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Why does Sawstop lower the blade ?

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Forum topic by Karamba posted 11-16-2015 05:34 AM 879 views 0 times favorited 15 replies Add to Favorites Watch
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Karamba

116 posts in 403 days


11-16-2015 05:34 AM

The blade stops immediately anyway but this makes the design much more complex. In fact without lowering the blade the system could be very simple and most saws could be retrofitted to use it.


15 replies so far

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TheFridge

5765 posts in 953 days


#1 posted 11-16-2015 05:49 AM

You are opening a can of worms bud. Sawstop threads usually don’t end well. Especially when it involves questions about retrofitting.

-- Shooting down the walls of heartache. Bang bang. I am. The warrior.

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Mip

446 posts in 1545 days


#2 posted 11-16-2015 06:28 AM

Trying not to “open up a can of worms”, but, I think the reason the blade drops is that there is a lot of stored energy in the fast spinning blade, and when the brake is applied, the stored energy releases all at once and forces the blade under the table; at least that’s what it says on the sawstop website. It’s a matter of physics, but that doesn’t stop Steve Gass from promoting it as something he developed into the tablesaw. What I want to know is why they went with the aluminum brake instead of the plastic one that doesn’t ruin the fifty to a hundred dollar saw blade.

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jmartel

6576 posts in 1617 days


#3 posted 11-16-2015 06:28 AM

It’s a way of dissipating the force. There’s a lot of force involved when the blade brake goes off. If you watch slo-motion videos of it you can see the entire saw shake when the brake is activated. Plus, the saw blade is still rotating a bit when it’s dropping, so it lessens the injury as well.

-- The quality of one's woodworking is directly related to the amount of flannel worn.

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Slemi

104 posts in 1008 days


#4 posted 11-16-2015 06:40 AM

I’d say it is because of the possibility ob blade “exploding” in case of someone fitting some cheap blade on saw. It is better this way. I would do it the same way if I was making the saw.

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bigblockyeti

3668 posts in 1188 days


#5 posted 11-16-2015 11:39 AM

It’s a joint effort between sawstop and the blade manufacturers to sell more blades. Much like the one between automakers (coupled with their refusal to use corrosion resistant chassis components) and the salt mines to get more salt on the road, necessitating a new car prematurely so those who can’t drive in the winter can pretend a little longer before the inevitable happens anyway. It’s all one big conspiracy.

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SirIrb

1239 posts in 697 days


#6 posted 11-16-2015 12:17 PM

This. I think that a nice thick chunk of Nylon 66 would get the job done. I would guess they had looked at this. My think that they would have had to machine all the pieces individually (you couldnt Injection mold a piece that thick) whereas with aluminum they can cast is and skim them on the mill. So speed of mfg.


Trying not to “open up a can of worms”, but, I think the reason the blade drops is that there is a lot of stored energy in the fast spinning blade, and when the brake is applied, the stored energy releases all at once and forces the blade under the table; at least that s what it says on the sawstop website. It s a matter of physics, but that doesn t stop Steve Gass from promoting it as something he developed into the tablesaw. What I want to know is why they went with the aluminum brake instead of the plastic one that doesn t ruin the fifty to a hundred dollar saw blade.

- Mip

-- Don't blame me, I voted for no one.

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bigblockyeti

3668 posts in 1188 days


#7 posted 11-16-2015 12:25 PM

They don’t even have to cast the aluminum, it’s a small section cut from an extrusion, much faster than casting and more cost effective 99% of the time too.

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Redoak49

1960 posts in 1455 days


#8 posted 11-16-2015 12:45 PM

I think the whole Sawstop thing is a giant conspiracy between Sawstop, blade mfg and the NSA. The cartridge electronics is really a spy device and reports back what you have been doing in your shop. I wear a foil hat to keep it from knowing what I think.

Please keep this all a secret!!

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SirIrb

1239 posts in 697 days


#9 posted 11-16-2015 01:57 PM

Extrusions. Yep, even faster.


They don t even have to cast the aluminum, it s a small section cut from an extrusion, much faster than casting and more cost effective 99% of the time too.

- bigblockyeti


-- Don't blame me, I voted for no one.

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johnstoneb

2148 posts in 1640 days


#10 posted 11-16-2015 02:02 PM

You will have to ask the power tool association. Gass offered the technology to the manufacturers. They wouldn’t even talk to him. So he tried to force the technology on the industry, he lost in congress, and the courts so he started his own company and now makes one of, if no the best saw in the industry.

-- Bruce, Boise, ID

View ChuckV's profile

ChuckV

2881 posts in 2994 days


#11 posted 11-16-2015 02:12 PM



I think the whole Sawstop thing is a giant conspiracy between Sawstop, blade mfg and the NSA. The cartridge electronics is really a spy device and reports back what you have been doing in your shop. I wear a foil hat to keep it from knowing what I think.

Please keep this all a secret!!

- Redoak49

My brother-in-law’s barber’s cousin’s accountant’s mistress’ auto mechanic’s brother used to work for the NSA. According to what he says, I suggest you add a second layer of foil when using a Sawstop.

-- “Big man, pig man, ha ha, charade you are.” ― R. Waters

View Ripthorn's profile

Ripthorn

1406 posts in 2452 days


#12 posted 11-16-2015 02:25 PM

The blade is dropped to dissipate the force. If you can allow the blade/cartridge assembly to swing down instead of being fixed, you don’t induce such a high force on the connection point for the assembly. The whole system only has so much energy, and the more forms that energy can take, the quicker the blade will come to rest.

Also, dropping the blade has the benefit of getting it out of the way. Even with a chunk of aluminum, as carbide tipped saw blade will cut through it for a little while. Let’s just say for fun that it continues to cut for 1/10th of a rotation. That is 4-5 teeth on most blades I use. That can still do a lot of damage. In reality, however, it is probably more rotation than that.

This also leads to why something like Nylon 66 wouldn’t be a better alternative, because the blade would slice through it much more easily than with aluminum. This means more rotations before coming to rest. It also would compromise the effectiveness of the blade dropping, which would happen more slowly which would result in more damage to the human. I don’t know about you, but if I were to purchase such a tool, it would be to avoid as much damage to myself as possible. After all, a saw is just a “thing”. If I were to rely only on my own skill and experience to avoid injury, I would not purchase such a tool. Simple as that.

As much vitriol as there is surrounding the saw stop, it is remarkably engineered. As someone with two degrees in physics, I tend to look at it mostly from the standpoint of how they were able to deal with a tricky dynamic system.

-- Brian T. - Exact science is not an exact science

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Bill White

4457 posts in 3427 days


#13 posted 11-16-2015 03:07 PM

“I suggest you add a second layer of foil”.......
ChuckV, I have now spewed coffee all over my keyboard. :)
Bill

-- bill@magraphics.us

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crank49

3981 posts in 2438 days


#14 posted 11-16-2015 04:23 PM

Yes, I agree, the blade drop is simply a way to use some of that kinetic energy present in the spinning blade.
Less shock on the system to re-direct the force than to just stop it instantly in place.
Really a genius piece of engineering in my opinion.

-- Michael: Hillary has a long list of accomplishments, though most DAs would refer to them as felonies.

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mds2

310 posts in 1411 days


#15 posted 11-16-2015 04:45 PM

I think the reasoning is in case someone fell into or onto the blade.

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