# How much should I charge?



## GCM (Jan 12, 2012)

I realise this is a "how long is a piece of string" question but someone wants to buy my clock:
http://lumberjocks.com/projects/70345

or make him one like it.

I haven't a clue as to what would be a reasonable price for it - there would be about $50-$60 worth of materials and hardware in it.

It was one of my first "real" projects and so I couldn't price it on time taken - the paint job alone would have been a working week.

Any guesses would be better than nothing at all.

Thanks in anticipation.


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## Mahdeew (Jul 24, 2013)

Customer: How much you want for it?
Seller: As much as I can get.


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## JBrow (Nov 18, 2015)

GCM,

It is a nice looking clock. By my way of thinking;

If you have heirs, one of them may want it when you can no longer use it; and may treasure it. Therefore, ask the heirs. If they want it, then no deal - consider making one and pricing it accordingly.

Even without any heirs, parting with any early project at any price would be difficult for me; and my first projects were nowhere near as nice as your clock. It is more emotional than anything else. Again, no deal.

But if neither of these apply, one approach is to check the pricing of clocks of a similar style and size locally and on the web and then double or triple the highest price. If you just want to get rid of the clock, sell it for the lowest price you can find.

If woodworking is a hobby and you want to turn it into a business, now may be your opportunity. Develop your pricing model and meet with the client for their requirements, negotiate the price, and build a clock. If the clock turns out well, word of mouth will generate business over time.


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## JIMMIEM (Feb 5, 2016)

Have you seen anything similar for sale? If so, are they custom made or mass produced? How much do they charge? You could price accordingly. Do you plan on making this a business?


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## ArtMann (Mar 1, 2016)

I am going to be perfectly honest. Your link to the original project indicates that the project was made from MDF. That fact alone reduces the value of the piece by a large margin. It is a beautiful design and you appear to have done a good job of building and finishing. I think it deserves a better wood - like black cherry, for example.


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## GCM (Jan 12, 2012)

Thanks guys, just to be clear, the clock shown in the photo was a prototype and an experiment to see if something good could be made of MDF, whilst I have a strong sentimental attachment to it I would sell it for the right price - alas I don't know what that is other than $60 is too low and $3000 is too high.

I would prefer to build another clock for the client as it would be easier to ascertain a reasonable price, but I am certain if I costed my labour at standard price it would be too expensive - that's ok this is not the start of a big business, just an exercise in selling something I have made in my workshop. I don't want to make a huge profit from it but I don't want to give it away either - especially as the client charged me $3500 to cut down 3 branches from a tree. (it is a big tree).

The client has no particular preference to buying the original or a copy - they just want it in a hurry.

Even major businesses, when they start up, don't know exactly what they should charge for their products, they have to do research and test the market - obviously that is not easy to do with this particular product.

@ArtMann LOL the client would have to mortgage his house to afford Black Cherry here (even if it was available). Certainly if I build a copy it would probably made of Tassie Oak (a species of Eucalyptus), expensive enough but in the realm of affordability.

The guy who wants to buy it has no idea of wood types quality etc - he just likes the way it looks.

BTW, the clock mechanism I used in this clock is now almost double the price…

Anyway I was just after a licked finger in the air figure, if any one wants to hazard a guess I won't hold you to it LOL.

Cheers and thanks again for the advice, it is most appreciated. Cheers!


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## Tootles (Jul 21, 2011)

Given that it is MDF, the earlier suggestion to check what others are selling clocks of a similar style for is probably most appropriate. You would need a particular point of difference (fancier wood perhaps) to charge more.

It is a nice looking clock so you probably could sell a few of them. That makes it feasible to produce batches of them, which reduces your time investment.


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## Tootles (Jul 21, 2011)

> the client charged me $3500 to cut down 3 branches from a tree.
> 
> - GCM


Well, in that case, ask for $350 - 10%.

I also had a quick look on eBay (Oz) - perhaps not the best comparison, but it is quick. Pendulum clocks can sell from $100 to $450.


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## JIMMIEM (Feb 5, 2016)

the client charged me $3500 to cut down 3 branches from a tree.

- GCM

Did you get other quotes for the tree work? If so, how did the $3500 quote compare? Is tree work the client's main business? Is he a 'friend'? I have a neighbor who is a contractor/builder. He did some work for another neighbor. The neighbor who had the work done confided to me that he felt that the contractor should have given him a discount as he is a neighbor and he had a short commute (across the street) to the job. I understand my client/neighbor's feeling but also realize that this is how the contractor makes his living and what would happen if the word spread and other neighbors wanted work done at a discount. Could this be the case here? Situations like this is the reason I don't like doing business with friends.
If you feel he charged you 'full freight' for the tree work then you shouldn't have any qualms charging him 'full freight' for the clock….basically he set the rules so you should be ok playing by his rules. If he questions your clock price you can tell him that you didn't question his tree work price (did you?).


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## Tennessee (Jul 8, 2011)

This is one of those projects that really depends on where you live.
In a large city setting, handmade of any actual wood, I can see this going for a few hundred dollars. ($US)

Where I live, in a small suburb in the Southern United States, my gallery would be hard pressed to see $200 US. It would probably be somewhere between $125 and $175.
If I drove 2.5 hours South and got into a gallery in an upper class part of Atlanta, that price might double.


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## sawdust703 (Jul 6, 2014)

I'm with Tootles on this one. Being a scroll sawyer myself, & making detailed clocks of all kinds, from cuckoo clocks to Grandfather clocks. The prices of these clocks would drive you insane! Literally! It'd amaze you at what folks will pay for clocks made from cherry, oak, maple, walnut, ash, even beetle kill pine. But mdf? What happens if their roof leaks, or the house floods, or? Its ruined! Hardwood can be salvaged. Yes, the clock works cost you money, too, but, nothing that isn't replaceable. I would talk to members of your kin before you sell it. Especially since its your first project. Then, if the feller that done your tree work still wants a clock, tell him what Mr. Tootles said. For $350 you'll build him a clock that will be worth every penny! Just my .02 worth.


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## Puzzleman (May 4, 2010)

my 2 cents is to ask the question to you of How many hours do you have in it?

When he cut your tree branches down, he knew how many hours it would take and charged accordingly.

Calculate your number of hours to make it by your hourly shop wage (hourly wage + hourly shop expenses), add your supplies costs and that is your price.

Here's the way that I would look at the price. 
If the customer thinks that he got a great steal on the price, Great. You got the price for your hourly work.
If the customer thinks the price is too high and doesn't buy it, you weren't planning on selling it before anyways.

Either way you win.


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## crawdaddy (May 19, 2014)

Why not just start somewhere. Cost of material + say 20%. Worst that can happen is he not buy it, or you find out later you didn't charge enough. But first and foremost the cost of materials should come back to you so that you may build more.


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## becikeja (Sep 12, 2010)

$400


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## JAAune (Jan 22, 2012)

If you sell it and someone asks for another, are you going to be happy at the prospect of making a new one for the same price or groaning at the thought of it?

If you're going to do it professionally, it's time and materials plus overhead plus profit.


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## kajunkraft (May 7, 2012)

Pricing is often a difficult issue. A lot of people simply charge 3 times the cost of materials. I would think that for something that is in the $60 range for materials, and is very unique, four times may be in order. The bottom line, in my opinion, is what have you earned per hour of labor? If the amount is $2.00 per hour, are you satisfied with that?


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## avsmusic1 (Jul 10, 2016)

Perhaps it would be helpful to ID the minimum you'd be comfortable letting it go for? If he had offered $200 or $100 what would your reaction have been?


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## rwe2156 (May 7, 2014)

Nice job, and I know you've got a lot of time in it. There is no easy way to say this is a prototype painted MDF so in reality you're kind of competing with Walmart and Kmart.

That being said, if he likes it I would ask him what he'll give you for it (and be ready for a let down).

[eyes staring upward….know I have to sleep at night] $200.


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## Jon_H (Jun 21, 2016)

Since you have a bit of an attachment to the original, I'd recommend making a new one for him.

Lots of good advice on pricing here already. Since you're not dependent upon this sale to put food on your table and keep a roof over your head, you have a tremendous amount of flexibility on price. You can charge whatever you want and the "customer" can take it or leave it.

A couple people have alluded to this, but I'm going to say it outright - what's it worth to you? What's it worth to you to take on customer and do work for hire? Quite often, when you switch from giving away your work product for free to charging money for it, the dynamic of the transaction changes. Sometimes considerably.

When you're giving away your work product for free, you can do what you want, how you want, *when* you want. When money enters the equation, that all changes. You now get to do what the customer wants, how they want it and *when they want it*.



> they just want it in a hurry


That right there is an indication that your potential customer already has expectations of you. High expectations. You may discover other expectations once you start down this path. All those expectations may make the whole process a pain in the arse.

Apart from the materials, what is your time, effort and trouble worth? What personal time and activities are you going to have to sacrifice in order to deliver the product on a schedule? How much time is going to be spent communicating with the customer, discussing design changes, providing status updates, explaining why you won't finish by the agreed upon deadline, etc. When it's all said and done, what amount of money will make you feel satisfied and ready to do another project for pay, not frustrated, used, and ready to give all your tools away? If it becomes a royal pain, what amount of money will make that pain tolerable?

If the "customer" is willing to pay that amount, great! You have a potential win-win on your hands. If they're not willing to pay that amount, then no harm, no foul! The customer will fulfill their needs elsewhere, you avoid a great deal of stress and headache and continue doing what you love to do the way you love to do it.

If you're hoping this transaction is the gateway to a full-fledged, full-time business, then many other factors come into play such as market value and costs apart from materials. But if this is just a one-off thing, charge whatever will make you happy to do the job.


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## benwinch07 (Nov 12, 2015)

I hope this thread isn't considered Dead yet, and that the OP is still open to advice:

David Picciuto over at Make Something has a clear cut video on how to price your work-






Basically, he teaches that everything takes at least a day to make, and that you should price things on how many days it will take you to make the thing. Set a price per day and quote accordingly.

I'm just getting into the world of commission work and its still a very part time venture so I modify this a little bit by understanding that I cant work on something for 8 hours a day. But when Im coming up with the price of a piece I think of how long it would take me to build if I COULD spend 8 hours a day on it, and I figure up the price accordingly. Say for example 5 full days (40 hours). I then try to note how much time each day I'm able to dedicate to the project as Im working on it and when its all done I hope that my few hours each day over the course of a few weeks adds up to or less than 40 hours. And if it does then I've quoted correctly. Im still working on my efficiency and workflow so right now I'm still overshooting my anticipated time, but as I progress I will get better.

So to relate this to your clock, How many days will it take you to make? And how much do you want to make per day? Add the cost of materials and there is your price point.


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## GCM (Jan 12, 2012)

Thanks for that Ben, yes I have (since starting this thread) seen David's very interesting video.

None-the-less I think there has been some great advice given on this thread so it was very well worth starting, and I hope it is not dead - a couple of "life issues" have cropped up preventing me from reporting back in the short term but I hope to give closure to the adventure pretty soon, including complications with the Australian Taxation Office, which, whilst of little interest to US and other international wood workers, none-the-less indicate the almost infinite number of "gotchas" in selling your work.

In particular I would like to answer some recommendations regarding choice of material and why local conditions have an effect on that.

In summary I would like to think that the thread is not dead and that further recommendations are welcome - due to local conditions those recommendations may not be applicable to me personally but could well help someone in a similar position.

As a teaser I have used some of the great advice given here and given a quotation which, to be honest, would be well below what the item would cost to build if I seriously included labour costs. If the quotation is not accepted then there are only two possibilities as far as I can assume - the potential client was not serous, or the market is not there for hand crafted work.


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## waho6o9 (May 6, 2011)

http://lumberjocks.com/huff/blog/36598


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## tncraftsman (Oct 21, 2009)

I've found this presentation by the Cabinet Makers Association to be an excellent guide on pricing your work.

The art of pricing profitability


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