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Forum topic by Holbs posted 01-27-2015 01:54 AM 958 views 2 times favorited 16 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Holbs

1379 posts in 1497 days


01-27-2015 01:54 AM

Coupling 6” ducting to machines is proving…. difficult to research. I really like the Rockler quick connect / disconnect, but it’s only for 4”. All of my machines are on mobile stands so quick connects are the way to go, but I REALLY do not want to downgrade to 4” for the coupling. It really seems there is no love for 6” ducting accessories out there. I do have 2 of the 10’ 6” flex wire hoses (which I plan on cutting into 5’ sections or maybe 3’ sections) coming off 6” x 6” x 6” HVAC wye’s.
Some other LJ members have stuck 6” flex into a 6” PVC coupler, which I’ll have to try. Maybe afix a wooden handle on the coupler like the Rockler 4” version.
I guess my 2 part question is: any downside to “carefully” slicing the 10’ 6” flex wire hose into 2 or 3 parts? And, any other ideas of quick connects for 6” ?

-- Yes, my profile picture is of a Carpenter Bee! The name is derived from the Ancient Greek "wood-cutter"


16 replies so far

View REO's profile

REO

889 posts in 1541 days


#1 posted 01-27-2015 02:19 AM

what are you running for a DC?

View AandCstyle's profile

AandCstyle

2575 posts in 1724 days


#2 posted 01-27-2015 02:22 AM

Holbs, first, you can cut the hose to whatever length you need-less flexible tubing is better from an air flow standpoint because the corrugation causes turbulence which reduces efficiency. Secondly, you could install a 4” x 6” sheet metal adapter (HVAC) on your tools, then use a band clamp (oil filter wrench) to tighten the hose to the adapter. All my tools are permanently connected so I haven’t tried this. FWIW

-- Art

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Jim Finn

2417 posts in 2389 days


#3 posted 01-27-2015 02:34 AM

I have cut my 6” flex into shorter pieces also but my equipment is not mobile and all my duct is steel.

-- "You may have your PHD but I have my GED and my DD 214"

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crank49

3981 posts in 2438 days


#4 posted 01-27-2015 03:47 AM

6” spiral hose will have about the same resistance as 4” smooth pipe so there is no loss to reduce to 4” at the machine if you are connecting to 6” flex anyway.
Half dozen of one and six of the other.

-- Michael: Hillary has a long list of accomplishments, though most DAs would refer to them as felonies.

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pmayer

864 posts in 2532 days


#5 posted 01-27-2015 10:51 AM

I find that the flex hose fits nicely inside the coupler and the coupler works great as a quick disconnect to the tool as shown here.

Here’s a good look at the port itself which is simply a short section of pipe glued into a plywood base. This approach is cheap, simple, and works better than any commercial products that I have used. The couple slips off easily so there is no need to attach a handle.

-- PaulMayer, http://www.vernswoodgoods.com

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RogerM

764 posts in 1866 days


#6 posted 01-27-2015 03:21 PM

I have an Onedia Super Dust Gorilla (2.5 HP) DC unit and run 6”metal lines throughout my shop but all of the final connections are with a 4” duct or flex hose. A final 6” connection to a piece of equipment seems like a lot of overkill to me unless it is a very large piece of equipment (say at least a 24” planer) that produces a lot of shavings.

-- Roger M, Aiken, SC

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pmayer

864 posts in 2532 days


#7 posted 01-27-2015 03:56 PM

If the tool does a great job of gather dust at the source, then I agree with Roger’s assertion. In my shop, this is not the case with any of my stationary tools, so the additional CFM delivered by running 6” all the way to the tool is not overkill. Great examples of this are my unisaw and SCMS, both of which are notoriously challenging for dust collection. The nearly double CFM that I get by running 6” to the final connection makes collection at the Unisaw exceptionally good, and much more bearable at the SCMS. I would also put my downdraft into that category. With over 1100 CFM going all the way inside of that box, the results are dramatically better than with a 4” conversion which chokes it down to about 700-800 CFM in the exact same duct run (I measured this several years ago, but don’t recall the exact number).

One example where I agree that it is probably overkill is with the jointer that is shown in the picture above. I have never tried it with 4”, but because the enclosure so effectively corrals dust right at the cutterhead, I believe that 4” would be just fine.

-- PaulMayer, http://www.vernswoodgoods.com

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Holbs

1379 posts in 1497 days


#8 posted 01-28-2015 12:56 AM

using 4” at machines instead of 6”. Hmmm.. I would guess (no scientific proof) that the most troublesome fine dust makers would be the table saw, miter saw, and sanding station. Of which I currently have 6” feeds into them, so they are taken care of (after completing overhead dust shroud of table saw blade). I have a fliptop jointer/planer which could use just a 4”. I have a delta 10” drill press / grizzly combo sander on fliptop which could survive with 4”.
However, I do like the idea of a 6” x 4” x 4” wye at the machines for overhead and underneath dust collection. Like the band saw (above and below table), same for drill press (well, 2 4” on each side of the drill bits), etc. I remember a Bill Pentz diagram at http://billpentz.com/woodworking/cyclone/ducting.cfm#tool_ducting of best dust collection for machines.

-- Yes, my profile picture is of a Carpenter Bee! The name is derived from the Ancient Greek "wood-cutter"

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pmayer

864 posts in 2532 days


#9 posted 01-28-2015 11:10 AM

Good point Holbs, on the 6×4 x 4 wye. I like this for some tools as well. I have this setup on my router table and it is pretty effective. The top one catches most dust for edge operations such as roundovers, while the lower port comes into play for plunging operations such as mortises. It would be much better if I were to enclose the router, but it still helps quite a bit as is.

-- PaulMayer, http://www.vernswoodgoods.com

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

3950 posts in 1961 days


#10 posted 01-28-2015 12:18 PM

I disagree about the fine dust from the TS. True enough, it may produce a little less per cut versus the other tools (I actually doubt that as well) but it’s used a lot more than most tools in a typical shop. Therefore it generates as much fine dust (I think) as any other tool, except maybe the drum sander. 6” to everything possible is the way to go, at least for me. As for the TS, you also need over blade collection since it throws a fair mount up there as well.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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pmayer

864 posts in 2532 days


#11 posted 01-30-2015 03:32 PM

I’m not sure which point you are disagreeing with, Fred. I think folks are on the same page in general about table saws being a big dust producer. I’m in favor of running 6” to a table saw in general, and in my case it makes a major difference as I have a unisaw with no internal dust management configuration. For saws like this, 4” is simply insufficient IMO, even with a large dust collector. I’m currently pulling over 1300 CFM (actual, not theoretical) at my table saw with a 6” port, and if I reduce it to 4” right at the tool that drops to about 850 CFM. The difference in terms of air quality between running 6” all the way vs. dropping to 4” is dramatic. In addition to noticeably improved air quality, I can tell the difference when I look inside of the saw cabinet. The saw stays much cleaner inside after upgrading to a 6” port on the saw.

The only situation where I wouldn’t recommend modifying the tool port on a table saw is when the table saw itself has a good shroud design that captures dust better right at the blade. Sawstop is a great example of this. They provide 4” internal ducting within the saw, which does a fantastic job corralling dust, so if I were fortunate enough to own a sawstop, I would just reduce 6” to 4” right at the tool port, and in that case 850 CFM that is concentrated right at the blade would outperform 1300 CFM that is pulling from 3 feet away from the blade, hands down.

-- PaulMayer, http://www.vernswoodgoods.com

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

3950 posts in 1961 days


#12 posted 01-30-2015 05:24 PM

Sorry, it was making the final connections 4” that i disagree with. I want all the air flow I can get…I actually just bought a SS and haven’t figured out a way to convert it to 6” (maybe I never will) but I also have 4” running to the overblade pickup. I do consider the TS a big dust producer, but I haven’t used my SS enough yet to decide one way or the other…from what little I’ve done on it so far, it seems to work fairly well. I think several of the newer saws now do this.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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pmayer

864 posts in 2532 days


#13 posted 01-30-2015 06:53 PM

Ah, OK. We’re definitely on the same page in that respect. I think doing an internal conversion of a SS to 6” would be messy and would be a mistake IMO. It doesn’t look like there’s enough room in there to convert to 6”, and if there was, I’m still not convinced it is necessary.

I’d like to get a SS someday, and if I do, I wouldn’t be thinking about converting it to 6” inside the saw. I’d run 6” right up to the back of it, however, and 4” up to the blade guard. It would be interesting to see an air quality test with a heavily used SS with a good dust collection system. I bet it would score pretty well.

-- PaulMayer, http://www.vernswoodgoods.com

View Richard H's profile

Richard H

489 posts in 1148 days


#14 posted 01-30-2015 07:03 PM

The way I have seen Sawstops done before to what seemed like good affect is 6” to the back of the saw into a 6” to 2 4” Y junction than 4” into the saw and the other feed reduced to the blade guard port.

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Fred Hargis

3950 posts in 1961 days


#15 posted 01-30-2015 08:12 PM

My last saw was a Unisaw, I ran 6” to the cabinet and had an overarm hookup of 4”. It stayed absolutely clean. When I changed over that same 6” to the cabinet is now choked down to 4” (about 3’ or so) to accommodate the new saw but the overarm is the same. I’m not using the SS blade guard, it only had a 1 1/2” or so hookup. I put my Excalibur on it (was also on the Unisaw) and it works real well. I have the same DC as RogerM so I don’t think I’m getting 1300 CFM, I would guess maybe 1000…but I don’t have a way to measure it.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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