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Motor Controller for Dayton Cyclone Dust Collector

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Forum topic by psient posted 04-06-2012 01:40 PM 2876 views 0 times favorited 32 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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psient

63 posts in 1033 days


04-06-2012 01:40 PM

I was hoping someone had experience with designing and building a motor controller for their dust collector. I will probably end up doing this for mine. I’d like to integrate remote control and timing. Anyone have any experience or ideas?

Thanks in advance.


32 replies so far

View BlankMan's profile

BlankMan

1487 posts in 2073 days


#1 posted 04-06-2012 02:13 PM

I have. Did it in industry for a while too. Did my cyclone, band saw, RAS, router table, etc. all with contactors and low voltage 3 wire Start/Stop pushbutton stations which on power failure will not start up when power returns. But there is electrical code to be concerned about and liability. Especially if hard wired. If plugged in and not hard wired maybe code isn’t as much an issue but it still needs to be done right. I didn’t do wireless remote, like I said low voltage 3 wire Start/Stop stations, just safer in my mind, don’t want things starting up because somebody used a cordless phone. I might have schematics someplace have to look, but like I said, liability. You’re dealing with electricity, can be dangerous, 120V, 240V, packs a punch. I used to deal with 480V 3 phase and higher. I saw what can happen when things go wrong. It was controlled testing for UL, but I’ve seen doors blown off enclosures and thick metal buss bar twisted like spaghetti. You have to respect it.

-- -Curt, Milwaukee, WI

View Bill White's profile

Bill White

3532 posts in 2680 days


#2 posted 04-06-2012 02:38 PM

Blankman, I too, would like to see schematics.
Bill

-- bill@magraphics.us

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BlankMan

1487 posts in 2073 days


#3 posted 04-06-2012 06:08 PM

I found what I think is the schematic file I was thinking of. Of course it’s in proprietary format that only the schematic CAD application can read so I’ll have to fire it up tonight and take a look at it. Dated December 2001, wow, it’s been that long…

-- -Curt, Milwaukee, WI

View Mainiac Matt 's profile

Mainiac Matt

4316 posts in 1048 days


#4 posted 04-06-2012 06:52 PM

Jot down the motor name plate data and the blower info. and call up the tech. support line at McMaster-Carr and they should be glad to spec a starter and the correct thermal overload.

They have industrial electrician types on staff that do it all day long….

-- Pine is fine, but Oak's no joke!

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psient

63 posts in 1033 days


#5 posted 04-06-2012 07:31 PM

Thnks Guys!!! Glad you all had something to advise with. I’ll be looking for the information to send along. I am going to go pick it up now.

When I return I’ll have more information.

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BlankMan

1487 posts in 2073 days


#6 posted 04-10-2012 12:27 AM

Bill, had some time so I dug out the schematic, the format is industry standard ladder diagram.

-- -Curt, Milwaukee, WI

View Les 's profile

Les

199 posts in 1410 days


#7 posted 04-20-2012 11:25 AM

Psient,

I use a simple relay with a 120 volt coil and 240 volt, 15 amp contacts. Install the relay in a box and get yourself a rempte control lamp switch. Plug the lamp control switch into a wall outlet and run the wires from it to the relay coil. The lamp switch controls the relay on and off and the remote goes into your pocket of your apron or whatever. You can start and stop from anywhere in the shop.

-- Stay busy....Stay young

View helluvawreck's profile

helluvawreck

15983 posts in 1586 days


#8 posted 04-20-2012 12:09 PM

I have been in maintenance in furniture plants for 40 years. I have built machines in our machine shop and built the control panels for all of them and have trouble shot the electrical controls in our plants. However, I’m not going to help you because of the liability. I just wanted to say just be careful. I assume that your family lives there. When you mess with electricity your playing with fire. Also know that insurance companies are taking a dim view of all kinds of things that they weren’t doing in the passed and are not as easy to get along with as they use to be. Whatever you do my advice is to have a professional electrician work with you on it so that it is up to par and has his stamp of approval on it. You don’t want trouble with your insurance company or your local government in case of a fire. And most important of all you don’t want to take chances with your family. It’s just not worth it. I know first hand what electricity can do.

helluvawreck
https://woodworkingexpo.wordpress.com

-- If a man does not keep pace with his companions, perhaps it is because he hears a different drummer. Let him step to the music which he hears, however measured or far away. Henry David Thoreau

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psient

63 posts in 1033 days


#9 posted 04-20-2012 12:23 PM

Thnks for the advice all!

Les:

Just to make sure I understand: you are basically using a wireless lamp switch to activate/deactivate the relay. I hopped on line to look for a relay but I don’t have the technical knowledge to specify a search for the correct genre of relay.

My specs for the dust collector circuit are:

240 volt 3 PHASE 3hp, I believe the motor is below 15 amps but I don’t have the plate in front of me so I’m guessing for now. This particular unit being 3 phase is a challenge. I did find an outfit that makes a wireless 3 phase 240 volt controller applicable to the dayton. However, I like to expand my understanding in all things woodworking so if you wouldn’t mind, could you elaborate on how to decipher the spec sheets on those relays I did find in my search. Here’s an example:

Square D, 8910DPA43V09, DP Contactor, 208/240VAC, 40A, Definite Purpose, Full Load Amps-Inductive 40, Full Load Amps-Resistive 50, Number of Poles 3, Coil Volts 208/240VAC, 50/60 Hz, Non Reversing, Enclosure Type Open, Height 4.00”, Width 2.50’’, Depth 3.12”, Series C, Standards UL/CSA

Seems like a complete description of the relay. The trouble is I don’t have the background to interpret this. Would this relay work?

Anyway thanks for the input. You guys are tops!

Jon

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psient

63 posts in 1033 days


#10 posted 04-20-2012 12:27 PM

Helluvawreck:

Thanks for the admonishment. I looked at your site/blog. Nice shop. I can only imagine being that organized and tidy.

Jon

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psient

63 posts in 1033 days


#11 posted 04-20-2012 12:29 PM

Blankman:

Wow! This is great! Thank you for sharing with us. I will study this schematic and seek more ability to interpret what it is conveying.

Great help. Thanks again.

Jon

View Retseih's profile

Retseih

27 posts in 1562 days


#12 posted 04-20-2012 01:32 PM

My switch for my dust collector is centrally located so I do not need to do a remote for my dust collector. I am however, trying to automate my blast gates with solenoids and bimba cylinders. Any harm in tapping off the tool switch to trigger a 240 VAC solenoid with a 3 way 2 position actuation? This will actuate a spring return bimba air actuated valve…I’m sure triggering a relay would be a better design, but I’m trying to keep the cost down since I have 6 machines I want to control….seems like I spend way too much time wandering away from machines and forgetting to close blast gates.

Dick

-- Palmer Divide Woodworks--Where steel collides with wood

View BlankMan's profile

BlankMan

1487 posts in 2073 days


#13 posted 04-20-2012 01:41 PM

Jon, I took a quick look at that Square D contactor, good brand, little bit overkill it’s good for 40A you could probably save a little money if you found one that was 25A. It’s 4 pole so that would would but if you found one that was 3 pole with one NO (Normally open) auxiliary contact that would work too and might be less expensive also.

A lot of contactors are made so that you buy and can add auxiliary contacts to them.

Now how are you going to create 3 phase power, static convertor or rotary converter? That would make a difference on how to wire a control circuit. I can provide a 3 phase schematic if I get some time this weekend and a legend.

This link may be helpful in explaining ladder diagrams.

-- -Curt, Milwaukee, WI

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BlankMan

1487 posts in 2073 days


#14 posted 04-20-2012 01:58 PM

Ok my mistake a 8910DPA43V09 is a 3 pole, a 8910DPA44V02 is a 4 pole. If you use a 3 pole you need one NO auxiliary contact for the schematic above or the 8910DPA44V02 4 pole contactor but again you can use a 8910DPA14V02 which is a 25A 4 pole contactor.

-- -Curt, Milwaukee, WI

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BlankMan

1487 posts in 2073 days


#15 posted 04-20-2012 02:05 PM

Ok, looks like auxiliary contact modules are available for Square D 8910DPA line of contactors, the is a 1NO-1NC module (one normally open and one normally closed contacts module) and a 2NO module that snap on to the contactor.

So the 8910DPA14V02 contactor would work with either the 1NO-1NC Square D 9999D11 module or the 2NO Square D 9999D20 module.

-- -Curt, Milwaukee, WI

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