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Replacing R4512 with 36-725?

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Forum topic by John146 posted 03-08-2017 09:42 PM 692 views 0 times favorited 13 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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John146

90 posts in 439 days


03-08-2017 09:42 PM

Hi Folks!

I’ve been lurking here for quite a while, and I know there are almost identical threads/questions compared to these, but I’m also under the impression that the quality and build of products change with time.

I’m also a beginner that probably knows more about saw alignment than woodworking at this point :(

I have a R4512 that’s still under the return period. It did not come properly aligned from the store (I was na├»ve enough to think eyeballing it would be sufficient). I was worried it had the known trunnion misalignment issue, but after spending a day with it, I managed to get it well within 0.005”. I’m not sure it’ll hold though

The miter gauge that came with it was absolutely horrible, so I ended up buying an Incra V27, which is pretty nice. Yesterday I noticed that the fence won’t consistently lock in to the same position, and that no matter what I did, my cuts varied from anywhere between dead-on to a 1/32 variation on a 20” rip. It did help a bit if I pushed the fence forward before I locked it.

I’ve been eyeing the 36-725 at Lowes each time I walk in. The fence glides smoothly, the extensions are flush with the cast iron, and unlike the Ridgid, it doesn’t come crashing down to the floor when I disengage the caster system. I figure so much weight coming down at such a speed isn’t can’t be very good for the saw, and because my shop is small, I move it around a LOT.

I also spent an hour at Lowes yesterday seeing if the fence could be aligned properly, and it could (I needed to turn the adjustment hex screws – and then felt my finger up the miter slot and seeing if the fence was flush with it throughout its length, but the Ridgid failed the same test). The miter gauge seems solid enough, so maybe I could return the Incra (nice machine, but it wasn’t free and I don’t need anything other than the common 90, 45, 27.5, etc.) – I’ll purchase it when I need it.

I went to HD yesterday asking them what they could do, and they said that I would need to bring the saw in and have them inspect it for issues. I explained that if I had to disassemble the saw, I would just go and buy the Delta, but they didn’t budge. They are out of stock in Lowes, but are willing to sell me the display model for 10% off (and because I have the Lowes card, that’d be 15%, bringing it down to $510 from $600) – and that’s what I’m planning on doing.

The one thing I worry about the Delta is that only one of the casters swivels, which might mean it’s more difficult to move around my tiny shop (It’s just a shed).

There are also lots of used saws for sale (mainly Craftsman) for cheaper; some are more expensive. They all seem to be older and therefore lack a riving knife and so on.

Finally, I have the Bench Dog 40-102 cast iron extension router table. From reading the reviews, I would need to drill some holes in it in order to mount it to the Delta – I’m apprehensive about doing so, but mainly because I’ve never done it before.

Should I go with the 36-725 display model? Should I get a replacement R4512? Should I hold out for something nicer – and does that even exist with casters and the space constraints I’m working with? I’d really like to start doing more woodworking and learning more, and spending less time babying bad tools, but I also don’t want to break the bank.

-- John 14:6


13 replies so far

View Runner's profile

Runner

58 posts in 768 days


#1 posted 03-08-2017 10:12 PM

I wouldn’t buy the display model. All the displays I’ve seen have been beat up and looks nothing like my properly set-up and maintained 36-725. Imagine the alignment issues…

-- Kjell - Eau Claire WI

View TheFridge's profile

TheFridge

9444 posts in 1481 days


#2 posted 03-08-2017 10:19 PM

Checking The alignment is something that you need to do with any saw so I wouldn’t go through the hassle of returning the rigid just because of that.

-- Shooting down the walls of heartache. Bang bang. I am. The warrior.

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

8008 posts in 3370 days


#3 posted 03-08-2017 10:33 PM

Have you tried pushing forward on the fence after you move it just prior to locking it down? Some of those fences benefit from that

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View Stewbot's profile

Stewbot

199 posts in 1079 days


#4 posted 03-08-2017 10:45 PM

Just another point regarding the floor model, I would check to see if it would have the same return policy as a new one, just in case. If your current saw has a bum fence and questionable alignment Id say its worth it to look elsewhere (its a few hours of breakdown and return process but years of ownership), but keep in mind the Delta is also only a $600 saw and may also have its hick-ups. For example, on mine the alignment is fine as is the fence, but it appears to have some blade wobble and some of its parts feel like they aren’t gonna be in it for the long haul.

-- Hoopty scoop?

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John146

90 posts in 439 days


#5 posted 03-08-2017 11:35 PM

Yes, that does make it behave properly. I think I actually got that idea from one of the forum posts here. Is this just something I’m expected to live with, or should I be expecting more from a $550 saw?


Have you tried pushing forward on the fence after you move it just prior to locking it down? Some of those fences benefit from that

- knotscott


-- John 14:6

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knotscott

8008 posts in 3370 days


#6 posted 03-08-2017 11:39 PM



Yes, that does make it behave properly. I think I actually got that idea from one of the forum posts here. Is this just something I m expected to live with, or should I be expecting more from a $550 saw?

Have you tried pushing forward on the fence after you move it just prior to locking it down? Some of those fences benefit from that
- knotscott

- John146

Pushing forward on those fences is really just best practice for getting them to perform well….nothing I’d consider defective.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

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John146

90 posts in 439 days


#7 posted 03-09-2017 12:08 AM

I think it does have the same return policy, but you bring up a good point. I’m not sure what other issues I’ll run into with the Delta. It has good reviews, but mainly in contrast to the misaligned older Ridgids. Mine has the “II” stamped on the trunnion too.

I did check again today using a dial caliper to see if the blade is still heeled correctly, and it still held the < 0.005” deviation, so I think it’s safe to say I won’t be having this problem in the future.

The display model seems to be in fairly good condition, and has only been on the floor for about 3 weeks.


Just another point regarding the floor model, I would check to see if it would have the same return policy as a new one, just in case. If your current saw has a bum fence and questionable alignment Id say its worth it to look elsewhere (its a few hours of breakdown and return process but years of ownership), but keep in mind the Delta is also only a $600 saw and may also have its hick-ups. For example, on mine the alignment is fine as is the fence, but it appears to have some blade wobble and some of its parts feel like they aren t gonna be in it for the long haul.

- Stewbot


-- John 14:6

View 01ntrain's profile

01ntrain

255 posts in 1065 days


#8 posted 03-09-2017 12:39 AM

In the world of woodworking, .005 really isn’t a big deal, especially from a sub-$1000 table saw. Good shop fundamentals will keep your saw in tune with the work you’re doing. Most contractor table saws aren’t really a “fire and forget” operation, anyway. They are meant for jobsite work, where metal-shop precision isn’t warranted. I think you’re seriously over-thinking this.

View JollyGreen67's profile

JollyGreen67

1669 posts in 2758 days


#9 posted 03-09-2017 01:32 AM

The display model was probably “thrown” together in 5 minutes to get it on the floor. Then, once there, everybody who walks by has to play with it – especially those who know absolutely nothing about power tools.

-- When I was a kid I wanted to be older . . . . . this CRAP is not what I expected !

View PaulHWood's profile

PaulHWood

434 posts in 2248 days


#10 posted 03-09-2017 01:42 AM

Delta still has a two part rail for the rip fence. This is an issue. I bought a used delta 36T30 fence and the woodworker I bought it from told me it would be like night and day from the stock ridgid and he was spot on

-- -Paul, South Carolina Structural Engineer by trade, Crappy Woodworker by choice

View IHRedRules's profile

IHRedRules

113 posts in 1471 days


#11 posted 03-09-2017 02:21 AM

If you are out to replace the saw, why not get something better? I’d put the two saws in the same category. If I were upgrading, I’d be looking at the Grizzly cabinet saws at a minimum, and if money isn’t a huge concern, Powermatic or Sawstop.

View John146's profile

John146

90 posts in 439 days


#12 posted 03-09-2017 05:49 AM

Thank you all for your comments. I was about to go out and disassemble the Ridgid, but two things changed my mind:

1. I managed to see a “real” saw in a “real” store—the locally owned tool shop, and it was the W1284. I’m not sure what issues that saw may have, but it seemed a class above in durability and ease-of-use. (I also saw the W1837 next to it, which had the exact same top as the Ridgid – as well as the fence (except there wasn’t any orange trim – the fence suffered from the same kind of flaw, so I guess my unit isn’t “defective”, it’s just a design issue)).

2. From what people here have commented, the Delta may end up having issues of its own. I might not necessarily be getting a better saw, just a saw with other issues (the Ridgid, for all its flaws, seems more “durable” than the Delta, though I plan on upgrading in about a year anyway). The fence on the Delta was nothing compared to the one on the W1284 or any of the other saws in that store.

-- John 14:6

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

8008 posts in 3370 days


#13 posted 03-09-2017 11:11 AM



Thank you all for your comments. I was about to go out and disassemble the Ridgid, but two things changed my mind:

1. I managed to see a “real” saw in a “real” store—the locally owned tool shop, and it was the W1824. I m not sure what issues that saw may have, but it seemed a class above in durability and ease-of-use. (I also saw the W1837 next to it, which had the exact same top as the Ridgid – as well as the fence (except there wasn t any orange trim – the fence suffered from the same kind of flaw, so I guess my unit isn t “defective”, it s just a design issue)).

2. From what people here have commented, the Delta may end up having issues of its own. I might not necessarily be getting a better saw, just a saw with other issues (the Ridgid, for all its flaws, seems more “durable” than the Delta, though I plan on upgrading in about a year anyway). The fence on the Delta was nothing compared to the one on the W1824 or any of the other saws in that store.

- John146

I think you’re right on the money on all points. The ABCs of Table Saws

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

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