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Forum topic by mindbender29 posted 08-20-2017 03:07 PM 1504 views 0 times favorited 22 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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mindbender29

7 posts in 94 days


08-20-2017 03:07 PM

Topic tags/keywords: question

I am new here but have been reading on here for years. I want people to understand I know the easy answer here is to saw Saw Stop no matter what but I am asking to help me decide on the bigger picture. But there is no way I can decide this and take the safety question out of it all.

I have done woodworking for years and had a decent shop set up. I tried to get my kids involved to no success. So about 2 and a half years ago I decided that I would be better off selling all my bigger stuff and doing things that my boys wanted to since they were all in high school and time was short with them. My one son is almost 20 and he has Velo Cardio Facial Syndrome. In his high school he went to shop class the past 2 years and loved it. He then wanted to start making things with me AFTER I sold my things. We have made the decision to rebuild the shop and for he and I to work on projects together since he is now finished high school and wants to keep making things.

I need a table saw and my budget is about $1,700 on the top end for a hybrid style in the garage. I want advice on what one to buy between the Powermatic, Jet Proshop or the Saw Stop. I know that people will saw Saw Stop but my son is not where he will not listen to me and go out and do something on his own if I am not around. He will not be using the saw either (although they let him in school I found out) but in the back of my head I think “what if”. We can make it to where I cut the breaker to the saw when not around incase he got a wild hair but I don’t think he would.

I have looked at these and to be honest the Powermatic looks to be the best and the Sawstop just has so many add ons to get it to the point to where it looks to be the same bang for the buck. I do not like Grizzly because the warranty is a year and every single time I talk to them they seem so rude. I also don’t want to pack a saw up and ship it back either. I want something to work and work correctly. I know Sawstop is a year as well but they seem to have better customer service than Grizzly. I would have to get the Sawstop hybrid with only the rolling base add on to stay in the same price point then add on all the other stuff down the line.

I have read a lot about this on the forums but there does not seem to be one throwing in all the different things I have to decide. So please don’t say there are other posts because I know that but I have a lot to figure out with my son, saw quality, customer service of the brand and upgrades in the future. So all that being said I decided to sign up and ask.

Thank you!


22 replies so far

View mahdee's profile

mahdee

3823 posts in 1582 days


#1 posted 08-20-2017 04:28 PM

I have a Grizzly and am very satisfied with it. As it relates to your son, I am not sure on which side of the “spectrum” he is. Does he have seizure, learning difficulty, behavior issues? Those conditions can greatly change the decision making as to limitations in using certain tools. I’ve been working with developmentally disabled for 36 years now and you would be surprised how capable some of these folks can be. If there are learning issues, the a routine is very important. If you want to discuss this in private, please don’t hesitate to contact me.

-- earthartandfoods.com

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Gilley23

358 posts in 196 days


#2 posted 08-20-2017 04:54 PM

The clear answer to me is safety. You know your child better than anyone and since you’re asking this question at all, that tells me that you do have a concern for his safety. Sawstop without a question.

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mindbender29

7 posts in 94 days


#3 posted 08-20-2017 05:12 PM

He is mentally around 8 years old. He does not have behavior issues and has a very kind heart. He will listen to what he is told to do and was in the wood shop at school with no issues for 2 years.

Yes, you are correct that I question safety. But I would be considering it if it is him or just me. My thing is also the quality of the product we would be getting as well. I can’t afford to buy it twice. Lets say that I knew for sure the Saw Stop hybrid was not nearly as good as the Powermatic but the Saw Stop has the safety feature. I would buy the Powermatic and just pull the breaker when I was done to avoid the wild hair situation. I will not let him use the table saw regardless of what one I buy for us to use . A sander or those type tools he can use but I will under no circumstances use the table saw.

I just hate all the add ons to the Sawstop and I wonder to start off with is it a good quality saw when I will not be able to afford the upgrades on the fence and the cast iron top. I also hate every time I go into a Woodcraft or my local dealer they won’t even talk to you about other brands they push the Saw Stop so hard. I get it won’t cut your fingers off and that is a great thing. But that does not mean it is the only option people have as well. I am not a wealthy man so I am trying to figure it all out. Grizzly looks nice but the whole ship it back to them when there is an issue get me. Also the agents I have talked to have terrible attitudes. If I lived there then sure I would look at them but I am in SC and that is a long drive!

View jmalcolm001's profile

jmalcolm001

17 posts in 566 days


#4 posted 08-20-2017 05:55 PM

Food for thought. Since you say that you won’t let your son use the table saw, safety for him shouldn’t be a significant consideration in deciding what saw to buy. Therefore, the safety issue concerns your use. You need to decide whether your safety practices ensure that you don’t need the safety features of a SS, or perhaps you think your fingers are less valuable than your son’s!! Consider also, since your son has already had a taste of the forbidden fruit of using a table saw at school, how difficult will it be for him to accept that he can’t use your saw? If your main concern with him using a table saw is that he might cut himself, perhaps the purchase of a SS would alleviate that concern enough to allow him to use the saw. All things to consider.

BTW, I don’t own a SawStop, but wish I did!!

View BurlyBob's profile

BurlyBob

4955 posts in 2080 days


#5 posted 08-20-2017 07:33 PM

Let take a moment to say, You Sir are an outstanding father. Going to the lengths you are for your son is wonderful and very worthy of praise. I have no doubt of the personal rewards you will receive for your efforts. My respect and compliments to you.

View mindbender29's profile

mindbender29

7 posts in 94 days


#6 posted 08-20-2017 07:41 PM

I think both our fingers are valuable! Trying to figure out the true quality of the SS without all the add on that they sell compared to the others. Then figure out is the safety feature worth it vs pulling the breaker. I still don’t think I want him using a SS. They are not 100%. So may pull the breaker anyway just in case.

Thank you Burly. I believe God intrusted me with 3 boys and I fail all the time but I am trying to do all I can to give my oldest a rewarding life. He will always be with us at home. If I don’t do for him then it won’t happen.

View Redoak49's profile

Redoak49

2852 posts in 1803 days


#7 posted 08-20-2017 08:27 PM

Sounds like you do not want a Sawstop…OK. I do not understand the add-on issue as you can buy it with nothing else but the base unit.

Instead of a table saw, he might like making things on a scroll saw…safer, cheaper and lots of different things to make.

View mindbender29's profile

mindbender29

7 posts in 94 days


#8 posted 08-20-2017 08:39 PM

I do want one just a lot of money for stamped steel wings and one year warranty. In school he made bookshelfs and he wants to keep making those.

View AZWoody's profile (online now)

AZWoody

1126 posts in 1038 days


#9 posted 08-20-2017 09:18 PM

I don’t know what you mean in terms of add-ons. I did a lot of research on the SawStop before buying my new table saw. The only real variations in terms of what you buy could be the fence, as it’s different between the models but the only other things you can add are the slider extension, overhead dust collection and the type of roller stand.

As far as I remember, there was nothing that could be added to make the build more stout or a better saw. In terms of quality, even though I did not buy the SawStop, the build was actually top notch and the castings are heavier than the other brands because of the amount of force that is exerted when braking a moving blade. It has to be overbuilt for that reason.

One thing I would recommend, on any of your tools, rather than pulling breakers is to use keyed switches for everything. Even something as simple as the kind that you have to insert a plastic tab. As he needs it, insert it and let him use the tool and when you’re done, pull the tabs and put them up where he won’t find them or even lock them in a drawer.

View Jim Finn's profile

Jim Finn

2564 posts in 2736 days


#10 posted 08-20-2017 09:21 PM



Sounds like you do not want a Sawstop…OK. I do not understand the add-on issue as you can buy it with nothing else but the base unit.

Instead of a table saw, he might like making things on a scroll saw…safer, cheaper and lots of different things to make.

- Redoak49


I agree 100% the safest tool in my shop is my scroll saw. One can cut their finger a little but that is it. There are many many things to make using a scroll saw. Check out some scroll saw forums.

-- No PHD, but I have a GED and my DD 214

View TaySC's profile

TaySC

268 posts in 147 days


#11 posted 08-20-2017 09:39 PM

I assume by add-on that he means all the upgrades you can select in the various steps of the build your saw.

Step 1 (for instance ), he can get the base contractor saw starting at $1,599 (already over his limit once you add delivery and taxes I believe)

Step 2 is where you select the fence…. he can get the 30” standard for no extra money, but the 36” or 52” adds $200 or $300 respectively.

Step 3 is mobility. If you are fine without the mobile base there is no additional fee here, but if you want either mobile base it adds either $160 or $199 depending on which you chose.

Step 4 is the dust collection, cast iron wings, sliding crosscut table or dust port adapter. All are options that obviously cost more.

Step 5 is add on like blades, zero clearance insert and extra brakes. Again, none are required at the time of purchase.

So you could get the $1,599 contractor saw on stand and only have to pay whatever shipping and taxes are required. If you want to add some things to it, however, that same saw with add-on can easily get up to $2,500 or so.

View TravisH's profile

TravisH

548 posts in 1749 days


#12 posted 08-21-2017 04:29 AM

My youngest brother is special needs and he still lives with my parents (39 years) and can understand your situation. Growing up with him and even now a lot of strange things/accidents occurred over the years.

I don’t have a Saw Stop, don’t like some of the dealings, etc. but bottom line it is solid saw (based on reviews and the limited opportunity I got to use one) and will make a difference if contact is made.

I personally would look at it from a different scenario. Stuff happens and even if unlikely the one thing I would keep asking myself is…. losing a finger or two will it impact us being able to work in the shop building things he wants? Would he want to continue to build things if you had lost a finger or would it scare him away from something he enjoys?

View AZWoody's profile (online now)

AZWoody

1126 posts in 1038 days


#13 posted 08-21-2017 04:59 PM



I assume by add-on that he means all the upgrades you can select in the various steps of the build your saw.

Step 1 (for instance ), he can get the base contractor saw starting at $1,599 (already over his limit once you add delivery and taxes I believe)

Step 2 is where you select the fence…. he can get the 30” standard for no extra money, but the 36” or 52” adds $200 or $300 respectively.

Step 3 is mobility. If you are fine without the mobile base there is no additional fee here, but if you want either mobile base it adds either $160 or $199 depending on which you chose.

Step 4 is the dust collection, cast iron wings, sliding crosscut table or dust port adapter. All are options that obviously cost more.

Step 5 is add on like blades, zero clearance insert and extra brakes. Again, none are required at the time of purchase.

So you could get the $1,599 contractor saw on stand and only have to pay whatever shipping and taxes are required. If you want to add some things to it, however, that same saw with add-on can easily get up to $2,500 or so.

- TaySC

I actually mentioned those things. Those are add ons that you pretty much would have to buy for any saw. There is nothing in the base model that makes it inferior if you don’t buy the extras.

Any other saw, you decide from 30-50 inch fence, mobile base (third party), etc.

Actually, most don’t even have an option for an overhead dust collection and the standard dust collection on most tablesaws are not that good. My main point was that there was nothing in the add-ons that you need to buy to make it an equal or better saw to match up with the other top brands.

View mindbender29's profile

mindbender29

7 posts in 94 days


#14 posted 08-21-2017 05:06 PM

Thank you for all the responses to this question. I had to work 3rd shift last night and it is a very physical job and I get wiped out. It is hard to work 3rd shift one day a week it completely throws me off my schedule. I am not sure what I am going to do at this point. I want to be able to let him build the things he wants and we looked at a scroll saw today. I sold my Excalibur scroll saw 2.5 years ago but again that is when I thought I would be taking away time from the boys. Anyway, I also thinking to buy a cheaper saw like the Dewalt just to make a few book shelves that he wants to make and make sure he is going to want to stick with it. That way I only invest a few hundred and have a portable saw as well. But if he decides not to stick with it I am not out $1,599 plus tax.

View JakeG's profile

JakeG

15 posts in 122 days


#15 posted 08-21-2017 07:20 PM

You’re looking at the SS hybrid, right? You’re not interested in the jobsite saw? Or the Bosch Reaxx?

If safety is your concern, then you should get a Sawstop. I would if I could afford one.

I think that you will be able to get close to 80% of your money back on the saw stop if you take excellent care of it and decide to sell it. I also kind of doubt that you would ever want to sell it. The only people I’ve ever heard complain about the Sawstop were grumpy old contractors who didn’t like using the push stick.

My son is only 17 months old, but I would love to do woodworking with him some day. I don’t think that I could do it with my current table saw (Delta 34-410). IF (god forbid) he had a preventable injury, I would think about how much that $1599 saw cost.
How many hours would it take to earn it?
How much does a permanent injury cost?

Damn, now I want to go buy one right now!

My dad actually lent me his table saw, and I thought about it in that moment. I knew I could never lend my son my table saw unless it had some countermeasures.

If you’re going to get a half measure, then get a track saw. At least then you have a pro-quality tool, instead of a throw away saw. They also seem to be very safe!

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