# Framing square



## Charliefreak (Nov 14, 2017)

This just popped into my inbox, and made me think "I definitely want one of those". Then I followed the link and discovered that it was $230.

Precision framing square from Woodcraft / Woodpecker

Does anyone know of a good similar / equivalent product that isn't so eye-wateringly expensive. A long, accurate square that can sit on one edge and can also square up to the edge of sheet goods would be a really useful thing for the work I do.


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

Not the same thing, but big, square and
possible to modify easily.

https://www.andersonplywood.com/square-for-festool-mft-square/


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## Charliefreak (Nov 14, 2017)

Or I suppose I could make something similar myself… but then how do I check that it's square without a square


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## Johnny7 (Jun 1, 2015)

> Or I suppose I could make something similar myself… but then how do I check that it s square without a square
> 
> - Charliefreak


The same way you'd check any square-

1. Put one leg of the square against a known straight edge, then draw a line along the other leg.

2. Flip it over and draw another line near the original line.

3. If the 2 lines are anything other than parallel, the "square" is not square


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## brtech (May 26, 2010)

you aren't going to get .001" per foot accuracy that way 

I have several Woodpecker products. They are great. I lust for this one, but it's just too much!


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## Holt (Mar 15, 2011)

I really want the set, but the thought of telling my wife I spent $400 on them is giving me anxiety.


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## LittleShaver (Sep 14, 2016)

If you want to improve the accuracy of the checking method described above. Extend the lines by butting up a good straightedge to the square.


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## jonah (May 15, 2009)

Woodcraft also sells a $15 Starrett framing square that is perfectly square. I know which one I'd rather buy.


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

Get a nice carpenter's square and a set of stair gauges and you're all set. Look for readability and cleanly etched markings. If you get it home and it's a little out of square, you can tweak it with a center punch. Search around for a tutorial on how.


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## Charliefreak (Nov 14, 2017)

That's a great tip! Stair gauges… brilliant.


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## Gene01 (Jan 5, 2009)

I know what used stair gauges are, but never used them before. How would you use them in check a framing square for accuracy?


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

> I know what used stair gauges are, but never used them before. How would you use them in check a framing square for accuracy?
> 
> - Gene Howe


They basically just add a lip to the square. That way you can lay it on the surface of a board and have them hook the edge, rather than trying to have one leg down on the front edge of the board.

It would be a good idea to do the square check with them attached to make sure you can draw good lines square to an edge. Obviously for inside and outside square checking you can leave them off.


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## Holt (Mar 15, 2011)

Didn't see it at Woodcraft and was ready to call you out, but there is one on Amazon for about that price!

Answers to one of the questions indicates it was made in China. Several reviews mention it being out of square. be cool if it turned out to be American made and typical Starrett quality.

All of that aside, it's not RED and doesn't come with a fitted MDF storage "case" (I'm assuming Woodpecker tricks it out like they do the other squares for which I paid entirely too much).



> Woodcraft also sells a $15 Starrett framing square that is perfectly square. I know which one I'd rather buy.
> 
> - jonah


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## Charliefreak (Nov 14, 2017)

The fitted mdf storage case actually runs you an extra $40!

As previous poster said, I'd love to be able to:

(a) hook the square onto the edge of a board and know that it is indeed square there (rather than lining it up with my fingers like I currently do

(b) be able to stand the square up on one edge and have it stay put, the way an engineer's square does.

I'm going to give the stair gauges a try as they might achieve both of those things.


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## Dwain (Nov 1, 2007)

I DID buy that Starrett framing square. Very happy with it. I'm going to go out and burn $5 on a set of stair gauges and get more use from it. By the way, Starrett sells stair gauges… for $42.00! I love Starrett, but I ain't investing in that.


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## jonah (May 15, 2009)

This is what I'm talking about. They call it a "rafter square" for some unknown reason. Made in the USA and mine is absolutely square as can be (or as close as I can see with 20/15 vision).

https://www.woodcraft.com/products/starrett-tempered-steel-rafter-square


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

> (b) be able to stand the square up on one edge and have it stay put, the way an engineer s square does.
> 
> I m going to give the stair gauges a try as they might achieve both of those things.
> 
> - Charliefreak


I have the set from Lee Valley. By reversing them on one edge of my square (one knob right, one left) I was able to stand the square on the edge. Not super stable though. A carefully cut kerf in a piece of hardwood might be better. If your square is steel (mine's not), you could rig something up with blocks of wood and rare earth magnets.


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## Smitty_Cabinetshop (Mar 26, 2011)

> Get a nice carpenter's square and a set of stair gauges and you're all set.
> 
> - Rich


Tip of the week right there. Also a good picture on handyman.com (would paste it here, but it's their image).


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## Charliefreak (Nov 14, 2017)

The Lee Valley ones look good - they're round, whereas all the cheap ones on Amazon are hexagonal.


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## woodbutcherbynight (Oct 21, 2011)

Just as soon as I win the lottery or a long lost relative leaves me a fortune I am getting this square from Woodpeckers!!!!

In the mean time I will just make do with the two cheaper ones that I have. 
LOL


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

> Just as soon as I win the lottery or a long lost relative leaves me a fortune I am getting this square from Woodpeckers!!!!
> 
> - woodbutcherbynight


I got a Woodpeckers 6" square for a good price at Woodcraft. It was on sale and I had some VIP credits built up. It's my favorite square. It just does everything right. I'd love to have the 12" and this new one, but jeez, the money. I can afford it, I just can't justify it.

Oh yeah, I do have their little mini one…lol. I kept looking at it in the glass case at the store and laughing until one day I needed something that size and bought it. At $25, it's one of the cheapest things they make - even cheaper than the case for this new monster.


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## Gilley23 (May 9, 2017)

Just take two speed squares and epoxy them together. BAM, $20 framing/inside corner/outside corner square that will stand on its edge. You want a 12" version? BAM, $40. Done and done. I just saved you $190.


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## woodbutcherbynight (Oct 21, 2011)

> Just take two speed squares and epoxy them together. BAM, $20 framing/inside corner/outside corner square that will stand on its edge. You want a 12" version? BAM, $40. Done and done. I just saved you $190.
> 
> - Gilley23


ROFLMAO


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## RichT (Oct 14, 2016)

> Just take two speed squares and epoxy them together. BAM, $20 framing/inside corner/outside corner square that will stand on its edge. You want a 12" version? BAM, $40. Done and done. I just saved you $190.
> 
> - Gilley23
> 
> ...


That should be ROFLMAO…BAM for when you roll into the wall.


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## Unknowncraftsman (Jun 23, 2013)

I have one woodpeckers medium sized Red aluminum squares. I don't like it it's too thick and clunky. I'm happy using my Starret combination square. I also have a steel rafter square from lowes and it's very accurate.I hardly ever need it for anything but plywood.


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## cabmaker (Sep 16, 2010)

> This is what I m talking about. They call it a "rafter square" for some unknown reason. Made in the USA and mine is absolutely square as can be (or as close as I can see with 20/15 vision).
> 
> https://www.woodcraft.com/products/starrett-tempered-steel-rafter-square
> 
> - jonah


The unknown reason would be because,,,,,THATS WHAT IT IS,,,,,,


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## Nubsnstubs (Aug 30, 2013)

> This is what I m talking about. They call it a "rafter square" for some unknown reason. Made in the USA and mine is absolutely square as can be (or as close as I can see with 20/15 vision).
> 
> https://www.woodcraft.com/products/starrett-tempered-steel-rafter-square
> 
> ...


Hehehehe Yep. all those numbers stamped, engraved or silk screened on "framing/Rafter squares are there for several different measuring methods for building different components of houses. They were a "computer" back in the day. I'll admit, I only use mine for checking square, but they are much more than a square…...... Jerry (in Tucson)


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## rwe2156 (May 7, 2014)

Isn't that a bit ridiculous? Even more is that people will pay that much for it.

FWIW my Starret carpenters framing square is dead on for a fraction of that.


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## jonah (May 15, 2009)

> This is what I m talking about. They call it a "rafter square" for some unknown reason. Made in the USA and mine is absolutely square as can be (or as close as I can see with 20/15 vision).
> 
> https://www.woodcraft.com/products/starrett-tempered-steel-rafter-square
> 
> ...


I know what it is. I know how it's used. I've built stairs, cut rafters, and just about everything else you can do with a framing square. The most common name for the tool is "framing square," at least where I come from. Nobody calls them rafter squares.


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## MikeB_UK (Jul 27, 2015)

> I know what it is. I know how it s used. I ve built stairs, cut rafters, and just about everything else you can do with a framing square. The most common name for the tool is "framing square," at least where I come from. Nobody calls them rafter squares.
> 
> - jonah


In the UK at least
A Rafter/Speed square









A Framing/Carpenters square.


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## EarlS (Dec 21, 2011)

I have some Woodpeckers "One Time" tools. One of them is a carpenter's square that has never been out of the case. It is a thing of beauty, which is why I clicked "order", never really putting much thought into what I would use it for. I also have one of the rulers and some corner squares as well as a marking tool. I use the ruler a fair bit as well as the marking tool. However, none of these items were inexpensive and I will admit they weren't especially good value from a practical standpoint.

Having said that, Woodpeckers does have high quality tools that is specifically targeted to folks that want better quality and are willing to pay for it. There seem to be more and more places like that, with high end, precision tools at higher prices.

At the end of the day, expensive, fancy tools don't make you a better woodworker.


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## dschlic1 (Jan 3, 2013)

You can purchase a 6" machinist square for about $20 that is accurate to 0.0006" over six inches. Look for Taylor Toolworks on eBay.


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## John_ (Sep 23, 2013)

I have one from the first time they were released a couple of years ago.

Would I buy it again? I would have to really think about it…. but probably not

First problem and I hate to say it, it cost too much to use on a daily basis, and it's heavy. At this point, mine is kept with my other 'precision' type tools that I use to tune up my equipment - like my Lee Valley precision aluminum straight edges, dial indicators, etc. It get's used and then immediately put back on the wall so nothing will happen to it. Other than being accurate, the only other real feature it has which is a plus - is it has a lip so you can set it on a piece of plywood for example, and the short edge will stay level with the surface of the long edge (does that make sense)

What I do use most of the time is a simple aluminum Irwin framing square which cost me $30 and is just as accurate for the most part.
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005XUHH5S/ref=oh_aui_search_detailpage?ie=UTF8&psc=1

If you really want to spend more money than that - take a look at the *Chappal Master Framer*. 
It's made from stainless steel and the 'Graduations and angular accuracy are to within ±0.003" over the length of both tongue and blade' . At $119, it's half the cost and would certainly take more abuse

Lee Valley sells them, they have free shipping right now and you can have it in your hands in less than a week instead of waiting who knows how long for the WoodPecker…
http://www.leevalley.com/us/wood/page.aspx?cat=1,42936&p=69569

If you want a WoodPecker square - I also have the 1281 (12") which does get a lot of use and does come in handy - but then again, it is about the same price as the Chappal

I know sometimes it is hard to resist some of those WoodPecker tools (at least for me) but when you really think about it…


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## Knockonit (Nov 5, 2017)

boy howdy, seems the wood tool world is much like the fishing world, the new bait, as in fishing is the same in wood, the new bait is the new tool. most are a tool of convienience or for the fella that doesn't wanna learn the old school way, so to speak.

i'd choke on a square costing that much, and or one of my good carpenter friends would do it for me, the choking that is, we could partake in a whole lotta other good things for that amount of ginglebob.
Rj


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## rbrjr1 (Nov 2, 2017)

> In the UK at least
> A Rafter/Speed square
> 
> 
> ...


THIS. (USA too)


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