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Forum topic by ownafixerupper posted 12-01-2013 11:49 PM 1040 views 0 times favorited 12 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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ownafixerupper

11 posts in 1019 days


12-01-2013 11:49 PM

Topic tags/keywords: lathe shaft axle center turning question resource

Howdy all—-and thanks in advance for your thoughts and suggestions.

I acquired an old Delta lathe (similar in layout to, but not the same as the 930) for relatively cheap. Based on various manuals I’m seeing online, I’m estimating it’s from around the 1930s. It’s got some rust across just about everything, but it runs.

Now, I have never owned or used a lathe before, but I could see it came with a drive center. The center connects directly onto the axle (or more properly termed shaft?); there are two set screws to drive against a flat in the axle. When I took the center off, it took a fair bit of effort, and I could see the flat on the axle was quite chewed up (seems to have been from various set screws over the years).

I drove the center into a pre-drilled hole in my stock (should have used a mallet, and didn’t, oops). Found the center very difficult to fit back onto the axle; I could only get it half-way back on. I’m hoping driving it into the wood didn’t distort the center—-didn’t think I hit it that hard, but I guess it’s a possibility. At this point, though, I managed to do some turning (which is surprisingly fun—-yay!).

The tailstock has a dead center, with the same setup (set screws against a flat). At some point near the end of my turning, I managed to break the pointy tip of the tailstock center; it was probably just weak from rust.

(note: Here’s where my poor terminology probably takes a turn for the worse, given my inexperience here).

A lot of what I see mentioned around are these centers/spindles/etc with a tapered shank (such as MT2). I would ideally like to have something that would accept such a tapered shank on one end, and the other end I could fit over my axle w/flat. I assume such things exist, but I have no idea what they would be called, or where I would look for them… any suggestions?

Any suggestions in general, if that’s not the best approach to take?

Many thanks.


12 replies so far

View TheDane's profile

TheDane

3794 posts in 2320 days


#1 posted 12-02-2013 12:36 AM

Wow … sounds like you have a real project on your hands.

The ‘axle’ is called a spindle. It might be helpful if you could post some pictures. There are a number of experienced turners who frequent these forums, and I would be surprised if there weren’t someone that could give you some real help.

-- Gerry -- "I don't plan to ever really grow up ... I'm just going to learn how to act in public!"

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ownafixerupper

11 posts in 1019 days


#2 posted 12-02-2013 01:12 AM

Spindle—-got it, thanks.

Here’s a pass at some pictures—-hopefully they will help illustrate the setup a bit better.

Headstock:

Spindle, chewed up flat, and the drive center:

View JustJoe's profile

JustJoe

1554 posts in 696 days


#3 posted 12-02-2013 01:21 AM

Wow! That lathe looks like it went swimming in the deep end of the ugly pool, but it should be salvageable.
What is the measurement on the shaft – 1/2, 5/8? You can clean it up with some steel wool and some pb-blaster or kroil. Use the penetrating oil, don’t try to sand the rust off or you risk deforming/shrinking the shaft and everything will be too loose.

The spur center should have some set screws. Are they missing? If so then take it to your ACE hardware and find a couple to fit. Pick up a small wire bottle-brush while you’re there. You can chuck it in a drill, put a few drops of penetrating oil on it and brush the rust out of the hole. When it’s clean and the shaft is clean it should be a slip-fit and the set screws will hold it in place.

Once you’ve got it cleaned up and figured out what size shaft that is maybe we can help you track down some accessories so you can do more than just the spindles. If it’s 5/8 that would be great because Shopsmith stuff should fit it.

Go to OWWM and look for a manual. Look over the headstock very carefully and see if there are any little holes that say OIL ME PLEASE.

If you replace the belt with a link belt (harbor freight sells them cheap) that will be one less thing to worry about and a little less vibration.

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View TheDane's profile

TheDane

3794 posts in 2320 days


#4 posted 12-02-2013 02:00 AM

I wouldn’t worry about the screw marks on the spindle’s flat. As Joe suggested, get some appropriate set screws, clean it up, and tighten the set screws down.

What is the distance from the center of the drive spur to the bed of the lathe?

-- Gerry -- "I don't plan to ever really grow up ... I'm just going to learn how to act in public!"

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ownafixerupper

11 posts in 1019 days


#5 posted 12-02-2013 02:31 AM

@JustJoe:
Yes, it’s going to take a fairly big effort to get it looking reasonable again. I’m hoping (possibly naively optimistic) that I can get one or two things made as gifts, then take it apart around New Years and really get into some rust treatments. I’ll start with steel wool and the penetrating oil as you suggest (thanks).

I do have the center screws, I had just taken them off at one point this afternoon trying to determine if something on the inside of the drive center was holding assembly up.

The diameter of the shaft is 1/2 inch. I almost feel like some minor amount of sanding might be necessary on the shaft—-you can kind of see in the last image that the non-flat area of the shaft has some grooves cut (which creates some lips in places). Perhaps cleaning up the inside of the center will be sufficient to overcome that, I will have to see.

It does have what I perceive is two oil ports:

Unfortunately, the location of those two ports is actually something that differs from the otherwise seemingly-identical 930 model on OWWM. I’m still perusing up all of the delta lathe manuals there, hopefully I’ll get lucky.

@TheDane
(EDITED)
4.5 inches.

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JustJoe

1554 posts in 696 days


#6 posted 12-02-2013 02:44 AM

Oh that’s going to be hard to find adapters or chucks for. Shopsmith stuff is 5/8”. Nova makes an adapter that will go over a straight 5/8 spindle:
http://www.amazon.com/NOVA-8-Inch-Chuck-Insert-Adapter/dp/B0064JJ6RO

But that won’t work for a 1/2. It will take some searching. You might need to have someone local with a metal-lathe make you a threaded adapter.

-- This Ad Space For Sale! Your Ad Here! Reach a targeted audience! Affordable Rates, easy financing! Contact an ad represenative today at JustJoe's Advertising Consortium.

View Nubsnstubs's profile

Nubsnstubs

173 posts in 387 days


#7 posted 12-02-2013 03:12 AM

Those ””Ports”” are actually spring loaded balls used to hold the spindle lock, which might be missing. Since you removed the spur, why not just remove the four screws holding the bearing in and find out what size it is. That headstock looks awfully close to the Delta Milwaukee Homecraft made in the 50’s, but made of aluminum with a 1” spindle with MT2… Jerry (in Tucson)

-- Jerry (in Tucson)

View Rick M.'s profile

Rick M.

3978 posts in 1037 days


#8 posted 12-02-2013 05:30 AM

It has to be a 930, the only difference I can see are the missing oil ports. The old Delta catalogs jump from the 277 four speed (1932) to the 930 (1933) except the 930 in the catalogs has the typical 1-8 spindle with #2 morse taper. Which tag does yours have, Delta Specialties or Delta Manufacturing?

-- |Statistics show that 100% of people bitten by a snake were close to it.|

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ownafixerupper

11 posts in 1019 days


#9 posted 12-04-2013 01:13 AM

Okay—-I’ve been battling a nasty cold that won’t go away, but I did manage to find a tidbit of time to go take some more peaks.

There is no tag left (though I can see where it was on the lathe bed), but based on Rick’s suggestion, I went through OWWM for Delta Specialties, and while I did not find a manual, I did find the following:
http://vintagemachinery.org/photoindex/detail.aspx?id=2399
Which has the observation:
Unlike other Delta lathes, this lathe does NOT have a screw spindle, but instead has 1/2” diameter round shaft with a flat, where the #138 spur or #143 face plate or the #120 chuck can attach.
That matches exactly the spindle I have.

I did also find another set of pictures:
http://vintagemachinery.org/photoindex/detail.aspx?id=3399
Both sets of pictures show a lack of a oil port on top.

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ownafixerupper

11 posts in 1019 days


#10 posted 12-04-2013 01:23 AM

@Nubsnstubs
Alright, I’ll further the admittance of my ignorance—-I’m not sure how much disassembly you were suggesting/asking. I took off the four screws and the cap, along with a felt pad and a couple thin metal plates. Resulting picture:

The portion of the spindle inside the cap is 5/8” inches in diameter.

View Nubsnstubs's profile

Nubsnstubs

173 posts in 387 days


#11 posted 12-05-2013 02:13 AM

Ok Fixer, it’s hard to tell, but that almost looks like a cone bearing with a 1” ID…. If that’s the case, you might be able to chase down a spindle with a MT2 and 1” 8tpi both inboard (right hand thread) and outboard (left hand thread). Is that rusty grease????? It also looks like some numbers on the bearing. If that’s the case, look up the numbers online and find out the size of the ID.
You indicated you removed a felt pad (oil/grease seal) and a couple thin metal plates (shims). That is the same setup as my old 1950’s Delta Milwaukee homecraft lathe, but my headstock and tailstock are cast in aluminum, and does have oil ports on top of the headstock. .
If you were to remove the screws from the outboard side of the bearing retainer, all you would need is a soft hammer and you could remove the spindle by tapping it out. I dont remember which way it come out, but I’m sure you can figure it out. . If it does have 1” bearing ID’s, then you’d be better off trying to find a 1” spindle. ............... Jerry (in Tucson)

-- Jerry (in Tucson)

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Nubsnstubs

173 posts in 387 days


#12 posted 08-25-2014 02:18 AM

Hey Fixerupper, did you ever get that old lathe running?................... Jerry (in Tucson)

-- Jerry (in Tucson)

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