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Need some input on labor cost for this project.

2K views 30 replies 18 participants last post by  bigblockyeti 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
I have a client at one of the lake communities that wants the picture below done in aromatic cedar. I've priced the wood and other materials at $700, including glue, and hardware.
I'm getting my aromatic cedar at $2.00 a BF and the frame (the parts you don't see) out of WRC. The material cost is inflated about 20% so I'm good on that.

I need to know a good way to price out the labor on this job. Have a look and tell me what your professional opinion is about labor charges. Keep in mind I work from a garage and I have all the major tools to do this job.

What would you charge for labor.
Feel free to ask me things you may need to price it.

I'm really clueless about charging for my work. I do need to make out on it though. I'm figuring it will take about 3 weeks to complete.

Here is what's in the home now.
Wood Flooring Floor Building Wood stain


Tableware Window Drinkware Wood Cup


Table Window Property Wood Interior design


The seats will be flat cedar panels glued up not the contouring you see here. He has a limited depth seeing it's a bungalow with very small rooms.
The table is a pedestal with 40"x40" surface.
The seats need to be lower so he can access the windows which hinge like doors.
Hight on seats is 27.5, depth is 19", Width on seats is 65" on one and 85" on the other.

Thanks for the advise.
 

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#2 · (Edited by Moderator)
That banquet has a lot of ply in it. You want to use all solid wood right?

Ok. Cedar is easy to sand and plane. You do have to be careful about
dents and "shop rash".

I wouldn't quote under $1500 for the labor. Such a price will send
some clients running for the hills and for others it will get a quick
"yes" (which means it's too low). You want a little jaw rubbing.

Sizing up the client is a skill that can help you. There's this odd
book called "the Closers" by Ben Gay III which I recommend you
read.
 
#3 ·
I am thinking you can make all the cuts you need at the shop is about 3-4 hours. Installation another 4 hours. Add 2 more hours to that and multiply it what you think your time is worth, hour and add it to the $700. You always can go 20% higher than that and give it back to him when the job is done. That makes everyone happy.
 
#7 ·
mrjinx007, and BinghamtonEd, I don't work that fast. I'm estimating about three weeks on the build mainly because I also run a handyman service and am often taken away for a day or two. There was no signs of rush from the client, he's one who appreciates real furniture and knows these things take time. Plus at 55 years old, I don't move as fast as I used to. lol
 
#8 ·
I can't work that fast, either, however I just do this as a hobby. I was just surprised that the approach just covered cutting the parts and putting them together in a few hours at the delivery site.
 
#9 ·
Understand Russell.. The design he wants will have a lot to do with it too. Tongue and groove vs., half lap or just butted together. So, estimation of how many hours + material and profit+ a little more to give back if need to. How is that?
 
#10 ·
Estamating can be the toughest part of the job. On a job like this to simplify working up a price I tend to do it in small bites .work up the time and material for the table and then each section of the banquet .I find on furniture work it always takes longer than you think. You can think about your hourly rate in a few ways: would you rather build this than do handy man work? If so if you charge $20 for handy man work is that enough for you on this kind of work? Forget the hourly approach and view it as a learning experience and charge 25% more than a retail store(look on line).
If I'm going off the top of my head I would charge $850 for the table $650 for each section of the banquet.
Delivery & installation $150+(3 times $650) $1850+$850= $2950
So if you work backwords @$2950- $700(material)=$2250 divided 100hours=$22.5 per hour
Like others have said once you give your price your lucky if 20% of your bids are accepted . What I've found helps prospective customers is breaking the cost down as I have above.
Good luck Russ
 
#11 ·
Thanks Jim, that makes sense. I've never been one to charge by the hour, it encourages slow work. I like to bid the job based on how much of the month it will take me to complete and how much money I'll need that month to survive. A large job like this can pay for March along with some side jobs. Just starting out is hard, I end up doing these jobs for little or nothing. I want this one to actually make a decent profit. The guy looks single, around 30 or so and lives in an exclusive lake community, not the kind with million dollar homes, they are just regular homes in a beautiful lake setting. Seeing this community is where I'm marketing the heaviest, I want to be known as someone who is first of all honest, easy to work with, prompt, and likely to be competitive with larger cabinet companies who look at this sort of job as a bother compared to cranking out kitchen cabinets. I can also get the wood at about half the price of a lumber company, as you may have noticed the wood and supplies for all this came up to only $700.00.
 
#19 ·
In paint grade from my shop. $6700 (labor at $35 an hour) You gave an Idea how long it would take you. Take that time estimate, double it, and then think what you want to make per hour. It doesn't mean you charge that, it is a good target. You work slower when you charge by the hour, but you work faster when you are trying to make per hour!!
 
#20 ·
Russell - I think a1Jim's suggestion is a pretty good one to follow, until you get the feel for how long a job will take and how much you can charge.

mrjinx007 - If I'm reading Russell's post correctly, he has a customer that wants him to build a set just like what's in the photo.
 
#21 ·
+1 to what Joey mentioned, I like to specify a cost while estimating my hourly pay and work toward that, I think bidding as a whole on a job is more professional as well.
 
#22 ·
Here are a few thoughts that come to mind.

1) Who is going to design the project? If you are going solely by the picture, then you will no doubt have to spend some time designing the project, even if it is simple drawings.

2) Did you allow time for gathering materials (lumber and hardware).

3) Did you include shipping charges for anything bought online?

4) Labor for delivery.

5) Do you have room to store the components until it is finished or will additional storage be necessary?

6) Help? Do you plan to lug this thing by yourself or hire some help?

7) Profit above and beyond your labor.

8) Contingency money - for oversights, screw ups, etc.

Good luck with your project.
Mike
 
#23 ·
Russell, I think Jim was just trying to show you a way of pricing not providing with an hourly rate, for example I install kitchen cabinets and do custom case work for a living and I do not work by the hour, however I do have several hourly rates for what I do. And yes I said rates not just one but several. For example I just completed a custom built in for a customer three feet wide, nine feet tall and two feet deep with drawers with soft close guides and divided lite glass doors, finished delivered and installed grand total two thousand three hundred dollars. Now this project took about five hours longer to complete than was estimated however, I marked up the price from my estimated costs. I generally mark up my costs by about thirty five to fourth percent, so I still made money just not as much had I hit my mark. Now I usually hit my mark on cost so life is pretty good but life and human error can sneak up any of us when it comes to estimating. There always seems to feel like a fine between soaking a customer and soaking your self. So good luck and I wish well on your project.
 
#24 ·
Prices and profits vary according to a lot of factors,where you live,how skilled you are,how much you pay for material and who your dealing with. I had a job not long ago where the so called customer was an aero space and once work started wanted things done to what those kind of standards required. Should you charge more for that kind of customer
? you bet!(assuming you want to deal with people like that in the first place:) There are factors to deal with on the job site,27 barking dogs nipping at your heals or owners or small children wanting to help. How about having to take 8ft cabinets up a spiral stair case ? The list is unending,many of these things only experience can help you spot,but even then there's always lifes little surprises that always come your way.
 
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