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Veneer blotchy after glue up

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Forum topic by rwe2156 posted 01-18-2016 11:21 PM 704 views 0 times favorited 20 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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rwe2156

2190 posts in 941 days


01-18-2016 11:21 PM

First time veneering experimenting right now.

I glued a piece of quilted maple veneer using Titebond Hide glue.
I coated each piece with a moderate layer.
There was one small split in the veneer which glued down perfectly fine.

Covered with saran wrap and clamped with caul board on top.
After taking out of the clamps, it appears some glue seeped through on the surface. I don’t know whether it was through the crack or through the veneer.

After some scraping most of it came off, but a small area is darker.

After applying a couple coats of shellac it is less evident, but still there. Kind of got in a hurry did I just not scrape it enough?

I’m not really thrilled with the glue I’ve heard Old Brown glue is better.

Comments/suggetions appreciated.

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!


20 replies so far

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Aj2

687 posts in 1258 days


#1 posted 01-19-2016 02:10 AM

I think old brown glue is better than the titebond.It cleans up easy with warm water.Dries very hard.
The only thing I can think is too scrap off the shellac in that area and see if you can clean up the glue with warm water.The titebond is water based too I think.
Did you warm up the titebond glue.Or use it cold.I could never get titebond hide glue to hold in any test pieces.

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shipwright

7165 posts in 2258 days


#2 posted 01-19-2016 02:19 AM

I think Titebond liquid hide glue is a dark color is it not? You are probably just seeing the glue through very thin veneer. You will only make this worse by scraping. All hide glue should be cleaned up with water and an abrasive pad. OBG is a lighter, natural colour like hot hide glue and would likely have been a better choice. Personally my choice would be hot hide glue but when I use liquid it is always OBG.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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rwe2156

2190 posts in 941 days


#3 posted 01-19-2016 11:04 AM

Yes it it dark and seemed very “gooey” to me. It was cool but not cold in the shop.

How long should hide glue take to dry?

After looking at it closer with some glancing light, the coat of shellac has made it easier to see what I think it is dried glue on the surface. I’ll remove the shellac and scrape it a bit more.

In retrospect, I think I used too much glue.
I would like to start using hot hide glue because I plan on doing more veneering.

Is there a cheap easy way to heat it? I’ve heard you can use a hot plate. What temp should the glue be at?

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

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shipwright

7165 posts in 2258 days


#4 posted 01-19-2016 02:38 PM

You should find your answers here : http://lumberjocks.com/shipwright/blog/series/5437

As for glue left on the surface, clean it up with water and an abrasive pad. Modern commercial veneer is so thin that scraping should be avoided wherever possible.

Standard sliced veneer today seems to be 1/42”, with some at 1/64” or even less. I encourage you to look into thicker veneers available at some suppliers. For example: http://www.certainlywood.com/woodmenu2.php?category=Special%20Thickness%20Veneers

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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Ger21

1047 posts in 2592 days


#5 posted 01-19-2016 03:55 PM

With some highly figured maples, like curly and quilted, the figure comes from the direction of the grain. What happens is that you actually have end grain in areas of the veneer.
If your glue is thin, or you use too much, the glue will penetrate through the end grain to the surface.

-- Gerry, http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/index.html http://www.jointcam.com

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rwe2156

2190 posts in 941 days


#6 posted 01-19-2016 10:42 PM

Thanks I think this is what happened. Here is a pic the shiny areas are where the glue is.

I’ve seen videos where hide glue is applied to the surface of the veneer prior to using the veneer hammer.
Is the purpose to fill the pores?

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

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shipwright

7165 posts in 2258 days


#7 posted 01-20-2016 04:28 AM

No, the purpose is twofold. One is to provide a lubricant for the hammer and the other is to stabilize the veneer against curling when wet on only one side.
Hammer veneering: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=D3SLEvvtS0c

Again, that shiny spot will come off easily with water and an abrasive pad.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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rwe2156

2190 posts in 941 days


#8 posted 01-21-2016 03:29 PM

Would heating the Titebond hide glue help?

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

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shipwright

7165 posts in 2258 days


#9 posted 01-21-2016 03:37 PM

Warm water will clean it quicker than cold but you stand a greater risk of reversing the glue under the veneer.
The best bet is cold water and a pad.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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rwe2156

2190 posts in 941 days


#10 posted 01-22-2016 12:39 PM

Thanks Paul, I ‘m talking about warming it up prior to glueing like standard hot hide glue.

I found the glue to be quite sticky and thick difficult to coat evenly.

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

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Ger21

1047 posts in 2592 days


#11 posted 01-22-2016 12:46 PM

That doesn’t look anything like quilted maple??

-- Gerry, http://www.thecncwoodworker.com/index.html http://www.jointcam.com

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shipwright

7165 posts in 2258 days


#12 posted 01-22-2016 02:31 PM

Yes heating the glue should help make it thinner and easier to use. I haven’t used it (the Tightbond) but that is the case with Old Brown Glue. Patrick Edwards ( who makes OBG) recommends warming it in a container of warm water. You can warm it as much as you like within the limits of hide glue (about 150 F) but it should be plenty thin enough around 100 F. If you warm it too much it becomes too runny so experiment a little to see what temperature/consistency you like.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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rwe2156

2190 posts in 941 days


#13 posted 01-23-2016 12:46 AM



That doesn t look anything like quilted maple??

- Ger21

That’s all I could figure it was,

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

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shipwright

7165 posts in 2258 days


#14 posted 01-23-2016 03:10 AM

Looks kind of like Pelin burl to me.

-- Paul M ..............If God wanted us to have fiberglass boats he would have given us fibreglass trees. http://thecanadianschooloffrenchmarquetry.com/

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rwe2156

2190 posts in 941 days


#15 posted 01-23-2016 12:49 PM

I’ll post a pic of it in the raw. I’d be interested in knowing what it is.

-- Everything is a prototype thats why its one of a kind!!

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