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Table saw blade wear markings

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Forum topic by Harry posted 01-20-2016 03:49 AM 1239 views 0 times favorited 38 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Harry

71 posts in 645 days


01-20-2016 03:49 AM

I am concerned about how this blade (Freud Fusion 410) is making wear marks on the plate. Although there is some wear on one side, the opposite side is much more worn. Spent some time checking alignment of table and fence and it was dead on. It makes smooth cuts but I am getting burn marks on most materials. Any ideas?

Harry

-- Harry - Professional amateur


38 replies so far

View lab7654's profile

lab7654

264 posts in 1712 days


#1 posted 01-20-2016 04:15 AM

I feel like it’s a simple answer but your fence alignment is my only answer and you covered that. I know a lot of people taper the very end of their fence away from the blade like 1/16”, but I’m not sure if that would help here. Do you ever use a riving knife? You could check the alignment on that or start using one and see if that helps. Curious what others have to say.

-- Tristin King -- When in doubt, sand it.

View MadMark's profile

MadMark

978 posts in 918 days


#2 posted 01-20-2016 04:21 AM

Your blade isn’t a perfect 90° to the top.

M

-- Madmark - Madmark2150@yahoo.com Wiretreefarm.com

View Harry's profile

Harry

71 posts in 645 days


#3 posted 01-20-2016 05:12 AM



I feel like it s a simple answer but your fence alignment is my only answer and you covered that. I know a lot of people taper the very end of their fence away from the blade like 1/16”, but I m not sure if that would help here. Do you ever use a riving knife? You could check the alignment on that or start using one and see if that helps. Curious what others have to say.

- lab7654

I had my fence set up with a taper at the end but not that large, only about 1/64” and it doesn’t make a difference. I don’t have a riving knife (older Unisaw) but do use a splitter, again doesn’t make a difference. Thanks for the input.

-- Harry - Professional amateur

View Harry's profile

Harry

71 posts in 645 days


#4 posted 01-20-2016 05:15 AM


Your blade isn t a perfect 90° to the top.

M

- MadMark

Checked again today with blade full up with an engineer square I know is accurate. This was my first thought. Are you saying the blade itself is the problem?

-- Harry - Professional amateur

View TheFridge's profile

TheFridge

5765 posts in 951 days


#5 posted 01-20-2016 05:32 AM

No runout on the blade?

My unisaw still cuts 89 degrees just fine. Much to my dismay.

Fence, blade, arbor runout, bearings. One of em.

-- Shooting down the walls of heartache. Bang bang. I am. The warrior.

View 716's profile

716

502 posts in 382 days


#6 posted 01-20-2016 07:15 AM


I know a lot of people taper the very end of their fence away from the blade like 1/16”, but I m not sure if that would help here.
- lab7654

1/16” fence off is a sure recipe for a disaster.

-- It's nice!

View joey502's profile

joey502

487 posts in 983 days


#7 posted 01-20-2016 08:09 AM

That is strange. In theory the work should not come in contact with that part of the blade unless the board moves, i.e. the board shifts a little after clearing the teeth on a crosscut. Any other issues with alignment or setup would result in an undesirable cut but not those marks. The teeth are proud of the blade body on both sides, if the blade or fence is out of line the teeth will hit the work not the body of the blade.

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

7216 posts in 2841 days


#8 posted 01-20-2016 12:07 PM

Tough to call with any certainty. Have you checked that the fence is perfectly straight across the entire length using a good reference straight edge? How’s the alignment of the spliiter/riving knife with the blade and fence? Is the fence face 90° to the table?

How tight is the arbor nut/washer against the blade?...too tight can warp the blade a little. If it’s too tight, I’d think the burn marks would be on the other side, but it’s hard to say for sure.

Raising the blade might help reduce the burning, but I doubt blade height is the root cause. Keeping the blade clean always helps, but yours didn’t look too bad. How sharp is it?

In addition to all the other basics you’re checking, make sure your insert is flush, flat, and not flexing.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View HokieKen's profile

HokieKen

1784 posts in 604 days


#9 posted 01-20-2016 12:11 PM

This is kinda funny. I had this same issue with a Freud 50T combination blade. I have 4 blades that I use regularly on my TS and that is the only one that burned the plate below the teeth. I never did figure out what was doing it but since it was only that blade, I came to the conclusion that it was the blade itself. The blade still cuts fine and doesn’t burn the wood in my case. The only thing I can figure is that its something with the tooth geometry that causes chips/dust to eject after the cut rather than in the cut and the waste is packing in and burning the plate immediately after the cut.

I did use an indicator to measure runout of the blade and found it was less than .0005” just below the gullets. However, that doesn’t mean that it’s not deflecting when running. I also use a Freud Glue Line Rip blade and a Freud Xcut blade and haven’t seen this on either of those, just on the ATB combination blade.

Have you tried other blades to see if you have the same issue? If not, and you’re not having any other issues with the saw, I’d say let it go. Keep using the blade if you can live with the burning or replace it if you can’t.

-- Kenny, SW VA, Go Hokies!!!

View knotscott's profile

knotscott

7216 posts in 2841 days


#10 posted 01-20-2016 12:12 PM

dbl post.

-- Happiness is like wetting your pants...everyone can see it, but only you can feel the warmth....

View Redoak49's profile

Redoak49

1953 posts in 1454 days


#11 posted 01-20-2016 12:16 PM

I would recheck the following——

Blade parallel to miter slots
Fence parallel to miter slots
Fence is flat
Fence not moving during cut
Run out on the blade
Blade perpendicular to table….I do better with a digital tilt box than an engineers square.

Good Luck

View Tennessee's profile

Tennessee

2410 posts in 1980 days


#12 posted 01-20-2016 12:18 PM

What we are looking at is almost impossible unless the carbide teeth are not proud enough, or possibly braised on at a bit of an improper angle.
What I find most interesting is the very clear, distinct line on the second photo. It is almost like there is something down below touching the blade as it comes around.

The first photo, with the larger amount of paint removed, it seems that the teeth are just not even going around since the wear fades in and out, and with burning on most materials, I’d think the teeth are just not proud enough.

If we assume that setup is correct, (90’, fence aligned, etc.) then it would be very interesting to see if the blade body is possibly thicker than it should be from some manufacturing defect. Of the cutters would have to be smaller, which I doubt.

I’m going with either too thick a blade blank, or the teeth were mounted at an incorrect angle when put on.
Rather confusing, but very interesting.

-- Paul, Tennessee, http://www.tsunamiguitars.com

View levan's profile

levan

472 posts in 2445 days


#13 posted 01-20-2016 02:12 PM

I would send pictures or link to freud customer service. It certainly looks like a blade problem.

-- "If you think you can do a thing or think you can't do a thing, you're right". Henry Ford

View lab7654's profile

lab7654

264 posts in 1712 days


#14 posted 01-20-2016 02:19 PM


I know a lot of people taper the very end of their fence away from the blade like 1/16”, but I m not sure if that would help here.
- lab7654

1/16” fence off is a sure recipe for a disaster.

- 716

Yeah scratch that, I think mine is setup somewhere between 1/64” and 1/32” out, 1/16” was probably a bad example.

-- Tristin King -- When in doubt, sand it.

View Harry's profile

Harry

71 posts in 645 days


#15 posted 01-20-2016 04:14 PM

Many thanks for all the great input, I’m going to check everything again tomorrow and also try different blades. I’ll also measure the blade plate. As a few stated, the teeth should be the only thing coming in contact with the wood, even if the alignment is off. Interesting that HokieKen had this issue.

I’ll report back as shortly.

Harry

-- Harry - Professional amateur

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