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1 3/4 hp band saw with carbide blade limitations?

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Forum topic by giser3546 posted 03-18-2015 02:27 AM 1116 views 0 times favorited 16 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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giser3546

179 posts in 939 days


03-18-2015 02:27 AM

I just came into possession of several large cherry logs. I would like to do as much milling as I can myself but I need a realistic idea of what to expect before investing in the process. I have a Laguan 14-12 which has a 1 3/4 hp motor, a 12” resaw capacity, and heavy 14” cast iron wheels. I’ve been able to resaw red oak up to about 8” albeit slowly but I’m wondering how close to the 12” capacity I can get if I upgrade to carbide tipped blade. Anyone used a carbide blade for resaw, and at what thickness should I just leave it to someone else?

-- "If you wait for it to rain, It will"


16 replies so far

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Moron

5032 posts in 3360 days


#1 posted 03-18-2015 02:36 AM

i guess it all depends

the odd person sets their own saw blade and sows what they reap

im old and experienced so sadly I get the customer to pay and have it delivered

-- "Good artists borrow, great artists steal”…..Picasso

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Logan Windram

303 posts in 1929 days


#2 posted 03-18-2015 02:37 AM

Just use a sharp blade and feed slowly…. Not sure carbide makes any difference.

My biggest worry would be hold the logs to cut, but you can alway jig something up.

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AHuxley

493 posts in 2788 days


#3 posted 03-18-2015 03:23 AM

The first issue is you haven’t specified the specific blades you want to compare. Any advice given may not be remotely accurate since there is no simple standard carbide blade and we don’t know the other blade you are using. It is quite possible that if the saw is power limited (at the 8” red oak) range if may actually be further crippled by adding a carbide tipped blade. Carbide teeth on bandsaw blades are the LEAST sharp initially of any of the standard woodworking saw teeth materials add to that many carbide tipped blades have a thicker kerf so you would be asking the saw to remove more material with a “duller” tooth.

So before we can go any further we need to know the specific blades you plan to compare. Also be aware the wetter the logs the more difficult it will be for the blade to remove the waste, chances are you should be looking at a specific blade for processing the logs which you would not use for resawing dry wood.

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giser3546

179 posts in 939 days


#4 posted 03-18-2015 03:52 AM

Now I’m using a 3tpi timberwolf blade, I’ve tried Laguna has blades but they didn’t seem to last very long.

-- "If you wait for it to rain, It will"

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AHuxley

493 posts in 2788 days


#5 posted 03-18-2015 04:02 AM

You still have to be more specific, Suffolk makes several 3 TPI bands with significantly different characteristics. I am also assuming the logs you want to process are wet…

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giser3546

179 posts in 939 days


#6 posted 03-18-2015 01:41 PM

Sorry about that, this is what I’ve been using so far:

http://www.woodcraft.com/Product/859672/Timber-Wolf-Bandsaw-Blade-115-x-12-x-3-TPI-Positive-Claw.aspx

Yes the logs are wet. The first truckload was cut Monday, the Second on Tuesday. This evening I’ll be adding a coat of latex paint to the ends until I get my milling procedure and a few more tools ready like a set of roller stands and such. I measured them and the biggest among them are 14” with most between 10” and 12”.

-- "If you wait for it to rain, It will"

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AHuxley

493 posts in 2788 days


#7 posted 03-18-2015 04:46 PM

What you have is a fairly aggressive blade with about .048” kerf but still not ideal for initial milling of green logs. I would not suggest a carbide blade for breaking down the logs for two reasons, most of them will have a wider kerf and less aggressive tooth which will leave you short on horse power, second there is no point risking an expensive blade in green logs, you just don’t know what may be inside them.

While I am not a huge fan of TW blades since you use them I assume you like them, this would be the TW I would suggest http://timberwolfblades.com/proddetail.php?prod=1202AS Highland also sells an excellent green wood blade.

As an aside for resawing close to full capacity on that saw I suggest a Lenox Kerfmaster from Spectrum Supply. It is the same bandstock as the Iturra Bandrunner and the Highland Woodslicer but significantly cheaper. The positives are it has a thin kerf and being spring steel (with hardened teeth) it is very sharp. It is perfect for resawing when power is limited. Be aware that it will dull faster than a carbon steel blade but they are cheap and will speed up the process with lower powered saws. My personal rule of thumb is 1/4 HP for each inch of resaw in most domestic hardwoods for handfeeding and double that per inch for SLOW power feeding (5fpm or slower), you can make do with less power but it makes blade selection more crucial and obviously slows down the feed rate.

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giser3546

179 posts in 939 days


#8 posted 03-18-2015 07:14 PM

Much appreciated AHuxley, You’re making me realize how limited my experience with BS blades really is. I have only really gotten to try the blade I’m using now and the Laguna equivalents which seemed to dull significantly quicker. That being said I guess my initial question should have been what would be the best blade for sawing green wood. That TW seems like a good idea but I’m not 100% set on TW, I am open to any and all suggestions as far as brand. I have done a significant amount of research on Lenox blades and will look into the Kerfmaster. thanks again

I did notice this little note on the kerfmaster page:
Please note: Although the KERFMaster™ can cut green wood, we do not recommend cutting green wood due to its thickness.

-- "If you wait for it to rain, It will"

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AHuxley

493 posts in 2788 days


#9 posted 03-18-2015 07:43 PM


I did notice this little note on the kerfmaster page:
Please note: Although the KERFMaster™ can cut green wood, we do not recommend cutting green wood due to its thickness.

- giser3546

I should have made it clear the Kerfmaster and the others from the same bladestock are ONLY for resawing dry wood not processing green wood. The Kerfmaster has little or no set to the teeth which allows it to leave a nice finish on resawn boards it can’t clear the big chips created from green wood and the taller the cut the worse the issue is. YOu want a blade with a lot of set as well as large gullets, low TPI a positive rack on the teeth and alternate set with raker.

I honestly cut little if any green wood save roughing the occasional bowl black which I use a 3/8” blade for, while I am sure there are plenty of alternatives the TW I linked to is the best one for the job that I can think of off the top of my head. I know Lenox makes several as well but not near my Lenox catalog.

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giser3546

179 posts in 939 days


#10 posted 03-18-2015 08:30 PM

Based on this new info it would seem like these are my best options:

1. Lenox Flexback carbon steel 1/2” x 0.025” x 3 tpi with hooked raker teeth. Would be a good choice given the hooked teeth giving me a deep gullet and the $13 price.

2. Lenox #32 wood carbon steel 1/2” x 0.032” x 3 tpi with a raker tooth set. This one is not marked as having hooked teeth but I don’t know that will be a big deal. It’ll run me $15.

3. Timber Wolf 1/2” x 0.032” x 2 tpi with an alternating set, even though its $25 the courser tooth set and my good experience with tw in the past may mean its worth it.

My saw is meant to handle up to 3/4” blades and while I have tried one it was a Laguna blade which I’ve never cared for, and that could have been the problem with that one.

-- "If you wait for it to rain, It will"

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AHuxley

493 posts in 2788 days


#11 posted 03-18-2015 09:13 PM

Of your three choices I would go with the TW despite being more expensive and dulling faster (softer teeth than carbon steel despite TW claims). I like it better than that particular flex back due to the thicker backer which will allow more tension and give a higher beam strength. The venerable Lenox #32 is NOT for smaller saws you need large wheels to prevent metal fatigue, usually reserved for 24” wheels and larger.

I can’t comment on the 14/twelve’s tension ability since although I have looked at them quite often I have never used them. Though looking at the tension spring and assembly it is clear they should be able to tension MOST 3/4” blades.

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giser3546

179 posts in 939 days


#12 posted 03-18-2015 09:56 PM

It claims to be able to run up to 3/4” blades but the extra tension makes me nervous that I’m putting extra wear on the saw. The tension gauge (for what its worth) goes well above the mark for 3/4” but I’m sure there’s a reason for its limitations.

-- "If you wait for it to rain, It will"

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AHuxley

493 posts in 2788 days


#13 posted 03-18-2015 10:08 PM



It claims to be able to run up to 3/4” blades but the extra tension makes me nervous that I m putting extra wear on the saw. The tension gauge (for what its worth) goes well above the mark for 3/4” but I m sure there s a reason for its limitations.

- giser3546

Again looking at the saw I would have no issue with putting MOST 3/4” blades on it a thick backed carbide blade when I would try for 30K psi might be pushing it, but carbon/spring steel/bi-metal and thin cross section 3/4” carbine blades (ala Laguna Resaw Master) look to be fine.

The thing to remember is the manufacturers size rating for BS is really a fallacy. It is not just the width of the blade that counts, it is the total cross section that matters and some types of blades need significantly more psi on them than others to perform as intended, so the scale if shown in width can’t be correct but for one width/thickness/type of blade. In fact they are almost all read low for anything except a fairly thin carbon blade of the size. Without a strain gauge (bought or DIY) it is really impossible to know the exact tension on a blade and without them it comes down to feel and trial and error with the scale as simply a rough guide.

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gfadvm

14940 posts in 2157 days


#14 posted 03-19-2015 12:36 AM

My saw is a bit bigger than yours (17” Grizz with 2 HP). I use a 1 TPI x 1” Timberwolf blade with VERY deep gullets (which are necessary when sawing large green woods. This thing cuts scary fast!

-- " I'll try to be nicer, if you'll try to be smarter" gfadvm

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giser3546

179 posts in 939 days


#15 posted 03-19-2015 12:59 AM

Looked a little harder and now looking at a 3/4” lenox flexback with either 2 tpi raked or 3 tpi hooked.

-- "If you wait for it to rain, It will"

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