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Forum topic by DavidNJ posted 12-29-2012 07:08 AM 5734 views 4 times favorited 150 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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DavidNJ

384 posts in 647 days


12-29-2012 07:08 AM

Could you share some information?

Which model you have?

Why you chose that brand and model?

What brands and models did you reject and why?

How does the ducting run/work in your shop? Multiple tools with blast gates? A flexible hose to a single tool at a time?

What dust collector did you have prior to your cyclone dust collector?

Are you satisfied with your dust collector?

If you’d like to also post a picture of your installation, that would be great.

I’m primarily interested in the dust collectors 2.5hp and under, but would be interested in all input.

Thanks,

David


150 replies so far

View kizerpea's profile

kizerpea

746 posts in 1021 days


#1 posted 12-29-2012 12:19 PM

Well my friend this is a can of worms busted…the frist answer of many i,m sure..build my own…in my projects.. As many guys here did ..bang for the buck…harbor freight 2hp is the way to go …an build from there..

-- IF YOUR NOT MAKING DUST...YOU ARE COLLECTING IT! SOUTH CAROLINA.

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

1784 posts in 1147 days


#2 posted 12-29-2012 02:30 PM

My current one is an Oneida, I bought it one day when I went brain dead. I’m hoping to replace it with a CV. But it replaced a shop built one (Wood magazine design) that was powered by a PSI 2.5HP SS DC. My duct was 4” PVC at first, and i quickly upsized that to 6” PVC. The 6” runs as close to every tool possible, and each tool has a gate. My current DC moves a lot of air, and to be honest everything is fine in terms of capturing the dust. Where my Oneida falls short is in separating the dust before the air gets to the filter. It’s so bad I have a gauge on the discharge to measure the filter ’s air flow. The Oneida is built like a tank, but it skips the finer points of what Pentz proved to be good for separation. No squared/sloping inlet, a neutral vane that’s improperly designed (IMHO), no air ramp…all of which get the last drop of fine dust from the airstream. Mine started life as a 2HP unit, and I upsized the motor to 5HP (another long story).

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, we sent 'em to Washington.

View Grandpa's profile

Grandpa

3133 posts in 1329 days


#3 posted 12-29-2012 03:40 PM

I bought a Clear Vue 5 hp. It really wasn’t that much higher than a 3 hp made by other companies. It had the Pentz endorsement and the customer service was great. It came with a remote control. I used 6 inche spiral wrap metal pipe. As I got closer to a tool I reduced it to 5 inch metal then 4 inch metal. Each tool is connected all the time with a blast gate in place. My shop is 30×40 ft so I installed the collector in the center end and ran a trunk line down the center of the room with branches to the machines. I used wyes and 45 deg elbows.
I was in Grizzly one day in Springfield, MO. I was looking at dust collectors. Another customer came by and said buy the larger of the collectors. I didn’[t do that the first time but I did when that unit was too small. He walked on by. I thought about that statement for 2 years before I made a decision. If I went to the 3 hp Grizzly I would have something that would do the job I needed done. Then I looked at the price and decided I could have a larger unit if I wanted to spend about $200 more. I chose to do that. I considered buy the Harbor Freight and upgrading with the better fileter system etc. By the time you do those things you can go buy a good system that is already together. Just bite the bullet and do it. You will spend it anyway.

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Dallas

2906 posts in 1141 days


#4 posted 12-29-2012 05:16 PM

I opted for the 1hp Harbor Freight dust collector. It’s not powerful, but I set it up with 4” green PVC and 90° elbows.
The longest run is from the band saw with a 2” PVC (sched 40) to a 4” bushing to the rest of the system.
It’s about 6’ total from tool to dust bag.

I haven’t hooked the table saw up to it yet, although that is in the works, but I do have a clean up opening that I can use to sweep all the floor FOD into. Every drop is removable and I have a short piece of pipe with a cap over it to remove each piece from the system. It may not be as fast and pretty or elegant as having blast gates or 5HP, but so far it works for me.

I modified the output so that it emptied into a 42 gallon Rubbermaid garbage can with a contractor bag in it.
The output from there is just a straight up run of 4” with the bag over it.

I also have it hooked to the planer and it catches probably 95% or more of the chips and shavings and dust with no problem…. at least until the garbage can starts to fill. I am full at about the 35 gallon mark.

Eventually I’ll rebuild the system, make it a bit more efficient, but for right now it works fine for what I’m doing.

-- Improvise.... Adapt...... Overcome!

View DavidNJ's profile

DavidNJ

384 posts in 647 days


#5 posted 12-29-2012 05:33 PM

Fred, which model Oneida do you have? Oneida has at least two designs. One is a cone its entire length, the other has a more conventional design.

View SASmith               's profile

SASmith

1590 posts in 1641 days


#6 posted 12-29-2012 06:57 PM

I am like kizerpea. I have a shop made wooden cyclone on a 2HP HF DC.

-- Scott Smith, Southern Illinois

View Manitario's profile

Manitario

2337 posts in 1537 days


#7 posted 12-29-2012 08:39 PM

I have the Clearvue 5hp cyclone; I love it and I am completely satisfied with it, however, it is expensive. From what I’ve read and the specs online some of the higher HP Penn State Ind. “Tempest” units are almost equivalent but cheaper. I have 6” ducting for my main lines in my shop and short runs of flex for the drop down; and run only one blast gate open at a time. It lives in an insulated closet I built for it in a corner of the shop because it is loud!!

-- Sometimes the creative process requires foul language. -- Charles Neil

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

1784 posts in 1147 days


#8 posted 12-29-2012 09:42 PM

David, mine is the Super Dust Gorilla.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, we sent 'em to Washington.

View DavidNJ's profile

DavidNJ

384 posts in 647 days


#9 posted 12-30-2012 03:38 AM

Fred, what did Oneida say about your problem. There units are generally considered good. The Super Gorilla has a conventional cyclone. While the tuning tricks are niceties, it should still work pretty well. I’m wondering if it is too strong. Have you tried opening two gates instead of just one one on the machine you are using?

Rob, nice shop, I’m jealous. How do you like your SawStop?

Scott…I’m impressed and curious about the wood cyclone. There is no reason it should work. But does it? How do you connect it in your shop? The issue is pressure drop across the cyclone in conjunction with the capability of your motor/impeller vs. the load from your shop. What is the load on the dust collector in your shop?

The cyclone is a first stage that enables a second stage for fine filtration. However, in the picture you still had a bag on the HF. Have you considered a canister or MERV 15 nano canister?

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Manitario

2337 posts in 1537 days


#10 posted 12-30-2012 08:48 PM

Thanks David! I like the Sawstop; safety features aside, it is the nicest TS that I’ve ever owned.

-- Sometimes the creative process requires foul language. -- Charles Neil

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

1784 posts in 1147 days


#11 posted 12-30-2012 09:15 PM

David, to make the story as short as possible, I spent hours talking/emailing to Oneida winding up with Bill Witter (the founder, I think). After providing them with samples of the dust in my filter, a layout of the system, and a considerable amount of other info, I never heard another word from them! My unit is separating 98.4% of the debris by volume. Oneida specs say 99%, so I’m essentially getting what they designed. Here’s my beef: that isn’t good enough, and the Pentz design changes get most of that last 1% (and make the unit 2-3 times as expensive). But if you use a lot of fine dust producing tools (drum sander, for example) you really need that last 1% of separation. Otherwise you wind up cleaning your filter twice per 35 gallon drum of chips. One more thought: that stuff that would make it more expensive is what Grizzly somehow figured out a way to incorporate without a stratospheric price….so I guess it can be done.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, we sent 'em to Washington.

View DavidNJ's profile

DavidNJ

384 posts in 647 days


#12 posted 12-30-2012 10:19 PM

Fred…your Dust Gorilla should be a fine duct collector. Oneida’s MERV16+ HEPA filters are probably the best offered to the hobbyist. ClearVue, Wynn, and Penn State mark their nano-filters as MERV 15.

My hypothesis is that you have too much power in your DC. If all the blast gates are closed it is trying to satisfy itself though the air openings in the one tool you are using. That may be creating very high vacuum in the system, enough that it is vacuuming the cyclone and its bin. Remember, the cyclone is basically just an empty chamber.

If that hypothesis is correct, opening some of your other blast gates for machines not in use should fix the problem, although probably at an increase in noise level. If it works, a long term solution may be a new duct port near the cyclone with a blast gate and automotive air filter. That would allow you to regulate the vacuum level.

Further justification for this hypothesis is Oneida’s creation of Smart dust collectors that monitor some combination of vacuum level and air flow/air velocity and adjust the compressor accordingly. In our shops we have tools that may vary by a factor of 2x or 3x in air flow needs for dust collection and often size the DC to handle the largest with a buffer for error and expansion.

It’s worth 30 minutes to run the test, isn’t it?

View mbs's profile

mbs

1438 posts in 1594 days


#13 posted 12-30-2012 11:38 PM

I started with at PSI tempest that would suck up a pc of paper. Went with a Clearview and love it. Look at “my workshop” where I have some pics, listed things I would do the same and things I would do differently. I also made a thien separator for my garage shop with a 2 hp jet brand and wynn filter.

To answer your question better we need to know more about your intent, configuration and shop tools.

-- Sorry the reply is so long. I didn't have time to write a short reply.

View mbs's profile

mbs

1438 posts in 1594 days


#14 posted 12-30-2012 11:45 PM

David,

I read your responses to what others have written. You seem to know a lot about dust collection already. just curious, why are you asking us the questions?

-- Sorry the reply is so long. I didn't have time to write a short reply.

View DavidNJ's profile

DavidNJ

384 posts in 647 days


#15 posted 12-31-2012 01:57 AM

If you follow my one week old thread you will see a week ago I didn’t know much. I still have lots of questions.

In the earlier thread the group discussion was more along the lines of: do you need a canister? Is a nanofilter excessive? Do you need a cyclone? Isn’t a cyclone overkill? Commercial shops don’t use cyclones, so why should a home shop need one?

I think I have a handle on that: http://lumberjocks.com/replies/553445

In this thread I’m trying to understand real world experiences with cyclone systems. Two ClearVue systems, one Dust Gorilla, and a homebuilt wooden cyclone. An impressive group although I’m hoping for more: different size systems, Grizzlys, Penn State Tempests, etc.

mbs, why did you replace the PSI with the ClearVue? Is it outside your workshop. That is an impressive workshop: 2 Delta TS (are they on the same rails?), a large sliding table saw, an Incra router table (why no Incra fence on the Deltas), a large blue thing in the middle I don’t recognize. Is it an obelisque from 2001, A Space Odyssey?

I didn’t know there was a place in AZ that had grass and trees like that.

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