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Forum topic by MarkSr posted 10-21-2012 12:45 AM 1886 views 0 times favorited 12 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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MarkSr

215 posts in 775 days


10-21-2012 12:45 AM

Topic tags/keywords: question oak traditional joining

I have a question for the pros out there.

I have been lucky enough to receive a good amount of boards of white oak, they range from 2” to 3-1/4” x
1-1/2” x 30” to 37” long.

Project: 24” x 60” woodworking bench, with a 3” top, (2 pcs. of 3/4” plywood with 1-1/2” x 1-1/2” oak boards) butcher block style, maybe 2 or 4 pieces of walnut for some style.

Here is the Question:

Will I have any problems down the road if I build the top with the individual oak boards running the 24” way instead of the usual 60” long pieces. I have never seen a table built that way and I really don’t want to end joint them, (remember the longest pieces of oak I have is only 37” long, and most are between 34” to 36”). Beside the dog holes ending up on a joint, (which I would not do) is there anything else that I would have to be concerned about????

I am just starting to get the frame work started and would really appreciate all the information (for or against) running the top boards the narrow way instead of the long way.

i will be patiently awaiting, because I value all you guys out there that have many years of experience and with that comes knowledge and that is why I am here, to learn.

Thanks,
Mark

-- Mark, ”...NEWBEE: On the road to learning a lot; but; a lot more to learn…” ("My Granddad used to tell me, if you didn't learn something new today, it just wasn't worth getting out of bed")


12 replies so far

View derosa's profile

derosa

1557 posts in 1560 days


#1 posted 10-21-2012 01:17 AM

I can think of two issues with it. First would be the need to really figure out how to deal with expansion. Expansion across 24” isn’t that much but across 60 would be a lot. Really with most benches the expansion is really dealing with about 18-20 inches due to overhang, even with overhang you’ll still be almost 3 times the amount to deal with. The other issue would be sag. With boards running length-wise each board only needs to support its self from sag, with the crosswise you will need to run full length supports and those will be trying to hold up the whole middle which will want to sag.

If you run two pieces, and take the cut off from the end you can use that at the beginning of the next row, the next cut off you use to start the third row but from the opposite end. that way even if most of the boards are similar lengths as yours are the cut offs keeps the seams moving around a lot more and will keep the waste down and the strength up. The butt joints won’t look the absolute greatest but if you cut them flush to each other it will still be more then strong enough and far from ugly.

-- --Rev. Russ in NY-- A posse ad esse

View RussellAP's profile

RussellAP

2963 posts in 1011 days


#2 posted 10-21-2012 01:22 AM

You can still do them 60 inches long as long as you glue them up right. Personally I’d rather have a 4’x4’ HDF bench. 24” isn’t enough room, I’d drop stuff off the back side.
Just stagger your glueups half way on each run so you can run them the 60” direction.

-- A positive attitude will take you much further than positive thinking ever will.

View MarkSr's profile

MarkSr

215 posts in 775 days


#3 posted 10-21-2012 01:46 AM

Thanks for the input.

I have been thinking of going 30” wide and I think I will.

Have either of you seen a staggered but end glue up 60” bench before? I really would not mind the pattern, I think it would be different and with some walnut in just a few lines I think I would like that. Is the two layers of 3/4” plywood approved?

I really appreciate the help, really.

-- Mark, ”...NEWBEE: On the road to learning a lot; but; a lot more to learn…” ("My Granddad used to tell me, if you didn't learn something new today, it just wasn't worth getting out of bed")

View cutworm's profile

cutworm

1065 posts in 1518 days


#4 posted 10-21-2012 02:01 AM

Just did a 60×25 bench with a 3” top. It’s a really good width. A lot of stuff around 24”. At 25” it makes clamping easy.
My old bench had a maple top with the board length of 22” and an overall 62” length. I used tongue and groove joints and it wroked well. Lot of cutting on the miter saw.

-- Steve - "Never Give Up"

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MarkSr

215 posts in 775 days


#5 posted 10-21-2012 03:20 AM

Cutworm,

I take it, the picture of the bench above is the new one, very nice I might add? The old maple one, the 25” wide, the top boards with tongue & groove joints, were they run the long way or the short 25” way?

I agree with the tongue & groove, my original plan was to run the top boards the short way. Glued up at 2 & 1/2 sections of 24” wide x 24” long. There will be (24×24 T&G) (12×24 T&G) & (24 X 24 T&G) sections, then glue the three sections together with biscuits. Then glue the whole top to the two layers of 3/4” plywood.

I plan on having an end vise and a side vise, the end vise I have, still researching the side vise.

What do you think of my plan for the top? Also I have to add, I want to put in 4 – 6 pcs. of walnut just to make it look interesting.

Have you ever seen a table made with the top boards running the short way?

Always taking in all advice I can get. Thanks

Mark

-- Mark, ”...NEWBEE: On the road to learning a lot; but; a lot more to learn…” ("My Granddad used to tell me, if you didn't learn something new today, it just wasn't worth getting out of bed")

View patron's profile

patron

13146 posts in 2066 days


#6 posted 10-21-2012 03:21 AM

here is one from buddy kova
in argentina
that runs crossways
(what her had)

http://lumberjocks.com/projects/72212

myself
i’ve never had a ‘real’ workbench

the one i have now
is 4 lower drawer cabs
with a 3/4” melamine top

sorry i’m not to much help here

-- david - only thru kindness can this world be whole . If we don't succeed we run the risk of failure. Dan Quayle

View RussellAP's profile

RussellAP

2963 posts in 1011 days


#7 posted 10-21-2012 03:36 AM

I’m not one to talk about benches much, mine is a couple of homemade saw horses with a piece of MDF on top. It’s stable and big enough for what I do.

I’d start out with either some 3/4 plywood, particle board, or MDF and then put the finish top on that. I’m assuming you have 5/4 oak to work with. Once you get a true flat surface with the MDF you can just plane your oak flat on both sides and glue it up right on the MDF and clamp it. Screw it in from the bottom. Be sure to screw it in while the glue is wet.

-- A positive attitude will take you much further than positive thinking ever will.

View MarkSr's profile

MarkSr

215 posts in 775 days


#8 posted 10-21-2012 03:42 AM

Buddy, from Argentina, Hello and thanks for your input.

That “UNREAL” workbench, has it served you well and have you got enjoyment out of making a project on it?
Then you have a “REAL” workbench. ”We work with what we have or we never complete, if we only wish;” by MarkSr.

At least you have your workable bench. I am still pondering how I am going to build mine.

Good luck and good fortune

Mark

-- Mark, ”...NEWBEE: On the road to learning a lot; but; a lot more to learn…” ("My Granddad used to tell me, if you didn't learn something new today, it just wasn't worth getting out of bed")

View MarkSr's profile

MarkSr

215 posts in 775 days


#9 posted 10-21-2012 03:49 AM

Russell, I agree with everything you said, do you see any problems, with heavy use, in the future of running the top boards the short way instead of the long way?

I am doing it because of the length of the stock I have.

Thanks for the reply.

Mark

-- Mark, ”...NEWBEE: On the road to learning a lot; but; a lot more to learn…” ("My Granddad used to tell me, if you didn't learn something new today, it just wasn't worth getting out of bed")

View patron's profile

patron

13146 posts in 2066 days


#10 posted 10-21-2012 04:31 AM

i would double up on the long rails
the top is attached to
to keep it from bowing

maybe some long inset
pieces top and bottom
glued and screwed
to the top itself
(while clamped good)
then attach the top to the leg/rails

you could use them for your dog holes too

-- david - only thru kindness can this world be whole . If we don't succeed we run the risk of failure. Dan Quayle

View RussellAP's profile

RussellAP

2963 posts in 1011 days


#11 posted 10-21-2012 04:56 AM

You could lay the boards in that way if you want to.I’d go with a 6 leg bench if that is the case.

-- A positive attitude will take you much further than positive thinking ever will.

View MarkSr's profile

MarkSr

215 posts in 775 days


#12 posted 10-21-2012 05:39 AM

Thanks to all, you all have been very helpful.

I am going to take the advice of Patron and RussellAP, using both of your suggestions would give me a very strong and true top even with the boards running the short way.

Only been a member for 6 days and have learned a lot. I am on my way.

Thanks again
Mark

-- Mark, ”...NEWBEE: On the road to learning a lot; but; a lot more to learn…” ("My Granddad used to tell me, if you didn't learn something new today, it just wasn't worth getting out of bed")

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