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Polycrylic scratches

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Forum topic by Lorelie posted 03-17-2015 04:47 PM 1822 views 1 time favorited 18 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Lorelie

4 posts in 627 days


03-17-2015 04:47 PM

I’ve just “completed” my kitchen cabinets; water based paint and then Minwax Polycrylic. I let the paint cure for 3 or more weeks before starting the Polycrylic. After a few mis-starts, I found that using the foam brushes worked best over a semi-smooth finish. The coats of Polycrylic were left to dry as long as a week between coats and I used a 220 sponge to knock off the rough spots. They all looked beautiful! I was so pleased and THEN when I started putting on the hardware, I realized it was scratching very easily! Too easily for kitchen cabinets. What do I do now? Did I not put enough coats on? I admit, I thought two coats would be enough but maybe not. I have not buffed the final finish and a few places I wiped off with a damp cloth and left a “white” streak but then it dried and was fine. Any help would be appreciated as this project has taken a very long time and I don’t want to mess it up now.


18 replies so far

View Fred Hargis's profile (online now)

Fred Hargis

3927 posts in 1953 days


#1 posted 03-17-2015 05:23 PM

I don’t think your problem is the number of coats. Waterborne finishes in general are very hard, meaning they scratch very easily. A true urethane finish (an oil based one) is very scratch resistant, that’s actually their calling in life. But many waterborne finishes (such as Polycrylic) are actually acrylic finishes with just enough urethane in them to put that seemingly magic word onto the label in some form. I don’t have a solution given the products you used, someone else will be along with their take on it. What exactly was the intended purpose of the Polycrylic? A good quality paint is more than sufficient for kitchen cabinets.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

View OleArmyAg's profile

OleArmyAg

6 posts in 631 days


#2 posted 03-17-2015 05:42 PM

Fred is probably correct, the paint is low quality. You want a good oil based urethane, like a Sherwin Williams Pro-Classic. Be forewarned however, this stuff is like painting molasses on. Thick is an understatement. You’ll also want to dump those foam brushes for something more appropriate for oil based paint. I have found good quality natural fiber brushes (pig hair) work for me.

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barada83

76 posts in 646 days


#3 posted 03-17-2015 06:46 PM

Is it scratching or chipping off? A topcoat with poor adhesion chips off.

-- Mike

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BinghamtonEd

2281 posts in 1830 days


#4 posted 03-17-2015 07:30 PM

At this point, you may be able to hide the scratches with some wax and they may not be noticeable.

-- - The mightiest oak in the forest is just a little nut that held its ground.

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Lorelie

4 posts in 627 days


#5 posted 03-17-2015 07:30 PM

I used Behr paint – 3 coats. This was the paint suggested by many. The problem I had with it was again, scratching. When I started researching that—Polycrylic was recommended. Mike, it is scratching – no chipping yet but I have a feeling it will be coming. Really need some suggestions of what I do now.

Question – the natural fiber brushes, will they leave brush marks? That’s why I went to the foam brushes in the first place. I started with a high quality synthetic brush as directed but had trouble with brush marks.

View CharlesA's profile

CharlesA

3018 posts in 1258 days


#6 posted 03-17-2015 07:35 PM

I’ve been migrating to GF High performance water-based poly for heavy use pieces because the finish is hard. am I missing something?

-- "Man is the only animal which devours his own, for I can apply no milder term to the general prey of the rich on the poor." ~Thomas Jefferson

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OleArmyAg

6 posts in 631 days


#7 posted 03-17-2015 07:59 PM

Lorelie, yes, I do have faint brush marks, but you can finish sand them out (rub them out). The foam ones won’t leave the marks, but you’ll be going through them pretty fast as the viscosity of this paint strains the foam and starts tearing it. You’ll start seeing tiny little things in your paint wondering what they are. It’s the foam from the foam brush being ripped apart minutely.

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barada83

76 posts in 646 days


#8 posted 03-17-2015 10:10 PM

It’s a tough call to me. If it were me, I would either try to sand it down to the paint or at least roughed up so something else can stick on and recoat with a more durable finish or I would rub it all down to a matte or satin finish with some steel wool. The latter assumes you have a gloss type of finish and would be ok with a less glossy one.

I painted my cabinets white to buy some time on a kitchen remodel. We used Sherwin Williams trim paint for it and the durability seems very good so far.

-- Mike

View Fred Hargis's profile (online now)

Fred Hargis

3927 posts in 1953 days


#9 posted 03-18-2015 11:03 AM

If that was Behr Premium Plus, it was a good choice. Anyway, I have no suggestions …sometimes trying to “fix” something makes things worse. Starting over probably isn’t acceptable (it wouldn’t be to me), and it sounds like living with it isn’t acceptable ether (that would probably be my choice at this point). You could try topcoating what you have with a better quality coating like the GF mentioned earlier, but I would try it in an inconspicuous place first, maybe the back of a door and see how it comes out. What you may run into is coatings of different hardness on top of each other don’t always play well. Plus, if the coats build up too thick, then you get “crazing” (cracking) in the finish.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

View Earlextech's profile

Earlextech

1159 posts in 2151 days


#10 posted 03-18-2015 02:17 PM

This may be too late for Lorelie but LATEX PAINT IS NOT A FINISH AND SHOULD NEVER BE APPLIED TO CABINETRY OR FURNITURE. Sorry about the yelling, but I can’t say this emphatically enough.
A proper coating would be something like Sherwin Williams Kem Aqua Pigmented waterborne lacquer, which can be tinted to 150 different colors.
Putting poly over latex only complicates the matter. Mixing chemicals from different companies is not a good idea either.
Thinned Kem Aqua could be the primer and un-thinned would be the top coats. No mixing of different companies or chemicals = less problems. Finishing is a lot easier than most people make it.

-- Sam Hamory - The project is never finished until its "Finished"!

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Fred Hargis

3927 posts in 1953 days


#11 posted 03-18-2015 02:21 PM

Earlex. you are correct (there was never a doubt) but it wasn’t clear to me she used latex (as in wall paint). The Behr Premium Plus I mentioned is a 100% acrylic paint that would be suitable for cabinets. Did I miss the part about her using latex?

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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Earlextech

1159 posts in 2151 days


#12 posted 03-18-2015 02:32 PM

Fred, she did say “water based paint” and I assume if she applied an acrylic paint it would say so and she wouldn’t have to coat with poly if that was the case. Perhaps I misunderstand.

-- Sam Hamory - The project is never finished until its "Finished"!

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Lorelie

4 posts in 627 days


#13 posted 03-18-2015 03:37 PM

I did use the Behr Premium Plus – I miss spoke on the water based paint issue. OK now that that’s clear …. It still scratched easily, that is why at least 3 paint stores (Sherwin Williams included) told me to use the Polycrylic. At this point it doesn’t matter what I did wrong, I just want to get it fixed. If I have to sand off the Polycrylic, so be it, not first choice but I haven’t gotten any other suggestions out there. Someone tell me what the GF is that was mentioned earlier, please.

View CharlesA's profile

CharlesA

3018 posts in 1258 days


#14 posted 03-18-2015 03:43 PM

https://generalfinishes.com/retail-products/water-base-top-coats-sanding-sealers/high-performance-polyurethane-topcoat#.VQmc_xDF--U

-- "Man is the only animal which devours his own, for I can apply no milder term to the general prey of the rich on the poor." ~Thomas Jefferson

View Fred Hargis's profile (online now)

Fred Hargis

3927 posts in 1953 days


#15 posted 03-18-2015 05:35 PM

Lorelie, SW owns Minwax, that may have been why they were in line with the Polycrylic recommendations (don’t know why the other 2 stores suggested it). The GF High Performance that Charles A linked is a very good product. It has UV inhibitors which you don’t need , but is essentially a clear finish…which you probably want. They have another very good finish called Enduro Var, but it does have some amber dye in it to mimic the color of an oil based finish, it might be an even better choice except for the color part (and it’s a bit more expensive as well). One thing I can’t gauge is whether it will have the scratch resistance you want, but it is a very durable finish.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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