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Over or under designed?

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Forum topic by depictureboy posted 01-18-2010 11:00 PM 4963 views 2 times favorited 17 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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depictureboy

420 posts in 3108 days


01-18-2010 11:00 PM

Well I have my initial design done. Now I am curious as to whether it is overdesigned or underdesigned. The project is a total remodel of our master bedroom and this is our first part, a platform bed with integrated drawers. I would value all opinions and criticisms.

http://home.mchsi.com/~ecathell/Sketchup/PlatformBed.skp

-- If you can't build it, code it. If you can't code it, build it. But always ALWAYS take a picture.


17 replies so far

View Sawkerf's profile

Sawkerf

1730 posts in 2534 days


#1 posted 01-18-2010 11:12 PM

How big will the mattress be? Will you have a box spring?

If you’ll have a box spring, I think that you can cut back (if not eliminate) the torsion box. Most matress/box spring sets rest on 3-5 slats between the side rails without a problem.

If you’re using a futon or just a mattress, you could probably open up the spacing on your torsion box and “skin” it with 1/2” ply.

A couple of years ago, I did bunk beds for a customers travel trailer with torsion boxes skinned with 1/4” ply on both sides. The ply was glued and nailed and has held up fine for several trips so far.

-- Adversity doesn't build character...................it reveals it.

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depictureboy

420 posts in 3108 days


#2 posted 01-18-2010 11:32 PM

That is something I was curious about. The torsion box…for it to work ‘right’ do both sides need to be glued? My plan has a skin of either plywood or mdf underneath, I was just going to have the top panel which is what the mattress will sit on attached to the base with pocket screws along the sides. That may not be substantial enough though. I was thinking of the grid more as solid support for the mattress and top panel. What do you think?

Also we would only be having the mattress. Most of the platform beds I have seen only have the mattress, its a queen size(80×60). Some of the assembly is going to have to take place in the bedroom so I can get the parts up my stairs.

-- If you can't build it, code it. If you can't code it, build it. But always ALWAYS take a picture.

View jlsmith5963's profile

jlsmith5963

297 posts in 2814 days


#3 posted 01-19-2010 04:05 AM

If you build something in the room because it won’t fit up the stairs I assume you don’t ever plan on removing it (even if you move)? Have you ever seen split box springs? There are two halves that are then laid side by side to make the full width of the mattress. If you built two half width torsion boxes, it would allow you to get the pieces up and down the stairs.

Without knowing what the skin material is it is hard to say whether your grid is over designed. One way to test would be to mock up a couple of grids and apply the skin over it and see how ridge it is. A little flexing isn’t going to make the material fail (typically most materials will deflect a lot before they fail).

-- criticism: the art of analyzing and evaluating the quality of an artistic work...

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

17672 posts in 3142 days


#4 posted 01-19-2010 04:51 AM

GEt a sleep number bed, they are great matresses!!

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

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depictureboy

420 posts in 3108 days


#5 posted 01-19-2010 03:52 PM

the torsion box is a split design…if you look really really close the center has 2 runners…I was really talking about the bottom skin for the torsionbox and the top panel…i may have some redesign to do as I move further into the project.

I was going to put a reversible glue joint on all the joints for the top frame, then use pocket screws to bring it all together…

so If I dont skin the torsionbox on both sides it wont be stable? I was planning on halflapping the intersections, not stapling like some do if that makes any difference…

topomax, I already have the mattress, just redesigning the room…thanks though

-- If you can't build it, code it. If you can't code it, build it. But always ALWAYS take a picture.

View yarydoc's profile

yarydoc

417 posts in 2610 days


#6 posted 01-19-2010 04:05 PM

I would recess the sides in about 3 in so you won’t bang your toes when you start to get in bed.

-- Ray , Florence Alabama

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depictureboy

420 posts in 3108 days


#7 posted 01-19-2010 04:58 PM

yep, the top frame has about a 2 inch overhang…I can increase that to 3

-- If you can't build it, code it. If you can't code it, build it. But always ALWAYS take a picture.

View Tango's profile

Tango

74 posts in 3019 days


#8 posted 01-19-2010 06:28 PM

Hi,
I find that you can get rid of many of the ribs of your torsion box and make the grid more open.
Having 4 boxes where your torsion box rests is more than enough to hold the mattress and lots of the extra weight from the “sleepers”.
I work as an architect and one of the principles I try to apply to woodworking is “getting the most from the less” structure wise talking.
The pieces that realy do most (if not all) the holding job in your torsion box are the ones running parallel to the long sides of your bed. Those “beams” are resting over the 4 boxes so I dont see that the other transversal members will do any other job that just “tieing” all together.

If you like, I can modify your sketchup to better explain my suggestion. Just send it to me.

Good luck with your Bed project. I am right now building one Queen Platform bed for me and my wife.

View Moron's profile

Moron

5032 posts in 3359 days


#9 posted 01-19-2010 06:49 PM

In my opinion, that torsion box is WAY< WAY over engineered unless you and your Mrs are morbidly Obese.

My guess is that you could cut out at least half of those cross members and still be extremely strong. In fact, with all 4 of the drawer dividers including both ends, and with an apron above the drawers….......I really doubt you even need a torsion box?

-- "Good artists borrow, great artists steal”…..Picasso

View depictureboy's profile

depictureboy

420 posts in 3108 days


#10 posted 01-19-2010 07:28 PM

hehe…I have changed the design…and Yes roman I removed the torsion box..hehe…I put it in my blog…

http://lumberjocks.com/depictureboy/blog/13129

I initially increased the spacing, but then I decided that maybe I really didnt need it at all…

-- If you can't build it, code it. If you can't code it, build it. But always ALWAYS take a picture.

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

17672 posts in 3142 days


#11 posted 01-19-2010 10:10 PM

You don’t need an over hang on a bed. We have one without. In the last 15 years, our toes have been just fine;-)) Use the extra room for deeper drawer space.

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View PurpLev's profile

PurpLev

8523 posts in 3114 days


#12 posted 01-19-2010 10:16 PM

the torsion box looks like an overkill. theoretically the 4 cross sections would be sufficient to hold the platform in place. if you add some boards length wise at the edges that should pretty much cover the entire platform.

edit: if you keep the 4 cross secions, and have the 2 face frames covering them up, you can ditch the entire torsion box layer all together. you are placing a mattress on top of that, and your body weight and mattress weight will keep it down and flat. plus it’ll be hidden, this is not a workbench or a table that you want to make perfectly flat.

-- ㊍ When in doubt - There is no doubt - Go the safer route.

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depictureboy

420 posts in 3108 days


#13 posted 01-19-2010 11:49 PM

yea I had originally wanted the torsion box for durability. But I think the way I have it now is the way to go….

Now all i have to do is pocket screw it to the frame underneath and it should be good. thanks everyone for your inputs and critiques..

-- If you can't build it, code it. If you can't code it, build it. But always ALWAYS take a picture.

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

17672 posts in 3142 days


#14 posted 01-19-2010 11:59 PM

That is about how our bed is made, but it is a King size with the structure going the other direction. The drawers are a bit shorter and there is a channel full lenght in the midle accessabell from the ends. Without the torsion box, you get more space for more drawers. Never enough drawers or closets in a house ;-))

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

View TopamaxSurvivor's profile

TopamaxSurvivor

17672 posts in 3142 days


#15 posted 01-20-2010 12:03 AM

Actually our bed is 4 basic pieces: head board, foot board, 2 cases of 6 drawers. They are tied together with some 1x’ to form the middle chase between the 2 drawer cases underneath. It is accessbile by a door iin the foot board.

-- Bob in WW ~ "some old things are lovely, warm still with life ... of the forgotten men who made them." - D.H. Lawrence

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