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Forum topic by builtinbkyn posted 11-24-2015 04:04 PM 1218 views 0 times favorited 48 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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builtinbkyn

651 posts in 405 days


11-24-2015 04:04 PM

Oh come on. You guys love these discussions – at least that’s what I’ve gleaned from all the reading I’ve done here :O

I’ve decided to stay away from hybrid saws. I’m sure they’re fine, but many seem to have one issue or another and at my advanced age of 55+ I really don’t feel like dealing with them. I just want to enjoy my shop time and not become a table saw mechanic on the side. Maintenance is one thing, but fixing a new 500lb product and sending parts back and forth, isn’t what I would consider fun. This will be the only cabinet saw I purchase, so I have to be happy with it.

Grizzly was a contender, but after reading and researching, I’ve eliminated that brand. I’m sure there are plenty of happy customers, but I’ve crossed them off of the list. I’m down to Powermatic, Sawstop and Delta and heavily leaning Delta even after years of admiring Powermatic.

Seems either the 3hp or 5hp Unisaw is available thru Amazon for under 3K shipped, and with a 52” rip capacity. I’m just wondering why they’re being offered at what appears to be a considerable discount. Anyone have incite into this? I can pick up the saw and accessories, including a rolling lift, storage drawer, thin kerf RK and inserts for 3k. No safety features such as the SS has, but the Delta is also a more complete package for what might be considered significantly less. The SS set up similarly would be 1K more. The PM is similarly priced to the SS.

From reading, it seems the Delta has been redesigned from the ground up and has some really nice features. Am I looking at this correctly?

Here's the Amazon listing.
Hope it’s ok to post it.

-- Bill, Yo!......in Brooklyn :)


48 replies so far

View ShaneA's profile

ShaneA

6472 posts in 2063 days


#1 posted 11-24-2015 04:24 PM

The Powermatics will be on sale in a couple of days at 15% off…20% accessories (plates, Thin kerf knives), and free shipping on most sites. I get the cabinet saw bug this time of year too. The integrated base on the PM 2000, and significant weight compared to it’s competitors make it an option. Jets will also be on sale too.

The Deltas are nice looking, feature packed saws too. I also wrestle with the cost difference on the Sawstops. I am still not convinced they are the equal to the PM and Delta…but I could be way off base there. Most people seem pretty happy with them. But by the time you add in the brakes, inserts, and mobile base the price really jumps up there.

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builtinbkyn

651 posts in 405 days


#2 posted 11-24-2015 04:31 PM

Hey Shane. Thanks for that headsup. I kind of thought there may be some price incentives after TG. Most people won’t be spending on major too purchasesl around the holiday so I figured these mfgs. would consider that and price them at a discount. I’ll keep an eye out for that.

-- Bill, Yo!......in Brooklyn :)

View bonesbr549's profile

bonesbr549

1176 posts in 2531 days


#3 posted 11-24-2015 04:48 PM

I’ve seen all up close, and the upper tiers of the Delta is a fine looking saw and like some of the features, but the state of the company, and other decisions they have made have left to be honest a bad taste in my mouth so I’d not go that route.

The powermatic is a fine saw, and i love the fit-n-finish of their tools. I have the big mortise machine and love it. I’m sure that would be a fine choice.

Not sure why the griz is off the table, but I had 10” 1023 for 10+ years and not an issue. But sure you have your reasons.

My current saw and the only reason I sold the Griz, was to upgrade to the 5hp Sawstop ICS. It is my forever saw and can’t praise it enough. It is top of the line in fit-n-finish and is a beast. If I could have got the 5hp in the PCS I would have as its a fine saw as well. I really wanted the 5hp so that was the decision. The safety feature, the customer service, and the quality just makes it a pleasure to use. Dust collection is great with the overarm guard and I also know if its ever sold (by the kids), they will get a good $$ for it.

Was it expensive, yep, but when I look at features and safety and amortize that cost over they years I anticipate to use it, its not much per year actually (I plan on living for some many years to come).

Ultimately you have to decide whats best for you i.e. features / budget.

Thats my opinion but that and $2.50 will get you a cup of coffee. Cheers and have a good one!

-- Sooner or later Liberals run out of other people's money.

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builtinbkyn

651 posts in 405 days


#4 posted 11-24-2015 04:58 PM

Thanks bones. Appreciate the intimate knowledge you imparted. The 610 and 1023 were seriously considered, but it seems they have their issues too. Maybe all of these products have them. I guess quality control was the first to suffer in a down economy. Making sales and dealing with things after the fact is the way of doing business. I know even SS has had some, but it does seem their customer service is on top of things. The Delta issues you hinted at, I’ve read about and have also taken into consideration. Though not all if it’s components are made here in the US, at least they are assembled here, which I do consider a good thing. We used to make the best of everything, but now not so much, unfortunately.

-- Bill, Yo!......in Brooklyn :)

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

3941 posts in 1958 days


#5 posted 11-24-2015 05:21 PM

I recently upgraded from a Unisaw, and that upgrade would have been the new Delta had they not moved the production overseas (I think you’re mistaken about the USA assembly; I believe that was moved to Asia as well). Their parts problem going on as we speak also made me look away. I considered a PM (and really like them), but wound up going with a Sawstop. For an Asian import they are as well made as any. I have to say, I’d bet the SS CS is really leading at (at least for now)....they have really been responsive to customers.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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builtinbkyn

651 posts in 405 days


#6 posted 11-24-2015 05:45 PM

Hi Fred. Been looking for info on where the Delta cabinet saws are put together. Thought they still assembled them here. The contractor saws all come from overseas. Maybe I’m wrong on that?

What I like about the Delta is the larger table surface at 31” and the distance to blade from the front is 13 1/2”. In order to get that size table on a SS, I’d need to step up to the industrial. I just can’t justify spending that much. The PM has a similarly sized table to the Delta, though 2” less in front of the blade. The “Professional” SS has a 27” table.

-- Bill, Yo!......in Brooklyn :)

View Richard H's profile

Richard H

489 posts in 1145 days


#7 posted 11-24-2015 05:48 PM

The SawStop 3HP PCS with the 52” fence is the same price as the Delta 3HP. If you go up to the ICS it is more but if you are aiming for a 3HP saw I don’t know why you would do the ICS. If you want a 5HP saw the price difference becomes a lot more significant as you pointed out. The Delta and Powermatic are really nice saws for sure but so is the PCS and it has the added benefit of the brake.

If SawStop follows their normal MO there will be a sale early spring where you can get a free mobile base or overarm dust collector with purchase of the saw. I am going to hold out for that sale myself as I don’t have the power straighten around in my shop for it yet anyways.

View Fred Hargis's profile

Fred Hargis

3941 posts in 1958 days


#8 posted 11-24-2015 05:53 PM

Bill, I went with the ICS because of the increased table size, my old Uni had the 27” table. To be honest, for a hobbyist I don’t see much difference between them. Regardless, I wish you the best with your choice.

-- Our village hasn't lost it's idiot, he was elected to congress.

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builtinbkyn

651 posts in 405 days


#9 posted 11-24-2015 05:56 PM

Hi Richard. I see the 3hp PCS @ $3250 shipped. Where do you see it priced better? The Delta is $2650 shipped.

-- Bill, Yo!......in Brooklyn :)

View Richard H's profile

Richard H

489 posts in 1145 days


#10 posted 11-24-2015 06:01 PM

My Rocker has the 3HP 52” PCS for $2999 in stock. The Delta has dropped in price since the last time I looked at it. $2650 is a really good price for that saw. I really like the arbor lock feature on the Delta I just wish they were more like the Delta that made my 15 year old tablesaw, jointer and drill press than the one that makes those things they sell in Lowes these days.

View moke's profile

moke

861 posts in 2241 days


#11 posted 11-24-2015 06:13 PM

Bill,
I don’t know how much more I can add, but I have the same SS as Richard H. It is also my forever saw. Similarly I have friends with the Powermatic and Delta. The Powermatic is truly built like a tank…I think better than SS even….but when we assembled it, I didn’t think some of fit as well as I thought it should. They were small things and not many, that would not effect the performance.

I go to a local tool sale a couple of times a year and about every third time, there is a Delta Rep there. He seems to have a different story about the company every time. Not sure I would buy anything Delta….although I have a lot of their tools…I am prepared to buy other brands new, in lieu of not being able to obtain parts. That is truly no way to run a company…and in my estimation will pull them down someday.

As far as grizzly goes I have a friend buy a planer from them, and while it works ok, it looks like it was painted with a broom!!! I think their product are ok, (except for that paint job) but the shipping seems to beat them up badly…all the stories I hear are the customer service shipped me out this or that and were easy to work with. Ok, but I am not a fen of having to work with customer on anything….I would like mine right from the start.

If I were to buy a saw again, I would get a SS, but that powermatic was pretty nice too.
Mike

View 716's profile

716

502 posts in 381 days


#12 posted 11-24-2015 06:24 PM


Grizzly was a contender, but after reading and researching, I ve eliminated that brand. I m sure there are plenty of happy customers, but I ve crossed them off of the list. – builtinbkyn

Would you mind to elaborate on this a bit more. While there are quite a few discussions about some faults in hybrid saws ( which I would admit a good portion of them are user errors ). However I am still to find a bad review on a Grizzly cabinet saw. This is despite the fact that for the price of mainstream Grizzly cabinet saw you can only buy a contractor type saw from Jet/Powermatic/Delta/Sawstop.

-- It's nice!

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MrUnix

4226 posts in 1663 days


#13 posted 11-24-2015 06:35 PM

From what I’ve been told, while the production of the Unisaw has been moved overseas, the current ones on sale (at a reduced price) are the last remaining US made ones, and will be at that price point until the supply chain runs out of them. I have not been able to find any real confirmation, but the Amazon listing does say it was made in the US, so YMMV.

Cheers,
Brad

-- Brad in FL - To be old and wise, you must first be young and stupid

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builtinbkyn

651 posts in 405 days


#14 posted 11-24-2015 06:48 PM

@ Mike

Thanks for your input. Didn’t know obtaining parts has been an ongoing issue for Delta products, but I would hope I won’t be needing them for quite some time. However that obviously is an issue none the less.

I may have to take a ride to NJ. I believe that is the closets location for me to see a Sawstop up close. I still don’t think I’ll be spending 5k on a saw though, but I’ve been know to exaggerate from time to time ;)

Yes what ever I do choose will have to be my “forever saw” too. These aren’t disposable nor are they light-weight so moving one out for sale or even service isn’t practical. I see it as more like buying a car. Difficult to make a choice and even more difficult to dispose of when you are either unhappy with the selection or it’s time to move on. Heck my first new car cost less than one of these saws LOL

@ 716

Just reading some of the reviews I see there have been issues with finish and some in important areas such as poorly ground miter slots and extension wings, aside from some operational issues. I’m sure not everyone has had these issues and I’m equally sure that even the higher priced saws have had issues, however Grizzly’s price point is lower for a reason. I may be well served by a Grizzly product, but there seems to be a better chance that I’ll have issues right out of the box with one vs the others I’m considering. I guess that will come at a cost.

-- Bill, Yo!......in Brooklyn :)

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builtinbkyn

651 posts in 405 days


#15 posted 11-24-2015 06:57 PM

Hmmm? Maybe that answered the question on the pricing. I guess that Made in USA was picked up in the “Questions” section? A few confirmed that, but they were earlier posts. The last says Taiwan. However you might be right about the lower price being caused by the desire to eliminate the remaining inventory of the US made product. Yes I wish that could be confirmed in one way or another.


From what I ve been told, while the production of the Unisaw has been moved overseas, the current ones on sale (at a reduced price) are the last remaining US made ones, and will be at that price point until the supply chain runs out of them. I have not been able to find any real confirmation, but the Amazon listing does say it was made in the US, so YMMV.

Cheers,
Brad

- MrUnix


-- Bill, Yo!......in Brooklyn :)

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