I splotched my strip of maple, also the sanding sealer (varathane brand) isn't really drying - my 220 and 320 grip paper seems like it's gumming up a little. I set the piece in the sun today for 30 mins 65 degrees but I didn't want to do that for too long. Didn't seem to work. The sanding sealer is one light coat foamed brushed on over 2 light coats of Watco Danish Oil that dried over 12 hours.
It was mid 50's in my garage so was the wood too cold? Sanding sealer can says no lower than 50 or 55 - can't remember.
Should I let it dry more? Should I take it down to bare wood and start over? Will the splotch come out or is that from the Danish Oil?
Sorry for so many questions and thanks for the answers.
Read about blotch control here.. The watco caused the blotching, and it will not go away. Surface will have to be stripped. Why are you using sanding sealer? The watco seals the surface, no need for it. What is your finish schedule (steps)?
You really did your applications backward. The sanding sealer (which is nothing more than a very thin film finish) should have went on first. As OSU55 said, now you have blotch and there's not a practical way to remove it. I suspect everything will cure, but it may take a while.
Can I just sand to bare wood or do I physically need to use a liquid stripper?
Read about blotch control here.. The watco caused the blotching, and it will not go away. Surface will have to be stripped. Why are you using sanding sealer? The watco seals the surface, no need for it. What is your finish schedule (steps)?
If it is cured, it will sand out. It take a long time to cure enough to sand, and may not be ready this weekend. I say this with love in my heart: but you're going to make a bigger mess with your attempts to"fix" this.
What is the solution then? Since my attempts at sanding as originally planned failed - there seems to be some scratching at the surface. I'm not going to scrap the piece. Sand those scratches out and lacquer or poly it and be done?
I won't be able to get to it until this weekend. If it is cured will it sand out? Dont really feel like stripping.
You won t be able to sand it back until it cures. The stripper will get it off more quickly.
- Fred Hargis
- tsbot
If it is cured, it will sand out. It take a long time to cure enough to sand, and may not be ready this weekend. I say this with love in my heart: but you re going to make a bigger mess with your attempts to"fix" this.
Here is what I did when I had to refinish a table top because of finish problems.
Try setting it out in the sun and wipe it down with a clean rag after a couple hours. It will be sticky, but keep rubbing and switching the cloth until is rubs smoothly. That will help get excess sealer and Watco off the wood.
You CAN sand everything off, even if it isn't dry/cured. You will just go through more sandpaper than you might otherwise. I'd start with some 220 grit so you don't take off too much too fast. Check the paper often and when it gets loaded up with finish toss it and put new paper on. Stay away from stripper as it will just make a bigger mess.
You can put sealer on, let it dry, then watco, let it dry for 72 hours or more, then use poly (arm-r-coat). Lightly sand between coats with 320 grit paper and wipe off any nubs.
Thanks! I'm invested and this is a special desk for my wife so I want it perfect (hence the sanding sealer I never used which I though would help with the finish). I'll sand it back down to wood and am not worried about how much paper I use.
What will help prevent blotching on the maple after I start all over?
My Plan:
Sand it all the way off
Danish Oil or otherwise
Wipe on Poly or Spray on Lacquer - any opinions on this?
Here is what I did when I had to refinish a table top because of finish problems.
Try setting it out in the sun and wipe it down with a clean rag after a couple hours. It will be sticky, but keep rubbing and switching the cloth until is rubs smoothly. That will help get excess sealer and Watco off the wood.
You CAN sand everything off, even if it isn t dry/cured. You will just go through more sandpaper than you might otherwise. I d start with some 220 grit so you don t take off too much too fast. Check the paper often and when it gets loaded up with finish toss it and put new paper on. Stay away from stripper as it will just make a bigger mess.
You can put sealer on, let it dry, then watco, let it dry for 72 hours or more, then use poly (arm-r-coat). Lightly sand between coats with 320 grit paper and wipe off any nubs.
Sealer is what you use before adding any other finish to help the wood absorb the top coats more evenly. It helps, for example, with blotching on woods like maple and cherry. Blotching occurs because some areas of the wood absorb more finish than others. Adding a thinned seal coat and then lightly sanding back adds some finish to those areas, so subsequent top coats sit evenly on the wood.
You can use a very thin coat of poly or lacquer, or a thin cut of shellac, or thinned out PVA glue, or….
Given everything, I'd probably lean toward wipe on poly, as it's pretty foolproof. But you can't rush any finish. Whatever finish you use, you have to follow the directions for subsequent coats and top coating.
Sealer is what you use before adding any other finish to help the wood absorb the top coats more evenly. It helps, for example, with blotching on woods like maple and cherry. Blotching occurs because some areas of the wood absorb more finish than others. Adding a thinned seal coat and then lightly sanding back adds some finish to those areas, so subsequent top coats sit evenly on the wood.
You can use a very thin coat of poly or lacquer, or a thin cut of shellac, or thinned out PVA glue, or….
Given everything, I d probably lean toward wipe on poly, as it s pretty foolproof. But you can t rush any finish. Whatever finish you use, you have to follow the directions for subsequent coats and top coating.
My belief is you will still have those blotches after you remove the finish, perhaps my term "ground zero" was the wrong one to use. You will likely have to remove a fair amount f wood to remove the blotching.
Based on my experience, sanding everything back down then using a sanding sealer should drastically reduce the blotching issue. I'm not sure what the watco will accomplish unless it is a stain. With walnut, using a dark walnut stain makes the wood so dark that you lose some of the shimmer and other interesting patterns.
Wipe on poly is really thin and not especially durable. Arm-R-Seal gives a really durable finish that you can wipe on or brush on.
If you were so inclined, General Finishes also makes Seal-a-cell, a sanding sealer that can also be used as a sealer and and first "finish" coat, followed by a coat or 2 of Arm-R-Seal, some good wax, and buffed out. I wait 24 hours between applications, lightly sand between coats with 600 grit. That is my go-to finish process for desk tops.
+1 card scraper would be a big help if you have one. A paint scraper used judiciously can work. Chemical stripper if you cant wait. As mentioned the blotching will be relatively deep. If you have the tools - card scraper to get soft finish off, then a smoother plane to get to uncolored wood.
Read the blotch control blog. Then use danish oil, stain or whatever to color. If a dining table dont use lacquer, if not spray precat lacquer. If a dining table or you dont have spray equipment wipe on poly will work well.
Thanks - yes I do have a card scraper. It's a desktop for the wife. I bought the Watco spray lacquer - will this be ok on top of the Danish Oil or should I wipe on poly?
+1 card scraper would be a big help if you have one. A paint scraper used judiciously can work. Chemical stripper if you cant wait. As mentioned the blotching will be relatively deep. If you have the tools - card scraper to get soft finish off, then a smoother plane to get to uncolored wood.
Read the blotch control blog. Then use danish oil, stain or whatever to color. If a dining table dont use lacquer, if not spray precat lacquer. If a dining table or you dont have spray equipment wipe on poly will work well.
+1 card scraper would be a big help if you have one. A paint scraper used judiciously can work. Chemical stripper if you cant wait. As mentioned the blotching will be relatively deep. If you have the tools - card scraper to get soft finish off, then a smoother plane to get to uncolored wood.
Read the blotch control blog. Then use danish oil, stain or whatever to color. If a dining table dont use lacquer, if not spray precat lacquer. If a dining table or you dont have spray equipment wipe on poly will work well.
Wipe it down with naphtha or paint thinner. That will help dry it and make it easier to sand. Yes you can put lacquer over the oil once it dries, but getting an even finish on a surface that size with aerosol will be a challenge. A wiping varnish might be more manageable.
My favorite blotch control is 1 part white glue to 6 parts distilled water. Brush it on liberally, let it set a couple of hours and sand with 320 or 400 to knock off the raised grain. A second application might be needed and that's where doing test boards is critical. The thing with your table is that, while the maple needs some blotch control, I wouldn't want to use it on the sapele. It won't blotch, and you really want that oil penetration to bring out the chatoyance. Tough call. How you proceed is up to you.
In the future, adding a metallic drier to your oil will help given the lower temperature you're working at. Your local Sherwin Williams store probably will have a can of Japan drier. Only add it to what oil you are going to use at a time. A milliliter per ounce of oil is all you need.
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