# Printer for printing plans



## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

I don't have a laptop I can keep in the garage (shop) for fear of messing it up yet I still rely heavily on plans, mostly sourced online for projects, as such I typically print out what I need to take to the shop. I need a new printer just for black and white printing and I'm debating between and inkjet and a laser. I've never had good results with inkjet printers as the ink is out (empty color cartridge can still disable B&W printing on many models), head is dirty/clogged or software issues. From a laserjet perspective, it looks like the toner cartridges have longer shelf life and result in a lower cost per printed sheet vs. ink. The Brother HL-L6200DW looks interesting but real world reviews seem few and far between. Does anyone have suggestions or sucess (and reliability) with what they're using?


----------



## Loren (May 30, 2008)

inkjet printers will print templates more accurately, if that matters to you. If you wanted to print up gears a laser printer wouldn't do it accurately enough, so I've read.

Basic printers are cheap these days, it's the toner and ink that are pricey. If considering a laser printer consider the toner cost as it varies a lot from brand to brand. If you wanted to spend more you could look at an ink tank printer.


----------



## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

I use my laptop in the shop all the time. I have done this for years without any problems. Just don't set in the direct line of the saw dust coming off your table saw blade.


----------



## recycle1943 (Dec 16, 2013)

for 20 or so years this is my go to 
https://epson.com/estore-clearance-center

I find a printer that looks like it'll do what I want then I go to ebay and see if after market ink cartridges are available and how much.
If things line up - I buy it. When It finally gives up the ghost, I go to the site and buy another. My latest is a 4 color ET2650 
I usually get a few years out of one -


----------



## MrUnix (May 18, 2012)

> inkjet printers will print templates more accurately, if that matters to you. If you wanted to print up gears a laser printer wouldn't do it accurately enough, so I've read.
> - Loren


Where did you read that? I've got both, a laser and inkjet, and both will produce absolute dead on accurate renderings of whatever I throw at them, including gears. I have several gripes about inkjet printers though; the main one being that I can't keep the nozzles from clogging up and giving me problems. I don't do a lot of printing however, so that does contribute to the problem.

If all you are doing is B/W, then a laser is the way to go IMO. Faster, crisper and more accurate printing that is durable and resistant to smudging.

Cheers,
Brad


----------



## LesB (Dec 21, 2008)

I have used HP printers for 20 years and never had a problem. The cartridges come with their own print head so you get a new print head every time you change cartridges. I just make it a point to keep spares so I don't get caught short.

I actually prefer a printed plan over having it displayed on a screen in the shop. I almost always make changes once I get into the shop and start working so with a print copy I can pencil them in and then make changes to the computer copy later.


----------



## prazbotta (May 20, 2020)

> I have used HP printers for 20 years and never had a problem. The cartridges come with their own print head so you get a new print head every time you change cartridges. I just make it a point to keep spares so I don t get caught short.


+1

Came to say the same thing.

HP for the last 20 years as well. I got one Epson printer about 16 years ago, had it for about 8 months and hated it the entire time. They make good printers, but you have to use them regularly. Get something where the cartridge is the print head.


----------



## sansoo22 (May 7, 2019)

I own both types of printers. An inexpensive Samsung b&w laser which is fantastic for most shop things. I also have a large format Cannon inkjet. I've had it for about 15 yrs now and its never gummed up on me. Even when I had it in storage for a couple years all it needed was new ink and to run its self cleaning cycle and it was good to go.

My experience over many years of IT, graphic design, and general tech foolery is you can't really go wrong with a HP or Cannon in either inject or laser. I stay away from Brother because they seem to change drums on their lasers all the time and finding one for older models gets tough. If you gifted me an Epson I would punch that gift horse right in the mouth.


----------



## Loren (May 30, 2008)

Matthias Wandel of Woodgears stated that.


----------



## craftsman on the lake (Dec 27, 2008)

I've been buying printers since 1979. I owned one of the first TI lasers on the market. Slow and expensive.

Anyway. Inkjet printers are not fun. You want a color picture a couple of times a year and the $28 cartridge is dry since you printed one picture six months ago. Thing is you can bring an SD card or thumbdrive to walmart and print a picture for about 20 cents. So for me color inkjets are a waste of money unless you need color on demand, all the time.

These days a small laser printer is dead accurate. It has to be for postcript and truetype fonts otherwise they'd look wavy. You can get tons of pages out of a cartridge especially if you don't print large black sections. HP or brother are fine and will work good and last a long time. If you have a Mac consider that if you want wireless printing it will be a bit more of a chore to configure on an HP. But they are great printers and the cost is not great. For the task you describe I'd do a laser, no contest.

I can vouch for not getting an epson though…. problematic.


----------



## controlfreak (Jun 29, 2019)

I think you should get a dot matrix printer LOL

I still remember the day that a customer said "I never dreamed I would one day pay more for a Dot Matrix printer than a laser jet one"

Went printer less at the house a decade ago. The cartridges would dry up every time we needed it and they take up too much space. I do have printers at the office I can use.


----------



## Ocelot (Mar 6, 2011)

Brother B&W lazer works fine for me and cheap - sometimes bundled with the super-jumbo toner pack that's good for 10 packs of paper.


----------



## drsurfrat (Aug 17, 2020)

+1 Ocelot: we have a Brother HL-2200DW and has been chugging away for years. Ha, they don't even make this model anymore but it's still going.


----------



## CaptainKlutz (Apr 23, 2014)

Used a Samsung laser printer for over 8 years now. Was one of those recommended by PC Mag at the time? Have never been disappointed using PC Magazine recommendations as long my needs are aligned with the recommendation scope.

Family uses a high capacity cartridge roughly every 9 months. Great machine. It started showing a minor fading problem on edge last month and needs a new fuser drum; but has been fantastic machine for home office. For black and white printing, will never go back to inkjet.

Just realized Samsung sold their laser printer business to HP, so guess my recommendation is a new HP or Brother recommended by PCMag? lol

Worked for Ink Jet printer mfg in 80's during the time inkjet tech was released into PC market. The business model on low end is making money selling high cost supplies, not printers. If you are not printing thousands of pages per month to justify cost of a large continuous use commercial model, and loading ink via bottles into secondary reservoir not located on print head; ink jet page cost is ridiculously high.

Cheers!


----------



## Tony_S (Dec 16, 2009)

I've had a Brother DCP-L2550DW IN the shop for a couple of years now. I swore to myself that I'd faithfully blow it out on a regular basis because of the dust in the shop. In reality, I blow it out…every 4 months maybe? It's never missed a beat. Great printer.


----------



## Redoak49 (Dec 15, 2012)

I have a couple Brother Laser printers and love them. I will never have an inkjet or HP printer again.


----------



## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

> Anyway. Inkjet printers are not fun. You want a color picture a couple of times a year and the $28 cartridge is dry since you printed one picture six months ago. Thing is you can bring an SD card or thumbdrive to walmart and print a picture for about 20 cents. So for me color inkjets are a waste of money unless you need color on demand, all the time.
> 
> These days a small laser printer is dead accurate. It has to be for postcript and truetype fonts otherwise they d look wavy. You can get tons of pages out of a cartridge especially if you don t print large black sections. HP or brother are fine and will work good and last a long time. If you have a Mac consider that if you want wireless printing it will be a bit more of a chore to configure on an HP. But they are great printers and the cost is not great. For the task you describe I d do a laser, no contest.
> 
> ...


Dry ink is our problem, might go 3-4 months printing nothing then need 50 pages of b&w and the damn thing won't print because the color cartridge is empty and I swear these damn things are digitally black listed after they're deemed empty. I refilled the color cartridge once with a kit and it still said it was empty. The Canon I850 I had 2nd hand from my parents lived to 12 years old before failing, it would print b&w with empty color cartridges and four new cartridges were $7 off brand. In a pinch I bought a $39 HP from wally world that takes a $35 black cartridge and uses half of it aligning itself and effing up the first several pages of the first print job while trying to communicate with my HP laptop that it's literally plugged into.


----------



## JAAune (Jan 22, 2012)

My favorite is an inkjet setup with a CISS kit (continuous ink supply system). We got an Epson Workforce and a Cobra CISS kit to do sublimation work and once that was done, it became the office printer. Ink is cheap, refills are easy, print quality is good and it prints instantly unlike the laser printer I'm used to.

Main downsides are higher initial cost, the occasional issue with ink droplets getting on the paper and Epson's firmware making random attempts to reject the CISS kit and ask for Epson cartridges. It's important to browse printing forums and find out which printer/ink kit combos play nice together.


----------



## artsyfartsy (Mar 25, 2015)

I have a brother 2270DW and have for a few years now. I have no complaints as yet. I too use my lap top in my shop all the time. However, I have to carry it from my den into the shop when I need it.


----------



## Lazyman (Aug 8, 2014)

My HP 5-in-One ink jet is infuriating. I don't print that often and when I finally do print a page, it will go into some sort of check out mode for a minute or two where it sounds like it is probably wasting ink to prevent clogging or something. I like the printer otherwise but you can't print something else until it finishes its you-are-not-using-enough-ink-so-let-us-do-it-for-you process.

I 3D printed a pen holder for my 24×24" CNC machine so I may experiment with using it as a plotter to draw out full size or at least larger plans that I make with or import into Sketchup. I am relatively new to CNC use and I use the pen holder mostly when I am unsure about a cut to test out a tool path without sacrificing wood.


----------



## splintergroup (Jan 20, 2015)

I'm with laser all the way, very accurate and inexpensive to operate. The deal sealer for me was not having dried up/clogged ink. The color quality loses out to an ink jet, but for B/W it's perfect. You can easily refill your toner at home to stretch the budget.

Both versions have become extremely inexpensive, but the more you pay for an ink jet, the more "friendly" they become as to clogging and ink refiling options. Of course there is some true junk for sale in both versions so buyer beware 8^)


----------



## jacww (Aug 23, 2015)

Inkjets are a pain in the neck, as everyone has already said. If you decide to go with an HP Ink Jet printer don't fall for their ink subscription. If you subscribe and later cancel, the cartridges that you received while you were subscribed WILL NOT work after you cancel!

Color lasers are much more reasonably priced today, but of course you have 4 (not cheap) toner cartridges to buy. The toner cartridges do last longer than ink cartridges and don't dry up or clog. Another potential advantage is that many color laser printers have a scanner built in. Could be an option if the budget allows.

Brother laser printers are at the top of my list.

TonyC


----------



## wormil (Nov 19, 2011)

Ink jets are low cost up front but expensive to operate. The good ones use pigment inks that clog nozzles if not used frequently and cheap ones use dye inks that produce poor quality prints. They usually have scanners and can make copies which is a nice feature.

Lasers are the opposite, cost more upfront but cheaper to operate. Scanners add $$ to the price. Color adds more $$$ to the tag. Lasers have more serviceable parts so they can go forever but the parts aren't cheap. Older Xerox printers run forever and are cheap, sometimes free, but usually need add on cards for networking.

I haven't noticed in any difference in accuracy or precision in modern printers. In the old days, early-mid 90s, lasers had disadvantages but back then plotters were king.


----------



## miketo (Jun 26, 2016)

I'm in the get-a-laser crowd. B&W is great and color is nice to have but honestly not worth the additional cost. We have a Canon LBP612; I thougth I'd use the color more but I don't. Duplex is a welcome feature IMO as I prefer smaller stacks of paper to staple and handle.

I also like using the local OfficeStaple DepotMax for printing things, especially ones that will get a lot of use. Used them for making some print-and-play games and was quite happy with the product-commercial-grade printing, quality paper stock, etc. If you have some plans that need enlarging or whatever, it's a great alternative. (No affiliation.)


----------



## northwoodsman (Feb 22, 2008)

I have numerous HP printers, one LaserJet and the remainder are InkJets. I spend over $500 every time I have to replace the toner cartridges (annually) in the LaserJet. It's only about $200 for the inkjets. For the shop printer I find what's on sales at Staples. I find it's cheaper to throw away or give away a printer that needs more than two cartridges replaced. Since I use it so infrequently I can go 2 years on the starter cartridges, usually for under $50.


----------



## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

> Inkjets are a pain in the neck, as everyone has already said. If you decide to go with an HP Ink Jet printer don t fall for their ink subscription. If you subscribe and later cancel, the cartridges that you received while you were subscribed WILL NOT work after you cancel!
> 
> TonyC
> 
> - jacww


I'm totally not on board with this whole digital rights ownership BS, not having the cartridges working that you paid for sounds like a recipe for a class action suit. As Lazyman mentioned, our cheap ass HP will go into ink wasting mode if we haven't printed in a while. All this could be avoided if I kept my own hacker on retainer to eliminate all the BS from firmware from something I bought but don't really own.


----------



## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

I think I've settles on the Lexmark MB2236adw monochrom laser printer, all in after tax and with an extra (?) toner cartridge it will be right at $200. As mentioned before, HP is no longer an option based on their digital rights ownership practices and the extremely poor quality. My parents use their printer(s) about the same and have run through a number of inkjet printers, a new one almost every year, all with the same problem of sitting idle too long and either wasting too much ink self cleaning the head or suffering through poor quality printing.


----------



## Kudzupatch (Feb 3, 2015)

FWIW I had to buy a new laser a while back. I settled on the Brother® HL-L2300D and not had a moments trouble out of it. I print shipping labels and receipts mostly. I see they are down to $99 now. I think I paid close to $200 for mine a few years ago. Very well pleased with mine.

I have a 42" plotter if you want really large full size plans.


----------



## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

*. As mentioned before, HP is no longer an option based on their digital rights ownership practices *

What does that mean? Digital right?


----------



## controlfreak (Jun 29, 2019)

Opposite of Digital Left


----------



## bigblockyeti (Sep 9, 2013)

I ordered the Brother HL-L2300D for $100 + tax from Amazon, the factory cartridge should be good for ~1200 pages, at least three year for us unless I buy more property or something requiring lots of printing and signing. The aftermarket cartridges are cheap and supposedly good for ~2600 pages, I'm debating going ahead and ordering a couple in the event that model and subseqent aftermarket support disappears before I need my first replacement.


----------



## CaptainKlutz (Apr 23, 2014)

> *. As mentioned before, HP is no longer an option based on their digital rights ownership practices *
> 
> What does that mean? Digital right?
> 
> - AlaskaGuy


I agree that HP is not a good printer option for those care about privacy. 
The 'digital rights' TOS you agree to when using their software is OVER BEARING!

They are ALWAYS allowed to monitor your printer activity. HP printers phone home with usage statistics, even if you turn off cloud printing. Printers not connected to an outside network, use the HP app on PC to redundantly send the data. Cloud printing enables them use any material your print through their cloud servers for any company purpose, even using random charts or graphs from your personal life for advertising.

Most smart corporate It departments set firewall rules to stop all data going to HP printing servers, and use secure local software to enable encrypted cloud printing across companies networks/devices. Pity the small business owner that doesn't realize all their corporate data sent from presidents laptop to wireless printer across room is being collected on HP cloud servers as port of BIG DATA harvesting.

HP claims the don't sell the data, and it is only used internally. But they have been breached by hackers several times, and are not a company I trust with secure personal data.

Yes, I know big brother is always watching, but will not buy equipment from companies that will not let me turn off data collection. YMMV

Thanks for letting me rant.


----------



## AlaskaGuy (Jan 29, 2012)

> *. As mentioned before, HP is no longer an option based on their digital rights ownership practices *
> 
> What does that mean? Digital right?
> 
> ...


Thanks for ranting. I have an HP laser color Printer, had no idea. I'll be looking for a new printer. My wife has an HP all-in-one computer. Got a rant for that too?


----------



## tvrgeek (Nov 19, 2013)

The new Epson "tank" printers changed everything. No longer will your printer eat up cartridges just cleaning and you get 10 pages per set. I do like having color and it is also my scanner/copier.

I still have my laser printer as the per page is cheaper and it is much faster but in all honesty, if it fails, I won't replace it. Actually, I have one more cartridge left and when it is used, may not even replace it.

I use third party cartridges and ink. Never had any problems.

Your shop should not be dusty enough risk a computer. If so, forget the plans and get your air filtering up to date. Dust will kill you.


----------



## Kudzupatch (Feb 3, 2015)

> I ordered the Brother HL-L2300D for $100 + tax from Amazon,.....
> 
> - bigblockyeti


I hope it works for you as well as it has for me.


----------



## CaptainKlutz (Apr 23, 2014)

> Thanks for ranting. I have an HP laser color Printer, had no idea. I ll be looking for a new printer. My wife has an HP all-in-one computer. Got a rant for that too? - AlaskaGuy


Glad rant informed.

To be fair, should add important details:

There are usually two software drivers available for printer.

- Windows approved version
: These are usually generic, and try to support common minimum capability for all similar devices from same mfg. Any mfg supplied drivers must meet Mickeysoft's design requirements, and are tested for compliance. The windows printers drivers don't phone home to mfg servers.

- Mfg supplier version.
: These are customized drivers written by mfg. While they can be stamped with MS approved label, they can/will collect data as defined in TOS. Always read the fine print of TOS.

Depending on device, WINDOWS driver only install can be PITA for all-in-one devices. All-in-One devices offer document scanning to PC, and some windows scanner drivers do not include hooks for scanning documents into generic windows applications like Paint or other image editors. So you end up forced to load mfg driver, or even worse the entire mfg (HP, etc) software package to enable using printer features. :-(

Am not 100% against HP, just angry with forced data collection. 
Sometimes HP is offering the best value printer available and can be smart money to buy one. I have owned several HP printers, though my kids have them now.

My training has taught me that best way to control any and all printer privacy invasion is assigning the printer a fixed IP on local network, and then set a firewall rule at router that blocks all out bound internet traffic from that IP. Note - This will prevent your printer from participating in auto refill program, and will not be able to use printer from outside home network.

Last but not least:
HP is not only intrusive data collection printer mfg. All the mfg have some data collection. Most I have used (except HP and Samsung printers now owned by HP) will let you un-check the data collection box during installation to minimize any privacy issues. so same guideline of using only the minimum software from mfg to enable use of device, will let you reduce/eliminate the data collection.

Hope this helps.


----------

