What are thoughts on these instructions?

What did that say?

-- Gary, East TX -- The longest journey begins with a single step.

Boggles the mind…it would take a younger mind that mine. I have seen plywood trim and face frames before but I sure wish they would not teach that in schools.

-- http://www.woodsongsfurniture.com

In fear of losing my man card. I avoid instructions, maps and of course asking directions. But these count as none of the above. It would take more time to read them than it would to build. It was written as if, to and from two people in the same shop. Not for outside use. A bit open ended if I were to be the builder. Also a text book? For reference? Not complete without it.

-- To those who fight for it, life has a flavor the protected never know. Unknown, on an empty C-ration box. Khe Sahn 1968

1.) Notice Drawer front is 18-1/2” wide, face frame Stiles are 1-1/2”wd and Rail is 15”lg for a total carcass width of 18”.

2.) Drawer sides are 11”lg according to cut list, Drawer drawing shows sides total being 11-1/2”, with the rabbet cuts shown; drawer back add no length to sides and front adds 1/4” to length. Should be 11-1/4”

3.) Drawer ends are 16-1/2” according to cutlist, drawer drawing showers drawer end dimension of 17-3/4”; even if drawer side were attached to the ends of the ends it would only total 17-1/2”

4.) With dimensions of drawer in mind, face frame rail is 15”. drawer must fit throught his opening. then drawer must be 11-1/2” wide in 15” opening; but the drawer is 17-3/4” deep in a 13” deep carcass.

5.) Overall drawing does not reflect a face frame on the cabinet, dimension is for side plywood only.

I have a few more but you can start to see why I question if my son could have even built this, let alone as a beginner.

-- Joel Tille

aww shucks uncle jed its easy , you just take that there cover page and scrap the rest ! lol
all id say joel is at least your son has a shop class , i dont think many do anymore from what i hear .

-- if you aint the lead dog the scenery never changes

The plan looks like something from the ‘60s. You would think over that period of time some teacher would have corrected the errors. Or better yet used any copies of the plan to start the fire in the pot bellied stove they use to get rid of last years frustration. A sad comentary on the state of our schools.

-- http://www.grandprairiewoodworks.com

I am glad I don’t have to build from that.

-- Maplewood, MN

Looking at the the bottom there are some math errors. If you wrap an 18” wide bottom with 3/4” wide trim you get 19 1/2” unless I am doing it wrong.

As for the sides. The are listed at 21 3/4” in the cutlist with 20 1/4” viewable in the drawing. That is an 1 1/2” difference or 3/4” depth of cut for the dado or “blind rabbet” That is all the way through. It seems like they should be only 3/8 in. or just biscuit it.

Same for the back.

-- -John "Do I have to keep typing a smiley? Just assume it's a joke." www.flickr.com/photos/gizmodyne

I”m sure projects like this aren’t helping keep students interested which might continue to help get these programs out of the schools…

- thankfully we have relative dimensioning!

-- The opposite of war isn't peace. It's creation. -- Wood T's: http://www.printfection.com/snbcreative

Sad, sad sad..

-- Karson Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com

Your kidding! a high school shop teacher is handing something like this out. “SAD”. I taught Industrial arts and never would have given my students something like this. Is your boy wanting to build this? If he is, I will send you drawings, bill of materials and procedures. Let me know.

-- Mc Bridge Cabinets, Iowa

WOW!, I started to put it together in Sketchup… forget it. “mrtrim” is right on the money. Teach the concepts of rabbits, dados, face frames, and everything else, but ignore any instructions or measurements, LOL.

sketchcup-file.skp

-- Tom, Central New York

Thanks for the comments everyone.

ww_kayak thanks for the sketchup. I also tried to draw this in autocad light, not much 3d capabilites. I could not figure out exactly how to assemble all the pieces. I was hopeing someone would do what you had done with newer software with the 3d capabilities. Did you find when trying to assemble all the parts that there was gaps in the construction?

nd2elk – his carcass is built, now he is just going to put a door on it. He did not have the doors done before he brought it home. After he had the drawer box finished is when he discovered it would not fit into the frame.

When he did bring his project home partially built, where the glue had come out of the joints it was a blue/black color stained into the wood. I have never seen glue do this before, does anyone have any ideas what would cause this discoloration. Last year a friend of my son brought his shop project over to our shop to finish and we noticed the same discoloration. It took him along time to clean this up. Is it the type of glue the school is using?

-- Joel Tille

It sounds like they used the old steel bar clamps or pipe camps. Those react with glue.

-- -John "Do I have to keep typing a smiley? Just assume it's a joke." www.flickr.com/photos/gizmodyne

gizmodyne – the glue was all up and down the case inside and outside. Some of the places are where no clamps could have touched the glue.

Photo of inside:

Photo of face frame attached to case, He has sanded as much as possible to try and remove the stain he has also started to sand through the veneer on the plywood:

-- Joel Tille

joel this is very common with oak . it will react the same with about any liquid spilled on it when still raw as well . why it turns black i dont know some years back i worked with a stairbuilder up in nashville that sweat profusely . the painters hated him . lol oak is quite porus and youll find the black can run fairly deep in the grain

-- if you aint the lead dog the scenery never changes

Lesson Learned:In all plans (even Fine Woodworking articles): Don’t trust the cut dlist. Make your own and measure as you go.

Thinking about this as a teacher: your son should correct the cu tlist (Spelling errors and all) and give it back to the teacher. (Ply is also written in the wrong spot-should be next to sides). If the guy is approachable at all he should tell him how frustrating it is and ask him how to fix the drawer situation. (Maybe the cabinet sits in the drawer).

-- -John "Do I have to keep typing a smiley? Just assume it's a joke." www.flickr.com/photos/gizmodyne

Or they should turn it into an instructional activity. As a class identify the errors in this cut list.

-- -John "Do I have to keep typing a smiley? Just assume it's a joke." www.flickr.com/photos/gizmodyne

Definitely! Aside from the drawer measurements being backwards, I think the bottom was too narrow(or wide?). I think that was because the length of the sides were wrong because they forgot to account for the rabbits? The faceframe seemed short I think?, but that’s where I quit. To be honest I had to tweek so many things I don’t even remember what they where :) It really did take WAAAAY to long to keep reading the “instructions” :)

Here’s what I ended up with on the drawer. Download the original form Picasa if you cant read the dimensions.

-- Tom, Central New York

Thanks eveyone – now I know I wasn’t just looking at it wrong.

I do know the teacher, as he was teaching when I went through the high school. My son tells me he is the teacher for an engineering class. Maybe they could take this as project and fix for the woodworking class to use.

-- Joel Tille

I believe No. 7 in the instructions says to cut top and bottom trim members to rought length. Should this be to RIGHT length?

wow these aren’t the best directions. i tend to do what mrtrim said and just take a picture and make all my own plans. if these are the best plans they have maybe they should have the kids just try to make their own plans.

great to see that schools are run by great minds… Oh, sorry.. I was wrong about that.

-- making sawdust....

i found it really funny how “stain and finish” were just one step expressed in all of 6 words. to finish my printer table took a lot of time and effort and trial and error. they make it wound so easy like some random kid who doesn’t have much experience could just pick up a rag and wipe on a finish.

My degree is in occupational education: teaching people a skill, how to do something.

That engineering teacher is an engineer that’s had a little bit of teacher’s training and teaches theory. The HS needs to find a real woodwork teacher to handle the shop class. He might be the greatest guy in the world, but teaching a skill requires you to have that skill.

I vaguely remember woodshop from elementary school. Our teacher was a carpenter.

-- Made lots of sawdust and pounded some nails. Haven't finished anything, though.

Could something like this be the reason our children don’t like shop class?

-- Berta in NC

I guess this brochure assumes the student already knows all the concepts for milling and cutting the pieces as well as what a blind rabbit is? The spelling and grammar issues are one thing, but to not even have the dimensions right in the cut list…you are just setting these poor kids up for failure.

-- Women love me.....trees fear me

I think I was just working with the architect who drew these plans.

-- Thos. Angle, Owyhee Design, Oregon

The dark color may come from the glue and wood comming in comtact with the clamp. My pipe clamps react like this. Not anymore – I cover them with tape.

-- Bruce from Central New York