dutch which have been used there for centuries. By compiling a lot data on antique chests and then building and using them he has come up with the chests he writes about.

Here is a Woodwright's Shop episode where he discusses the origin and usefulness of his English chest.

http://www.pbs.org/woodwrightsshop/video/3200/3204.html

A thread with some pics of his newest Dutch chest (which is designed for travelling).
http://lumberjocks.com/topics/47069


----------



## JGM0658 (Aug 16, 2011)

He travels with his ATC, at least to show it. He has done so in WIA.

Like the Roubo bench the ATC is the product of research of how woodworkers worked in the past. Anybody who has read his books knows this. There are no misconceptions.


----------



## wormil (Nov 19, 2011)

Jorge, not everyone has read his books, blog, or seen his shows. Until seeing it in person and listening to his reasoning I considered the chests a compromise for people who cannot store their tools in other ways. My bigger hand tools are on the wall, my smaller ones in drawers, I've been thinking of how to consolidate them for awhile and that's what led me to investigate tool chests. I would consider a wall cabinet but even though my shop is small I have more available floor space than wall space.


----------



## Loren (May 30, 2008)

My main concern with such solutions is that it may lock
the less experienced craftsperson into a fixed notion
of which tools should be on hand.

For example, if your tool chest does not have room
for a 24" bow saw, maybe you never make the saw
and never really consider that you might prefer
it if you tried it for awhile.

... that's just one example - and there's an economic
reality that for a pro it can be very difficult to make 
a living with hand tools only. That's one reason some
of the guys advocating this approach seem to be 
primarily occupied with teaching and writing… not that
education and preservation of traditional craft isn't
valuable.

There's a larger philosophical question of whether you
want to do woodworking to build nice things, make 
a living, work only with hand tools, or (as many do) 
as a reason to more or less collect tools and training 
literature.


----------



## 12strings (Nov 15, 2011)

villaggio's posts have given you some good input…Here's a bit to add from me:

I built a dovetailed tool chest, slightly smaller than what schartz recommends. I really love working out of it. I was previously just working off a wall with everything hung on pegboards. This is much better, for protection, and organization, and It makes you think about what tools you really need to put in there.

I generally do a bit differently, and just reach in and get each tool as I need it, rather than unloading it at the beginning. I also leave the chest lid down because it's so close to my bench (small garage) that if left open it would surely fill up with shavings and sawdust. Mine is also on wheels, which makes moving it really easy, and also makes the height a bit easier…but I"m young, bending over doesn't bother me yet.

I really like that with the chest closed, I can run power tools and not worry about sawdust collecting on my hand tools. I can't imagine having everything out on open shelves anymore…

I also will sit on it, and use it as a sawbench when crosscutting with a hand-saw.

I have blade covers for all my chisels, knives, and marking guages, except my 2 mortise chisels, which I just try to put next to non-metalic items. I also really like the saw-till. Mine holds my 5 saws: Panel, tenon/carcass, dovetail, cross-cut carcass saw, & Gent's saw. + My coping saw hangs on a hook at the front. I didn't make many custom tool holders other than a set of hooks to hold a drawknife on the back-side of the saw-till, and a small wooden divider to hold my card scrapers…they kept getting burried at the bottom of a sliding till.

Final verdict: I love it. The only think I might change is try to convert one of the sliding tills into a tool tray with a folding handle that can be taken out and carried with one hand for small jobs.


----------



## JGM0658 (Aug 16, 2011)

IMO like Roubo, a tool chest is not something necessary for the hobbyist and it is only because of CS that have become somewhat popular.

Take a gander at this shop and workbench. This guy has everything at hand on the walls, why would he use a chest? workbench and workshop

For on site work you need the tools that will allow to fit and refine the work, this is usually done for doing case work like kitchens, book shelves, etc. To me working out of a tool box in my workshop would drive me insane, plus would kill my back.

here is what I carry when I go to do on site work.



















A few planes, chisels and saws is all that it is needed. Anything more than this and IMO the work that should have been done at the shop was not done properly.


----------

