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Forum topic by btarb24 posted 10-21-2018 05:00 AM 1094 views 0 times favorited 34 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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btarb24

12 posts in 1680 days


10-21-2018 05:00 AM

Topic tags/keywords: jointer cupping grizzly craftsman calibration

Around 8 months ago I attempted to joint some eight foot boards on my 6” jointer and ended up with some serious cupping. Tried over and over without success. I eventually had given up and ordered a new Grizzly G0490x. I figured the parallelogram bed and spiral cutter would make my life easier. It’s been on backorder ever since.

Fast forward to today.. I got word that the grizzly should finally be coming in on a barge at the end of the month. Unfortunately, Trump is now tacking on a $300 tariff for a $1500 tool. This is rather hard to stomach since I don’t think there even is an american-made jointer I could buy as an alternative. It feels like a forced and unjustified donation to the government.

Due to the tariff I decided to give calibrating the old craftsman one final go. I put in new blades and set them to be within .001 of the outfeed table with a dial caliper. I ran my test boards through 5 times each (on a 1/16th cut) and still ended up with 1/16” cup on each board.. making a whopping 1/8th when mating the boards together.

zero’d to the outfeed

Adjusted each of the 3 brand new knifes so that each end read zero (or within .001 higher)

And here’s the result. Ends touch, but a big gap in the center.

I ran the boards through without putting any downward pressure.. only side pressure toward the fence and enough force to push it through the cutterhead. I’m far from a jointing pro… anyone have any insight into what i might be doing wrong in order to get such poor results? I’d like to eventually get the grizzly, but prefer to keep using the craftsman til the tariffs are rescinded (if i can get it calibrated).


34 replies so far

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AlaskaGuy

4644 posts in 2485 days


#1 posted 10-21-2018 06:44 AM

Have you checked the tables for parallel alignment? If not do so. Hears how.

https://www.woodmagazine.com/tuning-up-your-jointer

How long are you combined jointer tables and, how long is the board are you jointing that you get the big gaps in. Did the jointer ever work right for you?

Edit to add, I always set the dial indicator on the out feed table and use a flat tip/shoe on it.

-- Alaskan's for Global warming!

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btarb24

12 posts in 1680 days


#2 posted 10-21-2018 07:26 AM



It sounds to me like you re clueless and want to blame someone else for your ineptitude. Good luck with that. If you have your jointer set up properly and can t get a straight face on a board, then another jointer isn t going to help you.

- Rich

No need to be a jerk. I clearly stated I wasn’t an expert. I also in no way attempted to blame anyone .. aside from you for your rudeness.

I made several considerations for buying the newer jointer. The longer table of the 8” ought to assist my need to joint boards that are too long to rest on the 6” jointer without the use of rollers. The spiral head will eliminate the need to align the knives. And furthermore, if my wedge tables are out on the 6” then i’m unlikely to want to disassemble and shim. The parallelogram design of the grizzly will make this type of future adjustments a breeze in comparison.

but mostly.. just please be less of a tool. No one appreciates it.

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btarb24

12 posts in 1680 days


#3 posted 10-21-2018 07:39 AM


Have you checked the tables for parallel alignment? If not do so. Hears how.

https://www.woodmagazine.com/tuning-up-your-jointer

How long are you combined jointer tables and, how long is the board are you jointing that you get the big gaps in. Did the jointer ever work right for you?

Edit to add, I always set the dial indicator on the out feed table and use a flat tip/shoe on it.

- AlaskaGuy

Thank you for the constructive reply. I’ve had success with jointing boards 4’ and under. The longer the board, the larger the gap in the center. The boards i’m having trouble with are 8’ oak. The table of the 6” jointer is somewhere around 4.5’ and the board has zero chance to rest fully on the infeed table when starting the cut so i have recruited the assistance of some roller stands. I’ve made countless adjustments to the stands but never get any improved results.

Thanks for the excellent link. I did spend some time checking the table with a proper straight edge and feeler guages during my troubleshooting some 8 months ago. I recall the table having a couple low spots in the centers of the tables and another on the leading edge of the infeed table. It seems that in theory this may be the culprit, but i can’t really tell. I’ll run through the guide you posted to see if i can gather some more info tomorrow.

View pauljuilleret's profile

pauljuilleret

106 posts in 1829 days


#4 posted 10-21-2018 08:57 AM

I have had the same issues when running long stock through my 6 ” jointer what I found was try using some in feed rollers and out feed rollers with the longer stock trying to run it by your self to needs more support mine also was great with the shorter material 4’ and under. The rollers helped a bunch. also a helper for real long material is a bonus.

View Kirk650's profile

Kirk650

574 posts in 924 days


#5 posted 10-21-2018 09:02 AM

The solution to my jointer issue, similar to yours, was to use infeed and outfeed tables. Ridgid used to offer some really good ones. With a bit of adjusting and readjusting the tables, I dialed in the jointing to my needs. I had considered a bigger jointer, but just didn’t have the room for it.

View Holbs's profile

Holbs

1984 posts in 2205 days


#6 posted 10-21-2018 01:45 PM

standard length jointer = nearly impossible to joint 8’ long boards.
longbed jointer = very possible to joint 8’ long boards.
build infeed and outfeed tables

-- The Carpenter Bee is derived from the Ancient Greek word wood-cutter "xylokopos/ξυλοκὀπος"

View lumbering_on's profile

lumbering_on

564 posts in 666 days


#7 posted 10-21-2018 06:29 PM

Just a thought – have you thought about contacting BusyBee in Canada? They sell an identical jointer for $1,600 CDN, which is ~$1,200 USD. If they can ship it to the US without duty, and for a few hundred bucks, that’s the same price as the Grizzly.

https://www.busybeetools.com/products/jointer-8in-3hp-4-knive-cutterhead-csa-cx08.html

View RobS888's profile

RobS888

2502 posts in 2021 days


#8 posted 10-21-2018 06:56 PM


Just a thought – have you thought about contacting BusyBee in Canada? They sell an identical jointer for $1,600 CDN, which is ~$1,200 USD. If they can ship it to the US without duty, and for a few hundred bucks, that s the same price as the Grizzly.

https://www.busybeetools.com/products/jointer-8in-3hp-4-knive-cutterhead-csa-cx08.html

- lumbering_on

I could be mistaken, but after telling Canada and Mexico the steel and aluminum duties of 25% and 10% respectively would stay on until NAFTA was renegotiated, Trump surprisingly hasn’t removed the duties (that are supposed to be for national defense purposes).

So there is probably a duty on the Canadian version as well.

-- I always suspected many gun nuts were afraid of something, just never thought popcorn was on the list.

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lumbering_on

564 posts in 666 days


#9 posted 10-21-2018 07:03 PM


I could be mistaken, but after telling Canada and Mexico the steel and aluminum duties of 25% and 10% respectively would stay on until NAFTA was renegotiated, Trump surprisingly hasn t removed the duties (that are supposed to be for national defense purposes).

So there is probably a duty on the Canadian version as well.

- RobS888

I’m just not sure how the tariffs are working in the US. If it’s strictly country of origin, then there would be a duty. But if it’s country of import, then it could be duty free. The tariffs for Canada and Mexico were only on steel and aluminum, but it doesn’t include finished goods.

View Aj2's profile

Aj2

1802 posts in 1974 days


#10 posted 10-21-2018 07:49 PM

The best way to get a jointer that’s satisfys the needs of a hobbyist is the used market.
You get to inspect the machine before you take it home. There’s a good chance you’ll be getting a lot more machine then anything new.
If you stick with the craft of making stuff from wood your going to eventually need to wrench on your machine’s.
Might as well get one that’s worth fixing.
I’m not a fan of grizzly machines they are just copys of what’s already out there.
I do agree with the tariffs it’s about time.

-- Aj

View btarb24's profile

btarb24

12 posts in 1680 days


#11 posted 10-21-2018 08:24 PM



Just a thought – have you thought about contacting BusyBee in Canada? They sell an identical jointer for $1,600 CDN, which is ~$1,200 USD. If they can ship it to the US without duty, and for a few hundred bucks, that s the same price as the Grizzly.

https://www.busybeetools.com/products/jointer-8in-3hp-4-knive-cutterhead-csa-cx08.html

- lumbering_on

Thanks for sharing the busyBee link for the Craftex brand. I’ve never heard of them but they appear to be identical to the grizzly variants. That particular one lacks the spiral cutterhead. This one here would be the equiv link from BusyBee. Comes in at $1525usd($1999cad) vs the grizzly at $1830
https://www.busybeetools.com/products/8in-jointer-helical-cutter-cx08hc.html

It appears that the busyBee site will only ship to Canada, so that $300 savings might be eaten up rather quickly by a shipping forwarder.. i checked a few and none of them would accept a 700lb parcel.

As a consumer, I’m ok with the tariffs as long as there is an american alternative available. However, i suppose that if they stick around for the long term then it might drive new american businesses to sprout up and fill the void caused by people who refuse to pay the tariff. However, that’d be a pretty risky business venture since if the tariffs ever got rescinded you would immediately become out priced again. I do kind of wonder what an equiv american-made clone of these cast iron tools would cost.

View lumbering_on's profile

lumbering_on

564 posts in 666 days


#12 posted 10-21-2018 09:13 PM


Thanks for sharing the busyBee link for the Craftex brand. I ve never heard of them but they appear to be identical to the grizzly variants. That particular one lacks the spiral cutterhead. This one here would be the equiv link from BusyBee. Comes in at $1525usd($1999cad) vs the grizzly at $1830
https://www.busybeetools.com/products/8in-jointer-helical-cutter-cx08hc.html

It appears that the busyBee site will only ship to Canada, so that $300 savings might be eaten up rather quickly by a shipping forwarder.. i checked a few and none of them would accept a 700lb parcel.

As a consumer, I m ok with the tariffs as long as there is an american alternative available. However, i suppose that if they stick around for the long term then it might drive new american businesses to sprout up and fill the void caused by people who refuse to pay the tariff. However, that d be a pretty risky business venture since if the tariffs ever got rescinded you would immediately become out priced again. I do kind of wonder what an equiv american-made clone of these cast iron tools would cost.

- btarb24

From what I’ve heard the owners of Grizzly and Busy Bee are brothers, so they carry a lot of the same items. I have no clue what you would buy down there as equivalent as almost nothing for woodworking is made in North America. General used to be made in Montreal, but they closed that and now make it overseas as General International. Lie Nielsen is made in MA, but last time I checked hand planes don’t come with plugs.

It’s even hard to imagine that they’d open a new factory considering that steel and aluminum is now the most expensive anywhere on the planet.

View tmasondarnell's profile

tmasondarnell

101 posts in 1965 days


#13 posted 10-22-2018 12:54 AM



Have you checked the tables for parallel alignment? If not do so. Hears how.

https://www.woodmagazine.com/tuning-up-your-jointer

How long are you combined jointer tables and, how long is the board are you jointing that you get the big gaps in. Did the jointer ever work right for you?

Edit to add, I always set the dial indicator on the out feed table and use a flat tip/shoe on it.

- AlaskaGuy

I would also recommend the Wood Whisper’s video on squaring up the jointer. Given the cupping, I would be looking at the outfeed table to ensure that all four corners are co-planer and parallel to the knives.

View tmasondarnell's profile

tmasondarnell

101 posts in 1965 days


#14 posted 10-22-2018 12:54 AM


Have you checked the tables for parallel alignment? If not do so. Hears how.

https://www.woodmagazine.com/tuning-up-your-jointer

How long are you combined jointer tables and, how long is the board are you jointing that you get the big gaps in. Did the jointer ever work right for you?

Edit to add, I always set the dial indicator on the out feed table and use a flat tip/shoe on it.

- AlaskaGuy

I would also recommend the Wood Whisper’s video on squaring up the jointer. Given the cupping, I would be looking at the outfeed table to ensure that all four corners are co-planer and parallel to the knives.

View Kazooman's profile

Kazooman

1216 posts in 2128 days


#15 posted 10-22-2018 01:22 AM

I am wondering about your comment: “I ran the boards through without putting any downward pressure.. only side pressure toward the fence and enough force to push it through the cutterhead”. Initially, the piece should be firmly on the infeed table so that it is not rising up at the edge entering the cutter head due to the weight of the length of material hanging over the back edge. On the way out, it should be held firmly down to the outfeed table for the same reason. If the leading edge is too high due to the long piece hanging off the end of the infeed table and then the trailing edge is too high due to the long piece hanging off the edge of the outfeed table you would get exactly what you describe. A piece that has high spots on both ends.

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