# Hide Glue for Beginners



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

*Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*

When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.

Here is what I came up with.

*Disclaimer*: I'm not a jig person so my jigs are usually utilitarian and often "throw away".

*This photo shows* the parts disassembled. Dimensions are irrelevant and I didn't take any so even I don't know them.









*Here the base piece* has been turned right side up. The groove is for the pin in the top part. The cutouts at the apex are to insure that no glue contacts the jig.










*Assemble the top part* onto the bolt and adjust so that the spaces on the sides fit your stock width. Then slide the pieces of your box together until they match perfectly.










*Now remove one piece *without moving the other. Coat the end with hot hide glue….Oh yes, this is a commercial for hide glue, sorry. But please bear with me.










*Slide the piece back* in and as the jig does most of the work, simply squeeze the top of the joint for about 15 seconds or so.










*This is the joint* removed from the jig about 30 to 45 seconds after the glue was applied. It's already strong enough to hold together.










*A minute later* it is strong enough to have it's spline grooves cut.


























*A little more hide glue* on the splines and slip them into place.










*In the time it takes *to walk over to the band saw the splines are glued well enough to trim off.










*The glue is easy * to rub off with your finger. It will ball up like rubber cement. You can throw it back in the pot if it's not too contaminated with sawdust. Then you can sand the joint and you're done. The elapsed time between this photo and the one where the pieces were dry fitted is under five minutes and with the splines now in place the piece is strong enough to continue to handle and work with.










*Of course in real life* it is not necessary to get things done this quickly. Pieces can sit while others are fitted and glued, but this is how fast it can be done.

This joint is perfectly square, both vertically and horizontally, despite the fact that if you look closely, my "hot off the miter saw" cut was not.

That's it 
I made a jig. Who would have thought.

Thanks

Comments, questions, critiques are always welcome.

Paul


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## degoose (Mar 20, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Very simple … cool idea….


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## LittlePaw (Dec 21, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


It's so good i'm planning to use it. Hope you don't mind.


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## gfadvm (Jan 13, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


This I can understand! Nice jig Paul.


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## SPalm (Oct 9, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Sweet.

But you have to include the time to heat up the glue. Which I have no idea how long it takes. So, how long does it take?

Nice jig,
Steve


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## larryw (Feb 10, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Great idea Paul, keep'em comin'.


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## longgone (May 5, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Great jig…simple and effective. Thanks.


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## Randy63 (Jun 25, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


I think this jig would be valuable for anyone building mitered boxes. A little sanding jig for touching up miters on a sanding disk is also a good idea if anyone is having trouble with perfect miters. I think the idea of boxes as a venue for you marquetry is excellent. There have been some fine examples of marquetry boxes here at LJ, and I'm sure you could make some wonderful additions to that collection. I couldln't agree more about the use of hot Hide Glue, it has the strength and many more convienences the modern glues don't.


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## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


It looks like it does a great job Paul. You may just become a jig-man.  I'm puzzled in how you insert the bottom or the top though. Rabbet I assume? If so, how do you account for expansion? Hey, thanks for sharing.


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Thanks all.

*Steve* you plug it in in the morning or before 15 minutes before a gluing session and unplug it when you leave the shop. If you're using it much, it's always hot.

*Rance* I used a floating PW bottom in Arnie's Tea Box and the top is my favorite substrate, MDF, dimensionally pretty stable. I don't anticipate any problems. I won't use that top style again though - too hard to glue in nicely.

*LittlePaw* Fill yer boots. Glad to help.

Thanks again.


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## sedcokid (Jul 19, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Paul,
Your blogs are great!! Keep'em a comin!!!

Thanks for sharing!!


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## lightweightladylefty (Mar 27, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Paul,

Thanks for sharing your brilliance with us. This is such a great learning place.

L/W


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## lanwater (May 14, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Very interesting jig.

Thanks for all your blogs thay are quite informatyive.


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## Bertha (Jan 10, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Hide Glue.

Time to bring the pot back out. I haven't fussed with it in a while. The time feels right.


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## BoxBuilder (Oct 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Good to know there is someone else out there who uses hide glue!! I started about 2 years ago & wish it had been sooner. Great jig BTW!


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


GOLLY! Had no idea that Hide glue dried SO FAST!

I'll have to look into that stuff… a little more…

You have a Pot (electrically heated?)...
Can you leave the glue in the pot at all times?
How long does it take to get the glue liquid?
We know it dries FAST… How strong is it for the long haul?
How about water problems?

COOL little jig! Nice job!
Thank you.


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Hi Joe
There are several articles on hide glue available on the internet. Here's one: http://wpatrickedwards.blogspot.com/2011/05/animal-protein-glue.html
Patrick is probably as much of an expert as you will find and he has several other articles about it.

Since I got through the initial learning curve, and there is one, I have almost never gone back to my pva bottle and will only use it occasionally for convenience.

1) I have a "Hold Heet" pot now but successfully used a Rival kettle for some time. They work well but the pot is well worth the initial investment.

2) Yes, as long as you don't let it go bad the pot never needs emptying

3) The granular, flake, or bead form must be soaked for a while before it can be heated and liquefied. The actual heating takes around a half hour. You can keep the hydrated gel that you get when you soak it in the freezer in little blocks to save prep time and once you get the pot hot in the AM you can leave it on all day.
Just remove the pot liner with the glue in it and put it in the fridge over night and it lasts very well.

4) It comes in various strengths for various uses but it is one of the strongest glues there are.

5) If you get it wet and warm at the same time it will re-liquify. Is that a problem or an asset? If you are talking about indoor furniture, that's a huge asset. for veneer work, an even bigger one.

Do some internet research. 
You will be impressed.

I think the main reason it has fallen into disuse is that "modern" glue manufacturers have done a great marketing job.


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## helluvawreck (Jul 21, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


It was very interesting, *Paul*. I appreciate it.


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## petea (Jul 4, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


I am very happy I joined Lumber Jocks. This is one of the greatest places to get great information and I just love it. Please keep up the good work and I will be adding some of my expertise in the near future.
Peter Apicella
www.petestradingpost.com


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Welcome Peter

This may be the greatest place but it can be very addictive.
I look forward to your posts


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Peter…

*Welcome Aboard !!

Enjoy!
*


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## stefang (Apr 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Perfect Splined Mitre Joints in Five Minutes Without Clamps*
> 
> When I posted "Arnie's Tea Box" http://lumberjocks.com/projects/50187 one of the comments (Roger) was that these boxes make a great venue for displaying my marquetry. I totally agree but that meant streamlining the process of making the box. First was to come up with a jig to make the corners perfect every time quickly.
> 
> ...


Thanks for bringing this to our attention and proving your point with those great videos Paul. Besides the strength factor, Just the speed and the lack of need for clamps should convince just about any woodworker to use hide glue. Your miter jig is pretty cool too. I have identified some European suppliers who also sell electric glue pots ( our power is DC here), so I can see myself getting into this pretty darn soon. Your blog here is a wonderful contribution towards making woodworking easier and more productive for your fellow LJ members. Thanks again, this info is much appreciated!


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

*Take it From a Real Expert*

*I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.

*You may want* to watch these several times. I still pick up tips every time I watch them and I've been using hide glue almost daily for a couple of years plus I've had this talk from Patrick in person at his American School Of French Marquetry. He is as knowledgeable on this subject as anyone in the country and commonly says that he'll change glues as soon as someone can prove theirs is superior. He'll also tell you that in the thirty odd years he's been saying that …. no one has.

*So here's a link* to a LOT of knowledge about hide glue from a true expert.

Enjoy, and I'll field any questions I can and throw in a few photos and whatnot as (if) this develops.

Paul

*P.S.* I probably should have checked first. There are already several good blogs and articles on LJ's ( search: Hide Glue) so there's another resource. I suppose it's good to bring it up again once in a while if only to have someone to throw questions at.


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## JR45 (Jan 26, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


Paul
Thanks for the link. As you said there is some extremely useful information here. 
I have a couple of questions. When you are assembling your wooden pictures do you use hide glue to join the individual pieces together before you lay the completed picture on to the chosen substrate? Do you need to reinforce your picture to safeguard it during the hammering process? Do you always use either ply or solid wood as your substrate material or do you use MDF on occasions?
Jim


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## HalDougherty (Jul 15, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


Paul,
The curves on the sculpted furniture looked so much like the curves I've been carving on my gunstocks that I want to fill my house with furniture made in this style. As soon as possible, I'm going to take a trip to tour the Maloof property to see the furniture Sam Maloof created.

Thanks for sharing the link on hide glue. The site has several videos I'll watch later as well. This Fall I'm starting on a new project. I'm going to build 6 Maloof style low back chairs and a live edge slab table for a Christmas gift and another smaller table with two chairs for someone else. I had been planning on trying hide glue for the first chairs because, if while shaping them, and I go to far, I can remove the part, and carve another one. It sure beats scrapping a chair and starting over… If the chairs turn out as nice as everyone else has made, I'll start making some Maloof style rocking chairs and I know I'll need to remake more than one part over before I get all the flowing curves the way I want them to look. Most chairmakers have paid a lot of money for prime lumber to build their chairs. At least I've got a sawmill and I have been collecting nice walnut, maple and cherry logs for the last year to use to make both my gunstocks and the furniture I want to make. If I mess up an arm or leg of the chair, I can easily bandsaw out another part and fit it to start over. That's not an option for most chairmakers. I'm going to make the first prototypes out of red oak before I use some of the beautiful cherry and walnut crotches I've saved. Last week I was given a 30' long spalded maple log that's 38 or 40" at the base. There's a lot of gunstocks & chairs hiding inside that log. I can't wait to see what it looks like inside.


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## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


Super interesting Paul thanks for sharing this most detailed video on hide glue


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## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


My 'Hide glue technique'... Any time I see hide glue, I run and hide.  Ha ha.

Seriously, I guess I fall into the catagory of folks that just want a quick, easy, non-messy glue solution. Emphasis on the easy. I subconciously put gluing into different categories.

1) Gluing long strips(trim) in place. This involves running a quick bead down a piece of trim, putting it in place, then tacking it with a brad or pin. Norm Abram uses this style a lot from what I can tell.

2) Gluing up shorter strips to make a cutting board, or other similar piece. This differs from #1 in that I would actually smear the glue on both pieces to get full coverage, and it would also be followed up by placing clamps to secure it until it dries.

3) Last, but not least, gluing inlays or odd shapes(usually small) in place where they will be sanded flush when dried. Inlays and marquetry come to mind.

Of these, the last seems to be the main use for hide glues. Because of the thinness of the wood maybe or the hammer technique to squeeze out the excess? I can't really pinpoint the 'why' I feel this way. I just can't see Norm(or me) drizzling a long bead of hide glue down a piece of trim with a brush before nailing it in place. It's probably that nasty brush that Patrick is using.

Paul, please know that I am not knocking the use of hide glue. I am honestly asking if you only use it for your marquetry or do you use it for ALL of your gluing applications such as M&T and perhaps a cutting board glue-up.

On another aspect, it seems I just want to be able to quickly reach for a bottle of glue and dab a bit on and be done with it. Having to keep a hot-pot 'running' throughout the day seems laborious. Please tell me it is not. I really emphasize 'easy' in my woodworking. I don't want to ramp-up on another technology or process. Would the simple Liquid Hide Glue bottles that do not require the pot be a first step, or are these just not the same?

PS: Great video links btw. This one and one from one of your other threads.


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


*Jim*

*1)* Yes and no on the first question. Yes if I'm assembling the picture on paper but It is not actually fastening the pieces together as much as assembling them onto a backing paper. This method is the traditional trademark procedure of french marquetry and requires very special butchers' paper.
No if I am assembling on clear adhesive film which I am doing more and more. I think if the French masters had had this product two hundred years ago, they may have used it.

*2)* Marquetry is always pressed, never hammered. Don't ask how I found that out, suffice to say that no one told me in advance.

*3)* I use baltic birch plywood and MDF. I like them both. Of course the old stuff was all done on solid wood so that's also an option, especially if you are doing curved surfaces.

*Rance*,
To each his own but I find hot glue to be quicker and easier and, while sometimes a bit messier than pva glue, 
certainly easier to clean up.
As for your categories, I'll do another segment with some photos but for now:

#1 and #2 would likely be done as rubbed joints with hot glue and the only differences from pva would be the lack of any need for fastenings or clamping, the length of time required before you could do further work with the piece, and the ultimate strength of the joint. all of these would favor the hide glue. Actually there are even more advantages like not sealing the surface and needing to be sanded or scraped before finishing, no down the road squeeze-out and on and on.
Fir #3, with hide glue you just dab some glue on the piece, press it in place with finger pressure for about as long as you might with CA glue and you're done.

On your last point, it can be a pita to keep the pot hot and at the right temp all day with the home made style which is why most who get hooked will buy a Hold Heet pot before long.

Finally, liquid hide glue can give many of the advantages of hot glue but misses some others like hammer veneering and rubbed joints that depend on the quick set of hot glue.

Yes, I use it for almost everything. The lone exception is large area flat glue-ups like laminating sheets of PW together.


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## stefang (Apr 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


Interesting video Paul. I have seen it used a lot in various woodworking publications, etc. I can't buy it off the shelf here in Norway, but I suppose I could buy it from the U.K. Thanks for the good blog and video link on this product.


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## mochoa (Oct 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


Hi Paul, Question about Hide Glue, do you know if cold temperature affectes it like other glues? I need to glue something up that I cant bring indoors and I'm hopeing hide glue will cure in cooler temperatures. Thanks!


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


I'm not an expert on that but I would think it will cure fine. It may be difficult to get assembled in time (the glue must still be liquid) if the air temp is low but if it's a small enough job to get assembled quickly, it will tack up very quickly as it cools and the rest of the cure is about drying so should not be affected by temperature much, provided it doesn't freeze.
If you can heat the pieces, it will help. You can also overheat the glue a bit (150 degrees or so instead of 140) and make sure it is nice and thin… the water holds the heat.


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## mochoa (Oct 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


I'm using Old Brown glue, do you think that matters?

So it sounds like it won't affect my the curing of the wood but it will affect my open time.


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


You'll have more time with OBG for sure but you should contact Patrick and ask him.
Here's the OBG site.


----------



## mochoa (Oct 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the help Paul, I'll check out their site.


----------



## Rocket187um (Feb 13, 2015)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


Great article. Thanks for the tips! Rocket


----------



## ButchWeathers (May 28, 2014)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


Check out the pickling pot on riogrande.com for $23.50 it makes a perfect hide glue pot for a very reasonable price. It keeps the glue at the ideal temperature of 140 degrees, has a porcelain lining so it's easy to clean, has a lid to keep it from evaporating too fast and I've let it dry out numerous times while still heating with no adverse effects. just add some water and shortly it's glue again. It's better than any glue pot I've seen for 5 times the price. It's made for pickling jewelry but it couldn't be more perfect for glue if they tried.


----------



## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

shipwright said:


> *Take it From a Real Expert*
> 
> *I promised* in a recent construction series about my current project to do a "how to get started in hide glue" tutorial, but in researching for useful photos and making sure my facts were correct, I took a second look at a series of videos with Patrick Edwards on Kieth Cruickshank's "Woodtreks" blog. I decided that if you want to learn about hide glue I'll let a real expert tell you about it and in video at that.
> 
> ...


That was an informative set of videos. Answered many visual questions for me. I think it's time to try some.

Thanks Paul


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

*Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*

*There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.

There are more but I'll start with these and you can question me about any others you may be worrying about.

*1) Not very strong.* 
In fact even the weaker hot animal glues are stronger than most modern glues and ultimately who cares because they are all stronger than the wood they are gluing.

*Here's an example.* These joints were made with no clamps, just hide glue smeared in the holes and on the fingers and then assembled.










*You can imagine* that those six screws can exert a lot of force. The only thing holding this press together is the glue. No pins, no bolts, just glue…........and I do crank on those screws.










*2) Won't last as long*

Evidence exists for the use of animal glues as much as 8000 years ago. The Egyptians used it 4000 years ago and it was used exclusively by the furniture industry until about 100 years ago. There exists furniture hundreds of years old with still holding animal glue joints. There simply are no pieces made with synthetic glue that are much more than 100 years old.

*3) Smells really bad / won't keep well* 
If left in the gel state in a warm place it will attract mold and essentially rot producing the smell associated with any rotting animal product and yes that's REALLY bad. ... But it ceased to be glue when the first mold appeared. The mistake was not caring for the glue properly.

*I use it every* day so my routine is that it goes up to the shop with me first thing in the morning and gets plugged in and every night when I leave the shop I take it down to the house and put it in the fridge. I've never had it go bad and I never throw it out, just add to it as needed when it starts to get low. Constant cooking like this actually makes it stronger.

*Here's my glue* pot in the shop …........... next to the radio. 
When I leave the shop at the end of the day I turn off the radio and that reminds me to take the glue pot….. simple.










*It spends its* evenings between the cat food and the Gatoraide.










*4) Getting wet will ruin it*

To soften (reverse) hide glue you need the presence of both moisture and heat (so don't take baths with your furniture.) Immersion for a period of time wouldn't be good either but casually getting it wet is not a problem. On the other hand when you need to repair a piece made with hide glue you can dis-assemble the joint with a very hot wet rag. Once apart you can immediately re-glue without removing all the old glue.

*5) Messy and hard to work with*

Here are a few short videos I did today for Rance. They should give you an idea of how messy and hard to work with it is.




  









  









  






*The process of* making the splined joint above in the third video (and yes, I meant to say *Spline* sled and cut *splines*) with hide glue is covered in this blog.
That's it for now.

YES, In fact I am on a little crusade for hide glue. All I ask is that you give it a try before you dismiss it.

Ask questions, make comments and criticize if you wish.

Paul


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


The last video seems reluctant to load. 
I'm working on it.

edit… I guess you'll have to click the link.


----------



## gfadvm (Jan 13, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


How does the Tite Bond Hide Glue compare with your hot hide glue? Where do you get your glue? Will one of those little pot pourri pots work to keep it hot?


----------



## Maggiepic (Aug 26, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


After watching your's and Patrick Edwards videos, I'm convinced to give it a try. 
You're in inspiration to all of us Paul. 
Now I have to hunt down a supplier and a pot. Do you order your supplies or is there someone local?


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Liquid hide glues will give you some of the advantages like reversibility, strength, and ease of cleanup (does not seal the wood against stains etc.) but do not have the quick gel that is required for rubbed joints and hammer veneering.
Hot glue gains decent strength in a few minutes as it moves from liquid state to solid by cooling, then achieves its ultimate strength in about 24 hours by drying. 
Liquid hide glues are made by adding retardants that prevent them from gelling at room temperatures so they gain strength only by drying.

I've added this link to the original post above. It shows the steps in a quick splined joint

Thanks for the interest.


----------



## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Well Paul, I am AGAIN honored that you post a video just for me. Thank you for the information. You're doing a great job of convincing me I should at least give Hot hide a try. Trying Titebond's Liquid Hide Glue would not be a problem. However, I would not be benefiting from some of 'HOT' Hide Glue's benefits.

What recommendations would you have for someone that wanted to just 'give it a try' without investing in substantial equipment(an expensive heat pot)? In the temperature ranges(140-180, I believe), what DIY alternatives are there? Something as simple as a coffee warmer type of setup? What are the HHGUG's recommending for starter folks? And is the granulated Hide glue from WoodCraft a reasonable place to begin? (Edit: I see you answered this above)

Reference: 
HHGUG - Hot Hide Glue User Group

PS: Even with the mess of a pot on Patrick's video, I was surprised at the lack of smell AND the simple water cleanup. I'm leaning towards the dark side.

Edit: And it doesn't impeed stains? Wow! How is its sandability?


----------



## ArtB (Jul 5, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Never thought to use hide glue,but now I would give it a try. But like GaryLwhere do you start? It isn't something big box stores carry.


----------



## Praki (Jun 17, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Hi Paul,

I have read a lot of articles/posts where the advantages of hide glue have been described. I like how you have addressed the usual hide glue concerns and finally I am telling myself that I should try it on my next project,

I do have a few questions in this regard. My woodworking happens on weekends and I don't expect to be gluing stuff every day (not even every weekend!). Fridge space is at a premium in my kitchen and I am wondering about the best way to work with hide glue under these constraints. Should I make a small batch and discard it after use or is it possible to somehow take it to a dry state to be hydrated again?

Secondly, what strength of hide glue do you recommend for normal woodwork and buy where?

Thanks


----------



## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Wow! It looks like WC carries more than I thought. I can pick up some BT&C on Tuesday evening. I'm thinking the 192 gram would be best. Could you confirm?










We'll see what I can come up with for a heat pot. Hey, what about an old coffeemaker? You can find these free on freecycle. *From CoffeeMate to GlueMate*. 










Except for the fact of having a glass container in the shop, I think it might just work. And there are ones made of SS. Oh, and Paul, I think it might be time for a dorm refrigerator in your shop(s).


----------



## derosa (Aug 21, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Rance- Just a warning on the titebond hide glue to really keep things clamped for a long time. I tried it one time and would never buy it again, lacking a lot of clamps I often only wait a few hours for regular titebond to dry and then unclamp things and don't stress any of the joints for 24 hours per titebond's direction. So with the liquid hide glue I didn't think anything of unclamping my headboard and clamping up the foot board and didn't pay attention as I removed the clamps and the top board shifted slightly without me noticing for another day. The result is that the top of the headboard has a slight gap in it all the way across so that a small amount of each tenon can be seen if you look closely. Thankfully I noticed it happening on the footboard even though about 18 hours had passed before I attempted to unclamp it, a quick reclamp and another 24 hour wait made sure it was dry. 
I am watching this because the hot glue interests me and from what I've heard doesn't suffer the same overly long drying time.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


*Rance* The "Rival" brand electric kettle available at Walmart for around $10 plus or minus has a thermostat and is a widely used starter pot. 192 gram is the best all round for woodwork.










You do have to get all glue off the surface, which you can do with a bit of warm water and a scrubbing pad after ten minutes or so but glue that soaks in will have no effect on stains or oils. It sands very nicely because it hardens hard unlike the pva that you are used to.

*Praki*, You are right. The best way for you to go would be to make smallish batches and discard after use. One thing you can do is hydrate a larger batch and freeze it in an ice cube tray. Then you have ready hydrated glue that will last a very long time. When you want to use it just throw a cube or two in the pot and when it's hot it's ready.

*derosa*, you can go back any time and reverse the glue in those joints by wrapping them with a hot wet cloth for a while. The joint will come apart and you can re-set it and re-glue it. No need to clean out the old glue as you would have to with pva because new hide glue adheres to old. That's one of the biggest advantages that you do get even with the liquid stuff. It's always reversible. There's no need to live with that mistake.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Sorry, I missed a couple of questions.

*Andy* I get my glue from Patrick at ASFM but WoodCraft is likely easier for you.
I'm not familiar with the pot you ask about but the one in the photo above will work well for cheap.

*Gary* See above for where I get my glue. Highland Woodworking carries the glue and the pots but an internet search for "Hold Heet Pot" will get you a variety of prices.


----------



## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


I think you are right Reverand. I'm still not impressed with the LHG. I'm looking at the HHG.

Sorry Paul, I'm bouncing back and forth here. I looked at your "Rival" pot from your economical veneer hammer. I read up that it has 7 temp. settings. I'm guessing that you get it to 150 degrees or thereabouts and then forget it. I'm guessing you use it as a double boiler with the Mason jar for the glue container.

*Edit: *Sorry, we are posting intermittantly. You've answered my questions. Thank you.


----------



## apprentice (Jun 27, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Like nature and chemitry, natural glues can be sucessfully manipulated for a wider range of useages.

You can add 1% aluminium sulphate to your pearls in order of making it waterproof and for flexibility in places like the canvas backing on a roll top tambour, add some glycerine for a rubber hold.

Not so sure it would stand up to salt water and a marine enviornment though?

The test for a useable consistency is called the "Straw Test" After mixing equal amounts of glue and water bring into the hot liquid state and dip your glue brush into the pot and quickly lift it out above the pot so as the liquid falls back into the pot.
What your looking for is a straw of glue to be in a constant gravitational unbroken line for around 12 inches before it starts to begin breaking off the straw into droplets, a continuous straw for that foot will give you a useable consistency…to adjust the straw length, simply add more water and test regulary as the water boils off through the day.

And most important of all, Never let your water jacket run dry or the glue will cook and be ruined.


----------



## SPalm (Oct 9, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Amazing Paul. Why is this all new to us?

And what a wonderful thinker you got. Keep it coming.

Thanks for the push,
Steve


----------



## CL810 (Mar 21, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Thanks Paul for a great blog.


----------



## HorstPeter (Aug 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


I'm glad there are people like you Paul, which are on a crusade to push hide glue into peoples minds and hands. When I started to get interested in woodworking I came across articles mentioning it and liking what I read, haven't used any other glue right from the start. From what I read it seemed to me that it was pretty much wonderglue and that at a fantastic price as well. Don't even want to imagine having to use other glues really.

Thanks for spreading the word about this and hopefully people will indeed give it a try and be as happy with it as me.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


*Steve*, In a word, *Marketing*.

IMHO synthetic glue manufacturers have out marketed hide glue manufacturers. It certainly isn't because they have a better product.


----------



## Richforever (Mar 19, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


It's on my list. Thanks for posting!


----------



## Schwieb (Dec 3, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Great post. Very informative. We're all so conditioned to grab a bottle of Titebond, we ignore the options. I remember my Dad had a glue pot and used hide glue back in the 50'. I also remember that he adopted using bottle glues available for assembly by the late 50's. I wonder what happened to that glue pot? I can see that there are advantages to hide glue especially for veneers. Gonna need to give this a whirl. Thanks Paul.


----------



## gfadvm (Jan 13, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Thanks Paul


----------



## TheOldTimer (Dec 13, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


My woodworking experience began in the 1940s living next to a one man woodworking shop in Chicago. I spent hours watching him from his front door during the summer months. When I was 9 years old he invited me into the shop and I was hooked. All he used was hot hide glue. The pot was turned on in the morning and off at night. Some of the cabinets and furniture he built was unbelieveable. He became my teacher and mentor until his passing. 
I have been using hot melt hide glue all my life and will never use anything else on wood. I only mix up small batches at a time and when I shut down for the summer, the pot gets put away. Much too hot for woodworking here in Phoenix during the summer months. Thanks for a great revue on Hide glue.


----------



## Jim_Gray_Sr (Aug 7, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


I started using hide glue several months ago and really like it. I use a cooker pot like the Rival (mines a Proctor Silex brand) with a thermostat that keeps my glue at around 140 to 150 degrees F. I use a Nutella plastic container to put into the water to heat up my glue. Also I cut about a 1/2" piece off of a poplar 4X4" and put it in the bottom of my cooker to set the nutella jar on so my glue's not setting directly on the heating element. It works just fine but a glue pot is definately on my wish list for Santa this year.


----------



## GlideGuy (Aug 18, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Good job, Paul. I grew up with the glue pot plugged in all day. Our furniture restorer/builder once told me "cold glue dits on the surface and isn't more than 'paste', but hot hide glue penetrates the wood fibers and softens them so they interlock when the joint is clamped forming the best joints. Have been using hot glue for over 43 years in restoration. Reglueing old joints with hot glue is simple - brush on hot water to revive the old glue and reset the joint!
GlideGuy


----------



## Mip (Sep 16, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


I've been reading the benefits of hot hide glue and all of the comments about it, and I have got to try this stuff! Not having to use clamps is a nice benefit. Another is the glue doesn't stain the wood like regular PVA will. One question, can the glue hold dissimular stuff like brass and wood, or glass and wood? Or is it just for wood to wood joints?


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


*Mip*, I don't have a lot of personal experience but brass, pewter and other metals were used in marquetry a couple of hundred years ago and animal glues were all they had. 
Also I know that glass can be etched by applying hot animal glue and allowing it to cure. It adheres so well that as it shrinks it actually tears the surface of the glass.


----------



## icemanhank (Jun 30, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Thanks very much Paul, I have just been trying to do some research on this very subject and your post has made it all so much clearer for me.
Great stuff.


----------



## dbray45 (Oct 19, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Paul - good stuff. I had not used hide glue until I repaired the veneer on an old table top. There is a distinct learning curve using this adhesive and can frustrate you mightily - especially the workability (or lack of) as it cools.


----------



## NoChatter (Dec 28, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


OK I just did a search for Rival Temperature controlled pot and didn't see what you are showing above. Can you post a link to the pot you are referring to at Walmart? I have a slow cooker now and it doesn't get the glue hot enough according to my temp gun, making it difficult to work with especially compared to your videos Paul. I'm about to give in and get the glue pot at see available at Woodcraft. Is that a good one?

Thanks for posting this Paul!


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


*NoChatter*,Walmart may not carry that one any more but any similar pot will do if it has a thermostat. What also works is a hotplate with a pot of water on it. Just put the glue jar in the hot water and regulate the temp with the hot plate. I highly recommend the Hold Heet pot but you should play around with the glue first for a bit before you jump in with that investment. Regardless of my opinions, hot glue is not everyone's cup of tea.
I couldn't find the one you were referring to on the woodcraft site.

*debray45*, One of the biggest mistakes people make with this glue is to keep it too thick. The water holds the heat. Very thin glue is what works and you get more time. You just have to experiment for yourself a bit.


----------



## dbray45 (Oct 19, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


I have not had time to experiment as much as I want. When I was doing the repair project, I had it on the the thicker side but thinner than the directions. I will play more in the future - I really like the adhesive for veneer work.


----------



## robscastle (May 13, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


Very informative.

I also have some Titebond liquid hide glue of which I have never used yet.
Upon re reading the directions it recommends clamp up of 30 minutes, that alone would be a reason forme not to use it.

However I will do some tests with it to determine if its worth using.
Currently my thinking is if I do more veneering I will fit up for hot hide glue use, it looks to easy so just what I need!

I can remember using it when I was at High school doing woodworking but have never used it since, maybe its time to rediscover its fine properties once more, thanks again for the informative videos.


----------



## Basher (Mar 22, 2017)

shipwright said:


> *Some myths, some Pictures and some Videos*
> 
> *There are lots* of myths around hide glue like it isn't very strong, won't last as long as modern glues,smells really bad, won't keep long once hydrated, is really messy and hard to work with and that getting it wet will ruin it.
> 
> ...


I inherited an old roll top desk from my great-great-great grand fathers days. The canvas under the rolls was very old and rotted. Hmmm, how do I fix that?


> ?? I guessed, and decided to use an old steam iron that my grandma use to use. I doubt any one irons clothes these days. The old fabric came off. There was this residue from the glue left behind on the wood slats. I purchased duck canvas at the local fabric store. To my amazement the old glue became sticky with hot water and probably would allow me to attach the new canvas. What was that stuff


? I had no idea, I asked a guy at Woodcrafter's. I came home with hide glue and now I am hooked. There was no bad smell. That glue on the desk had to be a hundred years old! I went rather slow, one slat at a time, no clamping, works more like contact cement. I watched a you tube video on hammer veneering and used that technique

Basher


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

*A Bigger Glue-up *

*I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.

*I am currently* knocking a bench together using lapped layers of plywood to give me the effect of finger jointed 4 1/2" x 3 3/4" material for the trestle legs. With hide glue, the lack of need for clamping makes this a very easy lay-up to fire together with a stapler. These joints will be extremely strong and rigid and will never work loose.






*I hope I made* that look as easy as it is. It is as quick or even maybe quicker than pva and I didn't get cramps in my hands from squeezing the glue bottle. The round bristle brush I'm using comes in a set of ten (two each of five different sizes) at Michaels for cheap and with the circular motion I'm using here is about the best way to apply the glue quickly and evenly.

*I would like* to think that I can lure some of you over to the ….. no, back to the light side with this.

Thanks for looking in.

Paul


----------



## Kentuk55 (Sep 21, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


I'm sure those will hold up forever really.


----------



## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


You did what you wanted to do…

Very good!

Very simple, fast, and direct!

I was wondering though… when you set your nailer on the glue-pot warmer, does it hot & get glue on it? LOL

Thank you.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


No Joe . I didn't even notice I had done that.

Actually the rim of the inner glue pot (that I had out at that time) completely covers the outer "heater pot" and protects it from getting dirty. The inner pot is what I take in at night. .... and no again. It would have to stay there a long time to get hot.


----------



## Karson (May 9, 2006)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Paul: I just found a magazine in my collection. It's Woodwork Issue #20 March/April 1993 (now out of business). On the cover is a picture of a marquetry donkey. It's like your Chevy. He - Patrick Edwards - made his from a copy in the Getty Museaum near Los Angeles.

There is a great article about Pat Edwards and his Marquetry business.

In the same issue is an article by Michael McGarry called "Hide Glue an old product rediscovered"

If you would like a copy of these articles let me know and I'll scan them into a pdf.


----------



## Schwieb (Dec 3, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Ok Paul, you're heating up my interest in more "traditional" glue-ups. Tell me again where you got your glue pot, Since I am entering the world of marquetry, I think I will need one. I am in the process of setting up a small class on basic marquetry in the next few weeks. I've found a teacher and he is an old man that wants to pass on his knowledge and veneer inventory to someone who will use it. I've said it before and I am sure there are many who can relate to this, glue is good but we thought it had to come out of a bottle.

Thanks for your post and continued effort to re-introduce us to the methods of traditional woodworking.

Ken Schwiebert


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


*Karson*, Thanks I'd appreciate that. I'll PM you my email.

*Ken*, I got mine from Highland Woodworking but I've seen better prices when searching them on the internet.
You are very lucky to have a source for veneer like that. I'm very envious. Good luck on your course, you'll love it I'm sure.


----------



## mafe (Dec 10, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Cool Paul.
Thank you.
I just watched a few of your videos, all good stuff, I am hooked on hide glue now.
Love that sander fr the shopsmith, btw.
Best thoughts,
Mads
(Was in the garage today painting on the model you send me, will post picture it becomes really cool, thank you).


----------



## phtaylor36 (Jun 13, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


You have convinced me Paul! I'm going to have to give it a try. I know my wife will never let me put it in the fridge though….I'll have to use it in smaller batches.


----------



## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Paul,

Titebond now has Hide glue in a bottle…
... how would rate it compared to what you're using?
... is it (TB) compromised in any way?
(other than the bottle has to be squeezed to get it out. LOL )

Thank you.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


*Joe*, I answered that here.


----------



## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


... thank you… missed that… (or just simply forgot… LOL)


----------



## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the heads-up Paul. I had read these comments but SWMBO was sleeping so I did not watch the video. You make it look so easy… because it is.  Not even messy either. I use Gorilla glue more than most and I get a lot of comments about it being messy. In fact I even teach in my class that it is messy. However, like you, I've found ways to keep that to a minimum.

I'm looking around for one of the Rival pots for the warmer. I'm just dragging my feet due to my work load and scheduling. I'll be picking up some of the 192 gram glue on Sunday.Yes, there is hope of a convert here. I can see advantages of the HHG over TB's LHG. (I'll make sure these acronyms get on the GG[Global Glossary].) I think just using the LHG would be a waste. I'll let you know when I make some progress.

Thanks again for starting your crusade. Really.


----------



## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Paul, Do you see any advantages of Behlen Ground Hide Glue over Brooklyn Tool and Craft Hide Glue? I'm leaning toward the Brooklyn brand.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Sorry Rance, not familiar with either.


----------



## stefang (Apr 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


I'm pretty sold on the hide glue Paul thanks to your blogs . I will be ordering some granules on the net and then I just need a glue pot. I appreciate you calling this to our attention.

The cheapest purpose built electric glue pot I've found (from Germany) costs about $150 + shipping, +added value tax (25%), + freight + a customs handling fee. I'm therefore looking for a less expensive solution. Unfortunately I can't use the Rival pot, but I'm pretty sure I can find an alternative for our 220DC with a thermostat heat control.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


That should work well Mike. I'm sure you will see the benefits.
PM me if you have any trouble getting it to work because as I have said, there is a little learning curve…......but it is definitely worth it.


----------



## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Other options… I just looked online for 'tiny crock pot'. This one comes up "Crock-Pot 32041-C 16-Ounce Little Dipper, Chrome" for $13. I could not find the temperature though. Stefang, if this is in the temp. range, then look on amazon.uk(or something like that) for a 220v model.


----------



## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


*Rance,*

Your link takes to you to *no where close to a Crock Pot.*.. LOL

*I found this:*

*Crock-Pot 32041-C 16-Ounce Little Dipper, Chrome*
(although this price is $14)... close…

*Rival 32041C Little Dipper Slow Cooker*
(looks like this one has a thermostat for sure)

*Hamilton Beach Party Dipper Food Warmer*


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Wrong link Rance. That one goes to here.
Does it have a thermostat?


----------



## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Ha ha. That's what happens when you multi-task. Yes Joe, the first one you linked to.

Crock-Pot 32041-C 16-Ounce Little Dipper, Chrome
Around $14. I would like to know what temp. they are set to. I'm guessing lower than a normal crock pot since they are used for dip rather than cooking.

Paul, I doubt it. But if the temp is right, then we're good. It still appears that old discarded coffee makers are a dime a dozen. And with the McDonalds coffee lawsuit, the temp. should be just about 155°F. Add two containers for a double boiler and "Bob's Yer Uncle". What makes this more desirable is that coffee makers come in a variety of voltages(110/220) from many countries and they are often discarded after the glass Pot is broken.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Here's what you're looking for Rance. These have been used by lots of people (me included) and they work great. Apparently Walmart doesn't carry them any more, but Target does.


----------



## JR45 (Jan 26, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Paul
I have brewed up some hide or pearl glue, and have had some impressive results on joints and veneering. So much easier than other glues! 
I found, however, that my glue mix took some time to set once applied unlike the "instant" bonding that seemed to occur in your and Patrick Edwards' videos. Does the glue need to reach a minimum temperature in order to break down the protein in the pearls before it becomes faster acting? I am using an old water jacketed boiler and a meat thermometer which indicates a temperature of 140 - 150 F. Is this high enough. Also, when the glue cools in the pot should it solidify to a brittle toffee consistency or does it remain jelly like? Apologies for so many questions but I would like to get my mixtures right and use hide glue as the adhesive of choice.
Thanks
Jim


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


*Jim*, Your temperature range is perfect. 
When cold (fridge) it should be a very firm gel.

I'm going to guess that you don't have your glue thin enough.

We tend to thing thinner=weaker so there is a tendency to keep it thick. Try a test by thinning your glue and hammer veneering a sample. If it still doesn't work, thin some more.

You only need a thin layer of glue to hammer. If the glue is too thick (consistency) then you can't have a thin layer. Also it is the water that holds the heat so the thinner the glue the more working time you have. If your glue is too thick it may be cooling before you get to the initial tack in veneering.

If you are still having trouble ask more questions. I'll help any way I can.


----------



## JR45 (Jan 26, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Thanks Paul. I had, in fact, added more pearls (soaked) to thicken the mixture thinking that it would provide a stronger bond. I will try a more dilute formulation to see if that produces better results.
Jim


----------



## stefang (Apr 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Hello Paul. I ordered 4kg of granulated hide glue from a good German supplier, 'Dick, GMBH' who also have some some reasonably priced tools including nice Bedrock design hand planes. Four kg. of glue will probably be enough to last for the rest of my life, but this amount worked out most economical for the freight charges.

I'm still trying to find a glue pot solution. So far the best possible alternative I've been able to find here is a baby bottle/food warmer. I will have a look at one this coming monday. I hope it will be ok. My main concern is it's ability to hold an even temperature and produce the desired 140F.

While searching the web I also found the following article on hot hide glue.

http://www.xrestore.com/pages/hideglue.htm

The most interesting part to me was towards the end of the article about freezing small amounts of glue in an ice cube tray. It seems like a wonderful and convenient way to store and use it. So if you haven't thought of this already I hope you will find it useful.


----------



## stefang (Apr 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Hello Paul. I ordered 4kg of granulated hide glue from a good German supplier, (Dick, GMBH) http://www.mehr-als-werkzeug.de/product/450143/Hautleim---Granulat.htm?lang=enwho also have some some reasonably priced tools including nice Bedrock design hand planes. Four kg. of glue will probably be enough to last for the rest of my life, but this amount worked out most economical for the freight charges.

I'm still trying to find a glue pot solution. So far the best possible alternative I've been able to find here is a baby bottle/food warmer. I will have a look at one this coming monday. I hope it will be ok. My main concern is it's ability to hold an even temperature and produce the desired 140F.

While searching the web I also found the following article on hot hide glue.

http://www.xrestore.com/pages/hideglue.htm

The most interesting part to me was towards the end of the article about freezing small amounts of glue in an ice cube tray. It seems like a wonderful and convenient way to store and use it. So if you haven't thought of this already I hope you will find it useful.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


That's great to hear Mike. I have a convert. 
You will learn to love the stuff.
I've seen that article before and I've done the freezer thing but I don't any more because now I just have a pot going all the time. Also the granulated glue I'm using hydrates in a few minutes so there's little advantage. If all else fails Mike, I know that you can use a hotplate and a saucepan as a water bath and control the temp just fine.

Have fun and PM me if you have any problems.


----------



## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Well, I picked up a packet of 192 gram granules last night. And I just posted a request on Freecycle for one of the Rival pots. I'm getting closer.  I'm not in a hurry though.


----------



## Roz (Jan 13, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


This is great, I have learned much from following your post. Thanks. t


----------



## FatherHooligan (Mar 27, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


I understand that you take the pot in to refrigerate it and I've read the comments that hide glue can be frozen in ice cube trays. Does this mean that freezing does not ruin the unused glue still in the pot?


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


No it's fine. I've done it.
I think the idea of hydrating a batch and then freezing it in small pieces makes sense if you are using heavy slab or even bead glue that takes a lot of time to hydrate. If you are using the granulated stuff it only takes a few minutes to hydrate so the whole freezing little bits is sort of pointless. 
You can hydrate and heat just what you are going to use.
If you use it every day like I most often do, you just keep the pot going and add to it when it gets low. As long as it's either hot or cold, you're fine….. but don't let it sit around warm or you'll be sorry.


----------



## sandhill (Aug 28, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


If I understand correctly it is stronger than PVA and its reversible. Just don't use it on your boat right Paul?


----------



## FatherHooligan (Mar 27, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


I was thinking my shop, in about a months time will be hovering around the zero mark so I wouldn't have to worry about the glue freezing if I forgot it in the shop…now that I think about it my shop is cooler than my fridge now so the glue would be okay out there. I usually turn the heat on before breakfast, f I turn on th glue pot at the same time things would be warm enough after I eat. I've a small project I'm going to test this out on. I'll have to follow some of the leads here on getting a trial glue pot. Thank you very much for posting this series!


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Try to get your pieces warm before you glue them. The thin layer of glue you apply will gel very quickly on a cold wood surface. It has to remain liquid until the joint is assembled.


----------



## NoChatter (Dec 28, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Hi Paul,

I got the Hold-Heet glue pot at Woodcraft this weekend and have a few questions I'm hoping you don't mind answering.

It came without a lid. Is one needed? I see you have one. Where did you get it? If no lid is necessary, can I store it in the fridge with no issues to the other things in the fridge (and keep a happy marriage)? How long can it stay in there? Weeks ok?

What is the thing in the middle that came with the glue pot used for? I see one in your too.

I have some hide glue that has become solid ie rock hard. Can I place that in the glue pot and add some water and will it become liquid and usable again?

Thanks for posting. It's working. You have mother convert…


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


A lid keeps it from evaporating as much and helps keep the heat in. They are a good idea. They are sold separately (who knows why?) for about $19, seems like a lot.

I got both of mine (one in BC and one in AZ) from Highland WW and ordered the lids at the same time.

The glue is safe when it's hot and when it's cold. You want to avoid warm …........... really. I'm pretty sure it's OK for long periods in the fridge but I know it's OK frozen. Never had any trouble with nearby foods and I've been doing it constantly for over a year.

The thing in the middle is a brush rest although I never use for one. It does come in handy when you are returning bits of gelled glue to the pot with your fingers or a knife etc. Use it like the shoe scraper is used to get the mud off.

A nice thing about hot hide glue is you never have to wonder if it's good. You can always give it the "string test". Just get a little between your index finger and thumb and as it cools see if you can pull long spidery strands. If you can, the glue is good. (see Patrick's video in segment one) If you have some that is rock hard, It's likely fine but may need some hydration (soaking) before heating.

Keep me posted and ask questions if you are having trouble.


----------



## NoChatter (Dec 28, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Update on my rock hard glue. It was actually slightly soft in the center where it was about a 1/2" thick. Broke it up some, stuck the lot in the pot, added a fair amount of water, plugged the hold-Heet pot in and after about 1 hour, I was in business. Used it to stick on some modding with no clamps! Worked great and really holds well and only after a few minutes… Heck of a deal!

Now off to order a $19 lid…


----------



## Bigkahunaranch (Apr 9, 2014)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


Sorry for ressurecting an old thread but the info in it is great.
Couple of questions for those using the hide glue for veneering:
What is the thinnest veneer you can use without "hammering"-1/8, 3/32, 1/16 ??
Is it necessary to apply a sealer coat of hide glue to mdf prior to veneering it?
I am concerned about the mdf leaching the moisture out of the glue.

Thanks, I am really excited to try out the hide glue.

Dave @ the Ranch


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Bigger Glue-up *
> 
> *I know that* some of you are interested in trying hide glue but think it is messy or inconvenient / slow to apply on larger glue-ups. I can tell you about it all day but maybe a video will be worth a few hundred words.
> 
> ...


It is not necessary to seal coat mdf before glueing with hide glue.
How you apply the veneer be it hammering or pressing is not related to thickness. You can do either wih sliced commercial 1/42" veneer or thicker sliced or sawn veneer of 1/16" or thicker.
Feel free to PM me if that doesn't answer your question ….... or for any other questions you have.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

*A Little Hammer Veneering Video*

*I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.

*I ask you can veneering be any easier than this?*




  






BTW, I love the new hammer and the brushes are a winner too.

Thanks for looking in.

Paul


----------



## Patricelejeune (Feb 21, 2013)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Great one Paul


----------



## tinnman65 (Jan 19, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Are you sure you didn't break that on purpose just so you could get rid of that acrylic and replace it with wood?
Nice video Paul!


----------



## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


That looks like it's going to be very STRONG!

Cool technique…


----------



## jumbojack (Mar 20, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Paul do not take this as criticism in any shape or form, but a question. I noticed you were more diligent on the right side closest to the camera. You spent a goodly amount of time in this area, short powerful strokes and less on the rest of the piece. Is this to get it lined up and square against the adjoining piece?


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


*Paul* I never really liked the plastic, but it gave me some light. I'll be happier now.

*jumbojack* When you hammer veneer the first thing you do is apply heavy pressure in one place to lock the piece down while you "squeegee" the rest. It makes sense, as you guessed, to do this in the area where your most important fit is located.


----------



## gfadvm (Jan 13, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Thanks for posting this. I never knew what you were talking about with "hammer veneering". Really a misnomer as there is no hammering! I understand the process now. Always a good day when you learn something!


----------



## Karson (May 9, 2006)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Paul Great video. Looks like a cool process.


----------



## gbear (Mar 6, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


It is so nice to watch someone who knows what he is doing when he is doing something you don't know about!


----------



## jumbojack (Mar 20, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


That makes perfect sense. Thanks Paul, I am officially looking for a pot.


----------



## Loren (May 30, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


The glue you get on the top face serves as a lubricant?


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


*Yes Loren*, it lubricates the hammer and it also serves to equalize the moisture and prevent the edges from trying to curl up as they would without it. As well the veneer being upside down in the substrate glue helps keep it from cooling while the veneer side glue is applied.


----------



## gavinzagreb (Jan 19, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


That was eye opening. Even though hide glue is not available here, it's good to know how it's done.
I'm thinking it should be called a veneer scraper rather than a veneer hammer though.
Is it ever used for hammering ?


----------



## JR45 (Jan 26, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Excellent video. You make it look so easy.
Jim


----------



## stefang (Apr 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Great demonstration Paul. The first thing I noticed was your new veneer hammer. You used the same method as Patrick Edwards and others I've seen, but I still learned more. I like the idea of pencil marking the strip to make sure you keep the glue more or less restricted the size of the veneer strip. I did wonder if the veneer came in thin strips or did you cut it that way, and if you did why? I can see it would be easier to control the process with thin strips, or did you do it to book match the grain? I also wondered if you had to joint the strip edges prior to gluing. Thanks much for this demonstration.


----------



## grizzman (May 10, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


hey paul, another great training moment, and a much needed repair on friendship, will look forward to seeing the new cover in place, when is the first big sailing trip…maybe some new video this year of you sailing, and the beautiful areas you will be in…have a great day…....bob


----------



## LeeJ (Jul 4, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


HI PAul,

You gotta love the ease of working with hot hide glue. And anyone that doubts it's strength should edge glue two boards together, without clamps, then test it's strength a while later.

It's amazing!

Lee


----------



## Bluepine38 (Dec 14, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the demo. Not that it ever rains in your area, but what are you using for a cover until this is finished?
Thank you once again for sharing.


----------



## garysharp (Nov 14, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Thanks Paul,
Great video, it's a great demonstration of how easy it is to use hide glue. Looks like I have a couple of the tools in my future my wife thanks you for helping to support American Express. You have a great day, and thanks for the time sharing this with us.


----------



## lumberdustjohn (Sep 24, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Interesting process.
Thanks for sharing


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Thanks everyone.

*gavininzagreb*, surely there is hide glue available near you. It is more commonly used in Europe than it is here.

*Mike*, I did joint them. They had one straight edge already but I tight-stacked them and ran them through the TS to joint and even them. You were all around the reason but missed it. If it was a solid mahogany hatch, it would be made up if strips about this size in order to form the curve. This will aid the illusion.

*Gus*, I'm making the top up in the shop. The hatch, with duct tape repair will remain on the boat until I bring it home on a fine day and replace the top.


----------



## vikingcape (Jan 3, 2013)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Well I just learned something today. Thank you for sharing Mr. Paul


----------



## phtaylor36 (Jun 13, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Great Video Paul. Now we just need a video of the Epoxy finish. That stuff seems tricky…


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


I'm using S1 sealer. It goes on like a thin varnish, soaks in and crosslinks to make a really watertight but thin finish. It won't look "plasitc-y" and it won't require sanding except to tooth it for topcoat.


----------



## Kentuk55 (Sep 21, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Wow. Git er done, Paul


----------



## Ken90712 (Sep 2, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Wow great job and great video…. I never really understood this type of veneering. Thx so much for sharing….


----------



## nzmerlin (Apr 9, 2013)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Wonderful work, not into that large stuff I'm into scrolling.

I must look you up I'm in Foxton, down the road a stones throw away.

*Merlin*


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Thanks Merlin, You can throw a stone a really long way !!!
I live in Canada…. The closest part to NZ though ….


----------



## NormG (Mar 5, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


I had never seen this process done, wonderfully done, thanks


----------



## mochoa (Oct 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Looks pretty dang easy to me. Great demonstration.


----------



## rustythebailiff (Jan 31, 2013)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the vid Paul. It brings all the stuff I have read together, and makes it much less daunting.


----------



## borny (Nov 11, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Hey Paul, quick question, I was looking for an opinion. I want to make and veneer some small chest of drawers out of plywood. Would you veneer the plywood, then build the box or build the box, then veneer.

Thanks in advance!


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


You can do either really. Veneering after is only possible with HHG/hammer veneering but allows lots of design options like matching grain on corners, hiding joinery etc. I guess my answer would be that it depends on the job and what you want. It is a little easier to veneer first but not difficult to veneer after assembly.
The last part of this blog entry shows a veneering after assembly project, my workbench.


----------



## borny (Nov 11, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


Thanks Paul, you confirmed my thoughts! Btw, I like what you are doing and its exactly what I would like to do.. Meaning the technique you are using to veneer and incorporating into projects. Another question, do you have an issue with the seems separating when the glue dries? Or do you over lap the seems and double cut them?

Also what do use to cut the veneer, a veneer saw or utility knife?

Thanks again!


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *A Little Hammer Veneering Video*
> 
> *I'm working on* a new top for the sliding hatch on my sailboat to replace the $136 piece of medium bronze acrylic that I sat on the other day…. Crack !!!.... This time I cold molded a curved panel from 3 layers of 1/8" cedar on opposing diagonals and decided to make it appear to be a solid mahogany hatch. This would be difficult to press with either my screw press or clamps and would require substantial jigging to vacuum bag so the obvious answer seemed to be to hammer it. Of course I also was dying to try out my new real (not home made) veneer hammer from Tools for Working Wood and the new glue brushes from the same order. Don't worry about the hide glue on a boat thing. This will be coated in epoxy when finished and will never be soaked for a long period in hot water.
> 
> ...


You can certainly overlap and cut both together. That works very well especially with thinner veneers. With thicker ones you may want to joint them and just pull them together with the hammer as in the above video.

No, I haven't had any problems with seams separating after the glue dries. Hide glues dry hard and don't creep like pva glues do.
I cut veneer with a veneer saw from Gramercy Tools, exacto knives, and sometimes the table saw. It all depends on the application.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

*Pressing with Hot Cauls*

*Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
Here's how the whole thing works.

*First of all* I set out my substrate and marquetry panel and applied hot glue to the whole surface of the substrate, just as I would have if I could press it all at once. Then I applied the marquetry and pressed the top 20". In the photo below the marquetry is in the press and the last several inches can be seen curling up a little away from the substrate behind the press.










*When the glue* was sufficiently cured, I removed the piece from the press and heated a 10" x 20" piece of 1/4" aluminium on one of the BBQ's. If you are wondering why I have two BBQ's it's because I also have 20" square cauls. They are 1/2" thick and hold heat longer but this smaller one was all I needed here. You can see them a couple of layers below the piece being pressed. The reason you can't see the marquetry is that the side that is up is covered by the french kraft paper that it was assembled on. This will be soaked off after the glue has set over night.










*When the caul was hot*, I placed it on the unglued end of the piece …....










*and pressed it again*. The heat of the caul re-liquifies the hide glue and presses it to a perfect flat 100% glued job just as if the glue had been fresh from the pot. It's worth mentioning that the heating takes about a minute, maybe less. Remember the glue is made from skin. If the caul burns your skin it will burn the glue, so hot to the touch but still touchable is the right temp.










*Here you can see* the end pressed first sticking out from the back of the press.










*This is one scenario* where hot cauls really pay off, but it is only one. There are many more. For instance any time that you are worried that your glue may have cooled too much to be certain that your glue-up is perfect, you can pop it in the hot press and stop worrying. Also it comes in very handy for flattening veneer. I have two bottles of veneer softener that I have never used because I can flatten just about anything by wetting it with plain water and putting it in the press with hot cauls. when they cool, it's flat. If it's still too moist I do it again with some newsprint to absorb the excess. Works for figures and burls and even fragile cupped pieces.

*Gotta love that hide glue.*

Thanks for looking in.

Paul


----------



## Sodabowski (Aug 23, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


A-ha! so you have a better modus operandi that I do for flattening veneer by means of water and heat - maybe is it the local water that makes a difference, here in Paris, Frogland we have the crappiest tap water around (full of carbonates).

I'll keep this Al plates idea aside and see if it can be mixed with a vacuum press. Thanks for the tip Paul


----------



## stefang (Apr 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


Looks like an excellent way to work the hide glue Paul. I'll have to see if I can find any aluminum plates and BBQ grills. I wonder if the plates can be heated enough with a heat gun? More work, but I'm not sure I can find grills like that here. I suppose smaller plates could just be heated in the kitchen oven. Thanks for this great blog.


----------



## SPalm (Oct 9, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


You had me at veneer flattening. Hmmm.
Thanks Paul.

Steve


----------



## Jim Jakosh (Nov 24, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


Very neat setup, Paul!!


----------



## nomercadies (Dec 31, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


Do you have information on making the press? Looks like something a person could use for several different processes.


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## longgone (May 5, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


Paul…I never do any veneering…but I look at your techniques and work and always get amazed in such a good way…!


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


*nomercadies*, You can find the press in my projects here.
I use it every day for all sorts of things. Most of the details you need are in the project post photos. I have more photos if you need them.


----------



## Karson (May 9, 2006)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


Paul: Using the heated plate, how long does it take to heat the glue and then loose enough of the heat to break everything down.


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


It.depends on the thickness of the plate. Cool to touch is a good indicator. I would usually leave the 1/2" cauls a few hours at least. I also have 1/8" ones that I use a lot more often and they will usually be cool enough in an hour or so.
That said it's always best to leave it longer.


----------



## LeeJ (Jul 4, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


Very nice setup, Paul!!


----------



## mochoa (Oct 9, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


Great tip Paul, thanks for sharing.


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## grizzman (May 10, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


now come on Paul, admit you stick some steaks down there and it inspires you to work harder, but if they also help with your woodwork, then what a good deal…your a pretty smart guy, i always love seeing what you show us in ways of getting something done when there is a challenge , oh and by the way, if i happen to come by, i like my steaks medium rare..mushrooms and onions also…


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


COOL lil BBQ Press you have there…

You could make a hamburger mold… press'em… yep… cook'em too… LOL

That a nice wood gluing press too… I can see how you could put longer pieces for top/bottom with work between and cauls on the outsides to get more out of the press…

Nice COMBO…


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## BigTiny (Jun 29, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


For longer pieces that aren't TOO much longer than the press, why not use longer pressing cauls and use clamps on the outer ends?

Paul


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## BigTiny (Jun 29, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Pressing with Hot Cauls*
> 
> *Today I was* pressing some marquetry that was 26" long. That's not necessarily a problem with hot hide glue unless your press is only 20" square like mine. Fortunately when I designed my press, I made accommodation for pressing much larger panels than will fit in the press itself by adding the two cheap bar-b-ques on the lower shelf.
> Here's how the whole thing works.
> ...


To Stefang:

A heat gun would work, but the trick would be keeping the heat even over the entire piece.

A better idea is to measure the oven racks in your stove and have cauls made that will fit in it. Leave about an inch or two space around the edges for heat to travel around the oven. Set it for 200 F and then let cool until it is hot to the touch but not too hot to handle, then use.

Heated cauls are also great for fixing "oopses" in veneering as it will loosen pieces so you can reposition them. Use a caul just large enough to cover the area you want to fix.

Paul


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

*Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*

*I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17. 
The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.

*After rolling the problem around* in my head for a while I came up with the following solution. It has a couple of quirks but also a few unforeseen pluses.










*First of all*, and the feature that attracted me most right off the top is the cost. With the advent of the coffee pod these things are available very cheaply at any second hand store. Most of you probably have one in the basement that was replaced when it's carafe broke…... right? I didn't so I had to pay $5 for this one.

*The second plus* is that it holds a temperature in the pot of …... 140 F!

*The third plus* (and I never thought of this until I was messing with it) is that you can put cold water in the tank and it will fill your outer glue pot with 200 degree water in a couple of minutes. Then you add the inner pot with the glue in it and it takes over and holds a perfect 140 F.

*Now the quirks*,

1) The heating element times out after two hours. I'm sure I can bypass that but if you turn it off and back on now and then it works just fine.
2) These machines have a raised ring around the heating plate that is smaller than the bottom of this glue pot. It is there to keep the carafe in place but in my use it prevents the pot from touching the heating plate and that just doesn't work at all.










*The element heats* to about 200 F…..










*... but even after* I added a 1/4" aluminium disc to make contact with the pot, all I could get was about 125 degrees.
Then I noticed that it was a little tippy and I could rock it a bit on its bottom. That was the last piece in the puzzle. I hit the bottom of the cast iron pot with the belt sander until it was flat and everything fell into place. It now perks along at almost exactly 140 with the water in the big pot at about 170.



















*I was considering* cutting the top part away for better access but I kind of like the water heating feature and after using it all afternoon today, I find it isn't hard to get the brush in and out as-is so for now it will stay intact.

*Total cost* ...

Glue pot. $17
Coffee maker. $ 5
Aluminium scrap. $5

Not a bad deal as it is considerably more temperature stable than my kettle/jar model.

Thanks for looking in.

Paul


----------



## Jim Jakosh (Nov 24, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


That is a nice piece of problem solving, professor. Nice going, Paul!!
When I was reading the part where the bottom did not touching the element, I was going to suggest an aluminum disc. I made an aluminum basket for my grill to grill vegetables in and it transfers heat really well.
You figured it out very will with that flattening to make positive contact!!

Jim


----------



## dclark1943 (May 30, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Looks to me like you could give McGiver a run for his money : )


----------



## a1Jim (Aug 9, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Very creative Paul.


----------



## Sigung (Nov 20, 2013)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


That's usin' your noggin!


----------



## toeachhisown (Eddie) (Mar 30, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


very cleaver ,Paul ,thanks


----------



## Druid (Sep 30, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Great job of recycling Paul, and economical too.


----------



## Texcaster (Oct 26, 2013)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Cheers Paul, always good to know a new way to … "remove skin from squirrel", Boris Badenov.


----------



## TopamaxSurvivor (May 2, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Paul, If you decide you want to try the hotplate, an incandescent dimmer rated high enough to carry the load should regulate the hot plate down further from its lowest setting. 2000 watt would probably be best.


----------



## madburg (Feb 3, 2016)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Yet another cheap and cheerful version - great idea. I looked at the Heat Hold and thought there has to be something cheaper to boil water in!!! So I bought a new Rice cooker for $14 Australian, put a tin can for the glue in the internal bowl that normally holds the rice/water. I made an internal lid out of a plastic plate, cut down to form and inner lid on the rice pot with a hole in it for the tin can glue pot.










So a bit cheaper than yours Paul!!! Having said that I've not tried it yet, so it might be a failure!!!!!!


----------



## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Thanks all,

Thanks *Bob*, I figured I could do that but I wanted to try this and it has a smaller footprint than my hotplate.

*Martin*, my kettle/jar is about that price too but I was looking for something to heat the traditional pot this time.
I hope the cooker works for you. If it has a thermostat you should be good.

BTW, the HoldHeet doesn't involve water. I really like them because they are deadly steady on temperature and low maintenance. I just plug it in and forget it. This one seems almost as good though.


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## rance (Sep 30, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Nice work Paul. I like repurposing like this. Having said that though, if I were a student, then it'd really aggrivate me to have to try to get the brush in and under that overhang. It may not bother you, but others may not be so flexible. Just a thought. 

And for future reference, sand might be a reasonable conductor in place of that aluminum disc.


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


I'm sure you are right Rance and I will eventually end up cutting the top off but for now the novelty is kind if fun. The students won't have to use it either. It's just to show another option.
I did think of sand and agree it would likely work but I was afraid it would end up all over the place. :-(


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## Kiwib0y (Aug 8, 2015)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Thanks for sharing your experience with a new heating method. I am sure some manufactures must get a surprise sometimes to find out how their produces are been used


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## JR45 (Jan 26, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Here's another cheap option for preparing HHG.
In addition to using a traditional pot and hot water I have also used this gadget which costs about £10 and was originally intended for melting waxes used in beauty treatments. It has a thermostat and does what it says it will do on the label.

















Unfortunately I don't seem to be able to post these pictures in the correct orientation even though I have rotated the originals several times.! Apologies for that.
Jim


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## kiefer (Feb 5, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Good and inexpensive option and like Rance mentioned the sand is a workable idea .
I got an old coffee maker and may give this a shot .

Klaus


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## robscastle (May 13, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


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## robscastle (May 13, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


and, Paul sad to say it looks like I will not be dropping in for that friendly cup of coffee in the workshop after all!!


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## madts (Dec 30, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Pretty smart there Shipwright. I plan to try this with a crockpot. We have a small one that we never use.

-Madts.


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## MLWilson (Jun 28, 2015)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


A rice cooker. Imagine that!
Jim Rowe: Rowe and resize to 1080:810.
*Paul*: You're a genius.


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## JR45 (Jan 26, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Thanks for the resizing info.
Jim


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## Sylvain (Jul 23, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


I have read somewhere that the first task for the apprentice arriving in the morning was to heat the glue pots.
Now you have a timer to do the apprentice's job.

On the percolator I use in the kitchen, the filter support swings lateraly for filling and emtying, so I could get it out of the way easily.


















the other machine is a pod machine but I like to have 3 cups in the morning.


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


That would be a better style I agree. I will likely be cutting mine down as I really don't need the water heating feature. I have the kettle from the kettle/jar rig.


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


Paul, have you tried one of the Induction type of cooking tops? (where you can set the Temp. you want)


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Another Inexpensive Hide Glue Heater*
> 
> *I already have* an electric glue pot (HoldHeet) for heating my glue and an electric kettle with a glass jar for backup but for the school I want to be able to show as many options as I can so …..... I started cruising eBay last winter and was fortunate enough to win an auction for a fine old traditional cast iron glue pot for the princely sum of $17.
> The problem arose when I tried it out on the hotplate I use for my sand shading. Even at the lowest setting, the glue would reach in excess of 170 F which is too hot and on the verge of burning it.
> ...


No Joe. I use my Hold Heet pot all the time. I will hardly ever use this one. i Just wanted to show the students another option.


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

*Reversible is Good*

*I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.

*Perhaps you can understand* my disappointment when I went out to the shop this morning and discovered that one of the lozenges was glued in upside down and fully cured.
I will let the pictures tell the tale but suffice to say that I was able to salvage and reuse the lozenge thanks to the wonders of hide glue 

*What's wrong with this picture?*










*Upside down!*










*Heat, water and a knife.*










*Reinforcing paper removed.*










*Lifting the petals ….*










*...and the background.*










*All the parts removed intact.*










*Re-assembled and ready to use ….. right side up this time!*










*You just can't* do this with any other glue. You gotta love it.

Thanks for looking in,

Paul


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## Schwieb (Dec 3, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Have to admit there is something to be said for forgiveness in hide glue. We get so used to the glues we typically use because the are available for use right out of the bottle, but just the same, very unforgiving. I am counting the days until I have the opportunity to work with you and learn more about this subject. I'm working on a plan to do just that before we all get too old or just can't do it any more.


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


There is still room in June Ken. I'd love to lure you to the dark side. (the hide side?).


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


I became a convert to hide glue a while back. To be more specific - liquid hide glue. After buying a bottle of Old Brown Glue and loving it, I decided I could make something just as good for far less money (like 80% less as it turned out). It took some tweaking to get the right viscosity in a decent temperature range, but I'm very happy with my recipe now.

I do buy my dry glue from Patrick (the creator of Old Brown Glue). It's really reasonable in bulk and they are awesome to do business with. I got a 5 lb bag of urea for $14 on Amazon - enough to last years. I saw the recipes that called for table salt, but I figured if Patrick used urea, that was the way to go.

I like how the viscosity varies with temperature. If I really need to spread it around, I can warm it up a bit. If I want something less drippy for box joints or dovetails, I can cool it down.

I've already found the reversibility useful on several occasions. I use it almost exclusively now, one exception being for entry doors, which get wet and hot here in Arizona. For those I stick with plastic resin glue.

Great series of posts Paul. I'm sure you'll convert more woodworkers with your clear instructions. Liquid or not, it really is great stuff to work with.


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## Detoro (Jan 17, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Finally, I'm starting to understand your work a bit better! 
I'm getting closer to applying your method of adornment to my boots! 
Oh, what possibilities!!
Regards, Roman


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## Bob Collins (Apr 25, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Great post Paul and glad you were able to save your work. Would the Titebond Liquid hide Glue be similar, I have glued up sections of a Mobius Ribbon arse about with normal glue and ruined the project by forcing it apart, it states
that hide glue can be disassembled using moisture, if so you have a convert. Thanks for posting.


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Thanks folks.

*Rich* I do use OBG on occasion but I really prefer all the advantages that I get from hot hide glue. When I need open time on a three dimensional piece I use liquid but as most of my veneering and marquetry are two dimensional at the time of pressing I prefer to use hot and apply hot cauls if necessary. I like the fast tack and I like to hammer veneer so hot is definitely my go to glue.

*Roman*, I know a place where you can learn marquetry…


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## Druid (Sep 30, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Nice recovery Paul. It sure proves your point about the benefits of hide glue for marquetry.
Now you have me wondering what this will become?


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...





> Thanks folks.
> 
> *Rich* I do use OBG on occasion but I really prefer all the advantages that I get from hot hide glue. When I need open time on a three dimensional piece I use liquid but as most of my veneering and marquetry are two dimensional at the time of pressing I prefer to use hot and apply hot cauls if necessary. I like the fast tack and I like to hammer veneer so hot is definitely my go to glue.
> - shipwright


Your work is beautiful, Paul. I will defer to you in any discussion of hide glue. I'm always evolving, so hot hide glue is not excluded from my future. I have a large inventory of dry glue laying around. All I need is a pot.


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


I gave it a shot when I had to glue all these drawer boxes up after final smoothing.










After all the questions I asked I kind of expected a certain result. It surpassed all expectations. I really didn't think it would clean up so easy. Now I don't have to dread gluing joinery up and the resmoothing everything afterwards to make sure there weren't any pva smears. Love it.

Thanks again for all the help Shipwright.


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## JoeLyddon (Apr 22, 2007)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Well, it looks like you hid from That one using Hide glue!

Very good Save and Luck!

Very nice result!

COOL! LOL


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## shipwright (Sep 27, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Thanks again,

*Bob*, water and heat together. Yes it will work fine but for small, hard to clamp glue ups like your strips hot would be even better as you could assemble them by just holding them in place for a minute and then setting them aside, no clamps.

*Rich* I have 50 lbs or so if you ever run out.


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## mafe (Dec 10, 2009)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Thanks for sharing all of this with us all, especially also the mistakes and how to fix them.
Always so wonderful to see what you are up to.
Best of my thoughts dear Paul,
Mads


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## DocSavage45 (Aug 14, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Paul,

Good to see another lesson posted. You have mastered the Patience neccessary to do the great things you do which of course comes from practice, planning and all the rest of the "P's" of woodworking. I got some* learnin *in hammer veneer work last November. Hyde glue smell takes some getting used too? LOL!

It's on my "to do " list.

I know as an ADHD woodworker I have a lot of "Patience" to learn. LOL!

Thanks for sharing you knowledge!


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## dclark1943 (May 30, 2012)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Paul, looks like you are the "pied piper" of marquetry - - loyal following ! nice work, and really interesting explaining the "reversal". Keep on gluing !


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## craftsman on the lake (Dec 27, 2008)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Elmers white glue can also be removed with heat. We use a flat iron to heat up and remove fretboards from guitars to replace them. It's a horrible person who glues fretboards on with titebond. The cardinal rule is white glue only.


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## kiefer (Feb 5, 2011)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Keep it up educating us on this glue and the methods !
I use it here and there and have had some good results after some initial disappointments but I guess it's like all the things we do practise makes perfect and even then we make mistakes as you demonstrated but with this glue it's reversible .

THANKS FOR YOUR GREAT LESSONS

Klaus


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## Kentuk55 (Sep 21, 2010)

shipwright said:


> *Reversible is Good*
> 
> *I'm doing a little* make work project in the shop while some veneer I recently dyed dries completely. It involves a repetition of diamond shaped lozenges with a flower in each. I made forty-eight from packets of twelve layers and the project requires all forty-eight.
> 
> ...


Wow Paul! That's one heck of a save. You-da-man.


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