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Forum topic by DKV posted 08-14-2012 09:44 PM 3689 views 0 times favorited 226 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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DKV

3183 posts in 1191 days


08-14-2012 09:44 PM

Paragraph 1 – No mention of Republican or Democratic views. No mention of religion, although I’m not quite sure how that would integrate with the subject. Anyway, be nice.

Ok, let’s banter. Here is something from the science section of the NY Times.

Global warming has become perhaps the most complicated issue facing world leaders. Warnings from the scientific community are becoming louder, as an increasing body of science points to rising dangers from the ongoing buildup of human-related greenhouse gases — produced mainly by the burning of fossil fuels and forests.

Global emissions of carbon dioxide jumped by the largest amount on record in 2010, upending the notion that the brief decline during the recession might persist through the recovery. Emissions rose 5.9 percent in 2010, according to the Global Carbon Project, an international collaboration of scientists. The increase solidified a trend of ever-rising emissions that scientists fear will make it difficult, if not impossible, to forestall severe climate change in coming decades.

However, the technological, economic and political issues that have to be resolved before a concerted worldwide effort to reduce emissions can begin have gotten no simpler, particularly in the face of a global economic slowdown.

I personally do not believe global warming to be a fairy tale. It should be fairly obvious to all that something significant is going on with our planet. I understand that in the very near future the government is going to change the name of Glacier National Park. I think they’re going to have a contest to rename it.

-- Have fun and laugh alot. Life can end at any moment. You old guys out there know what I mean...


226 replies so far

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trickshot

10 posts in 1204 days


#1 posted 08-15-2012 12:12 AM

My dad grew up in a town 100 miles from the Atlantic Ocean. However, as a child he collected shark teeth in a creek near his house. Where did the ocean go?

Does climate (weather) “change”? Yes. It was warmer here today than yesterday.

Does the SUN and it’s solar flares effect us more than carbon dioxide? Yes.

Have they had to change the name of the catastrophe from Global Warming to Climate Change? Yes!

5 things that make me even more skeptical.

#1 The meteorologist that come up with these theories are getting grants from the government. Do you not think there’s some influence there?

#2 How can a meteorologist tell me what’s the weather is going to be like in a 100 years but he can’t tell me if it’s going to rain tomorrow?

#3 In the seventies, we were headed to Global Cooling. What happened??

#4 Al Gore left the WH worth about $1 million. He’s now worth over $100 million selling snake oil.

#5 Politicians (any) involvement.

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ChuckV

2437 posts in 2214 days


#2 posted 08-15-2012 12:34 AM

-- “While the world with closed eyes sleeps, The sky knows and weeps - steel rain. ” ― Nathan Bell

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DKV

3183 posts in 1191 days


#3 posted 08-15-2012 12:36 AM

If that’s not proof of global warming then I don’t know what is. Did the driver manage to escape? You must have taken the picture in Sacramento.

-- Have fun and laugh alot. Life can end at any moment. You old guys out there know what I mean...

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Howie

2656 posts in 1609 days


#4 posted 08-15-2012 12:42 AM

@trickshot, 5 very good points.

-- Life is good.

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DKV

3183 posts in 1191 days


#5 posted 08-15-2012 04:00 PM

Now you see it, now you don’t. These images, captured two weeks apart by NASA’s Terra satellite on 17 July (below) and 3 August, show a dramatic retreat of sea ice in the Arctic’s North-West Passage.

-- Have fun and laugh alot. Life can end at any moment. You old guys out there know what I mean...

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waho6o9

5078 posts in 1263 days


#6 posted 08-15-2012 04:08 PM

Nonsense

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OldMarine

70 posts in 959 days


#7 posted 08-15-2012 04:34 PM

Snow and ice melt in the summer.

I’m shocked!

-- Jim, Southern Oregon

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DKV

3183 posts in 1191 days


#8 posted 08-15-2012 04:52 PM

I hope you guys don’t own homes in Florida at sea level. Oh wait, all homes in Florida are at sea level. Don’t say I didn’t warn you. Your legacy to your grandkids will be underwater someday in the not too distant future. I can’t argue with those that refuse to listen. Kind of like religion I suppose.

-- Have fun and laugh alot. Life can end at any moment. You old guys out there know what I mean...

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DrDirt

2494 posts in 2429 days


#9 posted 08-15-2012 04:58 PM

Nobody is saying it is not getting warmer, The debate is on ANTHROPOGENIC warming.

Facts is there was the medieval warm period.
So why was it warmer before there were cities/factories/cars/electricity generation? the population was only 10% of what it is today!

It is also true that it is warmer today than during the ice age.

What is missing is a good/defensible picture of exactly what fraction of the global warming is from human activities. I can look at the LA skys and it doesn’t take a rocket scientist to say “that isn’t good”

The leap I don’t make is that ANY microscopic step forward, is worth an infinite amount of resources to change or implement just to say it is better.

PART of the warming trend is NATURAL… is that Part 2% or 30%? I don’t know.

But if ADOPTING the draconian solutions proposed by UN panels means that the earth will warm 0.5 degree C in 30 years instead of 27 years….then we need to decide what is that 3 years worth.
It is not 3 years of life, but rather like calculating gas savings with speed limits.

I see the climate change as inevitable. Both because of natural warming, but also because India and China pollute more than the US does. and the BRIC countries (Brazil, Russia, India, China)- where all the jobs are moving to, are unwilling to take part in this dialog on change.

WHy the hell are we going to spend resources on this? Just for our conciences?

SHow me that the regulation is worthwhile and actually PREVENTS anything. ANd then lets discuss a CONSENSUS approach, rather than the US sending our jobs that were done in clean factories here, to the third world where we will instead generate 3 times the pollution. Before someone claims to be SOLVING global warming. Again if all we are doing is delaying a small increas by a year, but spending a trillion dollars on the effort, that seems a total waste of time.
Like saying we will drive of the cliff at 47 miles per hour instead of 50…isn’t that so awesome! At the end of the day you prevented bumpkus

-- "If we did all the things we are capable of doing, we would literally astonish ourselves." Edison

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DKV

3183 posts in 1191 days


#10 posted 08-15-2012 05:11 PM

Regulations, shemegulations…at this point it doesn’t matter. I don’t think we can turn around our polluting ways. Some of the biggest polluters don’t care. I’m not saying the end of the world is coming but I am saying some pretty significant changes are.

-- Have fun and laugh alot. Life can end at any moment. You old guys out there know what I mean...

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Smitty_Cabinetshop

10036 posts in 1305 days


#11 posted 08-15-2012 05:13 PM

Imposing a scientifically enlightened, global warming, world view on the developing economies named above won’t go over very well, I’m thinking. No one interfered in similar fashion in the West’s Industrial Revolution, and the environmental habits from that period were finally redressed in the US with environmental regulations rooted in the 1970s. Serious issue, unclear the way forward is… (Yoda-like phrase, sorry)

Oh, and +1 to Dr. Dirt’s points…

-- Don't anthropomorphize your handplanes. They hate it when you do that. -- OldTools Archive

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SteviePete

224 posts in 1990 days


#12 posted 08-15-2012 05:15 PM

This issue contains all the trappings of the Middle Ages view of a flat earth. Mix in Politics and Religion-used and misused. This topic contains so many avenues of thought, every “fact” has been turned into an is/is not statement. And of course, we all know it is impossible prove something doesn’t exist.

So, I’ve decided to stay out of this one because as a “God fear’n hooman bean” (Pogo – 1968) I don’t want to produce any more ozone depleating gas. “And that’s about all I have to say about that!” (Gump, Forrest 1994 Movie)

-- Steve, 'Sconie Great White North

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TheOldTimer

223 posts in 1773 days


#13 posted 08-15-2012 05:25 PM

If it is not woodworking, I am not interested

-- TheOldTimer,Chandler Arizona

View jmos's profile

jmos

681 posts in 1056 days


#14 posted 08-15-2012 05:25 PM

Keep this up and they’ll ban science topics altogether too.

Climate and weather are two different things. Weather is immediate, climate is long term. Fluctuations in weather do not indicate changes in climate.

Here’s a link to a good site discussing the common arguments against climate change (sun activity, volcanic emissions of CO2, data has been faked…) http://www.astronomynotes.com/solarsys/s11b.htm

Ken Mueller was a climate change skeptic and darling of the denialists, until he studied the evidence (with funding from the Koch brothers none the less). Here’s an article he wrote for the WSJ http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970204422404576594872796327348.html

While much science research is funded by the government, it’s not like these results started with the current administration, the trend was identified years ago and the research continues to support the theory of anthropomorphic global warming; research done in the US and other countries.

Having said that, I don’t for a moment think that humans will act in our own best interest and modify our behavior to stop this, we can only hope for a technological breakthrough to reduce carbon emissions, or get ready to deal with lots of new problems.

-- John

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DrDirt

2494 posts in 2429 days


#15 posted 08-15-2012 05:42 PM

Ultimately we will act out of preservation.

However many in the UN want to have teh USA “fall on their collective sword” for the new agenda, while the rest of the world laughs

-- "If we did all the things we are capable of doing, we would literally astonish ourselves." Edison

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