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Forum topic by GregD posted 01-14-2011 04:37 PM 6543 views 0 times favorited 17 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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GregD

634 posts in 1859 days


01-14-2011 04:37 PM

What is the best glue for attaching 1/4” thick skin onto a flat substrate? I would like plenty of working time ‘cause I work slow. I was going to use original Titebond, but I’ve heard also about someone using DAP plastic resin glue:
http://www.dap.com/product_details.aspx?BrandID=63&SubcatID=10

I am building an interior door with a stave core. The blank for each stile and rail is a red cedar stave core (butcher block). Onto the each edge of the core I’ve glued a strip of African mahogany. Now I need to glue 1/4 layer of mahogany to each face of the core. The stiles are 5”x80” (and shorter) and the raiils are 9”x37” (and narrower).

I’ve been advised to glue both skins onto the core at the same time. I was going to use pads made from HF anti-fatigue floor mats (on sale today through Monday in my area) between the skin and 3/4” thick plywood cauls for the clamp-up.

-- Greg D.


17 replies so far

View ND2ELK's profile

ND2ELK

13495 posts in 2496 days


#1 posted 01-14-2011 04:46 PM

I used Titebond extend when I did my crib moldings and curved pieces. The Dap product is good to.

-- Mc Bridge Cabinets, Iowa

View Earlextech's profile

Earlextech

1010 posts in 1413 days


#2 posted 01-14-2011 11:47 PM

Titebond will work great. Just make sure glue covers the entire piece and you must do both sides at once or you will warp in one direction.

-- Sam Hamory - The project is never finished until its "finished"!

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papadan

1156 posts in 2091 days


#3 posted 01-15-2011 12:00 AM

Use contact cement. It applies to both surfaces and allow to dry. When the pieces are put together it is instant and permanent. I prefer the green can of water based, no stink or dangerous fumes. Here a little tutorial I made on laminating.

-- Carpenter assembles with hands, Designer builds with brains, Artist creates with heart!

View fussy's profile

fussy

980 posts in 1773 days


#4 posted 01-15-2011 02:15 AM

Greg,

Some say urea formaldehyde, some say ordinary pva (white, yellow) and contact cement should work fine too. Glue won’t stick where it isn’t, so spread it thouroughly and caefully. With some of the extended open time pva glue,ie titebond, elmers, you get a few minutes longer to work, contact cement gives you plenty of time to line things up but only ONE shot at sticking them down. Read the labels, consider your way of working, and decide for yourself. They will all work,k maybe.

Steve

-- Steve in KY. 44 years so far with my lovely bride. Think I'll keep her.

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TopamaxSurvivor

15024 posts in 2398 days


#5 posted 01-15-2011 11:00 AM

DAn, Your link is a 404 file not found error.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

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TopamaxSurvivor

15024 posts in 2398 days


#6 posted 01-15-2011 11:06 AM

What is the open time on the Dap? Tech page says pot life is 4 hours at 70 F. Seems like it should be less once it is spread out.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

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GregD

634 posts in 1859 days


#7 posted 01-18-2011 03:18 PM

Thanks for the comments. I think I’m going to go with Titebond simply because I’m more familiar with it.

Part of the challenge for me is that there are several steps in this door-building process that involve techniques I’ve never done before…

I decided it would be worth the trouble to make a practice run on the gluing procedure. I glued up an extra core, no problem. However, I wasn’t happy with the results I was getting on test cuts as I was working up to resawing the practice skins. I haven’t done much bandsaw work and this is the first resawing I’ve done. So I’ve been working on that the past few days. Got some advice from the staff at the local Woodcraft. Pulled, cleaned, and lubed the blade, cleaned the tires and guides, reinstalled the blade, and went through the usual tune-up procedure. Then I made sure my fence was perpendicular to the table, and that the workpiece would run flat against the fence and table with no wobble. Finally, I ran some test cuts at a much slower feed rate and got much more satisfactory results. So next step is to cut some skins from inexpensive red cedar, and proceed with my practice glue-up.

-- Greg D.

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GregD

634 posts in 1859 days


#8 posted 01-18-2011 03:24 PM

My impression is that DAP cures by chemical reaction – like epoxy – so I would expect open time to not change much when the glue is spread out. The clamp times are quite long.

papadan – any suggestions on how to get an even coating of contact cement? I’ve only used it once for some plastic laminate and the stuff is so thick and sticky that I got it thick in spots and thin in others. I probably would have had better luck using a wide putty knife.

-- Greg D.

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papadan

1156 posts in 2091 days


#9 posted 01-18-2011 06:36 PM

Putty knife or plastic spreader works best. HERE is that link

-- Carpenter assembles with hands, Designer builds with brains, Artist creates with heart!

View Loren's profile

Loren

7809 posts in 2370 days


#10 posted 01-18-2011 07:08 PM

The trouble with contact cement is putting the pieces together in the alignment
you want. The glue grabs immediately on contact. The a 1/4” thick panel
you probably won’t have much of a problem – just leave plenty of excess around
the edges of the skins and trim them after the glue set.

Applying plastic laminate or veneer with contact cement you have to
make sure the glue grabs in a specific sequence so you don’t get big
bubbles. With something stiff like a doorskin I wouldn’t expect the
bubble thing to be a problem.

I’ve used a small paint roller to apply it or a cheap chip-brush. You can
spray it too but it cleanup is a hassle.

-- http://lawoodworking.com

View Colin 's profile

Colin

93 posts in 1533 days


#11 posted 01-18-2011 10:49 PM

I actually did a couple of closet doors with contact cement. Worked fine but it supposedly has a lot of creep. In other words, eventually gravity will cause it to sag a little.

Woodweld or other urea resin glues work well I’ve been told but I have a hard time keeping my shop warm enough to use it so I have a bucket of powdered, catalysed urea resin glue that has yet to be opened.

Titebond 1 works, titebond lll works, but titebond ll has too much creep. Titebond lll has more open time which can be a good thing.

As far as resawing face veneers, the final step should be running it through a thickness sander. I just pay the shop at my lumber yard to run mine, they usually only charge about $7.50 which is their minimum. I resaw it myself but am thinking about having them do that part too. That has more to do with labor costs though. If I want to pay myself a decent wage, it actually costs a little less to have them do it.

I use door stiles I cut off of a commercially built door as culls when clamping up engineered core frame members. Keeps everything nice and flat and distributes the clamping pressure more evenly.

-- http://www.columbiawoodscreendoors.com

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Colin

93 posts in 1533 days


#12 posted 01-18-2011 10:57 PM

One more thing, you probably checked this but just in case…

You need to use kiln-dried wood for your core, otherwise it will expand and contract too much and can cause checks in your face veneer.

Also, it is usually not a good idea to use softwood as a core for hardwood faces. Poplar is a good choice if it is interior. You can also use generic mahogany if you have a source that sells it cheap.

These problems are more of an issue when doing exterior doors but it can effect interior doors as well.

-- http://www.columbiawoodscreendoors.com

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GregD

634 posts in 1859 days


#13 posted 01-19-2011 03:25 AM

Argh…

Colin – I thought about that, but was hoping I wouldn’t have a problem with an interior door. Making new cores with poplar is going to set me back a bit, but probably the sensible thing to do.

-- Greg D.

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

15024 posts in 2398 days


#14 posted 01-19-2011 04:25 AM

Colin You seem to have the handle on glues; what about plain old white glue like Elmer’s?

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View Colin 's profile

Colin

93 posts in 1533 days


#15 posted 01-20-2011 07:32 AM

Greg, like you say it probably won’t move much being interior… I just wouldn’t want to take the chance personally.

Topamax, to be honest, I have never used Elmer’s and don’t really know anything about it. I was under the impression it is similar to titebond l, but not sure.

-- http://www.columbiawoodscreendoors.com

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