LumberJocks

Need help with a project

  • Advertise with us

« back to Woodworking Skill Share forum

Forum topic by Wilson_woodworking posted 04-24-2018 01:05 PM 537 views 0 times favorited 15 replies Add to Favorites Watch
View Wilson_woodworking's profile

Wilson_woodworking

8 posts in 115 days


04-24-2018 01:05 PM

Topic tags/keywords: question trick tip

This an old wheel that a customer wants me to use in making a wheel barrow. How should I attach this to the handles? I’ve used numerous solvents and wrenches and cheater pipes to try to get the old “inner hub” out. The upper side is open and the lower side has a cap (which is not coming off either).
It’s going to need to roll some, but not much. It will be mostly decorative.
My current idea is to lay the handles over the top and use metal strapping (for hanging ductwork) to hold the hub snugly against the handles. Any better ideas?


15 replies so far

View Lazyman's profile

Lazyman

2277 posts in 1469 days


#1 posted 04-24-2018 01:32 PM

First, make sure that the thread on the side that won’t come off isn’t a reversed thread to prevent it from unscrewing itself when the wheel is turned. If that is not the problem, try using a propane torch concentrated on one side of the nut to break the rust bond. I’ve read, but never tried, that melting some paraffin into the treads while it is hot can allow it to wick into the nut and help as well.

EDIT: if you have an oxyacetylene torch with a small tip, you can more easily concentrate the heat to a smaller area.

-- Nathan, TX -- Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.

View Kazooman's profile

Kazooman

1087 posts in 2034 days


#2 posted 04-24-2018 01:44 PM

If you can’t get hub off, I think that there would be better looking ways to attach the handles. The two ends have very different profiles,so a little custom shaping would be required. I would explore having the handles on top of the axle hub as you suggested, with a profile cut into them to match the shape of the hub on each side. Then I would fashion some blocks with similar profiles in them for the underside and them secure them together with carriage bolts. This should still allow the limited rotation that you need.

View John Smith's profile

John Smith

1241 posts in 244 days


#3 posted 04-24-2018 02:19 PM

photos of both sides (in the sunshine) of the hub itself may help a little more.

the two iron implement wheels that I inherited had 3/8” drill rod for bearings.
not the round ball bearings that are common in other applications.
they are easy to clean up once you get them out.

.

-- Graduated Valedictorian from the University of HardKnocks --

View CRAIGCLICK's profile

CRAIGCLICK

117 posts in 155 days


#4 posted 04-24-2018 02:52 PM

Are you sure it’s not a press fit?

I, too, would like to see photos from the sides in better light.

If it’s use will be decorative and it won’t have to roll much, you could just cut off the ends and then use bar stock through the center as an axle.

-- Somewhere between raising hell and amazing grace.

View TechTeacher04's profile

TechTeacher04

387 posts in 1613 days


#5 posted 04-24-2018 03:25 PM

There appear to be 2 removable shaft collars with square head set screws. Using heat and penetrating oil remove them and see what you have to tackle next. You could search tractor and or machinery forums for alternative ways to free up the hub.

View John Smith's profile

John Smith

1241 posts in 244 days


#6 posted 04-24-2018 06:51 PM

I’m with Tech ~ the two square lock bolts must be removed and it appears
that the right side is missing the cap that you can see on the left side.
if you do not see any threads on the right side, that means the cap on
the left side is just a pressed fit. Like the old hubcaps, tap tap tap wiggle wiggle wiggle
apply some heat and 50/50 mix of acetone and ATF for penetrant it will come off – eventually.

.

-- Graduated Valedictorian from the University of HardKnocks --

View CRAIGCLICK's profile

CRAIGCLICK

117 posts in 155 days


#7 posted 04-24-2018 07:10 PM

I didn’t notice the set screws. I think I’m losing my mind!

I once completely rounded the head off one exhaust manifold nut on a Chrysler 440 engine. These were weird nuts in that they were hollow “sleeve” type nuts and when they were rusted in they were almost impossible to remove because the sleeve would crush and break off and about the only way to deal with it involved actually having to break the ear on the manifold in order to cut the stud off.

The way I handled it was to spend a week spraying PB Blaster 2 or 3 times a day liberally into the well on the manifold where the nut was broken off. Then I let it sit for a couple of days more. After that, using a reverse rotation drill bit, I pretty much just hogged it out of there until it worked its way into the remainder of the hole and broke the sleeve nut loose.

The point (I swear I have one) is that time and PB blaster can probably do anything. I would very carefully drill a hole down through the center of the bolt using a high quality bit and, after spraying PB on it for a few days and letting it soak, use an EZ out to VERY gently coax the set screws out of there.

-- Somewhere between raising hell and amazing grace.

View Wilson_woodworking's profile

Wilson_woodworking

8 posts in 115 days


#8 posted 04-24-2018 08:20 PM

It’s surprisingly difficult to take good pictures of this wheel. Hopefully this helps.

I really appreciate the comments everyone!! At first glance I would think this is press fit. But the set screws make me think it’s just rusted in place. I finally got the set screws out last night, then went to waylaying on it with a hammer to no avail. I let everything soak in penetrating oil overnight, and still nothing.

I don’t have access to high heat other than a magnifying glass and the sun. I’m kinda thinking along the lines of Kazooman. Fashion some sort of wooden housing. BUT… Wheel barrow handles would be going to the wheel at an angle. So I’m having trouble visualizing how the wheel would spin inside the wooden housing while mounted.

Unless I made a very narrow block…. I could just use a U-bolt! It’s narrow, it could be parallel with the wheel, while allowing the splay angle of the handles, and doesn’t have to be the precise diameter of the wheel. There’s enough of a lip on either side to prevent it from rolling out sideways…..Thanks you everyone for the help!

View CRAIGCLICK's profile

CRAIGCLICK

117 posts in 155 days


#9 posted 04-24-2018 08:51 PM

Do you have access to a large pipe wrench? I would put that on the cap (the one with the square on it) and mount the wheel in a vice and have a go at it.

The way I see it, those set screws are in there for a reason and the inner flanged hub is rusted into the outer hub. The set screws are what used to hold it in there. If I was a betting mad, I’d say that there are two grooves in that inner hub that the set screws snug into.

You have two choices. You can either try to get that cap off the end (and I think a big enough pipe wrench will do it…you can rent one at any tool rental place) and then mount the whole thing in a 20 ton shop press and have a go at pushing the inner hub out using (again) a lot of PB blaster.

BTW, if you don’t have PB Blaster, go out and get a can. I have yet to find anything that works as well.

You can also go to the local big box store and pick up a MAPP gas torch…it burns way hotter than propane. That will allow you to put some heat to the outer hub to expand it and break it loose. You could even try putting the wheel in a freezer before you do that.

-- Somewhere between raising hell and amazing grace.

View bondogaposis's profile

bondogaposis

4894 posts in 2433 days


#10 posted 04-24-2018 09:00 PM

I don’t have access to high heat other than a magnifying glass and the sun.

You really need a torch like this. To get it to work properly you are going to need an axle. You can get that apart with heat, get a torch, they have a thousand uses around the shop.

-- Bondo Gaposis

View CRAIGCLICK's profile

CRAIGCLICK

117 posts in 155 days


#11 posted 04-24-2018 09:00 PM

One more thing. Doing a little reading online about this. It looks like you have a cast iron hub and a steel inner hub (sleeve).

It appears that a 50/50 mix of acetone and dexron automatic transmission fluid works better than any other penetrating fluid. Just mix it in a spray bottle and spray it on there and allow it to sit for a few hours.

-- Somewhere between raising hell and amazing grace.

View MrUnix's profile

MrUnix

6845 posts in 2281 days


#12 posted 04-24-2018 09:06 PM

Electrolysis would probably break it free.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

View hairy's profile

hairy

2741 posts in 3614 days


#13 posted 04-24-2018 10:11 PM

http://www.kanolabs.com/google/?gclid=CjwKCAjwq_vWBRACEiwAEReprA3G3b8CAp_MUsqgdYguCE1NNRX8mj0Og_1QOuYXZdbDUElbLAGwvxoCeZIQAvD_BwE

Kroil. Best stuff on the planet for getting rusted parts apart.

-- My reality check bounced...

View Lazyman's profile

Lazyman

2277 posts in 1469 days


#14 posted 04-24-2018 11:06 PM

If the heat or perhaps the Kano Kroil doesn’t work, I would probably give up with separating the parts and come up with a way to attach it to the the wheelbarrow with something similar to a hinge strap. Good opportunity to try your hand at some basic blacksmithing with your new torch and a hammer. See this to see the shape that I am talking about. Many antique wheelbarrows used this approach to attach the axle. You can get some mild steel from HD or Lowes and bend it to shape around the hub with a hammer after heating it with the torch and then drill 2 holes to attach it to the WB. You will need something on the side of the wheel without the nut to keep the wheel in place.

-- Nathan, TX -- Hire the lazy man. He may not do as much work but that's because he will find a better way.

View runswithscissors's profile

runswithscissors

2804 posts in 2107 days


#15 posted 04-27-2018 12:47 AM

I suggest using a wooden barrel (split in two lengthwise) for the “barrow” part. Then you can legitimately call it a wheelbarrel just to annoy your school marm sister in law.

-- I admit to being an adrenaline junky; fortunately, I'm very easily frightened

Have your say...

You must be signed in to reply.

DISCLAIMER: Any posts on LJ are posted by individuals acting in their own right and do not necessarily reflect the views of LJ. LJ will not be held liable for the actions of any user.

Latest Projects | Latest Blog Entries | Latest Forum Topics

HomeRefurbers.com