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Forum topic by pendledad posted 650 days ago 3926 views 0 times favorited 170 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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pendledad

189 posts in 692 days


650 days ago

Topic tags/keywords: tablesaw question help advice buying

After my last post about the issues I had with my tools, my wife gave the okay to pull the trigger and purchase a new TS. I’ve been doing lots of research and I’ve decided on a few things but I will need help narrowing my selection…

I don’t have 220V in my garage. And I am not going to pay to run a 220V line out there because we’re tearing it down in less than 5 years as part of a larger project on the house. I know that limits my capabilities for cabinet saws because most of them are in the 3hp range. However, I am going to build a dedicated woodshop as part of this addition and I can run as much power as I need when that is complete. So 220V will be available in the future, just not now. The idea of Grizzly’s 7015P 110 or 220 operation is very appealing in this aspect. I can wire it for 110 for ~5 years, then bump it to 220 when I get my new shop. Another reason why cabinet saw may not make sense for me is I don’t see myself working with 3” thick walnut. I am more of a poplar/spf guy for the foreseeable future as I am just getting started with this hobby. I think a 1.5-2hp range would be adequate for many years.

That said, all the reviews I’ve read about the Grizzly hybrid saw have indicated issues with alignment at different blade heights. The last thing I want to do is pay $900 for a saw that can’t cut square when I want it too. The idea of an enclosed cabinet where the motor isn’t exposed is very appealing to me. I understand it isn’t a cabinet saw because of the trunions and design of the saw, but having a cabinet base where the moving parts are fully enclosed inside is appealing to me.

So let’s call my budget ~$1,000. I can go a bit more if needed, but $1,500 would be a stretch to get approved from the boss. And I’m leaning towards new vs used. I want the quick release riving knife option on the newer saws for an extra layer of protection against kickback.

Some saws I looked at:
Grizzly 0715P
Grizzly 0713 (only $100 more than 0732 and better wings)
Ridgid r4512 & clones

Steel City? Laguna? Not sure of those brands, they seem less popular than the others.

Any input is greatly appreciated. Thanks for the help.


170 replies so far

View jap's profile

jap

1224 posts in 657 days


#1 posted 650 days ago

r4512

-- Joel

View Cosmicsniper's profile

Cosmicsniper

2199 posts in 1761 days


#2 posted 650 days ago

The only problem I see is that regardless of voltage, you would be buying, at most, a 2 hp saw. If you are good with that, then great. I personally think its not enough, especially if I knew that 220v was in my future.

I’d get a used Ridgid hybrid type, or similar for now and then sell it once I move into the permanent shop. That way, you aren’t locking yourself into your “lifetime” saw right now. Because you’d get close to what you paid for it when reselling, it’s almost like free rent.

Your opinions might change in five years, so I’d keep that open.

-- jay, www.allaboutastro.com

View HorizontalMike's profile

HorizontalMike

6915 posts in 1517 days


#3 posted 650 days ago

So are you actually going to “change” the location of the garage and/or future project? My thoughts are if you are going to have a shop even close to that area, you could run the preliminary power line to that spot (under ground), put a temporary box/head on it, and run a heavy 220v extension cord for now. Just an idea…

-- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..."

View pendledad's profile

pendledad

189 posts in 692 days


#4 posted 650 days ago

Thanks for the replies. Let me clarify the future of the shop. My garage now is currently connected via a breezeway. We’re going to demo all of that … straight to the ground. We’ll pour a new foundation and build a garage with bonus room above it and connect it to the house via a insulated mudroom instead of a breezeway.

My shop will be a large bump-out off the back of this new structure (or possibly a free-standing shed style shop in the back of the property). Anyways, the electrical in the whole house will be rewired during this project … so I don’t want to pay an electrician now and then. I don’t have any space on my current panel so I would have to upgrade my panel to get room for another 220 line … and the quotes for just an upgrade to the panel and bring the service to 200amps have been in the $1,800-$2,500 range. That does not include running a new line or any rewiring of the house.

I don’t mind running with a lower hp motor. I have a 3/4 horse motor now, and it has handled the cuts I’ve needed without bogging down much.

I like the solid cast iron wings and fence of the Grizzly 0715P, it seems like it has a nice build quality to it. Those items seem better than the Ridgid … however it does come with a heftier price tag.

View NiteWalker's profile

NiteWalker

2709 posts in 1179 days


#5 posted 650 days ago

Whichever saw you decide on, go for one with cabinet mounted trunions.
IMHO, with a cabinet saw you won’t feel like you compromised later on down the line.

Choicewise, I’m in the same boat and will be upgrading early next year. With being on saw #3 now, I made an oath to myself that my next tablesaw will be my last.

I’m leaning towards the sawstop cabinet saw with 1.75HP motor. Pricey, I know, but it will definitely be the last saw I buy.

In your budget though, I’d take a long hard look at the steel city 35950. It’s listed as $999 in steel city’s current flyer.

About the power, 1.75HP is fine. Unless you’ll be using 2” stock in every project you build.

-- He who dies with the most tools... dies with the emptiest wallet.

View Cosmicsniper's profile

Cosmicsniper

2199 posts in 1761 days


#6 posted 650 days ago

I don’t understand why 220v is so important if you aren’t getting something with some hp to truly take advantage of it?

I can think of three reasons to switch a motor from 110v to 220v…

1.) You are running on a typical 15 to 20 amp 110v circuit and you keep tripping the breaker. But if you dedicated a 110v circuit to only the saw, it’s a moot point.

2.) You are experiencing some power loss due to longer wiring runs with the 110 wiring. This extra resistance also causes some excess heat.

3.) You can save some expense with 220v because the legs can be smaller gauge wire than a single 110v line.

Otherwise, there’s no practical advantage to switching a motor from 110v to 220v. 2 hp is still 2 hp.

I thought I always could get by with my direct-drive Craftsman TS…that is until I got the 3hp Unisaw. There are just some cuts that I can’t imagine doing with less. Its certainly a debate, but I don’t like the saw to work anymore than it has to…it’s kinda a safety concern with me…the longer and harder it runs, the more bad things can happen, IMO.

-- jay, www.allaboutastro.com

View RussellAP's profile

RussellAP

2938 posts in 889 days


#7 posted 650 days ago

Ridgid R4512 is a good saw. You won’t notice much difference in saw till you go over 1500 anyway so keep it cheap and accurate.

Make sure your present electric service to the garage is 20 AMP and don’t use extension cords.

-- A positive attitude will take you much further than positive thinking ever will.

View WoodWorkWarrior's profile

WoodWorkWarrior

46 posts in 675 days


#8 posted 650 days ago

I have the 0715P and love it. It cuts everything I need it to. My only complaint was the fence, but I’ve gotten around that, see my review here. Granted, if I moved up to a 3HP saw I probably wouldn’t want to go back, but frankly 2HP (at either 110 or 220) works for me. The saw is a good saw and a great value. I wired 220V for it…but it wasn’t difficult or super costly for me. I also wanted the possibility of other 220V equipment.

I looked around a lot of other saws, my budget was even less than yours, and ended up with the Grizzly because of the feature set and quality you get for the price. Just a thought.

-- Jason

View pendledad's profile

pendledad

189 posts in 692 days


#9 posted 650 days ago

Thanks for the recommendations. The Steel City looks like I could have that at my door for $1,300 (plus tax) from HD. I like the cabinet mounted trunions. I’ll have to take a closer look at the reviews/specs tonight.

I plan on taking an unused 110 line in the basement and extending the feed into my garage where the TS will be placed. The rest of the garage outlets are daisy chained off the kitchen … such a mess. Gotta love a 1935 house with sketchy contracting work over the last 80 years.

View toolie's profile

toolie

1723 posts in 1231 days


#10 posted 650 days ago

r4512 for these reasons:

1. the moving parts are fully enclosed inside.

2. riving knife.

3. 90 day satisfaction guaranty .

4. 3 year guaranty.

5. lifetime service agreement eligible.

6. integrated mobile base.

7. dual voltage 1.5hp TEFC induction motor.

additionally, the fence rails can be slid to the right for increased rip capacity beyond the 30” capacity. the tape on the front rail would be useless, but that’s a small price to pay for 36”-40” of rip capavity.

it’s no unisaw, but if you can find a HD that honors the harbor freight “20% off any single item coupon”, it can be had for $400 plus tax. even if you want to upgrade in the future, the investment in the 4512 is reasonable enough that it could be used as an outfeed table for a 2 saw set up. a larger cabinet saw could be the rip saw and the 4512, placed perpendicular to the outfeed side of the cabinet saw, could be set up for crosscuts and dadoes like this.

-- there's a solution to every problem.......you just have to be willing to find it.

View knotscott's profile (online now)

knotscott

5369 posts in 1978 days


#11 posted 650 days ago

The alignment issues that plagued the early G0715P, also plagued the R4512 and Cman 21833….AFAIK, those issues have all been resolved. With good setup and good blade selection, all can be good performers for you. The G0715P has a better fence, full enclosure, and solid cast wings. All have table mounted trunnions….alignment is more difficult, but once done, it should stay done.

Hybrids and hybrid style contractor saws with cabinet mounted trunnions are the Steel City models, the Craftsman 22116 (made by Steel City/Orion), the General International 50-200R, 50-220R, and 50-240GT, and the Porter Cable PCB270TS. Some have the yoke style cab mounted trunnions that span the corners of the cabinet, others are supported in the middle by the strut.

These are both cabinet mounted trunnions on a hybrid saw:
PCB270TS

Steel City 35925/Cman 22116

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

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SirFatty

471 posts in 815 days


#12 posted 650 days ago

I’m very happy with my PCB270TS.

-- Visit my blog at dave.spalla.com

View Charlie's profile

Charlie

1001 posts in 889 days


#13 posted 650 days ago

I have a Steel City 35990 and I’m extremely happy with it. I watched Craigslist for a used saw and there just wasn’t anything available in my price range and I ran out of time. DO NOT buy the Steel City saw at Home Depot unless they’ll honor Steel City’s price flyer. When I bought mine, HD wanted almost $400 more for the saw than what Steel City was selling it for. I picked mine up at a local distributor for the flyer price.

CABINET MOUNTED TRUNIONS: you want them. Alignment is hugely easier with them. I know first-hand after aligning an R4512 before taking it back due to OTHER alignment issues that were not resolvable and then getting the 35990 and aligning that in less than 1/10 the time. BIG difference.

View Don Niermann  's profile

Don Niermann

207 posts in 2575 days


#14 posted 650 days ago

R4512 Had it 6 mo and love it

-- WOOD/DON (...one has the right to ones opinion but not the right to ones own facts...)

View HorizontalMike's profile

HorizontalMike

6915 posts in 1517 days


#15 posted 650 days ago

IMO, 5-years is a LONG time to postpone getting what you truly need. I lived nearly a lifetime “making do” with inferior/minimalistic tools. I now kick myself in the rear for having done so. All I can say is that you can get a heck of a lot of WW-ing done in 5-years with the right equipment. If fact you could actually save yourself enough dollars (making your own furniture, etc.) in five years to pay for not only the electrical service, but the table saw as well, IMO. You are going to do what you are going to do, but do remember that a real 3hp cabinet saw makes a lot of difference. You only cry once buying a real saw. My 2-cents

Because I skimped most of my life, I used this:

WHEN I finally got the message correctly, I got this:

I will NEVER be able to justify why I waited so long, and I mean that.

-- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..."

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