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Forum topic by mzimmers posted 09-07-2007 07:50 AM 1903 views 0 times favorited 15 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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mzimmers

193 posts in 3914 days


09-07-2007 07:50 AM

Topic tags/keywords: drill countersink screw

First, I just want to say hello. I activated my account earlier today and have already received several warm welcomes. I think I’m going to like it here.

On the subject of tools, etc…I recently bought a set of reversible drill-countersink/screw bits from Sears (part # 26171 if anyone needs a better description). I inserted them into my drill press and discovered an alarming amount of run-out. I took the set back and got a replacement, which is at least as bad as the first.

I’ve double-checked all the likely culprits: my press is good, and all the bits were properly seated and tightened down. I’m forced to conclude that these just aren’t all that well-made. So, my question is: does anyone have a recommendation for another maker of this kind of tool? I specifically would like the ones where you just flip the bit around to go from drilling to screwing.

Or…is it possible that I’m expecting too much from a tool like this? I realize that most people probably are going to use it in a hand-held, rather than in a press, but still, greater than .125” of run-out at the bit tip just seems excessive.

Anyway, thanks for any input…

mz

-- M. Zimmers


15 replies so far

View snowdog's profile

snowdog

1164 posts in 3981 days


#1 posted 09-07-2007 02:08 PM

What does “run-out” mean? Is that when you try to drill a point and it moves off the point your aiming at? My wife yells at me all the time to stop running out for new tools <laugh>

-- "so much to learn and so little time"..

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Thos. Angle

4444 posts in 3961 days


#2 posted 09-07-2007 02:46 PM

I have a couple of Ryobi drill and screw bits.I don’t think they were made for a drill press. Seems like mine are built with a soft movable piece? in the middle. These were made more for carpenters to use on job sites. For drilling screw hole on the drill press I use a set of DeWalt bits.

-- Thos. Angle, Jordan Valley, Oregon

View mzimmers's profile

mzimmers

193 posts in 3914 days


#3 posted 09-07-2007 04:12 PM

When I used the term “run-out” I was referring to the wobble of the drill bit—as stated above, it’s greater than 1/8” with one of the attachments.

-- M. Zimmers

View olddutchman's profile

olddutchman

187 posts in 3934 days


#4 posted 09-07-2007 09:15 PM

It’s good to have You here. I have been a member for 3 weeks, and this is just about the best place out here. I aggree with Thos. Angle, that the bits that You have are for electric hand drill. , and are sloppy at best. They are handy for ceentering holes for hinges, locksets and the like. I only use one piece bits in the drill press and am not sure of any sets with the precision that You’r looking for

-- Saved, and so grateful, consider who Created it ALL!!!

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mzimmers

193 posts in 3914 days


#5 posted 09-07-2007 11:00 PM

OK…well, then, if this set isn’t high-precision…what can anyone recommend for some really high-quality countersinks?

-- M. Zimmers

View Steve Renard's profile

Steve Renard

49 posts in 3921 days


#6 posted 09-08-2007 01:09 AM

hellow and welcome, I am also a new member.I use a set of dewalt countersinks in my drill press and have good results,they are the type that use a set screw to lock the bit down.

-- steve with Grains Of Passion woodworks

View Woodminer's profile

Woodminer

69 posts in 3936 days


#7 posted 09-08-2007 04:46 AM

Let me add my own welcome there, MZ.

With tools, you usually do get what you pay for. And you usually DON’T get what you DON’T pay for! It’s usually not a question of getting out what you put in. And there is definitely some of the silk purse/sow’s ear thing going on with tools.

If you’re doing brute force work, your basic Sears or Harbor Freight drill set will get you through the day. No promise for tomorrow, though. If you need the hole to actually BE 3/8”, you may have to spend a few bucks for a good bit from a reputable maker. Or make the cheaper bits work better (maybe even good enough to get you through for a while) by sharpening them really well. If you buy quality tools, they come with less prep needed and they will generally last a LOT longer. Sears or HF are generally NOT in the “precise” category. More in the “mostly good enough” column, IMO.

The hardest lesson I ever had to learn was that tools are not ready to use out of the box. There are few tools that applies to more than standard drill bits. They are notoriously poorly fashioned. You can look at the end and realize that the point isn’t in the middle! There is a Drill Doctor in my future at some point in time, I surely hope!

Tools out of the box should at least be ready to be prepared for use. Sawblades are an exception to the rule, as are hammers, but most cutting edges need to be sharpened or honed or at least tweaked. E.g., chisels need to have the coatings removed at least far enough up the steel to be able to sharpen and hone.

-- Dean, Missouri

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mzimmers

193 posts in 3914 days


#8 posted 09-08-2007 04:51 AM

Thanks for the input, Dean. Do you have any specific recommendations for countersinking bits? I’m more than willing to spend what’s necessary to get quality tools. I bought the Craftsman because they were the only brand I was aware of that featured the flip bits. But…I’m open to suggestions.

Thanks again…

-- M. Zimmers

View Nicky's profile

Nicky

695 posts in 4091 days


#9 posted 09-08-2007 06:08 AM

Welcome!

I have a couple 1/2” countersinks that I purchased on Amazon. Go to the Amazon site, and do a search for countersink. I believe thay are from Irwin. I’m sure you’ll find a similar bit at Sears.

-- Nicky

View scottb's profile

scottb

3648 posts in 4326 days


#10 posted 09-08-2007 06:25 AM

I have a great set from Rockler.com – bought these before the local big box carried some cheap Ryobi or Hitachi ones. which i’ve used and destroyed in modest, perhaps even less than normal use. The rockler set was pricier, but way, WAY, better.

The rockler set was also more convienent to use rather than flipping the drill/countersink and driver bits. They have a “sleeve” for the driver that fits right over the drill bit (hex) with adjustable stop. They have a few different sets, for countersinking, and another for centering, for #6, 8 and 10 screws (I think).

-- I am always doing what I cannot do yet, in order to learn how to do it. - Van Gogh -- http://blanchardcreative.etsy.com -- http://snbcreative.wordpress.com/

View Woodminer's profile

Woodminer

69 posts in 3936 days


#11 posted 09-08-2007 07:38 AM

Hey MZ,

One resource for tools that I’ve found to be hard to beat for quality is Lee Valley in PA. They tend to be a little pricier, but their tools and hardware are really hard to beat for sheer quality. The link above will take you to drill bit stuff. They sell a variety of things from their version of the flip to a dedicated 82ยบ countersink that will chamfer holes up to 1-1/4”! They claim it doesn’t chatter and will countersink for screws down to #0. But it is a dedicated tool. I have several countersinks from 2 flute to 6 and they all tend to chatter, so the Lee Valley version must be a doozie!

-- Dean, Missouri

View Bob #2's profile

Bob #2

3809 posts in 4020 days


#12 posted 09-08-2007 01:54 PM

MZ- Welcome!
This one should fit the bill for your problem. It has drill stems that run straight through to the drill press and should eliminate any run-out from the countersinks.
The plus is that the parts for this set are open stock letting you replace any part that wears out rather than have to buy the whole thing again.

Bob
countersinks
http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=32309&cat=1,180,42240

-- A mind, like a home, is furnished by its owner

View Thos. Angle's profile

Thos. Angle

4444 posts in 3961 days


#13 posted 09-08-2007 02:19 PM

I use bits similar to the ones Bob shows. I’ve had trouble getting replacement bits but that shouldn’t be a problem from Lee Valley, they are a good company. I would go with this set.

-- Thos. Angle, Jordan Valley, Oregon

View Bill's profile

Bill

2579 posts in 4160 days


#14 posted 09-08-2007 05:29 PM

Instead of using a dedicated countersink bit, I usually drill the countersink with a forstner bit, and then drill the hole for the screw. The forstner bit will leave a nice hole, with the center pre-marked for your next drilling. That way I can put my money into other things I will likely use more often. If I get to the point of needing this type of drill bit, I will probably check out Lee Valley. Rockler and Woodcraft may have similar ones as well.

-- Bill, Turlock California, http://www.brookswoodworks.com

View Dadoo's profile

Dadoo

1789 posts in 3989 days


#15 posted 09-08-2007 10:29 PM

I’ve been using Insty-Bit pro version #82502. They are a 1/4” hex-shank, quick change countersink set, so they fit in your hand drill or drill press. Can’t remember what I paid for them but they still serve me quite well. The drill bits are adjustable lengthwise for accomodating various screw lengths. They are not tapered like the good Lee Valley set above, but the bits are easily replaceable. I also bought two Vermont American brand Plug Cutters in 3/8” and 1/2” sizes. Hope this helps a bit.

-- Bob Vila would be so proud of you!

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