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Sharpening frustrations

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Forum topic by skeemer posted 01-01-2013 03:30 PM 987 views 0 times favorited 21 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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skeemer

94 posts in 1118 days


01-01-2013 03:30 PM

I received a few new items for the workshop for Christmas, namely an IBC blade for my #5, an 8000 grit waterstone, and a extra course / course DMT diamond stone.

So I got to work with lapping and sharpening the new plane blade on the extra course stone, and was sorely disappointed with the ‘courseness’ of this stone (also with the flatness of the blade out of the package). After nearly two hours on the stone I still have a decent hollow on the back of blade. So I figured maybe the blade is just very out of flat and I took a break from it and tried out another (original Stanley) blade as well as some chisels. Same thing, tons and tons of work and time and not making a lot of progress.

It became clear to me that none of my tools (which were flattened and sharpened using scary sharp) are as flat as I thought they were. So I feel that I am in need of a rougher grit to get my tools flattened and then reset the primary bevels. I’ve been looking at the extra-extra course DMT as this is around 120 grit equivalent (as opposed to 220 on the extra-course), which I’m hoping will get me through my blades in a much more timely manner. I’ve tried light passes, medium passes, and heavy passes on the DMT and it doesn’t seem to remove that much material.

Any other suggestions on getting my tools lapped flat before going through the grit progression? In my arsenal I currently have the two stones mentioned above as well as a 1000/4000 grit waterstone, sandpaper of various grits, and a ROS. I’ve found that sandpaper wears out too fast for my liking and (apparently) doesn’t get the blades as flat as a stone would.


21 replies so far

View Arminius's profile

Arminius

304 posts in 2557 days


#1 posted 01-01-2013 03:37 PM

For lapping a blade flat, I use a mix of a 300 waterstone and 80/120 sandpaper on a granite reference plate.

I’d also suggest you look up the ‘ruler trick’, I believe Charlesworth’s invention and save the work of flattening the whole back.

View Don W's profile (online now)

Don W

15580 posts in 1321 days


#2 posted 01-01-2013 03:41 PM

When I encounter iron as bad as you describe, and it happens quite a bit, I head to the power. I start on the belt sander. I have an old belt sander with a nice flat steel bed.

The last iron I used the side of this, http://lumberjocks.com/topics/44161 I’ve only done this once so far, so its not a recommendation yet, but it seemed to work well.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

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Smitty_Cabinetshop

10394 posts in 1372 days


#3 posted 01-01-2013 03:46 PM

Does the hollow extend all the way to the edge of the iron? If not, it doesn’t need to be lapped out. That said, LJ Bandit uses a belt sander very effectively for sharpening tasks and posted about it over the weekend, I recall. Good luck!

-- Don't anthropomorphize your handplanes. They hate it when you do that. -- OldTools Archive

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skeemer

94 posts in 1118 days


#4 posted 01-01-2013 04:21 PM

Here is a picture after about 45-60 min of flattening on the extra course DMT. I realize I am flattening alot more than necessary (I like shiny metal) but even just working on the 1/2 – 1” behind the edge it is a slow going. I also realize that this A2 steel is much harder and takes longer to wear on, but I feel like the amount of time I’m putting into this is not in line with what I’ve read from others about these blades.

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Smitty_Cabinetshop

10394 posts in 1372 days


#5 posted 01-01-2013 04:26 PM

Holy crap, that’s not good at all. I’d be inclined to send it back, Skeemer. That’s not right, and with A2, as you said, it’s a total pain…

-- Don't anthropomorphize your handplanes. They hate it when you do that. -- OldTools Archive

View JohnChung's profile

JohnChung

282 posts in 828 days


#6 posted 01-01-2013 04:42 PM

If the handtool takes 60 mins then you are doing something wrong. Just kidding. Seriously, if it takes that much time just sit back and understand the issue.

Back to the blade. With that much hollow at the back of the iron is NOT good. I would return it back. Usually
flattening the back of the blade is done once. It is VERY possible to flatten and sharpen on sandpaper. Just use the proper backing.

View Don W's profile (online now)

Don W

15580 posts in 1321 days


#7 posted 01-01-2013 04:48 PM

I’d second Smitty’s comments. Those blades are not cheap. They should be better than that.

-- Master hand plane hoarder. - http://timetestedtools.com

View Straightbowed's profile

Straightbowed

717 posts in 1051 days


#8 posted 01-01-2013 08:32 PM

use 80 grit sandpaper it will take cre of that hollow

-- Stevo, work in tha city woodshop in the country

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Straightbowed

717 posts in 1051 days


#9 posted 01-01-2013 08:35 PM

I have a A grade granite plate from my work 42×42 it is flat and slick thats what I use to flaten everything for stones, wood, irons chisels happy new year

-- Stevo, work in tha city woodshop in the country

View Brian Strothcamp's profile

Brian Strothcamp

111 posts in 1447 days


#10 posted 01-01-2013 08:47 PM

I never had luck with scary sharp unless I used the film type abrasives…
Either way its only as flat as your surface, some use glass but its a big unknown in the equasion.
Get a small granite plate… works for scary sharp AND making sure your stones are flat (the granite becomes your #1 reference).

View Arminius's profile

Arminius

304 posts in 2557 days


#11 posted 01-01-2013 09:13 PM

Wow – I had heard better of the IBC blades. As a hollow, that is worse than 100-year old Stanleys I have refurbed. Not sure how much the Hock or L-N blades are, but the Veritas ones for Stanley are about the same price, and if they have been dead flat when I buy them from LV.

View lj61673's profile

lj61673

234 posts in 1153 days


#12 posted 01-01-2013 11:05 PM

Why should anyone have to spend all that time and effort on so called premium plane iron? Send that back and get a real iron from from LN or Veritas.

View sikrap's profile

sikrap

1065 posts in 2112 days


#13 posted 01-02-2013 03:31 AM

Another vote here for sending it back. For what they’re charging for IBC blades, you shouldn’t have to spend more than 2-3 minutes flattening the back. I’d get a refund and either get a Lee Valley or a Hock. If you go with either of those vendors, you should call and make sure they know you’re going to be using it in an old Stanley plane. The make them in different thicknesses and the thicker irons could be problematic. Good Luck!

-- Dave, Colonie, NY

View waho6o9's profile (online now)

waho6o9

5304 posts in 1330 days


#14 posted 01-02-2013 03:37 AM

Send it back along with an email attachment of this LJ thread and kindly
explain the situation.

View bandit571's profile

bandit571

7526 posts in 1437 days


#15 posted 01-02-2013 03:41 AM

If you care, go to a blog I have posted today. I use a beltsander to get things flat, and start to establish a decent bevel. Then I head for the stones. One blade today, it was out of flat in three different directions, at once. Almost like a twist to it. Now….

I think I am pretty close….

-- A Planer? I'M the planer, this is what I use

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