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Hand Plane vs Computer

3K views 25 replies 19 participants last post by  miles125 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
In one corner, Bailey #5. Age - 90, weighing in at about 4 3/4 pounds. Technical components, flat sole, removable blade, adjustable frog.

In the opposite corner, Dell laptop. Age - 5, weighing in at about 5.5 pounds. Technical components, motherboard, 2.0 GHZ CPU, 512 MB memory and a 60 gig hard drive.

Contest - Longevity and the usefulness of the technology.

Winner - Bailey #5 hands down.

I can barely even give this old laptop away. Most of those I offered to thought it was too "old."

I work in IT and am always fascinated with the advancement of technology, the ever growing capabilities of the computer and what I can do with it.

But when I see something that's usefulness can never be diminished, I can't help but be impressed even more.

David
 
#3 ·
Ah but David. We DO "upgrade" our hand planes. We "tune" them like you would your laptop. And we "upgrade" their cutting irons and cap irons with aftermarket goodies like you would add an SSD or more memory to a laptop. Still, your point is taken. Even without those upgrades and with a bit of tuning, your #5 will still cut wood well into the 21st century…and beyond. No can do with a laptop.
 
#6 · (Edited by Moderator)
David,

That is an interesting point. As a software developer of way too many years, I am drawn to the opposing properties of woodworking - the physical presence and the longevity of everything from the materials to the tools to the finished products.

Many of my tools and projects will be passed on to my children. Computers represent amazing technology, but are fleeting - just another part of our throw-away world.

Have you checked that Bailey #5 for viruses?
 
#12 ·
My 5C collects dust as my new jack and smoother are in hand. That's not to say it can't be used to great effect, but I have a better love now.
Tools do get older and they also do get better. I'm simply unwilling to go back to the tear out that I experienced so easily before.
The 5? It can be diminished. How many of us use a transitional plane regularly?
gene
 
#13 ·
My apologies, for the following is surely the product of a warped mind….......

Ahhhhhhhhh….....but a different point of view….......

The computer represents and contains knowledge possibly generated, at least in principal, thousands of years ago. It could be used to design manufacturing processes, to produce even better planes, than the Bailey. It has computational power much greater than that used to land men on the moon.

The plane will die. The computer will die. But the intellect embodied in that computer will last for millenia.

So…....you will not outlive the plane. Does that make you inferior to the plane?

Transient organisms, with recorded knowledge…..archived now increasingly, into digital media….....which will outlast written paper bound records…..........by many orders of magnitude…....create increasingly more capable and diverse machines….....even better planes.

But as I sit here, with three computer screens, and three computers humming, ready to do my bidding…...

.....the things I like best about my techie study are….....

.......the keyboard drawer I made myself over 5 years ago out of plywood and heavy duty drawer slides, that has never been finished, because it is constantly in use, and allows me to place a keyboard or a flightsim yoke on it or a racing wheel….....

......and the swiveling three level shelf resting for perfect viewing, for my internet cable modem, router, and switch, built to my needs in my humble shop a few years ago…........

..........and the many little utilities I programmed years ago that make my computer work easier.

Must not trivialize the intellect that went into that mass produced Bailey plane, dependent on the written record of technology, accumulated through the ages, involving metallurgy, engineering, assembly lines….....

OK, OK, OK…......

I know….....'tis somewhat in jest…........but there is a grain of truth there….......

If you have read this far, you must know my latest conversation with David included talking about the next planes I will buy…......

But remember, as you relish the next dish of ice cream, or the taco with sour cream…...all the technology involved in producing it…...and remember it is still totally dependent on cows and their paramours, the bulls, and their spring time antics in the fields….......

......and the wood we use, comes from a plant….......

So….....would you be a woodworking plane, a tree, a computer, a cow, or a bull…..........?...............(-:

With that I rest my…......head on my pillow…...good night.

Jim
 
#14 ·
Great responses all.

I think I am reaching that age where there develops a certain fondness of the past and the way things used to be or what my mind likes to imagine they used to be. I am a physical person, I like to touch things, tinker, know how things work. Things are so virutal these days, even some of my close friends are trapped inside these little boxes :) I got into woodworking because I needed something that had texture, substance, something to physically interact with. It keeps me balanced from losing myself. I am turning into a dinosaur in the modern age, but one with excellent keyboarding skills.

As far as the laptop goes, my son is using it. He is 12. His school is requiring students to have computers. He can't play the latest games on it and it can be used for writing papers. The limitations, in this case, will work well for him.

And, while my plane has not shown any sign of viruses, I do have to check it for bugs. Spiders can be an unpleasant surprise.
 
#15 ·
Yes Jim, but you're not still running a 286, or the even more awesome 486 replacement, which no one will seek out, except maybe a museum curator.
And while the theory that technology makes things better is nice in theory, the reality is, it is applied more in how to make things cheaper, and how to make them last for shorter periods of time.
And the written will last, well after they drop EMPs…
 
#16 ·
yall lost me way back there with Jim my head hurts,got a old desk top computer dont know what it is but has window xp and i have to blow the saw dust out of it once in a while but the planes never clog it up i had my plane laying on its side i thought it might hurt the edge if i just set it down flat and a friend said i was one of those types i said what do you mean he said it was just a rhykenologist joke i dont even know what that is i know i aint been running any fever thou David i will just be glad when get better in this craft
 
#17 ·
Hey David, I used to work with wood for a living, and played with computers, now I do the opposite. I think of it like this. All the information I've gained working with wood and tools through a computer would have taken me a life time without them.
 
#18 ·
Regarding computers, my first one was a Commodore Pet in the 70's. Don't have that for sure anymore. But when I was about 16, back in the 50's, my grandfather gave me some old tools, and there is a couple of those still bouncing around the shop. So although I had to take a contrary point for fun, I definitely agree with what you have said…..

Back to the old grind…..........
 
#19 ·
Hillarious. In fairness, it's a bit of a comparison between apples and oranges-pun intended. My No. 4 SW won't run Sketchup, and my laptop takes forever to smooth even softwoods. The laptop helped me find the #4, learn how to get the iron Scary Sharp, and tune it. The #4 helped me make the table the laptop resides on.

But in the end, the usefullness of one will fade much quicker than the other.
 
#21 ·
My thought is that the plane vs computer might be better thought of as two different comparisons. The hand plane is akin to an abacus - it does one thing simply and well. The computer might be more analogous to the bevy of power tools (not sure which one). They can be set up to do multiple tasks with formatting but there's a newer fancier model with more laser guides etc that will come along as soon as you buy it.
 
#22 ·
I love gadgets and, over the years, I have done much with a computer. I have nothing personal against them. There are times, though, that I think we get a little lost in the virutual world. I performed a little genealogy research a few years ago, I have a collection of photos and family heirlooms that I wanted to associate with the names and faces of my ancestors. I look at all the pictures, film reels, objects and think about the photos and home videos on hard drives, websites, cellphones, etc. and wonder how much might be lost for our next of kin. Books are on kindels, movies are on netflix, music on ipods, friends on social networks, etc.

It is an apples and oranges comparison. But when I spend so much time working on a computer, building programs, running processes, creating online documentation, feeling something that is "real" in my basement at 3 AM listening to music on an old boombox, spinning CDs, the world seems right again. I agree computers are useful tools, I made friends all over the world and my area doesn't offer much for the woodworker. There are tools and materials I would have no clue on how to get without the ability to order online. My knowledge of the craft went up 100 fold because of this site, youtube, and other woodworking resources. But there still is nothing like holding an old tool, fashioned for a specific purpose, and knowing that "purpose" is still a word that has some meaning and has not faded away yet either.

David
 
#24 ·
The computer I bought 7 years ago is now so slow with (MS-)Windows that it is not anymore usable. About 30 minutes to start.

But it is perfectly fine when using a bootable CD with puppy linux on it. Perfect to browse on LJ.

Isn't there a plot to make you buy new computers all the time?
I had to buy a new one because my wife wanted to use Windows.

The obsolecence is built in nowadays. There is a counter in the printer; when it reaches the programmed number of pages it simply refuse to work anyfurther.
 
#25 ·
I have one old computer, 10 years old, still in use, not as a main device, but as a secondary computer with my secondary hobby, flightsim. It runs one of the three screens on my desk. It is still quite usable, running Windows XP. I think the reason it still functions is the high end construction in the first place, with state of the art stuff at the time I bought it. If anything breaks though, it is toast. Just can't get parts to fit the bus structure etc. If it stops working, I may replace the innards, but will more likely just buy a cheaper new one.
 
#26 · (Edited by Moderator)
I think what you're really sensing is the vulnerability of being dependent on others in order to use computer technology. In that it requires thousands of people's ongoing cooperation for me to type and everyone else to read this sentence. A few guys at the local power plant not cooperating and our computers won't even be useful as door stops. The block plane and other basic tools don't have that level of dependence on others.
 
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