LumberJocks

Make sense of this please

  • Advertise with us

« back to Coffee Lounge forum

Forum topic by kolwdwrkr posted 05-14-2009 07:26 AM 1747 views 0 times favorited 75 replies Add to Favorites Watch
View kolwdwrkr's profile

kolwdwrkr

2821 posts in 3055 days


05-14-2009 07:26 AM

Topic tags/keywords: question

“Help might be on the way. The Obama administration announced a plan in March to provide $75 billion in incentive payments for the mortgage industry to modify loans to help up to 9 million borrowers avoid foreclosure. But the extent of the relief remains unclear, with questions lingering about how much the lending industry will cooperate in modifying loans.”

This does not make sense to me at all. So the government is to give the banks 75 billion dollars as an “incentive” to get them to “modify” loans that “up to” 9 million borrowers have. SO doesn’t this mean that not only does the banks get 75 billion dollars but they also get a majority of the original loan from the borrower?

This is out right bullshit. Why the hell would they do this? It makes no sense at all. You could give 1 million dollars to 9 million people and those 9 million people wouldn’t owe shit anymore. The bank would get ALL of the money owed for the house and the people would be out of debt. If this isn’t FUBAR I don’t know what is. Maybe I just don’t know what the hell is going on anymore. Seems to me that we should just throw around billions of dollars to freakin nothing and call it a day. Oh wait, we do.

-- ~ Inspiring those who inspire me ~


75 replies so far

View LocalMac's profile

LocalMac

281 posts in 2871 days


#1 posted 05-14-2009 07:38 AM

If you gave 9 million people 1 million dollars I could think of a few things that would happen.

Hummer would become the number one vehicle in America.
People would pay off their houses and then buy a bigger one that they can’t afford.
Divorce rate would go up.
Small businesses would pop up everywhere and then fail because people think money fixes everything.
Wall Street businesses men, investors, and banks would get rich after digging their greedy fingers into the pockets of these 9 million and leave them with nothing.

-- Don't tell her I'm in the shop!

View kolwdwrkr's profile

kolwdwrkr

2821 posts in 3055 days


#2 posted 05-14-2009 07:49 AM

All good points. But, the money is being wasted anyway and isn’t reaching the American people. So what is really better? Besides they could regulate it. Maybe they should spend 75 billion dollars fixing small business’s and saving jobs so people could pay for the damn mortgage. Take my business for example. Because of the recession and the short amount of time I was in business it failed. I couldn’t afford the marketing and such to get my name out, and after only 4 years in business nobody knew who I was. So 3 people lost their jobs and I lost everything. And I mean EVERYTHING. If there was an incentive for business’s like mine where you could get the money easily I’d be in good standing.
SO there ya go, there’s tons of things they should do with the money that would actually HELP the American public. NOT the banks. It’s pretty damn low when you have to bribe the freakin bank to help the very Citizens that keep it in business.

-- ~ Inspiring those who inspire me ~

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

17671 posts in 3141 days


#3 posted 05-14-2009 07:49 AM

You got it pretty well figured out. The banks get the money from the gov’t (us taxpayers) and they get it from the the mortgagees (US taxpayers) too. One of them used the bail out money to buy a Japanese Company (don’t remember which one) With the amount of bail out money and stimlus money they are passing out to the criminals who run Wall Street, they could just give us all a years wages to spend and the recesson would be over.

Too bad the greedy bastards have been screwing us for the last 30 years. It’s going to take a while for this to “correct” in my opinion. During the last administration they would talk about 250,000 jobs being created every 6 months or year. They never mentioned we need 150,000 +/- to keep up with population growth. If they counted the people whose unemployment has run out and all those who are under empolyed who want to work at their profession or trade, plus the over 50 gang that are regularly discriminated against, I think the un- and underempolyment rate is at least 20%.

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View kolwdwrkr's profile

kolwdwrkr

2821 posts in 3055 days


#4 posted 05-14-2009 07:59 AM

Or, why couldn’t the government just look at the 9 million peoples bills (The IRS already knows what you make, what you spend, what you owe, etc) Pay off all their bills and mortgage to a $0 balance and call it a day. In other words if Joe owes 600k on everything that is what he gets. He is debt free. But, the government would then monitor his future financial status to ensure he isn’t buying said hummer. Basically regulate his spending. You are already regulated on how you spend by the debt you owe. But by doing this there wouldn’t and couldn’t be any substantial debt. So there wouldn’t be bankruptcies, etc.
Am I wrong?
BTW if you say people don’t want to be regulated on how they spend, I’m sorry but you already are in one way or another, and punished with taxes, debt, etc.

-- ~ Inspiring those who inspire me ~

View LocalMac's profile

LocalMac

281 posts in 2871 days


#5 posted 05-14-2009 08:16 AM

I’m confused by how people get so behind on taxes. I see commercials every day about people who owe hundreds of thousands of dollars in taxes and companies get them off by paying only a fraction. I’d like to know how these people get so far behind and how they get out of it. I understand struggling families or hospital bills keeping people behind but when you get to owing the government over a hundred grand I have a hard time feeling sorry for them. They just sound like criminals. The government wants their back taxes and if they aren’t paying it off are the rest of us paying for their debt? Just curious.

-- Don't tell her I'm in the shop!

View kolwdwrkr's profile

kolwdwrkr

2821 posts in 3055 days


#6 posted 05-14-2009 08:28 AM

The back taxes aren’t really in question here. I’m talking about mortgages and other bills. It seems as though the average family pays their taxes every year on time every time. However these are the people losing their home. So the money they paid in taxes over all the previous years isn’t going to help them at all? I’m behind on taxes myself. But it’s because I lost everything as I stated and don’t have work. So the taxes that I owe I can’t pay. I can’t pay anything without a job.
You really want to discuss being criminal with not paying taxes. What about the millions of illegals working here that don’t pay them? They go to our hospitals and get free care, take jobs citizens should have, etc. They seem to take and take and never give back. That’s criminal to me.
People have to make decisions when they get into a jam. When money is low and you have to choose between food and electric as opposed to taxes, are you going to choose taxes and live in the dark with no food. Screw that.
The tax money so many people pay doesn’t come back to the American citizens. It goes to war, to help foreign countries feed their people and rebuild their countries, it goes to auto makers who outsource to oversea companies, etc. So basically the money leaves the states. God forbid we ask for some of it back without some sort of repercussion. This country has flushed itself. It’s time to start taking it back and make some changes.

-- ~ Inspiring those who inspire me ~

View dan_fash's profile

dan_fash

62 posts in 2891 days


#7 posted 05-14-2009 08:33 AM

well, I can at least respond onthe tax thing. One incident snow balls into huge problems. A friend of mine had a great year in the 90’s. His taxes for the year were about $50,000, but he had only budgeted for taxes about $30K. his good year bumped him into a different tax bracket. So, $20K he didn’t have, went on an installment plan with the IRS, where he paid about $2000 a month, which should have paid him off in about a year and a half, but the IRS continued to charge late payments on late payments at a HUGE interest rate, and at the end of 1 year, having paid $12000 on a $20000 debt, he still owed almost $20000 dollars. of course this added into his next years Taxes owed, and made the problem worse. After years of trying to work out of this, he had paid almost $60 K on a $20 K debt. I won’t excuse his not having the money in the first place, as he should have been better prepared, but tryin to pay the IRS is much worse than trying to pay off a credit card with a high interest rate.

-- "If I find in myself a desire which no experience in this world can satisfy, the most logical explantion is that I was made for another world." -C.S. Lewis

View kolwdwrkr's profile

kolwdwrkr

2821 posts in 3055 days


#8 posted 05-14-2009 08:39 AM

Dan_fash thank you for proving that the government %$#^s us ever chance they get. That’s insane, and the road I’m on. Now I’m really depressed. LOL.

-- ~ Inspiring those who inspire me ~

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

17671 posts in 3141 days


#9 posted 05-14-2009 08:39 AM

kolwdwkr, Debt is how the economy was financed since the bust the union campaign starter with the Air Traffic Controllers Union in the early 80’s. Wages went stagnant in relation to inflation, credit was eased and banks were finally relieved of their required reserves. I believe they went down to about 10% in the early part of the decade. That’s why we have teh crisis, nobody has any cash reserves. You will notice the old south slave states is where all the foriegn factories locate away from the “good uniion jobs” with benefits as Sarah Palin put it during the campaign explaining how she and her husband finally got health care. Big blunder for a R candidate ;-)) The old south is where Wally World came from with their substandard wages, not benefits, thousands of illegal immigrant workers and coaching employees to get gov’t provided health care.

LocalMac, Business people get behind on taxes when they have a cash flow problem. I worked for a company who didn’t pay in any withholding of taxes, medicare or SS for about 100 employees. The feds finally tried to seize their bank accounts, but the bank called their line of credit due and payable the day before. On Friday, about a hundred electricians paychecks bounced. We finally got paid as wages have first claim on the assets, but they went under. I don’t know how much they owed in taxes.

Another guy I knew of was a big spendeer who was using some kind of tax shelter. It took the courts about 5 years to declare the shelter illegal. Add in interest and penalties on the back taxes and he owed about 1 million. Those of us who are honest and pay our taxes are probably the stupid ones, aren’t we?? :-))

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View LocalMac's profile

LocalMac

281 posts in 2871 days


#10 posted 05-14-2009 08:39 AM

I see your point. I’ve always believed that America needs to focus on our own problems. I’m not saying we should practice isolationism but we’re not going to create peace in the Middle East, we’re not going to cure all the diseases in Africa, but maybe we can realistically solve social issues here at home. Charity is always the right thing to do when possible but it angers me to see us trying to feed the world while children in America are homeless and starving. As far as illegal aliens go, you can’t place all the blame on them. The real criminals are the business owners that hire them. They are the ones who are giving Americans’ jobs away and paying out just enough for them to get by. If I had a choice between being starving and jobless or illegal but able to take care of my family I’d choose the second option too. Once we start going after the business owners we can start turning this problem around.

-- Don't tell her I'm in the shop!

View LocalMac's profile

LocalMac

281 posts in 2871 days


#11 posted 05-14-2009 08:45 AM

haha. Good call, Top. We are suckers. I forgot to pay my state taxes my first year of working when I was a kid. I never bothered when i realized it because the state owed me like $20. So now I figure some time down the road I’m going to ask the state for my money along with late fees and interest. I consider it my personal social security account. : )

-- Don't tell her I'm in the shop!

View kolwdwrkr's profile

kolwdwrkr

2821 posts in 3055 days


#12 posted 05-14-2009 08:47 AM

I’ll come back to this in the morning and hopefully the conversation will still be good without problems and controversy. I didn’t start this topic for a fight, so for anyone that hasn’t commented it’s going good so far with good solid thought out views. Thanks LocalMac, Dan_Fash and Topamaxsurvivor for the civil responses thus far. I’m sure I will wake up with some stuff to say, and I sure hate to look to see a bunch of hogwash and hatetred. So goodnight.

-- ~ Inspiring those who inspire me ~

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

17671 posts in 3141 days


#13 posted 05-14-2009 08:53 AM

I had that same situation when I started in the mid 80’s. In DEcember, my “accountant” told me I would owe 2-3000 on April 15th. I had estimated my taxable income within $2000. On April 13th, he called me and said I would owe $12,000 for the previous year and to make a big deposit for the curent year. I knew the tax on $2000 wasn’t $12,000!

I immediately called the accountant who sold him the business and told him what had happend to me. told him he’d better get what he could if he hadn’t gotten cash when he sold becuase that business because it was going to be totally worthless very shortly with that clown running it.

I was very fortunate I had the cash to pay and had no choice but to send a check to IRS on the 15th. I filed for an extension to give me time to find a real accountant. On the 14th, I did everything I legally could to maximize my perious years deductions before the filing. Needless to say, I was in a bit of a bind making payroll that summer!! :-((

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

17671 posts in 3141 days


#14 posted 05-14-2009 09:07 AM

What I’ve learned in 60 years that I advise my kids and anyone who is going into business; you need to know enough about accounting and taxes to know if you are being lied to by an incompetent accountant, you need to know enough about regulations to know if you are being lied to by an incompetent gov’t worker or some hot shot trying to build his career on your back, and you need to know enough about investing and banking to know if you are being lied to by an incompetent or a Wall Street leach. When in the market place , be aware and maintain a vigil because if you are in compliance with every law and regulation that affects your business, you cannot possibly compete with those who don’t know or don’t care. Once you have educated yourself, taken your licking in the school of hard knocks, done business with ony those you can trust (that really narrows your market share) to pay, if you are lucky enough to find a niche you can excell in, you may be better off than just having a “real job.” :-))

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View Catspaw's profile

Catspaw

236 posts in 3281 days


#15 posted 05-14-2009 12:26 PM

My little rant here would be to add that the financial aid for mortgages is supposed to be for some one who gets behind in their payments, maybe some extra expenses from medical, snowball, etc. and can prove their income, re-negotiate with the bank, and get back on track.

Well, the fact is, most people who are facing foreclosure are facing it because they lost their jobs. Now….how can you prove your income if you don’t have a job. Basically the whole thing couldn’t work from the very beginning. As far as I’m concerned it has all been a scam.

Kinda like unemployment insurance….nobody is hiring, so why do I have to waste my time going on several interviews every week to prove I’m looking for a job. WHAT jobs? I’ll get one as soon as something comes along. Until then I can use the time for working on my house or my farming…or even doing volunteer work like Habitat while watching out for paid work. I’m not a parasite, I’ll get work as soon as I can. Just give me some of the thousands of dollars that I’ve already paid in.

I’ve been paying into unemployment for decades….I should get at least some of it back without all the red tape and hassles. I’ve worked for around 40 yrs and have been unemployed for about 6 months of that time (un-voluntarily) and have gotten only about 4 or 5 weeks worth of unemployment.

Just more reasons for me to do everything I can to avoid government. I’m one of those types that dreams about being one of those people who find an infant in the cemetary and apply for a social security number for them and live with a fake identity all their lives. That way when the government comes along, I don’t exist.

-- arborial reconfiguration specialist

showing 1 through 15 of 75 replies

Have your say...

You must be signed in to reply.

DISCLAIMER: Any posts on LJ are posted by individuals acting in their own right and do not necessarily reflect the views of LJ. LJ will not be held liable for the actions of any user.

Latest Projects | Latest Blog Entries | Latest Forum Topics

HomeRefurbers.com