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Workbenches - Tail Vise - Why is the End Jaw sticking out?

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Forum topic by PurpLev posted 05-26-2009 11:01 PM 18859 views 3 times favorited 24 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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PurpLev

8476 posts in 2307 days


05-26-2009 11:01 PM

Topic tags/keywords: question tail vise gap

So I googled around, and couldn’t find the reason – thought maybe someone here might know:

traditional workbenches have a tail vise, where the front jaw closes flush with the bench hole strip – but the end jaw is 2”-3” away from the table (breadboard) – why is that? whats the reason for that gap?

tail vice gap can be seen here on this bench

I’m in the process of designing a workbench, and would like to have a tailvise – but am buffled by this gap?!? anyone know?

-- ㊍ When in doubt - There is no doubt - Go the safer route.


24 replies so far

View Karson's profile

Karson

34878 posts in 3059 days


#1 posted 05-26-2009 11:04 PM

I’m waiting for the answer. I don’t plan on making one, but it’s a great question.

-- I've been blessed with a father who liked to tinker in wood, and a wife who lets me tinker in wood. Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com †

View Cato's profile

Cato

641 posts in 1971 days


#2 posted 05-26-2009 11:22 PM

Lev, not sure why that gap is there. I googled and found this guys workbench project and no gap on the tail vise on his, nor on the one I have that was my grandfathers.
Say how are you going to fit that workbench with your car in the garage?

http://www.wordsnwood.com/2001/p.bench/

Also this site has a work bench forum that would probably have your answer
http://www.workbenchdesign.net/bench.html

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PurpLev

8476 posts in 2307 days


#3 posted 05-26-2009 11:30 PM

Thanks Cato, I’ve lurked that site already, some good info there.

I’ve seen some tail vises that are flush all around, and some that are like the first link you posted- with no ‘end jaw’ to them.

I like the idea of the traditional vise – with the front jaw AND the end jaw. Nyquist designed a tail vise that closes flush with both front and end jaws, this give you the possibility to clamp on both faces.

I’m just curious – why the gap on the “traditional type” vises. I assume there is a reason for it – but what is it?

Edit:

P.S. – that workbench is going to go in the living room – I still have some room there.

-- ㊍ When in doubt - There is no doubt - Go the safer route.

View lew's profile

lew

10036 posts in 2414 days


#4 posted 05-26-2009 11:31 PM

I always thought the tail vice was used to hold stock flat on TOP of the bench- wedged between two bench dogs. If that’s the case, the vice would not really have to close tight. Of course this type of answer is how rumors get started.

-- Lew- Time traveler. Purveyor of the Universe's finest custom rolling pins.

View degoose's profile

degoose

7014 posts in 2013 days


#5 posted 05-27-2009 12:31 AM

When someone finds out I too would like to know.

-- Drink twice... and don't bother to cut... @ lazylarrywoodworks.com.au For lovers of all things timber...

View Francisco Luna's profile

Francisco Luna

936 posts in 2052 days


#6 posted 05-27-2009 12:36 AM

Good point.
I would say, it is either for aesthetic reasons -the proportion between the front rail length and the vise face piece- OR to give the right “room” to the screw length, commercially available.

This pictures belw ilustrate my second theory.

-- Nature is my manifestation of God. I go to nature every day for inspiration in the day's work. I follow in building the principles which nature has used in its domain" Frank Lloyd Wright

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cabinetmaster

10874 posts in 2217 days


#7 posted 05-27-2009 02:43 AM

Looking at the picture, the end vise and the square section that it is attached to both have about the same gap. Looks like this may serve a double purpose. Look at the gap where the end leg is on the front. I think that whole section is part of the end vise.

-- Jerry--A man can never have enough tools or clamps

View PurpLev's profile

PurpLev

8476 posts in 2307 days


#8 posted 05-27-2009 03:00 AM

haha, I’m glad so many find this an interesting question. I thought about it for a long time. but never saw an explanation yet.

Francisco – the pics you posted are what I’m following – it’s the Frank Klauzs bench from “The Workbench” book. I thought like you did -that it’s to accomodate the factory screw- but if thats the case, the bench could be made longer- or the vise assembly could be embeded deeper in the bench which would make the jaw close flush with the bench? so I’m not sure if that’s the reason.

Dave – as you mentioned, there are tail vises that do not have the ‘end jaw’ but are just a square block that completes the bench surface.

I am interested in the idea of having both the tail vise to use with bench dogs, and ALSO an end vise that can hold parts like a front vise can. kinda getting the best of both worlds.

Francisco- from that same book, there is an page that refers to the Nyquist design – in that page they talk about how most traditional vises have that gap – but his design eliminates it and actually make use of both jaws of the vise – that’s what triggered my interest. but even there- there is no mention of WHY the other vises have that gap…

cabinetmaster- it might seem like they have the same gap, but the inner jaw closes flush, while the outer jaw does have an open gap. google ‘Frank Klausz Bench” or “Traditional Bench” and you’ll see what I mean.

so – we have more interest , but still no answer…

-- ㊍ When in doubt - There is no doubt - Go the safer route.

View PurpLev's profile

PurpLev

8476 posts in 2307 days


#9 posted 05-27-2009 03:17 AM

Yup- read that book too. I’m not a big fan of the LV twin screw – too many issues with this one, and at $300 – way out of my budget even if it was perfect.

I like the tail vise for it’s ability to hold pieces vertical between it’s front jaw and bench. I think it’s a very versatile vise. that, and the shoulder vise. only thing is – they are much more intricate to build and install compared to a cast front/end vise. so before I get into any final designs and bill of parts- I want to make sure I’m not missing anything.

-- ㊍ When in doubt - There is no doubt - Go the safer route.

View Francisco Luna's profile

Francisco Luna

936 posts in 2052 days


#10 posted 05-27-2009 03:28 AM

“but if thats the case, the bench could be made longer- or the vise assembly could be embeded deeper in the bench which would make the jaw close flush with the bench?”

mmmm…that makes sense…..

I dont see any impediment to make what you want, the only thing is to notch that bolt head at the pic…..


-- Nature is my manifestation of God. I go to nature every day for inspiration in the day's work. I follow in building the principles which nature has used in its domain" Frank Lloyd Wright

View Francisco Luna's profile

Francisco Luna

936 posts in 2052 days


#11 posted 05-27-2009 04:25 AM

Sharon …........If you need to get more inspired,visit: www.workbench.se….........;)

-- Nature is my manifestation of God. I go to nature every day for inspiration in the day's work. I follow in building the principles which nature has used in its domain" Frank Lloyd Wright

View marcb's profile

marcb

762 posts in 2332 days


#12 posted 05-27-2009 08:44 AM

I prefer a shoulder vise to a tail vise. A well setup shoulder vise will hold boards both with dogs and in the opening as needed.

Flush, smooth sleek and supported the entire length so you can really go to town with a Scrub or jack without worrying about the screw.

View kiwi1969's profile

kiwi1969

609 posts in 2100 days


#13 posted 05-27-2009 09:18 AM

I can,t comment because I don,t own a vice :-)

-- if the hand is not working it is not a pure hand

View Doug S.'s profile

Doug S.

295 posts in 2366 days


#14 posted 05-28-2009 03:56 PM

This is in the same price range as the LV twinscrew, but definitely a slick setup for a tail vise
http://benchcrafted.com/vises.htm

-- Use the fence Luke

View PurpLev's profile

PurpLev

8476 posts in 2307 days


#15 posted 05-28-2009 04:09 PM

Thanks Doug – as I stated here I would have loved to get this vise – but WAAAAY out of my budget – although , if anyone here wants to send me one – I’ll PM you my address :o)

I did take the idea from that vise and will attempt to replicate it’s functionality with a $40 Lee-Valley Tail vise screw and some wood blocks/rails (maybe some iron if I can find it)

-- ㊍ When in doubt - There is no doubt - Go the safer route.

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