Need some sanding advice

I must follow this for information on the replies. I would use a scraper, but what do I know?

-- Chance Four "Not Just a Second Chance"

its kinda the nature of the beast, no matter how much or how you sand it wont change but depending on the finish is the key here, if you go beyond 220 grit lacquer has a hard time sticking and thats the finish i would use. for an oil finish the finer the better but doug fir is not a good choice for an oil finish imo. but no finish is what is desired here so why not exagerate that softer grain and give it some 3d depth by sand blasting it then block sanding the hard grain to 2000 grit in steps, i think that would look very cool. just a thought.

-- no matter what size job big or small do a job right or don't do it at all.

I used a scraper to get the chatter marks out, but I just can’t get the darn thing sharp enough for finishing… it just seems to tear out the soft grain. Maybe that’s what I should be practicing. I’m still learning this stuff.

-- I'll grow up when ketchup bottle farts stop being funny.

How do you sharpen your scraper?

-- Chance Four "Not Just a Second Chance"

Thanks Vonhagen, It would look cool, but it’s just the opposite of what I’m trying to achieve.

I’m going to step back into the shop and see if I can get a card scraper sharp enough to do the job. I don’t have a honing tool, so that may be the problem there. But I’ll know is a little while. I’ll be back a little later.

-- I'll grow up when ketchup bottle farts stop being funny.

try taking a brown paper bag and block with it it works like burnishing, a scraper is just going to tear and chatter. i use a brown paper bag a lot to polish dull spots, elbow grease.

-- no matter what size job big or small do a job right or don't do it at all.

I need to get some rest, so I will drop off this information then hit the rack. I put a fine mill file in my wooden jawed vise near the bottom of the jaws and in a position that is flat and parallel to the floor. I use one of the jaws of the vise like a rip fence. I take the scraper and rub it in one direction against the direction of the teeth on the file. The scraper blade is kept at a ninety degree angle to the file by making sure I have constant contact with that one jaw of the vise. I check to see if there is a bur on both sides of the square bottom edge of the scraper. If I have a bur on both sides, I use it either in my two handled scraper or just by hand. If the bur is not there or disappointing, I stroke it again until I get an effect I like. The bur is very sharp. I get a very interesting effect with oak, but don’t know about your selections of wood. Good luck.

-- Chance Four "Not Just a Second Chance"

vonhagen is right – the best you can do is sand to a fine grit and then burnish the wood. It is unlikely that it will ever look like hardwood, but burnishing is the best you can do. Paper bag or paper towel will work, but shavings from your scraper will work even better.

-- Kelby

Thanks for all this excellent advice everybody, I really do appreciate it.

nomercadies, is that to say you get the burr straight from the file, without honing? I do pretty much what you describe, but I don’t get a burr until I use a chrome vanadium screwdriver to hone it. Do you apply much pressure or just lightly pull it across the file?

I think I got a decent edge on the scraper this time, as I got small shavings (not dust) without using too much pressure. I still have to practice my scraping technique though – getting the angle right, longer sweeps, and not leaving stop/start marks.

I tried burnishing with 0000 steel wool and that turned out to be a mistake – left a dull gray hue and I had to re-sand and start over. Then I used a coarse rag and that worked out pretty well. I’ll try the paper bag, paper towel and shavings tomorrow.

I have concluded that the soft grain will never shine up like the hard grain, simply because it is too porous. Still, this is a good exercise for me. I’d really like to get the smoothest surface possible before applying any finish coats. I have some padouk, walnut, and a few others that I also want to experiment on. But that’s for another day, namely tomorrow. It’s time to call it a night.

-- I'll grow up when ketchup bottle farts stop being funny.

I know you said no sealer but if you use a ½ pound cut of dewaxed shellac it will soak into the soft grain and then you can sand to an even sheen. Unfortunately it’s the nature of the wood that the softer grain can’t be polished as good as the hard grain. Thats exactly why you have to wait for a finish to harden and cure be for you can rub out a high gloss finish. If the topcoat of finish is uncured and soft it won’t polish. Like the old saying goes “You can’t polish a turd”. Some have used buffing wheels and compounds but I think with the light color of the wood the buffing compound would discolor the wood.

-- Save lives, ease suffering, reduce morbidity and mortality, stomp out pestilence and disease, postpone the inevitable, and fake compassion. The Paramedics Creed

Try this video on how to sharpen a card scraper http://www.thewoodwhisperer.com/videos/scraper-sharpening-w-william-ng/ It’s very good.

You do get your edge from burnishing, not off the file. And you don’t need a big honking burr, a big burr is weaker and will break or roll easier.

-- John

Yeah, I use shellac to get a sheen on things like this. Have never been able to make it work without…

-- Lis - Michigan - http://www.missmooseart.com - https://www.etsy.com/people/lisbokt

Ted, I burnish/hone the edge on my scrapers with a round screw driver shaft. It makes the edges nice and flat and gives a prety good finish, although I’m not sure how good it would be on Doug Fir!

-- Improvise.... Adapt...... Overcome!

There is always going to be a difference between the early wood and late wood, that is just how trees grow. The difference is cellular, the early wood cells have large cavities and thin walls, the late wood cells have small cavities and thick walls. Here is a picture.

I think the shellac sealer idea is best as that will help to even the densities between the early and late wood.

-- Bondo Gaposis

I’ve had a talk with me. After I watched William Ng do sharpening the right way I felt kind of silly. How could running a scraper at a 90 degree angle on a fine mill file firmly enough and often enough to give you a fine bur you are happy with give you anything close to what Mr. Ng is doing. He is fabulous. Then I looked over at the table next to the chair where I am typing this. I looked at and felt the top once more. The table is red oak. I am so happy with the feel and look of that piece, I am not sure I want to go to the time and expense of doing it right. I do strop the scraper on a large, wide, leather belt after exposing it to the file. I didn’t mention that, but that doesn’t make me righter than before. I don’t recommend my process to anyone after watching how to do it properly. I’m just not sure I want my opinion messed up by facts. I do lace my Kool-Aid with Cream Soda after all, so perhaps people shouldn’t read this. (off subject … Bondo Gaposis … what a hoot of a name!)

-- Chance Four "Not Just a Second Chance"