# Picture Rail



## tyskkvinna (Mar 23, 2010)

I am going to be installing some picture rail in a house-a fair amount of it, let's say six rooms. I've looked up the picture rail online and it is fairly expensive-average price I found was $15/8' length… and it is SPF. I would prefer a hardwood, maybe even a kind of cool looking hardwood…

Having trouble finding the appropriate router bits for such a thing. Any suggestions? I don't mind spending the cash to get a nice one (or nice set, I assume it will be a multi-pass operation) because I think I will be able to use the bits for other things later, as well.


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## MT_Stringer (Jul 21, 2009)

Do you mean chair rail?


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## chewbuddy13 (May 28, 2009)

Try looking for multi-profile bits, they give you many options for different mouldings. 
http://www.woodworkersjournal.com/Main/Articles/Making_the_Most_of_Your_Router_Bits_Multi_Profile_5544.aspx


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## Alexandre (May 26, 2012)

How about a Wood Master?
Spend about $3000 and some really good knives, that tool would be your planer, drum sander, molder and gang rip saw?


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## Alexandre (May 26, 2012)

Or, just get a router bit(s) custom made for you….


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## tyskkvinna (Mar 23, 2010)

No, I mean picture rail-the thing you hang at the top of the room that you will then hang picture frames from. I intend to use it as such, so it will need to actually hold (a little) weight.

If I don't find anything that will work I fully intend to throw the rough cut wood in my CNC sheet router and do something crazy.  but that will take a lot of time and is gross overkill.


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## DS (Oct 10, 2011)

Check with a local molding house. Even if your profile is not standard, if you have enough lineal feet, they will charge only a nominal knife setup fee.


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## ITnerd (Apr 14, 2011)

Lis, this is a bit out of my day to day, but I think most of those larger profiles would fall under the molder/shaper head category. That said, if you were willing to piece together a couple of bits to get a cool end shape, here's a couple of sets I've found.

If you wanted a deep cove as part of it, I'd probably recommend using this type of setup with your table saw, or cheating Brian Havens style. This would save you from making 4 gazillion passes on your router table.

I recall reading somewhere that you have some very cool equipment in your shop - if you have a tilting router table, and are willing to grind off some bearing heads from cheaper bits, check out what Matthias Wandel did.

Best of luck, I've enjoyed all your project postings so far, please let us know how it turns out.


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## cabmaker (Sep 16, 2010)

Sounds a little pricey for picture rail in a paint grade. I can get it for approx. 1.00 lf here (north texas). Pretty easy to run though. Three cutters will do it. 3/4 bd., 3/4 flute and panel raiser would be the likely combo to get a profile your after


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## dkirtley (Mar 11, 2010)

Not knowing what is available to you locally, I would guess you are not looking in the right type of place. I would go for a molding shop that also does custom staircases. There are some cool staircase banister bases that you could probably use for picture rail. Are you looking for the profile that has the big bead on top for the clips? That might be a bit harder since it is a specialty profile. You could also take a couple passes with a roundover bit on a nice piece of crown molding.


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## Sawkerf (Dec 31, 2009)

How ornate do you want the rail to be? They aren't commonly used around here, but those that I've seen were pretty simple. Pieces of flat stock - sometimes with an edge detail. People I've talked to say that the picture rail should be unobrusive so it doesn't clash with an ornate picture frame.

You can make some pretty neat profiles with just a table saw and a router.


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## longgone (May 5, 2009)

I put picture hanging moulding all throughout my house and paid about 55 cents a linear foot for it in cypress. Iit is quite common here in Louisiana in the houses with taller ceilings. I bought it at a local lumberyard and they had lengths up to 16 ft.


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## tyskkvinna (Mar 23, 2010)

The rest of the house has very ornate woodworking details so I want to go a little fancy. Very open to what, though.

David - yes, precisely.

I will look into these suggestions!


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

Thanks Lis, I learn something new everyday.

A picture rail is a type of molding that runs horizontally across the walls of a room, level with the top of the door frame. The rail provides a way to hang pictures instantly, and without putting holes in the walls. The hanging itself it accomplished by an accessory called a "picture rail hook," usually made of metal, which has an arm that hangs over the top of the rail. A second arm extends down in front of the rail to provide a hook to hang the picture.Originating in the 15th century, picture rails peaked in popularity in the late 19th century, when it was fashionable to have rooms full of hanging pictures and knick-knacks. Oftentimes during this period, the picture rail would be nearly invisible, buried beneath a solid line of portraits and paintings lining the walls. In the 1990s, a resurgence of interest in period decorating brought the product back into the decorating magazines. In modern homes, it is usually used as a decorative accent to the crown molding and chair rail rather than as a functional fixture.


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## Gary (Jul 24, 2006)

Lis,
My wife wanted picture rail in our bedroom so I made it out of Black Walnut to match the other work I was doing.
Some of the project is documented here: http://lumberjocks.com/projects/20673
I bought some router bits and it went pretty quickly.
If you need more details or want to discuss it, let me know.


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## tyskkvinna (Mar 23, 2010)

Gary - I actually found your project while I researched before making a post. Yours made me think that perhaps Walnut would be a good idea! 

DKV - My house has pretty tall ceilings (13' I think) so the rails are up at the top, not by the door. This means that they can be bigger and make sense, visually. I think little tiny rails would look out of place. Also, since the house is old, it won't be just for looks. Not interested in plowing through that plaster and lathe just to hang a couple of pictures….


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## DKV (Jul 18, 2011)

Gary, I just looked at your project pictures and realized that I have seen a lot of that molding in old victorian style homes. I just didn't know what it was for. I thought it was strictly decorative and I'm guessing most of the people living in the homes think that way also. I haven't seen any with pictures hanging from them. Maybe I don't hang with the right crowd. BTW, I like the contrast between the walls and the walnut.


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## Oldelm (Jun 11, 2012)

A few years ago I saw a picture rail that I thought was great looking. It was about 2" high with a rope carving on the top hanging bead and a cove under the bead. The rope section was gold leaf and the cove was stained dark. It gave the appearance that the rope was laying on top of the cove. Your Cnc could most probably run that rope easily.


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## lumberjoe (Mar 30, 2012)

Are you good with metal work? The house I grew up in had picture rails. There was molded trim on top, then some ornate copper on the piece under it, but you could see the wood through the patterns (think scroll sawn). It was beautiful, especially with the patina


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## Sawkerf (Dec 31, 2009)

In the days of plaster walls, picture rails were a great way to hang things without the hassle of making hard to patch holes in plaster. I've seen some in San Francisco Victorians that were put up before the plaster. Sometimes they were painted to match the walls and sometimes they had an accent color. Some were very ornate and detailed and others were very simple.

They went out of fashion when drywall came along and patching nail holes was much easier.


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

All it need is a rabbet on one back edge for the picture hooks.

As a practical matter the hooks can be made in any shape.
They are just bent metal widgets.

If your clients want to use a commercially available hook,
get the hook and design the moulding around the hook 
geometry.


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## BertFlores58 (May 26, 2010)

Lis,
Hope this will give you an idea… I made a picture frame for the 4 season whose thickness is 5/8. I made top and bottom rails with slot (groove) to slide the pictures in it on what ever position I like. A back vertical support reinforced it. These are all detachable and I use only screw. I also put a stand that is adjustable so that it will stand on the top of our bar… Not posted as project because I am still looking for the right stain. The wood is too brown and I am planning to make it white to have contrast with the 4 seasons chinese marquetry of mother pearl. Please look in the following pictures:




























If you plan to have single rail on top then make a through rail which you can have rollers or slides on the upper part… just like a curtain rail..

Hope it will add to your solution.


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## cutworm (Oct 2, 2010)

http://www.amanatool.com/articles/picture-rail-moldings.html


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## Jim Jakosh (Nov 24, 2009)

Liz. do you have a picture of the cross section? If so, it did not come through on my end. You can make a lot of moldings with 3 or4 router bits and a good clamping process so they don't wander the least bit through the router. Some of the milled stock is not straight and you don want it wandering into and away from the cutter. Can you send me a picture of the cross section?
thanks, Jim

ps. I buy all my router bits from MLCS. They have good prices and they cut good for me!


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## tyskkvinna (Mar 23, 2010)

Jim-no? I don't have pictures of anything?


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## oldnovice (Mar 7, 2009)

If you want an "off of the wall" (no pun intended) solution, take a look at some of the options.

Picture rails

I have no idea what they cost but at my last job they told us not to hang anything on our cube walls but use these rails instead … hey they were paying for them, why not.


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## mtenterprises (Jan 10, 2011)

Cutworm has it that's what you want to do. Just total up those bit prices and get working.
MIKE


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## dhazelton (Feb 11, 2012)

When I went looking for it only one lumber yard in the county had it, only one profile in poplar at a dollar a foot. Then I couldn't find any place that sold picture rail hooks! I think if you want something special you will have to mill it yourself like everyone has suggested. If you want nice hooks you'll have to go online probably.

I'm renovating a bedroom in my house and added a closet, so I needed some fluted door casing and turned corner blocks. The home center had expensive stain grade material or a cheaper kit shrink wrapped. I bought the cheaper kit as it will be painted. First piece I started to cut to length and I see melting plastic - the kit was styrene. NO WHERE on the package did it say 'This is plastic crap - don't buy me.' I didn't want to go back to the Depot so I used it. Now I have to figure out how I will mortise in the antique surface mount lockset I wanted to use.


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## DS (Oct 10, 2011)

A quick check of molding suppliers puts the cost of various picture rails, (simple to fancy), between $0.69/foot and $1.25 per foot in Poplar. All of these options seem to cost less than your quoted online source.

Find a molding house in your area and have them make it for you. They may stock a few standard profiles, but can run in whatever profile and wood that you want.


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## PRGDesigns (Jan 25, 2012)

Know anybody with a W&H molder/planer? If not, depending on how many feet of molding you will be using, it might pay for itself along with a custom knife set. You might also get future work with it. I use mine to run custom crown molding because I couldn't stand the random stuff they sold at the box stores. Much more efficient than your CNC. Just a thought.


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## tyskkvinna (Mar 23, 2010)

That molder/planer is pretty sexy. Too bad this is for my house and I can't justify the price for the job…

I think I have settled on something that will work for me. My router can handle the round-over part that the picture hook actually hangs on. So I think I am going to run that and then throw them in the CNC and do some kind of fancy things to it. Should go pretty fast. The slowest part on it would be the round-over because I would have to flip it a couple of times.

Also-I have not been too happy with the hooks I can find online for such a thing so I'm just going to make them. In my metal shop, this is trivial.


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## oldnovice (Mar 7, 2009)

*I would like to see the results of the CNC made rails … maybe some I process photos too!*


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## D_Allen (Oct 11, 2010)

Perhaps this is what you are looking for.
This image is from a seller on Etsy.
http://www.etsy.com/listing/98599439/poplar-wood-picture-rail-moulding-hooks


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## PRGDesigns (Jan 25, 2012)

FYI - I found the W&H molding knife for the picture rail in D_Allen's post. No price listed, but it looks like a standard knife.


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## D_Allen (Oct 11, 2010)

I would think it would take at least 2 passes, possibly 3 depending on the machinery.
Probably why it is not cheap.


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## PRGDesigns (Jan 25, 2012)

I would guess you would also need an inverse knife to cut a bed for the molding to ride on after the first pass to support the rounded edge. Doubles the price of the knives.


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