# How would you make these legs?



## huyz (Jan 16, 2016)

Hey all!

I'm trying to make this bench for indoor use:










For the legs, the tutorial uses miters, then uses brad nails and screws to join them as seen here:










Is there a simple, stronger way to make this than miters? I have a table saw, miter saw, drill, and router (no table) to use.

They also use screws to attach those legs to the bench top, which I'm also wary of. I was going to swap that for some dowels instead-is there a stronger, simple method you'd recommend?

Thank you for your yelp!


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## bigJohninvegas (May 25, 2014)

That design is ok, looks good anyway with the fact that it will hide all the end grain. Personally I would use a spline miter. That would give the joint plenty of strength. 
http://lumberjocks.com/BigRedKnothead/blog/38806
I assume the bench is for outdoor use. I would use stainless steel screws.


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## RonAylor1760 (Aug 17, 2016)

Multiple Mitered Slip Joint …


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

Butt joints and pocket screws where nobody looks.

Pocket screw holes can be freehanded with a
3/8" spade bit. Drill straight for a bit to get
the spade engaged in the wood and then
twist in the cut to the desired angle.

Of course you can get a pocket hole jig for
$20 or so.

I can badmouth pocket screws with the best of
them but they are the right fastener for a lot
of jobs when traditional joinery is too time
consuming.


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## Nubsnstubs (Aug 30, 2013)

Rabbet the verticals, cut the horizontals with the proper angle and screw them together at the top and bottom. Measure the thickness of the top and the thickness of the top horizontal bar, add them together, and purchase screws that are at least a 1/4" shorter. If you countersink the screws, take that into consideration before you get the screws. Drill the proper size pilot hole, attach the legs using good glue, and you're good to go…............ Jerry (in Tucson)


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## bondogaposis (Dec 18, 2011)

Box joints will be the strongest. For mitered joints I would spline them to add strength.


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## wormil (Nov 19, 2011)

Someone asked this question before about the same bench. Agree with Bondo, box joints are the way to go.


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## huyz (Jan 16, 2016)

Thank you for all of the replies guys!

Clamping this trapezoid is going to be difficult no matter which method used right ? Splined miters would look cleanest but require making a separate jig-more difficult than a box joint jig I believe. I wonder if box joints will be visible once dyed black.

Might go for box joints, or butt joints with screws. Lots of things to consider while finishing up the top


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## TheFridge (May 1, 2014)

> Someone asked this question before about the same bench. Agree with Bondo, box joints are the way to go.
> 
> - Rick M.


Ditto

Edit: a little glue and free fine sawdust cures almost all cracks. Especially if painted.


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## Loren (May 30, 2008)

Those legs are totally a biscuit joiner type thing
from the days when they were the hot thing
in WW magazines. The joiner handles the
angles at a snap, etc… that's another way
but you still have to mess with clamping
any way you do it. I still maintain pocket 
screws and butt joints are the least fuss 
(screws in end grain are weak fasteners) but 
considering the scope of doing the whole
project, lavishing some care on the joints
only adds a bit of time.

Personally I think these sorts of designs are
weak and I'd prefer an added gusset inside
the leg frames. This stuff is typically design-school
output and young design students often haven't 
been observing furniture much before school
and have no repair experience. Just fyi… 
I get asked to make school designs from time
to time and they are always problematical.


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## DirtyMike (Dec 6, 2015)

with a welder.


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## tblank (Apr 8, 2010)

If the legs are to be paint grade, why not cut them out of a piece of plywood as a single unit. Lay them up to achieve desired thickness with epoxy. Edge band the visible edges and paint. Legs with no joints at all and still strong enough to bear required weight.


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## craftsman on the lake (Dec 27, 2008)

Make them without the 45's. Just be sure the verticals overlap the horizontals so the end grain of the horizontal pieces don't show from the sides. Then put two screws in each corner. Countersink them and plug with a wood dowel, chisel and sand off the extra. When painted they won't show at all and it will be strong.

Screws will also be strong.


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## huyz (Jan 16, 2016)

Thanks for the tips everyone.

I just wrapped my head around standard box joints for 90 degree angles, but for a trapezoid like this it gets more complex I think-how do you accomplish this? Also how would you clamp a trapezoid like this-a custom jig just for this project?

Kinda leaning towards butt joints to not overcomplicate this.


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## huyz (Jan 16, 2016)

> If the legs are to be paint grade, why not cut them out of a piece of plywood as a single unit. Lay them up to achieve desired thickness with epoxy. Edge band the visible edges and paint. Legs with no joints at all and still strong enough to bear required weight.
> 
> - tblank


Maybe I'm not understanding you right, but if it's cut from a single sheet won't it require multiple sheets, with tons of waste?


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## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

> with a welder.
> - DirtyMike


That was my first thought also… as soon as I saw it, I instantly thought rectangular metal tubing.

Cheers,
Brad


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## Johnny_Yuma (Nov 29, 2009)

I personally use Dominoes for glue ups like this, but that's an expensive option. Splines are the next best option.
Keep your cut offs when you cut your miters. You can then hot glue them to the outsides so your clamps have something square to clamp against.


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## bandit571 (Jan 20, 2011)

Hmmmmmm









Just an idea…









Maybe too complicated….


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## bigJohninvegas (May 25, 2014)

No need for a special jig for spline miters. Checkout bigredknotheads post. Shows you how to do it on your table saw. Makes for a very strong miter joint, That looks really good. 


> That design is ok, looks good anyway with the fact that it will hide all the end grain. Personally I would use a spline miter. That would give the joint plenty of strength.
> http://lumberjocks.com/BigRedKnothead/blog/38806
> I assume the bench is for outdoor use. I would use stainless steel screws.
> 
> - bigJohninvegas


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## whiteshoecovers (Jun 7, 2015)

George Nelson is rolling over in his grave


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## tblank (Apr 8, 2010)

Huyz Depending on the dimensions of the table, it shouldn't take more than a sheet of 3/4" ply. What I meant was, the cut out is one piece and laminated to desired thickness. With proper layout. I can see multiple pieces from one sheet of plywood if the table I less than four feet wide. It seems to me eliminating the joints would give need rigidity. The "waste" could be saved for other projects like making templates or router/table saw sleds or a number of things. Laminating with epoxy would make them darn near bombproof. Why complicate things with un-needed joints? Hope this explains better. Good Luck.


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## bilyo (May 20, 2015)

I assume you are building this for exterior use. If so, I would have the legs fabricated from steel box sections and then have them powder coated.


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## huyz (Jan 16, 2016)

> I assume you are building this for exterior use. If so, I would have the legs fabricated from steel box sections and then have them powder coated.
> 
> - bilyo


They would be for interior use, but steel box sections sounds very sturdy. Thanks!


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## 000 (Dec 9, 2015)

Joints could be screwed or doweled from the top and the bottom.


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