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Hide glue for bent laminantions - does it cure too fast?

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Forum topic by Loren posted 02-02-2013 01:15 AM 656 views 0 times favorited 10 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Loren

7543 posts in 2299 days


02-02-2013 01:15 AM

I’m doing some bent laminations. I have used Urea glue in
the past but of course it’s hard stuff and will likely nick
my jointer knives when I clean up the laminate.

I have a lot of hide glue on hand (got it from a bookbinding
shop closing down) and I’m wondering if it’s worth
trying to do bent laminations with it. I have a two part
form.

Ideally I’d like to spread the glue on all 4 layers of the
laminate, wrap them with masking tape on either end
and get them clamped down all together in the form.

I reckon I could spread the glue and get the clamps
tightened in about 10 minutes…. no problem with
room temperature glues, but how about with hot
hide glue?

-- http://lawoodworking.com


10 replies so far

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404 - Not Found

2544 posts in 1621 days


#1 posted 02-02-2013 01:28 AM

I can’t see it working Loren. What’s wrong with PVA?

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Loren

7543 posts in 2299 days


#2 posted 02-02-2013 01:55 AM

Creep. I’ve seen PVAs do that before. The PVA I’m using
now is rated for RF gluing and seems to dry harder than
the more common hardware store stuff. I’ve had
regular PVAs creep really bad on me, but it was a long
time ago.

-- http://lawoodworking.com

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a1Jim

112077 posts in 2228 days


#3 posted 02-02-2013 02:11 AM

If your using resin glue just use a paint scraper before jointing or planning . It’s hard to beat resins open time and how rigid it is when dry which is important for bent laminations .

-- http://artisticwoodstudio.com Custom furniture

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David Drummond

86 posts in 1316 days


#4 posted 02-02-2013 03:20 AM

Sam Maloof used plain old Titebond I and he did a lot of bent laminations. I have done both Urea Formaldehyde and Titebond. The crib I built I used Urea Formaldehyde but used Titebond on the Rocking chair. I think the deciding factor is whether or not springback is really that big of a concern… On a rocker it really doesn’t matter cause the piece doesn’t mate to anything other than the legs which are sanded to fit after the rockers are out of the form whereas the crib I built had successive pieces that need to match. I haven’t noticed any glue creep on the rocking chair I built so I would feel comfortable using Titebond again for a lamination but I digress… I don’t know if I would trust hide glue on a lamination as I would fear it would delaminate in any kind of humidity.

-- "Twenty years from now you will be more disappointed by the things that you didn't do than by the ones you did do... Explore, Dream, Discover” Mark Twain

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Loren

7543 posts in 2299 days


#5 posted 02-02-2013 03:28 AM

Good point about the longevity of hide glue in
tensioned laminations.

With 4 layers I don’t think I’m going to have
much springback but a little won’t matter.

-- http://lawoodworking.com

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shipwright

4955 posts in 1449 days


#6 posted 02-02-2013 04:09 AM

Loren, you will get no creep or spring-back with hide glue. Ten minutes is likely out of the question for hot hide glue but Patrick Edwards’ Old Brown Glue is exactly the answer for you. Check it out. Patrick is in every way a true expert on the subject of hide glue and he developed OBG just for this kind of work.
... and don’t worry about humidity. It takes both heat and serious moisture to reverse hide glue. As Patrick says ’You really shouldn’t take your furniture into the bathtub with you”. I have tried to reverse an old well glued hide glue joint with hot water and added heat and I can tell you, it can be done but you need to be ready to do some work.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

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TopamaxSurvivor

14742 posts in 2327 days


#7 posted 02-02-2013 05:33 AM

Old Brown Glue says to set in the sun or warn water to use. After it cures, will it let loose setting in the sun?

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

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shipwright

4955 posts in 1449 days


#8 posted 02-02-2013 06:00 AM

At room temperature it is a gel. When heated in a warm water bath or the sun, it becomes liquid and usable.
It has an extended open time because of it’s low gel temperature.
Like any hide glue it’s final cure is by drying.
Unless it is soaked again, heat will have no effect.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fiberglass trees. http://prmdesigns.com/

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Loren

7543 posts in 2299 days


#9 posted 02-02-2013 06:12 AM

Thanks for the feedback.

I’ll probably try cooking up some of the glue I have
with urea to see if it’s viable to test.

Seriously, I have like 50 lbs of “dry” hot glue. Lots of
it is in these black forearm-sized licorice-like slabs. I
gotta figure out some way to use it. I also have
several pounds of granules.

-- http://lawoodworking.com

View John Ormsby's profile

John Ormsby

1279 posts in 2388 days


#10 posted 02-02-2013 06:45 AM

I use Urea glues for bent lamination because they pretty much hold their shape when taken out of the form. Urea and Epoxy would be the only two types Recommended for bent lamination. Most others will flex out of shape when removed from the forms.

-- Oldworld, Fair Oaks, Ca

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