LumberJocks

Electric run and wire size

  • Advertise with us

« back to Coffee Lounge forum

Forum topic by mike85215 posted 06-14-2010 05:08 AM 2873 views 0 times favorited 19 replies Add to Favorites Watch
View mike85215's profile

mike85215

127 posts in 1867 days


06-14-2010 05:08 AM

Topic tags/keywords: question

Okay I know that it is a little late to be asking these questions but here goes….
Last week at work I ran a new electric line for an instant water heater for the kitchen area in the sales office. I ended up running a three wire loose line of 12 gauge with a 20 amp breaker and a 15 amp outlet. The run was a little less than 60 feet. The heater calls for a 20 amp circuit and it draws 2400 volts.
My question is what do I need to go back and fix….if anything.??
Thanks for your help.
Mike


19 replies so far

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile (online now)

TopamaxSurvivor

15024 posts in 2398 days


#1 posted 06-14-2010 05:15 AM

You need a 20 amp outlet on a dedicated 20 amp circuit.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View mike85215's profile

mike85215

127 posts in 1867 days


#2 posted 06-14-2010 05:20 AM

Thanks Topomax…I was hoping that you would answer. I did open a new 20amp circuit that is dedicated for only the heater. I wasn’t sure about the length of run and if it would make a difference on the gauge of wire. So I need to change the outlet from 15 to 20 amps ? Anything else that I missed?

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile (online now)

TopamaxSurvivor

15024 posts in 2398 days


#3 posted 06-14-2010 05:23 AM

Normal building wire sizes are good for 100 feet or so. Not much info there. No way to tell how many code violations are in your methods. Have it inspected to be safe.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View mike85215's profile

mike85215

127 posts in 1867 days


#4 posted 06-14-2010 05:28 AM

Thanks for helping. I will get it inspected next week.

View WoodSparky's profile

WoodSparky

200 posts in 1824 days


#5 posted 06-14-2010 05:34 AM

I disagree. You can put a 15amp receptacle on a 20amp circuit.

-- So Many tools, So little time

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile (online now)

TopamaxSurvivor

15024 posts in 2398 days


#6 posted 06-14-2010 06:30 AM

Not if it is a dedicated circuit for a specific piece of equipment. In most cases you can only use a a single outlet, not a duplex.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View Gregn's profile

Gregn

1642 posts in 1706 days


#7 posted 06-14-2010 06:53 AM

If it were me I’d run 10 gauge wire for 240 volt instead of 12 gauge wire. But thats just me.

-- I don't make mistakes, I have great learning lessons, Greg

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile (online now)

TopamaxSurvivor

15024 posts in 2398 days


#8 posted 06-14-2010 06:59 AM

Lower the voltage, the higher the voltage drop. You wouild be better off running #10 for 120 than 240.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View Pete_Jud's profile

Pete_Jud

424 posts in 2475 days


#9 posted 06-14-2010 07:48 AM

I assume 2400 watts, not volts. That is 20 amps at 120 volts, or 10 amps at 240 volts. 12 g at 60 ft would be ok, 10 better. But if you use a toaster, microwave or coffee maker on that 15 amp 120 outlet, It might be a little much for the 20 amp breaker and 12 g. I would make the run 10 g, and run the wire as 240, put a small sub panel in the kitchen. Put a 120 V 20 amp circuit breaker one leg on the circuit to the water heater, and put 15 A or 20 A on the other leg for the 15 A duplex outlet. Put a 20 amp 240 breaker for the 12 g going to the kitchen. 60 feet of 10/4 is not to pricey for the safety and utility. An office kitchen can see a lot of loads, my shop finishing room/kitchen has a small fridge, coffee maker, and microwave, and often all three are running at the same time.

good luck

-- Life is to short to own an ugly boat.

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile (online now)

TopamaxSurvivor

15024 posts in 2398 days


#10 posted 06-14-2010 07:54 AM

That is all irrelevant. Any device using 50% or more of the circuit capacity requires a dedicated circuit and a single outlet if cord connected.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View crank49's profile

crank49

3481 posts in 1693 days


#11 posted 06-14-2010 08:23 AM

Topo is correct. You only need to change the outlet in terms of electrical code.. assuming everything is installed properly. The wire size and breaker will be ok for a 2400 watt load; but fully loaded at 120 volts. A water heater is a resistive load, so even though you are going to get a little voltage drop on the long run it will not really hurt anything; the heater will just not heat quite as fast as it would on a 10ga circuit.

-- Michael :-{| “If you tell a big enough lie and tell it frequently enough, it will be believed.” ― A H

View mike85215's profile

mike85215

127 posts in 1867 days


#12 posted 06-14-2010 02:53 PM

I did run a duplex outlet, however it is located underneath in a cabinet and will not be used for anything other than the water heater. Yes it is my mistake it is watts and not voltage. The question now is does the 15 amp outlet need to be changed to a 20 amp ? Or knowing that it will not be used for anything else will the 15 amp be okay?

View UnionLabel's profile

UnionLabel

660 posts in 1923 days


#13 posted 06-14-2010 04:15 PM

Topo is right. here where I live, a microwave must be plugged into a single 20 amp outlet. So must a dishwashe and a sink mounted water heater.

-- Methods are many,Principles are few.Methods change often,Principles never do.

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile (online now)

TopamaxSurvivor

15024 posts in 2398 days


#14 posted 06-14-2010 04:28 PM

A device that uses 50% or more of the circuit’s capacity requires a dedicated circuit and a single outlet, not a duplex. They started requiring single outlets for washing machines, disposals, ect a code change or 2 ago. Therefore, sounds like you need a single 20 amp outlet on your circuit since it says a 20 amp circuit on the device and it draws 2400 watts.

-- "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View birdguy's profile

birdguy

73 posts in 1630 days


#15 posted 06-14-2010 06:28 PM

Ok are the wires exposed? If so u should use conduit I prefer metal why 3 indivual 12wires not romex or sompting

showing 1 through 15 of 19 replies

Have your say...

You must be signed in to reply.

DISCLAIMER: Any posts on LJ are posted by individuals acting in their own right and do not necessarily reflect the views of LJ. LJ will not be held liable for the actions of any user.

Latest Projects | Latest Blog Entries | Latest Forum Topics

HomeRefurbers.com

Latest Projects | Latest Blog Entries | Latest Forum Topics

GardenTenders.com :: gardening showcase