# Woodsmith CNC Router



## brucem26

Hi all,
I am quite interested in the DIY CNC router featured in the current issue of Woodsmith magazine. It looks great and the components used all seem very good quality. My questions are:
a) Is anyone else considering this build?
b) Any reservations or concerns on the design?
c) Is there any downside to building your own CNC router? Tremendous cost savings and I think it would be a very cool project to make but is there any solid reasons why you wouldn't go down this path?

Many thanks.


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## moke

I saw that too, a couple days after the magazine came out I went to a seminar at Woodsmith, so I asked about it. The fellow that gave the seminar is not the fellow that worked on the project but said he saw it in the shop and thought is was neat, but did not know anything about it. He did say it was a two magazine article build. I failed to ask the cost of the motors/kit.
So think their should be more in the next issue.


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## lew

I looked at the the on-line parts list and was quite surprised at the cost of "their" sources. I think with a little digging you could find the electronics a bit cheaper.


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## wormil

I hadn't seen it yet.

The sources page is broken for me.
https://www.woodsmith.com/magazine/sources/242/cnc-router/


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## DS

The downside of building your own CNC is the lack of support from an overall manufacturer. You are basically on your own to ensure the proper function and usability of your machine.

This may not be a problem if you are the type of person to get in and figure things out. I've found that no matter how I build on my machine I can always come up with a better way down the road and I am too tempted to tear into it and rebuild it again.

Sometimes a situation will call for a turn-key machine that can become productive right away. The trade off is between time and money.

If the journey is about building a machine and you can spend time more than money, then there is no problem. 
If the journey is about building projects on the machine right away, then plan on spending more money than time on a turn-key machine.

Additionally, you will find that the CAD and CAM software you use will determine the utility of whichever machine you have as much as, or more than, the specific hardware features of the machine.


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## avsmusic1

> Additionally, you will find that the CAD and CAM software you use will determine the utility of whichever machine you have as much as, or more than, the specific hardware features of the machine.
> 
> - DS


I can't speak to the initial question, but i will say that I've seen DS's last point made in nearly every single CNC convo I've heard or thread I've read


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## mpsprunger

good project for good, tolerant, patient craftsman, CNC equipment requires these talents. Stepper motors are noise, the specs are very tight for accurate machining. The backlash in the leadscrew assemblies is critical. The possibility racking in the gantry always exists if anything is slightly off. It can be accomplished


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## xeddog

I have been considering one for quite a while, having learned quite a bit about some of the basic mechanics and principles involved from my 3d printers. I don't think I would need one as large the article describes, but maybe more like 18×24 inches, and using a palm router instead of a "real" router. I haven't looked through the article in detail, but I did notice they said the cost of the project minus software (and I think also not including a router) was about $1300. I still have a lot of questions though.

Wayne


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## Lazyman

I saw that article and have been considering building a CNC machine for a while now. Everytime I think about making one like the WS version, a little research always leads me back to buying a kit from OpenBuilds or possibly one of the Mill Right machines. While the challenge of making one from scratch sounds like fun, having never used one, it am not sure I would know what I don't know.


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## brucem26

Well I'm going to jump in with both feet. I too looked at the OpenBuilds units. I think that DS really nailed it… if making the machine is as much of a goal as is making projects with the machine it's a good fit. If you just need a CNC and are only considering building for the cost savings you might be approaching it the wrong way.
I'm a pretty methodical guy, attention to detail, etc so am feeling that this will be a big challenge to see if I can match the tolerances required. Probably won't start until I see part 2 of the article but I've got a good idea now of what's going to be entailed as well as some ideas to improve on the design already (adding drag chains, emergency stop button, limit switches, overhead gantry mounted LED, etc.)
Will definitely post pictures once I get rolling.


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## diverlloyd

Bruce I think you can cut a lot of the cost down but looking at banggood.com for parts. I don't catch what stepper motors they are using but banggood has lots of parts.


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## wormil

If I order from a place called banggood.com it better come with pretty hair and a smile.


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## diverlloyd

Rick everytime I make a post about them usually add the "it's not a adult site". The name comes from the best bang for the buck and a good deal. It has been a safe site so far while using the PayPal option. I have been looking at a couple of their soldering stations and a lot extra laser burner parts. I'm very satisfied with the burner.


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## Mike_D_S

Bruce,

One piece of advice I would have for a DIY builder is don't skimp on the steppers, controllers, etc. If you like the process and want to go bigger you don't want to have to buy the hardware a second time.

When I looked at a DIY build initially the cost differences for the hardware was fairly nominal.

Mike


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## wormil

Lloyd, I'm just kiddin ya. But the first time you posted it on hot deals I did a double take.


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## Tmanpdx

I'm on my 2nd version of my own CNC and looking at the video, I think you will learn a lot but you will be ultimately disappointed with the accuracy & repeatability and without close loop servo controllers, you're going to find that it will tear itself apart if you're not there to stop it.

I learned the hard way. Spent $$ buying a basic kit from pdjinc.com - without the controller & built my own. It's based on 80/20 frame with linear guide rails. Found that because it was put together with bolts and screws, it was constantly getting out of alignment as even a small bit of movement compounded over the 4'x4' area was enough to make things not accurate. The X Axis would get out of step & skew the gantry when something got hung up (ball screws can get gunk in them and they lock up) and if it wasn't for me being there, it would have torn itself apart.

Looking at the woodsmith one, with it made of wood, I just don't see how you're going to have the accuracy to do anything worthwhile.

I do so much with my CNC, such as dado's, dovetail slides, bowties to strengthen cracks in slabs, mortise & tennon, etc that I was going crazy with a few thousandths of an inch out (bowtie won't fit), or dado's that aren't the same width 24" apart - so your casework is tight on oneside & loose on another.

So, I enlisted a friend of mine to use his Haas mill to make all new brackets with threaded inserts and I upgraded from the 1/2" ball screws to 1" ball screws and added servos to ensure it won't get out of whack and lengthened the bed to 6' instead of 4', so now it's a 4×6.

I was into this for about $6K initially, and then another $3-4K for the complete overhaul.

I can see the appeal of building your own. I learned an incredible amount, but the accuracy on a wood built CNC is going to only be able to those 3D relief carvings because they don't need the accuracy & no one would be able to tell the difference. If you want to do anything that requires repeatability and accuracy (dado's, butterflies, mortise & tenon, etc) you're going to need to have a more stable & robust platform.

I can't tell you how much I've enjoyed my CNC. It allows me to do things like the past 3 days where I cranked out 20 charcuterie boards with the same handle on all of them. I use vacuum hold downs to make setup a lot easier (most of the 3 days was jointing, glueing & planing).

But I would really tell you to head over to cnczone & check out their builds. They are serious. It's going to cost, but in the end you'll have a robust & accurate CNC.


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## oldnovice

*Tmanpdx*, you did raise many valid points in your comments that should not be ignored by those contemplating a CNC.
Rigidity is extremely important and, in my opinion, bolts in wood are not rigid enough!

And, nothing takes the fun out of wood working faster than a bad tool, whether it be a chisel or a CNC.


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## brucem26

So reading all this I guess one has to decide "how accurate is accurate enough for what I'm going to do?" 
I am NOT creating watch parts or circuit boards that need accuracy to .0001 I'm a woodworker, wanting to add CNC capabilities to my work. That might be relief carvings, might be curved templates etc - honestly at this point I really don't know what the possibilities are and probably won't till I start making stuff.

I understand the need for rigidity in the system and accuracy in the build for sure but I don't believe a statement like "bolts in wood are not rigid enough" is warranted across the board. The entire build is using Baltic birch plywood, nylon stop nuts, etc which in my opinion can make for a VERY rigid structure. For sure you need to be able to hold tight tolerances in the build but that is all part of the challenge of a DIY CNC.

Finally, I've asked to chat with the author at WS - I'd really like to know what the experience using this machine has been like and express some of the concerns being raised in this forum thread. We'll see what he says if he replies.


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## Lazyman

According to the WS video that Rick linked to above, they have been using their prototype machine for a couple of years. WS designs are pretty solid in my experience so I don't think that they would publish a design that isn't strong enough for woodworking. There are many successful DIY CNC designs out there that are made using similar materials and techniques. Even a few of the commercial machines use MDF or similar materials for the main structure of their machines. If you are inclined to make your own, this looks like a good one to try to me.


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## oldnovice

*Bruce*, you took my comment about screws in wood way too serious but you have to admit that a bolt in threaded piece of metal is much stronger that a threaded/inserted bolt in wood.

I guess it comes down to do you want to build a CNC or do you want to use a CNC?
Because I spent the latter years of my career in control systen design and automated testing I didn't want to spend my time in my shop building a CNC so I bought a CNC instead!


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## brucem26

Absolutely I agree. The question is "is a bolt in wood strong *enough *for my needs"?
And ya, you're right, I want to build a CNC as much or more as I want to use one! Thanks.


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## oldnovice

*Ah ha*, now we know what *Bruce* is going to do!
I believe that, based on my background, you can understand why I want to use one.
*MrRon*, has a blog on his CNC that you may want to check out.


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## wormil

More on their cnc


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## Ger21

> I m on my 2nd version of my own CNC and looking at the video, I think you will learn a lot but you will be ultimately disappointed with the accuracy & repeatability and without close loop servo controllers, you re going to find that it will tear itself apart if you re not there to stop it.
> ......................
> 
> Looking at the woodsmith one, with it made of wood, I just don t see how you re going to have the accuracy to do anything worthwhile.


I strongly disagree.
My wooden CNC has been running for 10 years now, and it's just as accurate as a $6000 turn key machine.
I started building it in 2003, and have less than $1000 into it.

A wooden machine, properly built, can work very well.

I'm currently working on a 4×8 wood machine that I expect to rival $25,000 steel machines.


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## OG51

If you do decide to go with the project, please let us know how it goes. I am really curious on how this machine holds up.

On the comments above, it really does depend on what you want to do with your cnc machine. Woodworking is a hobby for me. I have a mostly plastic hobby cnc machine but it really meets all my needs. I only do one of a kind gifts or pattern prototypes.

I do not do 2d cutouts with it since typically a table saw or bandsaw is faster than making a one off pattern. Not always but most times. If I had to cut a ton of same cuts that would change of course.

I can see this machine meeting a hobby woodworkers needs if it really works. It will be slow and accuracy may not be super precise but since its not doing production runs it really isn't an issue.

Regardless of what machine you have, software is a key to its success. CAD/CAM experience really helps unless you will be purchasing all your patterns. There a bunch of programs to play with. I would recommend grabbing any trial versions if available and start playing with them to see which one you like. Making custom cnc patterns is a ton of fun.

I had zero background in CAD/CAM as well in cnc when I started but after 6 years I feel very comfortable in making patterns and using my cnc. Expect a steep learning curve with the software at first but it will get easier.


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## Balloonengineer

I have built my own machine (aluminum extrusion, not wood), spent a little under $3K. The v-wheels on aluminum are reminiscent of designs from years ago. Different types of linear rails are now readily available and affordable, I would recommend the upgrade.









I have not looked at their electronic components, but I know that many of the kits of parts sold on ebay or some of the chinese sites are poorly matched. I would do some research and make sure the steppers, drivers and power supply are all properly matched, for best results V = 32 x sqrt(inductance) . The video they show has very slow feed rates. In wood, you need fairly fast feed rates to have suitable "chip load", or you end up creating dust (and heat) and not chips at the high rpm of routers or spindles.. When the feed rates are too slow, the bits tend to overheat and dull more quickly.


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## wormil

I wouldn't build one unless I was going to make it pay but there are so many around these days I bet it's not easy to market.


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## brucem26

One recurring theme I keep hearing is gantry racking potential and inability of V bearings on aluminum angle to do the job. I see component kits such as this on Amazon from Joomen and others. CNC gurus…. is it truly worthwhile moving to steel rails w/ bearings and a ball screw? This drives the cost WAY up there but in the long term might be worthwhile?


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## Ger21

> CNC gurus…. is it truly worthwhile moving to steel rails w/ bearings and a ball screw? This drives the cost WAY up there but in the long term might be worthwhile?


Yes, the difference is substantial. An even better upgrade is to go with "profile" linear rails.
http://www.automation-overstock.com/categories.asp?cat=204

Then are 10x more rigid, and smoother than the round shaft variety.


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## diverlloyd

Rick it's odd adults sites with normal names and parts sites like bang good.


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## brucem26

I had a nice mail back from Chris Fitch who is the author and designer of the Woodsmith CNC router at the heart of this discussion. He made several good points:

*"The goals that I had for the project: 
1) Create a machine that could be built by the most number of woodworkers with average equipment in a reasonable amount of time. 
2) Create a solid high performing machine for the lowest possible cost so that it will be accessible to the most people. 
3) Create a machine that could be reasonably explained in 24 pages of a woodworking magazine (not so easy).

My hope in this machine is to provide a simple, obtainable starting point for people to enter into the world on CNC machining. I hope that people will take the base design and modify it, upgrade it , customize it, and share their ideas."*

I think these comments are right on the money and well serve to justify the design…. no this isn't an industrial quality, production CNC machine. It's meant for a woodworker who wants to stick his/her toe into the CNC arena and see what it holds with some assurance that they will come out with something tried, proven and very useful at the end. This is where I am at.


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## TomM

I built one years ago for about $700, which included the computer, software, steppers, drivers, and everything. It was a "black pipe and rollerskate bearing" model that I built to cut out electric guitar bodies I cut out a few, then it turned into a dust collector for years. I just sold it a few weeks ago to a co-worker who wanted an entry level machine. Out of the total cost, there was about $250 in QUALITY Acme anti backlash nuts, bearings, shaft couplers. When I started it I knew I could build all the moving parts, so I challenged myself to the start- I said If I just bought a stepper motor and controller, and learned the programming and setup, and it moved in a predictable manner with the freeware out there, then I would start building the machine.

Here's a video of the thing running from long ago. 



 As with other things in life, building the first one just teaches you how to build the second one.

I might start another one later this year, most likely a Maslow type - https://www.maslowcnc.com/

CNC routers are very fun to build, the good and bad is that they turn into their own hobby sometimes. I've had a laser for 10 years and that does some nice cabinet door engravings. Right now I'm just having fun working on my basic woodworking skills.


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## Lazyman

I just stumbled upon this video on a new CNC design that looks interesting. Looks like a startup but the simplicity is pretty cool.


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## brucem26

Well the CNC router build is underway. I made a few changes to the design in Woodsmith - most notably using ball screws instead of lead screws/backlash nuts. I have received all of the ball screws (1500mm, 900mm and 400mm) and I think this will add a lot to the tool. I've also gone with a 1200 oz X axis motor to ensure no power problems. Finally I added a secondary power supply to deliver lower voltages for other bits like LED lights, cooling fans (2) and the USB control board. No obstacles yet. Fingers crossed!


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## brucem26

I bought the ball screws from China. 
https://www.ebay.ca/usr/linearmotionbearings2008

The man that helped me, Chai, was fantastic. He helped with immediate responses, threw in a few extras and had it all shipped via DHL Express. I had it in my workshop in under one week.

Top marks to LinearMotionBearings2008…. excellent company to deal with and the quality of the products is PERFECT!


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## Ger21

> I ve also gone with a 1200 oz X axis motor to ensure no power problems.


You made the cardinal sin of the CNC beginner.

With stepper motors, bigger is quite often not better. Stepper motors lose torque as rpm's increase.
If you have 5mm pitch ballscrews, then you need high rpm's to get decent speed.
In most cases, a high quality 400oz stepper will outperform the 1200oz ones you bought, sometimes by 2-3x.


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## ArtMann

I already have a commercial CNC router but I am very interested in your project for its own sake. I hope you will continue this thread as work progresses and I wish you the very best of luck in this endeavor.


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## brucem26

Base is pretty much done. Gantry sides are cut out.
If you are building this unit from Woodsmith, there is a dimension error in the location of the bearings for the gantry X axis. PM me if you need the correct values.
All of the steppers, controllers, power supplies switches, etc have arrived - this is starting to become a reality!


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## HerringImpaired

The new Woodsmith magazine is here! With part 2 of the CNC router project!


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## Henryp7768

I just received my copy of their part 2 of the build. I am some what disappointed in the information they supplied about the electronics necessary. Nothing was included about what controller board they selected, nothing about what stepper drivers etc. I have 40+ years of experience in Electronics and am very familiar with stepper motor systems. I helped my nephew select and make his Very Large Format 3D dual extruder printer. While I can easily select my own control system and drivers most readers will not have the experience necessary. I checked the "Online Extra's" and there is a hardware list but nothing about the boards or their specifications. This is the first time since I started with issue #1 that I have been disappointed with a Woodsmith article.

If I missed it can someone please point out where it is located!!


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## brucem26

Hi Henry,
In the article Chris used a combination sold by BuildYourCNC.com The "kit" includes:
(2) NEMA 24 425 oz-in stepper motors
(2) Drivers (3.0Amp 24-40 Volts, 1-1/64 microstepping)
(1) NEMA 34 651 oz-in stepper motor
(1) Driver (6.0Amp 24-70 Volts, 1/2-1/256 microstepping)
(1) 36v 8.8a Power Supply
(1) Interface Board Depending on the One Selected (USB or Parallel)

This is specified in the bill of materials in on-line extras.

I ended up purchasing my components a la carte from a Canadian supplier (The Stepper Motor Store - www.steppermotorcanada.ca) (excellent to deal with I might add) and went with a larger power supply and a larger X axis motor. I'll be posting more pics of the build in a few days - coming along great!


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## Henryp7768

Thanks for the info Bruce, but I still cannot find the bill of materials your referencing. I found the CNC Router Materials & Hardware list (http://www.woodsmith.com/magazine/extras/242/cnc-router-materials-and-hardware-list/) but it does not include the information you provided. Where did I miss it?

By the way my Nephew that I helped make his 3D printer is now a distributor for Openbuilds. So I pretty much get my materials at cost. From where I retired from I have enough new Nema 24 , 34 and 37 steppers that were dumped out from excess inventory to build several. I will be selecting the control boards and drivers soon and was wondering what they were using.


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## brucem26

You have to d/l the PDF and open it in order to see the hyperlinks to the suppliers.


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## Henryp7768

Thank you, I did in fact miss the link. I was expecting a detailed list, not a link to a complete kit.


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## BrianSiano

Love to see progress on this. I'm thinking about building this, and I could use the inspiration.

One question, about the cams that hold the gantry on the rails. The plans specify them as being made of wood, with a 1" dowel glued to a knob. Is there some other method of attaching this? Some hardware that does the same job?


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## brucem26

To tell you the truth Brian I was a bit skeptical at first about them as well but having tried it, they work great. Remember that these cams/knobs are simply the mechanism to adjust the bearings so they are in full contact with the rail. They are locked down in place with nut/bolt. They also give you an easy way to release the bearings for removal or to tighten them up a bit if things start to wear and loosen over time.
Using this method also gives you the ability to fine tune the amount of cam action simply by varying the offset of the 3/8" diameter hole in the dowel.

Feel free to PM me directly if you have any specific questions about the build. I must say it is quite an experience seeing it come together.


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## Henryp7768

I can see why they went with the shop made cam assemblies. The eccentric bolts that are normally used are a bit spendy and you would have trouble finding them that fit all the way through the 3/4" plywood. The ones we used in the past typically fit through a 1/4 to 3/8 (6-8 mm) thick aluminum plate. Once locked in place there is no real wear on the shafts.


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## brucem26

It's getting there. I finally have an X axis! How do you like my "stepper motor"? LOL
You really need to be deadly accurate with the location of bearings, motor mounts etc at this stage. Any misalignment would put a lot of stress on motor, bearings etc. VERY happy I went with ball screws instead of lead screw.


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## wormil

Bruce did you buy detailed plans (if they have any) or just going by the magazine? My experience with Woodsmith is their plans give the absolute bare minimum information possible, to the point you have to cross reference between plans and specs. I haven't seen these issues yet so I don't know if that is true here.


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## brucem26

Hi Rick,
I just went by the plans in the magazine but indeed I drew up full size plans of key areas before starting construction. I've made a few changes to the unit, most notably using ball screws with end bearings rather than lead screws so full size drawings were definitely a must.
I have to say though that the plans in Woodsmith in general I find to be extremely well thought out and illustrated. A few dimensional errors but that is to be expected in a project of this complexity.
I would also say that Woodsmith tends to underplay the level of effort required for some projects. IMO this one should warrant a "high experience required". You need to be comfortable working in both imperial and metric (all of the ball screws, motor mounts etc are metric) and more importantly you need to be comfortable working to +/- 1/64" maximum in your tolerances. A precision machine like this just won't do its' job if things don't quite align… for instance Baltic Birch is 17.5mm and not 3/4" You have to be aware of how those differences add up, where it's critical and where it isn't.

Not trying to scare anyone away from tackling this project - I'm having the time of my life building it - just be prepared for some engineering, visualizing things in 3D and ensuring all your blades and tooling are accurate and razor sharp. Go for it!


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## MrRon

Oldnovice directed this thread to my CNC build. I started it 7 years ago and still have not finished it due to health reasons and priority of other projects. To be completely truthful, I don't think I will be able to complete it as I am running out of time (84 years old). I started out on the project with much enthusiasm with the goal to machine aluminum in support of my hobby of building model trains. Overall, the size of the CNC was too big. I didn't think it would be rigid enough for metal working, so I started to redesign it to a smaller more rigid size. One thing led to another and here I am 7 years later with a partially built CNC that will never be used. One of the reasons why I have pretty much dropped the project is cost. I was trying to get by with the least cost for materials by designing my own parts, but there comes a point when "you gotta spend the money". I think it would probably work ok for wood, but not metal. Anyway, I consider the project dead. I don't want to discourage you in any way from building a CNC. If you have the time and want the challenge of building as opposed to buying, then go for it. Cost can add up pretty quickly when you start looking for the best materials and parts. There are a lot of Chinese made parts available from Amazon, but their quality is questionable. In my build, I was trying to avoid any Chinese made parts and that sent the cost skyward.


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## ssnvet

Home brew wood (usually MDF) framed CNC routers have been around for quite a while and there are several proven open source designs available out there. Joe's 2006 CNC router is very similar to the picture the OP posted and plans are available to download for free at cnczone.com.

For hobby use and learning these little machines are fine. The reason they are inexpensive to build is because they usually have:
> ACME lead screws with Derlin nuts as opposed to ball screws
> "improvised" linear motion hardware (often skate board bearings and angle iron) as opposed to linear bearings.
> MDF frames as opposed to steel and aluminum.
> Small NEMA 23 stepper motors with small drivers as opposed to higher power steppers or servo motors.

What is sacrificed is:
>durability (they are not commercial duty machines)
>less precision and repeatably in the machines positioning
>rigidity (flexing of the frame causes inaccuracies a
>power and speed.

Thy also usually have a fairly small work envelope.

That said, they can be a great way to get into CNC and you will learn a lot by building one. If you love CNC routing and use it a lot, then you can buy or build a better machine with confidence that you're not spending the money unwisely.

I think that if you're interested in building one, you should go for it.


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## Elbert22

Started the woodsmith CNC machine 3 weeks ago and everything is going well until I got to the gantry. I had to stop when I noticed that the dimensions for the bearings didn't look right. I'll start again in the morning and correct the measurements.


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## Balloonengineer

For any of those of you who have not purchased the recommended electronics kit - don't. It is a very poorly matched system, will tend to run hot and will provide nowhere near the listed torque. Those steppers have an inductance of 7.5mH, and will provide maximum performance at about 87V, but the included power supply and drivers are at 36V. At the lower voltage, it will be operating near max current all the time, instead of a lower current at the optimum voltage. Power (Watts). = Voltage x Current (amps). And heat is proportional to the square of the current.

Look instead for lower inductance steppers (good ones are usually in the 2 - 2.5 range, and operate well at 48V) and drivers rated at 50V. You will have much better performance.


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## brucem26

> Started the woodsmith CNC machine 3 weeks ago and everything is going well until I got to the gantry. I had to stop when I noticed that the dimensions for the bearings didn t look right. I ll start again in the morning and correct the measurements.
> 
> - Elbert22


Indeed there is an error in the vertical dimension of the bearing location. This is a critical error and you will be remaking your gantry sides if you don't catch it.









The error is shown above circled in red. The 5 3/4" dimension is wrong. It should read 6 1/16" The 4 15/16" dimension should read 5 1/4" this produces a c/c distance between the 3/8" top holes and the 1" bottom holes of 3 13/16" You can also vary the offset of the cam hole in the "Cam with knob" assemblies but adjusting that is a last resoort.

I have advised the authors at Woodsmith of the error but did not see a correction posted even in online extras.


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## ssnvet

If anyone is using NEMA 23 steppers, you can use an all in one controller with the break out board and stepper drivers housed in one compact little box. I converted a benchtop mill to CNC with the Gecko G540 and the electrical side of the build (complete with limit switches) was plug and play… easy-peasy.

We built a small aluminum framed gantry robot for hot melt glue application at work. Very similar design concept, but using 80/20 and custom machined connector plates, and used the NEMA 23 package from CNCrouterparts.com . This was a bit pricey, but it is a high quality build and gives you spindle control and vacuum control if you go that route.


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## Elbert22

Spent an hour or two but have the dimensions dialed in and it is solid and smooth. The electronics , now that's a whole different story. Here's where I'm at now.


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## brucem26

As summer rolls in it gets harder and harder to get time in the shop.. some progress though. The gantry is almost completed. This is an area you really need to pay attention to tolerances. If that ball screw binds it will be no end of trouble. Also be sure to align those vertical Z axis rails exactly perpendicular to the table. Don't make any assumptions that just squaring it to the gantry is sufficient.









I have also found that it's easiest to paint as you go. Much easier to get into some of those nooks and crannies while it's in pieces. Be sure to mask off any areas that are to be glued (like the Z axis rails) before painting.










Oh yes, not really mentioned in the article but be sure you insert those bearing bolts for the Y axis BEFORE you glue on the Z axis rails - you'll be out of luck if you try to do it later.










Motors are getting installed this week, more pictures then.


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## Mike28

I am seriously considering building this and am glad I found this forum. Thanks for posting your progress and changes/ corrections.
Curious what the advantage is of using ball screws instead of lead screws?


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## brucem26

Hey Mike, glad you're considering it…. this has been the most engaging project I have ever built. It will really push your skill level and attention to detail to a new level. Of course I have yet to see if it will even move but that's for another day. Build it - you won't regret it. As an aside, my total cost for the project WITHOUT any software licenses or computer/monitor in the mix is $2,037 CDN This includes ball screws for all 3 axis and top quality materials throughout. That includes all the electronics, motors, ball screws, plywood, aluminum, even the paint.

The decision to go with ball screws over lead screws was a long and involved one… before I started this project I didn't even know what a ball screw was LOL. There are lots of articles online expounding on the advantages/disadvantages of them vs lead screws but really it boils down to one thing - accuracy. And in the world of CNC accuracy is king. You will get virtually 0 backlash with a ballscrew and the bearings on each end ensure the screw runs perfectly true. I bought mine from China - LinearMotionBearings2008 - http://www.ebay.ca/usr/linearmotionbearings2008?_trksid=p2053788.m1543.l2754 
The owner Chai was fantastic at answering all questions, helping me select the right one and shipped it all DHL Air Express, I had all the parts in my hands a week after ordering!

Finally - take those plans from Woodsmith as a starting point. If you use ball screws you'll need to make some changes anyways. Don't order the "kit" mentioned in the article for motors/controllers, etc - there are lots of places to buy a la carte that will result in a better & cheaper build. Think about adding LED lights, drag chains, limit switches, etc - use your imagination.

PM me direct if you want to have further conversation Mike - happy to chat with you (or anyone else) on the phone as well to share experiences.


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## ArtMann

I would say the most important reason for using ball screws rather than acme screws is a reduction in friction and associated gain in performance. It is easy to get the lash out of acme screws with the right kind of nuts but it is impossible to reduce the friction to that of a good ball screw. In reality, I have seen CNC machines constructed using simple threaded rods and the users report satisfactory results for their purposes. That is obviously not the kind of machine Bruce is shooting for.


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## brucem26

Here's a few videos and articles that helped me make the decision to go with ball screws. And yes ArtMann is quite right - friction is also a huge enemy of stepper motors and the ball screws do an awful lot to reduce it.









https://www.thomsonlinear.com/downloads/articles/Ball_Screws_and_Lead_Screws_The_Real_World_Difference_taen.pdf
https://blog.misumiusa.com/lead-screws-vs-ball-screws-2/


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## Mike28

Can you tell me which stepper motors and drivers you went with?


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## brucem26

> Can you tell me which stepper motors and drivers you went with?
> 
> - Mike28


For the Y and Z axis I used the followng:
438 oz-in, 57HS112-4204-03, Nema 23

For the long X axis I used the following:
1200 oz-in, 86HS115-4208-05, Nema 34

Drivers were:
Nema 23 Micro Stepper Driver 2DM556
and
Nema 34 Digital Stepper Driver 2DM860H

Power supplies Used:
Mean Well 48V Power Supply 120V / 240V AC input. 48V - DC output 12.0 amps.
and
Mean Well Multi Voltage Power Supply 5V, 12V, 24V - DC output 7, 4, 2 amps
(this one runs the auxillary bits, cooling fans, lights, breakout board, etc)

The 36V power supply referenced in the article is inadequate for motors of this size.

All of my components bought through:
The Stepper Motor Store (https://www.steppermotorcanada.ca/index.html)
Excellent to deal with BTW!

First motor is in place.


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## Mike28

Thanks again for the info. If I decide to go with this I'm sure I will have many more questions.


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## xeddog

Just for curiosity, you said "the long X" axis. So what is actually the "front" of the machine? Is your electgronics bay on the left end?

Wayne


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## brucem26

There are different schools of thought on this. In my opinion the x-axis is always the long one. Ie. the Gantry runs back and forth along the x-axis. The y-axis is the one that runs across the gantry and of course the Z axis is the vertical. So not sure what I would consider the front of the machine but the electrical components AR at the back.


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## xeddog

> There are different schools of thought on this. In my opinion the x-axis is always the long one. Ie. the Gantry runs back and forth along the x-axis. The y-axis is the one that runs across the gantry and of course the Z axis is the vertical. So not sure what I would consider the front of the machine but the electrical components AR at the back.
> 
> - Bruce Macdonald


I guess I have been "contaminated" with 3D printers. For those, you are usually looking at the business component, the hotend on printers, from the front. With this CNC, that would be looking straight at the router so the long axis would be Y. Of course, it doesn't really matter since you will define that with software and/or firmware.

Wayne


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## Elbert22

I really wish I had come across this forum before I bought all the supplies listed in the Woodsmith magazine. Hopefully I can make it all work. I bought the 37V power supply. Is it that important I get a 48V power supply?


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## Balloonengineer

The optimum voltage for the steppers Is dependent on the inductance of the stepper, and is given by
V = 32 x sqrt(inductance)
So, for example, the Nema23 ones Bruce bought have an inductance of 3.5mH, and would have peak power/torque at around 60V. The Nema34 should have 80V.

They will work at lower voltage, but not reach their rated torque and tend to run a little hotter. Power = voltage x current, to move the same load at at lower voltage requires higher current and heat is related to the square of current.

For the size and weight of this machine, will not be an issue as those steppers are probably oversized, as ball screws have very low friction and generate higher forces at lower torque than the acme lead screws would.

It is of course necessary to have drivers that are rated for the voltage you choose and current the stepper can draw. The drivers usually can limit current to levels safe for the steppers.

My machine uses smaller Nema23 425 oz-in steppers and my gantry weighs 150 lbs. (cut area 49" x 60", made from very large, stiff, aluminum extrusions). I get 600ipm rapids and usually cut at 200ipm or more. But my steppers have an inductance of 2.0 and run great at 48V. It is also rack & pinion.

By the way, I have mine set up so X-axis is the gantry, Y-axis is the longer axis.


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## brucem26

Well it's time for a few more pictures and a progress report.
The CNC router is really starting to take shape now, pretty much all of the mechanical is in place, now it's on to the wiring. I do wish I had made provisions in advance to route the wires from front of machine to the back through the interior <sigh> not much I can do now. The computer and monitor/keyboard will all be up at the front (opposite end from the electronics) along with the emergency stop switch etc.
I am considering adding LED lights under the gantry, both for assistance in seeing what's going on at the business end as well as just a little bling.

I had to move the unit to mount the big 1200oz X axis motor… holy smokes this thing is HEAVY!!! I'm guessing it's probably pushing 200lbs now with all the motors and electronics in there.

I decided to add drag chains for wire management. They were $20 each (need 3 of them) but they will really help with keeping the wires in an untangled state. The plate that attaches the drag chain also makes for a wonderful place to store router bits and mills, pencil, etc.

I will be adding an electrical plug for the router up on the back side of the gantry - this way my router just plugs in - no need to cut the factory wiring.

I've also added limit switches (6 of them) for all 3 axis. Peace of mind more than anything.

All for now. As always, feel free to contact me if you have any questions/suggestions about the build. Happy CNC'ing!


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## Redoak49

This is an amazing build.


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## oldnovice

You are moving at breakneck speed!


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## grubby65

Started the build a few weeks ago. Was progressing well until I came to the wiring. Ordered WoodSmith recommended kit from BuildYourOwnCNC and what they sent me is not what was in the magazine. Received push/pull drivers instead of CW/CCW. Still working with them on this issue. Checked the machine out and along the Y-axis i'm out .004" in the vertical plane and along the X-axis .010". Here are some pictures.


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## brucem26

Looking good. Most drivers are compatible with both PUL/DIR as well as CW/CCW - unfortunate you got the wrong ones. As I said earlier I believe you can do considerably better in both price and components if you shop around rather than buy the kit but that is water under the bridge - I'm sure they'll get you fixed up.

A couple more recommendations from my build:
1) Use terminal blocks on your gantry to bring all of the motors, limit switches, lights, etc to one point. Then you run all of your cables up through the long X axis drag chain and tie them into the other side of the terminal block. Simplifies the wiring tremendously.
2) I added a second power supply for 12V and 5V to service the BOB, lights, fans, etc. Again just simplifies the wiring.
3) I've ordered a USB keypad so I can jog the unit along it's axis w/o having to do it from Mach 3
4) Not sure how useful this will be but I've also added enable switches for X and Y axis. This allows me to disconnect the power to the X and Y motors so they can be turned by hand. (remember that a stepper motor is always ON providing a holding force even when it's not turning.) The ENA+ allows you to break that hold temporarily.

A few more pics.


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## Balloonengineer

If you wire in an e-Stop, that can be used to disable all steppers so you can reposition as well.


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## xeddog

It has been a while, so I was wondering if you have completed the build, and if so . . . PROVE IT!  (That just means pictures of some completed projects, and perhaps a video of it running).

Wayne


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## grubby65

It is completed, but having issues uploading video. I'm pretty steep into the learning curve right now. I have been using VCarve-Pro which is a fantastic program. I do a lot of speaker building, my first project was a small back loaded horn speaker enclosure. One thing I have found out though, is trying to 1/4" deep cuts in 3/4" 13 ply birch plywood causes the stepper motor in the X-axis to lose steps. So, I am trying to determine what the limits of the machine are. Cutting MDF is a breeze though.


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## brucem26

My machine itself is complete and I have tested using the jogging controls to move it around - all good there. My hold up now is getting the dedicated base built so I can finally complete everything (ie: the drag chains attach to the base, the computer, UPS and monitor all attach to the base, final wiring etc)
The other issue is that nice weather sort of takes precedence of me being in the workshop (according to my wife anyways). 

I think I'll purchase VCarve Desktop and Mach3 - they seem to be the best combo I've tested.

I don't think I'll have an issue with power in the X axis stepper - 1200oz motor.

Will post video/pics ASAP


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## grubby65

That is about twice as big as the motor I used


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## DonRamsey

Bruce, have you compiled all your mods, sources, part numbers, and corrections into a document. I'm well into the build and just found this forum. To bad for me, I've already made the error with the incorrect dimensions. Would love to have all your advice in a document.


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## DonRamsey

If you made the error that Bruce refers to in post #54 on the bearing mounts, here is a suggestion. Rather than rebuild the gantry parts, cut off part of the bearing mounts, fill the holes with a dowel and add a section for the new hole for the upper bearing. This should save a lot of time and effort


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## DonRamsey

There is one thing in the hardware selections that I discovered. The 3/8" washers should be SAE washers or the outside dimension will bind the roller bearings and they will not rotate.


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## brucem26

Well folks, it's done! Finally!
I really couldn't be happier with the result, everything (so far) is working like a champ. I thought I'd make notes of what I learned over the course of building this beast. There was certainly some hard knocks along the way - hopefully this list may help those building or considering to build this unit. This was my very first step into the world of CNC and I think I've done a decent job, time will tell! Now to learn the software which will no doubt take longer than the build!

Lessons Learned in CNC

1. The plans in Woodsmith are a starting point. Do not take them as the gospel. Don't be afraid to make changes to the design to suit what you want.
2. Check then double check every single dimension in the plans. YES THERE ARE ERRORS IN THE PLANS! Your motors, your drive controllers, your mechanics will vary in size from what's in the plans.
3. Be sure your calipers are accurate. 1/64" matters! Most of your components will be built in metric mm so use that if you're comfortable with it.
4. Draw up full size plans of all the critical areas (gantries, bearing locations, motor mounts, etc)
5. A 48" wide drafting table is a valuable thing to have. 
6. Consider using ball screws instead of lead screws and anti-backlash nuts. They are WAY more efficient and practically immune to backlash. Yes you will need to redesign the motor mounts and static ends but it is well worth the effort. If you need help locating them contact me. I used 1500mm for the X axis. 900mm for the Y axis and 400mm for the Z axis. Do it, you will never regret the decision. All 3 of the ball screws including the BK12 and BF12 end bearings, drive linkage and the bracket that connects the ball screw bearing to the moveable plate were under $300 Canadian.
7. Don't think that the sources listed in Woodsmith are the only place you can buy these components. I'm not knocking BuildYourCNC.com but there are lots of alternatives and many of them much cheaper.
8. Buy the stepper motors, drive controllers and the BoB (breakout board) from one source. That way you will have some assurance that they all work together. Buy from a dealer who will assist you with the endless questions you'll no doubt have. Plug here for https://www.steppermotorcanada.ca they were fantastic to deal with.
9. Buy a bigger stepper motor for the X axis. That gantry carries a lot of momentum when it gets going.
10. Add LED lights to the underside of the gantry. Really helps you see what's going on.
11. Add plastic drag chains to the X and Y axis. I used 18mm x 50mm and they fit perfect. Really helps with wire management.
12. You must use SAE washers next to the bearings. If you use the larger 3/8" diameter ones they will bind on the bearings.
13. Think in modules. Logical units of the build. For example, run your motor wires to terminal blocks. Then run your wires from the drive controllers to the terminal blocks. This way you are not trying to make a single connection from the motor all the way back to the electronics. Another example, put a 115V outlet on the gantry. Now your router just plugs into it, no need to cut the cord, need to take the motor off for repairs? No problem just unplug it.
14. Consider adding a second fan. There is a lot of heat generated from those electronics for one little fan.
15. A 36V power supply is marginal especially if you use a bigger X axis stepper. I used a 48V unit.
16. Consider adding a second power supply for the 5V and 12V needs. Easy to do.
17. Paint as you go. Don't build the whole thing and then think about painting it. 
18. Build a dedicated base. This thing takes up a considerable amount of floor space, you can capture a lot of storage space underneath it. Be creative!
19. Don't forget about the cost of software in your total cost estimates. It is significant!
20. When you think you've used enough screws, add a few more. Rigidity is absolutely mandatory here!
21. YouTube is full of great videos on building CNC routers. Spend a lot of time watching them and making notes about what you want YOUR CNC to look like.
22. I installed a UPS (uninteruptable power supply) so that in the event of a power failure mid-rout I'm not left in the dark and can shut things down gracefully.
23. Connect a USB numeric keypad so you can jog the system around with a handheld unit instead of from the keyboard.
24. Install an Emergency Shutoff switch. This has two connections, one for the system and one for the router. When all hell breaks loose you have one button to press.
25. Only build with the best quality Baltic Birch you can find. Do NOT use Home Depot grade plywood!
26. Install 5 limit switches for X+, X-, Y+, Y-, Z+. These were not in the Woodsmith plans but very easy to add and it gives you an assurance that the system will not self-destruct at the limits of axis travel.
27. I purchased a dust boot specifically for the Dewalt router. TBD if that was the right decision or not but it is well made (3D printed) and fits perfectly.
28. Buy your wife flowers - often - this build is very addictive and you'll be spending a lot of time and money on it!
29. My final cost for the entire unit and the base EXCLUDING software and the router was $2,538 Canadian. I can't imagine what an equivalent Shapeko or equivalent unit would cost!
30. You will likely have as much fun building it as you will using it. Take your time, be a perfectionist, be very accurate and you will have a unit you can be proud of.

And now for a few pics…
As always please message me if you have any questions on any aspect of what I've done.
Bruce


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## DonRamsey

Fantastic job and thanks for the "Lessons Learned". Great info.


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## DonRamsey

Let us know how its works on projects.


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## Elbert22

Talked to you several months ago about my build and you were very helpful. Sent several pictures and was going to send more, but my wife told me to spend more time INSIDE the house or I could stay in the garage till further notice. I since mostly finished it, and it is nowhere near as nice looking as yours, but it works. It will jog in all directions but when I try to run G-Code on it, it will will run in the Y ,and Z axis but not in the X axis. Any ideas why it would do that? I"ve added some photos of the final project. Thanks. Well I've trying to sign up on photobucket for over an hour and i've lost all patience with that POS. I'll try again with another way.


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## Lazyman

Fantastic. It would be interesting to see a Bill of Materials of the components you actually used. A lot of it is probably interspersed throughout this topic but a final list would really help anyone trying to build it themselves.

What software stack are you using? I recently stumbled upon an unbelievable deal on a never used CNC Shark at a garage sale a few weeks ago and it came with Vcarve 8.5 and I am currently going through my learning curve. I figured out how to import Sketchup Files into Vcarve. For the version I have, you have to save the SU file in an older version so that Vcarve recognizes it. Any input on other software would be helpful to me and anyone else taking the plunge.

BTW, I saw your letter to the editors in the latest issue of Woodsmith. I agree with you.


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## Elbert22

I used a 48 volt power source. (2) NEMA 24 425 oz-in stepper motors. (2) Drivers (3.0Amp 24-40 Volts, 1-1/64 microstepping). These are for the Y and Z axis. (1) NEMA 34 651 oz-in stepper motor (1) Driver (6.0Amp 24-70 Volts, 1/2-1/256 microstepping) for the X axis. Mach 3 usb interface board withMach 3 software package. E stop switch with limit switches on each axis. DeltaCAD and vecrtic CAD/CAM software. Can anyone think why it will not run in the X axis when running G-code but jogs fine.


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## OG51

Thank you for sharing the journey. For myself, that is one of the coolest woodworking projects I have seen.

Not beautiful (in the end its a machine) but it is really cool.

Hope to see some of the project you all create.


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## brucem26

Thanks, appreciate the comments. As far a summarized list of components that I used:
- 438 oz-in, 57HS112-4204-03, Nema 23 motors for Y and Z
- Nema 23 Micro Stepper Driver 2DM556
- 1200 oz-in, 86HS115-4208-05, Nema 34 for X
- Nema 34 Digital Stepper Driver 2DM860H
- Mean Well 48V Power Supply for motors
- Mean Well Multi Voltage Power Supply for fans, lights, breakout board
- BL5 CNC USB Interface Board
- Limit Switch V-156-125 on X+/-, Y+/- and Z+

Mach 3 software
I am still evaulating which CAD/CAM program(s) to get. Vectric Desktop looks like the best I'm on the fence so far.

I'd love to see more pictures from other builds!


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## xeddog

> Can anyone think why it will not run in the X axis when running G-code but jogs fine.
> 
> - Elbert22


I can't tell you much about your CNC machine, but in the 3d printing world, that would be an indication that the X endstop isn't working. Do you have terminal access to your controller? There should be a command you can use to test them. In 3D printing it's a M119 command.

Wayne


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## Lazyman

You can try the Vectric software for free. I think they just came out with version 10. They have some good tutorials on YouTube to help learn how to use it effectively.


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## Lazyman

> Can anyone think why it will not run in the X axis when running G-code but jogs fine.
> 
> - Elbert22
> 
> I can t tell you much about your CNC machine, but in the 3d printing world, that would be an indication that the X endstop isn t working. Do you have terminal access to your controller? There should be a command you can use to test them. In 3D printing it s a M119 command.
> 
> Wayne
> 
> - xeddog


You might try a new USB cable or perhaps try using a different USB port on the computer. I was having trouble getting gcode to run but was able to jog just fine and a new cable fixed the problem, though one USB port doesn't work even with the new cable.

Are you jogging using the PC or do you have a remote?


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## DS

If your X-axis isn't running by g-code, it could be that the home switch is faulty. 
If the machine can't determine X0, it will refuse to run code for this axis.

Most machines will refuse to run any code if all the axis' cannot be homed to machine zero.

You could also check that you have the X-Offset for your working coordinates set properly in the controller.
Often, this is moved around to match where your fixture is located on the table.
If this value is out of bounds for your table, I suppose that could do it as well.


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## pluto26

I have been trying to get digital copies of the CNC plans from woodsmith. Just having differculty for some reason with them. Does anyone have the digital magazine to share?


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## brucem26

> I have been trying to get digital copies of the CNC plans from woodsmith. Just having differculty for some reason with them. Does anyone have the digital magazine to share?
> 
> - pluto26


I have them in PDF along with a boatload of other specs and docs I'm happy to share. PM me direct and I'll send to you.


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## grubby65

I do have mine up and running. Started with some simple projects now moving on to a Wooden Geared Clock


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## pluto26

Gruuby65 looks like it works great. Any insights in building one. Any help or notes and changes you did would be greatly appreciated.


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## grubby65

Actually I built it pretty much identical to the article, save the mistakes in the dimensions. It works fine, except at the far end of the X-axis. I don't go much closer than 4" from the end of the bed. Probably the biggest issue I had was getting the stepper motors tuned. Had the acceleration way to high and I would lose steps.









This is the table I built for it.


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## pluto26

Thanks for the inspiration. Need to get the plans and start. Thanks again


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## DonRamsey

I know there was a measurement error on the holes for the bearing. Are there other errors?


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## brucem26

> I know there was a measurement error on the holes for the bearing. Are there other errors?
> 
> - DonRamsey


I deviated from the plans by using ball screws etc so I didn't uncover any other dimensional errors in the plans.

I received this back from Chris Fitch who is the WoodSmith author that designed the CNC router we are all building:

Hi Bruce,
Thanks for the photos. Your CNC router looks awesome and I love all of the upgrades. I agree that a follow up article on the efforts, upgrades and changes that builders have made would be very interesting. Perhaps we can do that on the web.
Enjoy your CNC machine!

Chris


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## OG51

@grubby65, I am jealous you are already working on your clock. I originally got my hobby cnc machine to cut gears for a wood clock. 6 years later I have completed 0 wooden gear clocks. I've made a few carved clock cases for mechanical and electronic movement clocks but no wood gear clocks yet.

I bought a few of Clayton Boyers clock designs a few years back. Didn't make them. I also purchased Gearotic 3.0 as well so supposedly I have everything to design and make my own but still haven't made them either.

@Bruce, thank you again for sharing the journey. Let us know when you are making sawdust with yours.


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## pluto26

Would the CNC design benefit from a dual motor setup on the x axis? Instead of the single motor pulling both the left and right sides of the gantry?


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## grubby65

In my opinion no. I am a Mechanical Engineer and design material handling equipment, specifically drag conveyors. I try to stay away from dual chain conveyors because of a timing issue. If one motor lost a step, the gantry would be skewed and I don't know you would ever get it timed again.


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## DS

> In my opinion no. I am a Mechanical Engineer and design material handling equipment, specifically drag conveyors. I try to stay away from dual chain conveyors because of a timing issue. If one motor lost a step, the gantry would be skewed and I don t know you would ever get it timed again.
> 
> - grubby65


Dual homing switches on the X axis would resolve that issue.


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## brucem26

I can only say that the unit has been running perfectly with the single X axis motor. I did take extreme care to ensure that the gantry was exactly perpendicular to the bed and that there was no binding whatsoever running it along the entire length of the rails. No racking at all.

I've made an awful pile of sawdust with this thing! The accuracy is just incredible and anyone I show it to is awestruck watching it do it's thing. Going to try photo carving next… pictures to come.


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## pluto26

Thanks for that valuable inputs.


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## grubby65

Made 1911 grips this weekend


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## Mike_190930

> I ve made an awful pile of sawdust with this thing! The accuracy is just incredible and anyone I show it to is awestruck watching it do it s thing. Going to try photo carving next… pictures to come.
> 
> - Bruce Macdonald


Bruce, can you quantify accuracy? For example, if you command it to go to a specific xy spot, say 5 different times, what is the spread in x and y achieved?


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## grubby65

Finished my first mechanical clock using it. Need to do some finishing, but it is accurate enough to build this.


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## brucem26

Most of my time the last while has been getting used to Vectric Desktop and Mach 3. Definitely lots to learn. I have found the Vectric tutorials really well done. They take you through all the steps and get you producing quality results.
I haven't done any scientific tests to very my claim of accuracy but for the work I am doing it is plenty accurate. I too have given demonstrations to friends and they just stare in awe that this pile of plywood and electronics is turning out such very cool projects.
I made up a full spoilboard with grid lines, 242 T- nuts and carved in quick reference dimensions. Also made a set of hold down cam clamps that work fantastic. Highly recommend you make a set, here is the link to his video and plans.


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## Lazyman

BTW, for anyone considering making the cam clamps in that video, it looks to me that they are not the correct shape for effective holding, at least the way he showed it being used anyway. If you look at the video, you can see that point of contact is not inline with the mounting screw so I think that they could come loose while in use. I made some in a similar way and I cannot get them to lock down tightly enough. If you look at about 8:30 in this video, you can see an explanation of why that is. He has links in the video description to files you can use on your CNC to make your own. He also has a follow up video for a clever adjustable clamping block to use with them.


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## brucem26

Note that the video I referenced above is 



 which does show the correct ones that screw into T-nuts. They work fantastic!

A quick plaque engraved for a friend's wedding.


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## Lazyman

Bruce, that is the cam clamp that I was concerned about. If you look at the screen grab from that video below, you can see that the black arrows where the cam presses against the wood are not in line with the screw so you probably have to tighten down the screw enough so that the screw is what prevents it from releasing during a run. The link that I provided is for a cam that keeps the contact point in line with the pivot point (the red line) so that friction alone will hold it in place and tightening down the screw will give you even more holding power. That may be fine for plaques and most engraving work but for a long run with lots of deeper cuts, I would worry it won't hold. I am new to the CNC stuff myself so this is partly conjecture on my part, but I have already had a piece release using cam clamps that I made after seeing the video you linked to. I used a slightly different design from a different youtuber but it has the same issue.










That plaque turned out nice, BTW.


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## brucem26

I see what you mean and that will definitely be the case if the handles are almost perpendicular to the work as shown in that image. I always have them at least at the 2 o'clock or 3 even 4 o'clock position at least so the net effect is that the red and black lines are close to in line or even beyond. They've been working good for me so far, I only tighten the cap screw enough to hold it, definitely not what's holding the clamp in position.

And I thought plain old woodworking was addictive….


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## Mike_190930

Hi Bruce,

Very much enjoyed and benefited from following your build blog here. You and several others are way ahead of me on this build and having fun making sawdust already. As I pondered the construction myself, I realized there were some things that could mess with the alignments of the three axes (x, y, and z) even if I was as careful as I can be in putting it together (that's more a remark on my personal skill level than anything else). So after a couple of sleepless nights, I decided to modify the v-groove roller axles to give me some angular adjustments after all was built. The description turned out to be fairly long, so I put it in my blog instead of burdening this thread. Would appreciate comments and questions.

-Mike


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## brucem26

Hi all,
Hope everyone who is building or has built the CNC router are having as much fun as I am!

I added a section into my website dedicated to this build. Check it out.
https://brucemacdonald.wixsite.com/macteam/cnc-router


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## Jbwoods

Hi Bruce,

Just curious to know how your CNC machine is working out for you. What software you decided to continue using. I have enjoyed your pictures and your information on build. I'm venturing into this build as well. Thank you!!


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## brucem26

Hi there,
The CNC machine is working great. Absolutely love it and it has performed without issue (well aside from the mistakes that I made and the CNC of course dutifully carved those mistakes into my work) 
I bought VCarve Desktop and love it. It is fantastic software, great support and does everything you could possibly imagine. I may upgrade to VCarve Pro some day when I have $500 burning a hole in my pocket so I can make full use of the 24×48 bed without tiling.
I use Mach3 to drive the machine. Simple, powerful, does everything.

I would love to chat with you about the build, answer any questions you might have and perhaps offer some suggestions. PM me and I'll send you my phone number. Really… glad to help.


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## paulLumberJock

If you are going to DIY, I suggest joining joescnc.com. I think it's about $100 to join, but you get plans with it.
It's a proven DIY design that you can customize. In my experience, the build threads on cnczone are all over the place, and often you don't get feedback after the build about how well it works, cutting speed, etc
I know I mentioned that site on another thread. I am not the owner of it, it's just a good site.


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## oldnovice

Your machine and your projects look *GREAT*!
You have done yourself proud.

Did I miss you mentioned which design software you are using?


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## brucem26

I currently use Vectric Desktop . Excellent software but will pay the extra $400 as soon a I can to upgrade to Pro where the 24" x 24" maximum size without tiling limit is removed.


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## oldnovice

*Bruce*, I have a Shopbot and could have downloaded VCarve Pro v9.5 for for the Shopbot version. Unfortunately I was a little late as there is now VCarve Pro v10 and I do not qualify for a free upgrade to v10!

I am still using v9 but am starting reach it's limits so I supplement it with my CAD program.


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## Lazyman

Fortunately, you don't have to pay for a complete new version. I think that you just pay the current difference between the version you have and the one you upgrade to. For me it shows that an upgrade from Vectric 9.5 Desktop to 10.5 Pro is $350 versus $700 for new purchase, which is the current difference in price between the 10.5 desktop and pro versions. Upgrading from 9.5 Desktop to 10.5 Desktop is $90. They have an unlimited (whatever that means) free trial so you can try it to see if the upgraded features are worth the extra cost.

When I initially bought my used CNC Shark (I think that it was technically new old stock), it was old enough that it came with the 8.5 desktop software. When I registered they gave me a free upgrade to the 9.5 version.


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## brucem26

I upgraded to Vectric Desktop Pro this week from Vectric Desktop. So nice not to have to worry about the 25×25 size limit any longer. Haven't explored the shape nesting feature yet but will soon. Cost me $473 extra.

Well worth it if you want to utilize the entire 4' length of your router table!


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## Lazyman

My CNC only has about a 24×24 bed but I have used the tile feature in Vectric Desktop for a piece that was about 6' long. As long as you have a way to precisely move and set the piece in place it works well, though I was doing something very simple. I basically cut some long grooves and mortises into a 6'x23" panel for a cabinet I made. For just a couple of panels (top and bottom of the cabinet), it would have been easier to simply use my handheld router but I wanted to see how the tiling feature worked.


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## olddawg

Just wanted to say that I also have completed the Woodsmith CNC router with valuable assistance from Bruce MacDonald. I took Bruce's advice and used the ball screws and larger stepper motors. I added limit switches and drag chains as suggested by Bruce. I also am using the Vectric Desktop and mach3 software. I have included some pictures of the completed build.

I would also like to acknowledge Jon at steppermotorscanada.com who was very gracious answering my questions and providing me with the stepper motors, drivers and breakout board.

I am a retired senior and so have taken up woodworking as a hobby. This was a very challenging project for me and without help from Bruce it may have been a disaster. I would like thank Woodsmith for their magazine and I have built several of their projects from their plans. I am from western Canada and this is a great way to spend the cold winters.

Again thank you to Bruce MacDonald who dedicated his time and resources to helping me be successful.

Hope this helps more of you to tackle this project. It is well worth the time and energy.

Pictures below:

https://app.photobucket.com/u/jgmccarthy/p/463562dc-1a7b-4d09-a49d-ac29cad8e3a1

https://app.photobucket.com/u/jgmccarthy/p/c79705d4-a524-455f-a750-d8041d7eea77

https://app.photobucket.com/u/jgmccarthy/p/4d01e23d-7a95-438c-a9a3-9e30f3c03a58

https://app.photobucket.com/u/jgmccarthy/p/33c04d76-8799-49ca-b16a-41c2770d8bae

https://app.photobucket.com/u/jgmccarthy/p/a0bc152c-c7a5-4300-a60f-a856811a6a77


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## brucem26

Very kind words Gerry. Thank you. More people need to take on this build it is challenging but you end up with a really robust, accurate and usable machine. I am always available for a chat.

Now Gerry let's see some sawdust piles on that nice new machine!


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## brucem26

Just so everyone is aware, Woodsmith posted a newer video of the CNC router with Chris Fitch.


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## AaronKing

Hey Bruce. I am thinking about following in your footsteps here and building a machine of my own. Did you ever consider buying linear rails for the gantry instead of making your own rails?? What was the deciding on factor on sticking with the original design?


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## brucem26

Hi Aaron. Glad to hear you are taking on the build. To answer your question… if I built it all over again I would indeed use linear rails instead of per plans. So why didn't I do it in the first place? 
Fear of the unknown. I was already making so many other changes to the original I wanted to start with a known entity. Had I replaced with linear rail it would have been a complete rebuild. Since it was my first ever attempt at CNC I didn't know if the rails/bearings system would be good or no good. Just went with the plans.

I've now been using the router almost daily for a year and a bit. The aluminum rails and bearings are fine. Really, they are working great. Solid as a rock, no play.
However…
Weekly I need to wipe the black off of the bearings and rails. Obviuosly the black is from the aluminum. So they ARE wearing - just very, very slowly.

Using linear rails would solve this for a few hundred bucks.

So yes, I *might* take on the engineering effort now (that I am more experienced) but I imagine this unit will last me a few more years at which time I might consider a rebuild.

This the type of rail I'd use - not terribly expensive. (need longer for X axis)
https://www.amazon.ca/Support-12-500mm-Bearing-SBR12UU-Blockbearing/dp/B078JY2C2Z

Aaron send me your email address and I'll send you my cell number. We should chat.


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## AaronKing

I sent you a message on your website with my contact info. Would love to have a conversation any time you are available.


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## AaronKing

Well Bruce. After hours of thinking and watching youtube videos and reading forums, I did finally build a machine. However I ended up going with a different design. It has worked out pretty good and I have been making chips for about two months. Now I find the harder thing is trying to come up with projects to incorporate the CNC into as I am just a weekend warrior and there is only so much carving I need around the house!

Anyways, I just wanted to say thank you again for this thread, and your generosity with your time and knowledge. It was really the catalyst that actually got me to take the plunge into this project, and it was very rewarding.


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## brucem26

Hey Aaron,
Glad to see it became a reality! Job well done.
As far as projects to make now that you have a CNC - man the sky is the limit… Some quickie's include:
Coasters with an inlay
Your signature to engrave into everything you make
Christmas ornaments
Signs…. OMG I've lost track of how many signs I've made..
Lake depth topography maps
Engravings into charcuterie boards
Kids toys

Just Google "CNC projects" and you'll see thousands of examples.
Anyways, glad I could be of assistance. Always here for anyone who wants to learn!


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## David1952

Bruce, I'm looking to build my own CNC Router and I ran across the posts in this forum. Given that the bulk of this thread is from 2019, I was wondering if you still had docs and notes you were able and willing to share. I would PM you as you said in a previous post but I don't have enough posts under my belt to PM anyone. Thanks.


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## Fdougd

Bruce, I have decided to build this thing. I am new to the forum so it seems I must post 5 times before I can send a message. I will send a message to get the correct dimensions as you mentioned in one of your posts. Also, I wonder if you or someone might like to comment on the 3/8-24×2 3/4 hex head bolts. These seem rather hard to find. #8-24×3/4 machine screws also. And last, did you get your aluminum angle at some place like Home Depot? Thank you for all your posts. Very helpful. I am looking forward to this.


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## DonRamsey

I won't to mention the hole size for the 1-1/4×1/2" ball bearing in the plan is incorrect. Plans shows 1-1/8" inch but a 1-1/4" bearing won't fit that hole. 1-1/4" is tight.


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## DonRamsey

> change won't to want
> 
> - DonRamsey


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## jinda

I'm using Bosch PR20EVSNK, and it is really awesome.


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## jb4x4

Hello Bruce how did you cut out gantry sides? did you somehow trace it? or based on dimensions. I have started project myself.


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## brucem26

> Hello Bruce how did you cut out gantry sides? did you somehow trace it? or based on dimensions. I have started project myself.
> 
> - jb4×4


I made full sized drawings of everything including the gantry. Then transferred those dimensions onto the plywood.. Be sure that you read my post about the error in the dimensions that appears in the plans. Or else you will ruin a set of gantry sides.
Feel free to ask me any questions about the build, I have helped lots of people through it. There are lots of secrets.
Above all else be sure you use ball screws and not the acme threaded rod as appears in the plans

Cheers! Bruce


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## Fdougd

I'm glad this thread is still going. I am building the gantry now. I would like to know if anyone has used the 3 Axis Electronics Combo(for Heavy Gantry) from BuildYourCNC. This was the package in the Woodsmith article. I have read, reread, and reread most of the 142 posts in this thread. I am learning a lot. Thanks.


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## Jbwoods

I have not, went with a bigger motors as Bruce suggested.

I would like to know how long did it take Bruce and whoever else but their cnc machine lol


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## Fdougd

Could I ask where you got your motors from? I've been working on mine for awhile, but I haven't been in a hurry and other things get in the way. I'm ready for the motors!


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## brucem26

> I have not, went with a bigger motors as Bruce suggested.
> 
> I would like to know how long did it take Bruce and whoever else but their cnc machine lol
> 
> - Jbwoods


Start to finish for me including building the base unit was about 9 months going from zero knowledge to having the machine move on it's own. Much of the time will be dependent on your background… if you have an engineering kind of mind it helps a lot!


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## brucem26

> Could I ask where you got your motors from? I've been working on mine for awhile, but I haven't been in a hurry and other things get in the way. I'm ready for the motors!
> 
> - Fdougd


I am Canadian so naturally I tried to buy as much as I could here. For all of my electronics, I used Stepper Motor Canada (https://www.steppermotorcanada.ca/) Jon is an excellent resource to deal with, very knowledgeable and PATIENT! LOL. Wherever you buy I'd suggest to deal with someone who can sell it all to you - motors, controllers, BOB, power supplies, etc) This way you can have some assurance it will work together.


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## jb4x4

Well … then I don't feel so bad here's a few pictures of my project


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## jb4x4

At this point I'm at 95% done with this project.. let me tell you all it's been a huge undertaking


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## Jbwoods

Hello all,

Bruce I'm needing your help with the electrical wiring of this project. would you please help. thank you in advance.


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## jb4x4

Bruce and David would either one of you guys please help. Need help configuring. Setup of Mach4. There's so much info so confused


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## OzarkJim

Good to see some other CNC fans on here. We have two both DIY. Only one is operational at the moment as we just moved into the new shop and plan on upgrading the older one to a larger bed (5×9). Just added water cooled spindle to the one that is operational (4×4 bed).


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