# noise



## darrenjttu (Dec 7, 2009)

My next door neighbor came over today at 5 pm and told me I was making too much noise and I woke her baby up. I was running my dw735 planer which is the loudest machine I own. Her baby is 9 months and I want to be a good neighbor but what am I suppos to do. It is 5 in the evening and I need to finish using my planer. Maybe I will ask her when is a good time to use it. Anybody else piss off the neighbors? Any suggestions? I am not getting any hand planes.


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## Chip (Mar 13, 2007)

I think after 9 or 10pm she might have a point but 5pm seems a bit early to be complaining. I guess the baby has to be a consideration though. Any way of muffling the noise by covering the windows or doors with something? I've never had a problem and have no idea how much noise I make to the outside world.


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## darrenjttu (Dec 7, 2009)

I did have the garage open. I usually close it because of the noise but I didnt today. My windows and garage door is insulated with the foam board.


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## SteveMI (May 19, 2009)

I'd go with keeping the garage closed when using the planer and see what happens. My neighbor was nurse on the midnight shift and I would work with the garage door closed until about 4 pm. Problem with babies is that they don't have concept of time, except their own, and you may be stuck with the door closed for quite some time.

Wonder what she is going to do with lawn services and neighbors getting a new roof.

Steve.


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## jeepturner (Oct 3, 2010)

Be as considerate as you can, babies grow up, and will be on a schedule soon. My planer is the loudest thing I have too, and I have to use in at the right times. I vote for the closed door and ear protection.


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

Close the garage door, and … if it isn't already … insulate it.

I live next door to an IN-considerate neighbor. It sucks.

It's one of the main reasons that I put my shop in my basement, instead of the garage. Our houses are close together, and I want to minimize the impact of my actions on others.

Good for you for asking, in this forum, though. Shows you give a darn. That puts you leaps and bounds ahead of lots of people, right off the bat


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## SouthpawCA (Jul 19, 2009)

I live in an association of attached townhomes. A neighbor, who's home is attached to mine, has a kid who is less than 1 and one about 2. I initially asked them for the baby's sleep schedule and I abide by it. What I also do is use my hand planes a whole lot more. Initially, it was a pain to do that. I wasn't any darn good at it at all, but practice makes better. I just finished hand planing the twist out of 6 lyptus boards and it really didn't take all that long. Once I got the twist out I did run the boards thru the planer, but it was once or twice and I was done. Using hand planes I've seriously considered selling my jointer.

I know what all the hand plane users say - it's relaxing or whatever. I thought it all was just hogwash. I purchased a Veritas low angle jack plane over a year ago with the intent to get heavy into hand planes. That was a year ago and the plane sat in the box. However, necessity required me to now actually use it. I practiced on a few scrap twisted boards, made some winding sticks, watched a few "how to" videos, then went out and started. The first was a bit slow, the 2nd was faster, the rest flattened very fast.

My Christmas list now contains a Veritas jointer plane. Give it a try, your ears and your neighbors will love you for it.


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## kit (Oct 25, 2010)

Let us remember that baby sleep time is also rest time for momma. . .she looks forward to those times in order to put her feet up, get chores done, etc. Her complaint may have had this perspective in mind. As suggested, you might inquire when nap time is. . .and a nice woodcraft gift for baby would be a nice touch (a simple coat rack with a Disney theme would be an easy one). Bottom line, sounds like you want to be accomodating. . .and that is a nice thing. . .

Kit


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## beckerswoodworks (Dec 26, 2009)

The last time I checked planers weren't any louder than lawn mowers. Using either of them at 2:00 am would definately be inconsiderate, but 5:00 pm is not. If it were me I would apologize and finish my planing.


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## dbhost (Jul 20, 2009)

Work with her. Not exactly good fences make good neighbors kind of stuff (See The Road Less Travelled if you don't get it…) but it would buy a LOT of peace among your neighbors if you extended an olive branch. Without a doubt your neighbor is being unreasonable if she is fussing about 5:00 P.M. noise. However since there is a baby involved, it would be nice if you could flex a little… And it sounds like you are trying…

Let her know that you will be making noise within the prime hours, but will be working to reduce the impact of the noise… Closing the door would help, a LOT. Her letting you know when the baby is down for a nap would help as well… IF she could put the baby down on the side of the house farthest away from the source of the noise would do wonders for avoiding interrupting baby's sleep… Also hanging old heavy blankets and sleeping bags along the wall between you, and her will help. Likewise, if your attic is uninsulated over the shop, do it, NOW, your neighbor relations as well as your comfort in the winter will thank you…

Of course, hand planes are a giant leap quieter…


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## swirt (Apr 6, 2010)

The kid is probably not too far away from a more "scheduled" nap time. A 5pm nap is probably a sign that the normal nap time was off and baby and momma were at wits end. I don't think you did anything wrong. An apology can often go a long way. You might even be able to ask for a nap sign. Something like a hat or stuffed animal in a window can be a signal to you baby is sleeping.

And yes trying to accommodate my own son's nap schedule is what pushed me more and more into going hand powered. As SouthpawCA said, come on in, the water's fine.


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## Tomas (Jun 25, 2007)

The solution is close the garage door, plane a little earlier or change to a less noisy machine (helical head). I say create a noise diversion, hire someone to ride their Harley up and down the street while you plane.


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## traupmann (Oct 8, 2010)

We have a drug half-way house a couple doors up the hill from us. We have lost quite a bit of garden art stolen from our yard. One object was worth well over $500 and had great sentimental value. Well I decided to put up a lattice fence 6 feet tall. My logic was that you can't climb it or get through it without making a lot of noise right outside my bedroom. 
So about a year ago, at 10am on a Saturday morning, I was ripping 3/8 wide redwood lath. After a short while, my neighbor, a single mother, comes traipsing up the driveway in her very skimpy PJs. Now she's not asking anything, just screaming at the top of her lungs. Explaining to her the actual time was well past the city's 8am noise ordinance, she cussed a bit about how long was she going to have to put up with me. It had been 8 years already… I told her 30 more and she was free. Next the police showed. Not a patrolman, but a sergeant. He asked if I was OK. Then he went into her house. An hour later, he came back out and explained that she had used such threatening language to the 911 operator, that he was sure she was going to shoot me. 
He then asked how much longer I had to go. By then we'd finished with the ripping and was shooting 3/4 inch long staples with my air gun. At that time it was almost noon, and I told him that it would take another couple of hours to put up the fence. He had a patrol car park on her side of the street to assure my safety. 
A couple of weeks ago she reappeared after being gone for about 2 months. The neighborhood rumor is a 'rest facility', but she hasn't gotten along with any neighbors, and her dramas can fill a much longer forum than this.

Asking for a pause in the action seems mild now.


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## HokieMojo (Mar 11, 2008)

I've got a 1 year old. It is tough for parents when they are trying to get a kid to sleep. I remember on 4th of july the people across the street were shooting off fireworks that were going off right outside my daughters window till about 11. It's the 4tth though so what are you gonna do.

At 9 months, there is a real good chance the kid already has a schedule. You might want to ask if the kid is or not. Most kids don't nap more than an hour or 2 at a time, so you've got a good chance it won't be hard to work around.


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## HokieMojo (Mar 11, 2008)

Swirt, 
The signal is a GREAT idea!


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## pcott (Jul 7, 2009)

I dunno. I have a child with autism who doesn't sleep well. But I don't expect my neighbours to fit their schedules around her sleeping, nor would I consider it reasonable to do so.


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## Eagle1 (Jan 4, 2010)

I know planers are loud. i have been told by my cousin that lives a little over a football field from me. When I start up my planer with the garage open. He says he knows when I am using it, even with his windows and door shut. But 2 hours after the ordinance, theres not much she can do but ask. Not yell at you. I even tell my kids that like to stay out all night and sleep all day. At 9am the shop gets turned on. If they wouldn't do what they are doing, they wouldn't get woke up.


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## Steve_B (Oct 30, 2009)

Tell her you were trying to help her out by drowning out the gangster rap the kids were playing driving by. Then offer to quit while the baby sleeps and go mow the lawn instead. LOL Really it's great you want to make nice with the neighbor. However she needs to figure out she has a neighbor and he has rights. If she was worried about noise keeping a baby awake she could have chosen to move or not have a kid. Maybe she should think about your schedule and put the baby down for a nap before you get home from work. Sounds like she has "opera syndrome". It's all about ME, ME, ME. And yes, I had kids and have grand kids and great grand kids. Welcome to parenthood. Now suck it up!


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## Gator (May 2, 2008)

If closing to doors and wondows works, then there is not much of an inconveniance on your part. Babies will evenually turn into teenagers .. then you will have an entirely different set of problems.. LOL..

Most of the people will agree that you are trying to be accomodating, and asking her to put up a "sign" is a great idea. If nothing else it would buy you a lot of slack from her in the future. If she is a reasonable person she will respect your hobby as much as she respects your actions to work with her. Good neighbors are a blessing .. some can make life just too miserable…

Gator


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## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

Darren, I'd be curious as to her attitude when she came and asked, was she considerate in her request? Yeah, close the door, accomodate as you can, but she's got to work with YOU as well, a team effort.


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## Ken90712 (Sep 2, 2009)

I work nights so understand what you're going through. One day I asked a neighbors if they could keep it down just little once around 6pm he got all huffy said, "not my fault you sleep at 6." So one time at 4 am fired up my Motorcycle by his bedroom he got mad. Told him not my fault you sleep at 4am this is my daytime. He got the point and chilled. " Moved later :>) ", got divorced.

I wake up pn my days off at 4-5 am and I'm dying to go out to the shop, but try and wait til 8. Or I'll go in early and hand sand or plan so I don't wake anyone up.

The world is becoming more populated and finding that happy medium is important. I think you're on the right track closing the door & talking to her. My one neighbor works nights and I always ask when he sleeps so I don't wake him as well. Luckily he says he cant hear anything.

Good luck.


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## JJohnston (May 22, 2009)

My next door neighbor uses a planer, and so do I, and the guy about 4 houses away, katty-corner across the intersection either planes or routs, or both. We make our noise during the day on weekends. The rest of the people have barking dogs that take over the noise-making duty at night. We're covered, round the clock. ;o)


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## racerglen (Oct 15, 2010)

My "day " starts at three am, I split shift sleep, an afternoon nap then real bed after supper.
If you think a planer's loud  try a built in vacum with the unit in the neat freak neighbours grarage..
In use LOTS ! And for some reason afternoons and with the garage door open.. (wonder if it was unmuffled like ther Harley's down the street ?)
Fortunately, they moved and the "new" neighbours aren't as clean and keep the door shut..
LOL..
I think my loudest tool would be my Skill belt sander, or Grampa's B & D router..never in use while the rest are sleeping..


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## rivergirl (Aug 18, 2010)

Hate to sound harsh but parents with kids need to learn that the kid is their problem- not the rest of the worlds's problem. Don is correct, what's the difference between a lawnmower and a planer? Not much. Five in the afternoon is the time for woodworking. The kid will adjust. Or the parent will adjust. That's the problem with people and kids today, they are confused about what their "rights" are. I raised three kids- and it was a noisy place here at my house. The kids napped when they napped. Or not. My problem- not the universes problem. If I were you I would keep planing and sawing during the normal hours and tell that lady to stay the hell in her own yard. I work outside all the time planing and cutting and grinding to my heart's content from 8 am to about 8 PM. I live in a swankyassed neighborhood and let me tell you NO ONE has ever dared to ask me not to work wood in my yard or garage. They know better. However, they do sometimes poke in to see what I am building. And I have all kinds of logs and wood strewn all about the place- a bit like the beverly hillbillies on riverfront property. Again, no complaints- in fact they bring me wood. My kind of town. Around here your legally allowed to make noise till 10 or 11 oclock. The cops can't do a thing until then.


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## nate22 (Jul 12, 2010)

I guess I would suggest when using your planer just close the garage door. And if your neighbor still complains just tell her that you have to use it and there is no getting around it. Some people have to realize that the world doesn't revolve around them. I guess I am kind of lucky all my neighbors now what I do for a living which is making furniture so they don't complain. So all I can say is try closeing the door when you use your planer and leave it open when you use everything else. good luck on it.


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

Rivergirl wrote: "Hate to sound harsh but parents with kids need to learn that the kid is their problem- not the rest of the worlds's problem. Don is correct, what's the difference between a lawnmower and a planer? Not much. Five in the afternoon is the time for woodworking. The kid will adjust. Or the parent will adjust. That's the problem with people and kids today, they are confused about what their "rights" are."

Perhaps the BEST reason to work this out through reasonable talks and reasonable accommodations is this:

There ARE laws, and the laws in many municipalities (or in the CC&Rs of many communities) tend to boil down to something akin to this: during "quiet hours" (often, something like 10pm to 7a), YOUR noise has to be confined to YOUR house.

Outside of quiet hours, though, your noise cannot be of the quality, frequency, or duration that would constitute-to the reasonable person-an unreasonable interference with the others' Right of Quiet Enjoyment.

So … the issue … in the eyes of the law … is really about the Right of Quiet Enjoyment-one that goes back hundreds of years, to English Common Law.

And … IN that law … tend to be things like …. your barking dog noise is NOT okay, but your screaming baby noise is.

In other words, the law actually carves out a special place for babies-from which sleeping babies wouldn't be too much of a stretch.

The Civil issue here is one called Private Nuisance (DAMHIK).

It looks at a couple things: would a reasonable person have a problem with the noise, what efforts have been taken or CAN BE taken to mitigate that noise, and [emphasis mine] *what is the value of the respective activities to society, and what is the appropriateness of the respective activities to the community*.

This stuff is important. Think about it, in your situation.

If you "assert YOUR rights," then a judge/jury will be forced to ask themselves a pretty simple question: which is more *appropriate*, and which is more *important*: your right to run your AC planer or that baby's right to nap.

And which can be more easily *mitigated*: the noise YOU'RE making or the baby's need to nap (note that the Courts will generally NOT force a baby to judiciously use amphetamines <grin>).

See where I'm going, here ?

*Rivergirl* is right, when she says, "That's the problem with people and kids today, they are confused about what their "rights" are."

But … it's helpful to remember that-while you surely DO have rights-this MOM has rights, too.

And I'd bet a buck that the Courts would find HER rights trump YOUR rights, in a situation like this.

So …. try really hard not to let it get that far, huh ? It's painful, expensive, and ugly.

Trust me.


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## PurpLev (May 30, 2008)

Amen to that Neil!

another thing to remember - the DW735 is far and beyond more noisy than any lawn mower, plus, you mow your lawn once a week or 2 weeks, but when you are milling lumber daily, all day long thats a different thing all together.

I think the lady asking for your cooperation was a good thing, and working with her would be a noble and humane thing to do after all - it's not all about rights and laws - we are living in a society and putting a human tough into things can make all the difference. trying to work it out with her using signs or schedules would be the best for both of you in the long run.

it's easy to say how things should be done based on personal experience - we all live in different neighborhoods with different people around us and different mentalities. the best option is to do what works best for you.

Peace.


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## dbhost (Jul 20, 2009)

Well, it does sound like the OP is being reasonable, and attempting to work with the complaining neighbor… I honestly haven't had any neighbor complaint issues in regards to power tools, although the HOA has had hissy fits about me leaving trash cans out too late…

I don't know how well established you are with this neighbor, but if at all possible, work things out with her where both of you can be reasonably appeased… The signal idea is a good one… Stick Mickey Mouse in the window or something… You keeping your door shut is another. Insulating your space not only controls the heat gain and loss, it also radically reduces sound transmission through the walls, doors, and ceiling…

Now there is a certain amount of reasonable expectation here though. You have rights to use your property during non overnight hours as you see fit, and it is not at all unusual for a homeowner to use loud power tools in the maintenance of their home. Lawn mowers, edgers, blowers, weed eaters etc… spring to mind. As do a bevy of saws, compressors, nailers etc… And for her to expect you to not work with these tools during normal daytime hours is beyond unreasonable.


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## ChuckC (May 13, 2010)

The DW735 is very loud and I don't think it's unreasonable for the neighbor to talk to you about it. I have 3 very young kids (2 are twins) and things can get stressful with them. I don't think I would ever chase down a loud neighbor though.
You are probably legally well within your rights to plane at 5:00pm but sometimes we do stuff just to make someone else's life easier. Even if it's a neighbor.
Like everyone else suggested close the door and see if that helps. When my neighbors get loud I put a lullaby CD in to help drown the sound too. Maybe she can do that?


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## cheford (Aug 3, 2009)

I really don't think there is a right answer here. There also is not enough details for me to form an opinion one way or the other.

How far apart are the houses?
Was she polite?
etc…

I have 3 kids, 2 are twins just turned 3, and my son just turned 1. What I do know from my experience, is that the more you worry about trying to be quiet so kids/babies can sleep, the worse the problem gets. Not that I would use my nail gun outside their bedroom door, but as far as outside noise goes, there is not much you can do about it. I am sure that I may have woken them up mowing the lawn a few times, but they get over it, and used to it.

On a similar note, my neighbor once complained that while she was napping at 2PM, that damn neighbor behind her was using his chainsaw and woke her up. Some people are very willing to give up their rights and others are not.


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## MsDebbieP (Jan 4, 2007)

I remember one tough week when the little one just wasn't sleeping well and thus, neither was I, and the one afternoon when I was getting that little naptime break, the neighbour's dog started barking… and barking… NO-NOT NOW. I definitely can appreciate the need for quiet-time on those rare occasions when the nap is desperately needed by the parent, let alone the child.

I am reminded of my thoughts about "community" (my editorial this past month) - people working together to find a way for the community to work. Some give, some take, some negotiating and compromising.
For me, I think the best idea is finding the best time for the loud noise activities.. of course that is only one way to find a plan to make this a win/win situation.

Best of luck


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## DaddyZ (Jan 28, 2010)

If you don't obey MOM the little one will someday grow up & then Come steal & Pawn all your toys,

By obeying Mom maybe he/she won't RELIEVE in your toybox!!!


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## newbiewoodworker (Aug 29, 2010)

I, personally, would do, what other LJs have said: Talk to her.

If she is receptive to the idea of maybe working out a "schedual", then respect that schedual, but mind you, ensure it is OKAY WITH YOU AS WELL..

You could also, ask her one day to stand in the babies room, while you run a few boards, with the garage door closed… Ask her if its still noisy.

OR

If she says "No-no-no, you will cease when my baby is sleeping, end of story" Or threatens to shoot you with a gun .. Then by all means, run that planer up until the noise ordanance goes into effect. I mean the minute of….. I am sure she will become more receptive, after a couple weeks of not getting any sleep…

I personally run my tools, planer included, until 12pm some nights, on weekends, and in the summer. I have never had an issue. My garage is maybe 20metres from the neighbors bedroom… Maybe this chick needs to put some more insulation in her walls, and maybe ensure all the windows are closed…

But then again, my family is in the buisness of pissing off the neighbors… We have an on going lawsuit over their driveway being about 4×20ft on our land…. So ever couple days my grandfather is out their drilling a new hole in their driveway, drawing out cut-lines, and clearing trees so he can park half of his car on their driveway…because its legally on our land… and best of all… they cant do a thing about it… Speaking of which, I have to ask him if the lawyer called yet..


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## CampD (Nov 8, 2008)

Like Neil states, and as a contrator, their are bylaws in every town about when I can start and stop equipment.
Most is 7am to 7pm. Sounds to me like she may be a little over tired or,, just that way to begin with and may try and dictate more of "your" hours in the future. If you intend to remain neighborly, I'd close the gargae door.


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## beckerswoodworks (Dec 26, 2009)

PurpLev, Any buisiness small enough to operate out of a garage isn't milling lumber all day everyday. And I'm willing to bet that a lot folks running planers in their garage are like me and running it at 5:00 because that's when they get home from work. It's the only time of day during the week that I can run my planer and that's why I would apologize and continue planing if I recieved a complaint.

rivergirl, I can't begin to express how nice it is to hear a parent who doesn't think she has special rights because she's a parent…


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## rivergirl (Aug 18, 2010)

I stand by my original statement. That mom needs to get a life. As for the kid not growing up to steal your tools if you let him and Mom nap? Are you insane- that type of ridiculous "me" expectation that is instilled from BIRTH is precisely why the kid WILL grow up and steal your tools and "pee" in your sandbox. The kid will learn to sleep through noise. 5 oclock is not late and the planer does not run all the time therefore the "nuisance noise" BS and Beener's English Common Law (are in California Beener?) argument don't really apply. People suck- that lady needs to stay in her own yard. I have one crappy neighbor- thank God they never built a house on that 200,000 lot they rest their boat on in the summer months. He came over here screaming once or twice about my dog. (I only had one then) Then he learned to never do that again. He called the cops once for "noise" (before midnight) on FOURTH OF JULY WEEKEND- ON THE RIVER. The guy is a total and his complaints to the powers that be went no where. So I say- go home lady. And the next time she ran the lawn mower in the afternoon I would go over and tell her I was napping- intermittently of course - due to my recent chemotherapy treatment. So she had better not mow anymore until I was completely healed. See how the shoe would fit on the other foot.


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## hisparadox (Mar 1, 2008)

a few questions.
1 how many decibels does your equipment create at the location of annoyance (property line)
2 what are the noise ordinances in your area
3 are you legally permitted to run the type of shop that your running out of your home
if your in compliance with those issues, there really isnt much they can do to change how you work, other than ask nice. if your not, you better get yourself there or you will find yourself in a situation that you can not win


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## ars (Jun 13, 2010)

IMO she's gonna have a problem with your planer no matter what and I guarentee she's already called your friendly local police department and they kindly suggested her to come talk to you. 5pm is 100% reasonable and you did nothing wrong, she just has to realize she has a baby, not her neighbors. Just to be a nice guy I think it would be cool to close the garage door, while you're "partying". But you shouldn't have to add any insulation or install anything to dampen the noise, unless the two of you are friends and can work out a deal to where she pays for your insulation. I mean, I hate my neighbor's lawn and their little rat dog, but I deal with it, because I'm an adult.

As long you're doing your best to be reasonable (which to me sounds like you are), that's more than adequate, she should be thankful that you're even considering her childish requests. Remember, it's not illegal to be a bad neighbor, not saying that's a good thing, nor am I saying you're bad neighbor. I don't know who was there first and it doesn't matter but both of you chose to live in that neighborhood, and both of you picked your homes. She's the one that chose to be a parent and babies waking up is part of parenting. Correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't the reason we went to school and busted our humps at work to get good jobs and save enough money to buy a house in a neighborhood that best suits our lifestyle. Sounds to me like she needs to grow up a little. Just out of curiousity, if you don't mind me asking where abouts do you live? or what type of neighborhood do you live in?


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## Knothead62 (Apr 17, 2010)

What's a 9 month old doing asleep at 5 PM? I don't ever remember any of our two being asleep at that time. That was about dinner time at our house. Even our littlest grandkids arent' asleep at that time of day. You might hope that she doesn't have any more kids. Could she be arrested for indecent exposure by parading in her skimpy nightie? Better yet, take a picture and give it to her husband! lol


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## newbiewoodworker (Aug 29, 2010)

I agree with River: At some point, she will have to understand: Shes the one that had the child not you… If she is concerned about the noise, then she can KINDLY ask you, to possibly close the door, and if that is not enough, offer to pay atleast a good portion of the cost of insulating it fully(I say partially, because it would make it more comfortable for you in the winter months, so I dont see, if you are finanacially capable, why you couldnt chip in a little green.)

Other wise, I would look up the local laws. And find out the decibel max. I would then call the local 5-o, and ask them to come perform a sound metering. If you pass, then thats her issue. If you don't, then I am sure they would kindly offer you a few pieces of advice, as to what you can do to reduce the noise. Chances are, if you asked politely, then they would be willing to do it one day for you. Since often Patrol Cars carry the sound metre, and surely one patrols your sector of town.

I have a 6 year old that lives in the house. He complains if the TV is on in the next room. When I am down stairs, mind you beneath both of our BEDROOMS, he rarely has an issue. Occasionally I have to stop until he FALLS ASLEEP, but he never(knock on wood) awakes.


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

It would be better if the original poster didn't have to learn that the LAW isn't really the only possible standard.

If it escalates to the point where the neighbor files a Private Nuisance lawsuit (civil, not criminal), you could lose.

Why take it that far ?

To prove some point-in this case … whatever point rivergirl thinks must be made ?

I wouldn't. I don't see the advantage.

Your mileage may vary.


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## tierraverde (Dec 1, 2009)

A lot of discussion here.
Bottom line is close the doors and windows when you have a noisy operation and I bet the problem will be solved.
In fact, have a friend plane a board while you are outside with the door open, and again with everything closed up. I would bet you will see the problem solved.


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## SignWave (Feb 2, 2010)

The story that I see being told here sounds like neighbors working together to me. The OP was using his loudest tool, and it woke a neighbor's baby. The neighbor took the time to come over and express her concern and ask for a compromise. The OP is asking for help coming up with a response, including possibly working at a different time. I don't see either person as having done anything wrong, but rather that they have competing needs that they're trying to work out.

Why not have two neighbors come up with a plan that works for both, without bringing all the extra baggage into it?

To darrenjttu, my advise is to say something like this:

"Yeah, that tool I was using sure is loud, but I didn't realize that it would be loud enough to wake up your baby, and I hoped that the time I was using it would be appropriate. But I understand that for a small child and their parents, sleep is a big deal, so I'd like to work with you on this. At the same time, I do have this work to do, and this tool is a big part of what needs to get done. Can you think of anything that might work better, so that I can still use my tool, but it won't cause issues with your baby sleeping? I can try to do what I can to keep the noise down as much as I can, or perhaps we can arrange a time so that I am not working while your baby is sleeping…"

Maybe I'm wrong, but I don't see any reason at this point why you can't find a solution that works for both of you.


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## richgreer (Dec 25, 2009)

I don't know this for a fact, but I assume that there is no zoning law or homeowners association agreement that limits your right to make noise. If that is the case, the lady has no way to compel you to limit your noise level.

Nonetheless, I would put forth a sincere good faith effort to reach an agreement with her regarding what time of the day it would be okay make some extra noise. I would try to cooperate with her.

If she is uncooperative, then "the heck with her".


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## zonkers (Aug 18, 2010)

I love traupmann's story. I guess it's funny if it's not you. I make as little noise as possible. And I always make sure all doors and windows are closed. And no neighbors are allowed near my shop. All very secret spy like. This way they don't know what I got in there so they never ask to borrow it! Done that, been there, never again.


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## Rick Dennington (Aug 27, 2009)

I agree wholeheartly with rivergirl… I'd tell the woman to piss-off and mind her own business, not yours…
I hate people like that who try to threaten you with crap…..I'd pay her no mind and carry on smartly with what I was doing…..How riduculious !! I think it is more about disturbing her than disturbing the cribrat…


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## beckerswoodworks (Dec 26, 2009)

I would certainly not tell her to piss off. That's not going to help the situation and she doesn't deserve to be talked to that way. darrenjttu didn't say anything about her being rude or threatening.

I'm all for working with the neighbors but this is a case where I simply have no room for negotiation. I have a very small window inbetween getting home from work and it being too late to make noise. My choice is plane at that time or not at all. So if someone complained I would apologize and continue before their complaint became valid.


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

One of my friends told me about a woman in their home owners assn who complained about kids playing basketball on the driveway. She thought they should move it to the back yard. Maybe she should be thankful they are playing basketball rather than dreaming up stuff to cause trouble in the neighborhood. I'll bet there would be BIG TROUBLE with a planer and table saw next door!! :-((


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## craftsman on the lake (Dec 27, 2008)

Okay this is going to sound strange but it works. It's not convenient but it works. I needed to quiet my dewalt 734 planer for a short while once awhile back. I turned a cardboard box over it and cut sections out at the infeed/outfeed tables. I had to take the box off to continually adjust the thickness level as I put wood through it but it muffled the thing a lot.


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## rivergirl (Aug 18, 2010)

craftsman, interesting thought- but I couldn't help thinking.. okay- so I have to cut my fingers off in order to ensure that the baby keeps sleeping. LOL Beener - California common law does not play out too well here in good old rural PA- god guns guts and glory.. and dont forget git off my land, and mind yer own damn buisness.  I don't believe a private nuisance suit would carry- because- babies sleep at random intervals. So how is the hobby builder to know when that is? And if he does shut the garage door etc. etc. he has behaved in a neighborly fashion. So, how could his using his equipment in his own home, during daylight hours be a nuisance? Unless of course he happens to live in a gated community with a full list of restrictive covenants. In that case okay- he will have to go and rent a garage in the hills of Pennsylvania or someplace equivalent. Just because a neighbor bitches and just because they have a child- does not mean the wood guy has to hide his candle under a bushel- or cardboard box as it may be. What happens when the kid decides to nap at 3 or 2 or 10 AM? The whole premise is ludicrous. Shut the garage door and grind away as needed to build a nice project. And you know what? I would build a giant trellis- and put it between the yards and grow some god awful perennial vine all over it. Tell her is a "green" sound proofing system- just trying to help the baby nap… you know…. a thoughtful gift from a thoughtful neighbor.


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## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

You know, the most irritating sound to me is a lawn mower or a weed eater. Every time I turn around I hear a lawn mower or a weed eater. I'm sitting on my patio in the evening enjoying the birds and the bees and the chipmunks and the squirrels while enjoying a good cigar and a nice cold beer and somebody cranks up a loud lawn mower or a weed eater. Do I go birserk over it? What is the difference? A lawn mower goes on and on until the grass is cut and some people seem to be in love with their weed eaters. And what about the blowers?
Some people seem not to be satisfied with their blower job unless they have moved every last blade of grass or fallen leaf from here to there at least twice and back again to the same place where it was before they cranked the beast up in the first place . I sure am glad that my hobby ain't running any of those noisy contraptions. *You know, if Americans keep insisting on being protected from every little nuisance or danger there is there simply is not going to be any freedom at all left for anybody.* I mean how long is somebody in a home shop going to run a planer anyways?


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

So … *helluvawreck* ....

Are you invoking the notion that two wrongs DO make a right ?


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## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

Neil, I don't believe I said anything about any wrong at all. Did I say somebody was wrong in cutting their grass, whacking their weeds, blowing blades of grass from here to kingdom come? I don't think that I said that at all. I believe that I said quite the opposite. I make allowances for my neighbors and I expect them to do the same for me. It's a pretty simple concept really. Even though it is irritating to me I deal with it by allowing them to make their noise and I would appreciate them allowing me to make mine. How in the world do you get from my post that I believe in "the notion that two wrongs DO make a right ?"

This is the second time you have done this to me on Lumberjocks.

"If a man does not keep pace with his companions then perhaps he hears the beat of a different drummer. So let him step to the music that he hears however measured or far away."

Perhaps someday I will be able to live up to your expectations. It's really not a big deal to me one way or the other.

Take care and have a nice day, Neil.


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

Will do.

Thanks.

You do the same


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## AaronK (Nov 30, 2008)

there have been a couple other threads about how planers are insanely loud. I tend to be a little more on the reserved side, so I limit my planer usage to midday (5PM counts) but definitely with the doors shut. those things just scream too much for anything else. Maybe on a hot summer day when everyone is outside and being noisy anyway, but that really depends on the neighborhood. For any place I've ever lived I'd muffle the planer noise as much as possible.

the only thing worse than a planer is a gas powered weed whacker ;-)


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

Taken from the 2/95 issue of FWW-article called "Taming Woodworking Noise:"

How loud are woodworking machines:

Machine: Sound intensity at ear level: Sound intensity at ear drum:

Nail gun (6d, 2" finish nail): 104dB 110dB
Chop saw: 102dB 108dB
Router: 104dB 107dB
15" planer: 96dB 105dB
10" tablesaw: 95dB 103dB
Palm Sander (1/4 sheet): 96dB 103dB
Panel Cutter: 95dB 102dB
Dust Collector: 93dB 99dB
Bandsaw: 92dB 98dB
Shop Vacuum: 90dB 97dB
6" jointer: 80dB 90dB

This only speaks to quantity of noise-not quality.

In other words, certain frequencies carry farther, and are generally considered more 'irritating.' It would surely have been interesting if they'd measured the noise at-say-25' away from the source. The article, though, was much more focused on hearing damage TO the machine user than … say … impact on neighbors.

But this does give a good relative indicator of which machines are the noisiest.

Cheers !


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## DaleM (Feb 18, 2009)

Nbeener, I know you are just taking this from FWW, but some of those seem to be in the wrong order. I believe my planer is louder than my routers, with most bits anyway, and definitely louder than my SCMS/chop saw. My bandsaw would be at the bottom of the list, way quieter than my jointer or shop vac. I'm guessing it depends on the blades and wood. Anyway, I'm fortunate I could use my basement as my shop, rather than my garage. I have insulation over the few small windows that are in the basement so most of the noise is contained. The insulation really helps as some have already mentioned.


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## 280305 (Sep 28, 2008)

I imagine that the 15" planer measured in that list from "Taming Woodworking Noise" is a floor model with an induction motor. The real screamers are the benchtop models with universal motors, like the DW735 that is the subject of this thread. The noise output of that type of planer lies just slightly below that of a space shuttle launch.


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## NBeener (Sep 16, 2009)

Yeah. Absolutely. There are a BILLION variables that they don't tell us.

I'll look at the article tomorrow, but … clearly … this is a "For What It's Worth" chart.

And I'm with you: I chose the basement (with NO electricity) over the garage (where I paid for TONS of outlets), largely to be more considerate of my neighbors.

My Ridgid R4330 (planer) IS the tool that makes ME reach for my earmuffs, when I use it-much more so than my jointer, or router.

The other thing is length of use. When I'm at it with the planer, the jointer, or the router, I'm at it for a while.

For ME … not so with the chop saw or the table saw.

Even the nailer is more intermittent.

I live in REALLY close proximity to my neighbors. I felt it important to be mindful of my impact on them.


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## cranbrook2 (May 28, 2006)

I set my neighbour straight about 6 months ago and never heard a word from them since )


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## grizzman (May 10, 2009)

im sorry there seems to be so much trouble with folks just living…doing there thing…whatever it is…i do agree that folks should be considerate about what there doing and if they have close neighbors who might have an issue…im fortunate as i live on 82 acres of land…no one around me..i can run what i want when i want..with no concern to anyone else…as i said im fortunate…i would hope the people would just be considerate of the situation, and be a good neighbor..be kind and considerate..do what you can to be a good person…there are folks who might try to be over bearing and go over board…those situations have to be dealt with on a case by case…over all…just try to get along with who you live with…be considerate to there situation…if i knew my next door neighbor was really sick…going through cancer and chemo…i would do what i could to help him or her … as patrick swazy said in a move…''BE NICE''... until i tell you to not be nice.


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## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

I'm one of the quietest neighbors in my neighborhood. No brag - just fact. It's a noisy world - it's gonna get a whole lot noisier. We might as well get use to noise. It's here to stay.


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## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

That is good, interesting info Neil. Obviously a router or planer is more irritating that a table saw or vacuum which is worse than a nail gun even though they are all in the same db range. Some days it sure is nice to turn the hearing aids off and ignore it )


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## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

Topmax, I've noticed that I'm starting to lose my hearing. What a blessing that will be at times. ;-)


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## Wfarm (Oct 19, 2010)

5 evening time good for work she need quiet you close door still working she go home and stop saying


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## rivergirl (Aug 18, 2010)

Beener- I don't think it was necessary to jump on helluva like that. I don't know where you got the idea that he was inferring that grass mowing was "wrong" etc. etc. Anyway- it is nice that you are comfortable in your basement working. That's just terrific. But you know what? I don't want to work in a dark basement all day long and I will work in the yard and garage and I have the right to do that within normal day light hours. How ridiculous is it when everyone has to pander to others for every little thing? I will not do it. I have done my stint for humanity and guess what I learned.. people suck. And they younger they are- the more entitled they believe themselves to be. That is imply bull pucky and mowing grass /running a saw does not constitute "two wrongs." If that neighbor ladies mother would have seen her attitude she would either 1) be humiliated at her daughter's inability to cope with the realities of life or 2) wished she had taught her some limits and spanked her ass once in a while. People like her need to go home, get real , get a life- and stay out of mine.


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## tierraverde (Dec 1, 2009)

Keep it up people, and this forum will get shut down too.


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## CampD (Nov 8, 2008)

I need one of those little emicon's of the guy drinking beer and eating popcorn!!


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## rivergirl (Aug 18, 2010)

Yeah whatever Jim and Camp D.


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## CampD (Nov 8, 2008)




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## Viking (Aug 26, 2009)

Glad we live in the country with nearest neighbor over 1/2 mile away. We only keep the deer awake.


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## Ken90712 (Sep 2, 2009)

Boy this Topic is getting some interesting responses.

Its 7 am here in Southern California (been up since 5am) is it too early to go out in the shop and make noise?

Its raining here which we all know is rare!

I have found if your nice to your neighbors or fix stuff for them they understand more. Were all buddies on here and as I always joke around that I'm in the 17th step of anger management I'm better now LOL …If we all had the same opinion it would be boring! 
Have a great Sunday Lumberjocks!


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## boboswin (May 23, 2007)

Can you insulate your space?
I put in 6" rockwool insulation and you can't hear diddly outside from 10 feet away with the radio on full blast.


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## JasonWagner (Sep 10, 2009)

If you live close enough to your neighbor that it causes problems, then I guess it is a problem. I would shut my garage door to use the planer. Easy enough to open it back up when you're done that chore. Luckily I have my shop in the basement, but can't do much when my son is napping. Portable planers, miter saws and direct drive contractor table saws are the worst.

NBeener - two wrongs don't make a right but three lefts do!


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## 33706 (Mar 5, 2008)

I recall a buddy of mine who had a brand new baby AND a brand new 15" "enco" thickness planer; he could run the planer in the basement without waking up the baby EVER. * ChuckV* is spot-on, I got rid of all those screamers wherever there was a choice, er, motors, that is, not babies!


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## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

I don't have a planer in my home shop. If they cause all of this much racket I'm not sure that I want one either. After all, I wouldn't want to run off all of the wonderful animals that live in my yard.


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## popmandude (Feb 17, 2010)

One suggestion that has not been brought up yet. (unless I missed it)
I thought about this very subject before I got a planer. I decided to stay away from the new light weight (relatively speaking) aluminum and plastic noise makers, and got an old parks planer. I can run this planer in my 20×20 garage shop, and not use ear protection. At $300.00 it was half the price, an at 60 years old has already outlasted x2 any modern day lunchbox planer. I think the older stuff is more quiet because they are more heavy and solid built absorbing more of the vibration and noise.Reckon I am tryin to say there is always a way.

Good luck to all
Randy


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## tlr (Sep 27, 2010)

I think "mom" needed the rest, if I remember correctly it is 'Mom" who needs as much sleep as the baby. Take it easy and you are doing the right thing by being considerate.
Remember this too, shall pass…


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## darrenjttu (Dec 7, 2009)

Ok so I ran the planer tonight at 6:30 with the garage door closed. She didnt complain. Yet… I guess it was not the babies naptime.


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## rivergirl (Aug 18, 2010)

Darren-  Fingers crossed.


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## StumpyNubs (Sep 25, 2010)

Make your neighbor a nice cutting board and tell her to shut her pie hole,


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## MsDebbieP (Jan 4, 2007)

I hope all goes well and that you have found a way for everyone to feel respected and that it is a win/win situation.


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## Dennisgrosen (Nov 14, 2009)

have you made a deal with her yet or at least talk with her so she also understand your situation

Dennis


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## ChuckC (May 13, 2010)

We obviously have no obligation to our neighbors when it comes to operating our tools during daytime hours. We also don't have an obligation to give up our seat on the subway for the guy with crutches or hold the door open for the person carrying a heavy box. We do, however, do these things because it's simply the right thing to do. It would really be a shame if everyone lived for themselves and only did what made their life easier and not the person next to them.

I'm not suggesting that we avoid our tools or lay out money to insulate our shop either. If the solution was to simply shut the door when you use the planer then so be it, shut the door. There's almost always a common ground, we just have to find it.


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