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| Forum topic by Dadoo | posted 295 days ago | 1643 views | 0 times favorited | 51 replies | ![]() |
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295 days ago |
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295 days ago |
I had a pretty good chunk taken out of my left ring finger by my table saw a couple years back, and I “nicked” a couple more in the same incident. I only call them nicks becasue compared to the big chunk that’s all they were. I think I read something somewhere that said the router and the bandsaw cause a ton of injuries. -- JP, Shelbyville, KY |
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295 days ago |
They all have potential to seriously bite you. You cannot be casual with anything designed to eat or slice wood. -- Maplewood, MN |
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295 days ago |
If I’m not mistaken, the table saw accounts for 40% of all woodworking injuries. This is in part due to the fact that it’s also one of the most owned/used machines in the shop. -- Tom, Surfside Beach, SC - Romans 8:28 |
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295 days ago |
I haven’t heard of any other piece of equipment shooting wood through walls -- "Functional WoodArt" by Debbie, Canada (http://www.execulink.com/~yohan) |
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295 days ago |
The main reason the table saw is so dangerous is the fact that you need a lot of knowledge to understand where the danger is. For most tools, if you do not put the hand in the blade there is no danger (most cutting tools). Putting the hand in the blade is probably only a minor contributor for table saw injuries. The problem, as MsDebbie points out, is that the table saw is a cannot first and a saw second. Maybe the question we should ask is what is the second most dangerous tool. Surprisingly (I read this somewhere but cannot remember where), chisels account for a large portion of ER visits (might be more than the table saw). Using chisels properly is even harder than understanding how the TS works. The thing to learn with the TS is to never let go no matter how bad things get. The only serious accident I got in 3 years of woodworking was with a bad tablesaw because I let go too early (the guard was missing mostly because I could never align it with the blade). I immediately purchased a contractor saw and have been safe ever since. I do get myself cut regularly with the chisels (no ER visits though). Alin -- -- Alin Dobra, Gainesville, Florida |
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295 days ago |
Probably the hammer. How many of you have hit your thumb with a hammer? Ooooooh, power tools. Sorry. Yea, table saw. But you know what else is nasty? Drill press + gloves. Thats a bad combination. Gloves get sucked into the chuck and make Jello out of fingers. Another one is circular saws (“skill saws”). They kickback just like table saws, but… it is the running saw and saw blade which goes flying toward you instead of just a chunk of wood. We get a lot of contractors coming in to our tool store with missing digits from circular saws. -- Check out my new website! http://www.theeasellife.com |
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295 days ago |
I little blood and some missing flesh when I touched the side of a table saw blade as I was bringing my hand back to the front of the saw. A very sharp veneer knife. -- Karson Southern Delaware karson_morrison@bigfoot.com |
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295 days ago |
I think the table saw can cause the most serious damage, it’s pretty unforgiving. My most common boo boo comes from my belt/disc sander combo when I’m holding a small piece and I end up removing finger prints along with wood. -- When you give someone a chance it may well be their last. |
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295 days ago |
I would say the hand drill. How many of you have you have a Phillips Head shaped scare on one of your fingers :). Ok, I don’t’ have a scare, but it sounded funnier. |
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295 days ago |
I’d vote for the radial arm saw. Even more dangerous than a table saw. The whole blade is mostly exposed and it has this scary climb cut feature where the blade is forced toward the user. It can also throw things quite well. I had it knock my grinder off a table with a 3” x 3” x 6” block of pine. By my estimate it was going about 300 mph when it left the saw. -- Leon -- Houston, TX - " I create all my own designs and it looks like it " |
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295 days ago |
leonmcd, I agree that the radial saw is more dangerous than the table saw, but due to the fact that less people have them, there are less accidents with them. I had a radial saw years ago, but ended up using it only for cutting long stock down to usable dimensions. Everything you do on radial saw is more dangerous, as you said, because the blade is right there. For almost every process, the table saw is safer. -- Tom, Surfside Beach, SC - Romans 8:28 |
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295 days ago |
You would think a drum sander would be pretty safe. We were sanding raised panel cabinet doors with a Grizzley dual drum sander, and my partner cranked the handle down too much (in a hurry) and the sander shot the next door he fed into it out the front and across the room, finally crashing into a glavanised trash can bending it in half. I was catching, but walked away from the front of the machine to get a set of dial calipers. That would have been a serious injury if I was in the path of that door. Yes, table saws are dangerous but ANY power tool has the ability to hurt you. -- Women love me.....trees fear me |
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295 days ago |
I went out looking for real numbers, and found The Consumer Products Safety Commission Hazard Screening Report: Power Tools and Workshop Equipment. It doesn’t give as much of a breakdown as one might like, but for the period 1997-2002 it puts “Bench or table saws” at 31,884 ER room visits, 64,651 medically treated injuries, third behind “Manual Workshop Tools” and “Miscellaneous workshop”, but well ahead of categories like “Saws, not specified”, “Grinder, buffer polisher”, or “Welding, soldering, cutting torches”. Obviously there are likely reporting issues and other problems, and none of these numbers are broken down per hours of use, but for a whole bunch of reasons table saws continue to scare me. However, table saws have a ”$0” millions in death costs, whereas those torches and lifts and jack stands will kill ya. Maiming and disfigurement generally beats death, but it’s still a matter of “sucks less”. -- Dan Lyke, Petaluma California, http://www.flutterby.net/User:DanLyke |
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295 days ago |
I agree that a table saw has the potential to be the most dangerous tool for a number of reasons already stated (prevalence amongst users) but I think lack of proper safety precautions and complacency due to heavy use probably play just as big a role. I’ve heard that the router is probably the most dangerous because the damage inflicted by a saw blade is relatively “clean” as opposed to a router that will take chunks of flesh instead of a cut. Also, once the bit hits something to cut, it “grabs” on. Either way, it is important to respect the tools. |
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295 days ago |
I’m thinking the most dangerous tool is the one being used at any particular moment. They’re ALL dangerous when not respected. I’ve seen some pretty nasty fingers on framers that just use a hammer all day (I know, I know, that doesn’t count). Probably right about the tablesaw though. At least those framer’s fingers were still on their hand. -- Better to say nothing and be thought the fool... then to speak and erase all doubt. |
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295 days ago |
Quote from Fine Woodworking small booklet entitled, “The Small Shop:” “By far and away, the tablesaw is involved in more serious hand injuries than any other woodworking tool or machine. It was responsible for 42% of all the injuries reported, followed by the jointer at 18%, the radial-arm saw at 7%, and the bandsaw at 6%. Although several other power tools – the shaper, chainsaw and circular saw, for instance – seem more hazardous, all figured in fewer accidents than even the hand chisel, which accounted for 4% of the total.” -- Tom, Surfside Beach, SC - Romans 8:28 |
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295 days ago |
In my humble opinion the most powerful “power” tool in the shop is the old noggin. If you don’t use your head when using any tool, electric or not, you’ll get hurt. My goal whenever I go in the shop is to come out with what I went in with, all my digits and all my blood. I’ve never had an in shop injury and I hope to keep that in tact by using my head. Only time will tell if I can keep this record going. I’ve been dabbling in woodworking since 1989 and got serious about it about 5 or 6 years ago. I hope that LJ’s will be here when I’ve completed my 50th year of woodworking so I can report back! Martin – 50 years – I hope you can keep this going that long! -- Betsy - GO BUCKS! |
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295 days ago |
As a paramedic, the most injuries I have seen have been from circular saws. I have also met seveal people that have lost fingers to table saws. Adrian -- Adrian ..... The 11th Commandment...."Thou Shalt Not Buy A Wobble Dado" |
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294 days ago |
My bad, I just noticed that the title of this topic is “Which power tool causes the most injuries”. My previous answer was to the question “What is the most dangerous tool”. I still think I have the correct answer to that question. Luckily very few people use radial arm saws ( for good reason ) so the total number of injuries is low. -- Leon -- Houston, TX - " I create all my own designs and it looks like it " |
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294 days ago |
I have to agree with Betsy; That uncommon thing called common sense will prevent most shop accidents. Most people interviewed after injuring themselves blame the injury on themselves, not the machine. Pay attention, think things through, if it doesn’t seem safe, don’t do it. Repetitive tasks account for a number of injuries, as the mind starts to wander and you find yourself working on auto pilot. And by all means, always use a spiltter / antikickback devce on tablesaws. I’m amazed at how many people don’t use one. This is flat out looking for trouble. While table saws account for the most injuries, those sustained by a shaper are far worse. Using a power feeder on these machines is HIGHLY recommended. Stay save ; Lee -- by Lee A. Jesberger http://www.prowoodworkingtips.com http://www.ezee-feed.com |
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293 days ago |
This makes me beg the question, how many hear have had serious accidents with tools (power or otherwise)? That’s probably a question for another thread… I (knock on wood) haven’t had any thing more than a scrape, cut, or bang from any of my tools so far. My wife is a bit to nervous for me to take any unnecessary chances. However, last year I did learn the hard way not to feed a piece through a router table between the bit and the fence. Shot out of my hand and flew out my open garage door, over my wifes car (thank God), and out into the middle of the street. I was lucky enough to feel it happening and let go so my fingers didn’t go with it. Stupid, stupid, stupid. ~DB -- Happy Ripping!!! |
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293 days ago |
As a side note, one of the problems encountered in shop class is the blur of a spinning blade. Younger students tend to think of blurry things as “soft”, so there is an inclination to test that notion by touching it. Shop teachers need to spend a lot of time teaching safety with clever demonstrations, in order to really drive home the potential for disaster. -- Furniture Medic- the prescription for damaged furniture |
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293 days ago |
Wasn’t it a Toolcrib’s survey that ranked the “user” as the most dangerous tool. Most accidents are things that we all know shouldn’t have been done, but were done nonetheless. Using tools for uses they are not intended for has to account for many as well. I find myself in trouble when forcing a screw with a drill or something similar. I should drill the proper pilot, but I try and muscle it. Bit in the finger. My biggest real fear is kickback. I respect my tablesaw and take the right steps in being safe, but things can still go wrong. I had a board kickback and break a solid wood panel in half. Work safe all. -- Jeff, South Carolina |
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293 days ago |
I think, being a sculptor w wood mixing power-tools in the pictures is plain dangerous all together but I do it. When I just have to make stuff, and the proper power tools aren’t available like a chain-saw or table saw. I’ve jammed thumbs trying to cut trunks in chop saws, seen spikes of wood fly by from table saws, still have a bottle of wood glue that was behind me that a shard of ipe wood pierced it like a sword stuck w, one end out each side lucky it wasn’t my fore head. seen co- worker get caught from a grinder pull his t shirt up to his neck, another 1/2 inch…man. good topic -- PJM.`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸¸.·´¯`·.¸ ><((((º> why's there a light in fridge and not the freezer? , aka, the wood hunter.aka tigermaple5 |
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293 days ago |
My vote goes to the radial arm saw as well, I have both a radial and table…...But it’s that radial arm that scares me the most….. Like already said, that big spinning wheel is coming right at ya… I hear ya about small pieces on the sanding belt…....I almost never have to cut my nails.. The fact is, no power tool is safe if misused…they all command respect. -- Brian's Table Top Toys http://home.mountaincable.net/~bgraham/ |
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291 days ago |
Well guys, I’ve done a little research into this question and find that the #1 accident causing tool is the grinder. They didn’t reinterate whether this was a bench grinder or a hand held unit though. The injuries caused were to the eyes mostly (45%) and to the soft tissue (44%). Here’s some other tidbits to consider: About 125,000 serious injuries due to power tools occur annually. 90% of those injuries are lacerations and similar type injuries. Around 32,000 table-saw related injuries occur every year. COMMON CAUSES: Innattention through repitition. Unexpected event. Inexperience, or overconfidence. But the stats state that the most tool injuries come from simple hand tools. So whether it’s a hand or power tool, we gotta be careful! -- Bob Vila would be so proud of you! |
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291 days ago |
Thanks for the stats Dadoo. On the topic, I’ve been sanding some small intricate parts using drums as well as a benchtop belt/disk sander. I was a little lazy and decided to just hold the small part. No big deal, but a did touch the sandpaper twich which made for a very smooth index finger! Should’ve used a hand screw, clamp or pliers to hold the work. -- Jeff, South Carolina |
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291 days ago |
Dadoo, I assumed that we were talking woodworking related accidents. I guess your research was based on any/all tools. -- Tom, Surfside Beach, SC - Romans 8:28 |
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289 days ago |
I( agree the radial saw is dangerous but if you realize that and use it correctly it is a GREAT TOOL. I would not give it up for anything. -- WOOD/DON (...one has the right to ones opinion but not the right to ones own facts...) |
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289 days ago |
I’ve been watching Norm Abram for the better part of 20 years and he still has all his fingers and both eyes, Bob -- A mind, like a home, is furnished by its owner |
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288 days ago |
Good point Bob. I do think that although it’s not a very “happy” subject, it’s good to remember when we walk into our shop, that we have to be careful with all these machines and tools. -- Tom, Surfside Beach, SC - Romans 8:28 |
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288 days ago |
I’ll add my ladder to the list. That might be more home constuction than shop work but I can get real comfortable standing on that “do not stand above this step” warning. |
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287 days ago |
Great topic and a great chance for us all to mentally smack ourselves and remember some of the “dang that was close” events over the past year(s). Too many of us seem to forget the immortal words of Norm – be sure to read understand and follow the directions that come with your tools and to ALWAYS wear these – safety glasses! -- CaptnA - "When someone hurts you, write it in the sand so the winds of forgiveness will scatter the memory... " |
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286 days ago |
I still have all my fingers and all my toes but I doubt if its due to brains but rather luck. I was at a shop when a guy some how managed to circumsize himself with a stationary grinder….....dont ask. I’ve seen so many fingers go flying, almost always a TS. Sometimes the shaper (and its the only tool that to this day makes my adreneline pump) reshapes the fingers and palms but for the life of me everytime I use my foredom power carver with a big Kutzel steel bit I manage to grind a portion of a finger into hamburger pate’ I probably couldnt count the amount of times the nail gun put a nail through my finger. Cheers |
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286 days ago |
I’ve seen the jointer get quite a few people. Table saw has to top the list though. -- miles125, Alabama.."Architecture is frozen music"" |
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286 days ago |
It’s not the tool…It’s us. Where our minds are at time we defy the rules to work by, god only knows. A table saw and a router table both bit my fingers once. Both accidents were do to stupidity or the mind wondering. Where I live though, the most dangerous tool, hands down, is the change saw. The weekend firewood cutter keeps our hospital emergency room full in the spring. -- Odie, Confucius say, "He who laughs at one's self is BUTT of joke". |
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286 days ago |
As a “shop teacher of 34 years” the worst accident by a student operating a machine was on a radial arm saw. Student was cutting multiple pieces with a stop block attached to the fence and cut off the tip of his thumb past the nail. I will never forget his scream. He just got in too big of a hurry. I team taught with another teacher and he had two table saw accidents by students, one serious. He also had one serious jointer accident by a student. All student accidents occurred due to the failure to follow a known safety rule on which the student had been tested. By the way, I have 9 1/2 fingers myself, lost part of one to an plastics molding machine while reaching around the guard!!! It does not pay to get in a hurry and take shortcuts! -- Bill |
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285 days ago |
I hate that…did I write “change saw” instead of “chain saw”? -- Odie, Confucius say, "He who laughs at one's self is BUTT of joke". |
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285 days ago |
Considering the topic, Odie, change saw was probably more at the truth than chain saw. -- "Bordnerizing" perfectly good lumber for over a decade. |
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285 days ago |
I would saw the table saw first and the shaper second. Safety First -- Ron, Twain Harte, Ca. Portable on site Sawmill Service http://westcoastlands.net/Sawmill.html http://westcoastlands.net/SawBucks2/phpBB3 |
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285 days ago |
the grinder… my husband was a mechanic and welder and we made many visits to the emergency room to get pieces of rust/metal out of his eyes. The one visit, I was about 8 months pregnant… they had me in a wheelchair and half way to the delivery room before I could say that it wasn’t me that we were there for! Fastest service we ever received in emergency—I almost wanted to take them up on it because they were so nice! ha. -- "Functional WoodArt" by Debbie, Canada (http://www.execulink.com/~yohan) |
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285 days ago |
As a novice, I will tell you that I have a healthy respect for my table saw (and other power tools). I think that with anything, power tools, cars etc. it all boils down to the user not having that respect. I recently added a featherboard to the fence, just for my own safty/piece of mind. It is not a substitute for or loosing that respect, but wanting to keep all 10 fingers. |
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285 days ago |
you know, my circular saw scares me more than my table saw. I know where to stand and where to put my hands with the table saw. Use push sticks or a sled. But if a circular saw decides to kick back, it’s coming straight at you no matter where you are. Head, chest, leg or crotch… not good… especially if you’re up a ladder, on the porch roof… -- I am always doing what I cannot do yet, in order to learn how to do it. - Vincent Van Gogh -- http://snbcreative.wordpress.com/ |
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285 days ago |
Scottb – that reminds me of building my new shop this spring. It’s a pole building, and one of the holes was too deep so the pole was shorter than the others. We decided to half-lap a short piece on the top to make up the difference. Guess who got elected to take the worm-drive saw up the ladder to cut a half-lap over his head in a 6×6 pole? -- Coffee is best with a fine layer of sawdust on top. -- http://www.north40custom.com |
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284 days ago |
When I still worked in the foundry they were having trouble with sand sticking in the castings. At the time I was working as an inspector on the end of the line. Of course Goodyear at this time owned the plant I worked in, so they sent down some engineers to find and fix the problem. To us that worked there we knew already that the shaker at the end of the mold castings wasn’t long enough. But what did we know. Anyway one day these three engineers were standing at the end of the line watching the castings come out of the shaker and the guy there grab the casting, a brake drum, with a hook and hang it on a chain that ran up through the top of the shop, back and forth, to cool off, they came out of the shaker at around 800 degrees F. Hence the guy at the end picking them up with a hook. Well after watching this guy pick up these casting for around 15 minutes one of the engineers reached over and picked one up with his bare hands. Then stood there looking at all of us frozen as if he could’nt move. Finally the guy with the hook grabbed it out of his hand. Now this guy knew this was a foundry, he knew this was the end of where they had just poured moulten iron 2800 degree brake drums he knew they were hot, yet he reached down and picked one up. I guess my point is some people are stuck on stupid and no matter what you can’t help them until they loose a couple digits. -- Mike. Profisher50@yahoo.com |
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284 days ago |
Anything sharp that you aren’t paying enough attention to. -- Gary, East TX -- The longest journey begins with a single step. |
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266 days ago |
I have been a professional woodworker for 38 years and have never been injured on a woodworking machine save eye dust. I have seen hands ripped off, fingers cut off, arms severed, people impaled by severe kickback from gang rip saws and ect. If you ever get in a hurry turn off the machine or device and take a walk somewhere else and think about how saving a few seconds can cause ghost pains in fingers or limbs that are not there anymore. Take the time to set up properly then double check yourself before hitting the start button. I cannot stress enough set up right. If you do not know right then take the time to find out what right is. I run just about every type woodworking machine industrial sized in our own company and do take walks from time to time because I kind of like my fingers and hands. 3600 rpm is 60 cuts a second with a 1 knife tool 120 with 2 knife, a 2 wing moulder head at 6000 rpm is 200 cuts per second and is made to pull you in if you make contact with the knife. Do yourself and your family a favor think it thru before using it. |
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266 days ago |
I feel most vulnerable when I am doing something repetitious and get in a zone. I usually stop and take a break. -- Ron Central, CA |
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266 days ago |
....I would have to say that blaming tools, (power tools//hand tools) for accidents, injuries and death….is like removing the responsibility from the one using those tools! Up here where I live we get a lot of snow and so when it snows, do the number of accidents go down or up for that given day, compared to a day without snow….you do the math. Snow does not cause accidents, injuries or death, but speed does and so when folks refuse to slow down what can one expect, but sudden impact with whatever gets in their way. This is the same with any kind of tool out there….ignorance is no respecter of a persons attitude, whether it comes to being a part time woodworker or a full time woodworker. Be ignorant of the tool you are using, and what can go wrong, and you are only a number waiting to happen in some hospital room or grave yard marker. One chooses to be ignorant by not understanding the tool they are using, how many times….and I can no-longer remember the number of times, that folks have come and asked me about how to use a tool, after they have already used it and failed to get the results they thought the tool would bring them. And then the times of silence that follow when I ask; “did you read the owners manual?”....duh, like whats that. How many times can I say over and over again….”if you don’t take responsibility to know your tool and respect your tool….then when you draw that last bit of air, don’t blame your tool, blame yourself!!!” Everyday, before I use whatever tool I’m using….power or hand, I first will take the time to examine the tool and if that tool is not up to ’righteous standards of integrity’, then I don’t use the tool. Does that mean that I am not going to proceed with what I had planed to do, until the problem with the tool is fixed….yes, I will stop and proceed no farther. What the numbers and statistics fail to take into account, is the ignorance of attitude that many have with their tools. What I have seen with chainsaws, makes me not want to repeat, since the response is usually “how could anyone be so dumb as to do that, as they go off and do the same dumb action.” If you are not planning on being safe by being informed on the tool you are using….and that also includes respecting your tool, yourself, the person working with you, your spouse and your children then you should just put your tools away and give up woodworking….since in essence what you are really doing, is planning to have an accident, injury or cause a death. I have stayed alive, with all body parts still attached and working, by planning to be safe and planning to stay safe. Woodworking is not for those who have no-time to learn the rules….the tool you dis-respect will be the one that stands up and kicks you in your face. This is a rule I have taught, and so whenever I am working with someone who does not respect their tools, I will send them packing….no-second chance. I have heard others talk of their mistakes and near misses with power and hand tools and this makes me sad, for one of the hardest things is to try and tell someone why they should plan on being safe, when they have already had a near miss. And make no-mistake, having a near miss and then living to tell about it does not give one ‘bragging rights’. This is like telling someone about the dangers of kickback on a 7 hp chainsaw….and forget about thinking the chain brake is going to save you in that less than one second, and they’ve already survived some kickbacks with a 2-3 hp chainsaw. Ignorance has a way of making one think that, because I survived to tell the story….I’ve learned my lesson and it won’t happen again. The only problem with that kind of thinking is that the graveyards are full of these types and more folks are dying to get in the same way. If what I’m writing here sounds hard….then so be it, because if I can change one persons thinking about safety….and that means not safety first, which just amounts to some nice sounding words, but first, plan to be responsibly safety minded and then the tools you are using, whether they are power or hand, will in like manner follow after your example! The best information one can ever receive about that new tool they just got, is before doing anything with that power cord or action of hand….read the owners manual and then take some time by examining your tool, and this is even after putting it together….take some time and think about what can go wrong and how will I prevent that from happening, plus what will I do in case, one day….my sky falls in….and remember, power and hand tools do not cause accidents, injuries or death….but attitude and ignorance in the minds of people do! Now having said all this, let me say that I am not saying anything bad about anyone who has written here or elsewhere on LumberJocks….so if my words have offended any, then forgive me as this is only my opinion and I mean no-dis-respect to any….however if I can offend any enough, to change their attitude on the tools they are using and therefore cause that one, (and yes, even if just one) to further live out their life with fullness of body parts, then stoning me by the multitudes I will accept. However, I might add that I have all-ready planned on being safe from stoning and know what to do if that should ever happen….LOL. ....only my two cents worth, but that two cents has the power to make one ”work smart, work safe, and live, to work the wood….” Thank you. -- --frank, NH, http://frank.wordpress.com/ |
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255 days ago |
I would venture to say that more experienced woodworkers are more likely to have an injury. Not because they use their tools more often, but rather they have been lulled into a false sense of security after years of no accidents. Many operations still scare me despite having knowledge of how to operate safely. I actually am a bit thankful that as I think about my actions and methods in relation to my desire to keep all my body parts attached! -- Jeff, South Carolina |
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249 days ago |
I have had one serious shop accident. TS when I was 15. I was ripping 1” x 5” sections of parquet flooring, and like most 15 year olds, was cocky and started ripping away. The part started to shake, and I stuck my finger down right on the blade to stabilize the part. Smart, Eh? Big shapers make the biggest mess- I saw a guy split from the web of his thumb, halfway to his elbow from a De-sta-co clamp from a kickback Jointers leave the least to put back on- I have seen the remnants of a wedding band glinting from a pile of gore and sawdust Like a few others said, the woodworker is the most dangerous tool in the shop. All of these accidents were avoidable. Matt -- The only easy wood project is a fire |
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