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Forum topic by Safetyboy posted 03-29-2008 03:50 PM 1619 views 3 times favorited 21 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Safetyboy

119 posts in 2415 days


03-29-2008 03:50 PM

Topic tags/keywords: question

LOML walked into my shop the other day, looked at the cloud of dust floating around, and promptly gave approval for the purchase of a dust collection system – whoopee!

I have a 10’x19’ shop in half of our garage… 110V only… basic tablesaw, jointer, planer, router table & CMS. I don’t ever run more than one machine at a time… but I would like to be able to set things up so I wasn’t always connecting & disconnecting hoses when I want to work on a different machine (I jump around on machines a lot – not very good yet at doing everything perfect the first time through). So right now, the plan is:

—Jet 1-1/2 HP Canister dust collector (this one: http://tinyurl.com/2v564f) – $500 after rebate on Amazon.
—Jet Air Filter (this one: http://tinyurl.com/yux5tu) – $200 after rebate on Amazon.
—Enough flexible hoses & blast gates for the 3 big machines.

What do you all think? Overdoing it/underdoing it? Something important I’m leaving out?

I’m not sure where I’ll put the dang thing yet, but that’s another problem…

-- -- Kevin in Mentor, Ohio


21 replies so far

View Manderson's profile

Manderson

13 posts in 2683 days


#1 posted 03-29-2008 04:16 PM

I went out last year and bought the the same configuration that you are after now. I have both 110 and 220 and read all the books too and ended up with the jet 1.5 hp and 2 air filters…one a jet and one a jds.

My recommendations:

- get the jet it does a great job and its pretty quiet. Get the canister and handle filter.
- don’t bother with the air filter. I went out and bought 2 one jds and one jet for my garage. They are loud and they don’t reduce “visible dust” that much. If you are worried about your lungs…then go for it.
- I’d rather spend the cash on a box fan with a cheap and a quiet shop vac or a upgraded 2 hp jet.

You are definitely NOT over doing it , though one thing…keep your flexible hose short with a 1 1/2 and dump your bag ALOT about 1/4 of the way full..why…cause it allows it to suck more…and sometimes sucking is a good thing.

View Fireball's profile

Fireball

65 posts in 2724 days


#2 posted 03-29-2008 04:17 PM

Kevin,

When I did research to make the same purchases you did, I came across some very favorable reviews for the JDS air cleaner. I’ve got one in my shop now and am very happy with it, although I have no direct experience with the Jet unit.

Also, when I bought a dust collector I relied heavily on the finewoodworking review that ranked the Delta 50-760 as the best. I’m certainly happy with it and its a good bit cheaper than the jet unit (I actually bought mine on sale from Lowe’s for under $300). The delta comes with a 1 micron bag. I am not sure what exactly the advantages of the cannister filter are over a bag, so perhaps someone can chime in.

Either way, you’ll be thrilled to have a much cleaner workspace – not to mention cleaner lungs!

View Peter Oxley's profile

Peter Oxley

1426 posts in 2531 days


#3 posted 03-29-2008 04:18 PM

I don’t know if you can overdo dust collection. My only concern would be the number of electrical circuits in your workspace. If you are on a single circuit, the dust collector and one machine might draw 20 amps. My DC and planer occasionally kick a 20 amp breaker when they are on the same circuit.

-- http://www.peteroxley.com -- http://north40studios.etsy.com --

View dalec's profile

dalec

613 posts in 2545 days


#4 posted 03-29-2008 04:19 PM

I am near completing the setting up my dust collection system in my garage. I got the Jet Air Filteration System along with a Delta 1-1/2HP dust collector. Working in 1/2 of a garage w/o some dust collection system means a lot of thing cleaning up after each day in the garage.

I decided to add two dedicated 110v (120v) circuits to the garage to handle the electrical load from the dust collector and the TS. I had been using a shop vac and TS using the existing garage circuit, but was concerned about the electrical load on that one circuit. The TS and DC each draw 15 amps. So you may want to look at the electrical demands in your garage.

I have no plans to put in a fixed hose system. I have gotten a second stage separator and 30 gal metal trash can to cut down on the amount of heavier stuff from passing into the DC through the impellers. I bought a quick connection adapter for the 4” hose so I can friction fit it over my 4” dust ports on my planer and the 2-1/2” adapter for the TS.

In answer to your question: Are you over-doing it? I hope my system reduces the amount of saw dust and fine saw dust in the work area. It means less clean up and best of all – less dust to get into my lungs. In all my reading, the very fine dust is the most damaging to our respiratory system.

Finding enough room for all this is a real challenge. I suspended my Jet AFS from the ceiling. I am in the process of reorganizing my garage to make room for the DC so I can put it along the wall when not in use. I still have hopes of getting two cars into the garage on occasion. That hope dims with each purchase.

I hope this helps a bit.

Dalec

View GaryK's profile

GaryK

10262 posts in 2645 days


#5 posted 03-29-2008 06:51 PM

Good luck with your system. Let us know how it works out.

-- Gary - Never pass up the opportunity to make a mistake look like you planned it that way - Tyler, TX

View Justin D.'s profile

Justin D.

26 posts in 2375 days


#6 posted 03-29-2008 11:03 PM

Kevin – This is a fun time. When you get this set up you will be very pleased with the accomplishment. I do have the Jet air filter for $200 you posted and like it very much. It’s icing on the cake though. First focus on the DC system. The Jet you’re refering to should work great IMO.

Unless the checkbook is wide open, I would hold off on the Jet air filter because you may have additional expenses in the duct work and gates. Give good thought to running thin wall PVC from the DC to the machines and using the flex as a way to connect the PVC to the machine. If you go with 4” PVC you’ll be happy. A number of years ago I updated from the dust pan and dust all over the place to a Harbor Freight 2hp DC (upgraded bag). That was a pretty decent solution for me. I did use PVC to run the ducting to each machine and then used flex to connect the machines. Try to do it so you don’t have to unhook and reconnect machines or you may find yourself saying…just one cut, and you’ll be back to square one with out using the DC.

As an evolution, I now have a cyclone with 6” PVC throughout. It’s great, but it is a big investment IMO…so if LOYL has the checkbook wide open you may consider this. In my opinion the single state unit helps you have some time to figure DC out and work with the ducting. I would also add to make sure the Bag filter is very small micron or consider a cartridge filter.

Anyway have fun with this and let me know if I can help with your questions. Regards, Justin

View Sawdust2's profile

Sawdust2

1467 posts in 2744 days


#7 posted 03-30-2008 12:40 AM

I have the Delta equivalent to the Jet air filter. It is noisy. But it picks up dust. I have three filters and I have to change it out about every week. (I get in my shop one weekend day, 1-2 week nites and I have a group of 5-6 friends who make it over on Wed nites to make sawdust) I just take the filter out and blow it clean with the air compressor.

I have the Jet 1200 cfm with 30 micron bag. I’m told that the 1 micron bag will make your shop cleaner and the dc more efficient. It’s my next upgrade.

I wish I had been able and/or smart enough to have installed dust collection sooner. I have come to be a believer in air quality in the shop. I use a dust mask for small quick jobs but if I’m going to sand or cut or route for more than a few minutes I use a respirator.

Lee

-- No piece is cut too short. It was meant for a smaller project.

View northwoodsman's profile

northwoodsman

227 posts in 2403 days


#8 posted 03-30-2008 01:30 AM

I have both of the Jet products that you are looking at. I have a 2 1/2 stall garage that I use as a garage and a workshop. Everything is on wheels and I can set up or tear down my entire shop in under 30 minutes. The dust collector is a must. Without it, the air filter won’t even make a dent in the airborne dust. Every time you turn on a machine or walk, you kick the dust up. I turn on the air filter when I go into the shop and let it run for a couple hours past when I am done for the day (thanks to the built in timer and remote control). I use the dust collector 99% of the time when I am using a machine (I should use it 100% of the time). What these do in tandem is nearly eliminate the dust on everything else in the garage (the bikes, the sporting good equipment, the shelves, etc.). The air filter works best when the garage doors are closed so you can recirculate the air through it. If you use the air filter when you are spraying a finish, remove the cloth bag filter from inside the unit and use a cheap throw away outer filter (not an expensive electrostatic). I find that my gas leaf blower does a good job after a large project to dust the shop with also. I just let it idle and it works great – open the overhead doors! When using an electric sander, a downdraft table makes a lot of dfference. Another thing that the air filter does is keep the room temperaure constant throughout. When the heater is on this does a great job circulating the warm air and eliminating cold spots near the floor, corners, and outer walls.

-- NorthWoodsMan

View Safetyboy's profile

Safetyboy

119 posts in 2415 days


#9 posted 03-30-2008 01:35 AM

Thanks for all the input, everyone… it’s great to be able to bounce ideas around like this.

Justin – I work a fair amount at this stage with plywood, which I cut with a circular saw, and put crosscut dados in with a hand-held router… so even with a dust-collector, I will still sometimes be spraying sawdust all over the shop… that’s where I thought the Air Filter would be needed, to get the stuff I can’t get with my DC… does that change your advice at all?

- Thanks, Kevin

-- -- Kevin in Mentor, Ohio

View Safetyboy's profile

Safetyboy

119 posts in 2415 days


#10 posted 03-30-2008 01:45 AM

Northwoods -

I never thought about the heat-circulating properties of the air filter… I use a little space heater in the winter, and while it does heat up the garage eventually, it always struggles for the first 2 hours to disperse the heat everywhere – the corners are always cold. Winter’s nearing an end now, but man it’d be great having better heat for next winter…

-- -- Kevin in Mentor, Ohio

View Justin D.'s profile

Justin D.

26 posts in 2375 days


#11 posted 03-30-2008 01:48 AM

Kevin – I very much like my Jet air filtration. I use it most when cutting down large pieces with a circular saw or when cutting MDF on anything. It works great and is quiet. No doubt you will find it a good addition to your shop dust control and I would recommend it. I have the Delta (triangle air filtration) as well. It’s noisy for sure and in comparison this Jet unit is very quiet. I actually have the Delta set up to direct outside and only use it when I’m using solvents, etc (I’m in a basement/not garage).

You’re plans are right on, just wanted to pass along thoughts on how much the duct work and gates end up costing and the time it takes to do it right. It caught me a bit off guard when I moved to centralized DC. Wish you the best.

View 8iowa's profile

8iowa

1489 posts in 2418 days


#12 posted 03-30-2008 03:34 AM

I don’t know exacty why, but several woodworking magazines seem to be “hung up” on the 4” ducted systems. This is fine for a large shop, with perhaps more than one person working at a time, and having long runs. For the basement or garage home hobbiest, this is overkill. Basically, you need to maintain 3500 cu ft per minute in the ducts in order to suspend the dust particles. In a 4” diameter ducted system this will put you into a 2 HP or larger unit which is noisy, takes up a lot of valuable space, and is electrically hungry.

Woodworking author Nick Engler has shown us how to design a 3” ducted system which will certainly do the job with a smaller and quieter unit – a system that makes a lot more sense for the home based woodworker.

Check out this streaming video.

http://www.shopsmithacademy.com/SS_Archives/SS109/SS109_Dust_Collection.htm

-- "Heaven is North of the Bridge"

View Safetyboy's profile

Safetyboy

119 posts in 2415 days


#13 posted 03-31-2008 02:32 AM

Well, most seem to be happy with the Jet unit. This is my rough plan for using it – green pipes are flex hoses running on the floor – white is 4” PVC (I need to brush up on my sketchup skills too!). Shop is 10’ by 20’. The jointer & planer will share a direct line from the DC. The other line will run in PCV along the wall, and branch off to serve the tablesaw, routertable, and CMS.

Will this work? The only problem I see is the line to the tablesaw gets close to 20’ long…

-- -- Kevin in Mentor, Ohio

View Justin D.'s profile

Justin D.

26 posts in 2375 days


#14 posted 03-31-2008 02:48 AM

Kevin – You need to teach us some things about sketchup. I have been looking at some tutorials and I really want to get to using that product. Your work looks great.

In evolving with my duct work, I really found, going up from the DC unit and running along the ceiling works the best. Try to come down from the ceiling to your machines and avoid the pipes on the floor. Gives you more space and avoids tripping/etc. I found using 2 (45 degree) PVC peices works better than a 90 degree piece when you go around a corner. It slows the turn down a bit. If you go the ceiling route, when you drop down to a tool, just use a 45 degree “Y” and make sure the “Y” is slanted toward the DC system. That of course is when you are dropping down to a tool and then need to continue on. Play with it a bit. Think about getting the fewest turns and the smoothest turns when possible. You may need to trade off some turns to get pipes off the floor.

I see your jointer and planer pipes may be in an area on the floor that you don’t need to use and won’t walk around, but the TS for sure might be a pain for you.

View Safetyboy's profile

Safetyboy

119 posts in 2415 days


#15 posted 03-31-2008 02:55 AM

I can’t claim those tool drawings, Justin – I downloaded them from the on-line library and imported them into the drawing. Some folks have spent a lot of time drawing up WW tools, it’s nice to use them!

The problem with going overhead for me, is that the garage door gets in the way of most of the overhead space… i might be able to go overhead to the Tablesaw, but the jointer & planer will definitely have to stay on the floor… it won’t be any worse than the hose from my Shop Vac I’m using now!

-- -- Kevin in Mentor, Ohio

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