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Forum topic by Blackfin29 posted 09-14-2018 12:29 AM 655 views 0 times favorited 20 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Blackfin29

28 posts in 347 days


09-14-2018 12:29 AM

so just took delivery of my new router table and lift and I read in the manual that “above the table bit changes are not possible with a Bosch 1617?” due to the short motor length on this router lift??

Is this true?

Would offset bits remedy this?


20 replies so far

View Rich's profile

Rich

3768 posts in 767 days


#1 posted 09-14-2018 01:37 AM

I can do above table changes with my JessEm and the 1617 using the standard Bosch wrenches. Maybe you can get two of the offset wrenches.

-- Half of what we read or hear about finishing is right. We just don’t know which half! — Bob Flexner

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Andybb

1390 posts in 781 days


#2 posted 09-14-2018 05:21 PM

As I have an original PRL and use the offset wrenches I initially thought that wasn’t true but I just called WP as I had considered upgrading my original PRL to the version 2. No above the table bit changes with the newer lift. That would be a deal breaker for me. They said the same for the Porter Cable too. Surprised they would do that for two very popular router models.

-- Andy - Seattle USA

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Rich

3768 posts in 767 days


#3 posted 09-14-2018 05:42 PM


Surprised they would do that for two very popular router models.

- Andybb

Me too, Andy. So with the new version you can’t even do above table changes with offset wrenches? I don’t get it. Are you supposed to lift the plate out of the table or something?

-- Half of what we read or hear about finishing is right. We just don’t know which half! — Bob Flexner

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JRsgarage

305 posts in 687 days


#4 posted 09-14-2018 05:49 PM

Seems to defeat the purpose of a lift. Lifting the plate to change bits would be a major pain…better without a lift

-- Two is One, One is None

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Blackfin29

28 posts in 347 days


#5 posted 09-14-2018 05:57 PM

This is interesting because in the literature it reads “offset wrenches, or collet extenders help” in above the table changes…

I’m a bit pissed off having just spent over a grand on this thing only to find this out….. NEVER heard a word of this until I read the manual.

Wouldn’t this news have spread quicker? am I the only guy to read the manual? I don’t fully believe it yet…

The product is nice.. actually if it means I buy a compatible router to be this quality I probably would do it.

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Andybb

1390 posts in 781 days


#6 posted 09-14-2018 06:37 PM

Even though I talked to them today I am still skeptical. Even with the router all the way down I can still reach the collet nuts with the offset wrenches. If the bit is high enough to use on the table I just can’t see how it can’t be reached and changed with the offset wrenches. Hmmm.

Yes, I would think somebody would have mentioned this before. Hopefully somebody with a V2 and a Bosch or PC will comment.

-- Andy - Seattle USA

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Blackfin29

28 posts in 347 days


#7 posted 09-14-2018 08:40 PM

So I just spoke to Woodpecker’s Customer Service. They claim offset wrenches make it possible, and/or a collet extender (Which I’m not loving).

Let’s hope someone chimes in with a Bosch 1617 in use… at this point I’m happy with the product, and would buy a different router motor if needed honestly. BUT still worth knowing.

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Kirk650

576 posts in 926 days


#8 posted 09-14-2018 10:59 PM

I have a PC router in my router table, and I can raise and lower the router bit from above the table. I can also use the offset wrenches to change router bits. I have a plate that allows me to remove a good bit of the plate to get to the bit. I think it’s a Rousseau (spelling). I can’t get the bit above the plate/table, but that isn’t a problem.

I have two 1617’s that I use for other jobs. I got the PC specifically because it was highly recommended for router table use.

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Blackfin29

28 posts in 347 days


#9 posted 09-14-2018 11:46 PM



I have a PC router in my router table, and I can raise and lower the router bit from above the table. I can also use the offset wrenches to change router bits. I have a plate that allows me to remove a good bit of the plate to get to the bit. I think it’s a Rousseau (spelling). I can’t get the bit above the plate/table, but that isn’t a problem.

I have two 1617’s that I use for other jobs. I got the PC specifically because it was highly recommended for router table use.

- Kirk650

Thanks, Kirk.

So is your LIFT a Woodpeckers PRL V2? This is “problem” I’m suspecting is unique to that specific lift/plate.


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Kirk650

576 posts in 926 days


#10 posted 09-15-2018 04:30 PM

With the PC routers, and the Bosch 1617’s, you don’t actually need a lift. The routers can be raised and lowered from above the table. In my first homemade router table I had the router attacked to a rectangular plate that was in place of the router base. I just lifted out the router and plate and changed bits. The fancier router table I have now has the PC router attached to a similar rectangular flat plate (maybe I can get the name of it) that has round inserts that snap into place. I use the ‘crank’, supplied by PC, to raise the bit as high as it will go, snap out the round inserts and use the offset wrenches to loosen the Collet and remove the bit. Easier to do than it is to write this. Let me see if I can find the model of the router table plate I use.

Yep, it’s the Rousseau Router Base Plate, for the grand sum of $8.99 at Woodcraft. Looks to be the same one as Klingspor’s for $44. Woodpeckers has one for $120 that has more snap in parts that will fit more sizes of router bits, but I have no problems with the one I have. Unscrew the Base plate on your router and replace with the Rousseau. Might need to drill and countersink a hole or two. Instructions with the plate will show you all you need to know for installation. And buy a remote shutoff for the router, so you can turn it on and off without having to reach under the table.

Oops, I lied. The $8.99 is for the centering kit. The Base Plate Insert (model 3509) itself is $56. Sorry about that. Maybe the Klingspor at $44 is a better deal. Anyway, except for my pricing mistake, the rest of what I said is workable.

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Rich

3768 posts in 767 days


#11 posted 09-15-2018 06:12 PM


With the PC routers, and the Bosch 1617’s, you don’t actually need a lift.

- Kirk650

I knew one of these “you don’t need a lift” replies would come along sooner or later. There is no comparison between a real high-end router lift and a router mounted to a plate. Zero. There’s a reason those lifts like JessEm and WP cost what they do. They’re built like tanks to handle the heaviest loads without flexing. Try making a stick cut in a 1-3/4” door stile in one pass without one. Actually, don’t try — it would be dangerous.

Besides that, the precision in the adjustment is in another league as well. Most, like the JessEm have a split nut on the lead screw that can be set for zero backlash. Even as it wears, you can reset it for no backlash.

There are many other advantages as well. The bottom line is, if your setup meets your needs, that’s great. It wouldn’t meet mine.

-- Half of what we read or hear about finishing is right. We just don’t know which half! — Bob Flexner

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Kirk650

576 posts in 926 days


#12 posted 09-15-2018 07:16 PM

Well…the truth is that ya don’t NEED a lift. Buy one if you want to, or if you are doing something that does indeed require one. I don’t do house type doors, and if I did I’d use my shaper and not the router. I don’t need a lift, and haven’t for 20 years of woodworking.

And do we really benefit from your suggesting that folks with no router lift are to be held in contempt?

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Rich

3768 posts in 767 days


#13 posted 09-15-2018 07:18 PM


And do we really benefit from your suggesting that folks with no router lift are to be held in contempt?

- Kirk650

Your words, not mine.

-- Half of what we read or hear about finishing is right. We just don’t know which half! — Bob Flexner

View Blackfin29's profile

Blackfin29

28 posts in 347 days


#14 posted 09-19-2018 04:33 PM

The verdict is in…. after 2 days of assembling this entire kit I am finally happy to say that the 1617 collet IS INDEED accessible from above the table during bit changes. NO idea why they would say that. Sure your lower jam-nut wrench will be tilted but do-able. However, the angle over time might compromise that jam-nut so I bought some offset wrenches and it’s overkill. IT CAN BE DONE.

Why would Woodpeckers make that claim? Or sort of make that claim.. I’ve only seen it in the owners manual.

One other issue… a $1000+ router table set up and it turns out they no longer provide the bolts to mount the lift to the phenolic table? Woodpeckers as usual, is awesome and is sending out 4 because I asked. BUT they told me they no longer supply them because the lift itself is heavy enough? Anyone buying that?

Overall SKOOOOOKUM rig…. Solid.

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Andybb

1390 posts in 781 days


#15 posted 09-19-2018 07:50 PM


Woodpeckers as usual, is awesome and is sending out 4 because I asked. BUT they told me they no longer supply them because the lift itself is heavy enough? Anyone buying that?

- Blackfin29

At least for the PRL that is absolutely true. It weighs at least 25-30 lbs and will not move and does not need hold downs. Can’t speak to the newer ones as the specs say that version 2 is only 14 lbs.

-- Andy - Seattle USA

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