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Drawers - commercial slides or wood runners

3K views 26 replies 16 participants last post by  beevis 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
Hi All,
About to start building my kitchen cabinets.

Option A: Build the drawer narrower and shorter than the opening to allow for undermount slides, then attach a second drawer front. Use through dovetails which I would either cut by hand or on the table saw.

Option B: Build it like a piece of furniture, with the drawer built tight to the opening minus the reveal, half blind dovetails and wood runners, and the front of the drawer box is exposed.

Option B might be cheaper, but then longer to cut the half blinds. And I'm not sure if the drawer action would be depressing.

Thoughts?
Thanks.
 
#3 ·
I'd go with option b (and you don't need dovetails…dado will work…who other than you will know???). Option b will require some lube from time to time (paste wax works).

modern drawer slides are moving towards the "soft close" or "self close" and are relatively expensive plus are a PITA to install I think.
 
#4 · (Edited by Moderator)
I use the accuride side mount slides and the Blum under mount soft close slides. It depends on the use. I also recommend you consider pull out trays in the lower cabinets. Better use of space and very convenient. The under mount slides are actually quite easy to install once you understand how they work.
It costs more up front, but is well worth it.
You also might consider buying the drawers pre-built or delivered knocked down where you glue them together. The modern equipment and suppliers of today can do it at reasonable costs and with great accuracy.

It is no big deal to add the drawer faces on the drawer boxes.

Also think about installing soft close door hinges. They are also worth it.
 
#6 ·
Thanks guys.

This is for my own house, which I've been painstakingly working on for four years now and is a large part of my portfolio as a builder.
With that in mind, I really don't want to order the drawers. You're right that $19 is crazy cheap. But then again, it's plywood with a 1/4" bottom. I want to do solid wood sides and a 1/2" bottom minimum.
I want to take my time, and make the nicest, most custom cabinets I possibly can.
When I open my drawers, I want to admire my dovetails, and I want potential future buyers of this house to feel the same.
Maybe this is crazy (probably), but what the hey.

I will do slide-out shelves, but I'm thinking basically the lowers will be chock full of drawers rather than doors anyway.

Thanks again.
 
#7 ·
Jonathan has it right, though I'd go for full extension self closing side mounts for both cabinets and furniture.

Side Note: Those who turn their noses up at commercial slides for furniture probably couldn't fit up a drawer properly if their lives depended on it.
 
#9 ·
About the only thing that appeals to me about the commercial slides, is that I would do through dovetails on the box (faster), and slap on a second face piece to fit the opening.

Do you guys think I'm insane for wanting to hand cut dovetails on about 10-15 drawers?
 
#11 · (Edited by Moderator)
I prefer Blum under mount, self and soft closing, full extension, hidden slides in kitchens. Wooden slides are perfect for traditional fine furniture, but not in modern kitchens, even if the kitchen won't look modern.

I DO NOT like "pull-outs", and lots of current kitchen designers agree… Why open a door to pull out a drawer? In any base cabinet where you're considering pull-outs, consider changing to a deep drawer (or several). It's also much easier to close a drawer with full hands, in a typical kitchen situation, than a pull-out / door combo.

BTW… I dovetailed my own kitchen, but I did a near-hand cut look with a D4R and variable spacing, using the smallest pins possible. If you really want to hand cut them, go for it. You'll be really good at it when you're done! ;^)
 
#12 ·
With available glues, Titebond for instance, butt glued and screwed/pinned drawers are as serviceable as dovetailed assemblies. The only reason, IMO, to handcut dovetails is to elevate one's self esteem. When I outsource drawers, it's dovetails because that's the only way they come, otherwise it's glue and screw/pin.
 
#13 · (Edited by Moderator)
If I built more cabinets, I would make inset drawers. However, I would never use wood slides in a kitchen. Wood slides are really terrible - they stick, require waxing, and let the drawer sag too much. Plus they require additional blocking.
I have been very pleased with the look of centermount accuride slides. The slides are invisible even with the drawer open, allowing you to display your dovetail joints.
Oh, by the way - don't cut them by hand - that is way too much work for a kitchen. Machine cut dovetils look just as nice, especially with a deep bit. See my forum on the topic below…
http://lumberjocks.com/topics/40073
 
#15 ·
I'll chime in…1/4 ply for the bottoms should be more than adequate (but than again I don't store my anvil in my kitchen). Hardwood runners are still present in pieces built a 100+ years ago.

My kitchen I used self-close side mounted ball-bearing slides that cost about $10/pair…a lot of cussing involved because the wife wanted the counter-top installed before I finished the face frames/drawers. Was very much a yoga thing.
 
#16 ·
I'm all for going all-out on the woodworking, but I'm a big fan of metal ball bearing slides in the kitchen. When I'm in the midst of cooking I want to be able to close drawers with a hip bump or a light kick. And kitchens get messy and have alternating humidity, which means wood slides will take a lot of tuning.

When we were deciding on a course of action, I bought a bunch of slides (and Accuride sent me a few) and I built some test rigs and tried 'em all out. We ended up with the Blum slildes, but those videos and notes might help you. Or they might just be more noise…. [grin]
 
#18 ·
One thing I haven't seen mentioned…

Think of a good kitchen as a shop… with nice decor!

You want to be able to easily open or close things with dirty hands and full armloads, sometimes in a rush… clean up easily, reach all the way to the back of drawers and cabinets, have places to put hot or "dirty" things down, be comfortably lit, and have storage and work surfaces at a comfortable height for the actual user.

After that… just make it look nice! ;^)
 
#20 ·
If this is a project that you want to take pride in saying "I built them from scratch" then that is the way I would go. I would also use commercial drawer slides, side mounted for smoothness of operation. I remember the kitchen in an old house I lived in. The drawers used wood runners. They were hard to open and close and would fall apart easily due to age. Kitchen cabinets need to be more sturdy and free moving for the amount of stuff they usually hold.
 
#23 ·
Thanks guys.

It seems like the only mechanical slide that allows you to make an inset 4-sided drawer box (integral front), is the centermount slide, and these look like only 3/4 extension and rated for 35 lbs.

Is there such a thing out there, as full extension undermount slides that mount UNDERNEATH the drawer bottom? Finally figured out what I want, and this is it!

Thanks again.
 
#25 ·
Thanks Cessna,
But I think I wasn't clear enough.
The problem with all these "undermount" slides, is that the body of the slide actually attaches to the SIDE of the case and requires a big clearance gap.

I want to do a four-sided drawer box with an integral front, inset. So what I need is an undermount slide where the WHOLE THING mounts underneath the drawer, such as in a center mount slide (but those are only 3/4 ext. 35 lb. rated.
 
#26 ·
I have worked on a few Airstream Camp trailers and they all had a single Blum side mount slide (rated at 100l.s per set), mounted underneath in the middle.
Some of them were built late 70's to early 90's.

If you wanted more capacity, you could always use 2 or more slides.
 
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