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Classic debate: lacquer vs. polyurethane

61K views 91 replies 61 participants last post by  kelvancra 
#1 · (Edited by Moderator)
I remember my old woodshop teacher saying "Ninety percent of amateurs use poly, and 90% of pros use lacquer." I personally prefer lacquer myself, even though it is a bit temperamental to work with, but this seems like a timeless debate. Are the pros still gravitating to lacquer, or is the field leveling?
 
#5 ·
I live in Florida, the humidity state. Lacquer fogging can be a problem here. Then there is the VOC / flammability problem. Catalyzed finishes stink to high heaven also. I use almost exclusively a product called Crystalac, available thru Mc Feeleys.com. It's waterbased, low voc, recoat in 1 hr, sands easily without loading your paper, and is more resistant to chemicals than lacquer. Try it you'll like it.
 
#6 ·
I used to be a "poly guy" but in the last few months I have been using lacquer more. It dries much faster and I can get 3 coats on in a day. However, it stinks and my workshop is in the basement. I prefer to use lacquer when it is warm enough (and dry enough) to take the piece outside to do the finishing.
 
#7 ·
Pro's use lacquer because it's faster, and time is money. Also, pro's are more likely to have a spray both, which is almost mandatory to spray lacquer.

There are also catalized lacquers available that ar just as durable as poly, without the yellowing.
 
#8 ·
i think poly is slower to build and you don't get the same clear shine as lacquer i have some that you have to brush on (lacquer) but have yet to try it i've been going with the arm-a-seal gloss this stuuf works fast building and the shine is clear like glass.
 
#9 ·
"Pro's use lacquer because it's faster, and time is money. Also, pro's are more likely to have a spray booth, which is almost mandatory to spray lacquer."

I guess that's been at the heart of the debate for me, if they're just using it to save time. I've got a booth and tend to loath putting anything on by brush, but poly can be sprayed just as easily.

Are pros really just using it for time reasons, or are they seeing something in the final product that looks superior to a poly finish?
 
#10 ·
I use poly, but if I am in a hurry, I use Minwax Polycrylic. It's water based so clean up is easy, it dries just like poly, but in only takes about 2 hours to dry and recoat. It is also milky white when applying so you can see where you have painted it on. I really like it and it seems very hard and looks great. The only thing negative about it is its expensive and it cant be used on floors.
 
#11 · (Edited by Moderator)
Lacquer, enough said. Lacquer likes to fog during temperature changes, so don't spray around sunset or sunrise. Spray at high sun. Ventilation eliminates VOC. Once she hardenes, minimum VOC. Humidity causes fogging during drop in temp. changes. Used for years, poly is too slow, at least for me.
 
#12 ·
In my experience there's just too much that can go wrong with poly, and the extended drying time only compounds the opportunity for error.

Lacquer is much easier to work with, and (for the record) I actually do most of my spraying outside - in the shade, of course.

I still think that every good woodworker should take the time to learn how to work with BOTH. It really helps to understand the different properties of these materials in terms of preparation, application, and bonding, and that knowledge can apply to other similar materials.
 
#13 ·
I think Kailua has got it right. There is a place for both poly and lacquer. Furthermore, there is also a place for hand rubbed, apply with a brush and spray on. It just takes a while to figure out what works best in each situation. I'm still trying to figure that out. Rub on poly (that I apply with a foam brush) is my default option but I am routinely experimenting with other approaches.
 
#14 ·
I have used lacquer almost exclusively for about 40 years. I realize I only look about 30, LOL, but I started young. I am a professional and it is about time. I have always had a stand alone shop, but I would not spray lacquer if I had a shop in my garage. My gas heater and water heater are in my garage so I have pilot lights going. Laquer (solvent based) is highly flammable and will explode. I knew a painter years ago that died in one of those explosions. You can get high easily without proper ventilation, ( I am saying this in a very negative way--You do not want to do this!!!!!!!!!!!) and according to anyone who knows me, brain damage as well.

Charles Neil has a thread going now about water based lacquer, which could change all that. I am planning to give it a try. Sounds like Poly is a good choice for hobbiests where time is not so much of an issue. As already stated, you can spray just about any finish.

These theads are great for learning about anything woodworking related. You get a lot of different perspectives which really make your own choices a lot easier. I didn't have this when I was new at the craft, but I did have several great mentors. The problem was, they all used what I use now which makes it a little harder for me to open up to all the fantastic new products coming out these days. Be open to making changes--when it's beneficial to do so.
 
#15 ·
If you care more about end result than time spent finishing, poly is a better option. Poly is a superior finish in almost every way (abrasion, water, chemicals, UV, VOC). The looks? ... Well, its very subjective. I started to use poly a while ago and will never go back to that flammable POISON (lacquer). Lately I was using water based poly, which is even better: you can do three coats in one day.
P.S. Never had problems with brush marks using poly. But again I'm not doing it for living, so I take my time.
 
#16 · (Edited by Moderator)
Hi All
I can't compliment enough the great comments on this site, they cover all the aspects of a question, I recently bought some Min-wax brush on lacquer, and really did not know what I was getting into, tried to use it with some disastrous results, streaks, brush marks, and some globing, don't get me wrong, nothing against the product, I take full blame for my poor results. I should have turned to Lumber jocks before my purchase, it would have saved me some trouble, and time. I make mostly small decorative boxes, and for my purposes the poly gives a more controllable finish ( I just do a box or two at a time, so setting up for spraying is not practical), I keep the project perfectly level and do just one side at a time, to get a mirror finish after the third coat, yes, time consuming, and the yellow tint of the poly, similar to the tint of natural stain, it brings out the best in some woods. Poly or Lacquer, I say as stated by some, it is dependent on the project, personal requirements, taste, and a number of other factors. Make the research on what your particular needs and tastes are, and then make the choice for each project. Keep working and sharing It's Mic Woodworker
 
#17 ·
Personally I prefer poly mainly for it's durability and the fact that it can withstand sanding and polishing with rubbing compound real well to give a wonderful smooth surface. I brush it on as I feel I have more control that way. I have been using oil based, but I plan to try using water based poly because it's faster and easier to clean up as already mentioned. The poly I use also has UV protection so it can withstand a lot of sunlight.
 
#18 ·
I have used both and use poly more so than lacquer. A lot depends on the project and what it will be used for. I guess what it comes down to is what will be the durability issue needed. If I am refinishing a piece I would want it to be lacquer over poly, because poly is a hard finish.
 
#19 · (Edited by Moderator)
One of the things about being a "Pro" is the amount of exposure to toxic VOC's. I have now put my health first and foremost when deciding what to work with. I only wish I thought more about it when I was younger before doing the damage to my lungs.

I spray 90% of the time and have been getting great results with the water based products such as Polycrylic. Its fast and looks great, and the customers are happy.
 
#20 ·
And 90% of the pro's use particle board…......

Just because the pro's use it does not mean its the best choice for your heirloom, or some other project. As has been repeatedly said, time and materials are money. Lacquer is fast, which has much to do with why it's so common in professional construction projects. I use it on some projects solely for that reason.

I have a credenza I picked up to avoid sitting on the floor to type this message. It looks beautiful (or did), but a fingernail will remove the lacquer finish. Keep in mind, "pro's" built this (of course, other pro's built things we envy too and finished them with other types of lacquer or some other finish). The same finish on a picture frame would be fine, since it wouldn't be subject to any real degree of wear.

Poly can be a nightmare for professionals. It adds significant time to jobs, such as for sanding between coats when [mandatory] re-coat schedules are missed, waiting for the finish to cure, and dealing with messy spray operations.

In the end, I like high quality finishes, even if they are more work. That may or may not include lacquer, depending on the type of lacquer and the project.
 
#21 · (Edited by Moderator)
Just a practical observation in support of many of the comments made -
I support my woodworking habit doing tech support for a librarary.
They recently bought a new desk/counter for the reference area.
Bought from an office furniture vendor-so assumably built by "pro's"
GORGEOUS piece of furnture-cherry - I assume a mix of solid and veneer.
Not sure what the finish is- It looks GREAT-BUT
It scratches if you stare at it hard.
The librarians are paranoid to sit anything on it.
There are vinyl pads and lace doilies (yes you read right) under everything.
After having spent well over a thousand dollars for this unit (it's BIG) they are about to spend several hundred more getting custom glass tops made.
I'm not sure which confuses me more-why someone would put such an easily scratched surface on something they know is subject to heavy use---
OR-why people who know something is going to be used heavily would buy something so easily damaged.
MORAL--
Choose the right finish based on the needs of the project.
SECONDARY MORAL-
Purchase the right product for your needs
 
#22 ·
I agree completely. There are so many different finish options available because they each have their purpose. I have switched most of my finishing from poly to lacquer because it is just a lot easier to work with and I get impatient with poly. Don't get me wrong, I've obtained beautiful finishes with poly, but it can literally take a week or two.

I'm also a big fan of applying simple oil finishes…but on picture frames or things that won't be abused by drink spills or scratches.
 
#23 ·
I haven't used lacquer yet! I'd like to…I started out using Poly but I really got tired of the plastic feel it gives…I really like the texture of the wood. Lately most of the indoor projects I made I finished in Danish oil or tung oil.
I will try out lacquer soon.
 
#24 ·
Since I don't do woodworking for a living, time is not that big of a factor for me. I gravitate toward wipe-on poly … I just like the end result.

I have used Minwax Polycrylic on the last couple of projects, and the advantages pointed out by SnowyRiver are sure worth considering.

My shop is in the attached garage, and the last time I used lacquer inside, SWMBO had a fit about the smell even though I had the ventilation system (18' garage door) open while I was applying it.
 
#26 ·
You all should check out Targetcoatings.com. They make a water based lacquer that is really good. I just finish spraying the first gallon and it does really good. No smell at all, recoat in 30 minutes, sand after 60 minutes. Full burn in with every coat. Great service

Les
 
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