Are Biscuits and Glue the Best Way To Join Wood...?

I don’t think there is such a thing as the “best” way to join wood, because it all depends on the circumstances. Certain types of joinery excel at certain applications. Usually there is more than one type of joint that will work for any given situation. A lot it of has to do with personal preference…. which type of joinery do you find more convenient, easier, better looking… whatever.

Some folks swear by biscuits, some are hooked on pocket screws, some love dowels, and some remain faithful to the good old mortise and tenon. There have been whole books written on the subject. I suggest reading one. Even better, get out to the shop and experiment!

-- Charlie M. "Woodworking - patience = firewood"

The simple answer, it depends on the function that the joint will perform. Most importantly however for me it depends how long do I believe my work will last, years?, perhaps a generation or two or perhaps I believe my work and passion should withstand the test of time. So we have power tools available today, I use them, I will motise with the press if I can, I will ground out a carving with a router where possible, but when I near the end, it is completed the way it has been done for the last few thousand years, my chisels may be made from better steel, but they are used in the same way they have always been. We are all 21st century traditional woodworkers to one extent or another..

-- If knowledge is not shared, it is forgotten.

It’s a whole chorus of “depends on the application”!

I use biscuits for edge-joining, and there I think they’re at least as handy for alignment as they are for strength. For instance, I’m about to lay up a top and some side panels for a shop cabinet out of a bunch of pieces of maple, the widest of which is 5” or so. 3/4” or 1” of solid wood along the edge of veneered plywood is a really easy way to construct fast cabinets. Those are great places to use biscuits.

If I didn’t have a Domino, I might also use biscuits for things like the frames of kitchen cabinets. Most commercial folks use pocket screws for that, I like something with overlap and glue, I think mostly it’s personal choice. And though I shy away from pocket screws, I'll use them where I think they're the most suitable technology (more of the finished product), which is where I want to be able to get something apart again to maintain it.

For chairs, because of the Domino I'm a floating tenon guy, but for various other furniture I like through tenons, because they give a look that’s really nice. And real tenons may be stronger than floating tenons, but generally I’d rather design stuff that doesn’t depend on that difference…

Yeah, pick your tools for the task, and sometimes you close a paint can with a screwdriver ‘cause that’s what you have close at hand, sometimes you use a biscuit where, in a perfect world, you’d do a tenon, because time or whatever dictates that you need to pick that approach.

-- Dan Lyke, Lagunitas California, http://www.flutterby.net/User:DanLyke

That would depend on who you ask and if they are trying to sell you something.

Nothing is best. It all depends on what you are doing.

-- Gary, East TX -- The longest journey begins with a single step.

It’s not best as a replacement for mortise and tenon joints. If you have access to back issues of Fine Woodworking, there was an article on this a couple of years ago. Biscuits were almost at the bottom of the list, right next to dowels.

-- Tim -- http://tmuli.com

I suppose one could talk with the tool makers/suppliers and see what they sell the most. That might provide a clue or two.

Appreciate everyone’s input. I realized before posting that questions like this can provide ambiguous answers. It depends…it depends…it depends.

-- www.NewMexicoSoap.com (My wife is a big time soaper)

biscuits and glue are one of the easiest ways of joining wood (after glue and brads) but now the best. it adds very little strength and it is the glue that is doing most of the holding the biscuits just align it. i love wooden joinery and i would say that it is the best. dovetails, and pinned mortise and tenon are some of the stronger out there and will hold up longer than any mechanical fastener. also other joints like bridle joints and dado’s add a lot more strength. Wooden joinery far surpasses most other forms of joinery and really has the ultimate holding power.

I like biscuits for attaching face frames to plywood cabinets and for alignment. The best part about them is they’re fast. Fast isn’t always good though.

-- What do you learn from being right?

Just out of curiosity…

I’ve never used biscuits primarily because of some reports of the biscuit telegraphing thru the wood down the line. I believe the application was edge joining table top boards.
True?

What do you mean by telegraphing ?

-- What do you learn from being right?

Biscuits are great for quick alignment purposes, but not much more than that. Mortise and tenon joints are the way to go for strength and if you want some cooler looking joints you could use dovetails, dowels, or if you don’t want to see the joints use pocket screws. If you just research a couple you will find that they all have purposes that they excel in and you will find that you’ll like on better than the other. Just try them out and see what you like.

-- Tyler, Illinois

boardman what you are talking about is decompression i think. they expand once they hit the glue making it a tight joint and the whole thing was that with alignment in boards they would bulge the wood up a bit and then you would sand it down all flush and come back later and it had decompressed leaving a divot in your piece. have only heard of it happening a could of times though nothing i would be overly worried about.

Okay That happens when you sand your joints before allowing enough time to dry

-- What do you learn from being right?

Yup – that’s whatI was talking about – the swell/sand/divot deal.

I think that biscuits in my opinion are as much for lining up the wood. The glue really is the holding factor. I know that if you apply the biscuits in to narrow a board you can actually see the biscuit outline in the wood after it swells. a tongue and groove will simulate the same thing. The biscuits are a little quicker if you have a biscuit cutter. I think that’s what might make them better. It’s simply someone’s better idea not that it’s “better” The first made mouse traps can still catch a mouse as well as “A better built” mouse trap. If you get my drift.

-- JJohn

I like my biscuits with a little butter and honey. LOL

-- JJohn

Long grain to long grain glue ups are the strongest woodworking joint. Biscuits are for alignment, some say they weaken a long grain joint. Biscuits are best smothered and covered with gravy.. Yum!!

-- Pat, Colorado

it all depends

-- a legend in my own mind ...

I was not going to post, as this is can lead to a no win type of argument, but… it all depends. As stated, biscuits are made out of compressed beech. They expand on purpose when they get wet with glue. That is why the telegraph through sometimes. That is also why they make a tight joint. For speed and also for plywood, they do a wonderful job (if you don’t want to use screws).

There is an interesting article about a lot of this from Fine Woodworking’s site (subscription required):
http://www.taunton.com/finewoodworking/FWNPDF/011148074.pdf

They test traditional mortise and tenon, square floating tenon, round edge floating tenon and biscuits. Biscuits loose. No surprise here I guess. The winner is traditional followed by rounded end floating tenons, then square edge floating tenons. This was a surprise to me. (This should be good news for Domino fans).

They also tested different dovetail configurations. Tenons beat them for strength, but DTs fail very slowly, so things hold together even with some failure. I guess that makes sense. They also found that the relative size (number) of dovetails and the angle made a difference. Surprisingly wide pins with a 7 degree angle were the most common and also the weakest. Dovetails with narrow pins were, on average, 30% stronger than the ones with wide pins. In order of strength: Narrow pin 7 degree, Standard pin 14 degree, Standard pin 7 degree, and last Wide pin 7 degree.

This is a huge subject that will never have an end.

Steve

-- Stevethepeeve -- I'm no rocket surgeon

After reading and following people like Kelly Mehler, David Marks, and others, I have abandoned the biscuit route. IMHO the biscuits were mainly for alignment purposes. Using Kelly Mehlers technique, I can get close enough with my edge gluing that just some orbital sanding will level out the boards. In the rare case of an uncooporating board, I use clamps to hold it flush.
AS to the original post, I think with a little time you will find your favorite way to make joinery, BUT, you should not abandon the other methods. They all have their places.
For me, building kitchen/bath cabinets, I use pocket screws. For furniture I prefer the loose or floating tenon joint. These are my favorites.

Now if you really want to get your mind blowing, do some research on Japanese joinery techniques-

-- MISSION FURNITURE-My mission is to build furniture