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Invicta/Delta DJ-15 Jointer Help

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Forum topic by deejay34 posted 03-25-2017 05:34 PM 792 views 0 times favorited 8 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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deejay34

9 posts in 444 days


03-25-2017 05:34 PM

I recently purchased an Invicta/Delta DJ-15 jointer via online auction. Unfortunately I did not have the opportunity to view the jointer in-person prior to bidding, as I caught wind of the listing the day it was due to end. So, I bid anyway. What little description was provided, combined with a few listing photos, appeared to offer a good tool in reasonable condition for what I felt was a good price (I ended up getting it for $300). See below for a few pictures from the listing:

It’s been sitting in the garage for a few weeks now, for a variety of reasons. For one, the tool identification plate shown in the auction listing (and confirmed upon first sight), indicated that it’s 230V. I currently do not have 230V capability, but since I’ve been contemplating the upgrade for quite some time now since some of my tools (table saw, dust collector, and drill press) are dual-voltage capable, I figured the purchase of this jointer would give me just the kick in the pants that I needed to add the sub-panel in my garage that I’ve been planning. See below for a photo of the tool plate:

As shown in the photo above, it clearly indicates 230V single phase. Well, when I started to take things apart to give it a good once-over and start the clean-up process yesterday evening, this is what I saw when I popped off the back motor cover on the stand:

Just in case it doesn’t show up clearly in this post, the motor is a 3/4-HP Delta 66-074, 200-Volt, 32-Amp, 1725 RPM, 3-phase piece of equipment. Oh boy. Here’s some photos of the electrical configuration and wiring diagram:

First, let me explain my plan. I already know that I am likely to sink more time/money into getting this machine operational than I anticipated…but, as they say, that ship has sailed. So, I’m approaching this as an opportunity to learn about my machine, what makes it work, and how to best take care of it so that I can enjoy it for many years to come. Basically, I want to learn about “what’s under the hood”, so to speak. I’ve already started cleaning up the beds and rabbet ledge, which have turned out really nice. Nothing that some Rust-Free, a few Scotch-Brite pads, and a little elbow grease couldn’t fix. There is a lot of gunk build-up (appears to be many years worth of grease, saw-dust, and who knows what else) in all of the nooks and crannies of this thing, so I’m thinking about a complete disassembly, thorough cleaning, maybe some sanding/priming/re-painting, and putting everything back together. This would be my first attempt at such an effort, but that’s what I’m thinking at the moment.

So, I’m looking for input, guidance, recommendations…all of the above. Let’s just start at the top:

1. What can be done in order to make it operational? I think my options are to either get a phase converter (if so, do I go with a static or rotary converter), swap out the motor for a single-phase motor (if so, any recommendations), or outfit my garage with 3-phase power capability (out of the question). I’m leaning towards a phase converter, but I don’t even know where to begin. If I go the phase-converter route, I think I’d still need to upgrade my electrical for 240V capability, correct? I should point out that I am not necessarily electrically savy. I can/have installed new 120V circuits, light fixtures, and A/V equipment, but that’s about the extent of it. With that said, I’m a quick learner, and what I lack in aptitude I make up for with conviction…or just pounding my head up against the wall until I believe I’ve solved the problem. But in all seriousness, any suggestions/recommendations are greatly appreciated, and details/specifics/photos/examples are even more helpful.

2. Given that I’ve never undertaken a restoration, am I crazy for wanting to completely disassemble this thing? Looking closely under the infeed/outfeed tables, and just at the front of the machine where the table locks are located, there is a lot of build-up that needs to be cleaned. A lot of it appears to be grease caked with sawdust. I figure if I’m going to go through the effort to make the machine operational, why not just go all-in and clean it up like new so that I never have to worry about it again? I’ve seen a lot of posts about various types of restorations (table saws, jointers, drill presses, etc.), but does anyone have any specific recommendations about this jointer, or something like it? Is there anything inherently difficult about a parallelogram-style jointer that might dissuade me from complete disassembly?

3. I’ve already loosened the positive stop nuts/bolts in order to lower the infeed/outfeed tables all the way so that I could remove the cutterhead assembly. The knives are shot, but I’ve already got a new set from Infinity ready to go. I was able to get the front bearing block off without much effort, but the rear bearing block (next to the belt pulley) is another story. I can’t seem to get that one loose. Again, I figured since I’m going through this much effort, I mine as well check/replace the bearings while I’m at it. Any suggestions on how to get the rear bearing block off? How about suggestions on replacement bearings?

4. Regarding exterior clean-up, it seems like a common approach is to de-rust, sand/strip any loose paint, prime, and paint. I’ve already got several small components and fasteners soaking in Evapo-Rust, as I’ve had good luck with that in the past stripping down hand-plane components. For larger components that won’t fit in a container/sealable bag, I plan to use naval jelly for any rust removal. The stand and the painted portions of the jointer body need some clean up, but I don’t know that I’ll need to go to the extent of stripping any paint. My current plan is to give everything a good wipe-down to remove any loose debris, followed by a good cleaning with mineral spirits and/or acetone. I am currently planning to use some Rust-Oleum spray primer on all painted surfaces, followed by some type of spray-on paint (likely aerosolized, as I don’t have a sprayer). I know several folks have posted about taking a paint chip sample to places like Sherwin Williams in order to get an exact color match…I may do that, or I may just go with a standard off-the-shelf grey from Rust-Oleum. Again, I’m open to input/suggestions.

5. I’m also thinking about some other small upgrades while I’m at it. Those upgrades include a link belt and a cast iron pulley. The existing belt appears to be in ok condition, but my experience installing a link belt on my table saw has been very positive, so I figured why not? Regarding the pulley, the current pulley appears to be the original pot metal pulley. I have no reason to believe it isn’t functional, but again, while I’m at it, why not? Any opinions on these (or other) upgrades that might prove useful?

Ok, I think that’s all I have for now. Thank you all in advance for any input you might be able to provide. I’ll do my best to document the process with photos and plan to post updates as I move along. Thanks again!


8 replies so far

View MrUnix's profile (online now)

MrUnix

5978 posts in 2032 days


#1 posted 03-25-2017 05:54 PM

Ouch… 200V three phase – that should have been stated in the auction listing up front. BTW, for a 3/4HP motor, that should be 3.2A, not 32A!

I’d get a VFD for it, and sell the starter that is on there now to recover some of your money. While running it on 240V may cause it to run a bit hot, that should not really be much of a problem unless you plan on using it for really long periods of time – like in a production environment… shouldn’t really be much of a problem in a home/weekend warrior environment (just keep it in mind).

And, if you don’t have 240v available, you can run it off 120v. You can get something like the FM50-101 for about $125, which will take 120V single phase input and produce 240V three phase output. A sensorless vector drive, like the L510-101 would work as well and give you a few extra options, but for a jointer, the V/Hz drive (FM50) is more than enough – you would not be able to use a lot of the extras the SVD would give you.

Of course, you could always swap out the motor – but then you would not only be looking at the cost of a replacement motor, but also would need to address the starter issue.

As for restoring it – that is up to you – but from the looks of it, I’d probably just put in some new bearings, clean up and wax the tables, and start making wood chips. And this is from someone who loves restoring old machinery :)

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

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Mike_D_S

311 posts in 2048 days


#2 posted 03-25-2017 06:02 PM

Well, I have a few thoughts on 1, 2 and 3

#1: My first thoughts would be to just sell the motor you have and swap in a single phase motor. My gut feel that at 1HP a phase converter is probably going to cost you the same as a 1HP motor. You might find a LJ who’ll do a swap with you? If it had been 3HP or more then the relative cost of the motor would be worth looking at the converter. Take note that as mentioned above you’ll need to do some wiring as you won’t need the existing starter circuit.

#2: Do you like to tinker and take things apart? If the answer to that is yes, then go for it. As long as you don’t lose any parts I doubt you could really mess anything up. And when you’re done you’ll know it backwards and forwards. You can find the exploded diagram on ereplacementparts or other similar web sites and that should be a good guide for disassembly. In the days of cell phone cameras, when I do any work like this I take a lot of pictures so I can remind myself days (weeks…months….ok ok a year) later when I need to put it back together. Additionally, I use ziploc bags and sticky notes to group sets of small parts. So for example all the bolts, nuts, etc for the cutterhead would go in a ziplock bag with a sticky note labeled ‘cutterhead bolts’. This strategy has saved me many times and allows you to stay very organized as you can line the bags up in order you’ll need them and not have to sort through a pile of parts.

#3: Try wicking in some penetrating oil if you can. Leave it overnight and try again. Sometimes it helps to give the offending bolt a sharp rap with a big punch from the top to help break it loose. Worse comes to worse, get new bolts and grind the heads off. Remove the bearing block then use a combination of penetrating oil, heat gun and vise grips to work the old bolts out. Absolute worst case is you have to drill it out and clean up the threads.

I personally love to tinker and see how things are assembled, so this would be fun for me…..
Mike

-- No honey, that's not new, I've had that forever......

View deejay34's profile

deejay34

9 posts in 444 days


#3 posted 03-26-2017 01:11 AM

Brad – Thanks so much for the input. The FM50-101 looks like a good solution. With that said, what other components would I need to complete the electrical portion of the swap? You mentioned a starter…do you have any recommendstions? If I were to go this route, is it as simple as wiring the motor to the VFD, and then wiring that to the starter, or is there more to it than that? Are there any references you can point me to that might illustrate the process?

Mike – Thank you for your input. If I were to swap the motor, I assume that a 3/4 – 1 hp motor that operates at 1725rpm would suffice, as that would be equivalent to achieving the cutterhead speed provided by the existing 3-phase motor? If that’s the case, I assume I could continue to use the existing motor pulley, correct?

If I do go the route of a motor swap, I would likely select a dual voltage 120/240V model so that I could make use of it once I choose to do my electrical upgrade. Are there any issues with that?

Finally, you mentioned the need to upgrade the electrical for a motor swap. Any chance you could point me in the right direction?

Many thanks to you both for your help. Keep it coming!

-DJ

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MrUnix

5978 posts in 2032 days


#4 posted 03-26-2017 02:27 AM

Brad – Thanks so much for the input. The FM50-101 looks like a good solution. With that said, what other components would I need to complete the electrical portion of the swap? You mentioned a starter…do you have any recommendstions? If I were to go this route, is it as simple as wiring the motor to the VFD, and then wiring that to the starter, or is there more to it than that? Are there any references you can point me to that might illustrate the process?

No.. you rip the starter out that is on there now (last two of your pictures above). The VFD provides the motor control and overload protection, so the starter is not used or needed. Couldn’t be easier, and the hardest part is trying to figure out where to mount the VFD. Only other thing required would be some wire and a plug for the wall (eg: an extension cord with the socket part cut off :)

Finally, you mentioned the need to upgrade the electrical for a motor swap. Any chance you could point me in the right direction?

The starter is a safety device… it has a magnetic contactor in it that will prevent the machine from coming back on after a power fail, and provides overload protection to the specific motor it is configured for. Change the motor, and you need to change the starters overload capability – there is a list on the data sheet you pictured above, which specifies what heater(s) you need for specific amperages. Try reading this primer over at the VM site: Magnetic Starters
One other alternative would be to get rid of the existing starter and get a cheaper IEC type starter, which has what I like to call ‘dial-a-amp’ :) Although that would bump up costs a lot more and be inferior to what you have now.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

View deejay34's profile

deejay34

9 posts in 444 days


#5 posted 03-26-2017 04:15 AM

Brad – I think I get the VFD and what would be required to wire it up. If I understand you correctly and am interpreting the user manual correctly, it looks like I simply disconnect the existing wiring that currently connects the motor to the starter, and instead connect that wiring to the VFD. Since the VFD controls the motor, does it also now act like an “on/off” switch as well, such that I could mount the VFD on the front of the jointer in place of the current switch (see pic below)?

If so, I assume that I also simply eliminate the wiring that currently connects the starter to the existing “on/off” switch on the front of the machine? You can kind of see the two wires in the picture below (one connects the motor to the starter, and one connects the “on/off” switch to the starter).

If my interpretation is correct, then the only connection that I’m left with is between the motor and the VFD, which is then connected to my power supply (I would just plan to use a 12-gauge extension chord with the female end cut off and wired to the VFD, per your suggestion above). Sound about right?

Thanks again for your help!

-DJ

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MrUnix

5978 posts in 2032 days


#6 posted 03-26-2017 04:21 AM

You will probably want keep the switch on the front of the machine, and mount the VFD somewhere else, like inside the cabinet. You can do everything from the panel on the VFD, but it’s not as convenient. The switch on the front just hooks up to the VFD and acts as a remote on/off switch. And yes, motor wires to VFD, and the VFD plugs into your wall outlet.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - In Dog I trust... everything else is questionable

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deejay34

9 posts in 444 days


#7 posted 03-26-2017 10:33 PM

Brad – Thanks again for the tips. Ideally, I’d like to be able to use the current switch to start/stop the motor, so if that is doable via wiring the existing switch to the VFD, then that’s what I’ll plan to do. I’m planning to purchase the VFD either later this evening or tomorrow (online), so will be sure to keep posting updates as things progress. Thanks again for the help!

-DJ

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SpryGuy

1 post in 37 days


#8 posted 11-04-2017 03:57 PM

Hey DJ – Any luck with this project? I just got one of these jointers and I’m in the same situation. Can you clarify what you did to get it to work and possibly post pics of your installation and restoration?

Thanks Matt

-- Matt

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