# Full or thin Kerf saw blade



## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

Hi,

I will be in the market for a replacement saw blade for a Bosch 4000. Having read a number of articles, I understand one advantage of a thin kerf over a full kerf saw blade is reduced demand on saw motors.

The Bosch 4000 is 15amp 4.4 HP peak rated. Has anyone out there with a Bosch 4000 had experience or recommendation on either the full or thin kerf on this saw? I welcome any thoughts on this subject.

Thanks,

Dalec


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## schroeder (Feb 8, 2007)

Dalec - for what its worth…I hate the thin kerf saw blades. First, they aren't as durable, they don't save a furniture builder much (1/32" - 1/16" each cut) and they screw up either your fence or your miter gauge for measuring (depending on whether you have a left or right tilt saw). Often we need to "nip" a little off for a tenon or a dado - the thin kerf suck here as well - many passes, many marks. (I sound bitter don't I - LOL)...my two cents..


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## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

Thanks Schroeder.

It seems your experience is that a full kerf blade gives you a more accurate/precise cut.

Freud and Forrest brand blades have been suggested as better brand blades. I am still researching and will give your opinion about kerf thickness a lot of consideration.

I don't know if I want to invest in a Forrest at this point, but would consider a Freud combination blade just to get me going. Right now, I have a used blade that has one missing tooth, so I am not planning to cut any wood on my TS until it is replaced in the next couple of weeks.

Again, I very miuch appreciate you taking the time to respond with your experience.

dalec


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## Dadoo (Jun 23, 2007)

Freud is good…I've had good luck with them and they won't set you back too far. As for thin kerf blades…If you rush the slightest bit, the blade will warp the slightest bit giving you a crooked cut. I had one in my miter box. The plastic red base plate shows the effect after cutting pine 2×4's too quickly.


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## coloradoclimber (Apr 7, 2007)

I've recently switched over to using more thin kerf blades and I like them. I am the kind of guy who swaps out his blades to match the job. I have some regular thickness ripping and crosscut blades I use for rough work, chopping up 2×4s and rough edging heavier stock. I have some thin kerf ripping and crosscut blades I use for more delicate work, 4/4 or thinner, small box stuff, detailed work. I run them all in a 3 hp cabinet saw so I don't really use them because of an underpowered saw. I don't use stiffeners. So far I have not noticed any warping, twisting, bending, or other deformations of the blade or poor cuts. I guess if you were hogging some real heavy cuts and feeding too fast you probably could get into trouble, but I suggest you could also get into the same trouble with regular thickness blades. I've not yet seen any downside to using thin kerf blades.


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## Tangle (Jul 21, 2007)

I use Freud Glue Line Rip blades and a Freud Melamine/Plywood blade. I switch back and forth. I do most of my cross cuts on the miter saw. What ever you buy, get it from the Lumber Jocks Store to help Martin keep this thing going.


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## GaryK (Jun 25, 2007)

I would say that it's a matter of personal choice. I use a thin kerf. I also tend
to use only one blade all the time for everything. About the only time I switch
it out is when I have to do wide dados, or a lot of smaller ones.

Freud and Forrest brand blades are both good with the edge going to Forrest.

Gary


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## mski (Jul 3, 2007)

I use Forrest WWII thin kerf, 1/12 HP Sears 10" saw, Love it, especially ripping 2" thick hardwood, it really does help with low powered saws, I was going to go for the stabilizer but I don't think I'll need it.
As far as durability, I just do this as a hobby so can't comment on how well they will hold up in a mass production shop.
Mark


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## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

Thanks everyone for taking the time to give me your recommendations on full and thin kerf and Freud vs Forrest.

Although I did some woodworking in junior high (does this date me or what?), I have much to learn both through reading (advice from LJ's) and by doing it. What I know is having good equipment that is aligned and maintained will make my learning easier and result in better projects.

I am leaning toward the Freud based on published reviews, LJ recommendations and cost. I am not fully decided on full or thin kerf, but sense that either will be ok to begin with. I would like your opinion on the uncoated or coated (red) and if it is worth the extra money?

Thanks,

Dalec


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## North40 (Oct 17, 2007)

The coated blades are really nice if you are cutting any pine/fir, or anything with lots of pitch or glue. It really makes a difference in the build-up on the blades. If you stick with oak and maple, I'd say go with the less expensive, uncoated blade.

For what it's worth, I use full kerf for ripping and thin kerf for cross cuts and sheet material. Thin kerf is quieter.


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## boboswin (May 23, 2007)

From my experience plus some reading it appears that the thin kerf blade needs less power to cut through heavy (thicker, denser) stock. 
Apart from that I have not seen or read any information that suggests statistical tangible benefits of one over the other.
It stands to reason the the thinner blade may flex more on a full height cut but that may be the price you have to pay for being underpowered.

cheers
Bob


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## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

Thanks Everyone for your recommendations and experiences with full and thin kerf saw blades. I also wrote Forrest to ask for their recommendation on full or thin kerf for my Bosch 4000. Their recommendation was thin.

With the experience of several of you and Forrest's recommendation, I am leaning more toward TF. Now what brand? I am looking at Freud and Forrest. It may come down to a budget driven decision.

Mean while, I want to express my appreciation to all of you for taking the time to respond to my inquiry.

Dalec


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## Caliper (Mar 12, 2007)

Dalec, I just finished wrestling with this decision. I decided I was going to get a thin kerf Forrest but my local supplier didn't have any. Now, the fellow helping me is the floor manager and is a stand-up guy. He turned me on to a blade the he really likes because he cuts a lot of frames for his dad (a painter). I'm in a box building mindset right now and wanted something that would give me some accurate miters so I jumped at it because the price point is only $35. The blade is a Porter Cable Razor. He also said if it didn't work for my needs he'd take it back. So, I'm giving it a whirl.

PC came out with it a few years back but it didn't sell well because to many… it looks a little goofy. The basically combined 60 tooth cross-cut with a 24 tooth rip. If you imagine the blade in quadrants, the NE and SW quads are the 60 tooth and the other opposing quadrants are the 24. The concept is that you can get through stock relatively quickly and then the the cut is cleaned up by the higher tooth count.

I've used it exclusively on the miter sled I'm building and I'm actually quite impressed. Granted, I haven't been working in the hardest of woods but it has handled 3/4 baltic birch, MDF, and 4/4 cherry just great. As mentioned by others, it is much quieter (but we should all use ear protection anyway).

The price point is right for the quality of work I've gotten out of it so far. It IS new and thus sharp so I don't know how long this will really last. The carbide is only C3 which contributes to the lower price point. I should also state that the first blade I bought was a full kerf Forrest WWII and it is fine, fine blade. It's just that I have it out for sharpening and I unfortunately just trashed my Freud last weekend and had no choice but to get a new blade. I also bought a TK Freud but have not tried it out yet since this PC is working out so well.


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## Caliper (Mar 12, 2007)

Here is a link to the Razor. I stand corrected. It's 50 tooth not 60 and there is a transitional configuration in the teeth. It's not as abrupt as I may have made it sound. There is a pic at the link below.

Porter Cable Razor


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## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

Jeff,

Thanks for taking the time to write such a long and detailed response to my question. I learn new things with each response. Aside from the issue of full vs thin kerf, I am also struggle with combination/general purpose blades or specialized.

My thinking right now is that the Freud LU86 or Forrest 40T TK or Porter Cable Razor offer a good way to start into woodworking. I would like your thoughts on this notion from you or anyone who wants to jump in.

Dalec


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## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

I really was not clear in my earlier thoughts about the Freud LU86 or Forrest. What I intended was: I am thinking that either a quality combination or general purpose saw blade may be a good starting point for a novice. Wanted some feedback if anyone has thoughts on this.

Thanks

Dalec


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## Radish (Apr 11, 2007)

I picked up a Freud Fusion last weekend, just a few bucks less than a Forrest WWII. Very exciting clean cuts, without splintering on the cross-cuts. Pretty amazing.


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## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

Doug,

I have seen ads for the Freud Fusion with a listed price in the Forrest range. I don't believe I have seen any reviews or comments on the Fusion with the exception of yours. It is yet another option.

I also began looking at the thickness 8/4 of some of the maple I may need to rip and thinking the saws I have been focusing on may not be the best for the application. I see the Freud LU86 suggest it works best rip up to 1". I will have to look at the Forrest and Fusion to see if they will handle thicker rips. So I may end up with a dedicated rip blade as Thos suggested very earlier on.

Dalec


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## SPalm (Oct 9, 2007)

Dalec, Over the years talking to people, it seems like having a three seperate blades: combo, rip, and ply fills it out. I do, and it works for me. I don't always change to the correct blade when I should. Mine are freuds and need to get sharpened. If I remember right.. LU84, LU72, and LU98. (Freud has too many gal dang numbers.)

Read good things about that Fusion. Hmmm…

Good luck,
Steve


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## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

SPalm,

Thanks for the info on your blade set. For the price of a Forrest, I could easily buy two or nearly three other brand good blades. Another factor to consider.

Appreciate your response.

Dalec


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## Radish (Apr 11, 2007)

Steve the Freud range part numbers have always gotten me in a dither as well. They are the only blades I use as the prices seem reasonable (well, except the Fusion - but it's performance has been exemplary) and they are available at my local woodworking supplier.

Dalec, good luck with the blade choices. If you have a band-saw that would be another and safer choice for 8/4 rips. 
With the TS, you could do partial thickness rips and flip the wood over with the same edge referenced to the fence. If the workpiece is not too long, you could leave a thin tongue of uncut wood along the kerf to prevent binding and finish the cut with a handsaw. Then cleanup with a plane or thickness planer. You might have to take any blade cover/splitter off to perform these cuts. Push sticks, feather boards and ear/eye/lung protection recommended. See all the tools and accessories you will need to work safely. Not sure if you are married or not, but you can show this to your life partner if you need to justify any purchases. Just my two cents…


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## dalec (Oct 3, 2007)

Thanks for the suggestions on ripping. I only have a TS at this point. I don't want to push the equipment or my safety.

Hope you enjoy the Fusion. I think blades in this class will have to wait awhile.

Dalec


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## Bill918 (Mar 4, 2012)

Been using Forrest blades for approximately 20 years. Last time I sent one for sharpening, an original, they informed me that it was the last time they could sharpen it and I would have to break down and replace it. 20 years out of a blade is not to shabby. I have Freud blades also, they hang on a rack. Forrest beats Freud hands down in performance and value. Years back I bought a Freud stack dado set. I was not happy with it so I sent it to Forrest to sharpen it to their specs, a world of difference. They are also a great company to deal with since they are a family type shop. Just my 2 cents.


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## danr (Sep 5, 2009)

Hey Bill918,

I have a Freud stack data set also. It's ok but not as great as I had hoped. Your comment about sending it to Forrest for a sharpening has inspired me to do the same. Going to do that next week.

As far as Forrest blades go I like them a lot (40T combo and 40T #1 grind). Just bought one of each new. Should last a long time like the last ones. Woodcraft had a bit of a sale on these this weekend. I have also used plenty of Frued blades (thin and full kerf) I think that they are quality blades at a good price. Since having my new Delta UniSaw (for about 2 years now) I only use full kerf because of the riving knife thickness. On my old saw (craftsman) I used pretty much only thin kerf. So it seems to me that the choice is somewhat based on the saw's power. Just a casual observation. Everybody has a different opinion based on personnal experience.

Thanks again for the idea.

danr


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## ShipWreck (Feb 16, 2008)

Dalec : I have used a full range of thin kerf and standard blades on my Ridgid portable jobsite saw. To be honest, I have not seen any difference in the saws performance, or quality of cuts. The thin kerf blades do tend to create a bind if you have a standard blade thickness riving knife. The better blades will react well regardless of kerf width.
My saw has gone through many housing rehabs and other projects. I would stay with a standard kerf if your riving knife is standard kerf.


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## NormG (Mar 5, 2010)

Personal choice. I use them as them as I can afford a better blade in the 7 1/4 area than purchasing a 10" blade of the same # of teeth


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## knotscott (Feb 27, 2009)

To say that "Forrest beats Freud hands down" means that you either haven't compared Forrest to Freud's best comparable blade (as in apples to apples), had a defective/dull/incorrect model/lower end Freud blade, or have some serious bias in favor of Forrest. I like Forrest as much as the next guy and think they have some great blades, but saw blades are relatively simple science for today's technology and Forrest doesn't have any fairy dust that elevates them beyond blades from Freud's top line, Infinity, Ridge Carbide, Tenryu's Gold Medal, or possibly CMT Orange or Amana Tool's best line….there are other candidates that I'm less familiar with. With a remotely objective comparison, there should be no reason you can't get remarkably similar results with at least a half dozen of Forrest's top competitors.

Now, if you prefer Forrest because they're made in the USA, your best girl gave you one, you like the look of the logo, like to stick with what you know, etc., then there's not much I can debate about….


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

*Thank you @ShipWreck.* I was reading through this entire thread and had noticed that no one had addressed the riving knife thickness issue until your post.

*Pay attention folks, matching your riving knife to your kerf thickness is IMPORTANT! * The riving knife should be just slightly undersized from the kerf of the blade being used. Notice that on mine, the riving knife is just 0.004in thinner than the kerf of the recommended blade size.


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## ShipWreck (Feb 16, 2008)

That is a sweet looking riving knife Mike. I can see by the numbers that it is a thin kerf. Who makes it…....Grizz?


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## HorizontalMike (Jun 3, 2010)

It is stock on the Grizzly and it is made for Full Kerf 0.125in blades.

Please note, for example… a thin kerf Freud blade has a 0.91in kerf and that is TOO small/thin for this riving knife.


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## ShipWreck (Feb 16, 2008)

Yep…I see it…...... .098 Had to get my over 50 eyes closer to the monitor.


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