# Looking to buy a Jack Plane - Should I get a No 5 or 5-1/2



## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

I'm looking to get a jack plane to add to my meager plane collection. I'd be curious to hear from folks whether their preferred size is a #5 or #5-1/2 and why. I find that currently, when I want to use a hand plane, I am looking to:

flattening a panel glue-up
knock down high-spots on shorter boards in preparation for a surface planer
jointing the edge of short boards

Eventually, I plan on embarking on a workbench build to make hand tools a bigger part of my woodworking journey. For that build, I would like to be able to use a hand planes for flattening the top. For additional context:

I've ruled out getting a low angle 62, as I anticipate eventually adding other bench planes to my collection. Looking to upgrade my Groz #4 with a #4 or #4-1/2, and adding a #7 or #8 jointer plane.
I'm keeping my options open for antique or new. Currently leaning towards new, and I have thus far liked the feel of the Bedrock-based planes (Lie Nielson, WoodRiver V3).


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## knotscott (Feb 27, 2009)

It's going to be a matter of opinion, but I really like my 5-1/2.


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## JayT (May 6, 2012)

5 or 5-1/2 depends on what I am doing. My #5 is set up with an aggressive camber for taking down high spots in a hurry or cleaning off rough sawn. Basically, it replaces a scrub plane. A 5-1/2, with a wider iron, really can't be can't be cambered quite as aggressively. I have a fore plane that gets used for similar purposes as the #5 jack, but in a different manner. My fore is a #6, but the same principles would apply to a 5-1/2 jack/fore plane. The fore plane takes a wider swath, but with a bit less camber, can't cut as deep as the narrower #5.

For larger panels and those where I don't want to remove much material, the #6 gets used. If I really need to take a lot of wood off quickly, the #5 works better because of how it is set up.

Biggest difference to me is that it takes a lot more effort to work the wider plane. I like the extra length of the larger plane and at times the extra mass is a benefit, but your arms and shoulders will definitely notice after a planing session.

When looking at your uses, my hesitation is that for knocking down high spots, I would use a pretty heavily cambered iron, while flattening glue ups would be less camber and for jointing, I use an iron with no camber at all. For those purposes, I have several planes each set up differently, but unless you are willing to buy two or three planes right now, compromises will have to be made.

If you had a #7 already, I would say get the #5. If all you have is the #4, then a 5-1/2 with a slight camber would give a lot more flexibility-it would take longer to knock down the high spots, but would work better for panels and jointing. Some people do like a bit of camber for jointing, so it will work, I just don't fall in that crowd. If you get a 5-1/2, you might find you don't need a #7 or 8. There are quite a few woodworkers (Paul Sellers would be one) that almost never use anything larger.

This is getting wordy, so my best recommendation would be to get a good 5-1/2 now and keep an eye out for a vintage #5. Those can be found frequently for less than $20 and a jack plane just doesn't need to be as fine tuned as a jointer or smoother, so there's no need to spend the money on a new #5 for rough work.


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## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

In my opinion, it depends on what you want to use it for, and how you want to use it. It sounds like you're not planning on using it for heavy dimensioning or anything like that.

I have an antique #5 set up with heavy camber and use it for hogging off a lot of wood. I like it for dimension and flatten boards, and to knock off corners quickly to make a chamfer.

I have my #5-1/2 set up as a smoother, and love it. I like the weight and size of it.

I'd say, if you're not planning on doing heavy stock removal, but just for those high spots and edge planing, I like the #5-1/2. Vintage or new, whatever is your preference.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Happen to have several #5s, each set up just a bit different from each other. From a "Hungry" cambered Scrub Jack down to a smoother style jack. And a few in between. All were vintage planes.

There IS a #5-1/2 and a #5-1/4 in the till as well









And the longest one being a #6. But the "Common #5 Jack plane can be set up to do a lot more than the others. Start with the #5, and work your way up and down from there.


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## rkober (Feb 15, 2012)

From the description of your intended work the #5 may be a little more "nibble" and adaptable. However either could work nicely for you.

If you're interested I have a Type 20 (late 60's) #5 that I got with an older plane that I wanted. It should make a great user plane and I'm just trying to $25 out of it (plus shipping maybe $13):









PM me if you're interested. Good luck.


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## simmo (Nov 23, 2008)

Hi whatever plane you get, get spare blades use one as a Jack ie curved and the others as jointers and smoother, a word of warning though planes don't like being lonely and silently make you buy more, I had this affliction but have weaned my self to only a No7 and a block plane,HTH
Chris


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## unbob (Mar 10, 2013)

It looks like Bandit has a 5 1/4 size squeezed in there. That is a must have for me-use it alot. Yep, you need all three in the #5s!


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

Well, weight is a factor if you're going to do a lot of
work with a jack plane. I get by fine with a couple
of old Bailey #5s, never had anything else. They
are among the most common planes to find at 
flea markets and so on and of course once you 
start acquiring iron planes, you'll find yourself
mysteriously drawn to flea markets and yard sales.


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## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

Good feedback from everyone so far. After tallying the recommendations, it looks like there is an interesting tally:

3x to start with a #5
3x to start with a #5-1/2
2x to call it a wash because I should just get both

I'm almost tempted to declare that I will buy both and make it a 3 way tie. But in all seriousness, I'd be curious to hear more feedback to determine any tie-breakers. Here is a summary of my take-aways from the advice given thus far.

Reasons for a #5: 

Cost - Plentiful antiques worth getting and restoring. Even moderate restoration will give me what I need for the flattening tool I am looking for.
Will likely start as a gateway tool leading to more planes with different blades setup.

Reasons for a #5-1/2

Companion to a #4 - Jay and Mosquito gave very compelling arguments that a #5-1/2 may be a better companion to a #4. 
Short jointer - Depending on my projects and use, it may be a better gap fill, and I may not find myself needing a #7 or #8.


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## Mosquito (Feb 15, 2012)

I agree with reason 2 under #5-1/2. I very rarely use my #7/8's anymore. I tend to generally make smaller sized projects, though.

Reason 1, though, I actually use the #5-1/2 instead of my #4 in most cases. If I do use a smoothing plane (#4, or #4-1/2), it's typically for a slightly heavier cut to go from the jack to smoother a little faster than what the #5-1/2 will do. Then I follow up with the #5-1/2, which I usually have set up for a very fine cut.

Under reasons for a #5, I agree with both  They're cheap, and don't have to be perfectly tuned up to work, or even razor sharp. I've never flattened the sole on any of my #5's, and … I'd be lying if I said I've sharpened my main user #5 yet this year…


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

If its for a Jack, I'd suggest the #5. They are cheaper, easier to find replacement blades (or anything for that matter) and they are MUCH easier to find.

With that said, if you walk into an antique store and a #5 1/2 is sitting there for $15, I'd suggest taking it home.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

I'm a #5 vote. It's likely been 18 months or more since I used my #5 1/2. For me, it's too long to be a smoother (a #4 1/2 is ideal for larger panels) and clumsy as a jointer (I prefer the #8). But to each his own. Many like the #5 1/2, I just never made a connection to mine.


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## Lsmart (Jan 1, 2012)

What about a low angle jack with multiple blades? lee valley offers 25, 38 and 50 degrees and you can grind any angle you want and they have a toothed blade for figured wood, plus adjustable mouth opening. Definitely not the cheap option I know but it is super versatile. I have the Veritas with all three blades and I love it, works for smoothing, flattening and jointing + lots of mass and low angle for shooting.

Don't get me wrong I also have a No 4 (which I use a lot) and a No 7 (which I use less but really appreciate when I have to) but the feel and versatility of my LAJ have me reaching for it almost as much as my block plane.


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## rad457 (Jun 15, 2013)

Don't use the big hand planes very much mostly work with Krenov style wood planes with Hock Irons and my trusty Stanely 60 1/2 and a LN 102. I do have a Stanely 3, 4, 5 1/4 and a 6. I have replaced all the blades with LV PMV 11 and could not believe the difference.


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## OSU55 (Dec 14, 2012)

Don't use my 5 1/2 that much. My 4 1/2's are much better smoothers, and the #5 gets use on rougher lumber because it has a narrower blade. Everyone should have a #4 - there's always a use for it, like knocking down high spots for a planer and jointing short boards, and about anything else, just check Paul Seller's website. A #7 is a must have for jointing and flattening panel glue ups, and a 4 1/2 is the best bevel down smoother. Forego the 5 1/2 and get a #7. Used, whatever vintage you can find. There really isn't a reason to buy a new high dollar Bailey style bench plane. OEM Stanley blades and breakers work just fine when you learn how to tune and sharpen. High cutting angles for unruly grain is where the higher $ planes come in.

When you're ready to buy new, get a Veritas BU LAJ - shooting plane, jointer, panel flattener, big smoother all in one with the right blade assortment.

I have a 1/2 dozen wood body planes. They're fun to mess with and I enjoy them, but if I had to choose I'd burn them in a minute and keep my metal planes. Woodies are much more tempermental.


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## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

I can see lots of good arguments both ways, but sounds like more folks have voted for the #5 to tip the scales.

I'm going to keep my eye out for a vintage and replacement blade, and be ready to pull the trigger whenever I see one that seems worth getting. I am not a big fan of restoration work, and in the case of a #5 for roughing work, I am OK with moderate tuning if the plane body and totes are in good shape, especially since I don't anticipate much in the way of sole flattening. I can get a new WoodRiver V3 for close to the same price (for the plane + blade), I'm inclined to fore-go the extra setup work and go with one of those.

As for bevel up planes, since I plan on growing my collection of bevel down planes, and I am not a heavy hand tool user yet, I've decided it isn't a good direction to pursue at this time.


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## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

> I am not a big fan of restoration work, and in the case of a #5 for roughing work, I am OK with moderate tuning if the plane body and totes are in good shape, especially since I don't anticipate much in the way of sole flattening. I can get a new WoodRiver V3 for close to the same price (for the plane + blade), I'm inclined to fore-go the extra setup work and go with one of those.
> 
> - paxorion


Finally catching up to old Wood Talk podcasts, and episode 206 and 207 touches on the topic of vintage vs. new, particularly for those that don't enjoy refurbishing. I did some quick math on the price aspect, and if I put a price tag on my time to refurbish, it certainly sways me away from a vintage hunt. But that's just me.


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## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

You're reasons for getting a #5 1/2 are the same as mine. My #4 smoother is just too small for some tasks and either a #5 1/2 or jointer is on my list next.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

One other point about #5 Jack planes, vintage style.

Go into a Home Depot, pick up a few 2" wide plane irons. They are a little expensive, at ~$3 each. Flatten the backs, add however much or little camber you want. Remember, just get the irons there, do NOT get any planes from Buck Brothers. The irons are very good, even if they are from Buck Brothers. haven't tried the block plane irons there, though.

I use the 5-1/2 and the DE6c as small jointers. Irons are the same width, just 3" difference in length. I do use a all wood 22" Try plane, and a 24" long Stanley #31 Jointer plane. These two are the jointers in the shop.

Had a Wood River #4 V3 for about a year…..and went back to the vintage #4s, rather the Millers Falls #9s. Same size as a #4.

One could just start with the #5 Jack/Fore plane, then work their way up, or down from there.

#5: 14" long, has a 2" wide iron ( same as a #4)
#5-1/2: 15" long. Most have a 2-3/8" wide iron. Older ones have a 2-1/4" one. 
#5-1/4: 11" long, has a 1-3/4" wide iron. Light, nibble, nothing more than a LONG #3. Also the more expensive of these three planes.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

> I am not a big fan of restoration work, and in the case of a #5 for roughing work, I am OK with moderate tuning if the plane body and totes are in good shape, especially since I don t anticipate much in the way of sole flattening. I can get a new WoodRiver V3 for close to the same price (for the plane + blade), I m inclined to fore-go the extra setup work and go with one of those.
> 
> - paxorion
> 
> ...


There is something in between.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

There are vast numbers of planes out there needing little more than fettling and sharpening to work. And work bery well.


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## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

> I am not a big fan of restoration work, and in the case of a #5 for roughing work, I am OK with moderate tuning if the plane body and totes are in good shape, especially since I don t anticipate much in the way of sole flattening. I can get a new WoodRiver V3 for close to the same price (for the plane + blade), I m inclined to fore-go the extra setup work and go with one of those.
> 
> - paxorion
> 
> ...


I'm a bit confused. What is in between? Finding a refurbished antique to buy?


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

> I m a bit confused. What is in between? Finding a refurbished antique to buy?
> 
> - paxorion


Sure. Half the price or less, and they should work just as well as an LN or Veritas.










I'd suggest find an old rusty relic and bringing it back to life, but if its just not your thing, find somebody (and there are several folks here who do it) who enjoy it. Its like taking in a stray dog. They just don't get any more loyal.


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## OSU55 (Dec 14, 2012)

Restoration vs tuning - If you're thinking full restoration, i.e. repainting and make everything look just right, yeah, that can be time consuming. Tuning up a plane is less, and you will do a little tuning on a new premium plane - I spend an hour or two deburring machined edges and cleaning off the oil. Learning how to tune a vintage (or new) Stanley provides the knowledge to troubleshoot issues with a new or vintage plane in the future. If I put a price tag on my time woodworking and doing other things in my shop, I'd stop woodworking and working in my shop. I enjoy my time at it, and that is the payment. It's a hobby, not a job, for me. I don't put a price tag on my time out on the water fly fishing, or strafing corners on my motorcycles, either.


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## CL810 (Mar 21, 2010)




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## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

One of my Craigslist alerts turned up this posting for a restored Trustworthy jack plane for $25. Any thoughts on this plane?

I couldn't figure out anything about the brand "Trustworthy" besides a post a while back that seem to imply that Sargent made this line of planes. From the looks of the photo, there's likely some pitting on the sole, but shouldn't be an issue for a jack plane. I can't help but hope that as a jack plane, this guy might very well be ready to use after some honing of the blade.

I grabbed a few pictures of the Craigslist post in case the listing disappears:


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Looks like a decent enough Jack plane

Might a little over-priced, but not too bad.


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## richardwootton (Jan 17, 2013)

Paxorion, 
I'm wrapping up a restore on a nice earlier type #5, I'd probably let it go for a decent price.


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## paxorion (Oct 19, 2012)

> Looks like a decent enough Jack plane
> 
> Might a little over-priced, but not too bad.
> 
> - bandit571


What might be a fair price for it?



> Paxorion,
> I m wrapping up a restore on a nice earlier type #5, I d probably let it go for a decent price.
> 
> - richardwootton


I may circle back with you if nothing pans out this weekend with either this one or at The Woodworking Show.


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## donwilwol (May 16, 2011)

That is a late Sargent made jack. It will be a decent user. I agree with Bandit, $25 is on the high side of retail, but not outrageous.


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