Inventor of Sawstop demonstrates with his finger

The naysayers will now change their tune from “he should use his real finger” to “he should use his <censored>“

-- - Please help keep Lumberjocks an enjoyable escape by refusing to participate in political discussions. Simply spit out the bait and ignore the thread...

I guess you could say… He gave the saw The Finger!

Awesome demo!

Awesome guts!

-- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500"

So what does it cost to fix the saw stop if it triggers? Can’t be cheap. Does it ever mis-trigger?

-- "That Government is Best that Governs The Least."-Jefferson

Seldom is there a miss fire from all the user blogs I have read and when taking with the SawStop sellers the unit is that has to be replaced is about $75 plus the cost of the saw blade. Yes, a bit pricey but something I would gladly pay if it meant my wife’s or my fingers.

-- Never board, always knotty, lots of growth rings

... easily the cost of some medical bills NOT COUNTING the part(s) that got cut OFF… :)

-- Have Fun! Joe Lyddon - Alta Loma, CA USA - Home: http://www.WoodworkStuff.net ... My Small Gallery: http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/showgallery.php?ppuser=1389&cat=500"

You have to buy a replacement cartridge, and a new saw blade. So if your partial to using expensive blades it could be a bit costly.

-- David, South Windsor, CT "I love the smell of sawdust in the morning"

I agree with the folks who point out that that frequent mis-firings could certainly be expensive.

However, SawStop isn’t new anymore. There seems to be a pretty decent installed base of Sawstop table saws in schools and pro shops, yet not many complaints about mis-firings.

Firings that hit skin don’t count, as the tool was doing exactly what it was designed to do.

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I was Charles Neils show and he had an employee using the saw stop. I arrived there after it had stopped. The blade went below the table but I don’t believe that the blade went into the trap.

Charles told me later that the employee had caused it to fire but I don’t think it went into full stop mode.

-- What happens in the workshop stays in the workshop. No wait that doesn't sound right. Karson Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com †

I’ve seen the hot dog demonstration before, but this takes it to a new level. Good post!

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

Having recently amputated my own finger, I’m not really sure how I feel about this. I understand that it’s an important safety issue, but the SawStop is over twice the price of my quite nice table saw. I’ve seen him do it with a hotdog, but couldn’t watch the finger version. I haven’t even looked at my own pics or x-rays yet. if they come up with something similar that works on existing table saws, or they come down to a reasonable price, please let me know. Meanwhile, I’m back up to 90%, which is still an A-. The only problem is that if I do anything semi-major again, my girlfriend will make me quit woodworking. Talk about pressure…

-- You can't control the wind, but you can trim your sails

I don’t think there will ever be a retro fit for existing tablesaws. From what I have read, the inventor never wanted to manufacture tablesaws, but the established players had no desire to license and incorporate the sawstop in their saws. If Delta, Grizzly, Jet, Craftsman, Rigid, etc licensed the technology and put it in all their saws, it would more affordable.
Jeff

-- "Why don't you just buy one" says the wife about the current project.

if I had the money, I would buy this saw in a heartbeat.

-- www.darrylmasterson.com ~ www.darrylmasterson.etsy.com

“Having recently amputated my own finger, I’m not really sure how I feel about this. I understand that it’s an important safety issue, but the SawStop is over twice the price of my quite nice table saw. I’ve seen him do it with a hotdog, but couldn’t watch the finger version”

As someone who has amputated a finger, I would truly value YOUR opinion after you’ve seen the video. Please watch and let us know your thoughts.

I have never suffered an amputation, so I value your input. If you truly can’t bear to watch, that says enough.

-- - Please help keep Lumberjocks an enjoyable escape by refusing to participate in political discussions. Simply spit out the bait and ignore the thread...

What a dipshit.

-- Just 'cause a cat has kittens in the oven, it don't make 'em biscuits.

I agree with Darryl, if I had the money I would buy this saw in a heartbeat. According to the video, the blade AND the saw unit costs about $60. Personally, I would much rather spend $60 (even without the blade) and keep my fingers. One drawback that I can see is that users may get lulled into a false sense of security and be careless when using a different saw.

-- Dave, Colonie, NY

Dick I have seen this machine before. It is truely amazing.

-- Grumpy - "Always look on the bright side of life"- Monty Python

Buy a CNC machine. Talk about safety you don’t even have to go near the thing except to press start. LOL. The only dangerous part about that is the belly you may get from sitting in your chair. This saw is cool, but I like to think that it’s my obligation to be safe. Dave said it best about the false sense of security and the carelessness that can derive from it.
BTW, has anyone discussed the down time costs of setting this thing off? How many days do you have to go before you have it running again? In a professional shop 15 minutes of down time is rough. I couldn’t imagine sitting around for days. I guess that’s why they don’t buy those saws, they buy the big sliding saws with digital controls, or I guess maybe they have 2. So is this saw geared to the hobbiest? The guy who can set it off and then wait for 2 weeks for his parts to come in. Or am I missing something.

-- ~ Inspiring those who inspire me ~

They claim it only takes 5 minutes to change the cartridge, and it would only make sense to always have a spare on hand, so downtime is not really an issue.

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

what if you set if off more then once in the same day? The same week? Are you going to have a bunch of cartridges? If this thing can be unintentionally set off it seems to me that you’d be destined for down time at some point. Not only does it cost you money, but it effects your business relationship with clients when you tell them you’re behind schedule because your saw triggered twice and you don’t know why. LOL

-- ~ Inspiring those who inspire me ~

I’m not trying to promote the saw in general… I’m just saying that downtime is a lousy argument against owning one. As a hobbyist, I would keep one extra on hand. But if I were running a commercial shop, I’d have several. At $70 apiece, that’s a pretty small investment to avoid the risk of downtime.

Now if you want to argue that the cost is too high, both initial purchase price and the cost of replacing blades and cartridges, that is at least a reasonable point.

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

I guess the question comes down to what is the price of your hands / fingers. It’s obviously been proven to work. So the question is how much are your hands/figners worth. When I end up getting a table saw I will be seriously looking into this. Hopefully its an investment that never has to be used, but if it ever is needed, I think the benefit of keeping my hand or fingers is much much greater than the cost of item.

but if the cost of the saw is important then ad the cost of the saw, the blades it screws up, the cartridges, the down time, etc. You don’t just buy a cartridge for $70, you buy a blade for 100, the loss of time recalibrating and aligning, etc.
kickbacks are more likely to cause injury then cutting your fingers off. The saws have blade guards to prevent that anyhow. If you take the guard off you are the one putting the risk on yourself. It seems like a very expensive investment just so you don’t have to be as carefull. You’ll save your finger from the saw and cut it off on the shaper. If it’s destined to happen you can’t prevent it.

-- ~ Inspiring those who inspire me ~

It might only take 5 minutes to change the cartridge but I can assure you, it would take a lot longer than that for me to clean my pants!

-- Gary, DeKalb Texas

LOL! Now that is a reasonable downtime concern.

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

As someone who just had an accident last Friday, I would say I would buy this if I could afford it. I was lucky. I hit my left thumb. It really just shaved off about an 8th deep about the size of a dime on my finger print. We can all talk about being safe and careful. There is a reason it’s called an accident. I had all the safety gear on, splitter, push sticks etc. I started to make the cut then turned the saw off and checked the blade height over the stock and lowered it a little more. (That’s what saved my thumb) I don’t really know how to explain what happened. A one second shift in focus then…zap back to reality real quick. Is the price a little steep? In my opinion yes. Misfires? Doesn’t seem to be a lot of reports on that. I don’t know if a false sense of security could every be had with a sharp blade spinning really fast staring at you. But that’s just me. I know this though. If I had a shop or school I would have these. An employee out for an injury, talk about down time.

I’m sorry about your accident.

It’s also very helpful to keep reminding us to be safety conscious at all times.

-- -** You are never to old to set another goal or to dream a new dream ****************** Dick, & Barb Cain, Hibbing, MN. http://www.woodcarvingillustrated.com/gallery/member.php?uid=3627&protype=1

I attended a hot dog demonstration live at a wood show earlier this year. It is awesome. Charles Neil made a very video review about this saw and he points out the other super features of this saw. http://charlesneilwoodworking.com/category_player.php?type=1&cat=4

Jeff you are right the copyright of this technology will prohibit other manufactures to retrofit however Saw stop has came out with a contractor saw which is slightly cheaper and I can see them coming out with a bench top saw within the next few years. The representative also told me that they are doing some Research
and development for other tools as well.
You have got to love the new marketing scheme “ Wife approved” I can tell you my wife would not have that cute smile if that saw would show up on our credit card bill.

-- All bleeding will eventually stop.

There is a post earlier in this thread asking what the value/cost of keeping your fingers are. I lost 3 fingers in my tablesaw accident. The cost to re-attach was $88,000. Out of my pocket was $14,000. But….they are back on and work about 70% – 90%...depending on the finger. :-)

-- Socrates: "I drank what?"

If you notice he used his finger to touch the side of the blade, and it was an easy slide into the cutting zone.. And he was not sliding it along like the hot dog. Doing it like they demo with the dog would take a lot of courage.

-- What happens in the workshop stays in the workshop. No wait that doesn't sound right. Karson Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com †

My latest Woodworkers Journal has an add on the second page with a girl holding a sawstop picture with the heading “Wife Approved”

They are trying to get the wife to force the issue, because we are all talking about how much it will cost.

-- What happens in the workshop stays in the workshop. No wait that doesn't sound right. Karson Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com †

I don’t know if I’ve seen anywhere a comment about the time that the sawstop mechanism is active. When you turn off the power to the saw, does that then turn off the power the the alarming circuit. Is it possable to get your finger into the blade after the time of power off and full stop mode.

When you turn it on there is a start-up mode on the circuitry. I’d hate to think that you could get some body part into the blade and not have it stop-n-drop like it shows after you’ve hit the power-off switch.

-- What happens in the workshop stays in the workshop. No wait that doesn't sound right. Karson Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com †

Karson, the blade brake safety feature stays active as long as the blade is turning. It will trigger if you touch the blade before it stops. Even when the blade is stopped and the saw not running you can get a red light just by touching the blade with your finger. That shows you that the blade brake system is active and working. The Sawstop actually has two safety features. You have to turn the saw on and wait for it to run its safety checks before you can then pull the switch to actually start the motor and blade. If there’s a problem then the saw won’t start. For me, turning the saw on and waiting for it to run its checks reminds me to pay attention to what I’m doing once I fire up the saw.

-- Darell, Norman, Ok.

Nice !!! It been what, almost two years since our last rousing round of sawstop religion / bashing. That thread is up to 1683 views and got 67 replies in about 12 days.

Another Sawstop brouhaha has over a thousand views and got 55 replies in 2 days.

This is very impressive and a giant leap forward in shop safety. With that said I would hope that it doesn’t cause people to be lulled into a false sense of security. Anything created by man can and will fail at some time given the right set of circumstances. I have always tried to be cautious when operating any equipment however one Christmas while building doll cradles I became distracted for a second and sawed halfway through 4 of my fingers right at the palm joint. Luckily the Doctors were able to save the fingers, 20 years later every time I start a power tool I relive that moment and it causes me to be even more cautious. Perhaps had I had a saw stop this all wouldn’t have happened but still don’t rely completely on technology because it isn’t foolproof.

-- Eagles may soar, but weasels don't get sucked into jet engines! Mike D.

I watched that video 3 times very closely, and it looked to me like his finger never touched the blade.
Maybe i missed something, but I don’t think so.
The guys not only stupid, but he’s got more cahonnies than me..
If you have to risk a finger or two to demonstrate your product, go for it!!!!

-- Remember--- one good turn-- gets most of the blanket!!!!

Safety issues aside, I’ve heard it’s a GREAT SAW too. ... so to the extent that the cost seems excessive for an average saw with this safety feature, it gets a little more tolerable when you consider that it’s a very very good saw.

On the wife issue, my own has seen the video and has mentioned several times that she wants me to get one—and this is just a little more than a year after taking delivery on my current cabinet saw… so it’s a good pitch on the the part of saw stop.

I don’t understand the downtime concerns. A trip to the hospital.. THAT’s serious downtime. I have not heard of a lot of misfires. Don’t know much about it in a professional environment though.

-- Laziness - Apathy = Efficiency

Another shop teacher I worked with in the past got one for his new school shop. They have had one misfire. Something about metal in the wood. I think it was a countertop type material and it was partially metallic. It basically works the same as a GFI sensor, just this one sets off a brake and the momentum forces the blade under the table. You can deactivate the sensor temporarily if needed. I also heard about that misfire happening when using treated lumber. All in all, I am working on approval to get 2 in our shop, one for each side. Economy’s tight right now, that affects our working budget since it is based on taxes. So for now I use a bret guard and do the best I can to watch each student cut on the table saw. No matter what each student has to have a setup check before they can turn the saw on, even my 2nd and 3rd year students.