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Will this foundation work?

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Forum topic by Hugh Anderson posted 07-31-2011 11:38 PM 1160 views 0 times favorited 14 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Hugh Anderson

49 posts in 2151 days


07-31-2011 11:38 PM

Maybe I should have posted this in a previous deck topic I created – different question though. :-)

I have been very indecisive about what to do with my deck replacement. The old one was rotten, and had previously been repaired (or so it looks like) Here is a couple of pics to show how bad it was.

The third image shows one of the foundation piers. It would be so much easier to use these than to start again. But what are my options.

Well, I figured that I would drill into the concrete to fix a post anchor – but examination of another (damaged) post shows metal reinforcing poles. The reinforcing would have to be in the center, and I would have to drill down it’s center hole. Risky maybe?

The original deck just sat on the concrete – is that still an option? It’s not one that I relish, but as you can see, the deck is pretty much ground level.

Anyone have any suggestions???

Thanks!!!!

Hugh


14 replies so far

View Mark Shymanski's profile

Mark Shymanski

5314 posts in 3172 days


#1 posted 08-01-2011 05:28 AM

About how big around are the concrete piers? Was the reinforcing rod around the perimeter or scattered throughout the pier? How many piers do you have to work with? How high off the ground do you want the new deck to be?

-- "Checking for square? What madness is this! The cabinet is square because I will it to be so!" Jeremy Greiner LJ Topic#20953 2011 Feb 2

View Hugh Anderson's profile

Hugh Anderson

49 posts in 2151 days


#2 posted 08-01-2011 06:55 PM

Thanks for the replies guys. To answer the questions, the deck is only a couple of inches off the ground at the house side, and about 9 inches at the front. Size will be 23.75’ along the house by 13’ projection. The piers are 6’ apart (both directions) so looks like plenty of support. Each is 6.5 inches across.

Here is a pic of a pier that is outwit the proposed new area, with a little crumbling of the concrete – you can see the reinforcing.

@ NotVeryGood – A couple of quick questions if that’s ok.

1. Gravity works as an accepted method??? The original deck was just sitting on the piers, didn’t know if it would be acceptable as a new method.

2. Shimming the deck – what’s considered acceptable for the shims? And what about securing them? I will go off and see if I can find a detail on this, but any info would be appreciated.

Thank you so much!!!!

Hugh

View Bertha's profile

Bertha

13003 posts in 2152 days


#3 posted 08-01-2011 06:57 PM

The piers look pretty good to me. Any idea how deep they’re planted?

-- My dad and I built a 65 chev pick up.I killed trannys in that thing for some reason-Hog

View Hugh Anderson's profile

Hugh Anderson

49 posts in 2151 days


#4 posted 08-01-2011 09:11 PM

Not sure how deep the posts are, I dug down over three feet at the side of one and it was still going.

Ok, so my mind is about to spontaneously combust. :)

I can run my ledger along the house, I can support the side and front beams of the concrete piers, but what about those supports within the structure? I for example I run a joist parallel to the house (on the six feet out piers) then I can’t have by joists running a full twelve feet out from the house – the will be interrupted by the division. Otherwise I will have 12 foot long joists only supported at either end. Is that acceptable?

It would mean that only some joists would have the middle support.

Hugh

View olddutchman's profile

olddutchman

187 posts in 3394 days


#5 posted 08-01-2011 10:02 PM

I know that this is not an excepted method, but under the circumstances, I think I would cut a flat plate to stand on the post, and put a ledge on the plate that holds it in place, no sliding when building. A good adhesive for treated wood could be put on the cement to squeeze out around the piere surround the post as to trap the pole and keep the moisture out. I know it’s not the proper way, but I think it would work perfectly! The only other thing that You could do is to break the cement from around the top, to expose the re rod about a foot . make a tube, or fine one that will slide around the cement thats there. That would allow You to bring the piers up 6-12 inches, and set the plate in place!

-- Saved, and so grateful, consider who Created it ALL!!!

View Hugh Anderson's profile

Hugh Anderson

49 posts in 2151 days


#6 posted 08-01-2011 10:35 PM

Re my last question, here is a rough sketch of the planned deck. There are concrete piers on the left and right sides – I just wanted to show where the piers are falling within the area. This is my problem, how to use them as supports. There is not enough height for a beam to be under the joists. In any case, the concrete is all at the same height.

@ olddutchman – thanks for the suggestion, but raising things up won’t work at all.

Hugh

View MOJOE's profile

MOJOE

548 posts in 2728 days


#7 posted 08-02-2011 04:00 AM

Since it appears that the deck framing is anchored to the existing masonry wall, there no need to anchor to the piers. Keep in mind, you will need to make sure the frame is rigid against lateral movements. If you still seem nervous about letting is “float”, I suggest you anchor to the front-center pier by drilling into the top of the pier and then a matching hole into the bottom of the frame…..kinda like a pin to hold things steady in all directions.

-- Measuring twice and cutting once only works if you read the tape correctly!

View Moron's profile

Moron

5032 posts in 3353 days


#8 posted 08-02-2011 04:16 AM

what climate zone do live in?

I suspect that given that the piers are still visible, that they are not forced up from frost and tides………….that they are good to go

but what do i know

liability changes when you mess with things you know not enough about

-- "Good artists borrow, great artists steal”…..Picasso

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Moron

5032 posts in 3353 days


#9 posted 08-02-2011 04:21 AM

as rule of thumb

you shouldnt canti-lever a deck more then one quarter its span, past the point of being supported on a bearing wall………( I disagree as there are too many variables but thats the thumb rule)………..in any direction

-- "Good artists borrow, great artists steal”…..Picasso

View Hugh Anderson's profile

Hugh Anderson

49 posts in 2151 days


#10 posted 08-02-2011 04:46 AM

:-) yeah, I would consider myself a competent DIY’er, but when I am getting into something for the first time I tend to check, double check, then triple check my intentions. And still there is room for screw ups!!! :-)

So, here is where I am at. Rather than fixing a ledger and trying to get it level with the existing piers, I am going to build the outer frame floating loose, level it, then bolt the ledger.

I’m going to install a beam, running left to right on the plan posted above, to sit on the piers showing closest to the house (that’s 6’ out) Then I will run the joists out in two sections, using hangers.

Sound like a plan? Thanks!

Hugh

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Moron

5032 posts in 3353 days


#11 posted 08-02-2011 07:08 AM

get a building permit

once the city signs over, liability becomes theirs

-- "Good artists borrow, great artists steal”…..Picasso

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Moron

5032 posts in 3353 days


#12 posted 08-02-2011 07:09 AM

the rest is “hear say”

: )

-- "Good artists borrow, great artists steal”…..Picasso

View devann's profile

devann

2200 posts in 2152 days


#13 posted 08-02-2011 07:51 AM

Hugh, your beams should run from the house to the outside edge of the deck. Joist should run parallel to the house. This will allow for the deck boards to be shorter, no butt joints in the deck boards and improves drainage from the house and off the deck boards.

-- Darrell, making more sawdust than I know what to do with

View Hugh Anderson's profile

Hugh Anderson

49 posts in 2151 days


#14 posted 08-03-2011 04:23 AM

@ devann – thanks, that’s exactly what I will do. Gentlemen, thank you all for the sound advice. I did all the ground prep today, off to order the timber tomorrow. :-)

Oh, a quick one if I may – best method to join beams? The almost 24’ will mean joining the ledger and the header. Bearing in mind I am sitting on concrete piers, so I have no posts to bolt to. Actually, the projections are also a little long at 15’.

Due to my lack of available height I was going to use double up 2×6’s.

Hugh

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