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Forum topic by buswanker101 posted 11-14-2013 02:28 PM 866 views 0 times favorited 38 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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buswanker101

10 posts in 342 days


11-14-2013 02:28 PM

Topic tags/keywords: question plane

Hey all. New here, so thanks in advance for any help! I recently bought a few old stanleys and started restoring some already. I had picked up a #4, #5 and #7 as well as a block plane. I have somewhat completed the #5 and #7. The issue I am having with both is I cannot get the blade depth set where it is at a uniform depth across the blade width and have it parallel with the mouth. I can only get one or the other but not both. Any suggestions on how to fix this? I put a brand new blade in the #7 so I know that blade is square and I checked the other and it is as well.

On the #5, using a small square to check to see if the sides are square to the sole it appears the sole is slightly high on the side the blade depth is shallow but before I do anything, is there an easy way to make sure that the sides aren’t messed up before going back to sanding away on the sole to attempt to even it out? I have moved the frog every which way as well as the lateral adjustment, etc. The frog face was also flattened. Any help is appreciated!

-- Don't sweat the petty, pet the sweaty


38 replies so far

View CharlieM1958's profile

CharlieM1958

15706 posts in 2905 days


#1 posted 11-14-2013 02:48 PM

I guess I’m not understanding the problem correctly, because what it sounds like you are describing is exactly what the lateral adjustment lever is used for.

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

View Airframer's profile

Airframer

2577 posts in 640 days


#2 posted 11-14-2013 02:52 PM

Unless you plan to use the plane as a shooting plane it really isn’t necessary to make the sides absolutely square to the sole.

I would just get the sole flat to the frog and use it. A jack plane like that doesn’t need to be 100% flat like a smoother or jointer does.

-- Eric - "I'm getting proficient with these hand jobbers. - BigRedKnothead"

View WayneC's profile

WayneC

12292 posts in 2784 days


#3 posted 11-14-2013 02:54 PM

Are you using the lateral adjuster? Small hammer to tap the blade right or left?

-- We must guard our enthusiasm as we would our life - James Krenov

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buswanker101

10 posts in 342 days


#4 posted 11-14-2013 02:54 PM

I have used it but that still isn’t setting the blade parallel to the mouth while keeping a consistent depth along the width of the blade. If I use the lateral adjustment I can set the blade parallel no problem, but then one side of the blade takes a deeper cut. Hopefully that makes more sense. If tried several combinations of where the frog is set, the lateral adjustment, depth, etc and its the same.

Im having the same issue with the jointer is well, which is really my main concern but since both are doing it, its driving me a little crazy!

-- Don't sweat the petty, pet the sweaty

View JustJoe's profile

JustJoe

1554 posts in 725 days


#5 posted 11-14-2013 02:55 PM

Trying to understand exactly what the complaint/problem is here.

In that picture – Is the cutter sticking out the same depth all the way across or is one side higher than the other? If one is higher, then which is it (top or bottom in the picture).

And the cutter itself – is the bevel ground square to the sides of the cutter?

And like Eric said – forget the whole sides square to the sole thing, this isn’t a shooting plane.

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buswanker101

10 posts in 342 days


#6 posted 11-14-2013 02:59 PM

If the picture, the bottom corner is out further than the top, so then using lateral adjustment, or even tapping with small hammer only makes it worse when trying to set parallel to mouth..

Square sides are forgotten.

-- Don't sweat the petty, pet the sweaty

View WayneC's profile

WayneC

12292 posts in 2784 days


#7 posted 11-14-2013 03:04 PM

One thing about the discussion is interesting to me. I have never been concerned with looking at the blade this way. I bring the blade out until it is taking a slight cut, then adjust lateral adjuster and depth until I get a full shaving. Have you tried using the plane and seeing how it cuts?

-- We must guard our enthusiasm as we would our life - James Krenov

View chrisstef's profile

chrisstef

11113 posts in 1693 days


#8 posted 11-14-2013 03:06 PM

I think that your frog is seated slightly crooked. I think I had the same problem with a #4 of roughly the same vintage. Seemed that no matter which way I adjusted it with the lateral it was coming out funky.

-- "there aren’t many hand tools as awe-inspiring as the #8 jointer. I mean, it just reeks of cast iron heft and hubris" - Smitty

View jonah's profile

jonah

453 posts in 1985 days


#9 posted 11-14-2013 03:06 PM

Are the blades square? If the sole is square, the mouth is square, and the blade is square, you should be able to adjust it so it’s cutting straight.

The lateral adjust lever is often too coarse an adjustment device. Try gently tapping the side of the blade at the top to get it in the center of the mouth and square.

View JayT's profile

JayT

2392 posts in 898 days


#10 posted 11-14-2013 03:16 PM

Sounds like the frog probably isn’t square to the mouth for some reason.

I have run into this on a couple planes, where you adjust the frog to square, but as soon as you tighten it down, it shifts slightly. On one plane, it was the result of the frog adjustment screw, plate and surfaces at the rear not being square to the face of the frog. That is a PITA to fix.

The other was the frog/bed mating surfaces not matching correctly, causing the frog to rock slightly as it was tightened down. That was a fairly easy fix with some lapping compound.

Now, onward. Who cares? On a jointer and especially a jack, as long as the mouth can open enough for the shavings to come out cleanly, parallelism isn’t necessary, IMHO. Open the mouth a bit, use the lateral adjustment to make sure you are taking off the same amount across the full width and make shavings.

On a smoother, where you are trying to get a tight mouth to help prevent tearout, then it can become a concern. That is the only reason the two examples above were even messed with.

Edit: Stef and Wayne got there ahead of me. Darn interruptions!

-- "The American Republic will endure until the day Congress discovers that it can bribe the public with the public's money." Alexis de Tocqueville, 1835

View JustJoe's profile

JustJoe

1554 posts in 725 days


#11 posted 11-14-2013 03:16 PM

OK. Assuming you’ve ground the cutter so the bevel is square to the sides of the cutter, and assuming you didn’t mess up the frog when you “flattened the top”, it looks like the frog is out of adjustment. (if any of those two assumptions are wrong, then of course we’re all just chasing unicorn farts here.)

Can we get a shot from the top with the plane sitting on a flat surface, the lever cap and cutter removed? That way we can see where and how the frog is currently sitting.

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buswanker101

10 posts in 342 days


#12 posted 11-14-2013 03:17 PM

WayneC, Ive tried several cuts and its definitely not cutting even. Ill recheck the frog and everything else to make sure its sitting flat.

Jonah, the mouth is square as is the blade.

Could it be possible that the top of the plane body where the frog sits is flat but the bottom soles isnt parallel to the top? Or vice versa. I put my sweet photoshop skills to work to help illustrate this..

-- Don't sweat the petty, pet the sweaty

View JustJoe's profile

JustJoe

1554 posts in 725 days


#13 posted 11-14-2013 03:21 PM

That would be highly doubtful unless you clamped it in a surface grinder at an angle and spent an hour blissfully grinding away. It would also show up fairly easily just looking at the inside edge of the mouth. A much more plausible explanation is the frog is not right.

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View WayneC's profile

WayneC

12292 posts in 2784 days


#14 posted 11-14-2013 03:23 PM

The picture you have drawn indicates that you should file the mouth. The front of the mouth should be straight across. Have you looked at the mouth with a square in relationship to the sides?

-- We must guard our enthusiasm as we would our life - James Krenov

View Don W's profile

Don W

15228 posts in 1254 days


#15 posted 11-14-2013 03:24 PM

Take the iron out, and take a picture straight down showing the inside of the mouth and the front of the frog.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

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