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Forum topic by MadebyMars posted 06-20-2018 01:51 PM 514 views 0 times favorited 15 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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MadebyMars

4 posts in 1250 days


06-20-2018 01:51 PM

Topic tags/keywords: design joinery

I’m working on re-creating something similar to the attached photo for my home. I’m still pretty new to this, so I can’t tell the best way to join the case work/cabinet to the legs to make sure this can actually be sat on. It looks like a frame and panel side, but I’m unsure of the best way to attach the top and bottom panels/cross members( if a complete panel isn’t recommended). The mitered legs are also throwing me off a bit. As far as structural integrity goes, should there be a floating tenon or dowel in addition to the glued miter joint?


15 replies so far

View Andre's profile

Andre

1921 posts in 1856 days


#1 posted 06-20-2018 01:59 PM

Depending on the dimensions, I would go with mortise and tenon joinery.

-- Lifting one end of the plank.

View ShaneA's profile

ShaneA

6965 posts in 2648 days


#2 posted 06-20-2018 02:08 PM

M/T would be the first method for me. However, I would say you could get away with pocket hole joinery on this one, as all of the pocket screws could be hidden, given the design of the bench. That would make construction a lot easier. Might not be a heirloom piece, but function and a great entry into woodworking.

View Sludgeguy's profile

Sludgeguy

27 posts in 172 days


#3 posted 06-20-2018 02:10 PM

+1 on the use of mortise and tenon.
May want to look at Kreg pocket hole screws for the bottom legs or some type of locked miter.

View bondogaposis's profile

bondogaposis

4820 posts in 2401 days


#4 posted 06-20-2018 02:11 PM

Mortise and tenon for sure. Standard frame and panel joinery with plywood panels. I would not not miter the bottom leg stretchers but use box joints.

-- Bondo Gaposis

View Nubsnstubs's profile

Nubsnstubs

1302 posts in 1780 days


#5 posted 06-20-2018 02:37 PM

If I was doing that build, I would make 2 identical face frames. Use whatever joinery you are comfy with, and assemble them. Make the side rails, and assemble the unit, again using whatever joinery you choose. Personally, I wouldn’t put the bottom rail on the floor like the one pictured. Raise it to whatever height you like, and complete the project.

It looks like the front shown has drawers. If so, it’s going to be a very useful item to have.

I’ve been using 3/8” x 1 1/2” dowels on all my cabinets and furniture I’ve made since I started my business in 1978, and have never had any fail yet as I would have had some very angry customers. To date, I haven’t heard from any of them. So, don’t overlook dowels. .............. Jerry (in Tucson)

-- Jerry (in Tucson) www.woodturnerstools.com

View PPK's profile (online now)

PPK

1074 posts in 859 days


#6 posted 06-20-2018 02:41 PM

+4 for mortise and tenon!

If you mitered the bottoms, you could reinforce them with a biscuit, or make a splined miter joint.

I’m not real fond of miters though. They alway seem to separate. There’s better joints out there…

-- Pete

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MadebyMars

4 posts in 1250 days


#7 posted 06-20-2018 03:01 PM

Thanks everyone. The mitered legs were really bugging me to begin with. I like the look, but don’t like miters for structural integrity. I am probably going away from the mitered bottom, but will keep the mitered top for aesthetics. What do you think about adding some dovetail keys to the top miter for strength? I can probably do a through spline, but would have trouble on something like dowels or a loose tenon due to my skills. I would be worried about alignment.


M/T would be the first method for me. However, I would say you could get away with pocket hole joinery on this one, as all of the pocket screws could be hidden, given the design of the bench. That would make construction a lot easier. Might not be a heirloom piece, but function and a great entry into woodworking.

View DS's profile

DS

2928 posts in 2470 days


#8 posted 06-20-2018 03:06 PM

Furniture manufacturers typically have automated dowel insertion machinery that makes doweling this piece fairly simple. If you are fairly practiced with a doweling jig and dowel points this isn’t terribly complicated to do manually either.

I do notice that even the mitered legs, though, have faces on the top and bottom which are NOT exposed and could be screwed together and not be seen.,

The rails can be attached with dowels, pocket screws, mortise and tenon, biscuits, dominos, floating tenons, or (insert other creative method here).

As for being able to “make sure this can actually be sat on”, just look at where the weight will transfer to the floor.
A mechanical bond is always preferable to a shear bond.

This is a super-simplified diagram. Even a dado gives a mechanical bond.

It looks like a nice piece. Best of luck to you!

-- "Hard work is not defined by the difficulty of the task as much as a person's desire to perform it.", DS251

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MadebyMars

4 posts in 1250 days


#9 posted 06-20-2018 03:07 PM

Agreed. I don’t know how much pull I have on changing the legs, that was part of the design my wife liked. I don’t mind the look, just worried about the strength. Might try to convince her that the piece will last longer. Thanks PPK.


+4 for mortise and tenon!

If you mitered the bottoms, you could reinforce them with a biscuit, or make a splined miter joint.

I m not real fond of miters though. They alway seem to separate. There s better joints out there…

- PPK


View MadebyMars's profile

MadebyMars

4 posts in 1250 days


#10 posted 06-20-2018 03:34 PM

I feel a lot of router work in my near future. Anyone have a Domino? I promise I’ll give it back.

View Mark's profile

Mark

923 posts in 2024 days


#11 posted 06-20-2018 11:44 PM

I might as well toss my 2 cents worth in. M&T all the way. There’s a reason quality furniture manufacturers use this process. Not as difficult as you might think.

-- Mark

View AandCstyle's profile

AandCstyle

3093 posts in 2307 days


#12 posted 06-20-2018 11:46 PM

Mars, make the miter joints for the leg to feet joinery and drill 2 holes for dowel pins up through the feet into the legs in each joint. Then the miters will never move and the dowels will not be visible. HTH

-- Art

View smitdog's profile

smitdog

372 posts in 2155 days


#13 posted 06-21-2018 04:56 PM

I was going to say exactly what Art posted, dowels up through the bottom of the miter. Don’t even need a jig, just drill straight through and glue in the dowel.

-- Jarrett - Mount Vernon, Ohio

View Woodknack's profile

Woodknack

11998 posts in 2430 days


#14 posted 06-21-2018 05:34 PM

The ends would be post and panel, the front would be mortise and tenon, the back I can’t see but I would probably do a plywood panel. I would eliminate the bottom “foot” or whatever because it doesn’t serve any purpose except to complicate the build. But if you like the bottom piece, instead of mitering I would put it between the legs and pocket hole it from the bottom.

-- Rick M, http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View Rick's profile

Rick

9905 posts in 3083 days


#15 posted 06-27-2018 11:31 PM



Depending on the dimensions, I would go with mortise and tenon joinery.

- Andre

YEP! No doubt about it! Best way to go!

-- Your Assertiveness Training Is Beginning To Interfere With My Anger Management!

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