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Feds raid Gibson Guitar for import of exotic Ebony lumber

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Forum topic by Dan posted 08-25-2011 10:37 PM 3735 views 0 times favorited 36 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Dan

3630 posts in 2348 days


08-25-2011 10:37 PM

http://www.wkrn.com/story/15325684/feds-raid-gibson-guitar-corp-in-nashville

Not sure if anyone else saw this yet…

Seems like there are bigger problems then the import of Ebony but thats just my opinion.

-- Dan - "Collector of Hand Planes"


36 replies so far

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Dan

3630 posts in 2348 days


#1 posted 08-25-2011 10:57 PM

They were investigated in 2009n but there were no charges. Looks like this time the feds came in and sent all the workers home…

-- Dan - "Collector of Hand Planes"

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sarahss

258 posts in 2117 days


#2 posted 08-25-2011 11:03 PM

Apparantely, the factory in memphis was raided yesterday but no reason why released yet.

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docholladay

1287 posts in 2527 days


#3 posted 08-25-2011 11:15 PM

Very interesting. My favorite guitar is an old Gibson acoustic made back in 1960.

To be quite honest, while I don’t want companies abusing and using woods till they go into extinction, I really believe that our government and law enforcement agencies have much bigger problems than worrying about whether Gibson uses a little ebony on their guitars.

Doc

-- Hey, woodworking ain't brain surgery. Just do something and keep trying till you get it. Doc

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Loren

8315 posts in 3116 days


#4 posted 08-25-2011 11:22 PM

It’s not the use of ebony that is likely raising red flags, it’s probably
the purchasing of black market ebony stolen from sovereign countries
where it grows and smuggled out.

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Dan Lyke

1510 posts in 3593 days


#5 posted 08-26-2011 12:17 AM

Wow. Someone in Gibson must be screwing up big time, or someone in the Customs & Border Protection Agency has a hard-on for Gibson.

I know a couple of people involved in guitar manufacture, and they’re super super careful to not only make sure that their Lacey Act paperwork is in order, but to know their suppliers and have a personal relationship so that they trust those overseas suppliers to not ship them contraband wood.

Like the other commenters in this thread, I’ll add my voice to the chorus of “being complicit in logging species into extenction is bad”, and even note that this isn’t necessarily about over-logging, but about simple theft of trees. Part of being a good international citizen is keeping a check on the trafficking of stolen goods.

-- Dan Lyke, Petaluma California, http://www.flutterby.net/User:DanLyke

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Bertha

13003 posts in 2161 days


#6 posted 08-26-2011 01:09 AM

^That’s what I was thinking, Dan. Gibson’s in a position to simply charge more for legal ebony. Someone’s got a bone to pick (I liked your expression better);)

-- My dad and I built a 65 chev pick up.I killed trannys in that thing for some reason-Hog

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juniorjock

1930 posts in 3233 days


#7 posted 08-26-2011 01:32 AM

hard-on for Gibson

Don’t think I’ve ever heard that on LumberJocks….............. You know better, Dan.
- JJ

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TopamaxSurvivor

17677 posts in 3144 days


#8 posted 08-26-2011 03:06 AM

Someone definitely wants to get Gibson for some reason; probably didn’t support the right candidate of some office. Too bad the feds don’t go after real problems Merrill Lynch or Goldman Sachs?

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

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David Grimes

2078 posts in 2107 days


#9 posted 08-26-2011 03:19 AM

It is also the fact that it is from Madagascar. It will be a desert island before long instead of what was a rainforest with unique species.

...from Wikipedia…
Deforestation with resulting desertification, water resource degradation and soil loss has affected approximately 94% of Madagascar’s previously biologically productive lands. Since the arrival of humans 2000 years ago, Madagascar has lost more than 90% of its original forest. Most of this loss has occurred since independence from the French, and is the result of local people using slash-and-burn agricultural practices as they try to subsist. Largely due to deforestation, the country is currently unable to provide adequate food, fresh water and sanitation for its fast growing population.
Primary causes of forest loss include
slash-and-burn for agricultural land (a practice known locally as tavy) and for pasture, selective logging for precious woods or construction material, the collection of fuel wood (including charcoal production), and forest clearing for mining.

The slash and burn highlighted above has NOTHING AT ALL TO DO with Slash the guitarist, the fact that he can burn at times or the precious Ebony fretboards that all real les paul’s should have (instead of sissy rosewood or maple). I’m just sayin’... ;=)

-- If you're going to stir the pot, think BIG spoon or SMALL boat paddle. David Grimes, Georgia

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pierce85

508 posts in 2030 days


#10 posted 08-26-2011 05:05 AM

I fought a speeding ticket once by arguing that there were far more important things for the criminal justice system to worry about than my alleged speeding on the highway. For some odd reason, the judge wasn’t impressed with my argument and I had to pay the ticket.

I’m sure this won’t come as a surprise to anyone, but I used to get beat up a lot on the playground :-)

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David Grimes

2078 posts in 2107 days


#11 posted 08-26-2011 05:31 AM

Hmmm. I used to beat up a kid named Pierce on the playground. j/k

-- If you're going to stir the pot, think BIG spoon or SMALL boat paddle. David Grimes, Georgia

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Roz

1693 posts in 3254 days


#12 posted 08-26-2011 05:43 AM

Man I hope that does not drive the price up on they. I am looking to buy one soon. Many of these countries look the other way if a dollar is to be made and don’t really care a wit about thier endangered species but our govenment goes after American business. Gibson must be creating too many jobs.

-- Terry Roswell, L.A. (Lower Alabama) "Life is what happens to you when you are making other plans."

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pierce85

508 posts in 2030 days


#13 posted 08-26-2011 06:03 AM

^who exactly then should the Law Enforcement Division of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service go after? Or is it the enforcement of environmental laws that you find problematic? Regardless, this is what the Law Enforcement Division of the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service does – enforce the environmental laws that Congress enacted.

As others have pointed out, this isn’t Gibson’s first run in with law enforcement regarding alleged violations of the Lacey Act. They’ll be given due process like anyone else accused of violating the law…

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TopamaxSurvivor

17677 posts in 3144 days


#14 posted 08-26-2011 07:02 AM

There is no reasonable expectation of justice in this country any more. You get what you can pay for. No money, you are screwed! King County police are a prefect example. No time to do anything in the south county except set at the bottom of hills on arterials writing tickets to people who aren’t riding their brake all the way down. Speeders going 55 in a residential neighborhood, too bad. All your tools stolen and out of business, too bad. Move to Microsoft Country up near Redmond; have a speeder problem, they are on it now!! Leave your car door open when unloading groceries; they will wake yoiu at 2 AM to see if there was a break in. I know of personal instances of these tings going on for over a decade.

What should Fish and Wildlife be doing? Be transfered to investigating the banking and Wall Street criminals that took down the economy and destroyed millions of peoples live; that’s what!!

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

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pierce85

508 posts in 2030 days


#15 posted 08-26-2011 11:09 AM

Topa, you know that we agree at least in principle on what should be done with the Wall Street criminals. In the best of all possible worlds, I would advocate a more permanent solution but that’s just wishful thinking on my part.

I’m sure Gibson (whether guilty or not) will succeed in purchasing the justice it hopes and expects to receive, like every other corporate body. But there are those extremely rare occasions when the corporate money machine doesn’t succeed, people do go to jail, and big fines are levied. Yeah, it is a joke in the grand scheme of things, barely a drop in the bucket, but it’s something.

What bothers me more are the corporate apologists who want to shield these white-collar criminals from any sort of legal or ethical scrutiny because prices on their favorite goodies just might go up if they’re not allowed to do whatever the hell they please. Don’t piss them off because they might take their ball and go to India or China to play – oh wait, they’re already doing that. See what WE did…

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