LumberJocks

New combo Jointer/Planer and table saw dilemma - opinions please

  • Advertise with us

« back to Power Tools, Hardware and Accessories forum

Forum topic by MarionSSS posted 01-18-2011 06:47 AM 5715 views 0 times favorited 42 replies Add to Favorites Watch
View MarionSSS's profile

MarionSSS

28 posts in 1341 days


01-18-2011 06:47 AM

On New Year’s eve my purchasing manager (read wife) approved a total redo of my shop – long story but the short version is that I got to sell pretty much everything I had and replace it with more mobile equipment and some higher quality stuff. Soooo, I’ve ordered a bunch of Festool stuff, Triton TRA001 (router table in saw extension), a combo jointer/planer and a new table saw.

So that day I ordered the following from Grizzly:
http://www.grizzly.com/products/10-Hybrid-Tablesaw-with-Riving-Knife-Polar-Bear-Series/G0715P
and
http://www.grizzly.com/products/12-Planer-Jointer-with-Spiral-Cutterhead-Replaces-G0634-/G0634Z

I knew from talking with Grizzly sales that the jointer/planer was back ordered until 1/21/11. I figured no sweat I can wait 3 weeks. Then I found out last Friday that both the saw and the jointer/planer are now back ordered to March 11th!! So I started looking around for other options and stumbled across Laguna Tools 10” Jointer/Planer with the spiral cutterhead:
http://www.lagunatools.com/used/combo-platinum10s
I almost pulled the trigger on the unit – had it in the cart, shipping info all filled out, etc but decided I better check the reviews on Laguna Tools. Discovered some horror stories about their customer service (some on these forums) and backed out of the purchase. Resigned myself to waiting for the Grizzly stuff.

Today I get a call from Laguna Tools. The sales guy insists they’ve made massive changes to customer support and he’ll email me some special prices on both the 10” & 12” jointer/planers. The 12” price was too rich for me but the delivered price on the 10” was $1973. Looks like a nice machine – better cutter head than the Grizzly. With the dollars saved from the 12” Grizzly, I could now spring for a Grizzly cabinet saw – either the 1023 or 690.

Any thoughts?


42 replies so far

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

14742 posts in 2325 days


#1 posted 01-18-2011 09:07 AM

The horror stories are a bit spooky, aren’t they. In complete and damaged tools off the factory floor scare me but I’m not buying anything for a while until I get what I have set up and running. Converting warehouse to shop;-))

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View live4ever's profile

live4ever

983 posts in 1660 days


#2 posted 01-18-2011 11:14 AM

Sounds like you’re basically talking about trading 2” of jointing/planing width for 1 more HP of tablesaw + potentially poor service on the j/p. You’re really the only one that can make that call, but it comes down to the stock you use/plan on using.

How much jointing have you needed to do on boards that were between 10” and 12”?

How much thick stock do you use on the TS? Do you use a lot of really hard species?

Is this your only planer, or do you have a ~13” lunchbox? I ask because for ME, 10” of planing width is too small. But that’s only me – I know my sweet spot for jointing is between 6” and 8” and my sweet spot for planing is between 10-15”, based on the stock I usually acquire.

Personally, I’d be a little wary of Laguna until their customer service track record really starts improving. You want to know they will take care of you if there’s something wrong and you’ve got a three-quarter-ton lemon sitting in your shop. Experience dictates Grizzly probably will.

Too bad Grizz doesn’t make a spiral cutter of their 10” J/P combo.

-- Optimists are usually disappointed. Pessimists are either right or pleasantly surprised. I tend to be a disappointed pessimist.

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

14742 posts in 2325 days


#3 posted 01-18-2011 11:21 AM

Is this a production shop work or hobby ? 6 weeks wait sucks, but if it is just hobby work, you can learn to or practice hand cut dovetails ;-))

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View barryvabeach's profile

barryvabeach

159 posts in 1693 days


#4 posted 01-18-2011 02:27 PM

Laguna has too many C S complaints for my taste – especially when there are so many other companies that continually get rave reviews – Lee Valley comes to mind even though they don’t sell what you are looking for, Sawstop, etc. For the tablesaw, it is hard to beat Grizzly price v. features, though you might see if you can find a similar offering from Shopfox – I understand they use the same manufacturer and just diff distribution chains. As to the JP – Jet ( which I have ) and Rikon both offer competing products you might want to check out. I like the Jet a lot, though it is more expensive than the Grizzly ( again they have the lock on dollars for quality ) and I see that Rikon has just come out with one, don’t know much about the features. If you are considering going to 10 inch, did you check the new Polar bear series J P – I haven’t seen it in person, but I think that it has an easier changeover because the fence stays on.

View HorizontalMike's profile

HorizontalMike

6938 posts in 1564 days


#5 posted 01-18-2011 03:25 PM

I generally agree with live4ever about assessing your needs and add the economics of buying an 8” jointer and 13” lunchbox planer for less than the combo unit. The widest piece I personally have planed thus far is 12” so I understand live4ever’s point about 10” being “too small” for planing capacity. My 2-cents…

-- HorizontalMike -- "Woodpeckers understand..."

View richgreer's profile

richgreer

4524 posts in 1724 days


#6 posted 01-18-2011 03:45 PM

For a purchase this big I would wait until good reviews about Laguna start to appear before taking a risk on them. Everyone knows that Grizzly customer service is great.

Btw – I’m happy to see someone else who likes and uses both Festool & Grizzly. Some have suggested that it’s odd that I like both – but I do.

-- Rich, Cedar Rapids, IA - I'm a woodworker. I don't create beauty, I reveal it.

View MarionSSS's profile

MarionSSS

28 posts in 1341 days


#7 posted 01-18-2011 06:19 PM

Wow, a lot of great responses. I’ll try to address each of the points you’ve all brought up.

Rich, I’m from Marion. I just jumped on board the Festool bandwagon – its superb dust control and systemic approach to its tools has restored my love for the woodworking. I started with the R0 125 and the CT 22 and after sanding with them for the first time, I was hooked. I bit pretty hard – I now have the Domino, TS 55, MFT/3, 55” & 106” guide rails and the OF 1010 should be here today. As far as Grizzly is concerned, I owned 8”x65” jointer for years and it was a great machine. When you need some heavy duty iron without a bunch of bells and whistles at a great price, Grizzly is awfully hard to beat. I know some of the Festool purists argue that a table saw is redundant if you own the TS 55 but it’s hard to knock the convenience of ripping hardwood on a decent table saw on a mobile base.

Here’s some background on my situation. I’m a hobbyist woodworker. My garage (22’ wide and 34’ deep) is my shop and is shared with my vehicles. I’ve had a mish mash of tools that I’ve built up over the years many of which were purchased more due to cost than quality. I did have a very nice (and large) Jet cabinet saw. It had the 52” extension table AND a 60” Excalibur (now Exaktor) sliding table. It was great for breaking down sheet goods and large stock but it absolutely dominated my garage. It was impossible to do any work in the garage without moving the vehicles out. By switching to tools that are more mobile I can work in the garage (it’s heated by the way) without moving the vehicles out.

For jointing and planing I had the previously mentioned Grizz 8” jointer and a Ryobi 10” lunch box planer. I wanted something beefier for planing but I did not want to use up any more space than my old jointer did. The combo J/P machines seemed to fit the bill. Initially, I was looking at the 10” machines but after further research, the spiral cutterheads really interested me. Unfortunately as live4ever mentioned, Grizzly doesn’t have a spiral cutter on their 10”. Looking at Laguna didn’t occur to me until I ran into the back order situation at Grizzly.

As far as the 10” vs 12” issue goes, initially I was perfectly fine with a 10” J/P. I didn’t think my purchasing manager would let me spend the $$ on the 12”. There have been a handful of times I wished a could have gone wider, but honestly 10” is fine. I have to admit as much I’d love to have the 12” capacity, horsing a 3/4 ton piece of equipment into my garage and on to a mobile base scares the snot out of me. The Laguna 10” at 436 lbs. looks a little more doable. That’s basically the same weight as my old jointer.

The Laguna looks like a really nice machine and by the way the $1973 delivered price was on a new machine, not a scratch and dent. I could go with this machine and wait for the Grizz hybrid – saving $400-$500 dollars wouldn’t bother my purchasing manager.

As far as wood I work in – I’m pretty vanilla. Oak, Walnut, Cherry – for tables up to 2” – 3” thick. Ummm – practicing handcut dovetails? I probably should but I’m kind of a “lazy” woodworker – why do it by hand when they make machines to do the work?

I also wanted to mention how well quality, well-kept machines keep their value. I sold that Grizzly 8” on Craigslist for $500 and my whole table saw setup for $1500 on Craigslist. That’s not a whole lot less than what I paid for them 15 years ago.

Again, as I new member of Lumberjocks, thanks for all your input – keep it coming.

View MarionSSS's profile

MarionSSS

28 posts in 1341 days


#8 posted 01-18-2011 11:13 PM

Whoops! 750 lbs. is not 3/4 of ton more like just over 1/3 a ton.

View live4ever's profile

live4ever

983 posts in 1660 days


#9 posted 01-18-2011 11:36 PM

Hehe, oops – my mistake. Still, being 1/3 of a ton doesn’t make those 750 lbs. any lighter. :)

-- Optimists are usually disappointed. Pessimists are either right or pleasantly surprised. I tend to be a disappointed pessimist.

View dbhost's profile

dbhost

5383 posts in 1882 days


#10 posted 01-19-2011 12:01 AM

From all the reviews I have seen about the extremely poor customer service, I would be VERY hard pressed to even give Laguna even a passing glance…

Have you looked into maybe the Jet JJP-12? Not the el cheapo bench top units, but the 12” floor model?

FWIW, I have had back orders from Grizzly in the past, and they were filled pretty fast. I guess it depends on how quick you want the order filled… It does seem though that Grizzly has had an awful lot of back orders lately…

-- My workshop blog can be found at http://daves-workshop.blogspot.com

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

14742 posts in 2325 days


#11 posted 01-19-2011 03:59 AM

If I were a saw maker, I would be keeping minimum inventory too with housing in the toliet and unempoyment and underemployment at 30-40%. There are 3 Dewalt 735s that have been on clearance at 2 Biue Boxes wthin 5 miles of my house since October. If they have been increasing backorders… don’t expect change in the near future.. expect more.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View carl_felderrep's profile

carl_felderrep

9 posts in 1333 days


#12 posted 01-21-2011 02:39 AM

Hi Guys,
I just run into this forum when looking for reviews on drill presses for one of my customers. Seems like a great forum. My customer is torn between Delta and General international. Part of the problem is she also needs to do some metal work on it. This brings in variable speed. Any of you guys have any suggestions.

BTW, this is a good thread on jointer/planers. My two cents. In the world of combo machines the jointer/planer is a great way to go. I would say if you look at space savings and material handling the jointer planer can be quicker than stand alongs. You end up with a wider jointer that matches your planer. Now, if you add to that matching up, your resaw capacity on the band saw you get the perfect balance.

View Pop's profile

Pop

419 posts in 2596 days


#13 posted 01-21-2011 03:15 AM

Having dealt with Luguna customer service & looking at the quality of machines my woodworking friends have from Luguna their equipment is on a level with General & Powermatic not Grizzly or Shop Fox (again Grizzly) I’me lined up to buy their dovetail cabinet saw & their 3 hp. cyclone. I think it’s the best product for the money out there.

On the subject of Grizzly cabinet saws. I have so far talked to several woodworkers who bought those saws and had problems with bearings, alignment & power shaft / arbor quality. This is from their mouths I have not personally had experience with Grizzly saws.

Pop

-- One who works with his hands is a laborer, his hands & head A craftsman, his hands, head & heart a artist

View Kevin's profile

Kevin

445 posts in 1855 days


#14 posted 01-21-2011 03:30 AM

Chances are griz will have the stuff in stock before that date if past experience is anything like i’ve seen before. The 1023 is a awesome saw for sure.

Kevin

-- Williamsburg, KY

View MarionSSS's profile

MarionSSS

28 posts in 1341 days


#15 posted 01-21-2011 04:57 AM

Pop you say:
“Having dealt with Luguna customer service & looking at the quality of machines my woodworking friends have from Luguna their equipment is on a level with General & Powermatic not Grizzly or Shop Fox (again Grizzly)”

I think I would agree with you for the most part except for Laguna’s Platinum series of machinery. Compare Laguna’s Platinum Series Tablesaw Left-tilt w/ T-square Fence to the Grizzly G0691. It’s hard to tell strictly from the pictures and specs but they look virtually identical to me. The fences in particular look exactly the same. Both machines are made in China. Price diff – $300 more for the Laguna.

The J/P combo machines aren’t quite as identical but the 12” machines from both companies are very similar especially the new G0634XP to the 12” Platinum. Price diff – $1050. Again both made in China.

showing 1 through 15 of 42 replies

Have your say...

You must be signed in to reply.

DISCLAIMER: Any posts on LJ are posted by individuals acting in their own right and do not necessarily reflect the views of LJ. LJ will not be held liable for the actions of any user.

Latest Projects | Latest Blog Entries | Latest Forum Topics

HomeRefurbers.com

Latest Projects | Latest Blog Entries | Latest Forum Topics

GardenTenders.com :: gardening showcase