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Freud or Forrest

4K views 28 replies 22 participants last post by  moke 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
I am getting to the end of the life of my affordable quality 10" table saw blades and would like to get a ripping and cross cutting blade that will last a long time.

In a weekend hobbiest shop that makes home furniture for myself and the neighbourhood is the Forrest worth the 3x the price than the similar spec Freud? I take my blades to a shop to get sharpened but would like to start doing it myself, I imagine the Forrest would have more carbide and can survive more sharpening but I have no idea.

Do you think it's worth it for me?

Thanks!
 
#2 ·
Both are decent blades, however the Forrest can be sharpened 20 times and they provide a mail in service and packaging for it to be done. If it were down to a choice between the 2 brands, I would pick the Forrest.
 
#5 ·
Forrest makes a better blade than Freud, IMHO. Has nothing to do with how much carbide is in the teeth and everything to do with flatness of the blades, tooth geometry and vibration control.

A bench top saw with a quality blade, will make better cuts than a cabinet saw running a bargain spinner.
 
#6 ·
It would help to know which blades you are comparing, I don't know of any "comparable" between the 2 where Forrest is 3X the price. That said, if you're after a combo blade I have the Freud and Forrest 40 tooth com parables (Freud 410 and Forrest WW2), and can't see any difference in the cut or how long the blade stays sharp. If you're referring to dedicated crosscut and rip blades, I have no experience with the ones from Forrest. Mine are all Freud, and I find them to be excellent.
 
#7 ·
Both are good blades. I am in the Freud camp and I do have a Forrest. The Freud is less costly. I don't buy the flatness argument. Forrest are "hand" flattened and the Freud is done by machine. I have never noticed any difference. Regarding sharpening, it is a little pricy to sharpen a Forrest, so Freud will still be a better value in the long run. IMOP

Bill
 
#10 ·
You can buy four Oshlum blades from Carbide Processors (rip, crosscut, or general purpose) for the price of one Forrest. I believe that Oshlum is the best kept secret in woodworking. I have both and Forrest is better than an Oshlum, but not better than four of them. Or even two of then for that matter.
 
#12 ·
I had never heard of Ridge Carbide Tool's but they have pretty good sharpening costs.

I am currently using a DeWalt 24 & 60 tooth set and its fine for building shop storage and household bookshelves.

I bought the Freud 8" stacking dado set and was FLOORED by the quality and silent cuts so now I am wanting to get quality all around. How long does a typical blade last in a constant use environment? If the Forrest has twice the lifetime of the Freud then it makes since to buy the Forrest.
 
#13 · (Edited by Moderator)
I chose the Freud LM72M010 Industrial Heavy Duty Rip Saw Blade 10-Inch by 24t Flat Top 5/8-Inch arbor Ice Coated for my ripping of 8/4 and 12/4 hardwood. I love it, and it even does a decent job with crosscutting. I liked it so much that I bought a second one even though the first is going strong. At $50, IMO, it is a steal at half the price of the Forrest. Plus the Freud anti-vibration and flat cut design has me impressed. Just my 2-cents…

I have not had to use a sharpening service as of yet, so can't comment on that aspect though.
 
#14 ·
This is very interesting, I have been kicking around the same two blades in my head too. I have all industrial Freud blades now, and have never had a combo blade….I noted on here several people praising the Forrest blades. I too, like uMinded am just a week end…week night woodworker…what difference other than sharpening would we be able to tell on our work?
Mike
 
#16 ·
Forrest blades make very nice crosscuts in all woods. That
means less sanding of hard end grain and virtually no blade
marks to plane or sand off. Part of the reason is Forrest
is very good about tensioning their blades to run flat.

With zero clearance inserts blow-out on the bottom of
crosscuts isn't much of a problem, but Forrest blades
when sharp do a very clean bottom even without a
zero clearance insert.

Freud makes some very good blades. They aren't quite
in the same class as Forrest though.

If you check on Ebay, Onsrud sells off excellent quality
new old stock saw blades at very cheap prices from time to time.
 
#17 ·
Also, part of how Forrest tends to make the blades is
they use very hard carbide. This means it stays sharp
for a long time and can take some sharp grinding too -
so they use some tooth geometry in the blades that
you don't find on offerings from some other brands
that use softer, less brittle carbide.

Hard carbide is more brittle. You have to be careful
with Forrest blades. Some other blades are made
with tougher, softer carbide and the tips ground
for durability more than for perfect cuts - which is
a good thing if you're working on jobsites or cutting
lumber that may have grit embedded in the faces.
 
#18 · (Edited by Moderator)
There are many good blades out there that have been mentioned. Make sure you have a good, properly aligned and tuned saw to use that blade. If the saw is not good, (arbor runout, bad bearings) a $120 blade won't cut any better than a $19.95 blade. I've used Forrest blades in the past, liked them, but find Freud blades work just fine for me. A 40 tooth Forrest blade will rip as well as a dedicated rip blade. It's in the crosscutting ability where the combination vs dedicated xcut blade makes a difference. Ripping takes place parallel to the grain, so tear-out is not an issue.
 
#19 · (Edited by Moderator)
The Forrest is an excellent all purpose blade and will give years of service. I have one as my go-to blade. You can send it to Forrest for sharpening but sharpening isn't magic and local sharpeners can also sharpen them equally well IMHO.

However, when it comes to ripping long or thick wood a Freud rip blade will outperform the Forrest. I have Freud Industrial rip blade that I use whenever I need to rip 8/4 woods, especially woods like hard maple.
 
#20 · (Edited by Moderator)
Freud and Forrest both make some excellent blades. Forrest makes only top shelf models, while Freud dabbles in multiple markets. ....IMO Freud's best (Fusion) is on par with Forrest's best WWII in an apples to apples comparison. There are a handful of top shelf blades in the 40T general purpose class that all have some advantages and disadvantages over the others….Forrest WWII, Freud Fusion, Infinity Super General, Ridge Carbide TS2000, and Tenryu Gold Medal are the best of those readily available to us that I've tried. None is best in all aspects of blade performance. The best blade for you depends largely on your objectives and your saw.

If you want the cleanest possible cut from one 40T blade, the Infinity Super General and Freud P410 Fusion (both made in Italy) have a distinct advantage over the 40T WWII and others in fine crosscuts, ply/sheetgood cuts, and polished rip cuts due to their Hi-ATB grind and dual side grind….the downside of that particular performance advantage is slightly shorter edge life between sharpenings, but a hobbyist should still get lots of miles out of them before needing to be sharpened. The Forrest is a bit more efficient at thicker ripping, but has slightly more tearout on crosscuts and ply, and slightly more visible blade marks on rips….its more traditional ATB grind will have somewhat better edge life if all else is equal (Forrest doesn't have exclusive rights to the hardest carbide…all the blades in this class use the very best carbide available). (FWIW, Forrest now offers a 48T WWII that will compete better head to head with the Super General and the Fusion. They also offer a fairly unique 30T that gives an excellent edge and efficient ripping, plus does a fairly decent job in many non-critical crosscut situations). The Tenryu Gold Medal is a similar design to the 40T WWII made to similar tolerances, but is made in Japan (several of their other lines are made in China) ....it used to feature an odd mid-kerf width of ~ 0.111", but AFAIK is now available something closer to standard 3/32" thin kerf and 1/8" full kerf. The Ridge Carbide TS2000 adds a flat tooth raker in the mix for less pronounced "bat ears", and claims to have 35% more carbide than Forrest….a claim I'd say is true, so if you want very good edge life, very good all around cutting performance, and the most resharpenings from your blade possible, the TS2000 is the one….Ridge Carbide was supposedly founded by former Forrest employees. The actual edge life you get from any blade will be heavily influenced by a bunch of variables that are outside of the manufacturer's control.

If you want the absolute cleanest crosscuts and ply cuts, you'll need to increase the number of teeth, while maintaining the quality and precision manufacturing….as in a 60T to 80T task specific crosscut blade from one of these elite manufacturers like the Forrest Duraline, Freud LU80, Infinity Ultrasmooth, Ridge Carbide TS1000, etc. If you want the absolute most efficient rip cuts, you'll need to decrease tooth count and go with an 18T to 24T FTG dedicated rip blade, but you'll give up some degree of polish on the edge, and you'll give up the versatility of a general purpose blade. If you want the absolute best edge life possible, you'll need to switch to a triple chip grind, while maintaining the carbide quality, but you'll give up some cutting performance in the process. If you want the best bang for the buck in a 40T full kerf blade, the Delta/DeWalt 7657 at $18 plus s/h is tough to beat.

My take on saw blades in more detail
 
#21 ·
You could probably buy a Freud Diablo 1024 thin kerf ripping blade for less than the price of re-sharpening a Forrest.
I like that they are 1. Easy to find at Home Depot, 2. Cheaper that lesser blades, and 3. THEY WORK GREAT ripping hardwoods up to 8/4 on most saws.

I don't want to start a riot, just throwing that in the ring.
 
#22 · (Edited by Moderator)
I have dewalt and elu and freud and some cheapies they all cut well I like the elu and dewalt sixteen inch blades which my saw take for twelve inch blades which I usually use I use freud or cheapies they dont get sharpened it's not worth while I just chuck them or make riving knifes from them etc. There is a company selling forrest blades with import duties and delivery they cost about not far under $200 each I won't pay that for a blade Alistair
 
#23 ·
I finally wore out my Forrest Woodworker II (actually, it;s not worn out, but it's reached the tipping point from a value perspective). I ended up giving the higher-end Freud Fusion blade a try. It's a fine blade. Cuts are smooth and blade is very sharp. Time will tell if it stands up as well as the WWII. It was about $30 less than the WWII.

One note about Forrest sharpening: They do a very nice job. But my last sharpening cost me about $45 with shipping and the replacement of three teeth. Personally, I would say that, in the end, the cost will be equal for both blades if you compare two Freuds versus one WWII with a Forrest sharpening.

One recommendation I do have is to get a dedicated rip blade. I had a tendency to leave my WWII in the saw no matter what and I think that helped to accelerate the wear. Now I use a Freud rip blade for all my non-finish ripping.
 
#24 ·
Thanks for the awesome writeup knotscott.

I currently use a DeWalt construction 2 pack (60 and 32 tooth) but the 32 tooth when ripping anything over an inch does not preform so well.

I am thinking I will not bother with the Forrest until I get a new cabinet saw. As thats 2-3 years away I think I will be taking some closer looks at Freud and the TS2000. Given the less than stellar performance of the 32 tooth DeWalt I'm not to big on a combination blade unless the TS2000 40t is better for my uses.

What do I cut?
Melamine, Birch veneered plywood, baltic birch, MDF, 4/4 oak, maple, mahogany.

Why ask this question?
I would like to get into exotic wood jewelry boxes as my wife has begun making jewelry and my nieces are soon teenagers. I did a test project with maple and the cut quality was not good enough without a lot of sanding, planing and adjusting.

So far my choices are:
T24442 Freud 10" 80T Double-Sided Laminate/Melamine Blade (Specifically for cabinets)
T24410 Freud 10" x 5/8" 30t TCG .118 Glue Line Saw Blade or
T24409 Freud 10" x 5/8" 24t FTG .126 Ripping Saw Blade
T24437 Freud 10" x 5/8" 60t Hi-ATB .098 Finishing Saw Blade

So thats ~$120 (without the melamine blade) so is the TS2000 40t better than the two specialty Freuds when it comes to sheet good work?
 
#26 · (Edited by Moderator)
I have both a Forrest WW2 and a Ridge Carbide TS2000.

The Forrest does ever so slightly better in plywood. but the TS2000 cuts faster and smoother with less burn in all other woods. Mainly cause of the Raker tooth.

I do like Ridge Carbide's amount of Carbide better than Forrest and quality of material.

I cut about 50/50 plywood and hardwood, and I keep the TS2000 in the saw and the WW2 as a backup. The ever so slight plywood difference isnt enough to keep me from changing blades, and because of TS2000 does better in all other cases.. I use it. i also like that it cuts a flat bottom dado which is huge.

FYI: Im using a 3hp Cabinet Saw.
 
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