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Craftsman Table Saw...Anyone know the model, approx year, any good?

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Forum topic by bbc557ci posted 325 days ago 935 views 0 times favorited 15 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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bbc557ci

515 posts in 572 days


325 days ago

http://rochester.craigslist.org/tls/3815631865.html

On CR not far from me (well, about 75 miles) and I’m looking for a decent TS that’s affordable. Note: if I were to buy new I’d have to/like to stay in the +,- $750 $800 range.

Opinions/thoughts welcome :o)

-- Bill, central NY...no where near the "big apple"


15 replies so far

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

5139 posts in 1873 days


#1 posted 325 days ago

I saw that the other day and thought it looked like a solid buy for $270. There’s no blade mentioned, so $225-$250 would be even better. It’s got a solid cast iron router table wing, a decent mobile base, miter gauge, and the upgraded Ridgid style fence. I’d guess that it’s a TTI/Ryobi model made between 1997 and 2004. Getting an exact model number would confirm….315.###### would indicate that it’s made by TTI/Ryobi in that time frame, which would make it pretty darn similar to the Ridgid 3650, also made by TTI/Ryobi.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View Tedstor's profile

Tedstor

1369 posts in 1131 days


#2 posted 325 days ago

A new $800 saw would be a fair bit nicer than that Craftsman. Or you could score a used cabinet saw for that money.
Not to say that the Craftsman is bad. It actually looks pretty nice. Not sure of the model number, but it looks like a post-emerson, 113 series. Perhaps built by Ryobi. The fence is decent and the router wing is a nice feature. And for $270, you’d have A LOT left over for good blades.
If you’re a casual hobbyist, that saw might be all you need.

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bbc557ci

515 posts in 572 days


#3 posted 325 days ago

Gents – I shot the seller an email a while ago asking for a model no. and also asked the age.

Here’s another one, much closer to me. More than I’m really looking to spend, and the fence doesn’t look all that “beefy”, also a bit concerned about the age. But a cabinet saw would be the titz!! Actually I would be willing to put out that kind of $$ for a really good TS. I’m an old phart and getting ready to retire in a few years, and would like a good TS just not sure what to get. I have allot of rough cut ash to rip & plane (about 400 BF) for trim here at my house plus been thinking of re-facing my kitchen cabinets. I also like furniture building, so a quality TS would be a real plus!!

btw…thanks for the replies and input I appreciate it.

http://syracuse.craigslist.org/tls/3817956059.html

-- Bill, central NY...no where near the "big apple"

View toolie's profile

toolie

1683 posts in 1126 days


#4 posted 325 days ago

that’s a nice saw. looks like it’s probably a ryobi built 315 series, as opposed to a 113 series, c-man. the two saws are slost identical, with the primarty differences being the mounting of the splitter/blade guard and the fence systems. the 113 series saws had a single thumb screw bolt mounting system that provides for splitter mounting/dismounting that does not disturb the alignment of the splitter. the 315 series saws have a splitter mounting system that i believe necessitates realigning the splitter whenever it is removed.

the fence system of the linked saw is better than the older 113 series saws, whose fence systems received poor reviews. the linked saw has a version of the align-a-rip fence system, albeit with a split front rail. i have a similar system on a ridgid 2412, with a one piece front rail, that performs as well as the delta t2 i have in a 70s vintage 113 series c-man. whilie the split front rail is potential area of concern, if it mounts to the saw like the fence system on my ridgid does, it can be slid to the right for greater rip capacity at the expense of using the front rail tape measure.

IMHO, it’s worth ~ $250, +/- $25. the mobile base and ci extension wing are good add ons. it looks fairly complete except for the spliter/blade guard (which is approx $50 – 100). a riving knife is not retrofittable to that saw. for a hobbyist, it’s a good saw. it can be a starter or, as in my case, probably all the saw that’ll be needed. i have two similar saws (113 emerson built saws, one a c-man and the other a ridgid) so i’m slighly biased. fine cabinietry is certainly possible with that saw, as i’ve worked with 8/4 hardwoods with both my saws, without incident or undue effort (always using a task specific sharp blade). i like mine so much that i kept them over a ‘73 vintage unisaw that i refurbished.

p.s., that powermatic is a nice little saw with a fence sysytem that many users dislike, favoring t square systems instead. IMHE, my unisaw had a similar system that performed quite well. but $1175 is a bit much for that saw. $650-750 would be closer to it’s actual value, if everything checks out. and where’s the splitter/blade guard? a BORK can be fitted to that saw for ~$150:

http://www.theborkstore.com/product.sc?productId=31&categoryId=4

and regarding this statement:

I also like furniture building, so a quality TS would be a real plus!!

i’d disageree that a cabinet saw is necessary to do fine furniture building. the contractor saw in your original link, tuned properly and equipped with a good blade, is more than capable of doing almost anything a hobbyist would want to do.

-- there's a solution to every problem.......you just have to be willing to find it.

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Tedstor

1369 posts in 1131 days


#5 posted 325 days ago

That P-Matic is a nice saw. It will likely last 100yrs. I personally wouldn’t pay the asking price though. If $800 is all you want to spend, tell the seller just that. If he gets no other offers, he might just bite.

View bbc557ci's profile

bbc557ci

515 posts in 572 days


#6 posted 325 days ago

Great info Toolie, thanks!! The Craftsman seems to be priced right, and does have some good extras. Still waiting for the guy to get back to me with the model no. & age. While waiting, I’ve been looking some more. Jeeesh… like a sickness!!

http://fingerlakes.craigslist.org/tls/3737954379.html Rigid

http://rochester.craigslist.org/tls/3787790696.html Jet

http://rochester.craigslist.org/tls/3788409671.html Jet cabinet saw

-- Bill, central NY...no where near the "big apple"

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bbc557ci

515 posts in 572 days


#7 posted 325 days ago

That P-Matic is a nice saw. It will likely last 100yrs. I personally wouldn’t pay the asking price though. If $800 is all you want to spend, tell the seller just that. If he gets no other offers, he might just bite

New motor is good. New bearings is/are good too. But I’d be a tad nervous if the re-bearing job was done right. And the fence….just looks kind of light weight, to me, or am I wrong on that? And, if he would come down to $800’ish, would it be wise to spend that kind of $$ on a TS of that age…1979?

-- Bill, central NY...no where near the "big apple"

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

5139 posts in 1873 days


#8 posted 325 days ago

The PM66 is a tank of a saw, but that fence isn’t their best offering, so I’d be offering in the $900-$950 range….if you’ve got 220v, and the cash, it’s all the saw you’ll ever need.

The Ridgid in the Finger Lakes is pretty similar to the Cman you linked, but it lacks the cast iron router table, and is more money.

The Jet Proshop is a nice hybrid with a good light duty Beise style steel t-square fence. $750 is a tad steep for a used hybrid with steel wings and no riving knive, but $600-$650 would be reasonable IMO.

The Jet cabinet saw is also a nice saw, but $1000 for a 22-25 year old Taiwanese made saw is too much. You can buy a new Grizzly G1023RL with a riving knife, and warranty shipped for $1349 (or pick it up for $1250).

Here’s a used Grizzly G1023 with an older style fence for $600. Decent full blown industrial cabinet saw (I’d offer $500 with that fence). You could sell the stock fence for $50-$75, and upgrade it later.

Here’s a gem of a used Ridgid 3650 contractor saw for $300. Two solid cast wings, Herculift, decent fence, it predates a riving knife, and I don’t see the splitter, which makes for a decent bartering point.

Keep in mind that the industrial cabinet saws are much more substantial than a hybrid or contractor saw, but with a good blade and good alignment, they’re very capable hobby saws. You’re fortunate to have some decent options available in the used market.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View joein10asee's profile

joein10asee

2756 posts in 505 days


#9 posted 325 days ago

”While waiting, I’ve been looking some more. Jeeesh… like a sickness!!”

Yep. It’s a curse, aint it? :-)

-- Perform A Random Act Of Kindness Today ... Pay It Forward

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bbc557ci

515 posts in 572 days


#10 posted 325 days ago

Here’s a used Grizzly G1023 with an older style fence for $600. Decent full blown industrial cabinet saw.

The Grizzly…I saw that in my searches but shy’d away from it because I’m not sure of Griz quality? Also, because it’s older I was wondering about parts if something were to crap out on it.

Here’s a gem of a used Ridgid 3650 contractor saw for $300. Two solid cast wings, Herculift, decent fence, it predates a riving knife, and I don’t see the splitter, which makes for a decent bartering point.

The Ridgid…Looks allot like the Cman in my original link, but hard to tell as the pic is far off. Thought I read here, or somewhere, that there was or is a problem with Ridgid (and some Cman) TS’s going out of alignment when the blade is raised/lowered. Would that be a problem with this particular model?

I do have 220 available, and the Griz would be very tempting!! I never used or worked on a cabinet saw. Making adjustments or allignments any problem with them?

btw…Thank you for the links, and the schooling!!

-- Bill, central NY...no where near the "big apple"

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knotscott

5139 posts in 1873 days


#11 posted 325 days ago

The current Cman 21833 and nearly identical Ridgid R4512 are the models with the alignment issue when you raise and lower the blade, not the older 315.###### or the TS3650. You’re correct that the 315.###### and the 3650 are similar….these two models had some miscut arbors that make poor dado cuts, but it’s easily correctable, and only effected some.

Like most brands, Grizzly quality varies by model, but is pretty similar to most of the Asian imports overall….Jet, GI, Steel City, Rikon, etc. They a direct importer, so don’t have a dealer network, and aren’t well thought of by dealers of other brands (go figure). The G1023 has been a solid performer for as long as I’ve known about it….it’s design is based on the older Unisaws. There are thousands of them in service in one form or another (1023, 1023S, 1023SL, 1023SLW, 1023SLX, 1023Z, etc)....many on this forum own a 1023. In this case, it’s also a lot more saw than the Cman or Ridgid too (this blog explains alot more). A call to Grizzly’s tech support could answer the question about parts. FWIW, I’ve got a 12 year old Griz G1029 DC, 12 year old 6” G1182 jointer, and a 5 year old Shop Fox W1677 that’s essentially a white Griz G1023SL….all have been terrific.

Here’s a look at the guts of the G1023:

Here’s an older Unisaw:

Here’s a look under the hood of the TS3650:

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View toolie's profile

toolie

1683 posts in 1126 days


#12 posted 325 days ago

Of all the linked saws, the 3650 is the one I’d focus on. $250 would be a good deal, assuming the seller does not have the splitter/blade guard. If it’s complete (splitter/blade guard, miter gauge, herc-u-lift, and fence system), its a great tool and worth the$300 asking price. Very similar to the linked 2412, which was WAY overpriced (pains me to say that as I own a 2412). Cabinet saws are nice, but that grizzly is a right tilt saw. Not an issue most times, but it bevels towards the rip fence which can present certain challenges when bevel ripping narrow workpieces. There are perfectly legitimate workarounds for that, but I’ve opted to go left tilt and avoid those workarounds altogether. Just something to consider as the selection criteria evolve.

-- there's a solution to every problem.......you just have to be willing to find it.

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bbc557ci

515 posts in 572 days


#13 posted 324 days ago

I agree toolie the 3650 seems to be a good deal. And I like the convenience of 110 vs 220 in case I want to move the saw around. But, what ever TS I get, I want it to be the last one I buy, so I like the idea of a cabinet saw because I’d never wear it out LOL. In the end though, I guess most any decent quality TS properly set up and maintained will out last me!!

-- Bill, central NY...no where near the "big apple"

View toolie's profile

toolie

1683 posts in 1126 days


#14 posted 324 days ago

I fully expect the two 113 series Emerson built saws I have to outlast me. That 3650 also offers 36” of rip capacity and the guide rails can be slid to the right for additional capacity, but at the expense of the usefulness of the front rail tape. I measure all my cuts, so that wouldn’t be an issue for me, but that’s a personal preference.

-- there's a solution to every problem.......you just have to be willing to find it.

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bbc557ci

515 posts in 572 days


#15 posted 324 days ago

knotscott – HUGE difference in guts between the cabinet saws and 3650 types. The pics you posted make it very clear why cabinet type saws are much more heavy duty than the contractor types. And your blog is really informative. Anyone who’s looking for a TS and hasn’t read it should. Allot of food for thought here!!

-- Bill, central NY...no where near the "big apple"

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