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Did I destroy this plane or can it be saved?

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Forum topic by Troy Cleckler posted 02-23-2015 01:28 AM 1601 views 0 times favorited 23 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Troy Cleckler

384 posts in 836 days


02-23-2015 01:28 AM

This is the #4 that was given to me and I was checking for sole flatness I found it was pretty bad and was taking a lot of effort even with 150 grit paper and water. It had a low streak down the center was slightly high behind the mouth. Worked on it about an hour and still had not come close to flat. Got the bright idea of using the oscillating sander belt to try and flatten it out. Got it down to the center ridge alright but royally messed up the toe. Didn’t bother measuring the washboard, so frustrated at myself for thinking a shortcut was the smart thing that I layed it down and walked away.
What am I looking at to try and salvage this plane, other than the obvious of a truckload of sandpaper and about a solid week of sanding?
Signed, feeling stupid

-- Troy. - Measure twice, cut once and fill the gaps....


23 replies so far

View Mykos's profile

Mykos

102 posts in 1259 days


#1 posted 02-23-2015 01:47 AM

Can you still get a thin full width shaving from it ? If so, it’s not ruined. It will take some work to get it totally flat again if that is your ambition. Loose silicon carbide grit on a lapping plate will work much faster and be safe.

Mistakes are how we learn :)

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waho6o9

7174 posts in 2041 days


#2 posted 02-23-2015 01:57 AM

View Greg In Maryland's profile

Greg In Maryland

550 posts in 2463 days


#3 posted 02-23-2015 01:58 AM

Ouch. Double ouch. Look at it this way, by the time you are done sanding those ridges out your biceps and triceps will be totally ripped.

Alternatively, you could send the plane (and iron) to Tablesaw Tom and he can machine it perfectly flat for $40 or so. His website is http://www.tablesawtom.com/. I have used him to flatten more than one plane and if I had a bit more money, or a smaller tool wish list, I would have him machine all my vintage planes.

Good luck.

Greg

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bondogaposis

4032 posts in 1816 days


#4 posted 02-23-2015 02:12 AM

Why didn’t you just go to a coarser grit? I think now machine shop.

-- Bondo Gaposis

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TheFridge

5765 posts in 951 days


#5 posted 02-23-2015 02:16 AM

As long as you didn’t mess up the mouth and all of the toe, you can still use it.

-- Shooting down the walls of heartache. Bang bang. I am. The warrior.

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crank49

3981 posts in 2436 days


#6 posted 02-23-2015 04:45 AM

I’m sorry to be so blunt, but the Oscillating Spindle Sander is the very last tool I would ever use to try to flatten anything. It is specifically made to sand concave curves; or create them.
Or did you mean belt sander?
In either case, whether you got on the roller of the belt or the drum of the spindle, that’s too bad. If you don’t want to have that machined, you might try 60 or 80 grit. Hell, 40 grit couldn’t do much damage. Then, if you have enough sole metal left when it’s flat run through the grits. Or, maybe just shop for another body. #4s are very common and you could probably pick up another body for $15.

My dad was an old school wood worker, hardwood floor finisher, trim carpenter, cabinet maker, etc. for over 60 years; retired when he was 84. He had a shelf full of Stanley planes in his shop and used them all the time. In all the time I spent working with and around him, I never once saw him flatten the sole of a plane. I think people are way over obsessed with sole flatness.

-- Michael: Hillary has a long list of accomplishments, though most DAs would refer to them as felonies.

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unbob

718 posts in 1368 days


#7 posted 02-23-2015 08:01 AM

I think it depends on what wood is being planed. Something like burls that are hard, soft, and even punky areas, the flatter and more precision the plane the better. Found that using a Lie Nielsen plane. My quest is to get the piece closer to finish scraping, without sucking the soft areas out, as with a plane where the mouth does not lay flat on the wood.
Getting an old Bailey plane to that level of precision is a considerable undertaking. And, if not needed, a waste of time.

View Troy Cleckler 's profile

Troy Cleckler

384 posts in 836 days


#8 posted 02-23-2015 11:39 AM



I m sorry to be so blunt, but the Oscillating Spindle Sander is the very last tool I would ever use to try to flatten anything. It is specifically made to sand concave curves; or create them.
Or did you mean belt sander?
In either case, whether you got on the roller of the belt or the drum of the spindle, that s too bad. If you don t want to have that machined, you might try 60 or 80 grit. Hell, 40 grit couldn t do much damage. Then, if you have enough sole metal left when it s flat run through the grits. Or, maybe just shop for another body. #4s are very common and you could probably pick up another body for $15.

My dad was an old school wood worker, hardwood floor finisher, trim carpenter, cabinet maker, etc. for over 60 years; retired when he was 84. He had a shelf full of Stanley planes in his shop and used them all the time. In all the time I spent working with and around him, I never once saw him flatten the sole of a plane. I think people are way over obsessed with sole flatness.

- crank49


Put it on the Ridgid oscillating belt. It has a flat plate in the center but it’s not even with the roller I found out! I was just looking for an easy way out which now has led to more time and expense.
By the way, crank, what do you ride? Figured with an avaitar like that and name like crank, you do ride a bike.

-- Troy. - Measure twice, cut once and fill the gaps....

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

3942 posts in 1958 days


#9 posted 02-23-2015 12:05 PM

I want to second the tablesawtom suggestion. I have 4 planes he has flatten and the work s impeccable. Include the iron and he flattens the back of it as part of the package.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

View OSU55's profile

OSU55

1058 posts in 1454 days


#10 posted 02-23-2015 03:01 PM

Destroyed, no, but it will never be your best smoothing plane. It appears it could salvaged for about any other use. If it were me, I would not spend $50-$60 (shipping) to have someone machine it flat (I’ve had some surface ground – they still required some lapping work to get contact in the right areas). Completely flattening this one would require removal of significant mass in the sole, from an already light plane. You can pick up another one for ~$25. Chalk this one up to the “lesson learned” category. For this one, get the high areas of the toe even with the mouth and back portions of the sole and it will be useable.

I routinely start with 50 grit on planes needing significant flattening. 120 grit will leave a very useable surface, and going above 220 is a waste of time – the sole will get scratched up anyway. While it is true that plane soles do not need to be perfectly flat (and certainly not 100% of the sole), the flatter they are, in the correct areas, the better they will perform. It is also dependent on planned use – a scrub plane sole just needs to be fairly smooth, forget flat. A smoother should be within 0.001”. Here’s a sole flattening tutorial if interested http://lumberjocks.com/OSU55/blog/39413

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RandyinFlorida

181 posts in 1532 days


#11 posted 02-23-2015 03:15 PM

I made the same mistake. I’m sure others have too.

-- Randy in Crestview Florida, Wood Rocks!

View Sawdustonmyshoulder's profile

Sawdustonmyshoulder

413 posts in 3093 days


#12 posted 02-23-2015 03:48 PM

Well, you could turn it into a scrub plane.

I was at Roy Underhill’s Second Story Store in Pittsboro, NC one day and Ed was planning to turn some #4 planes he had into scrubs.

Here is a link to Stumpy Nubs video on how he did it: http://youtu.be/gFBnTOGc-2w

There is always hope.

-- Makin' Sawdust!!!

View bandit571's profile

bandit571

14594 posts in 2148 days


#13 posted 02-23-2015 04:07 PM

Destroyed? Nah, still in one piece.

Take a Sharpie pen, make a lot of black lines across the sole

Take a 60 grit sanding belt, cut it, lay it out flat on something flat

Gave the ASSEMBLED plane ( with the iron retracted back up into the plane) a few swipes the length of the sole

Check at the toe, both sides of the mouth area, and the heel. Go until all three areas are without any black lines.

Wax the sole, and carry on with making shavings…..

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

View crank49's profile

crank49

3981 posts in 2436 days


#14 posted 02-23-2015 07:53 PM


By the way, crank, what do you ride? Figured with an avaitar like that and name like crank, you do ride a bike.

- Troy Cleckler


My ride is a Giant OCR2 road bike for organized rides, or a Giant Cypress SX for commuting or just knocking around..
The bike in my avatar is actually a bamboo bike. I never rode one but would like to.

If I hadn’t been laid of a couple times since Obummer got christened I was wanting to get a recumbent bike, but can’t afford that dream for now.

-- Michael: Hillary has a long list of accomplishments, though most DAs would refer to them as felonies.

View unbob's profile

unbob

718 posts in 1368 days


#15 posted 02-23-2015 08:40 PM

Some alternative methods of checking and dealing with flatness. This old Wards Master #7 has some problems. Instead of shot gunning the sole by running it over sand paper causing rolled up edges, I am being more selective where the metal is removed by checking the sole using strips of paper. The thin paper is a cigarette rolling paper .0004” thick, up to paper that is .008” thick. Setting the plane on a jointer table and using the combo square.
In the photos there is a Nicholson Magicut file and a narrow block with 60 grit emory.

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