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Hide Glue & Acrylic Paint Compatibility

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Forum topic by bilyo posted 12-07-2017 07:51 PM 234 views 0 times favorited 10 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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bilyo

40 posts in 935 days


12-07-2017 07:51 PM

Some time ago, I made a cabinet top of several narrow pieces butt glued with pre-mixed hide glue. I later tried to paint the project with acrylic paint. When the paint dried there were tiny ridges along all the glued joints. I have never heard of or read about compatibility problems between hide glue and any finish, but this appears to be the case. I have since fixed it by stripping the paint and applying a couple of coats of shellac before re-painting. Has anyone else ever had this problem?


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dubois

33 posts in 1663 days


#1 posted 12-07-2017 08:42 PM

On the face of it it seems that acrylic had formed an air tight cover and the glue benieth was still curing. Did you wait long enough between gluing and painting I wonder. Otherwise, and in fact as a general rule such a finish on wood can better be disregarded and a less impermeable covering, linseed oil paint for example, used.

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bilyo

40 posts in 935 days


#2 posted 12-07-2017 10:05 PM



Otherwise, and in fact as a general rule such a finish on wood can better be disregarded and a less impermeable covering, linseed oil paint for example, used.
- dubois

Sorry for misunderstanding. Are you saying that acrylic paint should not be used over hide glue?

I don’t remember exactly how long the glue cured before painting, but it was probably a couple of weeks or more because I did a lot of other stuff before the project was complete and ready to paint.

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Rich

1969 posts in 422 days


#3 posted 12-08-2017 03:54 AM

Hide glue doesn’t cure, it dries, and it can be redissolved with water. My guess is that the acrylic paint softened it and caused it to swell. Perhaps it would have flattened back out when it fully dried again.

Since the shellac sealed it and fixed the problem, you’re all set.

-- No matter how much you push the envelope, it'll still be stationery.

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shipwright

7779 posts in 2630 days


#4 posted 12-08-2017 04:17 AM

Hide glues dry hard. The amount of water in a paint film, in the absence of heat, will have no effect on its stability.
The only thing that I can think of is that perhaps in the interim between gluing and painting, the wood shrank a little and the hard glue did not.
I don’t use a lot of liquid hide glue but I can’t see it being the problem. If it were hot hide glue which I use all the time I would just about guarantee it’s not the problem.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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dubois

33 posts in 1663 days


#5 posted 12-08-2017 08:41 AM

What I am saying is I wouldn’t use acrylic on wood. And that is because it blocks off to a high degree the exchange between the wood and its surrounding – wood is hygroscopic remember, a key tenant of woodworking, it wants a certain relationship to the atmosphere and not to be hermitically sealed off.

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bondogaposis

4472 posts in 2184 days


#6 posted 12-08-2017 01:01 PM

Crrackle paint finish is achieved by painting latex acylic over glue. That sounds a little bit like what you have going on here.

-- Bondo Gaposis

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CharlesNeil

2140 posts in 3703 days


#7 posted 12-08-2017 02:04 PM

Bondo is correct , a light coat of shellac before the paint will solve the issue

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bilyo

40 posts in 935 days


#8 posted 12-08-2017 05:54 PM

Thanks for the comments. Now that you mention it, I do remember reading about making a crackle finish with latex paint over hide glue. Had I remembered that sooner, I would have used the shellac on the first attempt.
Thanks

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CharlesNeil

2140 posts in 3703 days


#9 posted 12-08-2017 05:56 PM

1/2 hide glue 1/2 water … apply let dry well, then latex over that , a heat gun or hair drier will increase the crackle .
but so outdated .. but is interesting to do

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Rich

1969 posts in 422 days


#10 posted 12-08-2017 09:06 PM


Hide glues dry hard. The amount of water in a paint film, in the absence of heat, will have no effect on its stability.
The only thing that I can think of is that perhaps in the interim between gluing and painting, the wood shrank a little and the hard glue did not.
I don’t use a lot of liquid hide glue but I can’t see it being the problem. If it were hot hide glue which I use all the time I would just about guarantee it’s not the problem.

- shipwright

But he wasn’t using hot hide glue…lol. Liquid hide glue is a totally different animal (pun intended). It dries hard too, but due its formulation using urea, it will soften and swell with moisture, regardless of heat. This isn’t my opinion or belief, it’s what I’ve experienced in my testing.

What specifically happened with the OP’s painted surface is moot.

-- No matter how much you push the envelope, it'll still be stationery.

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