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Glue-up question

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Forum topic by phlyers posted 09-02-2013 11:29 AM 1117 views 0 times favorited 13 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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phlyers

93 posts in 441 days


09-02-2013 11:29 AM

Not sure what’s going on here…I have (what I believe to be) some very old rough mahogany that was apprently used as wall studs in a very old building that I jointed and planed down for a glue-up. I have a good tight joint and put some titebond 2 on each edge and spread it on evenly. Put the clamps on and left it alone for about 30 mins so I could scrape the squeeze out but the glue was still pretty wet. I let it go overnight and when I took it out of the clamps and scraped it I tried to split the joint. It came right apart using only minimal pressure. What did I do wrong? Trying to think of every possible reason here. My shop isn’t too humid but it DOES has some dampness, the wood has a pretty strong vinegar smell. Was the joint not prepared right? Clamps were good and tight. I know I had enough glue and even slid them back and forth before clamping. Thoughts?


13 replies so far

View Richarde's profile

Richarde

2 posts in 381 days


#1 posted 09-02-2013 11:43 AM

Anytime glue smelled like vinegar, it was old or had frozen over the winter.

-- Nc rich

View phlyers's profile

phlyers

93 posts in 441 days


#2 posted 09-02-2013 11:44 AM

The material itself smells like vinegar not the glue. I just bought the glue yesterday.

View Tennessee's profile

Tennessee

1447 posts in 1168 days


#3 posted 09-02-2013 12:51 PM

There is really only a few things: Either the glue did not penetrate the fibers of the wood due to some kind of preventative, (the vinegar smell?), or the glue was bad out of the bottle and did not set correctly.
Finally, some old wood is so porous that it will be able to completely absorb the glue and not allow a functional welded joint to form. Essentially, it all gets sucked into the fibers of the wood.

One of these three almost has to be it. If the glue is present on the joint, it either did not penetrate or would not. If the glue looks to be about gone, the wood absorbed it all and no weld could form. It is all in the wood fibers below the surface.

-- Paul, Tennessee, http://www.tsunamiguitars.com

View Nicky's profile

Nicky

636 posts in 2746 days


#4 posted 09-02-2013 05:20 PM

I always associate the vinegar smell with fresh cut oak. A pic of the wood would be nice, and may be helpful.

1+ on Tennessee’s response.

Other thoughts, if you have a couple of scraps, try cleaning first with acetone, glue for 30 mins (clamped) and try separating the joint.

-- Nicky

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phlyers

93 posts in 441 days


#5 posted 09-02-2013 05:27 PM

Yeah it’s Oak not Mahogany. Anyway I forgot to mention that when I was able to separate the glue joint the glue was still wet. It sat all night and just looked and its all dried up now. Kind of a mystery here. I will try it on some scrap and see what it does.

As far as pictures I can’t get a good shot on it but will try again later

View Dallas's profile

Dallas

2906 posts in 1141 days


#6 posted 09-02-2013 05:33 PM

Easy fix….. rough up the edges. Jointing the edges of that old oak made it too slick and the glue will not get into the pores or dry.
You want your glue edges square, but you ant to give the glue something to work with, after all, you ain’t trying to melt pieces of plastic together with model glue.

-- Improvise.... Adapt...... Overcome!

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phlyers

93 posts in 441 days


#7 posted 09-02-2013 09:36 PM

I tried roughing up the edges on some scrap. Glued up, waited 30 mins (I know it’s not fully set) and it came right apart with very little effort. I looked at the edge and it sucked up all the glue. How do I overcome this?

View BJODay's profile

BJODay

383 posts in 597 days


#8 posted 09-03-2013 02:33 AM

Wipe on a layer of glue, let it dry. Then try the glue up with a new layer of glue.

BJ

View 404 - Not Found's profile

404 - Not Found

2544 posts in 1623 days


#9 posted 09-03-2013 10:52 AM

Have you tried a polyurethane glue, such as Gorilla Glue?

View phlyers's profile

phlyers

93 posts in 441 days


#10 posted 09-03-2013 11:31 AM

I took BJ’s advice. That seemed to do the trick. Is it because oak has porous grain?

View 404 - Not Found's profile

404 - Not Found

2544 posts in 1623 days


#11 posted 09-03-2013 11:58 AM

If it’s red oak it has very big open pores, it’s not the nicest smelling wood either.

View a1Jim's profile

a1Jim

112087 posts in 2231 days


#12 posted 09-03-2013 12:19 PM

BJ’s trick is called “sizing” it works well on end grain too.

-- http://artisticwoodstudio.com Custom furniture

View Richarde's profile

Richarde

2 posts in 381 days


#13 posted 06-01-2014 10:34 PM

I built a drum sander using my lathe. I used 2 inch PVC for the drum. I also found that it was better able to sand by doing it at the top of the drum and I made supports using 5/8 bolts mounted through plywood front and rear . The front banjo is the one that came with this lathe and the other banjo is from another lathe.
Just to clear up some questions I m certain you might have: I got into router work a few days ago and I purchased 2 different small benchtop belt sanders . Both continually stalled out sanding 4 ” soft pine with minimum pressure and I have 2 of 4 lathes that arrived with cracked rails and the manufacturer sent me new ones and told me to keep the cracked ones. I am using one as my regular lathe,one as the power unit for my buffer and drum sander, and gave 2 to new club members.

-- Nc rich

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