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Glue + Black Walnut

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Forum topic by bronxtale posted 05-08-2016 01:17 PM 936 views 0 times favorited 20 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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bronxtale

5 posts in 625 days


05-08-2016 01:17 PM

Hello Everyone,

I’m going to be making a kitchen table from black walnut.

I got two slabs with live edge. I am going to cut one straight edge on both slabs and join them. Or so that is the plan.

My question is what is the best glue to use or best method/way to do this so I can join these two slabs together?

Do I have to do any light sanding after the glue dries?

The legs are steel and i have that all sorted out. Just need help/tips/advice with the two slabs.

Thanks for any advice given.


20 replies so far

View BobAnderton's profile

BobAnderton

219 posts in 2255 days


#1 posted 05-08-2016 02:16 PM

Any regular yellow PVA wood glue will be strong enough. Thightbond III is darker than yellow glue and may be a better match to the color of walnut. You’ll need to do some scraping/sanding after the glue dries as there will be some squeeze out.

One challenge you’re going to have is getting the two straight edges truly straight and 90 degrees to the faces, not just close or pretty good. For this I think you’re going to need to use a jointer.

The other thing I wanted to point out is that you should expect that table top to expand and contract across the width up to 1/2 inch as season and relative humidity change. If you’re going to attach it to a steel frame across the width you’ll need to make sure that this movement is accommodated or the slab will crack in time. You don’t say how the attachment to the frame is going to be done, you just mention steel legs, so I’m speculating about what you have in mind.

-- Bob Anderton - Austin, TX - Nova 3000 lathe, Alaskan Mark III mill, Husqavarna Saw

View ThomasChippendale's profile

ThomasChippendale

244 posts in 397 days


#2 posted 05-08-2016 02:30 PM

To get a perfect glue edge, you will need to pass them on a long bed jointer. To ensure the top is flat when glueing the two sides together, you can joint them together. Place the two halves side by side just like they will be glued together and fold the two faces together. Clamp them together and joint them together, any discrepancy in the jointing angle will be compensated for.

Wood expansion amplitude is a result of the original moisture level of the as built tabletop VS the moisture variations in your environment. you also get twice the amount of wood movement if the slabs were cut tangentialy to the growth rings VS radialy.

In any case, leave the top free from expanding/contracting in the way it is attached to the steel base.

-- PJ

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splintergroup

829 posts in 687 days


#3 posted 05-08-2016 02:35 PM

As to glue, Titebond makes a ‘dark wood’ glue (I have and use the TBII on Walnut).

It blends in far better that the yellow TB, but if your joint has any sap wood, the darker glue will show a line.

View Aj2's profile

Aj2

692 posts in 1263 days


#4 posted 05-08-2016 03:15 PM

Since your asking the glue question.You may want to consider a doing something differant than a glued joint.A small gap with a chamfer.It will need more attention to keep clean with food crumbs.
Gluing two long slabs together to look like one takes some skill or lots of luck,

View bronxtale's profile

bronxtale

5 posts in 625 days


#5 posted 05-08-2016 03:32 PM

I am reading all the responses.

I should add this.

These slabs are Kiln dried.

Would it be better then to just butt up the two pieces and put a cleat under neath and forget the glue?

The base – square shaped. I was going to cut a piece of wood (like plywood) and sit that on the base of the legs. Then place the two slabs on top of that and screw through the plywood and into black walnut to give it a stable base.

The base is like this – https://www.lowes.ca/dining-sets/monarch-specialties-i-1046-dining-table_g1567957.html?searchTerm=kitchen-table

Thanks so far for advice.

View ThomasChippendale's profile

ThomasChippendale

244 posts in 397 days


#6 posted 05-08-2016 09:04 PM

No, a glued butt joint is best and will keep breadcrums and spills from making a dirty line between the two pieces.

-- PJ

View HokieKen's profile

HokieKen

1780 posts in 604 days


#7 posted 05-09-2016 04:24 PM

If it’s KD and you have a jointer (or the skills w/ a plane), I’d go with the glue joint for sure. Worst that can happen is that you don’t get a good joint and have to rip it back down the glue line. Joint according to PJ’s suggestions and you should be fine though. Make sure to allow for expansion though when you attach to base.

-- Kenny, SW VA, Go Hokies!!!

View Rick M's profile (online now)

Rick M

7923 posts in 1845 days


#8 posted 05-09-2016 05:36 PM

Glue joint on a walnut table. I don’t own a jointer and cut the edges on a tablesaw using a Freud rip blade. Glue was plain yellow glue, maybe Elmers, maybe a generic, can’t remember but I don’t usually buy TB. Scratches are because I used a wiping oil/varnish and they don’t provide very good protection. I’m probably going to scuff sand the top with 600 grit and put on a thin coat of polyurethane.

Click for details

-- http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View bbc557ci's profile

bbc557ci

589 posts in 1539 days


#9 posted 05-09-2016 05:41 PM



As to glue, Titebond makes a dark wood glue (I have and use the TBII on Walnut).

It blends in far better that the yellow TB, but if your joint has any sap wood, the darker glue will show a line.

- splintergroup

There ya go, what splinter said. Also/obviously, straight glue joint is essential so a jointer or nice straight rip on the table saw. Don’t know about your thought of relying on a plywood base for stability, I’ve never tried it. But I would thing “something” would give when the wood decides to expand/contract with humidity changes.

-- Bill, central NY...no where near the "big apple"

View Aj2's profile

Aj2

692 posts in 1263 days


#10 posted 05-09-2016 07:08 PM

How and the heck is he going to rip a slab with a live edge on a tablesaw.And get any kinda acceptable glue joint?
Live edge table slabs are usually Kinda big.

View splatman's profile

splatman

562 posts in 864 days


#11 posted 05-09-2016 07:40 PM

Screw/nail a temporary straight edge over the live edge on the underside. Rip face-down with the temporary straight edge sliding along the fence.

Or use a track saw.

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Rick M

7923 posts in 1845 days


#12 posted 05-09-2016 11:17 PM

Point being, there are multiple ways to do it and achieve excellent results. And you don’t need to have any one particular machine or tool, or use a special or dark glue, plain old generic yellow glue is perfectly fine.

-- http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View bronxtale's profile

bronxtale

5 posts in 625 days


#13 posted 05-10-2016 12:26 AM

Hey All,

I love the passion you guys have. A ton of great advice. Thank you all so much. I don’t want to start any fights but do appreciate all the help.

As for cutting it straight that isn’t going to be a problem.

I’ll be using this. – WFS

I just have to make sure both slabs are same thickness.

How do I make sure I am allowing for expansion?

I need to put it on a base of some sort because its two slabs and I don’t think the table legs will hold the weight evenly. So I figured if I put something on top of the table legs as a base and then the slabs on top of that it will hold much better.

The other issue is that each side of the table has two screws – so not using a base would mean the table is held on by 4 screws only.

View Rick M's profile (online now)

Rick M

7923 posts in 1845 days


#14 posted 05-10-2016 03:17 AM

I was picturing something like this, where one edge of each slab would be cut straight and glued to each other, the live edges on the outside.

Since you mention a bandsaw mill, are these freshly cut slabs? If so, they will need to dry for awhile before you can use them.

The base you posted is not very big, and is square, so will your finished top be square to match? Using plywood underneath is kind of jakey and if not secured correctly could cause problems.

-- http://thewoodknack.blogspot.com/

View Aj2's profile

Aj2

692 posts in 1263 days


#15 posted 05-10-2016 04:13 AM

So you will mill your own lumber?.That always makes a piece of furniture special when it’s all from the same tree.Good luck Sound like fun.

Aj


Hey All,

I love the passion you guys have. A ton of great advice. Thank you all so much. I don t want to start any fights but do appreciate all the help.

As for cutting it straight that isn t going to be a problem.

I ll be using this. – WFS

I just have to make sure both slabs are same thickness.

How do I make sure I am allowing for expansion?

I need to put it on a base of some sort because its two slabs and I don t think the table legs will hold the weight evenly. So I figured if I put something on top of the table legs as a base and then the slabs on top of that it will hold much better.

The other issue is that each side of the table has two screws – so not using a base would mean the table is held on by 4 screws only.

- bronxtale


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